Newbie 1667: Bushfire! (Game Over)

[ai_shuuu]

/confirm
Hi ppl ^^

Its my first time playing mafia game in an english forum. I have plenty experience playing this game off site, and eager to learn how it work here.

Lets have some fun ^^

vote : radical rat

for being radical

[ai_shuuu]

@goodmorning
I've read one of your game in 1656 up to page 20 or something, where loha claiming bulletproof and you vote him instead...

didn't dare to meta from just one game tough... >.<

@azoriussenate
do you have other (less custom) idea about how to start the game?

[ai_shuuu]

Happy monster day!!!

@goodmorning #12
Sry to bring that up :p
what do you mean by awful?
Actually i've read that game even before we know we will be playing on the same game for a reference
The way you play in which i can't follow you, makes me develop certain level of wariness of you.

@azoriussenate
Well actually im not really familiar with rvs too lol.
What do you think about the game so far?

[ai_shuuu]

^sry that i still cant shake this feeling lol

i have some opinion on Rat, but i'd love to hear more from azoriussenate, vetrock and mortfeld first

Be back when i get home

[ai_shuuu]

This is my early read to radical rat
#13, #22
Strike town to me
it make me remember how i play in my first mafia game. Whats a bit off is the pressure tough...

#24
strike 2.

But 2 strike in one page? Seriously?
Its kinda like he know where all the bait is and bit it deliberately...

However his recent post #41 are a good post and im pretty content with it
"The only motivation, Scum or Town, I can
think of for PC's actions( You're welcome to
refute this if my explanation is wrong by the way ), is an attempt to make friends.."

UNVOTE: Radical Rat

VOTE: azorius senate
You can call this a semi serious vote

the way you explaining your experience in this game when i basically just asking another way to start, sounds a bit defensif

[ai_shuuu]

@phantomcobalt #51
Dude, you still have your own vote on yourself -__-
Thats not really a L-2...

[ai_shuuu]

woot
Now thats L-1
(or L-2?)

[ai_shuuu]

@phantomcobalt
Now i dont want someone accidentally hammer you without giving you chance to claim, so you should move your vote somewhere else

@azoriussenate
#59
then you should do something about it
#60
well i think if a certain event in game didn't make you react, you will react to something that affecting yourself

[ai_shuuu]

btw does the self vote are categorized as OMGUS too?
Sry, i've read the wiki but i don't really understand...

[ai_shuuu]

i've met a scum claiming scum, i've met town fakeclaiming PR, so i'm not really sure how to aproach this self vote thingy...

@phantomcobalt
- one thing about a trick or strategy is once its out and more commonly used, its lost its magic
So, why do you keep using it? Especially after you get a bad result from your previous game?
How do you so strongly trust on your read on rat based on this?
i need your opinion on my post #52, how much it affecting your read?
I know im just resuming some question, but i didn't see your answer on this yet.

Btw you keeping your vote on yourself now starting to irritate me.
I don't want to put someone on L-1 this early in game, but in the other hand i don't like you nullified that option.

[ai_shuuu]

@phantomcobalt #95
Unless someone put it on wiki =/

@performer #99
whats new for me : rvs, hammer lynch, can't use pm (not really, have been playing 2 game where i can't use pm), semi open setup

sry i will do reread and catching up later, can't really do it right now

[ai_shuuu]

@phantom 157 <testing post tag
My first post in my attemp to post more than 10 post are;
I still don't letting you go without answering my question, i'd even jump on your wagon if its necessary. Now from where i see it, you doesn't even hesitate to push a lynch to someone else, not to mention your vote put him on L-1 with this reasoning
"104 doesn't strike right to me. Seems like
he's textbooking town on the uninformed
majority part."
But before i really do that i will make sure of certain things first.

[ai_shuuu]

@azoriussenate
127oh did you interpret my post 52 and 64 that way?
What if i told you that my real reason to vote you are "your lack of interest of the current game progress or finding scum or certain event as i mentioned in #64"?

106 which post of mine did you read as town?

[ai_shuuu]

^but surely that feeling or whatever are have some specific basic from my post right?

And also i'd like to hear from Goodmorning, 21
Her unexplained read of me are really worry me. I had certain warriness of her just like i said from the start and this not help... :/

After goodmorning answer this i will post more about her

[ai_shuuu]

^oh actually what goodmorning said is newbTown,
Well, i've been playing in 13 games (eventough the way we play are alot different there.), and moding 1 game. I'm not used to some rule here, like i mentioned before plus i forgot to mention unlimited vote and 2 weeks phase deadline.

[ai_shuuu]

uuughhh... Actually you're much bigger magnet than phantom is...
And im reverting back to my original playstyle unconciusly

[ai_shuuu]

@GM point me my mistake that give out my newbness

[ai_shuuu]

People I don't want to lynch today: Mort, Gm, Ai

Nullreads/hard to say: Rad Rat (having a
hard time reading RR), shrike (leaning town
on shrike), Performer (leaning scum on
Performer)

what really bother me on azor reads are :
He town read mort and nulling Rat when both of them are using the same reasoning to justify their vote on phantom; scum buddying a town. On top of that, i wouldn't read 56 as a strong post to town read mort, anyone can said what mort had been said.

He react so strongly on my first reasoning when i vote him but then he town read me when he think my vote on him is some sort of reaction test, or a push with no intent to lynch.
Well, i have to admit some of it is true, and somehow he had been generating more content recently. But i'm not really sure its because he had a wagon behind him or he really really want to do it.

And shrike...
Azor read shrike as lean to town by this post, correct me if im wrong
"Unvoting me taking me out of hammering
range. Me and shrike must be partners!! Case solved!"
Can you elaborate more on this @azor?

Then he Town read GM because some of GM's comment are somehow save him
Like when GM speak to performer "thats not it, thats not it at all"

I won't say anything about his read on performer and phantom tough. Both of them either doesn't have strong argument or (missinterpreting?) azor post.

[ai_shuuu]

Lol...
im sort of waiting him to do condensed read, and instead he claiming cop...
Didn't see this coming

[ai_shuuu]

first, how do ppl cc if you don't say your exact pr?
well, if its a fake
"This means I am one of {Tracker, JK, BP.} No, I'm not telling you which."
Only a cop can cc you, and thats bad move for a cop to do that when he can use his power at you instead
so, no. don't. It would harm town more than helping it
for now i'll take things as it is, unless some fact tell me otherwise.
One thing for sure there is either a jk, bp, or doc in this setup
===
Some say real hunt begin after someone died.
Will be back later to answer some question directed on me...

[ai_shuuu]

@GM ah... I see
If thats the case thats a smart move to do as cop
cc you and clear 1 ppl of his alignment

But idk, maybe im just getting paranoid after phantom fake claiming

[ai_shuuu]

@performer
190well, not so much involved when i vote him. To see this you should see his early post before i vote him @52

191
Town :
radical rat 52
Gm, well she's uncced pr. But even before her claim, she is true to his word

Scum :
Azorius

For another person ill try to get better read about them in this phase...

[ai_shuuu]

@performer
#97 define unique
#99 "Why? Because Rad's post and first vote on Phan (other than Phan's
self vote) alone, sounds Townie - but
combined with a possible town flip from Phan
- this would raise my suspicion-ometer."

You said that rad's vote on phan sounds townie but if its a misslynch you would suspect rad?
Didn'nt we misslynch ppl alot than we catch scum?

#191 how did you town read mort? In #98
You read him scummy...
Did i miss something?

#223 "One reason is because I defend valid PR claims no matter what town role I have."
Don't you get suspicious that phan claim before anyone intended to hammer him?

[ai_shuuu]

@shrike
#46 i guess thats GM's thing >.<
#209 "I agree with this to an extent and I've
realised that D1 lynch is not as important as
I'd been taking it"
Can you explain why D1 lynch is not as important?
And how did self vote is not bad gambit when i read it on wiki there is "don't don't don't don't self-vote" especially in newbie game?
Where its antitown behaviour, and playing for scum wincon?
Yes its get us out of rvs but we will talk about it over and over and over...
And then this, "Woah, this post is bizarre. It almost sounds
like a softclaim.
" you think he did softclaiming and you vote him instead >.<
Sry, i dont get this@shrike
#46 i guess thats GM's thing >.<
#209 "I agree with this to an extent and I've
realised that D1 lynch is not as important as
I'd been taking it"
Can you explain why D1 lynch is not as important?
And how did self vote is not bad gambit when i read it on wiki there is "don't don't don't don't self-vote" especially in newbie game?
Where its antitown behaviour, and playing for scum wincon?
Yes its get us out of rvs but we will talk about it over and over and over...
And then this, "Woah, this post is bizarre. It almost sounds
like a softclaim.
" you think he did softclaiming and you vote him instead >.<
Sry, i dont get this

@vetrock
123 "Sometimes you get lucky
and lynch scum, but mostly it is about who
makes mistakes."
Now we know that regardless of his alignment anyone can make mistakes, then how do you scumhunting?

[ai_shuuu]

@performer
"How come you ask me about that?"
Trying to see things from your perspective of course. This is your full sentence. "Although I've only seen self votes made by
folks in situations that lead to them being
outed as

scum

, your situation is unique to me."
When you said that pc situation is unique i get the feeling that you hinting that somehow that action can be justified. That there is possibility that those action can be done by a town.
In itself i agree... I've seen many things that a town would do in the name of scumhunting, or making trap or whatever "they think" its the right thing to do... That is why i use different approach to read pc.

But then in this post #99 you said that we should see rad in particular.
"... but combined with a possible town flip from Phan- this would raise my suspicion-ometer." Why rad? From my POV, it's look like you were trying to set up next lynch candidat when pc flip town.

#274"I've seen scum early vote someone. It's easy for them to jump on something and cause a wagon for that."
And i've seen town do that twice as much.

"How PC posted about Rad being a "VERY STRONG townread," led me to believe Rad & PC

were unlikely to be same alignment.

"
Why did you nullifying the possibility that there is a town vs town case?

#223 "One reason is because I defend valid PR claims no matter what town role I have."
Don't you get suspicious that phan claim before anyone intended to hammer him?
VOTE: performer

[ai_shuuu]

oh, btw i know my grammar is sucks, if theres something in my post that doesn't sounds right, feel free to point it to me. I'll rephrase it for you

#294
Overall this post is a good post, but pls avoid to use this emoticon >.<

[ai_shuuu]

V/LA

Will be in limited access for two days... Roughly...

[ai_shuuu]

^what do you think about this...

338
Yes, you have... but i want more...
________________
thats what im asking you... >.<
Why pressuring rad in particular? Theres vet and mort but you specifically mentioning rad which you read as town on the same post.
Whats wrong?
1. Because It's contradicting with your earlier statement that you read rad's vote are towniish "Because Rad's post and first vote on Phan (other than Phan's
self vote) alone, sounds Townie"...
2. Setting up next lynch candidat are a good way for scum to lead town from one misslynch to another misslynch...
Scum know that phan lynch would flip town and they use it to lead town to another false target...
________________
Oh btw i'm sorry that i'm wrong for missinterpreting the word 'unlikely' by nullifying the possibility...
Still, your statement leaning to the possibility that rad and phan are not in the same alignment so my case for you still stand...

_______________
And then #274
You unvoting rad after you vote him in #273
I see this as (backtracking? Backpedalling? Don't know the right word for this) bcs you see my post in #263. That vote, if you insist on it will sounds like you confirming my suspicion on you...

That or you somehow find it hard to lynch to RR

So how do you change your read to RR?

i'm back >.<

[ai_shuuu]

RR #380
ugh... All of it? >.<
Actually you have to ISO me to see this matter clearly
- To make it simpler, he would (blame? Pressure?) RR if phantom flip town. i found that contradicting with his early statement that RR's vote itself looks towny... #99
- #273 an omgus vote on RR
- #274 unvote
I see this as backtracking after he see my post accusing him in #263
Otherwise i didn't see how he change his read on RR so fast.
and another thing in this post that i 'd like to point out,
"I think I explained this in another post, but I stated that I would suspect Rad because I've seen scum early vote someone. It's easy for them to jump on something and cause a wagon for that."

since when this behaviour become alignment indicative?

"How PC posted about Rad being a "VERY STRONG townread," led me to believe Rad & PC were unlikely to be same alignment."

how do you come to that conclusion?

@performer
no... If you see my post #263 and #264 you would see that i'm also questioning shrike and vet
And you catch my attention...

Oh btw i that's not how i read meta...
If i'm towny i'll do this, if i'm scum i'll do that. That info can be easily twisted with certain wifom ifykwim

[ai_shuuu]

azorius 288
Why "pretty post" is necessarily aligment indicative?
About vet, yes i see that too. Actually i want to see how far vet would go for PC lynch. But his lack of activity make it hard for me... Oh well...
A question for you, if you're scum what would you do on day 1? Adding more fuel on Phantom lynch or sit around and see things happen from somewhere save?

[ai_shuuu]

@rad rat
You can also elaborate in this matter, if you think i'm wrong i will happily change my read on performer

[ai_shuuu]

@azorius #417
"My FoS on Rat stems from the reaction to my post about it. Rat has grossly overreacted in my opinion."
Which post? This? #308
Humm... I see your point...

"So if I'm scum day one I think I would make it a priority NOT to be the hammering vote on any townies. I think I would have voted and stuck on someone a lot earlier than I did."
Thats not what i'm asking you >.<
What i mean is, phan is digging his own grave in day 1. You had the same initial suspicion with me that his wagon are way too fast. It's an easy lynch from scum POV.
In that kind of situation i want you to imagine that you're scum, what would you do?
yell around "phan is scum, lynch him" or keep your hand clean of this?
and once again, thats not how i read meta.

[ai_shuuu]

btw what is reach of case means?

[ai_shuuu]

@GM can you point me where did performer show a valid read on vetrock?

[ai_shuuu]

"Why do you discount A?"
"Went back and checked, when I said C I
meant A"
"Why do you discount C then?"
Roflmao
Sry, this conversation strikes me funny.
But seriously can one of you tell me how you draw this conclusion from a no kill night? Or am i the only one whose being left out?

@shrike
"...before responding to gm's low effort jabs."
more roflmao
yeah... Sometime she also use a provoking word such as "i have an eye on someone" too >.<
But i know where this playstyle come from. It's a playstyle from someone who's being sheeped alot.
She's simply removing a "magnet".
Its a good thing that she's the closest thing to confirmed town. Or else we would have a hard time reading her.

@jake #448
"@Ai shue - what was the point in mentioning gm's previous game if you were not using it to meta him? Why did you read that game to begin with?"
In the first place, i read that game as a personal reference to adapt to some rule and gameplay that i'm not familiar with. Its a coincidence that i play with GM as an IC.
Well, in the end i use it as reference meta tough... I wouldn't say my meta would be valid from just one game. Becs to meta someone i have to either play with him or watch that game very closely as if i play in that game my self.
Anyway, since she's the conf town, i don't see the merit to point out this meta... :/

[ai_shuuu]

and more fast forward... Mort wouldn't answer your question

[ai_shuuu]

@GM
"I said it was a valid point that one might
want to PL any slots one doesn't want in
LyLo."
Hummm... I've been thinking this through...
About policy lynch, i will agree to this as the last resort if i only have town and null on my reads...

@timu & gm
A, C, 1? What about 3? seriously, i don't get it...

@performer
Rather than saying this, "If somehow I end up being lynched, I believe the current people voting me (ai & shrike) need to be watched for", it will be more helpfull if you can tell me why my case on you is wrong...

[ai_shuuu]

@shrike ISO me to see the entire case.
I'm ok with performer lynch, but are you? Now since the deadline are getting closer, we need to decide who to lynch.

And about azor, i change my read on him to lean town. Now i see the reasoning in his behaviour. I'll elaborate on this later.

Been back and forth login and logout but hardly post anything due to irl.

[ai_shuuu]

@jake i need your read list pls

[ai_shuuu]

@shrike
"I did ISO you. Pretty sure the arguments I listed were the only ones you made. Correct me if I'm wrong."

is it about azor?
I'm answering your question about performer...

@jake
"Gives scum a list who people think are town (who to kill) and who they think are scummy (who to frame/mislynch)"

Interesting... Yet intriguing >.<
Its the first time i heard this argument...
Ok, on the current situation i want to hear your opinion about no lynch, is it good for town?

[ai_shuuu]

@shrike
my case on performer
Basic question :
"What i mean is, phan is digging his own
grave in day 1. You had the same initial
suspicion with me that his wagon are way
too fast. It's an easy lynch from scum POV.
In that kind of situation i want you to imagine that you're scum, what would you do?"

My answer :
"2. Setting up next lynch candidat are a good way for scum to lead town from one
misslynch to another misslynch..."

What i found from performer post that somehow fit my answer :
"In my opinion, if Phan gets mislynched, we
should take a look at Radical Rat on d2, as he was the first person to call Phan out on the self vote being scummy.

Why? Because Rad's post and first vote on Phan (other than Phan's self vote) alone, sounds Townie - but combined with a possible town flip from Phan- this would raise my suspicion-ometer.

"

When i asking why rad in particular? Its his anwer :
- "I've seen scum early vote someone. It's easy for them to jump on something and
cause a wagon for that."
I don't know if this is the site meta that scum will early vote on someone but i disagree...

- "How PC posted about Rad being a "VERY
STRONG townread," led me to believe Rad &
PC were unlikely to be same alignment."

- "In terms of setting up the next lynch candidate to be Radical, I was saying that Radical would be highly suspect. This is a form of putting on pressure. What's wrong with that?"
Ok... if he say its a form of putting pressure... Then why rad? It still contradicting with his early statement that rad's vote sounds town. If he think rat's vote is town and he suspecting someone on that wagon, shouldn't he (FoSing/pressuring) another wagoner first?

"You unvoting rad after you vote him in #273 I see this as (backtracking? Backpedalling? Don't know the right word for this) bcs you see my post in #263. That vote, if you insist on it will sounds like you confirming my suspicion on you... That or you somehow find it hard to lynch to RR"
That...

And some of his self meta
make my suspicion stronger.
------------------------
Im on phone and on 8 hours trip. But i'll try to catchup. Btw tymu/mort slot is the only slot i haven't do iso yet.
How much time we have left?

[ai_shuuu]

Azorius
Thks btw to make it a list. you make it easier for me :p
-Azor was initially defensive ( 52)
"do you have other (less custom) idea about how to start the game?"
"Well I could introduce myself and give some background on what level of mafia I've played before. I'd say I'm somewhat of an... "
"Well actually im not really familiar with
rvs too lol."
Is this conv. even makes sense? >.<

-Azor wasn't showing much interest in
finding scum (64, 177)
Yes i do. Its the feeling that he somehow only addressing matter that been presented to him.
When i pressure him, he unvote mort instead. I mean... Come on, if you feel the need to get read on mort first, ask him question, pressure him, torture him, squish him hard... but not unvote him...
Or else you put your vote on someone else to add pressure... Its an advice that i steal from somewhere :
"Not enough info? Start asking questions. Not enough to go on? Attack something small. Others don't like what you say? Good! Every post in which something gets discussed, the town gets a little more info. As a townie on day 1, the most important thing is not to be right, but to put ideas out there and discuss them"

-He (ai_shuuu) disliked Azor's reads ( 210)
Been explained

Actually i want to see how he fare with 2 vote on him. What i don't expecting is perfomer and pc put him on l -1
_________________________
Now in day 2 i see the change in his behaviour. he come out of his comfort zone... Exchanging vote with rad with such intensity. I didn't say i agree with all his case, but i see his reasoning.

And then i see the reasoning behind his reluctantcy behaviour to pressure someone...
he want something solid for a case...
When he's attacked or attacking someone he want some solid basis
Thats why he reacting so strongly on my "initially defensive" case...
Dude, its almost impossible to build a hard case from zero point...

I still don't like his initial read on mort, his idea of sheeping, and "most town" thing...
But i go with my gut that he is mildly town.

[ai_shuuu]

oh btw vote for deadline extension too

[ai_shuuu]

mortfield
#56
personally im ok with his vote here. It put phantom on L-1 and give him pressure to move his vote elsewhere.
but his reasoning...
I believe that if someone accuse someone else buddying, he would hate that behaviour. But i see his first 2 post as mildly buddying azor and GM >.<

#71
Good question

#i don't like the way he present himself as newbie town #61 and #172. It sound like a back door if he make mistakes. As if he didn'nt want to take responsibility for his action (it sound hard but i cant express myself in a more mild sentence, srry >.< ). I like the way azor present himself better than mort.

#101 "As it stood he basically just was telling people not to discount the fact that the IC could be scum.
This seemed absolutely obvious to me, to the point of being superfluous, but I didn't want to say this and come off as defending the IC absolutely."
I don't see where rad's post being superfluous. IMO, its ok to be warry to the IC. As long as you still keep it under control and don't tunnel him all the way. At least, rad's post is good in the way providing something to discuss on day 1.

#128 good post. I agree to some point.

my battery is low, will add more soon

[ai_shuuu]

congrats gl and utl
And im really sorry for not completing the game due to rl
Ugh... Perfomer is the last person i thought is the doc...

[ai_shuuu]

lol never ever use this smiley >>>
I never tought ppl who use that smiley genuine with their feeling
Usually I use that smiley to give pressure to ppl by spamming it
this >>> better

What really frustrating with no lynch in day 2 is i cant bring more ppl in performer wagon. And the no lynch in day 2 is suck for mafia (i guess). When everything goes right, misslynch in day 2 will goes to mylo day 3. Thats what im aiming personally. Mylo is better than lylo for mafia right?

Then what makes me freaking out is i town reading azor so i tought he will hop on performer wagon too. But he hop on jake wagon instead... Ugh...

Still have problem with how long the game is played here, i guess i have to see my schedule before i can join into more game.
Oh btw now i know why i cant quote ppl, its the browser. Will try to fix this later.