Newbie 1760 (Game Over)

Tywin Lannister · Post Post #525 (ISO) » Fri Dec 02, 2016 7:56 pm

In post 481, Elbirn wrote:Gif fluffy and turnip were off my wagon

Survey says GiF + (Tywin/Jae)

You're not gonna like how bad you're reads are when you're again proven wrong. It's like you didn't even read anything the entire game for you to keep me in your lists over idk, the entire other 7 players. I think you've called everyone scum at this point with your post-death flailing, and none of it seems to be helpful, especially considering I know my alignment. I think you're just objectively not good at this.

Tywin Lannister · Post Post #526 (ISO) » Fri Dec 02, 2016 7:57 pm

Ugh, phone. Your* not you're etc all

JaeReed · Post Post #527 (ISO) » Fri Dec 02, 2016 7:58 pm

Anyway uh... I kinda forgot where I was going with this (also I think Dewy was SE, but Thor was the IC in that game too... I have rotten luck with ICs). Was more to show that I don't believe scum would bunch up like Tier and 8uny did there.

The framing theory was that Tier gave 8uny a random townread for seemingly no reason. Which he then later retracted when I prodded him about it. It looked sus to me.

Alisae · Post Post #528 (ISO) » Fri Dec 02, 2016 8:08 pm

Interesting, I'm sure I can probably take away some other things from that, so thanks.

Oh Hai Tywin.

In post 479, Alisae wrote:Twyin, when it comes to Tier and Jae, I'm starting to agree, however heres the thing. Tier convinced Jae to push the lynch. What I'm starting to get concerned about is why Tier urged Jae not to wait.
Also you are the 2nd person to say that they would be impressed if I flipped scum. Toto said that first. Why?
And what makes you think you'll get NK'd?

JaeReed · Post Post #529 (ISO) » Fri Dec 02, 2016 8:30 pm

Spoiler:

D1 here scum had to bunch up or they would lose DDD, the scum roleblocker. GuiltyLion was essentially faced with turning his copper read 180 from town to scum or hammering his buddy. He hammered copper. It essentially forced a word where DDD!scum = GuiltyLion!scum (in that situation it was ALWAYS lynch DDD first for the record).
D2 I forced a no lynch with the help of ironstove and Accountant. In no world was I lynching anyone but DDD. We also had a no death N1 from goodmorning doc saving me.
D3 I held town hostage. I said it was me or DDD as the lynch because the next day was lylo (lynch scum or lose) and I was planning to autovote DDD in lylo if we couldn't get him lynched that day, when we still had the leeway of having a mislynch, so if he was town that's a guaranteed loss because scum could pile on and they'd leave me alive to do it. We finally lynched scum. GuiltyLion followed the next day (finally) for the win.

They were in a tough spot here and tried to wifom a lot by voting together. But this was less of a typical newbie game. Both scum here were SE's I think. If GuiltyLion hadn't hammered copper it would have been much harder to find DDD's partner, I think.

Spoiler:

Again, here... Scum do the typical one on, one off (which is what Elbirn was talking about earlier where he looked for only one scum on the wagon and tried to pair with someone off it). It's pretty common for newbie games.
Replacements here were Libellule replaced by PantherPunt, and Irrational Agent replaced by Zyf.
I actually replaced into this during lylo and proceeded to correctly work the VCA to figure out the scum team before screwing it up at the end to vote on town because of a weakness I know I have. It was really quite silly. If you want to see me do the VCA it's here: http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... 2#p8329769

JaeReed · Post Post #530 (ISO) » Fri Dec 02, 2016 8:36 pm

So basically, in a newbie game I expect scum in general to have not voted together for long periods of time.
I expect them to not bunch their votes, and to usually be one on/one off if they're not one of the first two/last two (like in the game with RC being the 1st vote and kraska being the hammer).
If scum is lynched D1 then I expect there to be bussing unless someone is in the game that is known to be a non-busser and they haven't been incredibly townie.

That said, that's just a macro level analysis. You also want to analyze the votes at a micro level.
mhsmith has a good IC post for newbies I think here: http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... 4#p8468554
Also the previous post in that game has stuff on RVS and other general things that I think it's good for newbs to know.

JaeReed · Post Post #531 (ISO) » Fri Dec 02, 2016 8:38 pm

Anyway I don't know how useful that will all be to this game for you but it should definitely come in handy in general.

Tywin Lannister · Post Post #532 (ISO) » Fri Dec 02, 2016 8:55 pm

In post 530, Alisae wrote:Interesting, I'm sure I can probably take away some other things from that, so thanks.

Oh Hai Tywin.
In post 479, Alisae wrote:Twyin, when it comes to Tier and Jae, I'm starting to agree, however heres the thing. Tier convinced Jae to push the lynch. What I'm starting to get concerned about is why Tier urged Jae not to wait.
Also you are the 2nd person to say that they would be impressed if I flipped scum. Toto said that first. Why?
And what makes you think you'll get NK'd?

Hello

And I still don't understand this 'tnip is town' angle unless the whole point is to get him NK'd and thus save us a possibly mis-lynch? But even that isn't right, because if Elbrin is VT, he doesn't know alignments, and him hinting that tnip gave a PR hint is just bad form. Either Elbrin just called out tnip as a PR (who apparently gave a PR hint that everyone missed (or pretended to miss) and so he's not doing town any favors), or he wants tnip NK'd on purpose, yet it's still BS due to no way of knowing alignments.

Honestly? I don't trust a word Elbrin has said. He was anti-town while still alive, so why would he change his tune to being super-town after calling everyone bad and whatever else he said while flailing. Even if he does flip town (which I'm still not convinced will happen), it doesn't mean he's not still a troll. Disregarding that, his reads seem really bad, and I have no confidence that he ever actually read the thread based on them. His insistence that people on his wagon are scum is just his ego hoping he didn't get town-lynched for his own play. Objectively, all 5 of us can't be scum, and I have stronger town reads in 3 of the 4 on the wagon than I do with the players not on it. Tier is the one suspect one in my eyes. Due to being an IC, he's gotten a free pass all game, which I don't believe is warranted. Gif, Tier, AA9/toto, and 8uny/tnip were the least active in this game. Tier came out of the woodwork to push Elbrin's wagon, but where has GIF been? Anyone remember that he's still in this game, or does Elbrin call his lurking a town move so let's ignore him some more?

This whole twilight hasn't given anything worth talking about IMO. Jae keeps asking for Elbrin to be pro-town for once, and he can't get any results. It's just been 'tnip is town, tnip is town' and calling me scum. I honestly don't believe Elbrin ever read the thread. It's just that bad.

If Elbrin is town, then my view is that he just doesn't want to admit that scum may not even have had to hop on to get him lynched. If there are scum on it, it has to be Jae and/or Tier. Jae may be scum though, because this 'help me find scum Elbrin!!!' stuff is really contrived. It's provided nothing useful as far as I can see. It's as if it's staged.

Elbirn · Post Post #533 (ISO) » Sat Dec 03, 2016 11:53 am

Tywin stop throwing a prissy little bitchfit and discrediting conftown because "waaah he called me scum".

Thanks.

I was attending various funeral events for the past 8 hours and was reaaallllly hoping this thread would have been locked by the time I got back and I'm really upset that it isn't. Did zaicon fall down a well?

Flip me dammit
Set me free

Elbirn · Post Post #534 (ISO) » Sat Dec 03, 2016 11:57 am

Also, tywin, if you think that what I'm doing is outing turnip as a pr (he isn't) the proper followup to that is most definitely not telegraphing that to the thread.

Thanks again
Xoxoxo, Elbirn

P.s., if you really think that the entirety of my wagon is all town, disregarding the fact that voting for me is easily excused and thus an easy vote for scum, then who is the scumteam? You've got aa9/gif/turnip/fluffy.

JaeReed · Post Post #535 (ISO) » Sat Dec 03, 2016 12:03 pm

AA9 is Toto, who was on the wagon.

Zaicon · Post Post #536 (ISO) » Sat Dec 03, 2016 12:08 pm

Final Vote Count - Day 1

Elbirn (5):

TierShift, Toto, Alisae, Tywin Lannister, JaeReed

Toto (1):

iamafluffyrabbit

Alisae (1):

thenameipicked

No Vote (2):

Elbirn, GuyInFreezer

Elbirn,

Vanilla Townie

, has been lynched!

It is now Night 1. The deadline is Monday, December 5, at 4:00 PM CST, which is in (expired on 2016-12-05 16:00:00).

Replacing iamafluffyrabbit by request.

Zaicon · Post Post #537 (ISO) » Sun Dec 04, 2016 9:23 am

Ms Columbo replaces iamafluffyrabbit.

Zaicon · Post Post #538 (ISO) » Mon Dec 05, 2016 1:27 pm

Toto,

Vanilla Townie

, has been killed!

►►Day 2◄◄

Vote Count 2.0

No Vote (7):

Alisae, GuyInFreezer, Ms Columbo, JaeReed, thenameipicked, TierShift, Tywin Lannister

With 7 alive, it takes 4 to lynch!

Deadline is Monday, November 19, 2016 at 4:00 PM CDT, which is in (expired on 2016-12-19 16:00:00).

Alisae · Post Post #539 (ISO) » Mon Dec 05, 2016 1:52 pm

Good morning, how is everyone?
VOTE: TierShift

Tywin Lannister · Post Post #540 (ISO) » Mon Dec 05, 2016 1:59 pm

VOTE: Tiershift L2

Hello everyone.

If you are scum Alisae, I won't even be mad. I'd just be impressed.

Alisae · Post Post #541 (ISO) » Mon Dec 05, 2016 2:01 pm

Hi Tywin. How are you? How is life? And why do you think the scum killed Toto?

JaeReed · Post Post #542 (ISO) » Mon Dec 05, 2016 2:01 pm

VOTE: TierShift

L-1

I'm kind of annoyed that Elbirn didn't get back to me on who else could be scum, honestly.

Alisae · Post Post #543 (ISO) » Mon Dec 05, 2016 2:03 pm

He said Tier in one of his posts. Tho now I'm concerned as to how quickly this got to L-1.

JaeReed · Post Post #544 (ISO) » Mon Dec 05, 2016 2:07 pm

I'm not, I TR both of you. Feel free to hop off if you're not sold.

Alisae · Post Post #545 (ISO) » Mon Dec 05, 2016 2:13 pm

It's not that I'm not sold. I have my reasons why I think Tier is scum. It's that we have plenty of time, and scum could know that this would happen so they would plan for it accordingly. And plus, wouldn't Scum Tier know that if he was wrong, this would happen?
In fact, I think Scum Tywin could be possible. He seems to get very defensive and attack the other person whenever he is called a potential scum.
And Jae, I have a town read on you too, but I feel like I'ma get betrayed by you at the same time. I don't think you're scum, but the possibility of you being scum is concerning me.

And we have a lot more time in the day, I wanna hear from Fluffy's replacement, GiF, Tier himself, even turnip. All of those cool people.

Tywin Lannister · Post Post #546 (ISO) » Mon Dec 05, 2016 2:58 pm

I believe we need to wait for everyone to post before anyone hammers here, especially Tier. Town PRs may have found something, so don't quicklynch Tier. As a matter of fact, I'm going to UNVOTE: for now, just in case we are wrong and/or a PR found scum and so they quick hammer Tier to avoid a lynch.

That all being said: Anyone that is a town PR with some info, please give it in a way that doesn't out your role, but do make sure we lynch the scum (or not lynch the townie) plz. I'm saying this for any of the newer players (whoever that may be). We have 5 town left, so a mislynch here and a successful scum NK makes it mylo (mislynch and lose). That would be 3 town and 2 scum. Town would have to lynch scum both days successfully after that or we'd lose.

I don't believe a no lynch vote works in this set up, since then it would mean 4 town 2 scum if they got the NK off. A mislynch there loses the game, again assuming the NK is successful. 2 town 2 scum means scum win. Just something to think about for the less experienced players, whoever that may be.

Tywin Lannister · Post Post #547 (ISO) » Mon Dec 05, 2016 3:07 pm

Toto was AA9, so that scratches that off my scum board. Tier is tops on my list followed by GIF and then tnip. GIF is STILL lurking.

Also, Fluffyrabbit got replaced it seems, yet he never requested it in-game. I'd assume a VT would request it in-game since they'd have no reason to PM the mod at night. Idk if I should read into that or not, but we need to hear from his replacement.

Also, again, GIF is still an active lurker that smells like scum to me. I'd be 100% down to lynch him or Tier right now. GIF is definitely scummy, and Tier not calling him out for it as an experienced IC makes them possible scum partners. FYI to you all. Actually, GIF not being called out by anyone but me only increases my belief that he's scum. His scum buddy sure hasn't done it.

GuyInFreezer · Post Post #548 (ISO) » Mon Dec 05, 2016 3:13 pm

Uh so

You guys are not going to believe this but

I have something to admit.

I

forgot that this game was a thing since the end of my V/LA.

Seems like a lot of stuff happened near the end of D1 and it's too much to catch up fully with my phone only so I'll be here by tomorrow afternoon.

Alisae · Post Post #549 (ISO) » Mon Dec 05, 2016 3:15 pm

Tywin, I've asked you multiple questions at this point and you haven't answered a single one of them. One of them was what made you think you would get NK'd? Becuase you never gave me a clear answer on this. You never gave me an answer on what you think of Toto getting NK'd. And why did you vote Tier in the first place if you just gonna take it off now? Didn't seem like you wanted to hear from him when you made it go to L-2.

I have a ton of questions for you, and you have not yet given me answers.
VOTE: Tywin Lannister