Mewbie 1472 ~ Game Ovah~

[BipolarChemist]

/confirm

[BipolarChemist]

Well I got the town goon, so that leaves us with setups 1, 3, B, C

I may not be understanding how the set-up works, but isn't there only mafia goon? Town goon isn't a thing...

[BipolarChemist]

Also, there's only room for one Canadian!

VOTE: Pharphis

[BipolarChemist]

There's definitely no Town Goon. I don't know what the hell you're talking about!

[BipolarChemist]

Oookay....

[BipolarChemist]

Pharphis has played on other sites before. I can believe he was trying to lure a newer player into jumping on that.

[BipolarChemist]

Pharphis has played on other sites before. I can believe he was trying to lure a newer player into jumping on that.

So do you think he was scum trying to mislynch new players or town trying to catch new scum?

I'm not sure. I have played with him before and he is telling the truth that he makes bold moves early, but whether that means he is town or scum, I don't know. He has a habit of getting lynched D1 as scum or dying N1 as town (or other).

[BipolarChemist]

I was probably pulled into a psychological test, but afterward he says we ruined his FUN. Like it didn't seem like this was for reads, more as a joke.
The joke bit is what I think is scummy. Now he comes out with trying to get reads, but I don't know it feels suspicious to me.

This feels like some back tracking and repeating of points made by other players. Kind of like pandering to the crowd.

[BipolarChemist]

This is bad logic. It sounds like you're saying he's usually lynched as scum so if he's being lynched it's always because he's scummy. That just gives scum the opportunity to lynch him easily.
You play on the same forum? How much.

I'm not saying that. I'm saying he's usually loud and one of the most seen players on a D1 in my experience and his play tells me nothing to what his alignment is. We also constantly joke about how every time he's scum he gets lynched D1

We play often.

[BipolarChemist]

We usually play on a forum where it's a 48 Hour day phase. Quite often we have our D1 lynch as someone who was loud or slipped in some way. The amount of times Pharphis was lynched D1 as scum is just hilariously high and I think it might just be luck.

[BipolarChemist]

I don't know he just has been. But that was not my point and you know that. My point was that his gambit tells me nothing about his alignment because he always does stuff like this.

[BipolarChemist]

My vote is still on Pharphis, because I'm interested in seeing how people act at L-1. I don't know why I would think you're locked for a lynch, as I only count 4 votes on you.

My read on Pharphis right now is cautiously leaning town.

[BipolarChemist]

A little early don't ya think, Ken?

Unvote

[BipolarChemist]

Pharphis, your "joke", seems very awkward to me. Why joke about that? As you are listed as Newbie player, I think it was a scum slip, you messed up somehow. As long as you cant convince me, that it was just a joke.
VOTE: Pharphis

This is the scummiest post I've seen. Not raising any new points and jumping of the attack train. The vote made this post though. This was the 4th real vote, but there was a vote that didn't count because of formatting.

Karlos, why did you place that vote on Pharphis? Did you consider the possibility of it locking him for a lynch?

Apologies for not posting more, unexpected busy couple of days.

[BipolarChemist]

BipolarChemist needs to post more, I want to hear more as he's currently in my null pile

Sorry!

[BipolarChemist]

Kenny, you wanted to hammer so early with little discussion. Attempting to skip discussion seems pretty bad in a game about discussion.

[BipolarChemist]

As dumb as I think it is that Kenny said he was willing to hammer, I don't see scum saying something like that, seems too bold. Much like Pharphis' play.

Hopkirk, who is topping your scum list now? Do you think Kenny is a good candidate for a lynch?

[BipolarChemist]

Also, VOTE: Hopkirk

[BipolarChemist]

@Hopkirk: I think my vote is justified for now. As for your question, I was simply curious to see your opinion now that Kenny is at L-1.
It's interesting that you have such a strong scum read on Kenny when he has 2 posts in this entire game. Do you think he's in hiding or just doesn't care?

Also, @ XLAV, same point. Kenny has made 2 posts, yet you don't bother mentioning that he has barely posted, but you call me and Guyett out for not posting enough. Why?

[BipolarChemist]

I made the vote because I feel as though you haven't been pressured what-so-ever this game and I have nothing to go off of right now.

Kenny has made 4 posts, two of the the exact same and mostly fluff, but I did miss one, that is my bad.

I don't believe my point on XLAV is wrong. He says that I and Guyett need more posts, but says nothing about Kenny needing more posts, while Kenny is being questioned and not posting.

Labelling my opinions as lies and misrepresentations is a misrepresentation in itself, as this is simply a difference in opinion.

[BipolarChemist]

Bipolar:
First person to try for the easy looking policy lynch.
The stuff about playing with phar before.
“My read on Pharphis right now is cautiously leaning town.” While voting phara.
Misrepping people’s motivations.
Not justifying votes.

Seems like he wants to take the opportunities he can to vote people/discredit people so others will vote them- voting people while not doing so.

Please justify your actions.

My initial vote from Pharphis was obviously apart of the RVS, and you know that. You talk about me misrepresenting motivations, yet you do the exact same back. I've explained why I did not remove my vote from Pharphis, and it was to garner reactions from other players while he was at L-1.

[BipolarChemist]

I was the first to vote Pharphis, but I stated it to be a joke vote, are you intentionally ignoring this?

The point of my vote was to see how you would question it and then go from there. I see you as the loud person and quite often people generally just follow that person, so I don't see the harm in attempting to question back at you.

[BipolarChemist]

How are you?

[BipolarChemist]

I'd like to leave this up to your interpretation.

[BipolarChemist]

I asked you a straight forward question: "How are you?"

Your refusal to answer my questions is highly suspicious

[BipolarChemist]

So are we just supposed to wait him out? It's been 3 days. Either he's given up or he's forgotten about the game.

[BipolarChemist]

I'm currently neutral on Hopkirk. I see a lot of questioning coming from him, but coming with that is I don't see any questioning of him. Any conversation is good at this point, with both Kenny and Karlos not posting in about 4 days and seemingly nothing happening about it.

I don't know how to proceed at this point with nothing happening. There is the option of hammering but we still have time and I'd like to hear from Kenny. I'd also like Karlos' opinion, but neither is going to happen.


Guyett: You are the first vote on Kenny, do you find your vote to be justified more so than before?
Cheese: Who would you prefer to see lynched?
XLAV: Who do you see as scummier, Karlos or Kenny?

[BipolarChemist]

I'm sorry that I'm trying to get people talking, because frankly it seems pretty dead right now.

[BipolarChemist]

You're only trying to get people to talk about stuff they've already said.

Hey bipolar, want to do a read list?

And you're trying to shut down any conversation at all. I can do a read list when I get home later today.

[BipolarChemist]

@ bipolar Alex asked the same question to me when he entered. I still think my RVS became justified.

I asked you the same question because Kenny is now at L-1 and has clammed up. If Kenny did post again, do you think he could change your mind?

[BipolarChemist]

“I see a lot of questioning coming from him”
“And you're trying to shut down any conversation at all.”
Pick one.

I want to see original questioning. For example, you asked Cheese who he wanted lynched when he’d said 4 post before that Kenny is his top scum. What does this actually help you with? You don’t seem to be hunting scum.

@Bipolar: What could have changed guyett’s opinion when Kenny hasn’t done anything else? The wagon has one more person than before.

My questioning may not be original but the point is to actually get some posting. Opinions change and thoughts are everything. Cheese may say Kenny is his top scum suspect, but getting him to expand on the subject may lead to something.

Silence can be just as revealing as speaking and Guyett was the first vote on Kenny. His opinion on the matter could matter greatly.

When barely any posting is happening, not many questions can really be asked because there is nothing to question.

[BipolarChemist]

My list of reads:

Disclaimer: This list of reads will be subject to change and should be taken with one olive, shaken not stirred.

Pharphis ~ Made a fun opening Gambit to get conversation started and obtained some good reads. Most likely town. He has been overly backing me though, might be something to watch for later.

Hopkirk ~ The question master! Early in game he hop(kirk)ed right out of the gate with some questions and continued to beat opinions out of everyone! I am still currently neutral on him due to his excessive defence for my mostly BS thoughts and questions.

Guyett ~ No read. He seems to have played before many times (hence IC). I'd like to be cautious of him, but I'd also like to hear more from him (and everyone else for that matter).

XLAV ~ Needs to post more! Geez! I'm getting mildly scummy vibes off of him and I would probably place him in my number 2 spot on my scum list!

King Kenny ~ What is there even to say. He gains my number 1 scum spot!

Karlos ~ Where are you Karly!?! I need to hear more from you! Don't just disappear on us! (Number 3 scum spot for his quietness for reactions early on)

Cheese ~ Delicious. Especially Cheddar and Swiss.

Cheesetovey ~ At the beginning he was a fan of doing short little bursts of posts, then he came in with a larger block of thoughts. I kinda get a scared towny vibe from him. Town list!

Myself ~ Brilliant. Handsome. And all around a wonderful person. He even asked how Hopkirk's day was! Like come on!

Alexcellent ~ I don't think I have have enough to go on. He questions decently enough and overall seems moderately townish, but I'd leave him near the middle ground for me.

[BipolarChemist]

Hopkirk, right now I just don't have any questions. But I really wanted to open up the floor to others to ask them. What I may not see, someone else might.

[BipolarChemist]

Also, Phar, I do believe you have to unvote before voting

[BipolarChemist]

Damn it, forgot to preview. I wanted to say to Phar that he should wait for the prod and see what comes of this. There is no rush.

[BipolarChemist]

@Hopkirk: Do you see a problem with me keeping my vote on someone I am unsure about while waiting for my top scum read to respond?

[BipolarChemist]

Hop why are you voting a null read instead of one of your 3 top scum reads?

Assuming this is for me. You have a fair point. But my vote on him seems to bother Hopkirk. So I both am entertained by it and it has gotten people talking. I'd also rather vote my null read and see what they think of it, rather than someone who I have a read on already.

[BipolarChemist]

Was it extremely scum motivated? Or was it a random vote because I wanted to see how you would react?

[BipolarChemist]

I don't want to jump and say XLAV is scummy right away, but it isn't looking good.

XLAV, you need to explain yourself right now. Why did you just stop and hammer time?

[BipolarChemist]

There are many scum motivations behind that kind of hammer. Scum can hammer their partner in an attempt to look more town, but that is usually seen through. Scum could also be scared of the vote switching over to them and jumping on the lock. Of course, there's the possibility of town just being tired of waiting, but that's a horrible excuse.

There was zero reason for you to do that, XLAV. Especially with 4 days to go.

[BipolarChemist]

Karlos was going to hammer KK too anyway. What I did was to save time.

If it makes you guys happy, want me to hard claim?

Saying that someone else was going to do the hammer means nothing and is a horrible excuse. We were all waiting for anything from Kenny and now you've ruined that. Why save time? There's no point! That's both a lazy and not valid excuse.

A hard claim means nothing. Pretty much everyone would claim vanilla townie at this point.

[BipolarChemist]

Sure. But why not discuss thins while we wait!

Cheesy: What is your opinion on XLAV's hammer?

[BipolarChemist]

Seeing that kk was the town doc it makes it look like xlav is definitly scum. Hammering without consulting before hand.
XLAV will definitly stay in my scum pack

what was your guy's read on karlos?

XLAV wouldn't have had a clue that KK was Doc, but you seem to be insinuating that he would have had this information.

VOTE: cheesetovey

XLAV had the next biggest target on his back, apart from Kenny and Karlos, so why would mafia kill Karlos? I think it may be to put pressure on XLAV.

My opinion straight from yesterday: "Where are you Karly!?! I need to hear more from you! Don't just disappear on us! (Number 3 scum spot for his quietness for reactions early on)"
I don't like quietness!

[BipolarChemist]

No i think you just hammered him. Thats the 4th vote. Are you serious cheese? Why the hell didnt you look at the votes before locking?

[BipolarChemist]

Do you have to unvote before voting?

[BipolarChemist]

No i think you just hammered him. Thats the 4th vote. Are you serious cheese? Why the hell didnt you look at the votes before locking?

No I voted for cheese before he voted for XLAV. XLAV isn't hammered

Do you have to unvote before voting?

I don't believe you do. Most games you don't have to unvote (It depends on the preference of the moderator)

All games I have played in, unvoting was necessary. I just assumed that was everywhere.

[BipolarChemist]

Points have been brought up. My main one here, cheese, is that you assumed XLAV would have know Kenny was the Doc. Why did you think that?

[BipolarChemist]

I did not assume he would know he was doc, I assumed he would know kenny was town. This game is about a informed minority and a uninformed majority going against each other. As I have said I believe XLAV to be part of that informed minority so he would know that kenny is town.
Is that how being mafia is, I have never been apart of the mafia before?

Your first post of the day:

Seeing that kk was the town doc it makes it look like xlav is definitly scum.

Right here you insinuate that XLAV is scum because KK was town doc, do you not?

[BipolarChemist]

Right now, to me it seems like Cheese is scum who is becoming increasingly desperate. Flip flopping on points (see Posts #337-340), calling a self-vote a scum tell, blatantly ignoring points made by others and not responding to them, as well as questions. I don't like it, cheese.

Cheese, Guyett asked you a question above, in post #328, and then in #335 you say we need to be clear on our points. Are you reading the thread?

[BipolarChemist]

can someone just hammer me?
I have a feeling im gonna get lynched today no matter what I say so I don't feeling like wasting my time answering all you questions when it will still be me getting lynched

This feels incredibly passive aggressive. I don't believe a townie would do act like this after being pressured. Please address the point brought up in the thread.

[BipolarChemist]

Unvote

Let's not rush into the lynch.

[BipolarChemist]

Cheese, you are acting scummy, but if you are town then you should go back and answer all the questions and respond to the points made against you. I know you didn't join the game to just give up. If you continue ignoring things, I will have no problem being the L-1 or even the hammer on you.

[BipolarChemist]

Being a passive aggressive brat about this all isn't helpful!

You are refusing to answer questions and comments and have more or less stopped all discussion completely.

VOTE: cheesetovey

This is the hammer vote I believe. I'm both tired of cheese's avoidance and frankly he's not talking, which is just infinitely scummy.

[BipolarChemist]

@Hopkirk: You seem to jump on the people who hammered quickly. To me that seems opportunistic. Would you mind giving more explanation behind why you think me and XLAV are scummy?

[BipolarChemist]

@Bipolar: Oppertunist? The people in my probable scum are the ones i've had as null scum/scum (you/xlav) as opposed to town/null down (alex/guy). Look at my previous posts for why i want an xlav lynch (which is what i would prefer today just in case).

That's not an explanation of why you think XLAV is scum. Yesterday you based your scum read on XLAV as cheese and him being a scum team.

What reasoning do you have for XLAV being scum and for me being scum?

[BipolarChemist]

I hammered because nothing was happening and we were all fairly sure cheese was scum. I got both annoyed at cheese and annoyed at the lack of anything interesting. It sucks that cheese was town, but I honestly don't feel bad after how he played.

[BipolarChemist]

VOTE: Xlav

You said to not vote too early, to avoid a quick lock by mafia, yet someone else votes XLAV and you jump right on. Aren't you doing exactly what you said mafia would do?

[BipolarChemist]

VOTE: Xlav

You said to not vote too early, to avoid a quick lock by mafia, yet someone else votes XLAV and you jump right on. Aren't you doing exactly what you said mafia would do?

When there's a vote on each person it's pretty much a choice between voting those two people. The only way i saw guy as scum would be with xlav while xlav could be scum with you thus scum xlav.

But at the time you voted XLAV, you were putting the second vote on XLAV. That seemed like a big move in the direction of a lynch. It even seemed like Guyett noticed this bu unvoting.

Yesterday you had associations of people. I want to hear more reasoning for an XLAV lynch than just "if cheese is scum, XLAV isn't", which I'm assuming that means the opposite as well (if cheese isn't scum, XLAV is).

[BipolarChemist]

I actually think your second vote is scummy enough to lay a vote on you. Even with your reasoning that there is a vote on two people, mafia could jump on if you're wrong on reads.

Hypothetically: Let's say both you, Hopkirk and XLAV are town, then there are two mafia that can easily jump on XLAV and win the game. Basically the situation you laid out in your first post of today.

I don't like it.

VOTE: Hopkirk

[BipolarChemist]

@Bipolar: If you're not scum remove that vote as scum can quickly hammer me.

You're making my point for me!

If you are wrong about XLAV, then mafia can quick lynch him too. You are going against your own point at the beginning of the day and to me it looks like you are looking for both a quick lynch and a mafia win.

[BipolarChemist]

“

The same thing can happen if both of xlav and guyett were town. It didn’t. Thus either guyett or xlav is scum. Xlav is much more likely to be scum than guyett. Thus I voted xlav.

Either xlav or guyett has to be scum (unless slow scum).

This defence reveals bipolar to be xlav’s partner.

You're assuming I'm defending myself, which I'm not. I'm pointing out the flaw in your voting excuse.

[BipolarChemist]

I'm not defending XLAV, I'm asking you to defend your thought on XLAV being scum.

At this point I am 50/50 on either being scum, but my top choice is you, Hopkirk.

[BipolarChemist]

Yes, because of your statement here:

"Voting quickly here isn't really recommended as scum can easily quick hammer (one town on town vote+two scum votes=scum win). Therefore voting straight away is not a good idea in lylo."

You voted XLAV very quickly when he already had a vote on him! Guyett then unvoted, which to me seemed like a townie unvoting because he's afraid of mafia quick lock.

[BipolarChemist]

Can mafia talk at any time or just at night?

[BipolarChemist]

NVM, it says in opening post.

[BipolarChemist]

Speaking of not being on, Alexcellent promised a full set of thoughts that I don't see.

[BipolarChemist]

"They had ample oppertunity to hammer xlav and didn't thus xlav is mafia."

This is a horrible reason. How did you know for 100% fact that XLAV was mafia at the time?

[BipolarChemist]

Hopkirk says that he thinks Alexcellent is town. He has also stated that he thinks either Guyett or XLAV is scum, but the both together is out there.

So if he thinks XLAV is mafia, then Guyett has to be town, and because he thinks Alex is town, my only option from that logic is that Hopkirk and XLAV are mafia buddies.

So according to Hopkirk, if XLAV is mafia, so is he.

[BipolarChemist]

hmm good point.
What if hopkirk is town and has a read on Alex wrong? could you see XLAV + Alex scum team?

Right now, I could see anyone here being scum. Alex for jumping on my hammer, you for vote laying fairly early, Hopkirk for contradicting himself, XLAV for the dumb hammer Day 1.

My scum list in order is: Hopkirk then XLAV then Guyett and Alex tied.

As for teams I could see XLAV and Hopkirk. But really I think most players here are at least semi-experienced, and could be hiding teams well.

[BipolarChemist]

Actually i'm saying it's YOU and xlav which i've said and you conveniently miss out, or possibly guy and xlav.

Since when did voting the person who has been a major scumread for most of the game and that you are convinced is scum become scummy?

From my position, what I see you saying is that you and XLAV are scum.

It's not that you are voting for someone you think is scummy, it's that you said not to vote quickly in fear of a quick mafia lock. Then you went and quickly voted for XLAV once he had a vote on him, putting him at L-1.

[BipolarChemist]

I get that you think that. I don't get how you think it has to be 100% XLAV as scum.

[BipolarChemist]

UNVOTE:

I think I've seen enough thus far. I've been constantly checking back here all day waiting for someone to jump on my vote. Honestly, I think Hopkirk is decently null town, rather than scum.

What I think is happening is Guyett and XLAV are scum buddies.

Reasons:
1. Guyett seems to have been almost waiting in this thread all day. I believe this is because he is waiting for his partner to lock. Meaning Alex or XLAV is his partner.

2. Immediately today Guyett voted XLAV, yet when Hopkirk voted XLAV, Guyett damn near immediately unvoted. Looks to me like an attempt to stop a quick lynch of his partner.

3. Guyett has consistently gone against XLAV since D2, after XLAV locked KK. On D2, XLAV reached L-1 where none other than Guyett unvoted him damn near immediately after.

4. Today, Guyett is leaning towards an XLAV lynch and then a hopkirk lynch for tomorrow, and he is sweetening up to me. What I see here is Guyett attempting to bus his partner and then get Hopkirk killed to take the win.

I agree that XLAV has been scummy since D1. Hopkirk, I believe you are more than correct, although I wish you'd stop being a dick and just give a list of reasons.

Assuming XLAV is scum guarantees, in my mind, that Guyett is scum.

VOTE: XLAV

[BipolarChemist]

Oh By the way, I just put XLAV at L-1.

[BipolarChemist]

Dang it.

[BipolarChemist]

Guyett, you played that very well. Unvoting XLAV at the beginnung of the day damn near sold it for me. Perfect mafia win and dispatching doc and tracker right away, we stood damn near no chance.

[BipolarChemist]

Lose both Town PRs, mixed with some unfortunate town plays. I'm not surprised we lost. On top of that just an uninterested town. Fairly disappointing.

[BipolarChemist]

See! Hopkirk and Guyett!!!

I knew it!

Ok, I was only somewhat confident in hopkirk, and had no clue on partner. I didn't have any solid reason against hopkirk, though.

That's where I was stuck D1. I knew there was something wrong there, but I had nothing to back it up.