Newbie 1425 Part Deux -- Game Over

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Hi all replacing in give me sometime to get up to speed, only 17 pages so should not take too long

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Ok that took a little longer than I originally thought, this is going to be a wall:

the only people I have had contact with before who are in this game now are RM (who I have replaced), Wisdom and NS. everyone else is new to me. In many ways this slowed down my reading as much of the latter part of D1 was a discussion on Meta.

so what have I got so far:

Chaos' early play only raised two questions in my notes and these point at 34 and 54. Basically post 34 the question that crossed my mind was, why is that indicative of scum, and post 54. Getting a scummy read off of the first two posts made by someone? Later on in D1 I have noted down that Chaos is pushing on a Singer vote. All of these add up to a very slight read of scummy bias on Chaos’ play, the slot was then replaced by Wisdom, so see my observations on this below.

Cats’ play began steady but then a few instances of sheeping others begins to creep in, The first is a sheep of my slot, 97, with a change of an RVS vote on Ray to a serious vote , while at the time of the post I would say it was warranted (see my comments on Ray below) it was IMO a blatant sheep of what RM has already said. This in itself is not a huge ringing bell, but then it happens again with a sheep of Wisdom near to the end of D1. This then is exasperated by PR fishing with regard to IV at 303 and 377. And I think one other occasion, but I cannot recall, as I did not note it down.

Evil Regals’ play began by giving me a null read, there is nothing there to be honest, in fact not much at all, maybe D2 will see more interaction, right now I am cautious of Evil but her actions later on in D1, see below concerning RM hammer, have convinced me to grant the benefit of the doubt

Arch Angel’s play began steady as well and my notes are minimal with a few question marks. Firstly and this is open to debate, She is suspicious of two townies who are now dead. Further she states she leans town on Evil? What is that based on? What content, of which there is little, would lead her to that read? After her initial suspicions of Singer and Guyett she later names Ray and Guyett as her scum suspects. She then is involved in the meta debate and maintains her opinion within that discussion.

IV, up until NS took over this was a major scum alert here in my eyes, little content and no real action in locating scum or even attempting to take part. IV/NS slot for now the slot remains near the top of my list as scum.

Ray’s play, I have read why early on people were concerned with his contribution, in particular those who have played with him before. What is notable is almost immediately after the third separate person had made such a comment he came on strong in the game. It is noticeable the differences in style and it is as if someone threw a switch, this concerns me though. Before I get to why I must say I partially agree with Ray regarding meta, I am adverse to looking at it but it does on occasion help, like in his play, what was said is correct, I get different reads. I would agree that it can be misleading for a few people who are able to change the way they play, but you cannot change the human element that makes us all who we are and this is what is used against us. Ray's change of style or expression is concerning me but for now I will hold my judgment on this in abeyance pending further development in game, I remain suspicious of Ray although in my notes at one point i actually write "Town ++", which means I got a town vibe on reading him in two separate posts, albeit those posts appear in the thread at the time there is the change is posting styles.

Wisdom’s play, replacing in late in the day on Day 1 and goes on the offensive quite quickly in particular in response to Singer and their discussion end of D1, what sticks out is the comment about seeing her dead D2. Is not a negative observation?, well it can be and it cannot be. On the one hand it could point to the fact why she died N1, but it could also say, “hey, lets set Wisdom up here and kill Singer”. Question is which is it. Again for now will hold committing to judging wisdom at this stage as later posts, in particular start of D2 do not raise any questions in my mind.

So they are my current thoughts/reads on players

There is also something else that needs to be covered. That is to do with the end of D1 votes. Looking at it RM was at L1 for a long time and there was no hammer, 136 does that say anything. Well the votes on her at that time were Guyett, Singer, Ray and Cats. Does that mean anything? Hypothesizing for a moment here Guyett and Singer are now confirmed town and dead, that would leave Ray and Cats on the Wagon who are unconfirmed. Looking at the activity during this time Chaos was absent and was prodded, Ray and Guyett were very active in the thread and ArchAngel makes an appearance but retains her vote on Ray and asks, “don’t Hammer yet. “ Evil appears in thread also and does not hammer in facts moves her vote to Guyett. IV also enters the thread and does not hammer placing a vote on Guyett. Archangel then reappears and moves her vote to Guyett thus placing him at L1. So does this say anything? What it does is maintain of suspicion on my part towards Ray and Cats, in particular Cats. Can it be said that by a process of elimination one or both is scum? Is it such a stretch of the imagination to suppose that all scum were not on the L1 wagon that my slot experienced towards the end of D1, I think not.

VOTE: ObsessedWithCats

I will continue to re read the thread and may well comment again on my current observations or any others I may pick up.

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read again Wisdom

you will see that the above is mostly if not all D1 reading, at the time Arc had made that statement, so my question remains even more so now she has undertaken a 180

AI am not picking Cats up for that alone, it all adds up in my mind too many things that can be questioned,

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Am posting on my phone but want to take up on a comment by Cats

in reply to my wall. You ask why I am making an assumption that one or both of you or Ray are scum, based on the votes on my slots wagon. While your comment regarding the fact that it could have been 4 town is a possibility it would mean that scum, or those that had not voted, chose to ignore a hammer and their target all along was Guyett. As I show everyone who entered the thread to a point after post 136 did not choose to hammer. The only person who was not active at all at that time was Chaos. So what does that whole scenario say to you?

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Hmmm Cats you are right, we disagree, Wisdom, I don 't agree, v and was not surprised at your comment considering the observation regarding your slot at the time Cats and I are discussing.

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As for Rach-wagon in Day 1.. She was at L-1 with no competing wagons which suggests to me that scum is ether a) piggybacking that wagon or b) scum is bussing their buddy.
Rach to me looked town Day 1

with regard to a) you read my post then?

as for b) if they were bussing why did Rach not hammer? in fact she actually said so at the time, or is that WIFOM from her?

So which is it a or b? come on don't sit on the fence.

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Prod dodge on a long weekend will be active Monday

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As for Rach-wagon in Day 1.. She was at L-1 with no competing wagons which suggests to me that scum is ether a) piggybacking that wagon or b) scum is bussing their buddy.
Rach to me looked town Day 1

with regard to a) you read my post then?

as for b) if they were bussing why did Rach not hammer? in fact she actually said so at the time, or is that WIFOM from her?

So which is it a or b? come on don't sit on the fence.

malakittens this is for you then..


notscience are you basically suiciding on us?

I would move my vote but Cats quick move of vote to another ER/malakittens seems opportunistic and Cats is where my vote is right now. So people are we saying lynch Notscience because he is bored?

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I will move my vote and am prepared to hammer NS, I will return here in 2 hours to do so

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So yeah, my vote would be on ns, but now Mala's (possibly legitimately) made me paranoid about somebody hammering while we've still time to be collecting and using information.

Yuck….. oh dear this stinks

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I think your post reeks of false concern.

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Cats I just re read the post care to explain this?

at this point might be playing against his wincon (I'm not sure how concrete that stuff is)

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I will hammer in ten Minutes BTW

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VOTE: notscience/vote]


Cats, the thing is we are not going to resolve this now, your post does not sit right, it does come across with false concern and now not knowing if ns is playing against or with his win con is strange when tyne win cons are open for all to see in the OPs…

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VOTE: notscience

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Based on what Ray?

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So Cats is good by PoE, who besides Mal is not? and do share how your process has got to this point?

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but there is more than one scum left Ray is there not? so who is scum 2?

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is there I thought there were 3, don't ask me why, I have played this set up several times….. bad mistake on my part

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ok so Mal is scum Ray, I don't agree I still think it is between you and Cats…. however I will go reread.

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have now read Cats, Mala and Ray.

Cats does come over to me more town than Mala/ER, I still have doubts about Ray but they are now not that strong, so right now my vote will be on Mala.

VOTE: Malakittens

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If it will make you more comfortable Malakittens I will remove my vote, for now, but I intend currently to replace it. But I would point out that there is another reason you have not been hammered, you are the surviving Mafia

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UNVOTE:

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Malakittens, its not BS at all. I re read your ISO, ERs, Rays and Cats, those attributed to you in whatever guise you use. thus my change of vote, I however remain suspicious of Ray but then he was key in the previous lynch of NS IMO.

ok they have not posted, so what. as for my "you are the final Mafia" statement, please don't belittle me or yourself, its a fair observation and where did I say you were town? the only direct statement I make about a read on you is this

Evil Regals’ play began by giving me a null read, there is nothing there to be honest, in fact not much at all, maybe D2 will see more interaction, right now I am cautious of Evil but her actions later on in D1, see below concerning RM hammer, have convinced me to grant the benefit of the doubt

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I rather want to go with Cats than mala...
but the question can we afford a mislynch today?

Cat dies...if cat is scum, we win
if cat flips town.. one of us will die in the night..
it will 2 vs 1

Smug and Ray - who are you comfortable voting today? Mala or Cat?

Like you I am suspicious of Cats, have been for a while, but am also suspicious of Mala. but having reread Mala/ER it did not gel together in my mind, her whole play rang bells.

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sorry that should read Ray -"but am also suspicious of Ray"

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Ray your last post is uncomfortable, I see what you are saying but it seems out of context when lined up against your previous posts, it is almost like you just threw it away to appease Mala, in particular you seemed so sure earlier.

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ha ha… no not really…

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and yes seriously… why, is that a problem?

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You seemed so sure of your reads early on and that Mala was the correct lynch, and yet you are saying you would re-read. If that is the case then you are not so sure of your reads, surely?

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So do you have a doubt about her lynch or are you solid on the Idea? Because although you are responding to a hypothesis and answering am obvious question that should be asked at this stage, I am not convinced your response is 100% genuine, and so my comment about it appearing to be a throw away line to appease her question.

You know I am still drawn to you or Cats fort earlier stated reasons as the more likely candidates at this time

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That was a terrible post mis spelling etc, am on phone

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AA what do you think we could reasonably achieve over the time we have? While your motive for your request
makes sense it also allows for more doubt to enter into people's thoughts, actually it could be counter productive? However notwithstanding your reasoning the thread is so slow how much more information can be gained do you think?

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Oh interesting .....

VOTE: ObsessedwithCats

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Cats, you put Mala at L1 what is your reasoning? Ray stop with the indignant hurt routine, you and Cats remain on my sus list.

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I disagree Ray, If Cats is scum then his vote post and it contents could be viewed in another way when you take it into context with the discussion beforehand and the reference made to it by Cats. By agreeing with me concerning my comment to AA on stalling the game while we "chew over our options", strikes me as suspicious. On the face of first read it seems a fairly innocuous statement, but I think you can maybe see what I mean when I say it could actually be geared to end the day quickly for other reasons. Thus my stubbornness in this regard. Had another player whom I am not suspicious of, made the same comment I would not have given it a second glance to be honest.

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I have not changed my read it remains the same. But I find Cats post suspicious for the reasons stated.

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I have read back through everything and thought it through and will say
that I intend to Hammer,

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my reads do not flip every day and I certainly have not changed my mind in any regard. Yes I was torn between Cats and Mala, That is why I went away and re read the ISOs, this has in my mind confirmed my course of action. Mala what now only strengthens that is your response. Ray I will lynch Mala for the same reasons I first voted for Mala as they still apply,

Mala do you have anything to add before the hammer?

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I can wait although I don't see why, but just to highlight, did I say when I was going to hammer? The thing is your response now and earlier do not strike me as town tbh. Yes you Ray and Cats are on my sus list. Do you think it wise just to focus on one person? I think not. Of the 3 you are currently the scummiest and the next lynch. I am also bemused by your lack of defence or attempts to point out why such a person is more deserving of the lynch.

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Still waiting then......

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as I have stated my intent to hammer, I will.


VOTE: malakittens

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Oh that is a nice feeling, week played guys and thanks for letting me sub in. I enjoyed it, honestly had a strong read on Cats and Ray for the first part of my entry into the game, but the more I looked at Mala the more things looked bad,

yes I got an attack of indecision near the end but it was Mala's attitude tot hat that actually swung my decision.

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that should read well played ??