Newbie 1530 - GAME OVER!

[ZZZX]

Oh. I need to have a small talk with you if you came back before the night comes I guess.

p-edit: ns was not really a scum read this whole game and him being scum was only a guess of PoE

[EspeciallyTheLies]

Exactly.

[notscience]

You two aren't scum are you

>.>

[notscience]

I saw that quickhammer

[EspeciallyTheLies]

If you are town, the game is won.

[notscience]

>.>

[WaffleGhost]

To clarify why am I scummy? Probably obvious but I've had to skim the thread between beach runs.

Secondly since I AM town what would help you, the town?

Thirdly: (Redacted:Consulting Rules)

[Rob14]

Vote Count #3.2:

Flubbernugget:

notscience, EspeciallyTheLies, ZZZX (3)

notscience:

Flubbernugget (1)

Not Voting:

WaffleGhost

With 5 people alive, it takes 3 to lynch.

V/LA:

WaffleGhost until 8/28.

Deadline:

(expired on 2014-09-08 18:15:00)

[Rob14]

Flubbernugget,

Vanilla Townie

, has been lynched Day 3.

WaffleGhost,

Town Doctor

, has been endgamed.
notscience,

Vanilla Townie

, has been endgamed.

EspeciallyTheLies,

Mafia Roleblocker

, and ZZZX,

Mafia Goon

, have won!

MAFIA WINS!

Some mod notes and setup/night action details incoming, then the thread will be opened up for discussion.

[Rob14]

Role Distribution:

TellTaleHeart - VT
notscience - VT
EspeciallyTheLies - Mafia Roleblocker
Atum - VT
WaffleGhost - Town Doctor
Flubbernugget - VT
VictorDeAngelo (SE) - Town Cop
ZZZX (SE) - Mafia Goon
Thor665 (IC) - VT

Night 1 Actions:
WaffleGhost - Protect: Thor665 (resolves)
EspeciallyTheLies - Roleblock: TellTaleHeart (resolves)
ZZZX - Kill: VictorDeAngelo (resolves)
VictorDeAngelo - Investigate: EspeciallyTheLies (result: Mafia)

Night 2 Actions:
EspeciallyTheLies - Roleblock: WaffleGhost (resolves)
ZZZX - Kill: TellTaleHeart (resolves)
WaffleGhost - Protect: ZZZX (fails; roleblocked by EspeciallyTheLies)

[Rob14]

I wrote some mod notes, but I lost them somehow - they're not in my mod notes Google Doc for some reason. So unfortunately, I have less feedback than would otherwise be the case. I know ETL, who tends to be very comprehensive, has some detailed game notes, though, so all is not lost.

One thing I definitely want to mention is that in LyLo, you've GOT to slow down. One wrong vote by a townie can allow scum to quickhammer. You should NEVER place a vote in LyLo immediately unless you have a moderator confirmed guilty on someone, basically. Talk it out, even if you think you know who you're going to vote. You completely overlooked ETL and ZZZX, and maybe you wouldn't have if you had dragged it out a bit longer.

Dead PT: http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=90&t=58740
Scum PT: http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=90&t=58671

[notscience]

[Antihero]

so, i kept up with this game....

first off, i just want to say GODDAMNIT.
i was sitting here all of days 1 and 2 thinking it was TTH/ETL, and that would have been the most kickass scumteam. ever. my head would've exploded. i was getting ready to print this game out and magnet it to my fridge.

rob, i blame you.

ETL

:

you should be ashamed of yourself. can't trust you not to draw scum in a game with fragile newbies... how do you look at yourself in the mirror...?

you make me sick.

(<3)

TTH

:

I remember being vaguely suspicious MathBandit upon reading, but I wanted to feel good about ETL so I did. I was getting so eaten up by paranoia about everybody later that I just wanted to cling to my few townreads no matter what for my own sanity's sake.

Her emotional meltdowns just looked so convincing. They just couldn't have come from scum they had to be real. I should have re-evaluated and now I'm just filled with regrets about this. I feel like such a fool.

ouch... you got burned. i feel for ya'. i really do.

these things happen. and yeah, i know it feels like shit. you're probably a little pissed at ETL, but you're probably mostly pissed at yourself.

don't beat yourself up over bad reads

(shutup ETL, i know it's the pot calling the kettle black)

. the only thing you can do now is learn from them. it's pretty apparent from your posting that you put thought into this game, it just led you to the wrong conclusions. while this will get better with time and experience, this also happens to everyone. even me.

especially me.

i'll have the

best case in the goddamn world

formulated. i'll be 100% convinced of it. and then a townflip comes along and shoots it all to hell. it's part of the game. welcome to mafia.

i would also like to remind you we're talking about etl here. there's a reason she has that "best scum" scummie. she's fooled a lot of people. you're in good company. she hasn't burned me yet, but i'm sure that day's coming soon enough...

(by the way, scum fake "townslips" AAAAAAAAAAALLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL the time. thor was right all along. it's null.)

ALSO, you

did

have the deck stacked against you from the get go when you had to fight your way through the legions of anti-town townies (looking at manx, atum, flubber, waffle, and notty).

know this though: full out paranoia isn't the way to go. you need townreads to get anything done and people to work with. i know it's the cool thing in current site meta to always have your hands firmly clasped over your asshole when townreading someone, but i prefer to get major burns from my townreads in 10% of games and have really awesome games working in a solid townbloc in my other 90%.

also, i would like to respond to this:

I appreciate the sentiment, Thor, but I think my kill was intended to make notscience and Flubbernugget look bad more than anything.

NOPE. thor was right. take it from me. i've submitted a TON of kills as scum and it's never because "oh LOLZ frame up kill" (that might be one of the side-effects, but it's never the main reason). they killed you because they didn't want you in the endgame. also, i would like to point out that you got roleblocked N1 (if you had an action, they did

not

want you using it). actually.... thinking on it...... i don't think i've ever been roleblocked (rolecopped twice, but never roleblocked). i've been here 6 years and you already beat me to being roleblocked by scum.

so cheer up! you're pretty articulate. (i'm not. i just scream about things like a crazy person. so even if i'm right, people may or may not follow me. you've got an edge here.) you just need to get some experience under your belt to know what to look for in terms of reads. it'll happen.

i promise.

flubber/notty:

don't quick vote in lylo.

just... don't

lylo is a time to be thinking "why am i still alive, why are these other people still alive, what do scum expect me to do, and what the hell am i actually going to do"? this time, it may have led you to suspect waffle a bit, but ETL

definitely

lived past her expiration date in this game. it's not a surefire tell, but it would've at least gotten you thinking. bottom line: whenever you rush through lylo, you get bad results (and yes, this is experience talking; i've done it myself).

just know that for next time, flubber. notty, i'm kind of surprised i'm having to tell you this......

ZZZX

:

...i think i'm going to start policy lynching you....

[Rob14]

ZZZX:

...i think i'm going to start policy lynching you....

Oh, I actually have something to say about this.

ZZZX, you had a time when there was a wagon on town at L-1 and you were online and weren't on the wagon. In LyLo, you hammer that wagon as scum, period. That's non-negotiable. Failing to hammer the wagon that will literally result in your immediate win is playing against your win condition, plain and simple, even if it didn't really endanger your long-term chances of winning. What's more, it's toying with town in a way that no one will appreciate. Luckily, you voted elsewhere and ETL followed to put town out of its misery, but seriously, don't keep the game going just for the sake of messing with town. It's actually pretty clearly against site rules for playing against wincon.

[notscience]

Is proper play when voted in lylo not to crossvote?

[notscience]

Like, seriously

I was under the assumption you're supposed to cross if someone votes you

I had no intention of voting until I thought things through a little more otherwise.

[Antihero]

ZZZX:

...i think i'm going to start policy lynching you....

Oh, I actually have something to say about this.

ZZZX, you had a time when there was a wagon on town at L-1 and you were online and weren't on the wagon. In LyLo, you hammer that wagon as scum, period. That's non-negotiable. Failing to hammer the wagon that will literally result in your immediate win is playing against your win condition, plain and simple, even if it didn't really endanger your long-term chances of winning. What's more, it's toying with town in a way that no one will appreciate. Luckily, you voted elsewhere and ETL followed to put town out of its misery, but seriously, don't keep the game going just for the sake of messing with town. It's actually pretty clearly against site rules for playing against wincon.

not what i was referring to.

i just can't for the life of me tell the difference between his scum and town games.

better be safe and just lynch him everytime.

Is proper play when voted in lylo not to crossvote?

NO

you're not a newb, notty. the proper play would've been to lean over and yell and scream at flubber until he unvoted

[Antihero]

notty, have you ever been in a lylo where a quickhammer led to a town win?

i have ........ once

ONCE

[notscience]

I've kinda lost my "yelling and screaming at people stupid enough to vote me" since I've been back because I've seriously been ML'd in every single completed towngame I have since I've been back.

I get it, I fucked up.

[Antihero]

I've kinda lost my "yelling and screaming at people stupid enough to vote me" since I've been back because I've seriously been ML'd in every single completed towngame I have since I've been back.

well you're doing something horribly wrong, notty...

you should.... like.... stop

[Antihero]

stop doing whatever it is you're doing wrong, that is

[notscience]

I will when I figure out what it is I'm doing wrong.

I still have absolutely no idea.

[Antihero]

i'm not meaning to put you down notty.

i'm just saying that it's bad form to quick vote in lylo. that's all.

even if someone else votes you first.

now, if it's 3 man lylo and someone votes you and the other guy doesn't quickhammer,

then you crossvote

. that's different, though.

[notscience]

I'm not really down about this game.

I'm just trying to put together in my head how I went from never ml'd to almost a surefire.

[Antihero]

well, not sure what you're doing in your other games, but here you definitely could've stood to be more transparent with your reads