JacksonVirgo's Mini Normal Review, December 2020

JacksonVirgo · Post Post #3 (isolation #1) » Wed Dec 30, 2020 6:57 pm

Some context

may

be necessary to understand the concept. MS's meta leans towards Millers claiming D1 to be believed effectively, whereas this setup flips that on it's head by essentially incentivizing it to stay hidden to have the Cop be effective but also have a false-positive result that will effectively get eliminated if they're checked. So it's either they claim and lose the Cops abilities which won't likely happen in practice or they don't claim and risk getting red-checked and eliminated (miller would likely either die or be claimed prior to lylo). I can definitely see the swing in this setup, that's why I suggested two versions to try and minimize it as best I can taking into consideration my experience designing setups.

the worst helped balance this setup prior to submitting it, credit where credit is due

JacksonVirgo · Post Post #5 (isolation #2) » Wed Dec 30, 2020 8:18 pm

Wouldn't an ungated Cop make a setup have more swing than an Even-Night Cop? Mafia would likely gun for the Cop regardless so I think it isn't an issue. On the other hand, I don't think telling Mafia explicitly that the Cop is gated in addition to the Enabler is a good idea as it gives too much setup information than what they should have.

JacksonVirgo · Post Post #8 (isolation #3) » Wed Dec 30, 2020 8:33 pm

Town Compulsive Novice 2-shot Cop sounds nicer owo

JacksonVirgo · Post Post #9 (isolation #4) » Wed Dec 30, 2020 8:34 pm

Can you explain why the N2,4,6 cop is swingier?

JacksonVirgo · Post Post #10 (isolation #5) » Wed Dec 30, 2020 9:13 pm

I'm good with any form of Cop, although only a 2-shot essentially I don't think I'm a big fan of.

JacksonVirgo · Post Post #11 (isolation #6) » Wed Dec 30, 2020 9:14 pm

Enabler and searching for it is useless after N3 in that case, which is again a red-herring which you say Mafia hates.

JacksonVirgo · Post Post #12 (isolation #7) » Wed Dec 30, 2020 9:15 pm

That and every night you get three Town town that you know isn't the Enabler. The elim, the kill and the vcop check.

JacksonVirgo · Post Post #16 (isolation #8) » Wed Dec 30, 2020 9:20 pm

Would Odd-Night Cop be a better fit and make the JKer Novice so they get at least one check? Mafia is very unlikely to hit a Cop check.

JacksonVirgo · Post Post #17 (isolation #9) » Wed Dec 30, 2020 9:20 pm

In post 15, Isis wrote:i'd probably pass the setup as-is if I was primary

Oh neat!! I feel like I did a good job with this one ahaha

JacksonVirgo · Post Post #19 (isolation #10) » Wed Dec 30, 2020 9:27 pm

In post 18, Isis wrote:
In post 16, JacksonVirgo wrote:Would Odd-Night Cop be a better fit and make the JKer Novice so they get at least one check? Mafia is very unlikely to hit a Cop check.
It dents the conceit of the setup a lot since claiming miller day1 is punished less. But it seems fine.

Wait how is it punished less?

JacksonVirgo · Post Post #21 (isolation #11) » Wed Dec 30, 2020 11:53 pm

In post 20, Isis wrote:If I understand enabler properly, a D1 miller claim means the miller is NKed night one but the cop gets one investigation that occurs the same night. With even night, there's no investigations at all.

It's fine though.

Ah I see

JacksonVirgo · Post Post #23 (isolation #12) » Thu Dec 31, 2020 7:55 pm

I do think the VCop should be gated now that you've brought it up. Are you saying that having a 1-shot OR a Novice 2-shot is your choices? Is there a reason why you said 1-shot instead of 2-shot because I think a plain 2-shot would probably be better overall. Compulsive Novice 2-shot Cop is fine as well (I don't really like the look of N2 N3 Cop lol).

JacksonVirgo · Post Post #24 (isolation #13) » Thu Dec 31, 2020 9:55 pm

Spoiler: Role Cards

Town Informed Macho Cop-Enabler Miller

You are informed that Mafia are informed that there is a Macho Cop-Enabler Miller. If will appear as a member of the Mafia to a Cop. If you are to die, all Cops will lose their ability.

You win when all threats to the Town are eliminated.

You can find the game thread here

Town Compulsive Novice 2-Shot Cop

You can check a player twice, you will know if they are a member of the Mafia or not. You must peform an action when you can, failure to do so will lead to your action being done at random. You cannot make an action on night one.

You win when all threats to the Town are eliminated.

You can find the game thread here

Town Tracker

You may check a player each night, you will see who they visited if anybody.

You win when all threats to the Town are eliminated.

You can find the game thread here

Town Jailkeeper

You may jailkeep a player each night, you will protect them from kills but you will role-block your target.

You win when all threats to the Town are eliminated.

You can find the game thread here

Town Vanilla Townie

You have no abilities outside your voice and your vote.

You win when all threats to the Town are eliminated.

You can find the game thread here

Mafia 1-Shot Roleblocker

Only once, you may choose to roleblock a player. This will stop their ability if they have one.

You win when all threats to the Mafia are eliminated or nothing can stop that from happening.

You can find the game thread here

You can find the Mafia PT here

Mafia 2-shot Vanilla Cop

Only twice, you may check a player to see if they're Vanilla or not.

You win when all threats to the Mafia are eliminated or nothing can stop that from happening.

You can find the game thread here

You can find the Mafia PT here

Mafia Informed

You are informed that there is a Macho Cop-Enabler Miller.

You win when all threats to the Mafia are eliminated or nothing can stop that from happening.

You can find the game thread here

You can find the Mafia PT here

And yes, I did use my tool (the one in development not the one thats hosted rn). Lemme know if those are wrong etc

JacksonVirgo · Post Post #30 (isolation #14) » Sat Jan 02, 2021 12:22 am

In post 26, Ircher wrote:6) Town role pms should likely have the win conditions listed, especially since the mafia ones do.

I've fixed up the other points but what does this mean exactly?

JacksonVirgo · Post Post #31 (isolation #15) » Sat Jan 02, 2021 12:24 am

In post 29, Isis wrote:Actually maybe you should think about designing that into your tool? Like the membership of the scumteam is a piece of information you could set one time, then the mafia role PMs could automatically print the list, excluding the member receiving the PM. It's something to automate.

Honestly never thought of it but I will definitely add that.

JacksonVirgo · Post Post #34 (isolation #16) » Wed Jan 06, 2021 1:07 am

Spoiler: Role Cards

Town Informed Macho Cop-Enabler Miller

You are informed that Mafia are informed that there is a Macho Cop-Enabler Miller. You will appear as a member of the Mafia to a Cop. If you are to die, all Cops will lose their ability. You cannot be protected from kills.

You win when all threats to the Town are eliminated and at least one member of the Town is alive.

Confirm your role via replying with your role name, alignment and any abilities you have.

Town N2 N3 Cop

You can check on Nights 2 and 3, if your action succeeds you will know if they are a member of the Mafia or not.

You win when all threats to the Town are eliminated and at least one member of the Town is alive.

Confirm your role via replying with your role name, alignment and any abilities you have.

Town Tracker

You may check a player each night, if your action succeeds you will see who they visited if anybody.

You win when all threats to the Town are eliminated and at least one member of the Town is alive.

Confirm your role via replying with your role name, alignment and any abilities you have.

Town Jailkeeper

You may jailkeep a player each night, if your action succeeds you will protect them from kills but you will role-block your target.

You win when all threats to the Town are eliminated and at least one member of the Town is alive.

Confirm your role via replying with your role name, alignment and any abilities you have.

Town Vanilla Townie

You have no abilities outside your voice and your vote.

You win when all threats to the Town are eliminated and at least one member of the Town is alive.

Confirm your role via replying with your role name, alignment and any abilities you have.

Mafia 1-Shot Roleblocker

Only once, if your actions succeeds you may choose to roleblock a player. This will stop their active ability if they have one. Your partners are [X] the Mafia 2-shot Vanilla Cop and [Y] the Mafia Informed.

You win when at least one Mafia is alive and all threats to the Mafia are eliminated or when nothing can stop that from happening

Confirm your role via replying with your role name, alignment and any abilities you have.

Mafia 2-shot Vanilla Cop

Only twice, if your action succeeds you may check a player to see if they're Vanilla or not. Your partners are [X] the Mafia 1-shot Roleblocker and [Y] the Mafia Informed.

You win when at least one Mafia is alive and all threats to the Mafia are eliminated or when nothing can stop that from happening

Confirm your role via replying with your role name, alignment and any abilities you have.

Mafia Informed

You are informed that there is a Macho Cop-Enabler Miller. Your partners are [X] the Mafia 2-shot Vanilla Cop and [Y] the Mafia 1-shot Roleblocker.

You win when at least one Mafia is alive and all threats to the Mafia are eliminated or when nothing can stop that from happening

Confirm your role via replying with your role name, alignment and any abilities you have.

Spoiler: Results and Feedback

That should be everything needed? Also if there's discrepencies with the role cards I apologize, I've found a few kinks in my tool that I'm going to be sorting out ASAP ahaha

JacksonVirgo · Post Post #35 (isolation #17) » Wed Jan 06, 2021 1:07 am

Ah feck, I forgot the game and PT links

JacksonVirgo · Post Post #36 (isolation #18) » Wed Jan 06, 2021 1:08 am

Oh and the Novice 2-shot. Gonna redo

JacksonVirgo · Post Post #37 (isolation #19) » Wed Jan 06, 2021 1:13 am

Spoiler: Role Cards Fixed

Town Informed Macho Cop-Enabler Miller

You are informed that Mafia are informed that there is a Macho Cop-Enabler Miller. You will appear as a member of the Mafia to a Cop. If you are to die, all Cops will lose their ability. You cannot be protected from kills.

You win when all threats to the Town are eliminated and at least one member of the Town is alive.

The game thread can be found here

Confirm your role via replying with your role name, alignment and any abilities you have.

Town N2 N3 Cop

You can check on Nights 2 and 3, if your action succeeds you will know if they are a member of the Mafia or not.

You win when all threats to the Town are eliminated and at least one member of the Town is alive.

The game thread can be found here

Confirm your role via replying with your role name, alignment and any abilities you have.

Town Tracker

You may check a player each night, if your action succeeds you will see who they visited if anybody.

You win when all threats to the Town are eliminated and at least one member of the Town is alive.

The game thread can be found here

Confirm your role via replying with your role name, alignment and any abilities you have.

Town Jailkeeper

You may jailkeep a player each night, if your action succeeds you will protect them from kills but you will role-block your target.

You win when all threats to the Town are eliminated and at least one member of the Town is alive.

The game thread can be found here

Confirm your role via replying with your role name, alignment and any abilities you have.

Town Vanilla Townie

You have no abilities outside your voice and your vote.

You win when all threats to the Town are eliminated and at least one member of the Town is alive.

The game thread can be found here

Confirm your role via replying with your role name, alignment and any abilities you have.

Mafia 1-Shot Roleblocker

Only once, if your actions succeeds you may choose to roleblock a player. This will stop their active ability if they have one. Your partners are [X] the Mafia 2-shot Vanilla Cop and [Y] the Mafia Informed.

You win when at least one Mafia is alive and all threats to the Mafia are eliminated or when nothing can stop that from happening

The game thread can be found here

The Mafia PT can be found here
Confirm your role via replying with your role name, alignment and any abilities you have.

Mafia Novice 2-shot Vanilla Cop

Only twice, if your action succeeds you may check a player to see if they're Vanilla or not. Your partners are [X] the Mafia 1-shot Roleblocker and [Y] the Mafia Informed.

You win when at least one Mafia is alive and all threats to the Mafia are eliminated or when nothing can stop that from happening

The game thread can be found here

The Mafia PT can be found here
Confirm your role via replying with your role name, alignment and any abilities you have.

Mafia Informed

You are informed that there is a Macho Cop-Enabler Miller. Your partners are [X] the Mafia 2-shot Vanilla Cop and [Y] the Mafia 1-shot Roleblocker.

You win when at least one Mafia is alive and all threats to the Mafia are eliminated or when nothing can stop that from happening

The game thread can be found here

The Mafia PT can be found here
Confirm your role via replying with your role name, alignment and any abilities you have.

JacksonVirgo · Post Post #39 (isolation #20) » Wed Jan 06, 2021 3:57 am

Spoiler: Mafia Role Cards

JacksonVirgo · Post Post #40 (isolation #21) » Wed Jan 06, 2021 4:00 am

It has been brought to my attention something that I am sure isn't a thing but I have to ask anyway. Cop-Enabler doesn't affect Vanilla Cop yes?

JacksonVirgo · Post Post #43 (isolation #22) » Wed Jan 06, 2021 3:39 pm

Hype!