Newbie 1495 (DAY 4) - The One where Everyone got Murdered

[Xayzeck]

VOTE: Mora

Hey Shinobi

[Xayzeck]

Nope. Did you roll town?

VOTE: Selfie

[Xayzeck]

Shinobi wasn't in 307?

[Xayzeck]

He plays on gut, feeling and emotion mostly? It was a pretty short game though and I had my attention elsewhere.

[Xayzeck]

You know, just because I did that in some towngames doesn't mean I do them in all of them. I'm surprised you're going after me for L-2 rather than Selfie, who put you at L-1?

I like you though, you can be town.

[Xayzeck]

I won't hide behind RVS for putting you at L-2. You had a wagon, and I jumped on for people to question me. You wanted to get out of RVS, and I wanted to get out of RVS. It's great that you picked up on it.

VOTE: Moratorium
He has a scummy picture

This is hiding behind RVS, putting you at L-1 for that matter.

[Xayzeck]

I've never really believed that L-2 early game is a scumtell. Same for L-1. It's scummy and super scummy respectively, but that doesn't necessarily indicate scum. It generates discussion, and I realised this only recently. I jumped on your wagon and put you on L-2 so that someone, in this case you, could call me out on it. I wanted someone to pick up on the quickwagon so that we can get more developed reads.

The "defense" would more accurately be "He did the exact same thing as me, but in a more awkward way. Do you find this suspicious as well?"

[Xayzeck]

Those two purposes, if both pursued by two identical town players, are directly contradictory, and Xayzeck would have me believe it's because he's "realised this only recently" between what appear to be his 9th and 10th games on this site (according to the wiki page in his signature).

I guess I should clarify what happened then.

I was reading a game, I forgot which, where L-1 happened pretty early on, and someone said something about derphammers being really rare because everyone is usually really scared of it and what not. Like, they do happen, but I don't think the general playerbase are that dumb. Wagons are a good way to start the game and get questions rolling, instead of votes all over the place.

@Selfie:

Yes, it's a slow start.

I'm not sure if holding your vote until others have posted will really encourage posting. Moving your vote to apply pressure is probably the better way to go rather than let it idle.

You should vote, voting is good.

[Xayzeck]

Yes, it's a slow start.

I'm not sure if holding your vote until others have posted will really encourage posting. Moving your vote to apply pressure is probably the better way to go rather than let it idle.

Have you meta'd her, Shinobi? I think she always has a slow start.

[Xayzeck]

Dunno, I tend to skim random games when I'm bored. And we have 1 ongoing game together too, no? That's about all the experience I have with your playstyle though. I don't think I've seen your scumgame yet

[Xayzeck]

Eh, I thought about it before saying it. I don't think I crossed the line too far?

Also yeah, I can see what you're hinting at lol, it isn't what I meant though.

[Xayzeck]

I can't be the only one who randomly reads games though

But yeah, I think you can see what I was trying to get at?

(and thats not how you spell my name)

[Xayzeck]

Shinobi, what's your read on Mora?

[Xayzeck]

I've got townreads on most of the people here. Weakest townread would be Mala, nullscum would be Selfie and Mafia

[Xayzeck]

Because everyone else has towntold more than she has?

Nullscum means somewhere between a null read and a scum read.

[Xayzeck]

They haven't contributed for a good read, and PoE leaves them as nullscum. I'm fine with lynching lurkers, but that doesn't help D2 because they don't have content for associative tells.

[Xayzeck]

Now that you mention it, I forgot thatguy2 was playing.

[Xayzeck]

MM: "I'm not mafia". Well, shit, obvtown I guess.

this made me lol irl

But I don't think the mod can force replace players. They'd have to like, miss prods and get replaced normally.

[Xayzeck]

UNVOTE:

Game's slowed way down, can't really make reads given 3 lurkers, to the point I'm just townreading everyone that's posting.

So of the people posting, I'd be fine with {BBT, Mala, Wolfy}. Everyone outside of this list is a stronger townread, or lurking like mad.

[Xayzeck]

I don't think newbscum could pull off scenario 2, Mora.

[Xayzeck]

Fake cop claims are garunteed to have a CC I believe, so if he is newbscum trying to fakeclaim he is either really dumb, or has really big balls because he's willing to bet nobody will CC, and that's highly unlikely.

[Xayzeck]

counterclaim

[Xayzeck]

but yeah, the two most likely scenarios are doc and no doc.

[Xayzeck]

As soon as he posted "I'm not Mafia", it was obvious he was town.

are you serious?

[Xayzeck]

hm i think mora is town

[Xayzeck]

[quote="In post 172, Moratorium"][/quote]
so short so sweet so to the point

can't be lying now can he

[Xayzeck]

woops i failed that quote

point being, I get it if you have a townread on him, but I don't see how you could possibly townread him for saying "I'm not mafia"

[Xayzeck]

BBT may be

[Xayzeck]

because there's no setup where a cop fakeclaim wouldn't get cc'd

given the real cop does cc

[Xayzeck]

	A	B	C
1	Town Jailkeeper	Vanilla Townie	Mafia Goon
2	Mafia Roleblocker	Town Cop	Town Doctor
3	1st Bulletproof Townie	Mafia Goon	Town Tracker

plugged from the mod for reference sake

let's say we're playing in setup 1. a 1-shot bp fakeclaim would go uncced and the only pr, jailkeeper, can look at the setup and think "oh, since nobody ccs he should be the 1-shot bp and we're in setup a"

if we're playing in setup B, a doctor fakaclaim would go uncced and the only pr, cop, can look at the setup and think "oh, since nobody ccs he should be the doc and we're in setup 2"

this doesn't work with a copclaim.

[Xayzeck]

Less likely to be you based on my read so far though.

does that mean you're scumreading him?

[Xayzeck]

given the real cop does cc

given that any pr does chose to cc, the fakeclaim would get called immediately

from my experience, it's probably one of those roles you don't want to claim if you're trying to avoid a cc.

[Xayzeck]

given the real cop does cc

given that any pr does chose to cc

pls read thx

[Xayzeck]

I'm totally lost on this.
I cannot imagine counter claiming a fake cop claim on day 1 under any circumstances - that's if I was the real cop or if I had a role that meant I knew there couldn't be a cop.
Why would anybody ever cc this on day 1? What would be the point?

yes i get that they wouldn't actually cc because that'd almost guarantee their death, but if you were cop and someone else claimed cop, you've found 1 scum already. you don't have to cc to tell everyone else he's scum, you can look for scumtells in his posts to prove to the rest of the town he's scum, and it's easier because you already know he's scum. if you someone get nightkilled and flip cop, MM would get rope immediately. while there's no visible benefits ccing a cop fakeclaim, there's no visible benefits in claiming cop at all

[Xayzeck]

distract town from what exactly?

[Xayzeck]

not really though

what exactly have i done to distract town from scumreading me?

[Xayzeck]

given the real cop does cc

given that any pr does chose to cc

pls read thx

this is the third time i'm quoting this, and you still do not seem to realise that in all my scenarios i assumed that the pr would cc.

i still don't see how this distracts the town from scumreading me?

[Xayzeck]

my fakeclaiming stuff is under the assumption that a pr will cc if he can cc

aka, someone claims jk, but i am tracker, and jk and tracker cannot be in the same setup, therefore I will cc

this makes the cop fakeclaim a bad idea if you're scum, as no matter what setup you're in, you will be cc-ed.

there are possible scenarios and roles you can claim and avoid a cc, which i explained on page 8.

realistically, you won't be cced, because if the real cop cc-ed, we would lynch scum, but we would lose cop. that is bad for town. thus cop will stay quiet. however, since cop knows he is cop, he can see through cop fake claim, and this will give him confidence to scumread fakeclaimer, and help town lynch scum while avoiding cop claim. this also makes a cop fakeclaim a bad idea

therefore cop claim is real

anything you don't get?

[Xayzeck]

that's my point - why would you assume the pr would CC? It's a ridiculous assumption. The pr would never cc.

not too sure why i've been assuming the PR would cc

not too sure why you find this important

[Xayzeck]

what exactly have i done to distract town from scumreading me?

you have not told me what i have done to distract the town from scumreading me

anyway, off to bed for tonight

[Xayzeck]

Love the effort you're putting into reading me Shin

[Xayzeck]

Xayzeck, what's your view of Shinobi?

Town, every since the exchange with BBT

[Xayzeck]

Coaching and townvibes

I think you guys are asking for details for my reads which I cannot provide. I don't do huge long wall posts going through every line saying why I think someone is town or scum. The way Shinobi interacted with you felt more town motivated than scum motivated, therefore I read him as town. For example, asking you to post reads. Given low content, and his persistence in pulling reads out of you instead of letting you conceal them and leave the town empty, has town motivation it.

You should be able to see these things too.

[Xayzeck]

Hi i'm here

catching up from my last post

[Xayzeck]

I already told you what I thought of Xayzeck. I keep forgetting that he exists, and I'm not sure if it's his playstyle or because he's scum avoiding the limelight. I played with him last game and he was scum, but he has the same feel of not sticking out in his posts and I'm not sure if it's because that's how he plays or if because he rolled mafia again.

everyone else remembers me just fine though

[Xayzeck]

Between his post 109 and 160 he changed his read on me from a weak townread to a possible lynch candidate.

why can't i lynch a weak townread?

[Xayzeck]

Ill be amazed at this point if both wolfy and BBT are town. I'm 90% sure at least one is scum.

why can't they both be town?

[Xayzeck]

And I have absolutely no idea why this is.

I just looked through your filter, and you've done precisely fuck all this game. You haven't had any reads, and the majority of your posts are questions or speculation on setup. I've played with you, and I know you like to use proper punctuation and spelling and whatnot, but you don't seem to be doing any of that there.

Now, bear with me, but when I see someone typing incorrectly, I generally want to ignore them because I think less of them. Call me an elitist or whatever, but I think it's possible that mafia could type incorrectly intentionally to have people gloss over their posts, which is what I felt like I was doing. With the majority of the newbies talking and contributing (and one of them being a cop) it feels like you could be doing more.

This is very important. Give us your list of reads, and tell us who you think is scum.

I've just been too lazy to type recently. And of course, you're the epitome of townness

And I've expressed reasons on people already, you just aren't reading.

Mora, MM, you, BBT are town.
Mala leans town.
Wolfy kinda null.
The rest are lurking too much for me to even know.

[Xayzeck]

Is it at all possible that Xayzeck and thatguy2 are a team?

Thatguy2's posts reek of fear, like he's afraid to do anything at all.

We could be a townteam if thatguy actually did contribute

[Xayzeck]

Is it at all possible that Xayzeck and thatguy2 are a team?

Thatguy2's posts reek of fear, like he's afraid to do anything at all.

VOTE: Wolfy

[Xayzeck]

I think I'm OK to go back to Xayzeck - I just sheeped Malakittens by switching (just to a different player)
Problem is we're going to need 100% of the active players (unless Xayzeck self votes)

What we really need is genuine activity from the lurkers - not just prod dodges.
There just isn't enough to go on.
If we mislynch and scum then kill an active townie we're down to 3 townies, 2 scum and 3 lurkers and we are well truly finished.
That's why part of me wants to (sheeping BBT!) lynch a lurker...

Anybody else you want to sheep instead of voting who you want to vote?

[Xayzeck]

Q+ derp in 328

[Xayzeck]

you however are now sheeping thatguy2!

weak omgus

[Xayzeck]

Here is how I am looking at it now. We have 3 fairly inactive players, and 6 active. Now, let's say an active got lynched today and an active got killed in the night. That leaves 3 inactive players and 4 active. With only 4 active players, and with two of those players possibly being scum, the game becomes very difficult for town and I don't really want to be in this position. If we lynch a lurker and he turns out to be scum, yay, well done us. If he doesn't, he wasn't very useful to town in the first place, unless we're unlucky enough to lynch a power-role obviously; providing we even have another power role in this set-up. What I'm trying to say is, I would much rather lynch a weak-town inactive player, than mistakenly lynch a strong-town active player. At least after N1 we have a lot more information to work with.

This guy's got a point. D2 with almost half lurkers will drive activity down the gutter.

And it's pretty down the gutter as it is.

[Xayzeck]

I'm usually against lynching lurkers, and wait for the mod to replace them.

But since they haven't been replaced yet, and the day's ending, I don't particularly care who we lynch.

I lean thatguy tho

[Xayzeck]

No one wants to join the Xayzeck wagon.
No one wants to really say why either.
Now he's wanting to lynch lurkers.

you're just throwing all sort of suspicion at me

because this has nothing to do with my alignment. also, i've expressed against lynching lurkers until BBT convinced me otherwise. I don't know what you're trying to get at

[Xayzeck]

This, plus there's four votes currently on the BBT/Wolfy false dilemma, makes me think scum is pushing the Wolfy wagon. I expect Malakittens to switch at any moment.

Xayzeck, you're in. Congratulations, you may leave the runway.

Don't get what you're trying to say to me here

[Xayzeck]

Mora, have you updated your townread on Wolfy based on his play, or is it still the scum preview button thing?

Also enomis, I didn't know you were from Singapore too

[Xayzeck]

UNVOTE:

[Xayzeck]

[quote="In post 420, BlueBloodedToffee"]What do you think of the wagon on Mala?

What is your read on Mala?

What do you make of Mora's vote/unvote?

What do you make of Shinobi's post about Wolfy being scum?/quote]
I've seen wagons build up on her as town

nulltown

null. he is town to me, i don't see how voting and unvoting makes him scum all of a sudden

nothing. I thought wolfy could be scum too, but after sitting back and thinking about it it's more like me trying to grasp at someone to scumread, because by PoE, my scumreads are (at the time)lurkers, and scumreading lurkers is pointless

[Xayzeck]

Just saying he's scum at this point when we have nothing to read you with is troubling.

Please elaborate how this would be a problem.

[Xayzeck]

I'll still definitely listening to anyone who feels like taking the time to convince me otherwise, but at the moment my vote is Xayzeck. That seems like the lowest hanging scum-fruit to me. I dont see the case for Mala being that strong.

VOTE: Xayzeck

Why can't I be low hanging fruit as town? May I know why you are scumreading me? If you're confident in mescum, who would my buddy be and why?

[Xayzeck]

lurker-lynching mentality

I don't recall this ever being a thing with me until BBT convinced me otherwise. confbias much?

[Xayzeck]

I leant thatguy, yes, but I never pushed for his lynch. Stop twisting please

[Xayzeck]

not really. I followed Newbie 1483, which she was in, so that's why I knew her townplay. Her play seems pretty similar here, and she was town in that game. I have yet to read a scumgame of hers, so I don't know how much they differ. I'm not exactly an expert in metareads too.

But honestly though, I haven't been following the game very well. I'll ISO her and read the more recent pages, but as of right now i'm not really up for her lynch

UNVOTE:

[Xayzeck]

@mala: You're scumreading half the playerlist? Can you narrow it down a little more?

[Xayzeck]

it seemed like you may have seen an opportunity there and attempted to capitalize on it

opportunity to lynch lurkers? I do recall saying that lynching lurkers would be a good idea after BBT did the paragraph on it, but I have yet to push for a lynch or a lurker for reasons I believe I have said before.

Am I misunderstanding you here?

[Xayzeck]

Ah, I see. How does that affect your read on me? Why would it contribute to a scumread?

[Xayzeck]

Why am I suddenly not in the list when I was at the bottom of your list?

[Xayzeck]

I'm on a phone right now, not near a computer. I can't give this the attention it needs from a phone

[Xayzeck]

@mala still

Why am I suddenly not in the list when I was at the bottom of your list?

[Xayzeck]

Why am I suddenly not in the list when I was at the bottom of your list?

I'm still not seeing the mala thing to be honest. It just feels like townflailing over scumflailing right now.

[Xayzeck]

@Xayzeck:

Hey bro. If you are not seeing the mala thing. Question your upmost scumread or do something? Or even if you feel that she's town, ACTUALLY defend her?

So you needed a computer to type, No, i don't see mala as scum. She seems like town flailing.

Really, you needed a computer to do that?

Tsk tsk tsk. I really feel like switching my vote back to you.

I townread her because her play looked like the townplay I saw, I thought that was pretty clear, I guess not.

And seriously? It's obviously easier to assess people on a computer. I skim posts on a phone, so normally if a game walls like crazy(this one especially), I'll wait until I'm on a computer before I do it. We are obviously not in a rush for a lynch, I don't know why you are so concerned with me putting this game back a few hours.

That as a scumtell is a incredibly weak. I'm really not impressed.

[Xayzeck]

Well I was hoping for more info before a hammer - didn't expect that much.

Xayzeck, again, what are your current reads?

townreading BBT, Shinobi, Mora, MM

nulltown on you

Wolfy and Mala i'm not sure of. I've got reasons to scumread and townread both of them, so I can't really decide

I'm scumreading enomis

[Xayzeck]

No I'm pretty sure I unvoted Wolfy

VOTE: enomis[/unvote]

[Xayzeck]

lol i failed the vote so bad

VOTE: enomis

[Xayzeck]

You unvoted twice in a row.... WHO CARES I DON'T CARE GOD THIS GAME

oh

i never noticed that myself

[Xayzeck]

are you talking to everyone or is that like very specifically for me?

[Xayzeck]

I am on a computer

I don't do cases though

Like really I've never done a case ever

[Xayzeck]

You've been AtEing a lot

[Xayzeck]

Xayzeck if you really want to get enomis lynched at this point you should probably make a case or something.

Just sayin'.

I don't do cases though

Like really I've never done a case ever

[Xayzeck]

@Xayzeck:

Well Blink blink surprise, did you forget my vote was on you after i replaced into the game? You think i put that vote there for fun? Granted it wasn't a strong scumread then. But after you posted you were on phone and couldn't give this the attention it needed. And all you did when you came back was to post a "I think mala is town flailing" with a bunch of information coming up. If that isn't what you use as a scummy point, it is for me. Therefore, i felt like moving back my vote to you. And now your omgus looks freaking bad. It is omgus because i don't even see much of a reason except for me calling you out. If you want to rebut me, give me some solid reasons.

I said this game needed more attention than I could give it on a phone, and I came back to give my thoughts once on a computer, and somehow that makes me scum?

[Xayzeck]

So in essence, you're scumreading me because i am scumreading people as to what you feel is a bad reason. Wow, what a Good reason you are scumreading me for.

scumreading people for bad reasons means your reasons are weak

and your reasons are weak because you know i'm town

because you're scum

it's that simple really

[Xayzeck]

I'd pretty sure I'd have an easier time asking people to convince me on Malascum, slowly do a 180 on Mala, and hammer to end D1 if I were scum

[Xayzeck]

That was addressed to Shinobi BTW. And you think my reasons for scum reading mala/ shinobi/you is weak? Please explain.

I have explained why the computer one was weak, and I still don't see how it's one of your main points for your scumread on me.

Shinobi is town, I don't know how you're scumreading him at all.

Mala could very well be scum, I'm just not seeing it myself. Isn't your Mala case just meta?

And that argument on you, that way would make you seem scummy? Yes? Since you didn't even scumread mala? After the points have been pointed out.

Why would it make me scummy? Because she's at L-1? I could have sheeped people, just saying she hasn't been scumhunting, she's been lurking, and that despite seeing her play as town, meta is unreliable unless you actually play with the person. I could have easily shifted stances and hammered Mala. It's what majority of the town seems to be comfortable with, and easily an easier choice if I wanted to stay out of the spotlight.

Above all, you could stay clear of a town wagon(if she is not your partner). Why not? You don't even needed a hammer. Other people could have done it the way that lynch was going.

This doesn't have anything to do with whether I'm scum or not though. If I think she's town, I stay away from her wagon, whether I'm town or scum.

[Xayzeck]

Stupid Singapore.

no ur stupid

Singapore's pretty amazing

<3

In other news mala is probably town

so that leaves me with {wolfy, enomis}

[Xayzeck]

His refusing to elaborate on why his vote is still on Mala is quite problematic.

Someone hammer this.

This doesn't make sense?

[Xayzeck]

then at others he looks 100% scum.

When does this happen? Is it the quotes that enomis brought up that you are referring to?

[Xayzeck]

VOTE: enomis

absolutely

only

because I don't want no lynch and I can't see BBT, JCozmo or MM doing it

You stated intent, and hammered like, an hour later?

We've got 5-6 hours till deadline, why did you hammer so quickly?

[Xayzeck]

BBT, if you felt so strongly about enomis town, why are we only hearing of it now, when he's at L-1? It's not just a townread on enomis either apparently, you seem too have a hardashell townread on him. When did this start?

[Xayzeck]

And somehow hammering him fixes the problem?

[Xayzeck]

That he hasn't explained his Mala read?

[Xayzeck]

If you're town, interesting read on Mora. I've never questioned my townread on him.

Anw enomis, I'd like to play with you more. It's not everyday I meet a Singaporean scummer

[Xayzeck]

Like I said, I don't do cases. I'll just talk and ask and vote until I have a good read on people.

At that point though, I may be able to tell you why I'm strongly reading a person, so I guess I could potentially make a case. Just not right now.

[Xayzeck]

Xayzeck X mala is not a scumteam.

because I defended her?

[Xayzeck]

Lots of stuff to address, I'll do it when I get home

It's obv we have doc though, so tbh atm I'm looking at Mora. Kept putting people at L-1, risking doc claims. That's scum motivation for me. I'll look through ISOs and think about it tho

[Xayzeck]

We've got cop (though this isn't 100% it's as good as), so if we're in docless, maf would kill cop. If cop is alive, and someone else died, probably means they roleblocked cop and went hunting for doc.

[Xayzeck]

Furthermore, what purpose would there be in me defending Mala if I thought she was town?

What? Scumslip.

I don't see it?

[Xayzeck]

I also think Shin is town. :\

Same. If this were a toss up between Mora and Shinobi, I'd go for Mora

[Xayzeck]

Lots of stuff to address, I'll do it when I get home

Can you do this now please.

my my aren't you pushy

[Xayzeck]

Why mafia killed Wolfy is kinda irrelevant. We don't know whether they saw a doctell or just random killed, and tbh it doesn't really help our position. Wolfy wasn't going to get mislynched anytime soon, and I think that should explain the nightkill enough. Don't get too distracted with why Wolfy died is what I'm trying to get at

[Xayzeck]

When you said there was a lot to address, I was expecting more than what you put in your first post.

I'm doing it post by post, instead of an entire wall. That way I'll be mindful of spamming the thread and leave out unimportant stuff

hopefully, that's the idea right now.

[Xayzeck]

It would be just dandy if we had a cop with some information for us D2......

This feels pretty town though. End D1 I didn't have a good read on Jcoz, felt like he was kinda 'in the background' for the game. Still kinda feels that way, but with his play so far D2, his reaction to night kill seems towny.

[Xayzeck]

Mora, have you explained why Mala has suddenly become a townread after end D1?

[Xayzeck]

You don't think that by trying to understand why scum killed who they killed it could help us to figure out who they are/what their plan is? I think it's a pretty important part of the information that N1 brings.

I don't think that thinking too much into it helps. NK analysis is usually very WiFom-y and open to be of any use. They could be dochunting, killing the most townread person, killing someone who would push for them, framing someone etc there's too many things to consider, and it distracts from what's happening right now and finding scum.

[Xayzeck]

IMO a Wolfy lynch points directly at Shinobi, so that seems like a pretty stupid freaking NK if I'm Shinobi.

Can you explain this to me? I don't get it.

Anyway right now I'm leaning Mora, whether or not it's a toss up between him or Shinobi or not

And I'm not sure how I feel about Mala anymore, the main wagons D1 were enomis and Mala, and it'd be a bit odd if they were both on town.

Mala, you said that your play normally picks up D2. Now would be a good time to deliver

I sincerely doubt Mora and Mala are buddies though, I don't expect Mora to bus Mala, and Mala to throw a fit at him. I mean, it could happen, but I weigh it as unlikely.

[Xayzeck]

I don't see how that is a scumslip exactly?

[Xayzeck]

Anyway right now I'm leaning Mora, whether or not it's a toss up between him or Shinobi or not

Can you tell me why, so I can address it further?

Basically if I were told "would you rather lynch Mora or <insert name here>" I would almost always say you.

Except maybe with Jcoz

Everybody else is townier than you

While the townread I had on you initially has kinda gone down with what enomis and the rest have said about you.

Vague as fuck and you'll probably hate me for it too

[Xayzeck]

Is your read on me based primarily on what others have said?

Yeah, more or less. Driving tons of people to L-1 is good, but it feels like you were just going around looking for claims almost, and hiding that under a town agenda. This, and everything else everyone has said, doesn't sit well with me.

So wait, let me get this straight - You now feel that I am the scummiest person left alive at this point?.

No? I don't know how you got to this conclusion, just that you're not exactly townier than Mora at the moment.

I also don't understand why you think the Mora lynch is a trap? What do you mean exactly by it's a trap?

And Mala, if you don't pick up the play we're going to have a big problem, especially if you make it to LyLo

[Xayzeck]

Xayz waffling through out day 1 on his town and scum read on me

I have? And what read change were you talking about when addressing 732?

BBT, I've never sheeped Mala on enomis? I voted him for my own reasons.

I relooked the Jcoz cop comment since people aren't sharing the same thoughts as me. At first, I thought he was just town waiting on cop report, and later on he thinks that cop legit had a report because cop didn't die. Now looking back at it, it seems really awkward and stiff, but if he were scum, he'd know why cop didn't die, and he'd know cop wouldn't get a report, so I don't really understand this coming from Jcozscum?

Anyway this is as much as I can do now from school's computer. Lesson's ending, I'll take a look at Mora when I get home.

[Xayzeck]

Can you show me where your reasons are for voting Enomis in these posts please?

The more I read, the more it looks like an OMGUS vote.

Man, this Enomis wagon gets crazier and crazier.

538 would be it.

It could be natural OMGUS, but I simply felt that he had an incredibly weak push on me, and I saw that as scummy.

I looked at the Shinobi case, and here's the thing. I had a townread on Mora earlygame, and that's kinda gone everywhere given I don't know how to sort him. He's had a great play early D1, and I don't think he would be freaking out as scum over the fact they wouldn't get a lynch end D1. If anything, I think it's scummy if he didn't try and help wagon someone end D1, so unless I'm skipping over a shitton of details right now, I don't think he's scum anymore. Shinobi I've had as town for a very long time now, and Mora's case doesn't exactly make me go "Oh shit, I've been townreading scum this whole time". So no. It just feels like you want to enter D2 with some sort of scumread, and you just picked Shinobi for reasons I don't understand. It doesn't feel like you're convinced yourself of Shinobi scum tbh.

I can't sort this game out for some reason, BBT and Jcoz feel jumpy and off with their interactions with each other for the last few pages, and this is kinda different from the BBT that was playing D1, he seems awfully more aggressive D2.

So basically, I'm not going to vote for Shinobi. BBT is no longer a strong townread, and Mora is no longer my strongest scumread, and today, for me, it'd be between BBT and Jcoz.

I would ISO BBT to see if there's anything super scummy that I've looked over, but he has too many fucking walls it'd bore my balls off. I'll do that another time.

@mora: If you're still considering Shinobi scum, who would be buddy?

Jcoz is at L-2 right now, and I don't have a ton of time today. I'll read the more recent pages in detail when I've got the time and drive.

[Xayzeck]

You're pushing a shitton harder, and you never did this D1, at least not to my memory.

Right now, you're aggressive as hell, you probably can't see it because you're doing it though.

Jcoz has pointed it out too, you're jumping to conclusions, and you feel a lot more on your toes as compared to D1, where you felt more relaxed. Again, also linked to aggressiveness.

Of course, scum want to drive a mislynch, but town need a lynch too. Saying that it was a panic lynch and it was solely scumdriven doesn't make sense to me at all. Nearing deadline with wagons all over, there's townmotivation in paniclynching someone, because nolynching is antitown. Of course, if you've drawn the conclusion that it's scumdriven, then that's up to you to base your reads on.

[Xayzeck]

Yes you are. You're asking a lot more and pushing a lot harder compared to D1.

The way you've been approaching interactions and just the vibe I've been getting from you strikes me as aggressive. I'm sure as hell you've done more than just what you've said though.

You are jumping to conclusions and calling things a lot more D2 than you are D1. D1 felt a little more relaxed and passive.

Both wagons end of D1 were not universally townread or scumread. You would be calling it paniclynch and scumdriven regardless because someone had to hammer their townread either way.

You seem to be scumreading Jcoz right now yes? So if it is a scumdriven wagon, why are you looking at Jcoz the most when he was offwagon?

@mod: VC please

[Xayzeck]

Point being: something happened at night, and I'm leaning scum QT interactions.

Everybody joined the enomis initially for a simple reason: They thought Mala was town, they didn't like enomis. That's basically why I hopped on, why Shinobi hopped on, and obviously why Mala hopped on. I don't see how you've drawn the conclusion this was scumdriven, paniclynch or not. You and Jcoz on the other hand, decided to stay OFF enomis, and I think you knew pretty damn well the Mala wagon wasn't going to be taking off. Why didn't you hop on enomis? Scared you would attract attention for voting someone you announced to be a townread?

[Xayzeck]

Activity has slowed way down, and I admit I haven't been active in this game.

Prod dodgy kind of post, but also to get Jcoz back in here,

VOTE: Jcoz

L-1.

[Xayzeck]

On a side note, I'm also beginning to think we should have lynched Mala.

Why, do you suddenly think she's scum?

[Xayzeck]

K. Sorry about my inactivity. Just I feel I got the game figured out so it's more me waiting on flips before anything else to see if my theory is right

How many more flips do you need before you are going to deliver?

[Xayzeck]

@mod: please prod/replace Jcoz

[Xayzeck]

This game is just waiting on replacements tbh

we've got a frozen deadline, and there's a good chance we'll get an extension, depending on the mod

[Xayzeck]

so I've kinda been very "ehh" about this game

walls aren't helping at all

give me an hour-ish and i'll address the last page or so

[Xayzeck]

Really overall I don't see any thought process of his that is genuine, none of the reads match his prior thoughts or his actions. All his movements and stances taken read as an attempt to fit in for instance the read change on Mora today, the Enomis vote, the Jcoz vote. Really there's no original content from him just a whole lot of fluff, filler and attempt of staying out of the limelight which is all scum motivated.

ehh

this is a good way to discredit what I have done by generalising my play

[Xayzeck]

Yes you have. Is it because you rolled scum?

Also i have seen the current posts however I can't respond unless you want accidentally unnecessary walls.

Nope, just haven't been as motivated for this game since my reads are pretty eh too

I'd like less walls please

[Xayzeck]

In Post 539 Xayzeck says he has Jcoz as null town, in Post 728 he quotes one of Jcozs posts and calls it pretty town, in Post 728 he has no good read D1 but towny D2 but in Post 743 Jcoz is her 2nd strongest scum read but in Post 799 he says Jcozs reaction doesn’t make sense as scum and then flips around again in Post 826 he says BBT and Jcoz have jumpy interactions and then suddenly in Post 851 he puts Jcoz to L-1. If you factor in that he himself stated that putting players to L-1 is a scum tell since it potentially rolefishes the doctor in Post 713 this all looks awful.

lol

some things I've got a problem with

no good read D1, 1 towny line D2, and what I said was that if it were a tossup between him and Mora, then my choice wouldn't be as clear. you're twisting what I said, because at that point he was not a strong scumread, he was a null-nulltown while I had stronger townreads on everyone else

you're acting as if Jcoz did aboslutely nothing between 799 and 826, and that's complete bullshit. He had a longass interaction with BBT, and my read changed from that. Again, you're twisting my reads into a sudden 180.

and again, putting playersssssssssssss at L-1 potentially rolefishes the doctor. This is just 1 player, JUST Jcoz. even more twisting happening. And suddenly put him at L-1? I don't think it was that sudden?

[Xayzeck]

"Twisting" is a weird way to describe the thoughts of an un-cc'd claimed cop.

how else do you want me to describe it

I don't think it's relevant whether he's conftown or not, the point is that a lot of the points he brought up are fairly out of context and inaccurate

[Xayzeck]

What you said is that you'd lynch Mora over everyone other than maybe Jcoz which means that out of everyone in the room the person you think is the 2nd most likely to be mafia is Jcoz (It actually objectively means this, so you trying to argue otherwise is humorous).

except that I never said he was a scumread at the time

[Xayzeck]

There's no real explanation behind how you've suddenly dropped your town read on him and instead want him lynched. Really this is the thing with most of your reads, they change based on what most of the thread seem to be thinking which is scum that's trying to fit it. Like I said; no original content.

I didn't like him in his interaction with BBT, and it gave me a reason to think he was scum? That's how it works, no?

[Xayzeck]

It was sudden there was no real natural progression of read whatsoever, you just put him at L-1 and given that you said putting people to L-1 that you don't intent to lynch is a scum-tell (Even if it's just 1 person) and in your vote post you state the intention isn't to post it's insanely scummy. But cool you think I'm "Twisting", why would I be twisting? Tell me that? I'm looking at what's in the thread and posting my analysis on it; you're attempting to de-credit a clear right now p much.

Except that I intend to lynch Jcoz

Why are you twisting? Because a lot of the points you brought up and I addressed are very out of context, and I'm telling you what's wrong and why I don't like it.

[Xayzeck]

Yeah, but you didn't say he was wrong. You said he was twisting your words. Pretty evident implication there, and I think you messed up.

vote Xayzeck

the fuck?

if I said he was twisting my words, that means he's distorted everything I've done

"but you didn't explicitly say he was wrong so u scum"

[Xayzeck]

1) Moras Post 29 brought up a fantastic point; there's a disconnect between Xays town play and his play here. Xays reaction in Post 30 was an attempt to deflect the attention elsewhere and is worsened by the fact that in Post 31 he states he intentionally did an anti-town action to be questioned about it; reads as scum fabricating an excuse under pressure. In Post 41 he's stating that he doesn't believe those votes are scum tells but is still pushing Selfie as scum for the action which doesn't mesh in the slightest. So Xay is essentially claiming 1) His town meta/theory changed from his last game to this game, 2) That he intentionally acted in an anti-town manner to get FoS'ed for it 3) That he doesn't believe that those L-2, L-1 votes are scum tells just anti-town but Selfie is scum for putting someone at L-1.

I think I also talked about this L-2 thing earlier in game.

Saying from my last game to this game is pretty inaccurate, I play in multiple games at once, and read games every once in a while. You make it sound like my thoughts on L-1 and L-2 early in the game changed overnight, they didn't.

I L-2'd someone to get questioned for it, yes.

I believe I said I put Selfie is scum for L-1 BEHIND RVS. That is scummy to me. I see scum motivation in trying to hide L-1 behind RVS, but I see towniness in blatant L-1.

2) Xays reads in Post 109 and Post 160 don’t mesh, his explanation of part of it in Post 307 is beyond dreadful; suggesting that you’re happy and want to lynch a town read makes zero sense.

That's because 160 was a lynchpool of active players. I keep D1 lynchpools to 3 people, and only 3. They're the bottom 3 people of a scum>town list, and if it includes a weaktownread, then the weaktownread goes in. Having a 2 person lynchpool gives the impression I have the scumteam D1, and that isn't true. In fact, that rarely happens.

Reads list in Post 326 is equally as bad and contradicts his Post 327 given that his reads should point towards thatguy being very likely PoE scum.

327 wasn't a serious thing you know

There’s also the fact that in Post 445, Post 454 and Post 538 he has Mala as town but throws her into “nullundecided” in Post 539, it looks like trying it might be setting up to get town cred upon a town flip without actually fully preventing it from happening.

Mala townread was largely meta based and pretty old by the 500s I hadn't gotten any new content(from what I can remember) so I was considering the possibility that she may not be town.

In Post 634 Xay states scum are Enomis and Wolfy, Enomis is lynched D1 and flips town, Wolfy is NKed N1 and flips town yet in Post 726 she says

“Wolfy wasn't going to get mislynched anytime soon”

which doesn't at all fit with him having Wolfy as scum; there’s also zero reaction from the flip or the lynch from him.

I think I was the only one scumreading Wolfy though? Or at least, one of the few. Wolfy was townread by most of the playerlist IIRC.

[Xayzeck]

1) I didn't "Mora is a weirdname vote" or "Mora has a weirdavy vote". I just hopped on the wagon. Unless you would like to call it RVS, but I don't.

2) Having 2 people you want to lynch very much gives the impression you have found the scumteam, and that was not the case. But I can see where you're coming from with it being pointless to have a townread in my lynchpool. I'd like to know how this is alignment indicative though?

3) He is scum via PoE, but I expressed then that I was not looking to lynch a lurker. If I had both lurkers down as scum, I would be pushing for people who wouldn't defend themselves, have scum join along, and potentially give scum 2 mislynches.

4) Meta townread > Townread got boring > Became null read > Mala wagon happened > townread renewed

That's what happened. I didn't go out and get her sorted out with a Mala-me interaction, because I didn't need to. Once the wagon picked up, she started flailing, and I read it was townflailing.

5) If I were town I would have come into the day pushing him? He's dead.

[Xayzeck]

hi f16

you're scum aren't you

and so many posts and words, and I'm sleepy right now. will address them really quick

[Xayzeck]

4) Not buying it but okay you've ignored the larger section of that; I don't see you interacting with anyone in the game in a manner where you're trying to further your read on them.

5) I'd lynch you for what you said in this bit alone really, you're trying to dodge around the point which is stating that someone "Wasn't going to get ML'ed" when they die makes no sense if you scum read that person yourself since if you're town and they lived you'd have been pushing on them.

4) My approach to this game is different, sure. I've taken a more passive stance. This is your strongest point though? This is what you're going to push as the bulk of your case one me? Kinda iffy, no?

5) I don't get what you're trying to say then. If Wolfy lived, I would still push for him, problem being he DIDN'T live, so this is a hypothetical situation, and I can't see how this is relevant?

[Xayzeck]

there was a lot less addressed to me than I thought lol

[Xayzeck]

oh F16 hasn't caught up yet

you've got stuff to do then

[Xayzeck]

I call people out for L-2 and L-1 a lot, and I learnt that it isn't really alignment indicative, and even now I push it because it helps get things started.

I did it this game to be pushed.

I got pushed way fucking harder than I expected to be. Comparing meta and shit. Like sure, I'd expect to get pushed a little, but not to the extent where Mora dug up my meta and pushed it strictly as a scumtell, I panicked the fuck out. I pushed some of the suspicion to Selfie, but I said why I did the L-2. After that shit I haven't had drive for this game except for small peaks here and there.

I don't like him comparing meta, as accurate as it may sound, I've only played with F-16 once (to my memory at least), and in that game I was just starting out so my play wasn't very developed yet. I don't think he knows me THAT well tobe able to meta me with so much confidence. Rather, it just feels like he's going to take my towngames and generalise them to make it look like I obvtown pretty well, and take my scumgames and generalise them to make it look like I'm quiet and awk as hell. Problem is, 307 I was scumread as well, and I got flashed to L-1. 299 was my first scumgame. None of these 2 hold any significant value or insight to what my town and scumgame are like, unless you actually experience it for youself.

And I've explained the other stuff like the Selfie vote and what not

[Xayzeck]

HAHA SO THATS WHO IMPACT WAS I WOULD HAVE NEVER GUESSED

yeah anyway I'll get to this game when I'm home

[Xayzeck]

And the point about the nightkill is massive, if for instance you’re town and got nightkilled it would be very unnatural for me to come out and say you were nightkilled because you weren’t going to be msylnched when I was planning on pushing on you but that’s what you’ve done with Wolfy.

I think maybe you've misunderstood the mislynch comment?

Wolfy was pretty townread by majority of the playerlist, I thought he could be scum. I thought BBT or Shinobi would have died, because they were my stronger townreads and most of the playerlist had them as town too. Wolfy never got wagoned D1, and hardly got suspected at all. He wasn't going to get mislynched anytime soon, but had he lived I would have pushed him anyway until I thought he wasn't scum.

If I'm misunderstanding you here, please enlighten me, because I really don't know where you're going with this point.

[Xayzeck]

I am town as fuck and you better see it sooner rather than later.

you've got like 4 posts, what? your slot doesn't exactly set you up to be able to say this.

[Xayzeck]

I know your play better and you feel scum, scum, scum here. Do something about it!

You pretty much played with me in one of my better towngames, if considering the bulk of your case to be meta, I don't understand this. If you see such a big difference between that towngame and this, then I find it hard to believe you're still giving me a chance to town up? Are you just trying to get some towncred for when I flip?

[Xayzeck]

Your point about scum finding it a bit more difficult to defend themselves actually makes sense though, given that a lot of they stuff they post will be lies and that is difficult to keep up for a whole game (unless you just don't post a lot and when you do it lacks a lot of content; points finger at Xayzeck and Mala).

From your last few posts, even though I've read them I couple of times, I still can't figure out how you're reading me. You seem to be constantly jumping between null and scum?

[Xayzeck]

Soooooooo...... straight up confession. Ok.

lol

how exactly?

[Xayzeck]

gaining towncred for when I flip-> trying to give me a chance to explain myself so that when I flip he doesn't look bad for just coming in and jumping on a mislynch

was it that hard to get?

Also, I don't want to claim unless I absolutely need to.

F-16, deadline should be a factor on when to provide or content or not. What's the point in stalling content? And also what's this about me reacting more strongly against your case on me because I found out you were Impact? You said it yourself you haven't caught up completely, so I'm holding off.

[Xayzeck]

lol i actually left this tab open and i didn't press send

[Xayzeck]

VT

which I didn't want to claim because it's the most awesomest role

F-16 is still scum, buddy is probably Mala or Mora

[Xayzeck]

Mala hasn't done much despite this being quite an important stage in the game, though I myself am guilty of this.

Mora was good early game, but as the game rolled on he began fucking up my thoughts on the game

Basically he just feels like a tornado messing up town fmpov until I've got no idea who's what anymore, and I dunno whether this is intentional or not, but I see no reason town want to do this

[Xayzeck]

Except that I can't convince people because I don't do cases?

I've been low activity this game because my reads have been all over, and given how I started and shit I haven't been super involved either. There were periods where my activity in this game when up, but they didn't last very long.

Basically I've got townreads on people, and PoE gives me scum:
BBT is actively contributing, pushing the game forward, from D1 til now
Shinobi came off as super town starting with pushing BBT(I think it was) for reads, and though his activity has dropped every once in a while, he hasn't done anything to even lead me to suspect he is scum

Mala started out as town because her play resembled what I've seen from her, but as the game progressed the meta read wasn't enough to keep myself convinced.
Mora started out protown, but like I've said he's kinda just tornado'd my reads all over, and probably intentionally, and that could be intentional.

F-16 though, has played with me a couple of times, and he hasn't caught up completely so I haven't said anything about him, but first off, he's played with me a ton.
He should have a good grip on what my towngame is like, and he's seen my scumgame too. Given the experience he has with me, and the experience he has with mafia, he should be able to figure me out, and he's done an awful job at it so far. I thought it was because he hadn't caught up completely, so I didn't really bother poking at him about it.
And holding off content until 2 days before deadline? I see no reason someone like F-16, as town, would do that. He replaces in, rolls scum, pushes someone, and disappears hoping to ride some towncred to deadline. Lovely ain't it?

[Xayzeck]

You're going to have to explain the bolded for me using some specific post examples because I'm not seeing it at all?

I don't know if I can use specific posts, but in general he's just messing up my head in this game. I'll see if I can find specific posts, but this is a "how he has played in general" thing.

[Xayzeck]

Explain your town read on Shinobi a little more from me; 1) What did you make of his "meta" excuse of "strongly town reading you" 2) What did you make his turn around to later agreeing with the scum read on you and being happy to lynch you 3) What do you make of my point in Post 1052 that since I've replaced in he's done absolutely nothing to contribute or post content but instead has just fillered and answered peoples questions.

1) Hm, I dunno, I think I'm the only one in the playerlist he is familiar with, so he's probably going to throw out a read on me first, and to label it as a strong townread is a little fishy, but that could just be him trying to look confident in his reads, which I generally see coming more from town than scum
2) This came muchmuch later in the game, while the townread was super early on. I'm sure you've had experiences where you townread someone, only to scumread them later, yes? The strong townread was probably not as strong as he made it out to be too.
3) Well, if I try and look at it from a Shinobiscum perspective, he's been one of the pushers for this game. Having a conftown replace in and do the same, I see no reason for him to stop, unless we're looking at a possible Shinobi/Mora or Shinobi/BBT scumteam, where his buddy was also a big role in the game, and could worry less about active posters scumreading him, because his buddy as active enough to influence that read. I don't think it's that big of a deal, I could see town taking a backseat for conftown.

And mostly Mora's end D1 play where he just starts going all over the place. I can't really give you specific posts because it isn't specific posts that explain what I'm feeling, so I'd say somewhere in the middle of the first page of his ISO. Of course, if you disagree with my thoughts on this, I understand, because this could be a playstyle thing rather than alignment indicative. I'm just leaning alignment indicative over playstyle.

I agree that Mora has been protown, that's how I saw his activity early game. But as the game progressed I got the protown vibe from BBT and Shinobi, whole Mora was just kinda wilding out all over. It seems we've got 2 different views on his play, but I have to agree that he's contributed a lot in activity lulls. Mala is probably scum over him.

Anyway, I have to go for the night, I'll try and phonepost tomorrow at school if:
I have time
Less walls

p-edit: holy shit you ninja'd me twice when I try to submit this stop

[Xayzeck]

So yeah, I won't bother holding reads in the back now. I'm pretty positive Mora, Mala and BBT are town. I have the scum team inside of [F-16, Xay, Shinobi].

I've got scumteam in {F-16, Mala, Mora}

I'd say Shinobi is pretty darn town, are you scumreading him because he's backed off since you replaced in?

ok going off now nights

[Xayzeck]

Great. Well, hammer was a mistake. Jcozmo and FFF are the same person.

how does this justify the hammer?

[Xayzeck]

On second thoughts, I don't know if Mora/Shinobi makes that much sense especially since Mora was the one who called out Shinobi on the Wolfy case. But I keep getting this weird feeling that Shinobi knows Xayzeck is town and the only way that could be true is if he is scum with Mora. I'll look for the quotes if the thread doesn't get locked.

Why does Shinobi have to be scum with Mora to know I'm town? He could just be scum, period. Can you elaborate?

[Xayzeck]

EXCEPT, as my alt Impact, I actually suspected him when we were both town and once pushed an L-1 flashwagon on him but backed off and then wagoned someone else. So, I am not entirely sure he would have an expectation that I read him correctly when past experience has shown that it is at least somewhat murky.

I believe that was when you met townme. I don't know for what reason you didn't townread me in that game based on what you saw from scumme in Scumhunters, but I recall you having a diamondhard townread on me after that flash, or at least toward the end of the game. It doesn't matter you scumread, by the end you're probably familiar with me as town, since I was one of your strongest townreads, and that's not murky at all.

[Xayzeck]

1) He stated you were his STRONGEST town read in the game purely due to meta reasons (Can you please at least ISO him and take a look at it yourself. 2) His town read changed purely due to my opinion and no new information, his reasoning was "I'm just agreeing with you now man" pretty much, take a look at it. 3) He'd stop because being active = having me interrogate him which is something scum would want to avoid?

1) Yes I'm aware of that, and I've already told you what I thought about it. Are you perhaps looking for a different answer?
2) If you had a townread on someone, but that person didn't do anything, it would make sense to keep townreading them, right? And I get that you find it fishy he just sheeps you on me, I find it fishy too, but a) you're conftown and b) listening to people is part of the game. Combine those two together, I can still see his behaviour coming from town as much as I can see it coming from scum, so I can't agree this is a scumtell.
3) Possible. I personally don't like his excuse of "oh i'm letting someone take over the lead of town because he's conf", because you can make just as much contributions as town. The thing is, he is one of the leading people in this game along with BBT and Mora, and in the event they are both town, wouldn't you agree this is a pretty ballsy move? Unless we're looking at a Shinobi/Mora scumteam, I don't think him backing off with your entry is a BIG scumtell, but I understand where you're coming from.

[Xayzeck]

I mean, I just can't argue against any of this. I agree, let's lynch Mala. I have pointed out numerous times how inactive she has been on both days but particularly on D2, but nobody seems willing to listen. She then glides in and provides one post which is a shining beacon of town-like activity (my assumption of how people read Mala's posts, not how I read them in case that wasn't obvious) and leaves again for days.

If you're agreeing with an F-16/Mala scumteam, why are you so eager to lynch Mala over F-16? What difference would it make?

[Xayzeck]

I don't agree with this. There must have been specific posts when you started thinking 'What is Mora trying to do here?' or 'That's a little confusing and doesn't make sense' etc etc, I would very much like to see some specific posts.

I already said, end D1 play, where I would scroll this game and be like "mora wall ugh what's he doing I'm so confused what why", go and take a shower, grab a cola, sit down and look at this thread and be like "ugh don't feel like drinking this anymore"

I cannot pinpoint any specific post that made me feel this way, I've already tried to explain what I didn't like by pointing you towards his end D1 play, what are you so insistent on specific posts?

[Xayzeck]

You do bring up a valid point re; Xays “I won’t claim unless I absolutely have to” looking like a doctor soft-claim, would like an explanation about that whole thing from Xay when he comes online though I have a feeling I might know what it might be due to.

didn't want to claim unless at L-1 with intent, for no reason at all. It was only when you pointed out it looked like I was setting up for a doc fakeclaim that I realised I needed to claim VT straight up and not leave it hanging to avoid a potential CC.

as for why I decided to respond to claim comments in such a fashion, I've got no idea

[Xayzeck]

Also uh oh, I have a feeling I might not be living through the night as well actually.

What makes you say that? There's still doc, scum won't risk rbing someone and kill you, only to have them not be doc?

[Xayzeck]

Also uh oh, I have a feeling I might not be living through the night as well actually.

Hammer reads null now

[Xayzeck]

ignore derpquote

[Xayzeck]

If doc outs now, we'll have 2 clears, the job will be pretty easy from there on.

[Xayzeck]

At least, I think that would be the best strategy for our current situation

[Xayzeck]

Post #1162 isn't true.

but you claimed anyway?

[Xayzeck]

Soooo.... I'm clear now, yes?

no shit sherlock

[Xayzeck]

I know it sounds stupid, but we just finished up a game where Xayz was a scum-rb'r in a previous newbie and his play is similar to that game to here. The only difference is that he attempted to defend himself from the lynch this game whereas he didn't do much persuading there to not lynch him, now he's doing effort which it was one of his downfalls there so he's trying to avoid being lynched here.

"this is like his recent scumgame but not like his recent scumgame"

did I get that right?

anw gotta leave my com now will post on phone if i get the chance

[Xayzeck]

im baffled how you ruled out mala to be scum with me

im not saying its a bad move tho

[Xayzeck]

You can put a line through Mala and myself as well. Been after her all game so it would seem unlikely that we are a team wouldn't it?

I've bussed before

[Xayzeck]

We dont have confscum though?

[Xayzeck]

Unless im too slow to catch on

[Xayzeck]

Ahh so thats how you got conf

Didnt you cone with the malaxay thing not being a thing? Brb reread

[Xayzeck]

Wasnt it you who ruled out me-mala?

[Xayzeck]

I get that he would conf himself if HE ruled out me-mala

But you did that? So I'm a little lost

Unless you're saying that "as well" implies he too agrees me-mala isn't the scumteam?

[Xayzeck]

Bbt is super conf now

So mala/bbt!

[Xayzeck]

Mainly because you can't protect yourself

[Xayzeck]

Hmmm

@mod: Would a hypothetical doc be notified if he attempted to target an invalid target?

[Xayzeck]

And then lied about his (public) role PM.

How?

[Xayzeck]

But you didn't know that.

Are you implying he should have known because he's doc?

[Xayzeck]

I'm not ruling anything out, but why didn't BBT CC right in the beginning?

well, i've been put in a similar situation, and I only cced late in the day

I had confscum, all I had to do was search for a buddy. of course, it isn't the same situation as this game where there is confirmed doctor, in that game the cop died the day before so the scum claimed doc in lylo. I just held back the claim and called it a fake claim, and tried to draw some associative tells and what not

although it isn't the same situation, but my two cents

[Xayzeck]

IM NOT SCUM THOUGH. Holy living fuck stop because if I'm lynched today town loses.

there are things that people should say in lylo

this isn't really one of them

[Xayzeck]

Good god if we do end up lynching the Rb'r please cop me so I can confirm myself inno, Ty.

"holy shit my partner is screwing up i'll just go all out with this shit"

Mala why does this feel so forced?

[Xayzeck]

I'd rather lynch Mora as it's a conf. scum for me, but Regfan has suggested he is more willing to lynch outside of the doctor claims so that leaves me with you.

But if he's confscum, why are you not pushing for him as well? Just because our conftown is looking to lynch between Mala and myself doesn't mean you stop generating content with your confscum.

[Xayzeck]

@BBT, But the role pms in the main post don't say anything about self protection? So why did you say it was in the role pm?

[Xayzeck]

Then what did you check? The pms in the main post are the same as the pms you would receive.

[Xayzeck]

And only now you're clarifying this?

[Xayzeck]

And I still don't think lynching in the VT claims is the way to go. It's lylo.

I don't think this has anything to do with anything? Rather, lynching in the VTs makes more sense.

[Xayzeck]

Just think about it for a second.

If I was lying, why would I not check to make sure what I was posting was the truth? I'm much more likely to make that mistake through telling the truth in an off the cuff manner.

panic and pressure are pretty good reasons. kinda like flailing, where you would grab on to anything just to make yourself look more believable

although this is not a scum specific trait, so I do see where you're coming from

[Xayzeck]

I claimed vT in Day1. Xayz claimed it last day phrase because his hand was forced.

Also this does not feel like town Xayz.

have you played with town xay? I can't remember

[Xayzeck]

Gut doesn't like this. Feels like he 'instantly' believes the claim.

erm

he had no cc? and we've been expecting a doc since D2?

in case you couldn't tell, I wasn't exactly typing with the happiest of tones when mora claimed doc

[Xayzeck]

I forgot this game existed

Mora - You're trying too hard.

wow what a shit response

[Xayzeck]

@mora on the selfprotect: Funny you brought that up, because when he said he selfprotected, my first thought was that it was a scumslip

only after I posted and it sunk in a bit, I realised that it wasn't a scumslip, and that normal doc could've done that as well

they just weren't aware about it

I checked sample PMs and nope, didn't say anything

It'd be horribly stupid of me to realise this and ignore it, given that he could very well be doc making a newb as hell mistake, and losing us the game

[Xayzeck]

I can see Xayz being partners with both

so opportunistic

[Xayzeck]

I'm town, and I'm predicting you won't see a quick Xayzeck lynch.

if you're scum

you won't be seeing it too

useless post

[Xayzeck]

Something about Mala's flip out at me felt genuine, and I've scum-read her ALL GAME.

setting up for

"hah she's scum I was right all along"

and

"oh she's town, i was right at the end there"

[Xayzeck]

Hi i'm still alive

BBT, Refgan was not fence sitting at all? Fence sitting is not being sure of something, and you can go both ways about it.

What Refgan was doing was leaning towards a certain side, but still not certain as other options are more obvious to him.

Get it right maybe?

[Xayzeck]

woah

holy shit

if mala is here it's game over

[Xayzeck]

Also I have quotes from Xayz and when he flips scum he's setting a pretty nice mislynch up on me in a lylo situation if he's not the RB'r

This is the quote that if Xayz flips scum he's setting me up for a mislynch. Regardless of his possible goon/rb'r status.

it's quotes like these in her iso that are just straight up weird

[Xayzeck]

i would do a case but it's one hell of an iso, and you seem like you've made up your mind

and it's one hell of an ISO to do a case on holy hell

[Xayzeck]

gws mala

[Xayzeck]

1342 is real as hell though

[Xayzeck]

hiya mora

i was rewatching darker than black recently

i saw your name in there

[Xayzeck]

I am the town tho

Perhaps you should wait for the flip