Newbie 1654 - A Game of Poker [POKER GAME OVERRAN]

[makara]

It begins!

VOTE: Nosferatu

[makara]

Question for everybody:

How much mafia experience do you all have?

This is my second game here. I play some irl mafia and I used to play lots of Town of Salem.

[makara]

It's probably not within the size constraints.

[makara]

Why did you feel the need to form a counterwagon when there were just two RVS votes on you, with the second not saying "wagon ho" or anything like that?

[makara]

Well I had the option to carry on with fractured single votes or double someone up. Went with the latter. Sounds as though you don't like my verbiage in saying counter wagon. Am I right?

Yeah. I dislike your characterization of two RVS votes as a wagon.

[makara]

@kim - why would you even consider putting someone at L-1 this early with the risk of a complete newbie hammering by accident?

[makara]

@kim - why would you even consider putting someone at L-1 this early with the risk of a complete newbie hammering by accident?

I'm considering it tbh.

For what reasons?

[makara]

Lol the NGR police are here. My bad my bad...let me be nothing but serious and laser focused from now on.

The contradiction of this site being so slow paced but with people who scream scum when you say anything NGR makes me laugh a little. And the word chafe does too.

I just need to go play a turbo. Nos will hate this post

what does ngr stand for?

[makara]

@overfl0w and @crashing_waves - thoughts right now?

@espeonage - why a wagon on TSO?

[makara]

Nosferatu is probably town.

is this a soft cop claim or just a town read/gut feeling?

i doubt it would be a soft cop claim - cop wouldn't have a chance to investigate yet

[makara]

After reading through the thread i'm reading panther as town and dislike the wagon on him.

I missed espeonage's post 57 so you don't need to answer my question in 60. I agree with his reasoning in it that we need to get this game started so VOTE: tso

[makara]

After reading through the thread i'm reading panther as town and dislike the wagon on him.

I missed espeonage's post 57 so you don't need to answer my question in 60. I agree with his reasoning in it that we need to get this game started so VOTE: tso

So was your comment in 60 asking why a wagon on TSO an attempt for reason to join?
This is just a sheep vote for me.

Yeah, it is a sheep vote. This vote was to move the game forward and actually get a wagon going. If you had actually read my post you would know that I missed espeonages post where he gave his reason for voting. It doesn't help that tso is lurking. After the recent drama I might move my vote elsewhere but I don't see a strong enough reason to yet.

[makara]

I saw espeonage's vote for tso while skimming

I didn't see his post explaining it

I asked why

I noticed the post later while checking the game and agreed with the reasoning so I voted tso. That's why I said that he didn't need to answer my question.

[makara]

there was already a wagon starting on tso. if i'm trying to get the game moving i'm going to vote for a pre-existing wagon

i'm still not quite sure what your objection to my vote is - is it that i'm actually trying to advance the game?

[makara]

i have a bad feeling about overflows vote - i don't really like or agree with the reasoning behind it

it feels a bit forced

i did say i didn't like the panther wagon - my reasoning in the vote was that I wanted a non-panther wagon to advance the game

[makara]

ic/se lurker is worse to me since 1) they should be expected to participate to help the newbies and 2) as a newbie in my first game i was sorta inactive at some points because i was super lost but an experienced player knows the ropes.

[makara]

idk about crashing waves honestly i'd like to hear more from him before i make my mind up

[makara]

@kim - what exactly do you find scummy and what is the scum motivation behind it?

[makara]

Mod can we get a VC pls?

[makara]

VOTE: crashingwaves hasn't posted much content at all, and feels like opportunistic scum hopping onto the Nosferatu wagon.

[makara]

@Kim, I don't understand your logic that something is so scummy it's towny. Can you explain this?

[makara]

VOTE: panther punt

first game on here, im excited

ive played a few on other forums, and on epicmafia chat room type games

@overflow He says right here that he's played on a few other forums.

Nosferatu is probably town.

is this a soft cop claim or just a town read/gut feeling?

not sure what the point of this post is from a town perspective, I don't know why you would point out any crumb type things until the person actually makes a claim

heh thats why them called newb games

fluff

UNVOTE: panth
VOTE: Nosferatu

then you have this which is just sheeping a popular non-RVS wagon with no reasoning involved

I'm pretty happy with the Crashing wagon right now. He says he's played on other forums, but he still is not giving reasoning for his Nosferatu vote.

[makara]

@PantherPunt - what's the scumtell in 104? is it the last part?

[makara]

Everybody in the game - huge quote walls are unsightly and usually unecessary - please spoiler or shorten quotes

[makara]

@Pantherpunt and Kim I really dislike your logic on too scummy to be scum. It essentially rewards scummy behavior and if someone is displaying scummy behavior it should always be heavily scrutinized.

[makara]

I have no idea why bluntly telling you how completely useless the first 6 pages have been so far and disliking your case on Nos has made you annoyed. If you actually think you have a legitimate case, then be as articulate as you can in explaining why, before I explain how you're wrong.

tbh saying that the first 6 pages have been useless sounds like a lazy excuse not to analyze anything

[makara]

@Nosferatu, why is your vote still on CW?

[makara]

also i'm moving my vote back to tso VOTE: tso i really dislike most of what he's posted - not much game content, just mostly dismssing the first pages

@tso what is your reasoning behind 35? i don't like how you ignored nosferatu's question about it, if you're posting a statement like that you need to give reasoning. also, what is your reason for your dismissal of all of the game so far - I personally think the panther/nosferatu interaction has been interesting.

@nosferatu i'm having a bit of trouble following your case on panther - are you still scumreading him for the buddying thing?

[makara]

@TSO - there's nothing I find particularly alignment indicative but I don't think it's been completely useless and dismissing it as such is anti-town at best. I'm already forming some resds.

[makara]

No, what I mean is that there's nothing particular that jumps out as SCUM! other than crashing waves, but there's always potential to do analysis and saying its completely useless is a just an excuse to not analyze.

Anybody who doesn't have any reads yet is either lazy or scum.

[makara]

I don't think crashing is coming back. currently i'm reading him as disinterested scum.

@tso can you link me to some recently completed scum games of yours?

[makara]

does anybody else have ideas? I feel like this game has majorly slowed down.

[makara]

reads list incoming

Spoiler: reads

vedith

- does well with questioning, good insight about the game

kim

- seems to have pro-town motivation behind posts.

overflow

- hasn't been participating much in scumhunting but i'm giving her the benefit of the doubt since that's basically how I played in my first noob game coming from tos

nosferatu

- agree with much of his case on pantherpunt.

espeonage

- pretty much null. there hasn't been much content from him

pantherpunt

- his case on nosferatu is weak and sorta feels like looking for a reason to scumread someone. i also didn't like his intentional trolling 47-49

t s o

- see vote above. i'm also not satisfied with his answers to my vote

crashingwaves

- pls post moar. more likely be disinterested scum but really I'd like to hear from his replacement (assuming he will be replaced which is the most probable) before putting my vote back on him.

[makara]

VOTE: Crashing_Waves

I'm like 99% sure he's scum. Especially since he was active today but has declined to post anything at all.

[makara]

V/LA until Thursday

[makara]

@LicketyQuickety – can you actually justify your scumread on me? The first time I voted with Espeonage was to get the game going, which is a town motivation. Second time I voted TSO and explained my scumread on him. Also where did I sheep a scumread?

Lickety is not being honest with his argumentation which is a big scumtell to me. I see no reason to move my vote.

Vedith vs. Panther is TvT, and Kim is a strong townread of mine. That leaves me with LicketyQuickety, Espeonage and Overflow. This group probably contains both of the scum. I have a scumread on Lickety for because of the whole CW situation and his dishonest argumentation, a scumread on Espeonage for his “derp”hammer.

[makara]

You know what. I'll take it back. Pre-Flip associations are bad. I still think we need to flip markara. I really do think they are Scum. I admit my case on Esp is not as strong, but I am still Sus of Esp for not pointing out that markara was sheeping a Scum read.

You can flip me. Poor Lickety, you'll look so scummy when I flip town

@Lickety, how would you read C_W?

[makara]

also i'm moving my vote back to tso VOTE: tso i really dislike most of what he's posted - not much game content, just mostly dismssing the first pages

@tso what is your reasoning behind 35? i don't like how you ignored nosferatu's question about it, if you're posting a statement like that you need to give reasoning. also, what is your reason for your dismissal of all of the game so far - I personally think the panther/nosferatu interaction has been interesting.

@nosferatu i'm having a bit of trouble following your case on panther - are you still scumreading him for the buddying thing?

I have no idea why bluntly telling you how completely useless the first 6 pages have been so far and disliking your case on Nos has made you annoyed. If you actually think you have a legitimate case, then be as articulate as you can in explaining why, before I explain how you're wrong.

tbh saying that the first 6 pages have been useless sounds like a lazy excuse not to analyze anything

"No reasoning for voting TSO"

[makara]

Your whole reason for voting with Esp was the sheep vote and you not that much later said they were your second strongest Scum read.

who is "they"?

This one vote is your entire case. I've already explained my reasoning on it, to move the game forward. TSO wasn't looking especially towny and I disliked both of the wagons.

[makara]

Your whole reason for voting with Esp was the sheep vote and you not that much later said they were your second strongest Scum read.

who is "they"?

This one vote is your entire case. I've already explained my reasoning on it, to move the game forward. TSO wasn't looking especially towny and I disliked both of the wagons.

They is Esp. I don't know many people by gender so I just say them or they. But yeah, what I meant by that is that what I said could easily be written as "Your whole reason for voting with Esp was the sheep vote and you not that much later said

they

Esp were your second strongest Scum read."

wat?

I never said anything about Esp being my second strongest scumread or anything about scumreading him at all until day 2. The first time I gave reads was 100 posts after the vote on TSO. This is a complete lie, and it only proves my point about dishonest argumentation.

Arm of Suspicion: LicketyQuickety

[makara]

also i'm moving my vote back to tso VOTE: tso i really dislike most of what he's posted - not much game content, just mostly dismssing the first pages

@tso what is your reasoning behind 35? i don't like how you ignored nosferatu's question about it, if you're posting a statement like that you need to give reasoning. also, what is your reason for your dismissal of all of the game so far - I personally think the panther/nosferatu interaction has been interesting.

@nosferatu i'm having a bit of trouble following your case on panther - are you still scumreading him for the buddying thing?

@TSO - there's nothing I find particularly alignment indicative but I don't think it's been completely useless and dismissing it as such is anti-town at best. I'm already forming some resds.

reads list incoming

Spoiler: reads

vedith

- does well with questioning, good insight about the game

kim

- seems to have pro-town motivation behind posts.

overflow

- hasn't been participating much in scumhunting but i'm giving her the benefit of the doubt since that's basically how I played in my first noob game coming from tos

nosferatu

- agree with much of his case on pantherpunt.

espeonage

- pretty much null. there hasn't been much content from him

pantherpunt

- his case on nosferatu is weak and sorta feels like looking for a reason to scumread someone. i also didn't like his intentional trolling 47-49

t s o

- see vote above. i'm also not satisfied with his answers to my vote

crashingwaves

- pls post moar. more likely be disinterested scum but really I'd like to hear from his replacement (assuming he will be replaced which is the most probable) before putting my vote back on him.

This is what I get for being an airhead. You had TSO as your second strongest scum read and me as your first. IIRC its because we have lurked and not much else besides that. So I see that you actually were sheeping a Null read instead of a Scum read which is not as bad. That makes my case on you much weaker I'll admit.

So at this point I'm just going to give my Town reads which are Panther and Kim.

Only my first vote could be called a sheep by any means.

Again you are lying. My scumread on C_W was not only for the lurking but the unexpected L-1. My scumread on TSO was for his flippant dismissal of everything in pages 1-6

Post 163 wasn't referring to what tso had posted, but the content of the first six pages of the game

What are your reads on Overflow and Vedith

[makara]

Vedith, how do you feel about the wagon on you?

[makara]

Vedith, how do you feel about the wagon on you?

This is the worst question anyone has ever asked int eh
histoey of evers

But its not.

Scum tend to react differently to wagons on them.

[makara]

Ok then what's the point of reiterating his suspicions. That's fucking weird.

And nah, I figured coz of tyhe whole defending thing/

It's to convey that I am extremely suspicious of it.

Why are you insisting on arguing about "appendages of suspicion" instead of scumhunting?

Appendage Of Suspicion: Espeonage

[makara]

EBWOP: To convey I am extremely suspicious and emphasizing how suspicious it is

[makara]

Read 300.

[makara]

I have decided we are lynching Esp today. Nothing about their play in this game is Pro-Town. With the incessant excuses for their play and a hammer that never should have been there is no excuse not to lynch them this game day.

VOTE: Esp

Don't try to lead. You are just as scummy if not more scummy than Espeonage

[makara]

What makes your focus switch from me to Espeon?

[makara]

What makes your focus switch from me to Espeon?

Because I have youself, overflow and Esp as scum and I really don't see you and overflow teamed here.

Explain further. Why don't you see me and overflow?

why tho
- Nosferatu

[makara]

Ok then what's the point of reiterating his suspicions. That's fucking weird.

And nah, I figured coz of tyhe whole defending thing/

It's to convey that I am extremely suspicious of it.

Why are you insisting on arguing about "appendages of suspicion" instead of scumhunting?

Appendage Of Suspicion: Espeonage

I am scum hunting. I am however very unorthodox. I have wagoned people in the past for using such things. I hate the whole concept of it and am glad it died out. The main reason I dislike it is because it removes a lot of accountability for pushes, which is definitely scum motivated, and if you want to push a different scum read then just say as much and explain your prioritisation. (Hint: Something Lickety is avoiding right now)

So yeah, I'm scumhunting.

Here's the thing. In this case, I had already been voting LQ before he replaced in and using the Arm of Suspicion was the best way to re-affirm my push and emphasize his scumminess. Since my vote was already on him, I'm accountable for the push.

The Appendage of Suspicion on you was mostly facetious.

[makara]

@overflow what are your thoughts on lickety and espeonage?

[makara]

Vedith, what do you think of a Kim/PP scum team here?

Is this a suspicion of yours?

[makara]

Busy right now but I will post my quick thoughts

I think vedith is town, which pts scum between overflow, espeonage and kim.

@espeonage - thoughts on kim?

[makara]

lol

[makara]

Now, given there is no reason to bus here

false

[makara]

I am ready to vote Vedith.

is this an omgus?

[makara]

btw

v/la tomorrow

[makara]

Just checking in. Will read thread later + post when I have time.

[makara]

@0verflow, what are your reads right now?

[makara]

@Kim, what are you thinking right now?

I still think the scumteam is Espeonage and Kim/0verfl0w. I'm pretty sure Espeonage is scum.

[makara]

Spoiler: This post tho

That's pretty ironic... Panth dies and then you still say I'm scum.
I would say Kim is a scum

Panth dying gives the following;

Focus onto me as he was suspecting me and only me
Focus off Kim as they were being suspected as a team, take out the partner suspicion and the focus goes (in theory site).

And I think that you are Kim's partner. But it still doesn't explain the TSO kill... The other person I would expect to kill with Kim on this would be Over.

votecount 1.6 (final)

Nosferatu

(5) -

PantherPunt

, 0verfl0w,

Kim

,

Crashing_Waves

,

Espeonage

Crashing_Waves

(2) -

Nosferatu

, Vedith

T S O

(1) - makara
0verfl0w (1) -

T S O

Not voting (0) -

With 9 alive, it takes 5 to lynch. Deadline is October 18, 3:30 GMT-7 or in (expired on 2015-10-18 03:30:00).

votecount 2.6 (final)

LicketyQuickety

(4) - makara,

Kim

,

Espeonage

,

LicketyQuickety

Vedith (1) -

PantherPunt

PantherPunt

(1) - Vedith

Not voting (1) - 0verfl0w

With 7 alive, it takes 4 to lynch. Deadline is October 25, 20:30 GMT-7 or in (expired on 2015-10-25 20:30:00).

So we see the same 2 names to help with 2 fast lynches.
Both wagons were scum driven, and scum rushed.

What happened to your Kim read?

[makara]

@makara: How did I lose my strong town read that you gave me in 300? Is there a way I can get it back?
?

It's mostly PoE. I think Espeonage is more likely to be scum than you though.

[makara]

I've had some things come up in real life and I will be unable to maintain a regular posting pattern.

Please replace me out