In post 58, Realeo wrote:Only true in Newbies game.In post 54, Infinity 324 wrote:In general scum tend to be slightly less active than town, just cause they are slightly less motivated in general
How to respond to presure when you're scum read
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In Mislead 2, we're the most active poster and we're both scum."The debate on whether short multi postings or a long wall of post is good or not is like a debate on gun control--we would never understand each other and we have to make peace with it." -Realeo
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I've... not FAKED the read per se, but I've definitely been soft toward my scum reads calling them null so they won't NK me while I lynch their buddies.In post 69, Realeo wrote:Not PR or gambit related? Actually faking reads?
I've absolutely called DGB null when I was scumreading her for that very reason, because when I scum-read her I wind up dead.Join me on my quest to play every NES game! Some of them are awful.
Kuribo's read is foolproof: one night he was high on NyQuil, and he's ancestors reveiled Aureal's alignment to him. - Dessew- RadiantCowbells
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The trick is to only give a read on one scum at a time.In post 79, kuribo wrote:
I've... not FAKED the read per se, but I've definitely been soft toward my scum reads calling them null so they won't NK me while I lynch their buddies.In post 69, Realeo wrote:Not PR or gambit related? Actually faking reads?
I've absolutely called DGB null when I was scumreading her for that very reason, because when I scum-read her I wind up dead.
After all, you can only lynch one scum per day, and it's not like anyone reads dead peoples' reads.2019 stats: Town WR 76.7%, overall WR 81.667%, 1 scum defeat involving a major mod error in lylo vs 8 scum wins.- callforjudgement
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It's really, really, really not true.In post 76, Infinity 324 wrote:^ not really, I find it true in general in any game.
Yes, there is the Lurkmass Rule (the bottom 1/3 of posters almost always have at least one scum)
But the more experienced you are as scum, the more comfortable you get with that mask, and the more likely you are to post.
I'm always in the Top Three of posting activity, regardless of my alignment. Other players like Fate, DGB, AngryPidgeon, pirate mollie, etc would easily be able to say the same thing.
If activity = town to you, then you'll never break through to the top tier in terms of scumhunting.Join me on my quest to play every NES game! Some of them are awful.
Kuribo's read is foolproof: one night he was high on NyQuil, and he's ancestors reveiled Aureal's alignment to him. - Dessew- kuribo
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yeah but that requires subtlety and we all know that ain't me lolIn post 80, RadiantCowbells wrote:
The trick is to only give a read on one scum at a time.In post 79, kuribo wrote:
I've... not FAKED the read per se, but I've definitely been soft toward my scum reads calling them null so they won't NK me while I lynch their buddies.In post 69, Realeo wrote:Not PR or gambit related? Actually faking reads?
I've absolutely called DGB null when I was scumreading her for that very reason, because when I scum-read her I wind up dead.
After all, you can only lynch one scum per day, and it's not like anyone reads dead peoples' reads.
I prefer to only go hard after one player anyway because associative tells are one of my strong skills and they're completely worthless until you flip a scum anyway. I hate, hate HATE people who draw associative tells between living players because it wastes time discussing cases that are meaningless if one of the players flips town.Join me on my quest to play every NES game! Some of them are awful.
Kuribo's read is foolproof: one night he was high on NyQuil, and he's ancestors reveiled Aureal's alignment to him. - Dessew- Infinity 324
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Of course not, and of course lurking is a shitty scumtell. But it's just false that town and scum have exactly the same activity levels on average.In post 82, kuribo wrote:If activity = town to you, then you'll never break through to the top tier in terms of scumhunting.- MagnaofIllusion
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Actually I've found that in the top 5 posters recently there usually is a scum myself.In post 82, kuribo wrote:Yes, there is the Lurkmass Rule (the bottom 1/3 of posters almost always have at least one scum)
Since post volume is play-style driven and not alignment driven IMO I think any attempt to peg scum solely based on post numbers is going to be generally a failed avenue."I am a leaf on the wind ... watch how I soar!"
Pretty much Geriatric game restricted at this point ... unless there are players I REALLY want to play with.- Infinity 324
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I agree with the second part, but I think alignment does have some impact on activity.In post 85, MagnaofIllusion wrote:Since post volume is play-style driven and not alignment driven IMO I think any attempt to peg scum solely based on post numbers is going to be generally a failed avenue.- Frozen Angel
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I'm always in top 5 posters ... shrugsFalse tears bring pain to those around you
False smile brings pain to one's self
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Shhhhh you'll force me to reveal the fact that the Lurkmass Rule is a broad generalization based on statistics because of course at least one scum is less active than the othersIn post 85, MagnaofIllusion wrote:Actually I've found that in the top 5 posters recently there usually is a scum myself.
And yeah most scum teams also usually have a more vocal leaderJoin me on my quest to play every NES game! Some of them are awful.
Kuribo's read is foolproof: one night he was high on NyQuil, and he's ancestors reveiled Aureal's alignment to him. - Dessew- MagnaofIllusion
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You can continue to think whatever you want.In post 86, Infinity 324 wrote:I agree with the second part, but I think alignment does have some impact on activity.
Unless you want to show a broad statistical analysis of posts per game Day played by players showing a statistically signficant higher occurance rate of players posting more as Town than as scum. Then your thoughts might move into something that is actually meaningful."I am a leaf on the wind ... watch how I soar!"
Pretty much Geriatric game restricted at this point ... unless there are players I REALLY want to play with.- kuribo
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Here's an example from the last game I moderated:
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Kuribo's read is foolproof: one night he was high on NyQuil, and he's ancestors reveiled Aureal's alignment to him. - Dessew- LlamaFluff
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This. Players will tend to post about what they normally do regardless of alignment with a few specific players as exceptions, I remember Nikanor from a long time ago would lurk post D1 as scum enough for it to be a tell, but for the most part if a player posts 3-5 times a day as town, they will post 3-5 times a day as scum. Unless you can prove there is correlation for the average (not newbie) player, I don't buy activity as being a tell at all.In post 89, MagnaofIllusion wrote:
You can continue to think whatever you want.In post 86, Infinity 324 wrote:I agree with the second part, but I think alignment does have some impact on activity.
Unless you want to show a broad statistical analysis of posts per game Day played by players showing a statistically signficant higher occurance rate of players posting more as Town than as scum. Then your thoughts might move into something that is actually meaningful.
Now in somevery specificsituations scum may be more prone to holding off posting because it suits them more to have another player say something first, but I don't for a second believe that "lurking" is a tell unless you can prove its done intentionally for an advantage.- Realeo
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I sense mathemathical challenge"The debate on whether short multi postings or a long wall of post is good or not is like a debate on gun control--we would never understand each other and we have to make peace with it." -Realeo
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In post 6, mastina wrote:This advice may sound like it's geared towards town, but really, this works regardless of alignment.
While the idea of refusing to defend yourself is all tempting and whatnot, realistically, when people see you refusing to address their attacks, at best they'll feel frustrated at you ignoring them. At worst, they'll assume that because you're not answering them, you can't, that you're deliberately avoiding the subject hoping it'll go away because it's incriminating.
Of course...if you put any effort into defending yourself, you can kiss your ass goodbye because you're getting lynched, guaranteed.
If you can't defend yourself, yet refusing to defend yourself gets you lynched, what can you do?
Simple:you address the concerns people have, but you redirect their attention elsewhere.You push their focus onto other players. You turn their reason for suspecting you around and try to focus it elsewhere. You don't want to ignore their suspicion. You don't want to defend from it. You want to make their suspicion no longer be something they want to direct your way. Get their attention where YOU want it. With you in the spotlight, it's the perfect time to highlight your scumreads, why you have them, and why the players scumreading you should listen to you and lynch your scumreads rather than you. (Yes, as scum, you should have scumreads.)
A task which is far easier, for instance, if you can point out that most/all of their reasons for suspecting you ALSO apply to your scumread. It won't work all the time; you'll still get lynched. The best way to avoid a scumread is to never be scumread. But this is the best general advice to take. Specific situations may differ (where some defense may be warranted), but in general, neither defending yourself nor refusing to defend yourself is the best approach to take. Work with the players accusing you, to try and reach a gamestate where they will push who you want pushed.
...Which you should have, by the way. If you don't have anyone who you want to see pushed, you pretty much deserve the lynch on you.
I didn't read the rest of the thread past this. The bolded is really the best advice you could get, and it summarizes the trend I was noticing with what people were saying. The act of "redirecting" their attention elsewhere comes from actively finding what else exists in the game to be suspicious about...in short, scumhunting, EVEN IF YOU'RE SCUM. All players, regardless of alignment, do suspicious, questionable things, and it's up to you to point all that out. Yes, the people who are tunneled on you won't care, BUT THAT'S NOT IMPORTANT. It takes a number of votes to get lynched, and by diluting the attention of the town, you reduce the immediate risk of a lynch on you, which buys you the time you need to let people focus on the next shiny thing that comes along.
Getting out ahead of the suspicions is also key. Be aware of how the game, as a whole, feels about as many slots as possible. Make sure that when things start trending against you, but you aren't yet the main focus, that you're making those moves to redirect and control the conversation. If you time it right, you won't have to deal with the suspicion that comes from seeming to survivalistically offer up other lynches for consideration...instead, you'll just be scum hunting, because people in large numbers won't be focusing on pushing you.GTK a me, currently live, this may be your only chance!
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I hate all this talk about "redirect the conversation elsewhere" "push a different target". to defend yourself, just be honest and try to reach an understanding with the other person as to why you did what you did as town. don't let it affect your scum hunting at all, and people will either realize that their concerns on you don't hold water, or they will hopefully see your play and the fact that you're not being disingenuous and give you the benefit of the doubt.
I have never had any issue with this, to the point where I was lynched for it; obviously there will always be idiots who just won't give a shit and will push you just because they want to push you, but I usually get widely town read in all of my games, so, /shrug.- Bins
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by how much?
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While I don't believe your way of doing it is wrong, being open can be very good strategy in many circumstances, but I disagree people shouldn't try to redirect or push someone else.In post 96, pieguyn wrote:I hate all this talk about "redirect the conversation elsewhere" "push a different target". to defend yourself,
These are all common things seen in real world application to debate and conversations. It's very common. It's up to other players how they go forward if a person continues redirecting or changing subject, etc.Show"You are the Joker of mafia players" - Oversoul
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his first post in the scum PT was "yes I rolled scum!"
I decided to post "haha just don't post that in the main thread", but to get up to date on the main thread first.
His first post in the main thread was "yes I rolled scum!" -popsofctown - Firebringer
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