Newbie 1656 : Game Over

[MoosyDoosy]

Moosydoosy replaces coolkyledude effective immediately.

hello everyone. Will read through the thread.

[MoosyDoosy]

I am just going to stop by and say that it's hilarious you all could not understand goodmorning's posts. It's a good chance to get reads.

[MoosyDoosy]

Sakura, supplying a comprehensible reason to vote sticks out. As scum you'd be more careful to avoid such contrast, wouldn't you (care to wifom-dance with me)?

I don't really understand. What post is where Sakura provides a valid reason to vote someone?

[MoosyDoosy]

lordj-why are you voting no lynch and why was it a problem for you that a player was at L-2?

i said no lynch and will change that to no vote if need be, basically i just dont have anyone at that momemt that i wanted to vote for. i unvoted LoHa because she was at L-2 and from what i had seen of her i didnt see anything that would say shes skum. i started to reread the thread before work and jsut finished and still cant really say i think shes skum but cant say town so i got a neutral feeling for her.
why dont i want someone at l-2/l-1 already were only what 3 days into the game we have plenty of time to look and delve into things we dont need to lynch someone RIGHT this second.

i think with someone at l-1,l-2 they will feel extremely pressured and would act alot different trying to save themselves then they normally would.

after rereading and looking more or less just at lohas posts i feel like the case on her is basically jsut off previous off site mafia games that they may or may not have played together cant really say its a good case so im going to VOTE: ether because i feel she is just wanting to lynch someone anyone, stated the case on Loha it stuck with a couple of players if it didnt stick she woulda jsut made a case up on someone else

Interesting to note this. Especially as my reads progress.

[MoosyDoosy]

okie, I'm basically caught up except for Page 9 because I feel too lazy and like a bum. Also because I scrolled through briefly and saw long posts and wasn't in the mindset to slog through them. So just some thoughts on people:

goodmorning

- town. good morning to you. Posts freely and shares thoughts, pressures points, and dealt with pressure nicely.

SilverWolf

- town. Actively asking questions and sharing opinion freely.

Ether

- town lean. Posts freely and seems to be pursuing what she wants. Only off-putting thing was when she lay a trap for a reaction by voting for LoHa and nobody reacted to it so she had to pursue it awkwardly by herself.

Mightymandarin

- town lean primarily because he's a newbie, but be wary. I don't like how he came into the thread trumpeting that he was a newbie and I'd like to see whether he keeps pulling the newbie card or not.

And then some other notes.

LoHa

- I hope you don’t say that Sakura’s accusation on goodmorning was good. Because the whole premise on that is false and the fact that you keep generating WIFOM conversation off of it would basically mean all of your posts were BS and filler.

coolkyledude

- Misinterpreted goodmorning’s posts but didn’t seem to get the 3 or so explanations from her afterwards. Means kyle isn’t exactly reading the thread properly.

lordj210

- Awkward posts. Not to mention he literally contributed no reads to the thread except for one wishy-washy post. Seems to spend a lot of time discussing voting mechanics and nothing much else.

OceanWind

- Made one post which I disagreed with and went off. hm…

I don't know if that's everyone, but that's where I'm at right now.

@LoHa

, please answer my question.

@lordj210

, please share more reads and who you're looking to pursue.

@coolkyledude

, please share who you're looking to pursue.

@OceanWind

, I’ll go over your post again and point out the things I disagreed with.

Any questions, feel free to ask~

[MoosyDoosy]

Any questions, feel free to ask~

coolkyledude - Misinterpreted goodmorning’s posts but didn’t seem to get the 3 or so explanations from her afterwards. Means kyle isn’t exactly reading the thread properly.

?
Also apparently you missed a read on me.
Amished tell?

Oh yes! You're a solid null and didn't do anything too noteworthy that stuck out either way. This may or may not be a bad thing.

[MoosyDoosy]

Amished tell?

Actually, maybe not.
Still kinda awkward you point a read on your predecessor like that.

oh I see what you mean. :/ I replaced for coolkyle. I guess he didn't read the thread properly because he didn't have much time.

[MoosyDoosy]

hm? I guess I'll have to look back at OceanWind and SilverWolf interaction. I'm glad you realized why your Ether read was terrible. Tentative town lean because you're having the same thoughts as me on lordj210 which is always a good thing. Just would like to hear what alignment you think that makes him.

[MoosyDoosy]

@OceanWind

Yeh, I’m not up for a SilverWolf lynch today. I think you might be getting tunneled and you’re reaching a bit. Not to mention SilverWolf was actually fairly active and not being minimal at all so I don’t really see where you’re coming from.

So I’ll ask again. What do you think of lordj210? And for another question. What do you think of LoHa?

[MoosyDoosy]

I think I'll be happy with this vote.

Vote: LoHa

[MoosyDoosy]

Can we lynch LoHa. The man is bad. He thinks Sakura’s posts on goodmorning were “good” and “sheepalicious” and goes on to start a WIFOM conversation off of them. But Sakura was just misrepresenting what goodmorning had said like the others. What’s even stranger is that Sakura was actually one of the later people to misrepresent goodmorning’s posts so I don’t know why LoHa specifically pointed out Sakura.

The point behind my question was to see whether he really thought that Sakura on goodmorning was “good” as everything he had posted would have been based off of a misrepresentation, making any posts he made filler and BS. To which he just deflected my question.

[MoosyDoosy]

Can we lynch LoHa. The man is bad. He thinks Sakura’s posts on goodmorning were “good” and “sheepalicious” and goes on to start a WIFOM conversation off of them. But Sakura was just misrepresenting what goodmorning had said like the others. What’s even stranger is that Sakura was actually one of the later people to misrepresent goodmorning’s posts so I don’t know why LoHa specifically pointed out Sakura.

The point behind my question was to see whether he really thought that Sakura on goodmorning was “good” as everything he had posted would have been based off of a misrepresentation, making any posts he made filler and BS. To which he just deflected my question.

You said this before you asked the question, if I was scum I would've compromised my play and answered accordingly to appease you, in an attempt to get you off my case. That's the last wifom from me, since it doesn't seem to sit well with anybody.

PS: if you don't know why Sakura stood out just then, you can't be helped. She gave the only sheepable argument att. I'm enjoying all the clumsy attempts to paint me scummy but I'm also sad that it won't stop. I like my day1 casual and respectfully distant.

Ether, are you going to be this neurotic about me being scum all game long? I think it's pretty clear who your nr.1 scumspect is without you reformulating it each and every time. What do you think that does anyway. How do you find scum? Finding someone you do n't seem to resonate with and neurotically, exaggeratingly deathtunnel that person seems suboptimal to me, at least on day1.

I like my D1 where people answer simple questions.

[MoosyDoosy]

starting my reread now

Hey GM, why you call a vote for lordj20 a good vote in the same post you vote LoHa, i call shenanigans!

ddi we ever see an answer to this i dont think we did as the next page goes on about asking a question that was already answered, would be this question that got unanswered

goodmorning likes SilverWolf.
LoHa voted SilverWolf.
goodmorning voted LoHa as a joke.

goodmorning said the vote on lordj20 was good because he agreed that lordj20 should get an avatar.

[MoosyDoosy]

What is RQS?

[MoosyDoosy]

Then in this case, LoHa's RQS was terrible. For some reason he picked out one of the later people to misinterpret goodmorning's posts, said it was somehow good, and went on to create a WIFOM based conversation out of it. WIFOM is something that is easily made up so I don't even see why a conversation should revolve around it and his conversation was based off of a misunderstanding in the first place. So no, his RQS should not be interpreted as townie in any way whatsoever. The fact that he tries to continue with it even after learning that the premise of his questioning was false is not something I like either.

[MoosyDoosy]

OceanWind? I feel that the guy is town for now. It's hard to judge him when he refuses to take part in conversation, but it'll be interesting to see how his reads develop over time.

[MoosyDoosy]

Um...okay.

XD Sorry that sounded super apathetic. My lack of interest is showing. o-o I just think we have a good lynch in LoHa and am just waiting to prod him with sticks.

[MoosyDoosy]

OceanWind? I feel that the guy is town for now. It's hard to judge him when he refuses to take part in conversation, but it'll be interesting to see how his reads develop over time.

You think he's town but you can't really say anything about him because he's not participating in the discussion?

Ummm............What?

The way he's trying to figure out the game makes me think he's town. Although it's rather annoying that he won't participate in discussion. Which is why the key to finding out if he's scum is to look at how he develops his reads over time and/or pursues them.

[MoosyDoosy]

Mightymandarin

- town lean primarily because he's a newbie, but be wary. I don't like how he came into the thread trumpeting that he was a newbie and I'd like to see whether he keeps pulling the newbie card or not.

Why is being a newbie mean he's a townread?

@MoosyDoosy

His questions were from the mindset of a newbie townie trying to figure out how to play the game.

[MoosyDoosy]

Mightymandarin

- town lean primarily because he's a newbie, but be wary. I don't like how he came into the thread trumpeting that he was a newbie and I'd like to see whether he keeps pulling the newbie card or not.

Why is being a newbie mean he's a townread?

@MoosyDoosy

His questions were from the mindset of a newbie townie trying to figure out how to play the game.

so he only asks a couple of questions and hes town yet i give reads and actually active and im skum??? can anyone explain this one to me (be nice if silver could explain it)

…Well it is my read so I think I should explain it.

It's less about the amount of questions he asked and more about the psychology behind it. If you look at the questions that mightymandarin asked, a lot of them came from the mindset of a townie trying to figure out how to play the game. If he was scum, I doubt he would ask any questions in the thread and just ask them in the Mafia only thread. So the fact that he's engaging in this thread with questions that come from a townie perspective lead me to believe that he is town.

HOWEVER, I can see him being scum if this is all a ploy to paint himself in an extreme newbie picture and gain the favor of town early on which is why I said that I disliked how he kind of barged into the thread starting with how he was a newbie. It's also why I said we should be really careful when considering him later on into the game.

[MoosyDoosy]

I come back to thread and nothing much has happened except OceanWind looking townier and LoHa looking scummier. -rolls in thread- So when is deadline?

[MoosyDoosy]

Sorry for the inactivity guys. I am feeling like there are people here who need to post more before I can get solid reads on them and as long as they don't, I don't have much to add.

GM is starting to concern me now. I feel like her scumreads are the easy reads-meaning mislynch bait if one or both of LoHa and lordj are town. She's handing out easy townreads to Sakura based on weak meta which she has said before she doesn't like to use unless it's recent stuff she's had recent experience with. Then she null's me who is also someone she's played in several games with including a recent town game-she scumread me hard there and a scum game-she townread me hard there.

I also don't like how she immediately questioned lordj on her town read on me and told her effort is not indicative of alignment. It's like she's trying to lead her into NOT townreading me because I notice she only questioned that and made an issue out of it. I get this strong feeling she's setting me up to take a fall in this game.

Think about it. Say one of her scumreads gets lynched and flips town. She is null reading me and discrediting someone who is expressed a townread on me and discredited the read as well. If I'm null to her, why is that a problem?

So I feel like she's setting me up for the next person to scumread if one of her scumreads flips town because I've been more than null this game and there is no reason I can't be leaning one way or the other for her right now, especially considering our very recent experience with each other. I can see the scum motivated plan in action much more than I can see town motivation in her overall gameplay right now.

This has been a concern of mine for awhile and I haven't been able to express it properly until I worked it out in my brain some but yep, this is what I feel is going on because if I was thinking about how I'd handle GM as scum in this game, I'd likely do something similar to deal with her familiarity with me.

VOTE: GM

Okay, I have no idea why SilverWolf was so hyper aware of herself in this post. o.O Looking at goodmorning’s posts on Silver prior, the only thing I can see that can be taken as a sign that goodmorning is looking to lynch Silver is listing her as null and that’s it. Otherwise she's talking about her finance test and about LoHa. I don't see why SilverWolf would care for her appearance so much unless she's Mafia.

goodmorning still looks town as a btw.

[MoosyDoosy]

Another thing I don’t understand is why we’re not voting for LoHa. I don’t see any real contributions to the thread from him and he’s universally read as scum. It’s stranger that people aren’t voting for him and are trying to push onto others. He should be our D1 lynch and then we look at the wagons and thread activity to see who was interested in saving him or not.

[MoosyDoosy]

these past few pages of back and frth has me extreamly confused now

Let me simplify it for you:

VOTE: Vote: LoHa

[MoosyDoosy]

VOTE: LoHa

Oops, there we go.

[MoosyDoosy]

I mean. When you guys started jumping at each other and pointing fingers, LoHa was just on the side sheeping votes, arguing about things on himself and over semantics. And sure, arguing over semantics to clarify a point is fine, but LoHa was just trying to claim something completely false. There's no way his intentions weren't to sheep when he literally just said he thought there were more votes on the wagon.

I just don't know what this man is doing. Whenever he comes in all he does is argue words, clutter the thread, and throw stuff at people. Most I can say is mafia or bad town that will screw us over later. And I'm pretty sure that he's Mafia.

I guess I

could

stop you guys from pointing fingers at each other and push LoHa's lynch more, but we do need to generate some discussion to analyze later down the line. But the main thing is that LoHa is doing scummy stuff and there's no way we're going to let him pass for it.

[MoosyDoosy]

So we're just waiting to see if he claims or not?

[MoosyDoosy]

I am 1-shot Bulletproff, a.k.a. Town Veteran (Standard Liquid Mafia Role on teamliquid.net)

My arguments and behavior have been extremely town and coherent, if you lynch me it's your own inadequacy, not mine. I am available for any and all discussion regarding supposed scumminess of anything I've done this game, and I'm confident I can argue my points objectively and logically. I am not responsible for your emotional or otherwise irrational assessment of the situation, but I can help you see the light if you care to make the first stem to disambiguate and make a case against me or something.

As for reads, it's pretty hard to distinguish alignments in this game, and my playstyle is most efficient if I live through day 1, because I mostly just probe for intelligence and the capability for objectivity and logic .. get to know people so to speak.

Hi n00bKing.

[MoosyDoosy]

Never thought I'd see you here, and especially in this game hm...? Well, at least things got interesting. mmm...I think I'll look over the thread again and at ISO's.

[MoosyDoosy]

LoHa if you really are n00bKing though, you should say so for real. Because then I can give an accurate read on you.

[MoosyDoosy]

@goodmorning, let us know who you're looking into. After reading your filter I don't really see you looking at anyone specifically. I'm also curious to know what you think of LoHa's claim as well.

Would like to hear the reasoning behind your current town reads and null reads too.

[MoosyDoosy]

So what I'm trying to wrap my head around is why LoHa would go out of his way to look as scummy as possible, say he wasn't doing things that he clearly was, and then claim a role and call us all dumb for it. mmm...to me it would seem that he should have tried to look as townie as possible rather than start shit fights with everyone, sheep wagons willy-nilly, and try to get on everyone's nerves by using semantics to draw circles in the sand. If he did look super townie, he would have fulfilled his job by absorbing a Mafia shot for one night. Hm...I'm actually going to keep my vote on LoHa and wait for him to answer my question on whether he's actually n00bKing or not.

[MoosyDoosy]

Sakura Hana looks town.

[MoosyDoosy]

btw, if we want to lynch someone besides LoHa that can be his scummate, I'm all up for the SilverWolf lynch.

[MoosyDoosy]

I don't think SilverWolf is scum with LoHa.

mmm...? Can you do me a favor and take a look at her ISO for me and re-evaluate that statement?

[MoosyDoosy]

[quote="In post 538, Ether"][/quote]
? What do you mean on this? Please elaborate further.

[MoosyDoosy]

...
Crumb your PR, always, in a manner as to be able to explain it persuasively but encoded sufficiently for scum not to make sense of it without the explanation; unless you're a moron and can't pull this off.

I don't, sorry. It was a long time ago, like 2008 or so. The forums there require "archive access," which is an additional paid feature, to look at things that far back.

I call bullshit on this. Url pls.

LoHa why are you bringing up something so late?

[MoosyDoosy]

LoHa I have a terrible memory. Please reiterate who your scumreads are again?

[MoosyDoosy]

I'd also like to know what exactly SilverWolf thinks of LoHa.

[MoosyDoosy]

So what do you think of LoHa?

[MoosyDoosy]

Yeahhhh I think my vote is going back.

Vote: LoHa

Also, what Sakura said about claiming is correct.

Answer my questionsss. What are your town/null reads and plz explain why.

[MoosyDoosy]

I'm back, reading the thread as it goes. Would like to hear more from Moosy andlordj210.

...this is slightly ironic.

[MoosyDoosy]

Starting to get annoyed/suspicious of Moosy not answering anything.

then vote me for it? Seems like that's the next logical step no?

[MoosyDoosy]

VOTE: MoosyDoosy

You tunneled LoHa all day and then tried to go after me when he claimed. You refuse to answer questions about it or address it at all.

I'm fine with this dying today.

I am admittedly fine too. Although the fact that you regarded me as an "object" is rather disturbing. Do I look that inhuman to you?

[MoosyDoosy]

VOTE: MoosyDoosy

You tunneled LoHa all day and then tried to go after me when he claimed. You refuse to answer questions about it or address it at all.

I'm fine with this dying today.

I am admittedly fine too.

Oh, interesting. Is this a tactic where you act so passive-aggressively and apathetically that people roll their eyes and ignore you? It sounds like you just don't want to play in this game. That's a shame.

I really don't tbh.

[MoosyDoosy]

To answer the question, my read change on SilverWolf was based around the fact that I read through her ISO and with an associative read with LoHa. While we're discussing LoHa, SW's doing her best to bring the lynch onto others such as lordj210 and goodmorning and diverting from LoHa. I also barely see any interaction between her and LoHa and the only point where she remotely considers him as a lynch is when she asks me for a case on him but then doesn't ask for a follow up which is in and of itself strange since she's pursuing my scum read on her doggedly. It's also strange since LoHa's been a big wagon and discussion point but SW doesn't really talk about him but mostly about others. You would think that she would say something about him at some point but there's really nothing. Her post about LoHa "going to claim" is really weird like she knew he was going to do it beforehand (scum chat) and right now she's still pushing hard off of him while trying to create wagons on other people.

[MoosyDoosy]

In and of itself, this looks like scum!SilverWolf aligned with scum!LoHa or scum!SilverWolf putting up a facade of not lynching town!LoHa to get town credit after the lynch.

I still think LoHa has done absolutely nothing and terrible things so I want to lynch him but I'm all up for a SilverWolf lynch as well.

[MoosyDoosy]

To answer the question, my read change on SilverWolf was based around the fact that I read through her ISO and with an associative read with LoHa. While we're discussing LoHa, SW's doing her best to bring the lynch onto others such as lordj210 and goodmorning and diverting from LoHa. I also barely see any interaction between her and LoHa and the only point where she remotely considers him as a lynch is when she asks me for a case on him but then doesn't ask for a follow up which is in and of itself strange since she's pursuing my scum read on her doggedly. It's also strange since LoHa's been a big wagon and discussion point but SW doesn't really talk about him but mostly about others. You would think that she would say something about him at some point but there's really nothing. Her post about LoHa "going to claim" is really weird like she knew he was going to do it beforehand (scum chat) and right now she's still pushing hard off of him while trying to create wagons on other people.

Can you see something scummy in SW aside from associating her with me or assuming I'm town. Because that's the more productive approach, don't mind me telling you.

unnecessary waffliness and some other things that OceanWind pointed out. mmm...

[MoosyDoosy]

At this point LoHa's tunnel is starting to annoy me, and i wouldn't be sad seeing him go even if he's a PR. I hate tunnelers, always have, always will.

I tunnel.

[MoosyDoosy]

o/ If you guys are so antsy about goodmorning I'm always around as a lynch target. To be honest, if one of you switches onto me the rest will inevitably tumble onto the wagon as well.

[MoosyDoosy]

o.O Mightmandarin's done an abrupt switch. He goes from asking newbie town questions to confidently formulating reads. mmm...

[MoosyDoosy]

I am not going to vote for goodmorning. For now eh.

UNVOTE:
VOTE: lordj210

[MoosyDoosy]

MightyMandarin should really vote though...

[MoosyDoosy]

Meh, me being around will just be a distraction later down the line so it's best to get me over with as fast as possible. :3

VOTE: MoosyDoosy

[MoosyDoosy]

Oh shoot, well killing me may be a bad idea lol.

This puts me in an awkward spot. I may or may not have extended night for all of us by accident. >.<

[MoosyDoosy]

Wait was there no night kill?

[MoosyDoosy]

ok lol no night kill is really strange then. Mafia probably just didn't kill anyone or they went after LoHa. Are there notifications if bulletproof vest is used?

[MoosyDoosy]

Meh, whatever.

I'm hard claiming Town Jailkeeper. I completely forgot my role tbh and didn't use it lol. Which makes no sense considering there was no night kill. This either means Mafia gave up and didn't kill or they targeted LoHa. mmm...but does LoHa get a notification if bulletproof vest is used?

[MoosyDoosy]

Can the Mafia Roleblocker kill if they use their action? mmm...that's the only set up that's possible if LoHa is bulletproof person.

Wow I just realized LoHa should have been confirmed town to me earlier through set up knowledge but I never checked the OP properly. eh. :/

[MoosyDoosy]

Actually, this makes no difference. This should be really simple for town to figure out if there's only one Mafia left. Continue with the lynch~~

[MoosyDoosy]

I mean, gut reaction says that it's probably someone voting for me. So....OceanWind, Mightymandarin, lordj210, Ether.

mmm...out of these four, the person who looks worse off is Mightmandarin.

[MoosyDoosy]

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Mightymandarin

Just for the counterwagon.

[MoosyDoosy]

I mean...it's suicide for scum to CC here as that would mean they would be lynched right after I am. So scum can't CC in this situation. As I said, scum is probably one of the few who jumped on my easy wagon immediately. Probs mightymandarin tbh.

Meh, I think it was pretty obvious that GM was pocketing me too for an easy ML after her own lynch but I guess people didn't see it that way. But it's a lot better it turned out this way lol.

[MoosyDoosy]

I dont think there was a no kill, it's really stupid because it increases the ammount of mislynches scum needs to win

7-1 at night > 7-1 Day > 5-1 > 3-1 > No Lynch? > 2-1
from
7-1 at night > 6-1 Day > 4-1 > 2-1
Well probably not as much as i thought.
I dunno, my gut says that Moosy's lying because no JK in their right mind misses their action during the night, but with no CC i have to take that as the very truth.

I mean....you can still lynch me. I would be completely fine with that too lol.

[MoosyDoosy]

I'm plenty sure lordj210 is town actually. He has a clean filter and while his spelling has been confusing, he shows how his reads have developed over time. I also understand why he voted GM at EoD as the case was going to be no lynch otherwise. Admittedly, he hasn't done much about his wagon other than to say that he's a mislynch but from what I've seen, there hasn't been a strong case on him anyway. Can people on his wagon explain why exactly they think he's scum?

[MoosyDoosy]

@lordj210, can you just explain why you did this early in D1?

You first say that no lynch is very bad for town:

Well, did they say why?

Well, it's been a few years. One guy convincing everyone to lynch me said "all you do is deflect." Like am I not supposed to address the points in the case he's making about me? Another thing was, they were all experienced players and were constantly referring to past games to make points about each other's scuminess. It seemed every post I made dug me deeper. Anyways, I never got how day 1 was supposed to work in this. There's always joke voting and people taking joke voting seriously.

It is bad for town not to vote, right? I'll go read the newbie guide.

from what ive seen and heard no lynching is almsot always bad for town weather the lynch ends up being a mislynch or not its still almsot always ad to no lynch

And then you proceed to do this:

ill be heading of to work here shortly but tonight i will be able to give more but right now i cant really say ive got much a read on anyone, and also to fix the l-2 that i dont like i will be

VOTE: UNVOTE vote no lynch for the momemt

Just wondering what the rationale was in taking an action you said was bad for town.

[MoosyDoosy]

I didn't vote for goodmorning because I still wasn't sure.

I agree with the case against Moosy. VOTE: Moosy

Which case was this?

And why did you think that me saying I didn't care was a bluff? ^_^ What made you think I really didn't care afterwards?

[MoosyDoosy]

This makes things a bit harder. I thought the game was in the bag but someone's playing well as scum.

UNVOTE: MoosyDoosy
VOTE: Lordj

My townread here is the weakest. Everyone who were voting Lordj is a townread, claimed JK, or was the counterwagon and there were also a lot of people willing to switch either way (SilverWolf, Sakura). GoodMorning and Lordj crossvoting isn't out of the question and scum-scum wagons are good for scum to get them out of a sticky situation if both are caught.

Did you do your re-read on lordj210 as you said you would? What about him do you think is scummy?

[MoosyDoosy]

I don't think he and GoodMorning planned it all out from the start. I do think that if he were town, she'd be putting in at least a little more than a token effort at derailing her own lynch onto his.

Especially concerning this @OceanWind.

[MoosyDoosy]

Just read through most of the thread (again) and who I'm sure

TOWN

are:

SilverWolf - healthy suspicion throughout.
Sakura - same as above; was willing to trade lynches with Ether
LoHa - definitely town as he locked on to GM from the beginning
lordj210 - healthy suspicion and was willing to have himself lynched; a target of what I believe was a scum counter-wagon.
OceanWind: Although he made a good case against GM, he did it rather late

SCUM:

Most likely is Ether - I know I said I retracted my statements about her, but this is how I feel after re-reading. She dismisses people's accusations instead of arguing against them; goes for attacking people's character/posting style rather than what they are trying to say; See: Her attacking OceanWind and LoHa on their posting styles instead of what they were arguing. Plays hypocritically, saying other people need to be more interactive when she admits to ignoring people on purpose. See posts # 362, 363, 364, 365. Also, trying to get a clearly suspicious, yet very active SilverWolf on her side by trying to start a wagon on LoHa.

Sorry I forgot how to link to individual posts. I wrote down the post numbers.

Moosy - seemed to be bussing goodmorning from the start. Claimed power role, but perhaps someone is waiting to counterclaim tomorrow.

WHY I AM TOWN:

I was against the initial wagon on LoHa on D1.

I, despite my last post about him, do not think lordj210 scum, and won't join the wagon on him.

I expressed my suspicion of goodmorning in one of my earlier posts. But later I began to second guess myself which lead me to incorrectly read her when everyone else caught on to her scummy behavior.

Reads lordj as town for being willing to die but doesn't townread me for that. lol. Also completely controversial to what you said earlier about me not actually caring about the game. Not to mention you failed to address my questions regarding that.

[MoosyDoosy]

Yeah, Mightymandarin is so bad here. Like wtf, i was town reading goodmorning the whole time so that can't be "busing" if I'm scum with her lol. Not to mention he townreads lordj for something he scum read me earlier for.

I'm also too lazy to check, but can the people he townreads (SilverWolf, Sakura, LoHa, lordj, OceanWind) confirm whether or not they scumread mightmandarin at one point or another? It's a common psychological thing for scum to townread the people that scum read them since they are technically right and as a buddying tactic.

[MoosyDoosy]

There is like no way he can townread lordj but scumread here. His townreading of lordj is also following thread sentiment from both me and Ether saying that lordj looks better. It's also really strange that mandarin is following sentiment from Ether but scumreads her. lol that is the opposite to do with reads from someone that you think is scum.

[MoosyDoosy]

It's a common psychological thing for scum to townread the people that scum read them since they are technically right and as a buddying tactic.

Eh. Not really.

I do think that he's just trying to hit as many notes that have either worked for him before or that he believes should work and hope some of them resonate with us--scumreading me after OceanWind and I expressed that his paranoia was townish and that we were weirded out that he'd stopped, deciding lordj was town and then immediately demanding to be townread for saying this in the exact same post, repeating that he thought there were 3 scum because no one saw it as a townslip the first time--but like I said, the first two wouldn't really bother me on their own. I just think it's too little, too convenient, too late.

Basically what I'm saying too. xd There's no way he can say lordj is town while scumreading both of us when we're the ones who said that lordj was town. It's an attempt to follow thread sentiment while pushing scumreads on random people and hoping they stick. What he failed to realize was that the thread sentiment he was following was from the people he was scum reading.

[MoosyDoosy]

Also, his whole response to OceanWind saying that no one was asking him for his opinion or considering it was overblown tbh. He was way too self conscious there as well since he was completely aware of how he looked.

Mightymandarin is definitely our best lynch here.

[MoosyDoosy]

I'm gonna predict the "Moosy is pushing mightymandarin because mandarin was right in scumreading him!"

Which is completely false because I made it clear where I stood before mm's post about scumreading me. Not to mention mm's reasons for scumreading me were absolutely false because I could not be busing someone I never voted for and it's just weird af in the first place for him to scumread me for something he townreads lordj for.

Meh, I'm done spamming the thread.

MM best lynch.

[MoosyDoosy]

I mean, all that shows is that he's super self aware? He knows how he looks and he's already thought of responses to how he looks.

[MoosyDoosy]

Also, it's completely possible that scum is Ether or someone else but I honestly don't care enough yet and I just want to clear up MM who's the obv scum in front of me.

[MoosyDoosy]

I want to hear MM before someone hammers him. If you have anything to say do it mandarin.

[MoosyDoosy]

I'm saying that his description of how he would play differently as scum--hiding behind his newbishness and throwing out reads without really bothering to make them make sense--is pretty much exactly what he did here.

Moosy, you caught the thing about you blocking LoHa if we do go to night, right?

If I block scum, do I block their kill power?

[MoosyDoosy]

huh. ok.

[MoosyDoosy]

I'm think we have the win in the bag. Can't see anyone outside of lordj or MightyMandarin being scum. We were fortunate that two people who were suspected a lot (LoHa and MoosyDoosy) both claimed power roles.

Reading through GoodMorning's ISO, her only interactions with MightyMandarin were to answer his IC questions. It's also odd that he was townreading GoodMorning while scumreading every other experienced player.

I'll hammer MightyMandarin. SilverWolf's point about GoodMorning pushing lordj for most of the game is one I agree with and tipped the scales.

We're waiting for MM for at least 1 day. No reply feel free to hammer him.

[MoosyDoosy]

tbh either way we're probs gonna kill him just to get him out the way as a big uncertainty. On the off chance he's town though, it'll be good to hear his last thoughts. This is great though because he can't claim PR since the two have already claimed. And even if he does, he'll be killed the next day/

[MoosyDoosy]

Nope, Mightmandarin dies here 100%. Someone should hammer. He doesn't answer any of the questions addressed towards him or respond to the cases against him. There's no reason to keep him around based on something as flimsy as sentiment.

[MoosyDoosy]

i like that MM gives us a god direction to look if he flips town wich by the sounding of it is that he will flip town

Really? Then who do you think is scum if MM is town?