Newbie 1680 - GAME OVER!

[BlueBloodedToffee]

VOTE: Bitten10minsago

He caught scum when he got bitten. I saw it.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

VOTE: SRMP

[BlueBloodedToffee]

You said you wanted a wagon.

I'm giving you a wagon.

Is there a problem?

[BlueBloodedToffee]

I mean, why would you ask for a wagon and then when you get it question the person who has jumped on?.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

I'm saying that to ask for support on a wagon and then question it when you get it seems awfully suspect.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

VOTE: ADK

This wagon looks even better.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

Thoughts on ADK and his wagon Dier?

[BlueBloodedToffee]

You should absolutely keep your vote on ADK.

There is no reason to unvote. People will talk whether you're voting or not.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

I mean, I don't know why you feel 'locked' into a vote when you just unvoted quite easily.

I don't get where you're coming from.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

We should still talk about other things. I will have various questions when I read up thoroughly later tonight.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

This does seem quite strange but why would he snap at the first person joining, unless he wanted to make a counterwaggon on that person?

Well, there is the reason you gave for one. It's also a very easy method of questioning that makes him look all inquisitive and townie like. The questions feel forced though based on the context.

There is also the off-chance that SRMP was his buddy and he got overly paranoid about a wagon starting. But that's just speculation.

The wagon is a good one and it got at least two reactions that I'd like to explore.

It's so good that you don't want to join it?

SRMP hasn't been around for a and I feel like pressuring bitten10minsago for not turning up yet :p

VOTE: Bitten10minsago

FOS:

ADK

Do you oppose the ADK wagon? I'm unsure why you're not voting him here.

I was looking for reactions to the wagon. I didn't "snap" at Garret, I merely questioned why he voted with me with zero reason or comments.

This is funny. It's funny because Garret turns up in the thread like 30 mins after this post. Would be the funniest shit ever if they were talking in the scum thread (ADK and Garrett) and that's why ADK got names mixed up in the main thread. Like, there is 0 reason for him to be thinking about Garrett in this post because he hadn't even been around.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

why are you jumping on the wagon in the first place?

Do you see how quickly we got out of RVS? Wagons create information and lots of it. It's the very best thing to do in RVS and isn't done nearly enough on this website.

My major scumread is on Rubixxx right now though. First they're on a wagon, then they're off when they start getting side eyed with a convenient shiny new townie defense. As a fellow shiny new townie, I'm not buying it. Not to mention the seeming intent to not piss anyone off or draw extra attention to themself.

This seems like such a throwaway right now when they've got no votes yet, but for now
VOTE: Rubixxx

I don't understand this vote at all?

How is being on and off the wagon scummy? Explain why they are scum actions and not town actions. As you stated later as well, it's actually flat out false as well.

Maybe I'm giving you more credit than I should, because the preemptive jump off the wagon is what really set off my scum detector. The fact that you're playing the newbie card by ignoring the others' advice not to and then actually getting someone else to read you as a townie just doesn't sit right with me. It seems too calculated.
Also, I guess I didn't really mean that you're trying not to draw attention to yourself, but rather playing your character incredibly strong to distract from your actions and potential underlying intentions.
I'll stick with my vote for now.

Why is him jumping off the wagon scummy?

Why is ignoring our advice scummy and how is he 'getting people' to read him as town?

You sure are clinging hard to this Rubixxx vote. Hmm.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

Rubixxx, even if you are town and not scum you are really doing a poor job of looking that way. All this energy you put into defending yourself make you come off as really defensive which, as someone who experienced it, is making you come off as scum.

At this point I think I may just unvote ADK because more evidence is suggesting you are suspicious.

Hmm, I didn't like your original vote and this confirms my suspicions. It's all based on speculation atm but it just feels off.

Can you explain why you think being defensive is scummy?

Genuine newbie question here: why would quickhammering be a scum tell? More than one person has said that it'd virtually be suicide for scum now, but I'm struggling to see why that would be so. I thought it was ideal for scum to quickhammer, seeing as it's a reliable way to push a vote through without any resistance.

I'm going to go ahead and trust the more experienced players when they say making a vote doesn't put us at risk of getting locked in a vote early. Meanwhile, I'm going to read through the thread again and try to figure out how I've drawn so much negative attention to myself! I also might list my -- what's the word? Impressions? Guesses?.... I'm going to go with "impressions" -- of all the other players. Try to understand which way they're leaning imo, and why.

VOTE: ADK

This post...where do I start? I think it killed the town read I was developing on Rubixxx. The very first word triggers alarm bells...genuine. Does scum!Rubixxx have something that he feels he would 'genuinely' do as town? Was he considering quick hammering and wanted to know the repercussions? That whole line just doesn't sit right with me.

Then there is the whole rereading to see why people are scum reading him and the good old 'Shit, people are scum reading me. Better produce a reads-list.'

This post is pretty goddamn scummy.

Okay, really quick before I try to get another nap in, where everyone pings on my list.

I'm going to assume the mod wouldn't put two newbies as the mafia

, since this is supposed to be a learning experience for all involved.

Snipped the reads list.

Rubixxx has got me conflicted - is the bold a town slip? Fake or real? I feel like I am town reading Rubixxx for the tone of his posts but scum reading him based on the content.

The reads seem worthless - as suspected. It looks like something he has done in an effort to look 'pro-town'. What is the point in listing reads when you can't explain them? Like, a lot of them are 'I don't know' or 'gut' or whatever. That whole thing just reeks of scum trying to look town.

and why is a townie at l-1? I dont understand

Oh my. I'm not sure what to make of this. Did you actually just slip? I know I like to use exaggeration when I'm writing so I could see a townie writing this, but shit, that doesn't look good.

You didn't say "Why is someone I am town reading at L-1" ... you said "Why is

a townie

at L-1?"

You displayed certainty of another player's alignment.

VOTE: SRMP

It's not often I see an outright scum slip on day one, but it's super clear that you slipped there. Nobody can possibly town read someone strong enough in the first 90 posts to just assume they are town to that extent.

I feel like you should know better than this? Like, I know where you're coming from but, ugh. There is a lot of other stuff happening as well.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

UNVOTE: Garrett
VOTE: Rubixxx

I think that this thing with SRMP is a distraction. I am especially interested to see people calling it a slip when not saying the same about this:

I mean, I could be number 4 out of 5 on your wagon to lynchtown if you reeeally wanted me to be.

This is Rubixxx threatening to put ADK at L-1 and implying that he is Town. Before and after this he claimed to be reading ADK as Mafia

That is quite clearly not a slip from Rubixx. He is saying it like 'I'll take you down to lynchtown' kind of thing (like take you 'downtown'). I can't explain it well and should probably leave Rubixx to do it.

UNVOTE:

Everyone looks scummy. What a fantastic game.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

VOTE: Garrett

This is scum. SRMP wagon is bad and I'm interested in seeing how that happened when I have the time to catch up properly.

Pedit - Quick hammering isn't all that common, but it does happen.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

LOL, if you have missed it then that's bad for you.

Or maybe you're scum? I don't know. But it's pretty clear that SRMP is not the lynch for Today.

You're town reading Garrett?

[BlueBloodedToffee]

SRMP join me on Garrett.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

Who scum slipped?

I've been following along, just not paying much attention.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

No, I read that. I remember saying it could be because you exaggerate when you write. I'm a chronic abuser of this myself, so I can understand it on some level.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

SRMP, who is scum?

[BlueBloodedToffee]

Drixx, you're misrepping pretty hard.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

@SRMP Ouch, I'm offended.

@Drixx, I'll elaborate when the time is right. That time is not now.

Are you town reading Garrett?

[BlueBloodedToffee]

We should not be hammering any time soon. I need to catch up and there are still things to discuss.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

Huh, not what I expected. Let me catch up and then we can probably lynch SRMP.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

I do but I need time.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

It won't be tonight.

We have time, there is no rush. I need a couple of days maximum.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

There is plenty of time.

No need to rush. I'll be here when I can

[BlueBloodedToffee]

Soon. I will 100% have caught up by this time tomorow.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

Again, in retrospect my posts were confusing and didn't really state my points well. My read on Rubixxx was scum for the reasons you went on to explain in your next post- his constant desire to look "pro-town" and act like he's just trying to be a team player for the town seem forced.

Today I'm not as sold on him being scum. I'm torn because his actions sometimes feel like he's just trying too hard to play the game "right" (like making a reads list without having much to say, lots of sheeping IMO, flip flopping on votes just so he has a vote down) because he's new, but if he is scum it would also make sense for him to try and do these things to give off that new player still learning the ropes vibe.

You didn't answer my questions.

Why was Rubixxx jumping on and off wagons scummy?

Why is him ignoring our advice scummy?

How was he 'getting people' to town read him?

Prehaps ADH was speaking to someone else in PT about trying to mislynch Garrett. Nice pick up though still it all seems unlikely; If it sounds to good to be true it probably is.

OK, so if you don't think it's that what do you think it is?

So the word "genuine" sends your radar off? Why??? It's not even like I said "genuine townie question" or anything relating to my alignment. It was me wanting to get clarification from older players about why that strategy was frowned upon. Now I know. It's more of a late game strategy than early game. So why would I go ahead and put in my vote if I knew it might risk seeming scummy? Because I knew that it wasn't something actual scum would capitalize on.

And why does producing a read list make me suspicious? Because of the timing? Sorry if it wasn't terribly detailed - it was actually more for me than anyone else. Kind of an effort to not forget everything I learned the previous day. It had nothing to do with trying to "seem" town! Boy, howdy. I had no idea it was even a thing to be "toob town. Now I know better!

Yeah, because scum know that everything they do is forced. They know the people they're pushing are town and they know the reasoning behind what they're doing, even if it doesn't make sense, comes from town. Therefore, when scum find something they can 'genuinely' push, something they think looks 'genuinely' scummy, they like to push it. I mean, I guess yours is slightly different as you're asking a question, but it still doesn't sit right with me.

The garret thing was just me getting players confused,

someone has mentioned him in a post and the names got switched in my mind

.

Lies. Nobody had mentioned Garrett outside of Dier's RVS vote, which I'm sure didn't do a whole lot to catch your attention. Your inclusion of Garrett was super strange.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

From what I have read up to this point in the thread, it seems that while SRMP has shown to possibly have made a mafia slip, Dierfire's post has really moved me to vote for Rubixxx. I mean some of those posts where it looks to be him claiming a townie and what almost looks to be threatening another poster with a lynch kill, are making me feel more assure in my suspicions. Not to mention as New Luna Republic said, the exaggerated word play is really coming into play with my previous assertion that Rubixxx is trying way too hard to defend himself.

This is awful. Look at the jump onto Rubixx, he voted him after this post. My word, how is Garrett not under more scrutiny in this game? He thinks SRMP scum slipped (which should CONFIRM SRMP as scum to Garrett) but he goes ahead and votes for Rubixxx anyway based on a misunderstanding from Dier? For reals bro?

Being defensive is not a scum tell. Some people are naturally defensive, as either alignment. It's never been scummy, and never will be.

Speculation? ADK reacting the way he did was not me going on just some speculation but on what he was actively doing. And why do I think being defensive is scummy? because last game I played scum and one of the reasons people suspected me and lynched me was because I was being overly defensive. I was newer to the game then so seeing another newbie like Rubixxx try the same thing I feel that is suspicious of being possibly scum.

Speculation on my part, I'll divulge info when I feel the time is right to do so.

You can't apply your own meta to somebody else, that's outrageous.

Well after reviewing it I do see how silly and ridiculous that sounds. I still do think though, that Rubixxx defense comes off as trying too hard at being town and I still feel that is a certain intent to look "pro-town" from how he keeps asking how people are scum reading him and saying how he has "genuine newbie questions" come off as trying to hard to play up the Newbie angle.

Again, being defensive is not scummy. You're sheeping everything other people have said; 'trying too hard to be town', looking 'pro-town' and 'his genuine newbie question'. Like, they're all the exact phrases that I have used when talking about Rubixx. Why is nobody looking at this?

VOTE: Garrett

This is scum. SRMP wagon is bad and I'm interested in seeing how that happened when I have the time to catch up properly.

OK, so SRMP wagon wasn't all that interesting. Rubixx town told hard in 137, he is now probably my strongest town read. NLR isn't really doing much but I don't think they're scum, and I don't like Drixx's push based on a 'slip' but I don't think that makes him scum either.

Garrett or ADK are easily today's lynch choices.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

Why is nobody voting Garrett?

Why is there no counter-wagon to SRMP?

[BlueBloodedToffee]

Just to be clear - I'll be continuing my catch up later, I have to go out for a couple of hours.

Allow me to catch up, we only have 12 pages and plenty of time. Not to mention the leading candidate should not be today's lynch.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

Alright, I'm back and continuing my catch up.

SRMP, you should vote Garrett. If only for self preservation, I'm handing you an opportunity to prove you're town. Why would you not take it?

[BlueBloodedToffee]

SRMP join me on Garrett.

wait, you read up...

and then dont lynch someone who scumslipped?

Is this a joke rn?

This feels town? Like, why would SRMP intentionally try to antagonize someone who isn't already on their wagon. Seems a bad play for scum...unless he thinks Drixx was going to try and drive a wagon on me and wants to have a basis to jump on it?

And here comes someone randomly chainsaw white knighting you. I figure there's some chance that you just reacted in a way I expect scum to react and you're actually town, and if you are the scum obviously know that. That makes the chainsaw white knighting of you particularly interesting.

So, to summarize what you're saying; SRMP reacted like he was scum, but if he isn't scum, then I must be scum for knowing he is town and defending him?

That about covers all bases right? I believe that's called 'lining up lynches'?

@SRMP - I'm pressuring him because he admitted to not knowing how your wagon sprung up but rushed to your defense. There aren't many reasons for someone to do that.

I find it interesting that me pressuring him for admitting he didn't know why you were being wagoned, but still exclaimed that it was bad (implying a strong town read on you)

Would I be correct in saying that SRMP has claimed VT over the next few pages?

vote: SRMP

This is L-1

Ewwwwwwwww.

@ BBT: What is so scummy about Garret? He's a little lower activity than other players but nothing in his posts has stood out to me much at all.

What do you think now I have elaborated on that read a little more?

I dont got much to say

why? Because they would have no reason to not jump at the opportunity for a free mislynch, they would much rather jump on the wagon, because they know at this point they can't be called out for it later, I suppose you can call it a somewhat of a slayers gambit (except the slip wasent intended)

on who I think is scum (my wagon is luna, drixx, rubixx, and ADk, BBT could be included for involvement of defense, the rest are probably town just for not taking the opportunity)

OK, so wait. Both scum are on your wagon, but you're scum reading me for not being on your wagon? Do I have that correct?

I also massively dislike the fact you have nothing to say after specifically asking not to be hammered at L-1.

ADK:

not explaining why they jumped on the wagon is scummy, but they are making an honest effort to be towny

Walk me through this. Firstly, I find it super strange that you don't have a bigger reaction to ADK just jumping ship onto your wagon. I mean, ADK was voting Drixx for a weak push on you and now he is joining Drixx on your wagon...what?!? And you have no problem with this at all?

Show me where ADK is making an 'honest effort' to look town.

BBT:

him and drixx is town vs scum, I would lynch one if the other flips town tbh, so if drixx flips scum I would advise a lynch here, and vice versa.

Tell me how you concluded that myself vs Drixx absolutely cannot be town vs town. I'm interested in hearing that.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

Imma do a reread and then sleep on things I think

However first impression of the BBT Drixx's argument Is that it's not TvT though I'll have to be carefull here.

Walk me through this. Why can myself vs Drixx not be town vs town?

luna, I was trying to check the strength of his read, if his read wasent strong but he caught me scumslipping, I knew he would have been scum, because scumslipping means they basically confirmed themself scum, so how could they have a weak read off of it?

im actually considering not posting, because im legit making everyone discuss me when my fate was already decided ;/

You're attitude around your lynch is really weird, I don't know what to make of it.

However, I have a question. You thought Drixx would have been scum because he thought you scum slipped but wasn't sure enough to bet on it.

Can you explain to me how you excuse this post then;

From what I have read up to this point in the thread, it seems that while SRMP has shown to possibly have made a mafia slip, Dierfire's post has really moved me to vote for Rubixxx.

Garrett outright states you could have 'possible scum slipped' but then he votes for Rubixxx. If he thought you scum slipped, a) why is he not voting you and b) why do you not have the same problem with Garrett as you do other people?

[BlueBloodedToffee]

SRMP's posting is so weird. I realise that I very quickly become the next lynch target if SRMP does flip scum (or even if he is town according to Drixx) but whatever, this feels wrong to me. His posts are scummy, there is no doubting that. But they're scummy on a surface level, if you try to understand where he is coming from, there are town motivations behind the things that he posts.

I just want everyone to look at Garrett and give me their opinion on his play this game.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

I say I hate to bring it up because it really feels like he's been carrying the game. I'm wary about putting so much trust in any one player, because no one's ever proven innocent until they're dead, but he really seems like he knows what he's doing...[/color]

Question; why do you think Drixx 'knows what he's doing' and would you still think the same thing if SRMP flipped town?

why waste 9 days of discussion? Theres no point, besides, you discuss other things, for example drixx and BBT

Just because we have 9 days, it doesn't mean we have to use them all. I usually like to get around 20 pages or so and then get a lynch. Games can drag and that only benefits mafia. At the moment, I still believe there is plenty to discuss.

The rest of the day phase will only be useful if it gets used productively. Of course ... I can totally understand why someone in a particular position would really want that extra time to pass ... and maybe the pressure along with it?

Give me some reads that are not SRMP?

@BBT

Why is Garrett Mafia?

Hey Dier, I keep forgetting you're in this game! I have elaborated on my Garrett read, tell me your thoughts on it.

In fact, I wouldn't mind knowing where you stand in the game on all players.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

oi, im villy.

OK, this makes me question my town read on SRMP. Initially, this post made me not want to lynch SRMP;

I see I got 3 votes

dont hammer me right away once I hit l-1, give me a last post.

I saw this as softing a PR. Basically, someone says don't lynch me straight away because I have something important to announce. This post made me think that SRMP was a PR and, as such, I was no longer interested in lynching him. As I know that to not be the case, my town read on SRMP has been weakened. It doesn't help that his 'important post' really didn't say a whole lot.

I would firstly expect a townie not to try and justify the slip in phrasing. I've never seen someone who refers to their town reads in absolute terms. Being town generally means being well aware of just how

not

sure you are about everyone else. It's the informed minority (scum) who are sure.

I would secondly expect a townie not to go straight to AtE once a vote and pressure were applied.

I could show you many a game where, as town, I have things along the lines of 'X

IS

town'. With 100% certainty. I have also asked why are we lynching town when someone is being run up who I am town reading.

I am sure in your time on this site you have also seen people say similar things and I'm astonished by your continued push on SRMP for something so small.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

RIP got prodded

have to remember to prod dodge RIP.

Jesus fucking Christ.

I'm caught up. I'm not ready to end the day as I don't have a good enough feel of where Drixx, Garrett or Dier are at.

Rubixxx is town, as is B10MA. Luna is also probably town.

I'm undecided on Dier, need to see more from him. SRMP has got me all over the place, but I'm inclined to believe he is really, really, really bad town.

Scum is for sure in Garrett, Drixx, ADK. Can anyone tell me where Garrett and Drixx stand outside of SRMP? Drixx has a serious tunnel going on and Garrett is doing just enough to slip by. ADK's posting isn't great either and his jump onto the SRMP wagon was disgusting.

There is lots going on here and no reason to end the day yet. Let's get a Garrett wagon going and see if we can get him to become more active.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

Rubixxx, Garrett is by far the superior lynch.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

Wanna elaborate?

Do you have reads outside of SRMP you would like to share?

[BlueBloodedToffee]

I fail to see why you're not on the Garrett wagon Rubixxx?

[BlueBloodedToffee]

Please switch to Garrett.

He is by far our best choice today.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

2 more please!

[BlueBloodedToffee]

Why is it going to look bad?

[BlueBloodedToffee]

That is my only concern, if SRMP is town he needs to show us he is town otherwise he is pretty much a default D2 lynch (if Garrett flips town).

[BlueBloodedToffee]

New question: why do you think that a Mafia player would not have claimed a PR?
Also, I gave you my response to your case on Garrett. Your thoughts?

I can't wrap my head around your first question, no matter how many times I read it. Can you rephrase it please?

I don't remember seeing your response. I'll look that up.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

He says as he joins the wagon

[BlueBloodedToffee]

Well Drixx's post is awful.

Claim in your next post Garrett.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

Don't worry, it just means I think you're town

I mean, I could lynch SRMP but I just think that Garrett is an excellent shot, and a superior lynch, in an attempt to find scum.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

I didn't want to lynch SRMP when I thought he was a PR. Now I know he isn't, I could lynch him.

That seems self-explanatory...

[BlueBloodedToffee]

Huh, was fully expecting to die.

That is a strange NK.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

VOTE: ADK

That slip.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

Where he mentioned Garrett for absolutely no reason.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

Why would he be mentioning Garrett when Garrett hadn't even posted.

Not to mention Garrett happens to show up like 30 mins later.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

Because it's better for him to point it out than somebody else?

It's an attempt to diffuse the situation before it takes off.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

Lololol.

That's a pretty good catch from ARS.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

There was also an obvious bus from Garrett on ADK.

OK Scourge!

[BlueBloodedToffee]

Also, if we're somehow wrong on ADK, which I sincerely doubt, Drixx is my next best bet for scum.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

I'm scum?

You must be the only person crazy enough to think I'm scum in this game.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

Anyone gonna hammer ADK?

Drixx feels like he could be scum. If it's not ADK, it's prob Drixx.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

Nice buzzwords.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

Please do make sure Drixx is tomorrow's lynch should lynching ADK not end this game.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

There is no point delving into it now.

We need to lynch ADK to progress, and most likely, win the game.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

All it does is give time for the ADK wagon to dissolve.

Why can't we talk about it tomorrow?

[BlueBloodedToffee]

Not ignoring but to respond properly as I would like I need to get on a PC and I have only been able to use my phone lately.

I do apologise B10MA, I will get around to your questions.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

UNVOTE:

Looks like I'n going to have to put effort into finding the last scum. That was a solid post from ADK and makes me want to look at Dier a bit harder.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

VOTE: Garrett

Just remember to look at BBT closely for as long as he remains alive. There's something oily about the way he's single-handedly swung a wagon while the first guy being wagoned is here being prodded. One guy is going to get lynched and goes inactive, a 2nd guy steps in and somehow gets a lynch on a third party. That's cause for close attention.

I would like opinions on this post because I'm not entirely sure what to make of it.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

He says as he joins the wagon

If you're right, you're a threat to scum because you were able to come in and get it done basically on your own effort, so you staying alive would be suspicious.

As for me moving over... I can see which way the wind is blowing, and SRMP has been prodded. Staying on him isn't going to get him to talk any more, is it?

Yikes, I wonder if this is why I was left alive...

[BlueBloodedToffee]

VOTE: SRMP

I'm good with either lynch, but it might be informative to see which way the hammer goes is there's a choice.

Ewwwwww. I remember Dier's last post on Garrett being a defence of him so I'm unsure why he is suddenly OK with the wagon (even though he is trying to form a very obvious counter-wagon.

Idk... why would Garrett draw attention to that fact by acting confused at it later? I feel like someone already made a post asking about that... brb looking.

Rubixx, walk me through why you chose to defend ADK coming into D2 after previously having stated you were scum reading him on D1.

Let's see what he has to say for himself. I can tell you from experience that it's quite possible to be the towniest town who ever towned and say something that everyone else in the game

misinterprets

(intentionally or not is not relevant) and get turbo lynched. It has happened to me. The worst possible outcome for today would be to discuss nothing other than this possible slip, turbo lynch and see a green flip.

There was nothing to 'misinterpret', it's what ADK said.

I still really think we've caught it with Kernel, though! like I said, there's stuff besides the slip that had me disliking that slot during my read through.

Can you talk about some of the stuff you disliked about ADK?

Also, would it be fair to say that you're suspicious of every player outside of Rubixxx?

[BlueBloodedToffee]

but why would town Drixx decide to vote Garrett if he was suspicious of me and Toffee?

This is a good question.

I have an answer.

Wanna hear it?

[BlueBloodedToffee]

I don't think scum busses their only partner on day one, being down half your team so quickly isn't worth the towncred because you're likely to lose anyway after that. You basically just have to go all in defending your partner, that's why I thought BBT might be SRMP's partner (obviously that theory's defunct). Dierfire gave the very hedgey "I'd vote for either of them" post but voted for SRMP. The fact that no one was strongly defending Garrett makes me think that his partner must be either a newer player who didn't know what to do in the situation or someone who was just gone from the game. That's why Dierfire and you are at the top of my scum list.

I'm not so sure. I plan to look over the Garrett wagon when I get some time but from memory it grew awfully quickly (almost quickly enough to make me doubt myself). I would say there is a good chance that one of the votes he quickly accumulated came from his buddy.

I want to say that Rubixxx should be clear for this now that a Newbie slot flipped Mafia. This is the sort of thing that I might tell a Newbie partner to say to play up the "clueless and new" angle, but I much doubt that Garrett and Rubixxx together would go for that sort of thing.

Rubixxx is pretty much clear based on Garrett's push on him alone.

At the time, I was reading SRMP as Mafia more strongly than Garrett, but not with enough BBT-level confidence to try to swing the entire lynch back the other way. I thought that it would be acceptable to lynch either and then look at the wagon dynamics. With Garrett flipping Mafia, the dynamic that I'm specifically looking for is a bus or a defense.

Again, you were not scum reading Garrett last we spoke about him, what changed? Have you seen any wagon dynamics you would like to discuss?

[BlueBloodedToffee]

Getting huge scum read off of BBT's most recent posts.

Let's talk about this.

Not ignoring but to respond properly as I would like I need to get on a PC and I have only been able to use my phone lately.

I do apologise B10MA, I will get around to your questions.

I don't feel like this is relevant anymore? If you still feel like there is something you want me to respond to, post it and I'll answer.

But I still want to know, BBT, why you were so intent on lynching Garrett D1 instead of trying to ressurect your ADK wagon?

Because Garrett was very obviously scum. There were some posts from ADK that weren't awful but everything Garrett was posting was pinging me head (remind me to get around to Garrett voting ADK, I need to revisit that because it felt weird at the time).

I think it would be really helpful to sort BBT today. What he's doing looks like a super confident player trying to take control and run the town. Thing is, there are plenty of players on this site who can pull that off as scum, and a few of his posts have been a bit "off" somehow.

@BBT - Feel like having a chat for awhile so I can get a feel for your thinking and get a better read on you?

I think I'm pretty obviously town. Why do you want to talk now? I was trying to get reads out of you on D1 and you were having none of it. Wanna talk about them?

[BlueBloodedToffee]

There are some things I need to do but this looks good for now;

VOTE: Dier

[BlueBloodedToffee]

Correct because it's clear you cannot misinterpet what he said.

His post was a 'typo', not something that could be misinterpreted.

How about those reads then?

[BlueBloodedToffee]

I just lynched scum and you want to try and cast suspicion on me?

If you're going to try it, go for it and do it properly. Give me something to respond to, these vague accusations are boring.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

There is no 'figuring me out'. I'm very, very clearly town.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

I have explained why I thought Garrett was scum.

How about those reads?

[BlueBloodedToffee]

I drive wagons all the time. It's kind of my schtick, I'm pretty good at it. I would like to think I have an above average rate of catching scum but I have of course made the occasional howler as well. All in all, when I push someone I am always confident in them flipping scum.

You can see in my recent completed games, check out Micro 'The Walking Dead' to see me drive two wagons on scum, one on scum from very early in D1.

I would like your read and reasons on Dier please.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

Well, I mean, scum would have to KNOW that Luna was tracker for your theory to hold any water.

Wanna shed any more light on this?

[BlueBloodedToffee]

Nah, I don't buy that at all.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

Because not everyone catches things like that, I certainly didn't.

Also, taking notes means nothing. If you do it as town, you almost certainly do it as scum as well.

If you're not scum, who is?

[BlueBloodedToffee]

Are you misrepping me again Drixx?

You're awfully defensive. Did you give me a read on Dier?

[BlueBloodedToffee]

Can someone state intent to hammer?

[BlueBloodedToffee]

Guess that leaves B10MA. Drixx won't hammer his buddy.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

Umm, yeah. I'm just gonna say I'm tired and leave it at that.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

Will catch up on the latest this weekend.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

Game is stalling.

Dier needs to be hammered.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

I can hammer Drixx if you get that wagon going I guess.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

Well played town, good game!

Dier, I think you did a quality job as a scum buddy and that needs to be mentioned. Not many people spend that amount of time/energy helping our their newbie scum partners so huge props for that.

All in all, a really good game! Well played town!

Thanks for modding Rob!