Newbie 1466: ICECREAM! (Game Over)

[awesomeusername]

Yay! Good game, everyone!

Special kudos to vonflare for being clutch on Day 4 and Thor for making his inspections clear retroactively.

@notscience: Yeah, you played fairly well but you really got ruined by Mindgamer being absent Night 2.

[Thor665]

Thor investigated me N3? well, alrighty then! I thought he would investigate hua-slot for sure.

There was no need to - the only way I wasn't going to lynch Hua was if I got a guilty somewhere else, and you were the only other player I could foresee looking like scum. Therefore a town on you = lynch Hua. Me being roleblocked = lynch Hua, and a scum on you = lynch VonFlare. You'll note that the rest of town was Salmonella (already confirmed town) and Awesome (my biggest town read). The investigation on you was the optimal move at that stage.

Thank you town for a decent pull together on the last Day.
I did post some thoughts in the DeadQT as to how that all played out...mostly it was just 'why haven't they lynched the obv. scum yet?' but, my thoughts are there if you want them.

Also, now it is time for;

Thor's Semi Patented Wall o' Reads

What this posting is about is just a general breakdown of thoughts, ideas, advice, accusations, and whatever else pops into my head about each player. Think of it like a final review of your play with (maybe/hopefully) helpful advice sprinkled in. All of these comments are simply *my opinions* so you may feel free to dismiss them, or to have them tattooed on your chest, or anything in between. I only tend to review players who are still the active players at game's end - so if you were replaced and want my thoughts, feel free to post and ask and I'll make that happen. Also, if you have any questions about something I say here, or anything I said or did during the game, please ask me about it and I'll clarify/expand on it as much as I'm able - I have been informed that it is my joob to help educate you about Mafia and there were a number of threats made about what would happen to me if I lied too much

awesomeusername

- As I commented in thread, you were pretty obv. town and I thought it showed easily. That is, by itself, a great compliment, because while part of the game is catching scum, another (sometimes overlooked) part is to help other town realize that you are also town. You did that very well. I also really appreciated that, unlike a lot of others, you tried to understand my case on Hua. Now, naturally, we had some issues there, and I'm not sure where the failing came in that communication (either I couldn't explain it well, or you just weren't able to grok how silly scummy she looked) but I *really* appreciated that you were trying to understand my issue. Keep that semi-open consideration about you, it is very pro-town, and also when you are scum will help fool a lot of people and get people to mistakenly call you town. Win win In a very loose sense, you probably had the best game of any of the other players here, so just work on polishing yourself and learning tells and I think you'll experience a lot of success at Mafia and also get people respecting your play.

Bert

- I...really hated your play. Mostly it was about the self vote...just, no, no, NO. Don't do that gak, it is terrible and hurts town. I wasn't even sure on lynching you or Hua that day, I wanted to see some reactions from you, and try to get a clearer read, and what you functionally did was go 'oh lawdy, town suspects me, I ragequit!' which was a move that was *very* beneficial...to the scum team. You accomplished nothing in your death except cutting conversation short and removing yourself as a suspect, and with more conversation you might have bee able to remove yourself as a suspect anyway. In the game you will experience pressure and people will wrongly (or rightly) call you scum, a liar, and all sorts of other things. That's part of the game, and you need to figure out a healthier way to respond to it than shutting down or you'll never be very helpful to your team. Also, never self vote unless you are scum.

TeedyKay

- You were probably the second or third most obvious town player because you were actively scumhunting and trying to solve the game, and I really liked that. I'll admit to personal neutrality on your reaction tests just because I don't think they would really catch scum - but maybe I'm wrong and they'll work, and they were at least pretty nicely pro-town reaction tests insomuch as they didn't hurt the town's situation (which far too many reaction tests do...and it's brilliant you aren't doing that) I think you'll benefit from a few more games under your belt, a lot of your cases were built a little haphazardly, but core aspects of them were quite good and I think as you get more comfortable with both your play and fine tune your scumhunting that will all get cleared up. I think your style is also particularly a solid one for the current meta of Mafiascum.

notscience

- I don't think you really have a right to blame Hua. I agree that Mindgamer did you a fail twice over (frankly, he should be ashamed of his play this game). Eh...after that, well, it's not like you had a lot of play to consider. Your fakeclaim could have done with more consideration, as there were a couple of pretty obvious and large gaps in the logic of it and the pro-town appearance of it. I personally think you should have considered a few more of Hua's reads before claiming her target (like, literally, VonFlare was the only town read she extroverted Day 1 - so you really should have claimed that). I also think you should have looked my posts over a bit before trying to suggest you could have argued that I'd investigated you...it was pretty obvious you were still my #2 suspect on the day prior to my death. Fakeclaiming is a potent tool, but you really need to make it look smooth to hope you can pull it off.

vonflare

- Your biggest strength and foible was paranoia. I thought you looked town because of just how scared of conspiracy and scum actions you were. Conversely - as town you were near paralyzed due to the same. You will mellow with a bit of time, I assure you of that, and though it will help you hunt better it will also remove your town shield that protected you from lynch in this game. I would say a good replacement for it is to try to tone back the confidence you express on your theories. I actually do consider confidence a pro-town tool, but until you start getting a bit of a rep or track record the bravado can come off a little false and make people want to lynch you for it. Also, being able to explain/defend your thoughts better would help. There were multiple times this game when I thought I had clearly showed you how you were wrong with examples, and your reply was, basically 'I don't care' and you kept on believing what you had and stopped talking about it. That's another bad part of that confidence, town needs to be able to consider new info and accept that they are potentially wrong.

Karlos4

- Um...well, basically you got lynched for a bad reason, but it helped me catch scum, therefore making it a decent contribution Don't take derp Day 1 wagons too hard to heart, it can and will happen to everyone at some point, and that's just life sometimes. I thought your play was okay, and I would aso say that a more experienced playerlist wouldn't have been as likely to lynch you. You do still need to work on doing hunting and cases of your own, as you were a little slurpy slow and that helped people want to lynch you, but otherwise your play was fine.

SalmonellaDreams

- You played a lot of things wel, your biggest issue was that you both appeared experienced and combined that with being a bit of a lurky presence - that was why I investigated you, you were hard to read. For either alignment that can be a dangerous thing. I would say try to focus on at least getting on once a day and contributing some thoughts, that is a good minimum activity level to prevent people from reading you as lurky or not. Other than that your play, hunting, and cases were all pretty solid, and probably of the other town you had, overall, the most accurate reads throughout the game, which is excellent.

Surye

- What caught you (besides an investigation) was how you reacted to the Karlos wagon. As scum, I really advise against pushing on a case you don't believe in, and your lack of belief in the case on Karlos really came through. You didn't want to argue or defend it, and you didn't even really try to proclaim i in general terms. You just expressed support, voted it, and then went into silent running. I do think your interactions with Hua were pretty solid on Day 2, as despite me being really sold on Hua scum you left me confused on Day 3, and that was your play, not hers, you did a great distancing job on that slot and bought the scum team another day.

GuyInFreezer

- I don't usually bother with Mod call outs. However, your response to This Post was *really* well done. You knew what I was really asking and how I was using you as a scumhunting tool, and you also knew that you couldn't answer it, and your wording in the reply was brilliantly done because it answered everything, served the purpose of the game, and yet wasn't a clear enough answer to allow me to draw many conclusions off it. Well played, sir Mod

I hope some of that at least helps some of you. As I said before, any questions - lob them out. I'm here as a resource, yadda-yadda-yadda.
I also had a good time with this game, and hope all of you did as well, and that you will continue to play on mafiascum, improve your skills, and learn more about how fun of a game this can be.

[notscience]

notscience - I don't think you really have a right to blame Hua. I agree that Mindgamer did you a fail twice over (frankly, he should be ashamed of his play this game). Eh...after that, well, it's not like you had a lot of play to consider. Your fakeclaim could have done with more consideration, as there were a couple of pretty obvious and large gaps in the logic of it and the pro-town appearance of it. I personally think you should have considered a few more of Hua's reads before claiming her target (like, literally, VonFlare was the only town read she extroverted Day 1 - so you really should have claimed that). I also think you should have looked my posts over a bit before trying to suggest you could have argued that I'd investigated you...it was pretty obvious you were still my #2 suspect on the day prior to my death. Fakeclaiming is a potent tool, but you really need to make it look smooth to hope you can pull it off.

Yeah, I kinda banked on a meta of being a total wuss as scum. I almost never fakeclaim (that's only like my second time ever, first was in my very first scumgame).

I'm glad I picked up on the PR Vibe from you this time.

Frankly, yeah I'm giving Hua too much crap. Mindgamer pisses me off though. The dude picked up his role PM and didn't even submit a fucking kill? Hell, a RANDOMISED kill would have been better.

[GuyInFreezer]

Regarding Mindgamer:
He did pick up his role PM and even replied me with a confirmation.
When the day ended, because he didn't post, I poked him with a PM to see if he was still around.
I'm not a fan of randomizing kills, and since I just couldn't put a night dl on hold since it was probably gonna tip someone off, so I opened the day and gave him 24 hours to reply or post in thread.

[GuyInFreezer]

(BTW he siteflaked again afaik)

Also kudos for Cabd for being my backup mod while I was gone

[notscience]

tbh I hate ending nights early with replacements still needed as it could compromise the gamestate.

HI CABD

I meant him randomized them not you GIF

[GuyInFreezer]

Replacements weren't needed when I ended Day 2.

[notscience]

I'm half-expecting Cabd to come in here with "replacements break games"

[Thor665]

I just couldn't put a night dl on hold since it was probably gonna tip someone off

A number of mods have a policy of obligating a replacement prior to starting Day regardless of the role/alignment of the replacement.
The larger a game gets the more I disagree with the policy, but in Micros and Newbies I think it's a good thing.

[Thor665]

I'm glad I picked up on the PR Vibe from you this time.

So much for hoping that you killed me for tanking your partner and having you as my next top suspect

[notscience]

You shoulda died N2 after your first post of N1 :/

[notscience]

First post of D2*

[awesomeusername]

Thanks for the feedback, Thor! You've convinced me process of elimination is useful (though of course it is when you're cop), and I actually like the idea of looking for town and catching scum that way. I'd never thought about it like that before.

I had a hunch that Thor and hua were both either PRs or scum by the middle of Day 2, since Thor backed off of hua so suddenly and hua was desperate not to be killed. So I actually would've been more inclined to lynch notscience had he claimed VT.

I would also like to point out that my slot was never even voted for the entire game.

[notscience]

VOTE: aun

[awesomeusername]

Game's over, doesn't count.

[Thor665]

I would like to point out that my slot had both scum voting for me at the same time.

[notscience]

I would like to point out that my slot had both scum voting for me at the same time.

Wonder where that's happened before

[SalmonellaDreams]

RE: Activity, yeah, I've been really bad about it compared to when I first started playing. I blame college, and I should probably take a break sometime.

This was a fun game, though.

[Thor665]

I would like to point out that my slot had both scum voting for me at the same time.

Wonder where that's happened before

My favorite was there have been two separate occasions when, in a multiple scum setup, I have been double nightkilled by multiple scum factions. You just can't get a nicer compliment than that

That said, it is a little awkward that I'm starting to consider voting me to equate to a reasonable scumtell...that's not a healthy or smart mindset to go into a game with. Maybe I'll get the title fairy to change me to 'The Gawd of OMGUS' or something...

[vonflare]

I would also like to point out that my slot was never even voted for the entire game.

Really? wow.

You are the ultra-town.

Thx for the feedback thor, I will remember!

I cant believe Mindgamer picked up his PM, replied to it, and yet never posted! Who would do that?

great job all. good luck in future games!

[vonflare]

and thor, thanks for the great "how-to-play-a-cop" bread crumbing lesson! If I ever play a cop, I will try to do it well.

[Surye]

Good game guys, regrets: hua leaving, then that mindgamer crap. Damn the quick hammer on me, I should have claimed (I actually had my fakeclaim typed into my browser I was just waiting to make sure I was ready to submit).

VOTE: aun: New policy RVS.

[Surye]

Also, Karlos badwagon aside, now I see why I couldn't shake you thor

[Thor665]

Yeah, if I hadn't checked you I would have still been focused on Hua Day 2.

[vonflare]

Yeah, if I hadn't checked you I would have still been focused on Hua Day 2.

well, that still would have resulted in scum lynch