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Aj The Epic
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Post Post #1650  (ISO)  » Wed Jan 11, 2017 8:20 pm

You would literally say it made sense if flubber took a shotgun to me and scattered my innards on the ground kairal

Kairal
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Post Post #1651  (ISO)  » Wed Jan 11, 2017 8:22 pm

People may be wondering why I'm planning to hammer 12 hours before the deadline. This is because IF scum are pushing for a no lynch (not sure they are but it's quite possible) the obvious course of action is to have a change in heart shortly before I hammer. Thus we need enough time to make sure we can get SOMEONE over the line.

Aj The Epic
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Post Post #1652  (ISO)  » Wed Jan 11, 2017 8:23 pm

But you know who the scum are so you're just advancing their motives, right?

Kairal I hope you see your inconsistencies here.

Kairal
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Post Post #1653  (ISO)  » Wed Jan 11, 2017 8:25 pm

In post 1649, Flubbernugget wrote:Karial, why would you think if I genuinely saw a reason that Aj was confirmed scum I wouldn't vote for them?


Because you are his scum partner. Why didn't you vote to avoid suspicion you mean? I'm not entirely sure whether or not you guys want me to self-hammer or a no lynch actually. You continuing to vote with me fits the latter. On the other hand a no lynch at this point is probably a guaranteed win so if you can be sneaky enough about it you'd probably go for it.

Kairal
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Post Post #1654  (ISO)  » Wed Jan 11, 2017 8:26 pm

In post 1652, Aj The Epic wrote:But you know who the scum are so you're just advancing their motives, right?

Kairal I hope you see your inconsistencies here.


As I just explained a no lynch is a certain loss (I'm not confident I'd avoid a lynch tomorrow) If I get lynched today at least there's a chance.

Kairal
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Post Post #1655  (ISO)  » Wed Jan 11, 2017 8:27 pm

In post 1650, Aj The Epic wrote:You would literally say it made sense if flubber took a shotgun to me and scattered my innards on the ground kairal


This sure makes you sound suspicious of Flubber. Why not vote him? After all even if we were scum partners you'd still be getting a scum. Ok then I'd get you lynched the day after maybe but if you came up town I'd be the lynch after that. 2 scum for 1 town is a good deal no? That's what I suspect you'd think if you were town. You aren't though so you won't vote for Flubber under any circumstances now.

Kairal
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Post Post #1656  (ISO)  » Wed Jan 11, 2017 8:33 pm

Incidentally I just want to be entirely clear about this. If I have to self hammer to prevent a no lynch because town can't get their shit in gear that is ENTIRELY on town. If you then go on to lose even though I've laid out the scum team for you, you better not come crying to me about it.

I Am Innocent
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Post Post #1657  (ISO)  » Thu Jan 12, 2017 8:07 am

@Massive, please unvote. I do not like Kairal sitting at L-1 with no counterwagon. If you trust me and BV at all, please unvote and consider a different read. But right now, I'm pretty sure your voting alongside at least 2 scum right now, so an unvote would be greatly appreciated. You can always go back if you disagree with me and BV in the end.
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I Am Innocent
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Post Post #1658  (ISO)  » Thu Jan 12, 2017 8:09 am

In post 1638, Flubbernugget wrote:Iai,

Look at how Kairal keeps backtracking over arguments. Are you really going to say that's town because their votes were all over the place?

What happened to people laughing down "too scummy to be scum"


There's a huge difference between acting scummy and voting scummy. Dier's vote history is extremely scummy. Your vote history is extremely scummy. Kairal's vote history is extremely all over the place.
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I Am Innocent
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Post Post #1659  (ISO)  » Thu Jan 12, 2017 8:13 am

For example, your voting history Flubber:

Voted Massive Day 1 IN POST 10 (never moved it)
Voted Massive Day 2 in post 874 (first vote of anybody day 2)
After Kairal unvoted Massive, leaving your vote as the lone vote, you joined the Jin wagon Day 2 as the 3rd vote on that wagon. (Post 899)
Voted Mini to start Day 3 (first vote of anybody day 3)
Moved to Massive Day 3
Put Kairal at L-1 just now

All cleared/nearly confirmed town except your opportunistic vote on Kairal

Bad voting history
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I Am Innocent
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Post Post #1660  (ISO)  » Thu Jan 12, 2017 8:16 am

Already pointed out Dier's poor vote history:

Elhabe in Post 101, their lone post, voting Cloudkicker "Cuz you're standing out more than others"
Dier in Post 275 voting Io (never moved vote, took until 859 for Io to be lynched)

Day 2 - Notta

Day 3 vote and unvote (1406 and 1409 respectively) of Cloudkicker

Bad voting history.
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I Am Innocent
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Post Post #1661  (ISO)  » Thu Jan 12, 2017 8:17 am

Probably should change the word bad to scummy.
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culted
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Post Post #1662  (ISO)  » Thu Jan 12, 2017 8:55 am

If you think kairal is a bad lynch you're gonna need to do better than showing everyone how much he likes to vote-hop.

culted
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Post Post #1663  (ISO)  » Thu Jan 12, 2017 8:57 am

There's one day until deadline and all you've got is "hey look at these lurkers who haven't voted much" and you're not voting either of them...

Like is this some kinda no-lynch attempt or what

massive
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Post Post #1664  (ISO)  » Thu Jan 12, 2017 10:05 am

My current thoughts:

Kairal pushing his VCA, even after being told it's probably non-indicative, I can't decide what that is.

In post 1600, Kairal wrote:Secondly as suspicious as everything you've done this last few pages is the fact is that the VCA implicates flubber more strongly than it implicates you.


In post 1640, Kairal wrote:Ok the two things I'm getting from my VCA are one of Naomi and Flubber must be scum.


The VCA doesn't indicate anything of the sort. In fact, a good scum team would make sure that all of their players are in rotation on wagons, to ensure exactly this sort of thing doesn't happen. And it STILL doesn't work around the fact that, if we even begin to trust that this VCA is exposing some sort of scummy behavior, that the rest of us would have to review it and deduce that Kairal himself is the one most likely to be scum, based on Kairal's own parameters.

So why continue to push Flubber here based solely on the VCA, and why push AJ based solely on his perceived defense of Flubber?

And maybe more importantly, why not push Naomi, who is supposedly equally as scummy due to the VCA as Flubber?

I'll unvote but somebody needs to explain this. We have 1 day 5 hours 25 minutes as of this post, if the votecount from Sunday is to be believed.

unvote
"1AM .. not a good time to think I started mixing massive and mathcam" - Totem, DP8
"unvote mlaker; vote massive; It's like MeMe/mneme and Corsato/Cadmium" - Dragon Phoenix, Newbie 38
PLEASE NOTE: I actively avoid being online on weekends! Don't replace me just because of this!

Kairal
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Post Post #1665  (ISO)  » Thu Jan 12, 2017 10:47 am

Well I had this pretty neat post all planned out threatening to self hammer again unless people started voting. I can't even do that now so...

I guess I'll just say you guys should really start voting. There is only one town player currently voting (it's me!). Maybe you thought you voted and forgot to? I am talking specifically to IamI, Dierfire, Naomi and BV. Well and massive now I guess.

Alright so massive's questions: My theory is that scum will make sure not to ever all agree with the same position (at least until it's been pointed out as seen in them all currently voting me). I agree that they won't take any other easy to recognize pattern. We can't assume that Flubber voted yes on every wagon or anything like that. What we can assume is that on every wagon (or major position in the case of the cop argument) at least one scum will disagree with the other two.

Now massive is quite right that I am implicated in this as well. I guess all I can say is I have a bit of advantage over the rest of you in that regard. The pattern is quite clear to me since I know I'm town and perhaps not so clear to the rest of you.

Not much of a defense but what else is there to say? I guess I don't see why I'd even bother with this whole thing if I were scum. I only had one vote on me beforehand so it's not like I needed to radically change my position in response to pressure or anything. I could've just sat on any random vote for a few days until we got a no lynch which is where we seem to be headed.

So why not Naomi? Well I did vote Naomi initially. Then everything with AJ happened and it became clear to me that he was protecting Flubber. Why not vote AJ then? Well partially because I think he's a more difficult lynch- start with the weakest link. If I can come to you guys tomorrow with a flipped scum in Flubber I think I've got a much better shot at bagging AJ. Secondly both he and culted are protecting Flubber - I think they're both scum but it's possible only one is. So go for the overlap in the Venn diagram of scumminess if you get what I mean.

Kairal
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Post Post #1666  (ISO)  » Thu Jan 12, 2017 10:53 am

It sorta sucks but the only way I can prove my sincerity is being lynched. So I guess you just gotta decide whether or not you think I would actually bother with any of this when I'm scum when I didn't need to. If you're not sure then lynch me. Personally I think it's pretty telling that all 3 of my scum reads suddenly manufactured poorly justified reads on me out of thin air. If you look at their posts over the last few days and think 'yup these are my town buddies' then vote me. Otherwise park your vote on Flubber and lets win this thing.

massive
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Post Post #1667  (ISO)  » Thu Jan 12, 2017 10:59 am

"I wouldn't do this as scum" is like the worst defense ever, btw.
"1AM .. not a good time to think I started mixing massive and mathcam" - Totem, DP8
"unvote mlaker; vote massive; It's like MeMe/mneme and Corsato/Cadmium" - Dragon Phoenix, Newbie 38
PLEASE NOTE: I actively avoid being online on weekends! Don't replace me just because of this!

massive
Mafia Scum
 
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Location: The Springs, CO
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Post Post #1668  (ISO)  » Thu Jan 12, 2017 11:00 am

All right, not the WORST ever, but again it relies on us to trust you, when clearly enough of us don't. So can you please answer:

In post 1664, massive wrote:So why continue to push Flubber here based solely on the VCA, and why push AJ based solely on his perceived defense of Flubber?
"1AM .. not a good time to think I started mixing massive and mathcam" - Totem, DP8
"unvote mlaker; vote massive; It's like MeMe/mneme and Corsato/Cadmium" - Dragon Phoenix, Newbie 38
PLEASE NOTE: I actively avoid being online on weekends! Don't replace me just because of this!

massive
Mafia Scum
 
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Joined: July 16, 2003
Location: The Springs, CO
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Post Post #1669  (ISO)  » Thu Jan 12, 2017 11:03 am

Because this:

In post 1665, Kairal wrote:What we can assume is that on every wagon (or major position in the case of the cop argument) at least one scum will disagree with the other two.


You're going to be able to put up as an argument for any group of people. Heck, me, Grey, and MDS were this over the first two days. That's not enough to call us a scumteam.
"1AM .. not a good time to think I started mixing massive and mathcam" - Totem, DP8
"unvote mlaker; vote massive; It's like MeMe/mneme and Corsato/Cadmium" - Dragon Phoenix, Newbie 38
PLEASE NOTE: I actively avoid being online on weekends! Don't replace me just because of this!

I Am Innocent
Mafia Scum
 
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Location: Massachusetts
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Post Post #1670  (ISO)  » Thu Jan 12, 2017 11:08 am

In post 1663, culted wrote:There's one day until deadline and all you've got is "hey look at these lurkers who haven't voted much" and you're not voting either of them...

Like is this some kinda no-lynch attempt or what


Nice shade.

In post 1665, Kairal wrote:Well I had this pretty neat post all planned out threatening to self hammer again unless people started voting. I can't even do that now so...

I guess I'll just say you guys should really start voting. There is only one town player currently voting (it's me!). Maybe you thought you voted and forgot to? I am talking specifically to IamI, Dierfire, Naomi and BV. Well and massive now I guess.


My vote is on culted, who continues to prod dodge with shade at me and then appeal to fear a no lynch.

********************

Massive, where are you at besides Kairal?
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I Am Innocent
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Location: Massachusetts
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Post Post #1671  (ISO)  » Thu Jan 12, 2017 11:08 am

culted, full list of reads please.
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Naomi-Tan
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Post Post #1672  (ISO)  » Thu Jan 12, 2017 11:11 am

VOTE: Flubbernugget I'm not really gonna have time to finish my read up as I caught the flu and am not really able to focus much, but as the day is ending I think I need to help lynch my primary focus. You can see why im voting from numberous posts. but yeah. Lets flip the red.
Naomi ~ ☠ ♠ ♣ ⦿ ✿ ♡ §

massive
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Post Post #1673  (ISO)  » Thu Jan 12, 2017 11:27 am

In post 1670, I Am Innocent wrote:Massive, where are you at besides Kairal?


Man, I don't even know. If I put my Kairal read into question then too much else falls off.

I still earnestly believe one of { Kairal, Flubber } is scum based on 1.07.

Naomi will drive me insane before I get anywhere near comfortable with her being one alignment or the other.

If Kairal is town, I could be completely pocketed by culted.

It seems like it's Kairal-Naomi-IAMI vs Flubber-AJ-Culted and I'm 100% it's not as easy as that.

Where are you at? For sake of the deadline, who's your compromise lynch?
"1AM .. not a good time to think I started mixing massive and mathcam" - Totem, DP8
"unvote mlaker; vote massive; It's like MeMe/mneme and Corsato/Cadmium" - Dragon Phoenix, Newbie 38
PLEASE NOTE: I actively avoid being online on weekends! Don't replace me just because of this!

I Am Innocent
Mafia Scum
 
User avatar
Joined: February 03, 2010
Location: Massachusetts
Pronoun: He

Post Post #1674  (ISO)  » Thu Jan 12, 2017 12:19 pm

In post 1673, massive wrote:
In post 1670, I Am Innocent wrote:Massive, where are you at besides Kairal?


Man, I don't even know. If I put my Kairal read into question then too much else falls off.

I still earnestly believe one of { Kairal, Flubber } is scum based on 1.07.

Naomi will drive me insane before I get anywhere near comfortable with her being one alignment or the other.

If Kairal is town, I could be completely pocketed by culted.

It seems like it's Kairal-Naomi-IAMI vs Flubber-AJ-Culted and I'm 100% it's not as easy as that.

Where are you at? For sake of the deadline, who's your compromise lynch?


I'll compromise on Flubber. I'd prefer the other 3 tho (culted, dier, AJ).
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