Open 778: Nightless Vanilla [Game Over!]

[Isis]

Hello Everyone.
I have been thinking about the best way to investigate the town since getting my Role Message.
I think it is best if we all focus our Votes onto one Player, except for the last vote that would Kill them. Then when someone has learned that a different Player has become a better choice, they will move their Vote and we will know things have become Serious.
The problem is how to pick the Player.

2 -humaneatingmonkey
3 -Cycle Men
4 -Albert B. Rampage
5 -votato
6 -Alisae
7 -Deimos27
8 -Elements
9 -Green Crayons
10 -Isis
11 -NorweiganboyEE
12 -Looker
13 -Firebringer

To help I used Dice. I did not throw them and adjusted them with my fingers until they showed the Value I wanted. Here is a picture to prove that I adjusted them with my fingers until I got the Value I wanted:

According to this result I submit VOTE: humaneatingmonkey.
Deimos27, Elements, Albert B. Rampage, Firebringer, Alisae, NorwegianBoyEE and humaneatingmonkey, you all woke up before I could share my Plan. Please adjust your votes to humaneatingmonkey to help us accelerate the game.

[Isis]

My name means Goddess not Terrorist.

[Isis]

The Players who got to Vote you will Factionalize against those who did not get to Vote you, from the rule against fully killing you. This will create Tensions. I will try to deliberately inflame the Tensions until a Player is likely to act angrily.

[Isis]

Ok that was fun

This is a new open alt hopefully becomes my main. I got tired of letter soup.

Lightly townreading Norwee and scumreading monkey for their reactions so far.

Not sure how to read Elements. He is always an axolotl-tier read.

[Isis]

Uh, I disavow the plan.

I scumread your reaction because kneejerking "this is town" then raising objectively meritous objections has this look to it like realizing a slot deserves to get townread but then pursuing a win condition where slots that deserve to get townread don't get townread. Norwee's response was more internally consistent.

[Isis]

Elements is an axolotl. An axolotl is a weird water amphibian thing shown in his avatar. Axolotls are very silly. I know this because Elements is very silly.

[Isis]

Yeah there's lots of space for that, it waters down the assessment a lot. I'm trying to cobble together what analysis I can in low information phase.

[Isis]

I figure it would be pretty difficult to read Egyptian goddesses too.

Egyptian goddesses are always town jsyk

[Isis]

Did you think the original post was sincere in spite of the bogus selection process?

[Isis]

If I had to guess which direction to interpret Element's I would say it's town indicative for him, because he seems to be more passive day one when he has a green role PM.

I'd probably dislike it if he were anyone else.

[Isis]

You ninja'ed me. I think I agree with your perspective in the dark, but for Elements it might be paradoxically town indicative

Pedit: the "lightly" adjective applied to both reads.

[Isis]

What can I say votato I'm a goddess

[Isis]

He might also onboard to the plan, but I'd expect him to self-consciously feel obligated to provide some shred of his own reasoning for participating.

[Isis]

Elements probably votes humaneatingmonkey there as every alignment except unlyncher, I think, but doing so silently is town for him.

[Isis]

Votato do you have a red role pm?

[Isis]

He might also onboard to the plan, but I'd expect him to self-consciously feel obligated to provide some shred of his own reasoning for participating.

see this is weird because i was trying to browse his recent games and i found not one thing that can give me this kind of idea. At least 5 of his last games have been town, and his most recent scum game he kinda replaced into.

so to have this kind of conclusion of declaring that he is "paradoxically town", you guys must have a lot of history. can you give me insight on past games that might give you this idea?

Spoiler:

I was thinking we spare the biggest town read each day

How would claiming help the game at all?

I don't see how claiming helps. If there is a claim we can spare them but their ability won't mean anything and we lose the advantage of their existence in the first place

^ I was agreeing with you oversoul

Worst case we lynch wrong and lynch scum tomorrow.

WORST CASE. That's terrible for scum btw.

PRs should claim D1 and w/o counterclaim we spare.

Don't scum just kill the pr claim night 1?

D1 scum!Elements
Your more recent scumgame might hold more weight, I don't know of it, but, here's to let you know where I'm coming from.

[Isis]

General pattern there is either objecting to bad planning or trying to get some kind of value out of joining in on stuffs

I think I have played 5 games with Elements? I have played with him bunches.

[Isis]

votato what do you think of Elements?

[Isis]

When you play nightless, do you try to target the dangerous players first, votato?

[Isis]

I have all sorts of theory opinions about this topic I'd want to say postgame but I'm not sure whether they serve my wincon right now.

#91 strikes me a smidge disingenuous. Town!votato is pretty aware that an iso with little content besides scumclaim wifom isn't very threatening to a scum!Isis, irrespective of attitudes towards Elements.

[Isis]

The absence of something useful is a trek into the negatives. I don't know what meta you're used to, but active lurking is hardly something I'd ever consider "an unknown".

[Isis]

There are plenty of people contributing even less than me... why single me out?

I'm discussing it in the context of your speculation about me trying to assess threats, which I'm perceiving as possibly fake speculation

[Isis]

wait when did someone support organic food

I could get on board with this

especially if someone supported "GMO-free food"

don't get me started

[Isis]

popular

i'm gonna be pop-u-lar

[Isis]

firebringer how r u

[Isis]

drnk >_<

[Isis]

league is bad.

[Isis]

I will always question your devotion to me unless you vote yourself firedog

[Isis]

VOTE: Firebringer

[Isis]

<3
Firebringer u r a treasure

[Isis]

VOTE: Cycle Men it is now to show Cycle men that afk'ing in a nightless setup is fucking disgusting

[Isis]

^_^

[Isis]

mostly because it feels like Norwee is forcing himself to push this.
It just doesn't look like scumhunting to me

Watch me.
VOTE: Isis
VOTE: Isis
VOTE: Isis

[_] Town Reaction
[X] Norwee's conception of a town reaction

[Isis]

Who on earth is Albert B. Rampage and where have they gone

ABR is a Legend from the Old Times and please speak of him more Respectfully.

[Isis]

VOTE: Cycle Men it is now to show Cycle men that afk'ing in a nightless setup is fucking disgusting

you call it afk, i call it being asleep when people usually get active

This has a more Survivalist appearance than I'd get if you just produced some content at whatsoever is your Golden hour of the day of content producing and tacked some indignance on the tail end of it.

[Isis]

why do you have pops avatar

I like this avatar!!!
<3

[Isis]

But i'm so much more cute.

Norwee whether or not you rolled scum this game you should know that you are Cute

[Isis]

GREEN CRAYONS YOU ARE 3.14159265% OF WHY I QUEUED FOR THIS GAME U BETTER COME PLAY WITH ME

[Isis]

Does that count as mafia?

[Isis]

Norwee boy is suspicious

[Isis]

This is my main now.
I've never played with you before, you simply have a 2002 join date.

[Isis]

I was trying to masquerade as an offsite player for the first 3 pages for reactions and memes.
I'm not sure the approach of putting someone at L-1 is refutable as a good strategy, any more than any other approach to RVS, because RVS kind of fundamentally sucks. It's not really a novel concept, only my presentation was novel. ("why did you RVS X" "X already had some votes" is pretty common) So I don't know if I'm "insincere", I think artificially wagoning someone to L-1 is at least tied with other RVS garbage, but I don't feel strongly enough to defend it to humaneatingmonkey for three pages after I've already gotten higher information traction into the game.

[Isis]

pls 4 minutes to compose my thoughts

[Isis]

I don't always respond to things in order, so if I don't say something older right away it doesn't mean I've skipped to-dos

[Isis]

I planned to masquerade as an offsite player before getting my role PM, but came up with everything else after getting my role PM, if you guys want to sort those choices in a valid way

[Isis]

VOTE: Cycle men because Norweescum is likely to reveal all of his teammates and write me poetry

[Isis]

What characteristic of the game made you feel that way?

[Isis]

votato your nihilistic attitude towards the possibility of generating valuable early content seems more like a defensive kludge than a worldview you feel driven to share

[Isis]

Come on I let you live for like 4 extra dayphases I think that was pretty good repayment

[Isis]

VOTE: Green Crayons

[Isis]

Elements is getting sketchier.

Green Crayons why do you think it's "playing wrong" not to be on a leading wagon in the early game?

[Isis]

I play a bit less on the weekends Albert.
I don't agree that forcing early consolidation is good mafia but I think I believe Green Crayons believes that.

I still don't have any strong reads

[Isis]

Actually I'll do some catch-up here and there whenever I have time.

Spoiler: Norwegian + HEM

The Players who got to Vote you will Factionalize against those who did not get to Vote you, from the rule against fully killing you. This will create Tensions. I will try to deliberately inflame the Tensions until a Player is likely to act angrily.

Doesn't sharing your plan kinda ruin any element of surprise you could possibly derive from it...?

It reads like you're trying to appear to be solving and putting out plans like you're having a townie mindset, but the actual plan described doesn't have much thought put behind it and thus i fail to see how it would be effective at containing scum.

It's like he mechanically explained RVS.

Ok that was fun

This is a new open alt hopefully becomes my main. I got tired of letter soup.

Lightly townreading Norwee and scumreading monkey for their reactions so far.

Not sure how to read Elements. He is always an axolotl-tier read.

Why are my reactions scum and what is your response to our critique of your plan?

I'm amazed that neither Norwegian nor HEM realised Isis's obvious trollpost was an obvious trollpost.

To help I used Dice. I did not throw them and adjusted them with my fingers until they showed the Value I wanted. Here is a picture to prove that I adjusted them with my fingers until I got the Value I wanted:

I mean come on, this part had be me wheezing.

HEM is even like "what's your response to our critique" after Isis has already showed herself an alt. Which isn't scummy, just legendarily unobservant.

Uh, I disavow the plan.

I scumread your reaction because kneejerking "this is town" then raising objectively meritous objections has this look to it like realizing a slot deserves to get townread but then pursuing a win condition where slots that deserve to get townread don't get townread. Norwee's response was more internally consistent.

What's with this assumption that the logic of an argument is intrinsically interrelated with the scumminess of the person making making it. I thought HEM was perfectly consistent by townreading Isis while disagreeing with her logic. It's not just that there's "lots of room for [it]" (48), it's the only sensical way of reading his posts. And I completely agree with HEM that if Isis's opening were coming from a genuine newbie, it would be really towny. I would just never buy it coming from a genuine newbie.

Norwegian seems a more calculating in personality than HEM, even just based on their academic tone in 34, so out of the two, the fact that Norwegian fails to recognize the obvious trollpost and makes it into some kind of "ah yes this is an intentional attempt to look like scumhunting without in fact progressing the game" looks far more disingenuous.

No, I think h.e.m. was townreading me either way. I just think it's somewhat scum indicative that at that juncture he's more concerned with litigating an approach to RVS that's slightly worse than any other approach rather building an emergent townbloc in a nightless game. It's not about dissonance, it's about priorities.
Like when I was in Guns and Roses and someone with zero games replaced in with an obvtown post that only one other person wanted to townlock, I spent like my next umpteen posts saying "cyanjet is town, don't ever lynch it after I'm dead".

[Isis]

Hi Alisae how are you

[Isis]

I'm an open alt, Deimos, you can request meta games if you want to

[Isis]

I can see how you could interpret it that way but my latter explanation is what I meant.

I'll fetch you four games in a moment.

[Isis]

*later

[Isis]

Scum, then town:

viewtopic.php?f=52&t=82266
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=81907

viewtopic.php?f=2&t=82449
viewtopic.php?f=84&t=82497

[Isis]

Man. I feel like I have no valid reason to townclear Deimos but if Deimos is scum I don't want to win this mafia game.

Newbies are indeed the most fluff deficient games. People in a fluffposting mood know better than to go ruin a newbie's on-ramp experience with it. And newbies themselves don't fluffpost until they reach a certain comfort level.

I myself fluffpost pretty heavily at times, but I pretty much always accompany it with content.

Firebringer has played several games with me and likes me so he is sheeping me for X hours. He hasn't ever professed I am good at reads or anything like that.

There might be enough Old Gods present to policy lynch Cycle Men and play the game with the remaining players because he's getting pretty defiant of playing any mafia.

I have been in my head a bunch about votato's scumclaim wifom, truth be told. His join date is recent enough for it to be -possible- to not learn this site's standard town PM color, and the standard town PM color at at least one other site is indeed blue (epic mafia).

I can't remember whether nsg used color in my role PM and am not gonna look it up because I don't consider that kind of thing really in the spirit of the game (but I'm still going to engage with parties that have brought it up).

The WIFOM is so much more intense if he actually doesn't know the town color and just kind of rolls with it (it looks like this game does have sample role PMs because nsg is a stellar mod). (I guess that means my role PM was probably colored because it was a copypaste of OP)

[Isis]

it looks like votato answered 18 minutes after i asked. If the timestamp was shorter I might ponder whether it'd constitute a townslip. Even if nothing precludes either alignment from making the post.

[Isis]

policy lynching? saying votato is scum because he said blue instead of green?

man, i feel like i'm on the wrong side of things.

happy to see that this game is moving away from garbage.

i've been away because i had to leroy jenkins a video i was editing for work.

i'm about to sleep now. give me 12 hours, and then i'll get back on this game.

TY.

uh i remember writing my post as almost-reprehensibly-equivocal
does it read that way to other people or am i losing my mind

[Isis]

I have been in my head a bunch about votato's scumclaim wifom, truth be told. His join date is recent enough for it to be -possible- to not learn this site's standard town PM color, and the standard town PM color at at least one other site is indeed blue (epic mafia).

I forgot until yesterday, but the mod's first or second post has role PMs post. Including color.

How does that change your thinking?


(Also, this discovery has led me to firmly believe human is town.)

It doesn't, I acknowledged that availability of sample PMs in my post. (I found them halfway thru composing the post though)

Man. I feel like I have no valid reason to townclear Deimos but if Deimos is scum I don't want to win this mafia game.

Newbies are indeed the most fluff deficient games. People in a fluffposting mood know better than to go ruin a newbie's on-ramp experience with it. And newbies themselves don't fluffpost until they reach a certain comfort level.

I myself fluffpost pretty heavily at times, but I pretty much always accompany it with content.

Firebringer has played several games with me and likes me so he is sheeping me for X hours. He hasn't ever professed I am good at reads or anything like that.

There might be enough Old Gods present to policy lynch Cycle Men and play the game with the remaining players because he's getting pretty defiant of playing any mafia.

I have been in my head a bunch about votato's scumclaim wifom, truth be told. His join date is recent enough for it to be -possible- to not learn this site's standard town PM color, and the standard town PM color at at least one other site is indeed blue (epic mafia).

I can't remember whether nsg used color in my role PM and am not gonna look it up because I don't consider that kind of thing really in the spirit of the game (but I'm still going to engage with parties that have brought it up).

The WIFOM is so much more intense if he actually doesn't know the town color and just kind of rolls with it (it looks like this game does have sample role PMs because nsg is a stellar mod). (I guess that means my role PM was probably colored because it was a copypaste of OP)

Are we allowed to ask you to claim your role pm color? Cuz i really want to now. Am i the only one who feels like isis is scummy?

Actually I'm slighly sl firebringer from the way he has been shitposting, which reads slightly different than normal to me.

I hardclaim purple text in my role PM and will never rescind.

[Isis]

if u are at all dissatisfied with the content I am posting ABR I am giving u a limited time offer of 3 people I will ISO and give detailed examinations into thoughts on how their mind operates, alignment, and their favorite color.

Order now.

ABR this is a very rare opportunity I don't think you should take it for granted

pedit: yay!

[Isis]

It’s right there in 337, votato

I'm reading on my phone at doc office. Prefer to post with pc

[Isis]

See look I accidentally proved why

[Isis]

First lets go post by post into each one and add some colorful insight. Then I will follow up with general summary of what I learned followed by CORRECT GUESS ON COLOR. Ohh also a read I guess. if ur into that thing.

Spoiler: Isis

18 Isis, trying to go in strong with the first post. What a try hard. Of course most of this is just show and not real effort. Maybe there to set the mood of what he is going to be doing later.

19 No the name is from the Egyptian god of the dead I believe.
23 This non-speaking normally in a idiosyncratic way is strange. Could be just fun loving rp/style kind of post. Still when someone is acting I am always thinking okay what u acting for.
41 Cool. Act dropped gave reads. Though since the reads are vague and im not going to pull this post to see what in reference to in the vagueness in language hard to tell how deep in thought these were but could just be general vibes.
44 This goes between old act and previous post. Overusage of words to describe something that could be done shorter. If Isis is rping what even is this character.
45 axolotl sounds weeb.
48 There isn't anything to analysis but Isis wants to analyze. I don't like this forceful push to move game forward players do. Let it flow naturally.
52 I didn't get this memo
53 Is isis expecting to get something readable from reaction to his first post? Or is this fake. I wouldn't take his first post serious nor would I think anyone really should. Isis has a more open mind than me.
57 I like this meta take on Elements. Not that I agree with it, just the highlight of "if it was anyone else". Shows he is factoring in normal player behavior into it.
63 Interesting this could indicate he planned that first post specifically for someone like Elements...
65 I am unaware of Elements/Isis relationship but Isis indicates a heavy knowledge of both his mentality and actions. It could be overstated. I would like to know more background on that to see if this is Pocketing or genuine. I am sure they played games, and I have too with Elements. But elements to me is semi-forgettable player in style.
67 I generally don't like these kinds of posts.
68 Here is the point where I go. Wow. Elements is mentioned so much. Is Isis protecting him because he knows Elements can be susceptible to mislynch? Does he actually believe he is town? Does he know he is town and just looking for ally/credit later. I need more background on that relationship.
69 Cool. Context. 5 games. Is that enough? Ehhhhhhhhh...might be enough for him to realize some things people pick on Elements for to point out. Fine. I am leaving this elements as a pass.
92 Its strange for context on nightless to this question because how does a scum or town answer this? "Go for the dangerous players" What differentiates a town or scum mindset. Maybe a mentality of player but I don't know if it will yield AI responses.

at this point im gonna start skipping posts. This is getting long.

94 This post is hard for me to understand
108 Lackadaisical response to pressure that I enjoy.
110 I am fine. How r u?
114 Good Post
116 And he thought I wouldn't vote myself.
120 Don't tell any pirates that.
121 Pressuring a non-presence, I am under assumption Isis has no reads here since he has yet to state a scumread. He mildly questioned votato and was defensive on the response. So I am thinking he is looking back to fish on what to do. Generally fine with this.
141 Showing that he thinks Norwee is projecting? Or maybe making fun of him. Should be voting him if its the first. First post I am generally like this comeback post was kind of scummy.
142 we just call ABR old fart these days.
143 Overanalysis into a post about not being here. Kind of questionable but could be just prodding here.
145 This and 146 is being very friendly towards 2 players. Isis is not known for being mean to players. But considering Isis, I am concerned of no scumreads. Minor pokes. And only one apparent town read.
188 If this post is true. 100% Isis is town here. Deciding not to masquerade as an alt would help his scum game only. Not his town game.
228 Why Green Crayons over Norwe? This defeats my "he is buddying" thing a bit.
251 Losing faith in Elements. Signaling a town paranoia
268 Confirms my "no strong reads" suspicion which isn't really like high level analysis.
303 So much focus on the votato role pm color. I forget sometimes that Isis focuses in on this stuff that I just don't care about. Not much to say but I don't like he townclears Deimos in a way here. Everything beyond that is fine.
304 This is one of those weird posts for scum to fake considering they have to be thinking "ohh I am gonna go see between these 2 timestamps when they posted and then conjecture here to make a read" its just a deeper analysis than scum will typically go for and not something intuitive to do. They are more likely to do something else than this. Rare to see a scum go this route for explaining a read and almost never for a "I can't make anything out of this".
310 no, u didn't advocate for policy lynch, ur not crazy yet.
352 I bet u think I am gonna call u town.

Okay in summary what we got here for Isis that can be summed up in one long paragraph instead of all those sentences above. First, the meta read in the early phase I think was interesting into his focus on Elements. In my mind when I think someone focuses in on a player like that its two possibilities for either deception or genuine. I leaned more in genuine because later it got backtracked. You could say Isis saw wasn't getting anything from it hence the deception part faded, I don't think so. I think he is looking at the player trying to sus-out things that should be town indicative not scum and not hve them be pushed in general not scum way. His reads are weak, and it shows throughout the gme and he has tried to push the gme in certain wys but also seems kind of relaxed with game state, maybe got used to it just not being a try-hard kind game. Isis is a person I don't expect to get frustrated with a game state not being to her liking. The reads on Norwee is strange for no push. The most interesting and I think most telling was response to votato and the looking aat time stamps and trying to figure out the authenticity of it, which is more telling to me that Isis is thinking in town sense than anything else.

I rate this player. With the Firebringer Grade:

To Townie To Fail.

Most importantly favorite color: Purple.

That was long. Okay next coming up soon.

You got my favorite color exactly right.
Seems like you switch to using "her" only when talking about my past games and I wonder if you have Osiris and Isis mixed up. Isis is the wife of Osiris, and she is the one who resurrected him when he died. Both are associated with death. 67% of the letters in "Osiris" are the letters in Isis so that's kinda confusing.

I am fine.

ABR why do you scumreading Deimos and Isis?

I have to start somewhere, don't I?

Yet it's not random nor is it gut.

Their posts feel weirded than others.

Indicating that someone is a loser at "one of these things is not like the other" without linking that to a distinct wincon is like, fake scumhunting right from the templates

Spoiler: Deimos

13 RVS
27 Asking for main. Kind of obvious Isis is alt.
272 Last paragraph was only interesting post. Highlights some analysis that shows a lot of assumptions/analysis within about a player that might be a bit too much.
276 Damn this heavy analytical players are going to drive me up a wall. The complexity of their mind is harder for me to grasp. They go a few hundred miles a minute within a few sentences. Nothing sticks out to me as saying he is just fabricating analysis, but to me the highlight was Elements. He came to a similar conclusion as me. And he doesn't have the experience or I don't think he does have the experience with Elements so this could be someone from a scum mindset who picked up on something and is highlighting it show he is thinking deeply. Like showing your sleeves while having a knife tucked in your shoe.
278 analytical speak. Not mindset indicative it just highlights again that analytical mind.
288 Posts like this always make me think. What is the purpose? What do you think you are conveying and how do you think this analysis is helping you? To me, the mindset is generally to see whose thought patterns can be manipulated and I think he is picking up Votato as a potential ally.
289 Newbie games aren't fun. They are like awkward and full of people talking like robots.
297 Surprised he brought up policy lynch. Analytical players generally don't push that.
320 Good reads here I actually think. He isn't shading HEM which I think would be the actual scum modus operandi, considering this is the opportunity to double down and force a ditotemy of Votato/him town.
325I would think he would pick up Isis read is based on meta if he was analyzing that more. Maybe not.
327 lol I guess he wasn't gonna push a policy. Or is this a lie?!? Probably not.
334 This post gave me the thought "hmm there is the players ego here". First time I seen something outside analysis, was kind of interesting to see it shed for a minute. Maybe a bit defensive not really in a bad way.
346 I don't think you would be dumb enough to pretend to have 4 scum leans in this game just because 4 scum.

Wow. All those posts. So much words. Well, I can easily say this is a analytical player. LOL. The worst kind of mafia player, we need to brun them at the stake tbh. Anyways, he is clearly going into depth on players post and picking them apart to think about players. Does that mean town? No. In this situation, I don't really think so. Sure some posts I can kind of see a townie mindset. Other posts, ehhh what you telling me some of this stuff for and wht does this help in either A) discussions to leading to you getting reads or B) do anything. The perfect example I guess was back in post 276. I can see this plyer looking into players the same way a predator looks for the easiest path to catching a prey. I don't think Deimos is looking for those easy mislynch bait, he is clearly looking to maneuver himself into the best altitude but not in a rushed manner because nothing in his posts is him screming "I AM TOWN" but I can def see positioning possibilities here the one post that kind of went against that was him and HEM which could just be not wanting to push that position too soon. Also this guy has L as his avatar. Should be clear sign of someones sense of ego.

Firebringer rating:

Scum Raccoon (they like to scavenge for good finds)

Favorite Color:

Turquoise

This was pretty resonant for me. Well, the parts about seeing a way everything he's done could very well be done from a scum perspective. Obviously I don't hate analytical players, since I am one, and I am more at true null than null-scum. Perhaps because he buttered me up.

[Isis]

FB notices that isis is online
isis defends by saying on phone, will post later, conveniently dropping phone wrong button slip
isis points out slip.

this doesnt really read as genuine to me

uh
what?

This is 3 lines of narration followed by a conclusion, which has an IioA flavor going for it, regardless of what moonlogic votato has for this later.
VOTE: votato seems like the strongest vote by now

[Isis]

Cycle Men you need to think this game before you get to rethink

[Isis]

The tldr is that Deimos is doing plenty of analytical posts where he just makes observations or raises questions but never really does anything substantive with these lines of discussion to formulate reads.

So he's effectively emulating the hard part about scumhunting as scum, and not cashing in on the part where he gets to mislynch people? You really sound like you're bad-casing him.

UNVOTE:

Everyone is scummy this game.
Except Firebringer
I'll call him scum since he likes it though, you're a scumbringer

[Isis]

He's not voting anyone.

Empirically, time and time again, D1 votecamps flip green disproportionately often.

This push seems disingenuous. I don't see why Deimos would be interpreted as feeling heavy pressure to provide content based on his approach.

Like your angle on Firebringer's case seems to diverge from a town thought process in a bunch of ways so it can bend over backwards and push a junkpush harder. Deimos is scum because he doesn't know who the scum is? That's not how this works. That's not how any of this works.

[Isis]

Deimos could flip red here and I would be concerned crayons bussed

[Isis]

It shouldn't be hard to see how it follows from your premises. As a caricature, to be fair.

How would he be playing differently if he was town? He would not be posting analysis at all? Fortunately I don't believe mafia works that way, threads would be very empty if going afk was a trust tell.

He would be posting the same analysis, but getting over the finish marker and hitting scumreads? The reason that's not happening is ostensibly he's not confident enough to warrant it because he doesn't have all the role PMs. That would be a change that benefits scum!him even more than it benefits town!him. Like it's like you're TMIing that he was actually scumcasing someone at some point and now you want him to be the butt of a joke.

[Isis]

What an truly absurd characterization of what I'm saying. Honestly.

Why do you need to clarify that you're being honest when you're already using superlative adjectives?

[Isis]

"Honestly" is an adjective that modifies you, not one that modifies my behavior. Maybe you just have a different way around words, I know the "honestly" tell has poor stock prices but if it had any merit it'd be this usage.

anyways

I don't think I'm being absurd.
I think your case is silly at best.

[Isis]

votato is pretending to scumhunt by pretending to be paranoid or doubtful of a post I made about visiting the doctor. I don't think he genuinely doubts whether I misclicked a quote post button on a phone or not but I think he has some conception that pretending to doubt others makes him look town.

To borrow your logic, he never finishes his conspiracy theory to posit why scum!me would do that.

Wait, I'm supposed to be adamantly against this line of reasoning

is this purgatory

[Isis]

this post and the next one are some of my circles I talk myself into about votato. I find the scumclaim wifom inconclusive with this nasty fear it's the kind of thing I'll flip green and feel dumb when I look at the posts during rereads.

votato's general positioning and pattern of when he does/doesn't provide content seems off, exemplified as the weird Waiting Room Conspiracy Theory that looked forced

[Isis]

by the bye while I was rereading my own posts I remember Firebringer misunderstood something I said.
To clarify I was saying earlier that I decided to pretend to be an offsite player pregame, but decided what to post after getting my role PM. I also decided pregame that I would out this as an open alt extremely early in the game (since I'm trying to replace my main account with this I kind of have to). So that decision is NAI, I can see why if it was formed only after rolling an alignment it'd be somewhat town indicative but please read me the hard way etc.

[Isis]

Ok but votato what color does my role PM taste like?

[Isis]

can i lick it?

Yes

[Isis]

I can vote Looker today.

I struggle to townread or scumread 456, but Looker is a fascinating escalator with no bottom step and left handrail that is also the right stairwell and it's not resonant to me to chuck a longsword at the Gordian Knot like this

edit: typed the word stairwell instead of handrail but that actually is even better

[Isis]

463 is content. I think it's less likely ABR is town.

[Isis]

Trying to let this fall away in the news cycle instead of doubling it down or jettisoning it probably means he rolled scum.

I think he has like lots of AI content you didn't roll scum or anything right so you have some thoughts you join in too

[Isis]

"you" is Alisae in that quote

[Isis]

that's a good point but I think you would have thoughts if you were town too

I think you do but they are little unripe strawberries you're not excited about yet and don't want to share

show me your strawberries Alisae

[Isis]

also, try not to tunnel me too hard

if you get focused on the people who post actively
and just kind of ignor the people who spend 10 minutes on an image macro saying "I join the battle" and produce no content
town always wins those games

11/10 times

idk why you're not in revel mode yet!!

oh no is this something you'd consider a shitpost

I can't push you I can't shitpost, what am I allowed to do???

[Isis]

Firebringer if you aren't on my team this game I will cry.

You're very convincing right now.

[Isis]

Isis if u keep calling me town ur gonna make me paranoid.

I only talked about being on the same team does being scum buddies mean nothing to you??

[Isis]

I'm proud of nsg always

[Isis]

I'm still catching up. It's a fast game

spice rack preview though, I think morally reprehensible primate townslipped

[Isis]

Spoiler: GC pocket case

In addition to the points Alisae made against Norwegian,

Shot:

VOTE: Cycle men because Norweescum is likely to reveal all of his teammates and write me poetry

It don’t come so cheap no more. Besides. It’s not like that worked out so well in Fusion mafia. Pocket attempts on you are out of the picture from now on. I know it’s sad for you, but after all... you can only blame yourself. If you had been obediently pocketed i’d let you live on in that sweet sweet blissfull ignorance.

Come on I let you live for like 4 extra dayphases I think that was pretty good repayment

Actually, you were one of the main reasons i was close to having a mental breakdown. All those times you unnecesarilly placed an extra vote on me made me want to break out in tears and confess that i’d been a very bad scum player and deserved punishment.

Chaser:

VOTE: NorwegianboyEE

VOTE: Green Crayons

Good vote Isis.

Interesting review of past events.
Is it wrong that I want to keep Norwee alive for about four days so I can encounter him breaking out in tears and confessing that he's a very bad scum player who deserves punishment though?

[Isis]

Rare case I'll do an ISO because it's so short

I believe Elements was confused as I was that Isis was serious in her proposition.

Elements' townreads are also opportunistic.
#81

on alisae [url=https://forum.mafiascum ... 83693]#230 again on me, monkey
this strikes me as a pocket attempts.

#82
these reads, with nothing to base it on, strike me as TMI. and i dont really buy his justification. even if it's true, it doesn't explain his firebringer read.[/quote]
You know I have since realized with 3 dice the numbering should have started at 3, it wasn't even possible for monkey to get picked.

I'm not as leery about those two naked townreads as you are because a. I don't know Looker super well yet but I think he's pretty unpocketable and b. I think the content to get to firebringer town does exist in the thread

I am realizing in spelling that out that both of those could be projecting to an invalid extent

mafia is hard
my stomach hurts for unrelated reasons

[Isis]

@Isis:

can you please confirm whether you thought Deimos was at L-1 and, if so, it's because that's what you and Norweig decided in the scumchat?

Deimos had 3 votes in a mini so I knew he was at L-gazillion

Norwee does extensively use his daytalk thread when he rolls scum if that's something you want to think about

[Isis]

Rare case I'll do an ISO

What does TMI stand for? That he's scum giving Too Much Information?

It's a pretty newish buzzword for accusing scum of confidently and accurately townreading town with too little evidence. It annoys me a bit since TMI in standard parlance refers to sharing information that shouldn't be shared because it's uncomfortable for the listener to hear it, not because it is particularly clandestine or necessarily even surprising. Someone has coined one of these new little misnomers that are gonna bug me.

I always preferred to think of the metaphor of a mathematics textbook with correct answers in the back.

"answer key" should have become the buzzword if this category of tell has had so much value increase it needed to get a pithy name

elect me president

[Isis]

TMI is the basis for most solid reads.

My 08 brain so totally finds this statement just so wild

such wow

we live in different times

I can't not acknowledge that people put tmi cases to work but i'll always find it funnest to catch people for not sorting and pretending to sort

[Isis]

nsg will you treat it as a valid voting alias if I spell out the name for "cycle men" starting at the third letter and wrapping back around to the front of his name for the last two letters

[Isis]

Nope. Double checked. Wasn't Isis, but Looker.

To be complete/fair I agreed with Alisae's characterization of emself as more aggressive as scum. E was pretty passive in a couple town games I played with em, and e seemed much feistier in the scumgame I read judging scummies.

[Isis]

hey just so you guys know, i'm ignoring questions on purpose. the reason? i'm truly lazy to comb through this thread to reply to questions peppered all-over. so if you guys have questions you need an answer for, just re-ask it.

This is the post that I think is a townslip

This has been a fast moving game with lots of people asking eachother questions, but I'm pretty sure at the time of this post there were no outstanding questions for monkey

scum remember questions posed to them better than town, in my experience, although they respond at about the same rate after scum deliberately ignore questions somewhat more often. I think scum monkey would be cognizant that he has no outstanding questions to address and just couldn't really formulate this post. Like even if a scum monkey can't remember exactly what answers he owed, I think he would remember the quantity correctly.
Whether he adopts a policy of insisting others repeat themselves or puts in the work to ctrl f for hem and monkey is not very alignment indicative. This is an informational thing.

Since I am not monkey there's a large chance someone did ask him something after all which zeroes this whole thing out but otherwise this is something I'm gonna put a bunch of stock in

[Isis]

VOTE: cle MenCy

[Isis]

619 is probably scum indicative
But I feel sad for Ali and want em to enjoy mafia

[Isis]

Looker's snark is a bit uncharacteristic from him, I think. Do you think anything out of game put you in a different mood, Looker, or do you think it's localized to this game?

I'm flipping back and forth on ways interpreting that deviation to be greentell or redtell

[Isis]

619 is probably scum indicative
But I feel sad for Ali and want em to enjoy mafia

what why

I don't know if scum indicative is the right word. It's just kind of a dampening multiplier of how much we can read into you not being aggressive or having much this game since if your motivation is low in general the delta between your scum and town enthusiasm will decrease.

[Isis]

Norwee is wrong, Looker is right. It's alignment indicative

It matches your general paradigm for mafia for it to trend that way. That doesn't mean there won't be some exceptions

Not going to indulge your fantasy of having more control over your tendencies than you actually do, sorry not sorry

[Isis]

Norwee is wrong, Looker is right. It's alignment indicative

It matches your general paradigm for mafia for it to trend that way. That doesn't mean there won't be some exceptions

Not going to indulge your fantasy of having more control over your tendencies than you actually do, sorry not sorry

will you indulge my fantasies?

Maybe, what are you fantasizing about?

[Isis]

You are town for not being aggressive, not sure how you got there.

Being demotivated in general decreases how far off null that gets you

[Isis]

I think it was admittedly unclear but I clarified later

[Isis]

Imagine if it had cursive font votato

and a narwhal gif

[Isis]

Learning the context that Ali is generally demotivated, like, already was before the game started, decreases how town-indicative it is that e is playing passively, although it is still town-indicative that e is playing passively.

That's a delta in the red direction so I said "scum indicative" but it's confusing.

[Isis]

Everyone else is town. Except Norwee who I am going to torture. And some people who are hard to figure out.

I don't think Clemency ever plays mafia in a readable way so it makes plenty of sense to advance to playing the 11p it kind of already will be.

[Isis]

good morning

good evening monkey

[Isis]

You're not necessarily wrong

Elements being scum is a high bar though, he gets lynched day 1 a lot

sometimes he even gets modkilled for not violating site rules, that's how fun scumteams think it is to kill him

[Isis]

Sometimes he fractures his scumrange and you can know he's town. Usually it won't happen. I will give him X days for that to happen and if it doesn't happen we kill him by default.

Contrast with Clemency which is just never going to spew in any direction ever.

[Isis]

Norwee is wrong, Looker is right. It's alignment indicative

I got real confused by what you’ve been saying on Alisae. Are you saying that my conclusion which is "Alisae can be aggressive as town." is wrong?

"It's equally likely Alisae will be aggressive as town as e will be as scum" is wrong.
Mafia is a probabilistic game, you can't find things that guarantee someone is scum, just things that make it more likely.

And the post before this one or whatever: it can be correct play to lynch you after Cycle Men, even if you have a higher likelihood of flipping red right now, if it's not possible Cycle Men will ever do anything to change my mind and there's some potential that you will.

[Isis]

@Isis: What snark? Can you show me where?

It's crazy how unpredictable they are. It's like you schedule this effort-intensive mafia game, and then a random exam comes out of nowhere.

This was sarcasm, which I'm not sure I've ever seen from you.

The rest of your post was edgier in general but that part was the most remarkable departure, to me.

[Isis]

I really object to the notion that Looker's playstyle doesn't meet the standard to be sortable. It's possibly more difficult to sort than some people's natural style but there's always enough there that you could sort it if you were smart enough. I think categorizing him with people who never care enough about winning their games to be sortable would be gross and I don't think you should ask people to adopt a totally different way of playing

obviously I am still catching up

[Isis]

You get one joke per game.

Scalia's signature sarcasm in every post, tho

[Isis]

I scumread him. Isis said he's unreadable

Your premises is incorrect. I read her commentary as saying that his playstyle in this game is indicative of being scum.

Deimos's characterization is closer to the truth. I could reason he's infinitesmaly (sp?) more likely to be scum off what he's posted, but mostly he's just unreadable. I've seen him be town with horrific isos, and read a game where he was lyncher and never provided enough that anyone had any chance of figuring that out.

Deimos doesn't seem to think it's optimal play to kill unreadable players first, but I think it is. Intuitively I feel like that's even truer in nightless but I can't math out a proof and maybe it's tied with nightful (of course, you often see people argue it becomes suboptimal in a closed setup with a high likelihood of providing a vig)

[Isis]

Does anyone have more context for how they expect ABR to play? I thought I heard he was like, good at mafia, but his participation here is bizarre at best.

I am wondering whether we should lynch him on an expectation he rolled scum with people he didn't want to cooperate with or something.

Obviously I don't have remarkably compelling reasons to want to lynch him, but he's not posting much you can work with any which way.

The last naked vote was on an UTR (by my casual tally), hard to view that as redeeming

[Isis]

lol I just realized nsg accepted my Cycle men alias.
That is sweet.

[Isis]

I now kind of want to stick with the policy lynch so as to help sort the person who was weirdly against the policy lynch

that is kind of how those things go

I mean it could go differently if Cycle men could actually play and alignment spew and stuff but he just wants a hamburger.

"ABR will play later" matches what I -thought- I've heard about ABR so I am find waiting to see if that will happen. I wasn't sure if I imagined that, so that's why I was asking. I'm a little *eyebrows* about being told that my mindset was bad when it was remarkably similar to my mindset about lynching cycle men which I don't remember getting criticized about the same way.
Pretty sure it was Firebringer, Firebringer, you're scum.

[Isis]

but he's cute!!!

[Isis]

this doesn't even sort monkey because monkey is town no matter what norwee is

[Isis]

you guys are lame
VOTE: Norwee

[Isis]

elements and norwee probably

>about to be lynched
>says elements and norwee are probably the scum
>keeps vote on Firebringer
>keeps vote on Firebringer even if there's an opportunity to build a wagon with people he doesn't scumread

prove you're trying and express your train of thought, so i don't change my mind and lynch you instead

does it help you out if the lyncher game featured a refusal to join the wagon on his lyncher target?


lel

[Isis]

this seems like similar behavior

i think he would do it as town too
he just does all the things
he is
cycle men

[Isis]

You can't sort someone who is already sorted, btw, monkey

[Isis]

VOTE: Cycle Men

[Isis]

why do i feel disappointed that monkey isn't scumreading me
have i been standing within six feet of firebringer too much?

[Isis]

If I didn't believe future sortability should ever be considered you'd be very dead Norwee :X

[Isis]

i agree with monkey the framing is acceptable, when you try to shoot the most skilled player in a playerlist next normal with me and they don't die cause I doc'ed them, you can be furious about that also

[Isis]

yet you stand strong on the stance that you

have

scumreads, yet you'd lynch a null

You are hosting a yard sale. You have a painting of a lake, a painting of the moon, and a painting of the sunset, they are all pretty old. A professional has appraised the painting of the lake and indicated it is worth 50$. He appraised the painting of the moon and indicated it is worth 5,000$. He has not seen the painting of the sunset yet, but you have an appointment for him to see it on Wednesday.
Only one person comes to your yard sale. She offers you 50$ for your painting of the lake. She isn't interested in buying the painting of the moon. She offers you 70$ for the painting of the sunset. You need 30$ between now and Friday to make rent this month.

You snap sell the painting of the sunset?

[Isis]

VOTE: Notwegian

nah i don't agree
i don't think norwee thinks im scum but also thinks im annoying at the same time
those are conflicting thought processes

You're saying you oppose a Norwee vote, but you're stating reasoning in the opposite direction? Most people consider cognitive dissonance scummy, aren't you describing cogdis from Norwee here?

[Isis]

ok so I'm thinking Ali, cycle, someone not currently active as the scum team.

Why Ali?

so vehemently against a cycle lyncch

How does that make her scum?

sees an opertunity to derail the cycle wagon and goes straight for it to save eir scum buddy
There's also the post I think still think is a slip. Frustrated ali is all like "if we were both scum we'd both be voting you nah nah ne nah nah" when in fact they are both voting me but e doesn't realise it

Isn't that kind of factual error more like, a townslip?

If I rolled scum with Cycle Men and he matched my vote I'd get hyper aware of the association with a slot with such high lynch equity

Is there a paradigm where you see it as a scumslip for scum!Ali town!Cycle maybe? I'm trying to follow

[Isis]

I'm still catching up

I prefer 4 post pagebumps to pagebottom votecounts FTR

I don't see why the pagecount matters, if it is getting too hard to traverse with the next page and previous page buttons try out the feature where you can type in any page number you want.

[Isis]

Aw that’s so nice Firebringer.
That’s 2 for the "Norwee is scum, but too snuggly to be lynched yet" tier.

i wonder if i would feel the same if you didn't have that anime avatar

It's probably the most win percentage skewed avatar on site

look at it

[Isis]

the thing that makes me so inclined towards human's lynch is that he still wants to lynch me on the argument that im in some way "unreadable" despite the fact that ive actively started playing and weighing in on the game, but doesnt feel the same type of incentive to push elements or firebringer

this tho
i'm getting kind of confused about how hme is interacting with new data and he's kind of wriggling his way out of me townreading him even though it's a heavy amount of work
I mean I do think people like gc are underestimating how players like cycle men can throw some really wild bottles of WIFOM in a way where they can still be somewhat tricky with moderate content
but like spicy Chinese fire drill lynches are more fun than policy lynching

[Isis]

VOTE: ali

see the axolotl gets it

[Isis]

I don't buy that he finds Ali, Me, and Isis scummy for building a NorwEE wagon, a person he scumreads, when he knows he's town. I don't believe he finds it scummy that I'm pressuring him to vote at 24 hours left in the day. If we're scum, we could have just mislynched him and it would have been easy. He would understand that. But what he did here? That's just not an organic progression.

Ok this is kinda good

[Isis]

Let's see what this flip teaches us

VOTE: Cycle Men

[Isis]

shush monkey!

not really as Cycle Men was a slot that was very easy to hammer there as scum. there was a universal apathy towards the slot, we were nearing our deadline, and everyone wanted.

plus, he's not really worried to be lynched at L-1 as town?
and he thought there was scum on his wagon, but he didn't react to it then the way he did when he "activated" just now?

Now I'm curious if you're defending him because you're TMI or because you're his buddy. Because there's no way you're not looking at this and being a little skeptical.

i am a little skeptical. im just more skeptical in other places. no one has talked me into joining this wagon yet. i really think there are better options. Also, you've now convinced yourself that im scum no matter how he flips? tell me: why would scum!votato do something to draw that much attention to himself when scum is served by apathy and apathy lynches? I think you've tunneled really hard at this point. can you take a step back and try to reevaluate what town!clemency and town!votato might be up to here?

this gives me crawley "i'm scum but that's not why vibes"

like
I feel like scum request their detractors do worldbuilding sometimes
because they know the 1 or 2 things about the world they've made actually strange and are a little bit proud about it.

[Isis]

Let's see what this flip teaches us

VOTE: Cycle Men

Are people calling me scum because I wanna hammer something to make sure we have a lynch?
Lmao alright sure whatever

It doesn't matter if we no lynch its nightless.

3rd no lynch is a loss
I'm explicitly never considering the draw thing an "option" for the record, I think you should play to wincon

would like to see the condition called a scumwin but draw is possibly better for describing a quasi-abandoned game if that somehow happened

at 33% ev there's some pretty gross strategies "playing for rating" like, lynch 2 people, if neither flips scum immediately hammer no lynch 3 times, etc etc

[Isis]

can we lynch votato, this is the second time he's tried to clumsily fake town paranoia

[Isis]

There's some data about towns lynching less accurately with longer deadlines and stuff so artificially following 1 game day per lynch has some merit from that angle

[Isis]

I'm not actually that happy about it, I don't have this game as figured out as I'd like

[Isis]

I'd probably bus Clemency if I rolled scum with him
it'd be nice to get mislynched for an accurate characterization of how I'd play scum, I get repeatedly annoyed about getting lynched and mislynched in games for allegations I'm protecting poorly positioned players and trying to sweep, even though I'm one of the bussiest player's I've ever met

[Isis]

I want to be clear. I'm not finding Looker, GC, Elements, and NorwEE as hard to sort. I am sorting them as likely scum. But I can be very wrong, and I think a flipped Cycle Men will help me be more right.

The only reason I didn't have Cycle Men as my primary lynch option earlier was the lack of counterwagon during that period. However, I can see merit in Deimos' push against him. But now I see that the paranoia around it is outweighed by the uncertainty Cycle Men will bring me later in the game.

So Cycle Men it is.

you can use the words policy lynch
you want to policy lynch me

There's a lot of posts I could quote


but I'm really really wondering whether the way Cycle Men treated monkey so differently from me for very similar reasons for voting him is a No Parity result between monkey and me

[Isis]

I'm 110% sure Firebringer is lying and he knew I was here and wanted to impress me, and he was successful

[Isis]

i mean he was probably also in a good mood but it's fun to call him lying scum

[Isis]

Isis, can I get a metaread on Elements and check if he's still playing to his town meta?

He's playing townier than his town meta and I'm confused. I mean maybe that's a bad thing because I felt like to some extent his scumwin featured him adhering to orthodox play people want to see. He's convincing me it's organic here, though.

I definitely can't say "he's playing to his town meta here", Ank explained me this really tricky way to townread him in fusion that I had to read like 4 times to understand, then it made sense to me and I was happy sheeping it all the way to postgame discussion, but my understanding of it was fleeting enough I don't remember it quite. But it definitely wasn't, like, "look at this relatively orthodox postflip solve"

Whatever you do, don't ask Elements to meta himself please, he might get modkilled, continue directing questions to me

[Isis]

GTFO with this vote

Eat this vote, scumbag.

Spoiler:

bro what are you doing

Am I the bro?

im not scum and i feel like if I was scum with Clemency here, he doesn't try to align himself with Norwee when Norwee thinks that I'm cordinating votes on him. That whole interaction just doesn't make sense.

pointing out of a plan to distance?

Are you accusing Alisae of drafting a distancing plan in the main topic?

VOTE: Firebringer

This vote-hopping atmosphere is kind of tricky. How effective would a bus be in a nightless?

Looker I think you might be town
Firebringer is town too I feel pretty sure about it

[Isis]

I too would like to hear from ABR. Figured I’d actually put him at L-1 and at least get some sort of reaction from someone. Like votato and sort of Norwegian.

Nope he's had long enough
VOTE:

[Isis]

sry I'm in a silly mood and want to mess with people

I don't need to lolhammer in nightless vanilla

sometimes I have to lolhammer people in closed setups to stop all the premature claiming killing my EV because my ears are bleeding and it just needs to stop

[Isis]

well that would be a slightly scum-indicative interpretation of my post ABR

[Isis]

I'm also curious why Firebringer and Isis bussed and not Alisae.

Isis isn’t a busser lol

I very very much would like to hear this post explained

[Isis]

Looker I think you might be town
Firebringer is town too I feel pretty sure about it

based on? could you explain?

Are you scumreading Firebringer and needing the reversal
are you actually trying to sort me?
The gamestate + your play is making you seem like scum enough so that it's hard for me to have the energy to go through and remember the townpings and explain them
if Looker is interested that's different

[Isis]

Votato is in too many games to play optimally and not giving his best imo. Could be scum or town.

my brain can't handle

[Isis]

This year I'm sending my mom and dad the normal Christmas card and the in-laws get a stationery printout of ABR's iso from this NSG's Open 778

[Isis]

don't worry you've made sure to play this whole game in such a manner that you're functionally a day 1 lynch.



more serious note I think that statistic comes from games with a nightphase and killing UTRs that partipated in a D1 scum lynch is a big deal

[Isis]

frustratingly I don't think you can be confident ABR flips scum here

I don't think anybody seems to disagree on that point.

[Isis]

Alisae can you stop acting scummy I was townreading some stuff you did this game

partitioning 4 person lists and saying they have 1 scum when that's like close to the base ratio of what's alive right now is not a very town thought process, it looks like setting up xanatos gambits

[Isis]

Green crayon i'm generally kind of slower at associations and VCA you are gonna have to give me the crumbs after you have chewed them up enough to spit out for the baby birds to digest

[Isis]

If lynching scum day 1 hurts your win percentage, and lynching a townread makes it harder to form an endgame townbloc, is lynching now-and-future unreadable people the best way to play day 1 in spite of widespread protests?

[Isis]

votato has more scum equity than ABR, I think, but I think it's kinda natural to want to the murder the one who is doing less to play the game.

[Isis]

I feel pretty good about that group in the aggregate

[Isis]

captain furret
more like
captain hammer

[Isis]

I don’t see votato and ABR on the same scum team. Didn’t before per Elements wagon analysis. Don’t now because of votato’s (either genuine or virtue signaling) outcry over the fake hammer on ABR.

yeah i think theres 2 scum in that group along with FB.

This would be my chiefest concern with the decision to hammer

[Isis]

votato do you think abr will flip scum

[Isis]

firebringer have you been running

we need to start a kind of communication channel where you are open and accountable about the "running" habit you've developed because it is really affecting your mafia play

[Isis]

I feel like Ali would like drawing with crayons but that might be a bad guess.

I think e would be good at it

[Isis]

VOTE: Norwee
I'M GOLDEN ROBSTER NOW

[Isis]

I would have tried to get a bit more out of the day phase but I'm not adamant about it

no need to be adversarial

[Isis]

VOTE: Norwee
I'M GOLDEN ROBSTER NOW

Norwe is town.

Oh how I'd love to believe

[Isis]

I'm kind of lowkey townreading elements

lowkey might be the only appropriate way to be townreading elements in any game maybe

[Isis]

VOTE: oka/gamma

..

Make it so, ensign.

Your wish is my command!
VOTE: Oka/Gamma

<absolutely nothing>

VOTE: fb/shiro

next wagon pls

Golden Robster the most majestic of beasts

[Isis]

VOTE: ABR

[Isis]

everyone's heard the joke about the hunters who called 911 right

[Isis]

I actually I thought I was offwagon

[Isis]

I release you, don't VC

[Isis]

wait so I was offwagon? then why doesn't Norwee understand me

maybe they don't tell that joke in Norway because they don't have a disgusting gun culture?

[Isis]

Green Crayons you live in Virginia can you tell the joke I don't want to tell it

it's so distasteful

[Isis]

Looker has posted a mean of three times per day, I don't think he's "inactive" because some users are hyperposting
also green crayons i have never asked you for anything else my whole life I thought we were friends

[Isis]

GC is unlikely scum with Alisae, unless he faked that there, which he might be able to manage, or unless the team is GC/Alisae/Cycle/ABR exactly.

In related news, GC should play more games with Alisae to the point where he mixes em up less in general just because e's one of the funnest players onsite.

[Isis]

That would strength Firebringer's "at most one amongst" plan

[Isis]

Ali is really good at scum, average or above average at town, not sure, I've played with em a couple times but e's died quickly (to NK one of the times which may say something)
But Ali is definitely fun
Firebringer will you tell the awful joke for me

[Isis]

Looker has posted a mean of three times per day, I don't think he's "inactive" because some users are hyperposting

Well he said something about not being able to post often and he *could* be exaggerating his unavailability because of alignment but that’s a road I’m not keen on going down because then we get into a question about how truthful he’s being about IRL activities.

So I don’t know.

This is only slightly less than his activity level in Menalque's Favorite Places and Purgatory, and his activity level was pretty similar between those games even thought they'd be a parity cop guilty. So I'd be inclined to interpret it as trying to grant good faith fair warning that he might not be able to show up a ton, then it not being so bad after all.

[Isis]

A Looker lynch seems the least predicated on town!ABR's apparently flawed understanding of the cycle men wagon so it'd probably be the one I'd sheep if I was obligated to pick one, but I don't hold ABR in that kind of esteem

Oh, Isis, you’re saying lookers activity level is not AI? Thought you were saying the opposite.

I'm an 08er when you are so comfortable with mafia u post 3 times per day it's time to go to newB Q and /IC

[Isis]

reread my post, quotations marks are meant to cast doubt on whether someone who is miles away from their prod timers should be called inactive, not, cast doubt on the motivations of the person exhibiting whatever activity level they are exhibiting.

[Isis]

there's a part of me that wants to ask looker if he can spew himself town and shift this really far towards autowin, then a part of me that thinks he would never want to comply, he kind of plays by trying to influence the actions of others rather than try to spew I think

[Isis]

northsidegal 78


looks like northsidegal in moderator form outposts me in SK form

[Isis]

Firebringer what sizes were these games? Wouldn't the percentile the top 5 posters represented be more important than the number five?

and what's the probability a random 5 posts has <2 scum to compare? I could figure it out if you could confirm, like, you were always looking at 10:3's. An 8:4 is already going to be pretty different and this is a little sketchy

And I assume you cut off tracking at the end of day 1?

[Isis]

what's your solve votato

[Isis]

Should be straight up 33% more scum in the top 5 from the getgo then, but, unlikely to be 3.

I'll try to remember how to do combinations and permutations to figure the default chance

[Isis]

The probability there is no more than 1 scum in a random selection of 5 players in a 10:3 mini:
1 - (3 choose 2)(10 choose 3)/(13 choose 5) - (3 choose 3)(10 choose 2)/(13 choose 5) = 98/143 = 68.53%

Not sure a 2% spike is a powerful and potent mandate Firebringer

[Isis]

I'm not sure I could lynch Looker over Norwee in good conscience.

[Isis]

why did you move me up your reads?

[Isis]

I'm trying to think of a worse way you could have responded

[Isis]

I haven't read everything
Awful lynch
Happy to lynch heavily from the wagon and be part of a town that deserves to.lose and does if that doesn't repeatedly hit scum

[Isis]

VOTE: Norwegian

this is the only post I read i'm drunk rn VOTE: Norwee blood for alibae

[Isis]

I'm so many pages behind.
UNVOTE:
I will read later tonight
I think I only stopped paying attention for like 24 hours or 36 but this game is explosive

[Isis]

i'm gonna solve this game

[Isis]

I think you’re probably town and I think we just need to lynch Monkey, Deimos, Votato, and Norwee.
I think that Cycle Men just doesn’t start a push on you and I think he buddied me when he was pushing you to make me look worse.
I think you are more town then those 4 so I am actually just appealing to you.

My heart wants this to be at least 2/4