Open 312 - Venomous Intentions [Game Over]

zMuffinMan · Post Post #6 (isolation #0) » Mon Jun 13, 2011 6:36 pm

VOTE: andrew94

obv scum

zMuffinMan · Post Post #17 (isolation #1) » Tue Jun 14, 2011 6:24 am

Well, this RVS went nowhere fast.

So, can you guys vote for andrew and we quicklynch him page 2? He's scum, so it's all cool.

zMuffinMan · Post Post #20 (isolation #2) » Tue Jun 14, 2011 7:34 am

I really wouldn't mind seeing a quicklynch on andrew actually happen. It would be hilarious. More so if he actually flipped scum.

So, who thinks scum chose roleblocker/doctor?

zMuffinMan · Post Post #22 (isolation #3) » Tue Jun 14, 2011 7:49 am

Are you saying no because you don't want to see a quicklynch in general?

I think you need to weigh up the pros and cons of getting rid of andrew (as quickly as possible) before you just say no like that...

zMuffinMan · Post Post #40 (isolation #4) » Tue Jun 14, 2011 2:39 pm

DK is a bigger VI, but what's your point? DK isn't in this game, and DK's posts are hilarious to read. If he were in this game, I'd grab some popcorn, sit back, and read him in ISO all day long. But he isn't, so it's irrelevant.

andrew is a good lynch just because... and he's scum. Two very good reasons right there.

zMuffinMan · Post Post #42 (isolation #5) » Tue Jun 14, 2011 4:04 pm

I didn't call andrew likely town, he's scum. His lynch is for the best.

What's wrong with set-up speculation?

zMuffinMan · Post Post #46 (isolation #6) » Tue Jun 14, 2011 5:56 pm

Setup speculation is probably never going to help find scum in this sort of open setup. I was interested in what people think the setup is. You don't have to answer it, but I wouldn't say it's pointless.

zMuffinMan · Post Post #50 (isolation #7) » Tue Jun 14, 2011 7:01 pm

bs wrote:Reading that quote it looks to me like you don't think he's scum there. Which means the previous posts, and the following posts, where you call him scum and obv scum are highly scummy themselves.

So because I acknowledge the possibility that andrew won't flip scum, I'm scummy? Or am I reading this wrong?

bs wrote:Why ask about those two roles specifically.

Because that's what I think the setup most likely is and I want to know who agrees with my theory. Like Eijolend has said, it's a metric fkton better than everyone RVing and then doing nothing.

zMuffinMan · Post Post #73 (isolation #8) » Thu Jun 16, 2011 4:22 am

I'm in a state of unconscious consciousness right now and not really able to think so er... Responding to just this for now and will catch up on the rest tomorrow.

someone wrote:Muffin, I asked you before, and i'll ask you again. Other than just for the lols, what reasoning do you have for voting Andrew? He has two posts, which didn't give anything other than a joke vote and complaining about someone linking his game. Wow, yeah, i totally see the content from which you got your tell. Please explain where you're getting this tell from.

He's a good PL? Gut? Do I really need a reason for a random vote?

zMuffinMan · Post Post #82 (isolation #9) » Thu Jun 16, 2011 3:13 pm

bs wrote:You didn't acknowledge that he might not flip scum zMuffinMan, you phrased it as Andrew flipping scum would be unexpected, which doesn't jive with calling him scum so often.

The word "actually" doesn't imply likelihood at all.

Do you have any suspects outside of me yet? Or do you have any intention of looking for scum outside me? Even if I were scum, I'd have two partners for you to find. Surely your time could be better spent doing something to actively find them than tunneling me for voting andrew.

xofelf wrote:
jilynne1991 wrote:I have a question. If someone seems too town-aligned, is it possible they're scum?

Yeah actually. Scum's goal is to fool the town into thinking that they're town too so they can win the game. Some people are better at it than others.

To answer this question properly, yes, but it's not a good reason to suspect them.

tox wrote:Scum: Attempts to start bandwagon,
hopes it sticks
.

Explain this part better, please.

xofelf wrote:So it is still a random vote? Yet you're defending it like it was a real vote. Mmkay.

It is a real vote. I take policy lynching andrew seriously. But you asking where I got a "tell" on him from is taking it a little overboard. Like, I am arrogant enough to think I could do this, but sadly in this game I wasn't able to pick up tells before anyone had even posted, so my initial vote truly wasn't based on scum tells andrew had given off.

zMuffinMan · Post Post #85 (isolation #10) » Thu Jun 16, 2011 6:44 pm

tox wrote:it's a lot of trouble to come up with false accusations against one innocent player (per lynch!) that are believable.

No, it isn't.

tox wrote:So, if you're scum, you obviously want your bandwagon to stick so that you don't have to start all over again.

Yes, but what gave you an indication that shotty wants the wagon on andrew to stick?

zMuffinMan · Post Post #88 (isolation #11) » Thu Jun 16, 2011 8:54 pm

tox wrote:No, not if a town-aligned player makes a mistake that can be exploited by scum, which I'm not going to say never happens (far from it). But if it were that easy for scum to frame townies, then scum would never be lynched outside of bussing each other.

By the same logic, if it were that hard to make a case that shouldn't really exist, then scum would never win.

But this is a pointless line of discussion so I'm dropping it now.

tox wrote:What gave you the indication that I am voting shotty for wanting the wagon on andrew94 to stick?

....

I didn't say you were voting shotty for that reason. I was talking specifically about #78, where you were saying that shotty-scum attempted to start a bandwagon on andrew, and was hoping that it stuck. And your reasoning for this is that shotty is lazy scum who doesn't want to make a case against anyone else. The issue I have with this is that I don't see shotty-scum legitimately being able to force a lynch on andrew with his RVS vote, so it's a false accusation.

Or am I wrong about what you were implying in #78?

--

@BS,

No, it doesn't. The whole paragraph, in context, is talking about how funny it would be to see andrew quick-lynched and actually flip scum. The fact you're pressing so hard on this and still ignoring the rest of the game is weird. Nothing else to add? No other suspicions? No comments on anything else that's happened?

zMuffinMan · Post Post #93 (isolation #12) » Fri Jun 17, 2011 6:16 am

bs wrote:zMuffin iso:
0: "obv scum"
1: "He's scum"
4: "and he's scum"
5: "he's scum"

Are you getting my point here.

I'm not quite getting your point here.

Are you suggesting that the sky is blue or custard is better than icecream?

I'm totally lost on this one. Sorry.

bs wrote:You said little but that Andrew is scum

Oh, this is what you meant. Now I getcha!

bs wrote:in the middle of all that you make a statement that implies that you don't think that Andrew is scum.

No, I didn't. I made a statement that it would be hilarious if he were quicklynched and he really is scum. This doesn't tell you anything about how likely I think it is.

bs wrote:Nope, you've gone way beyond where you could claim that it was still a random vote, you've backtracked your reasoning, and shown yourself that your stated reason is not what you believe.

Do you really believe I think andrew is scum? And that I thought he was scum prior to anyone in this game posting?

bs wrote:Your only defense is deflection ("Stop tunneling on me and look for scum") and mis-representation (quoting out of context)

The "deflection" wasn't a defense, it was a suggestion. Perhaps your time would be better spent actually scum hunting because tunneling me for this whole andrew-is-scum issue isn't going to work out well for you.

Not sure where I misrepresented you, and I think this is ironic, considering you're telling me that the word "actually" implies likelihood - it doesn't.

--

eijo wrote:Baby Spice, actually you seem a bit overeager to find something scummy out of opening posts and jumping on little wording issues.

^

--

Toro wrote:Right. At this point in time I'm thinking that zMuffinMan and shotty might've been starting this as bait to see if anyone would try to bite and start a legitimate case on them, which taipan did.

Not so much "bait" as a point of discussion to start the game, although it might have doubled as bait.

zMuffinMan · Post Post #108 (isolation #13) » Fri Jun 17, 2011 9:38 pm

tox, why are you asking andrew for good reasons to keep him around?

Like... What possible answer could he give you here that you would think is a good, valid answer? Does "I'm town" suffice?

zMuffinMan · Post Post #110 (isolation #14) » Fri Jun 17, 2011 9:56 pm

....

What big deal?

I want to know why you asked: "Can you give us any good reasons to keep you around?"

What answer were you actually expecting him to give here, and why was it important for you? Why did you need to get a feel for him as opposed to anyone else?

zMuffinMan · Post Post #115 (isolation #15) » Sat Jun 18, 2011 9:21 pm

unvote

VOTE: xofelf

zMuffinMan · Post Post #124 (isolation #16) » Sun Jun 19, 2011 8:58 am

@xofelf,

Because I think you're scum.

zMuffinMan · Post Post #130 (isolation #17) » Sun Jun 19, 2011 1:15 pm

I'm not reaction fishing. I don't know about andrew's intentions, but I actually do think xofelf is scum. His posts so far have been overly-cautious, not trying to step on any toes while not trying to actually hunt scum in any way. Doesn't sit well with me. Call it gut.

zMuffinMan · Post Post #131 (isolation #18) » Sun Jun 19, 2011 1:16 pm

@Vifam, do you actually think your vote on Jakesh is pressuring him in any way, especially now that you've told him why you're voting for him?

zMuffinMan · Post Post #134 (isolation #19) » Sun Jun 19, 2011 3:52 pm

I don't expect you to prove that you're not. I expect you to lay down and die like good scum.

zMuffinMan · Post Post #146 (isolation #20) » Tue Jun 21, 2011 7:39 am

Hey, xofelf, if you vote for BabySpice I'll believe you're town. Do it.

Unvote

VOTE: BabySpice

zMuffinMan · Post Post #156 (isolation #21) » Tue Jun 21, 2011 7:11 pm

BabySpice is scum for overreacting to the whole andrew=scum thing and faux scum hunting while lurking her way into oblivion and avoiding any other discussion. And this one I'm more confident about. xofel, you can be town, if and only if you vote for BabySpice. Come on, it's a good deal.

zMuffinMan · Post Post #158 (isolation #22) » Tue Jun 21, 2011 9:59 pm

bs wrote:Muffin, can you be any scummier?

I think I could.

bs wrote:You are striving like crazy to fake up a rubbish case on anyone you can and I'm tired of it

Like what?

bs wrote:whilst trying to cover your own scumslips with jibber

What scum slips? What jibber?

bs wrote:I stopped paying attention to the game because you offered nothing but the same rubbishy reasonless stuff that is in pretty much everyone of your posts.

I feel special. I'm the reason you're lurking? I'm that important that nothing else in the game matters to you?

zMuffinMan · Post Post #189 (isolation #23) » Wed Jun 22, 2011 9:48 pm

bs wrote:1, I doubt it.
2, Your case on Andrew, your case on xofelf, your case on me.
3. Well, I've listed them and quoted them. but if you want to try this rubbishey deflection some more then go right ahead.
4. More misrep. (I believe I pointed out your earlier misreps already) Someone who is lurking is reading the thread and not posting, which is not what I said I was doing at all.

Delfection and misrep. Scum tactics that come right after push the easy mislynch.

1 redux. What do you know, you did.

1. I could if I wanted to. I'm pretty good at it.
2. There... was no case on andrew... Could you quote it, please? My "case" on xofelf was a reason for putting my vote on her - hardly a case. My "case" on you is virtually the same as my "case" on xofelf - I think you're scum, and your actions don't suggest otherwise. It's by no means a case, though.
3. Fun fact: the more you say I'm using "rubbishey deflection", the more true it is. No, not really. But do go ahead and show me these "scum slips" you've found. Surely it'll help your case on me along, so I don't see a pro-town reason not to.
4. Wait, are you saying this is a misrepresentation because you're not reading the thread, and so therefore you can't be a lurker? Well, you showed me. You're not a lurker for not reading the thread, you're scum.

--

Vifam wrote:Why didn't you point any of this out when Baby was already pushing on you?

I haven't really been paying attention to the game. I've been lazy.

Vifam wrote:Why did you ignore that and scrounge around looking for a good lynch for the last two pages when there was one in front of you the whole time?

Are you suggesting there's some sort of scum motivation here? If so, what?

Vifam wrote:Hey Muffin, can I get a list of who you think is scum?

BabySpice and her two cohorts.

Vifam wrote:Mafia would ask "Hey who do you think is town"

Elaborate on this.

Vifam wrote:Scum are Muffin and dr.

Whoops. Looks like Vifam is onto us, shotty. Me, you and our hydra as the third scum. Bonus points to anyone who guesses the name of our hydra (begins with an a and ends with a 4).

--

xofelf wrote:Also, it feels almost as if andrew is being bussed by his scumbuddies, Shotty and Muffin.

Face-palmed so hard at this statement for so many reasons. Thanks to you, I have a big red mark on my head. Want to explain how this makes any sense?

--

eijo wrote:And what the heck is this "you are town if you agree with me"-thing about? It's not funny and not helpful!

It's a little funny.

What do you think it was about?

zMuffinMan · Post Post #192 (isolation #24) » Thu Jun 23, 2011 3:51 am

Vifam wrote:Probably trying to kick start some kind of BW. Since you've had some fail attempts before here, finding one would some decent logic grounded on it makes sense.

No, I mean, what's the scum motivation in me suddenly attacking BS now as opposed to earlier.

You were pointing out that I was going after others (well... xofelf and that's it, since I never really went after andrew) before going after BS. I was wondering if you saw some sort of scum motivation here.

I'm not sure what you actually mean "finding one with some decent logic grounded in it". Are you saying the logic behind my bs vote is sound? Do you agree with it? What about the logic behind my xofelf wasn't sound?

Vifam wrote:Who do you think is most likely to be scum with her and why?

I don't know. Do you?

On that note, why do you think shotty and I are scum together, and who is the third scum?

Vifam wrote:Besides, townreads are useless if the people you think are town are not getting lynched, so there is really no point in outing them anyway. In my opinion.

No, town reads are still reads. "Outing" your town reads gives others just as much information as "outing" your scum reads. I'd argue the logic behind your town reads is far more important than the logic behind your scum reads, and giving town reads and reasons for those reads is far more valuable in discerning alignment than someone just giving their scum reads. It also gives an excuse for scum to tunnel without having to commit to calling anyone town. And it's much harder for scum to look genuine when giving town reads.

zMuffinMan · Post Post #195 (isolation #25) » Thu Jun 23, 2011 4:41 am

Vifam wrote:You yourself said you were not paying attention to the game, right? So as scum you wouldn't be paying attention to attacking BS up until now.

It

sounded like

you were saying I was scummy for not attacking babyspice earlier. It

sounded like

you were suggesting there was some sort of scum motivation behind me attacking xofelf before going after babyspice.

So what I want to know is whether you think there was some sort of scum motivation behind me going after xofelf before babyspice. Like, the logic behind me-scum thinking it was a good idea to attack xofelf, then back off and attack babyspice instead. You can suggest that I was trying to start bandwagons all you want (and I was, in a way, so that's partially true), but why would I, as scum, go through the effort of attacking xofelf before babyspice? What do you think I stood to gain there? Why do you think I didn't just outright go for babyspice?

Vifam wrote:Both you and dr have been acting scummy, I can't get a team dynamic from both of you, since I don't think you two could be busing Andrew but you've both been acting scummy enough on your own.

Could you explain properly what I've done that is scummy and why it's scummy. All I've really seen is you saying "well, you tried to start bandwagons" - and? Is that scummy, now?

While you're at it, explain your scum read on shotty.

zMuffinMan · Post Post #201 (isolation #26) » Thu Jun 23, 2011 10:31 pm

You are pretty, andrew. Never let anyone tell you otherwise.

zMuffinMan · Post Post #205 (isolation #27) » Sat Jun 25, 2011 6:33 am

So, yeah. Baby Spice is still scum, why don't people see this? I can understand Vifam completely ignoring this since he's chainsawing me, but the rest of the game is being lazy. Help me kill baby spice, please. The rope is heavy and I need some help getting it around her neck.

zMuffinMan · Post Post #210 (isolation #28) » Sun Jun 26, 2011 3:06 am

My lack of content is because I'm lazy. Also, the flow of this game is being ruined by inactivity, which is kind of a buzz kill, and there's not much content from anyone else to really bounce my own ideas around. Town is lurking, and scum is taking advantage of this to lurk just as hard. It's annoying.

Baby Spice is still the best lynch for today.

zMuffinMan · Post Post #213 (isolation #29) » Sun Jun 26, 2011 7:24 am

Still waiting on this response to me you promised in #199. Considering how long it's taken you to write, I expect a 2000-word essay of epic proportions. If not, you are scum. Get to it, Vifam.

zMuffinMan · Post Post #218 (isolation #30) » Mon Jun 27, 2011 1:28 am

Oh, cool, I accidentally stumbled into a lurkers anonymous meeting. So the first step to overcoming your problem is admitting you have a problem. OK, taken care of that. Now for steps two through to twelve. Content, people, not apologies.

zMuffinMan · Post Post #228 (isolation #31) » Mon Jun 27, 2011 1:49 pm

Just realised there's 22 hours until the deadline. hmm

@eijo,

his posting style would fit the scum attempting to cause chaos

...

You mean because I'm actually posting? Or are you taking baby spice's argument about me wanting andrew lynched seriously? Because that's the only argument she actually has going for her, and it's not even a good argument. The rest of her posts have been "OMG YOU'RE DEFLECTING", "OMG I'M NOT LURKING, I'M JUST NOT READING THE THREAD ALTOGETHER". Yeah, this is the person that thinks I'm scummy. Think long and hard about that.

@vifam,

vifam wrote:-Suggest a quick lynch
-Argue that is a good lynch
-Drop that, lead on Xoelf
-Drop THAT, lead on BabySpice

When you were doing all of that, I assumed you were reaction testing, but you've said so far that every vote you've had has "reasoning" behind it. As you can see, no one besides BabySpice was going after you until you admitted that your votes were not tests. You made everything seem like a reaction test up until now. You've yet to be completely upfront about an FOS that didn't involve BabySpice. There is only one reason to go "Hey this fos is just gut" and then go "Okay this time I'm serious", you're trying to seem active and at the same time confuse town about your real thoughts. Your thought process seems to leap from thought to thought and refusing to give us any real detail.

So... I'm scummy because I suggested quicklynching andrew early... and because I changed my mind on xofelf?

I've given reasons on my baby spice suspicion, you've completely ignored commenting on it. And this game has just allowed people to lurk and go unpressured, which is just bad.

What FoSes do you even have, Vifam? You have me, and I know I'm not scum, and you have shotty, and if shotty is scum, you hit the jackpot there, because it wouldn't be based on scummy play, it'd be based on you being lucky enough that he's actually scum and your flawed reasons for thinking this are coincidentally correct.

zMuffinMan · Post Post #231 (isolation #32) » Mon Jun 27, 2011 11:01 pm

I'm not all too distraught about being lynched in this game. There's 3 people (baby spice, jilynne and lobster) who have posted less than the mod. Even the flaker, Jakesh, has posted more than them. It sucks the fun out of the game when people lurk like that.

There is at least one scum in that trio (I'd say baby spice).

One of eijolend and Vifam is scum (eijo probs).

As for the third scum, I'd guess andrew, just based on my other suspicions and their reactions to my early posts ("dat chainsaw", written by BS).

I'd rather not waste my time if this is just going t be a lurkfest on top of calling people scummy because they do things that make no sense for scum to do.

@eijo,

Oh yeah, that quote by baby spice was super solid.

Let's see... She caught me changing my mind about xofelf (that's really scummy, only scum change their minds). And... er... yep, that's it. That's all there was in that quote.

Or... what exactly did she quote that you agree with?

zMuffinMan · Post Post #234 (isolation #33) » Mon Jun 27, 2011 11:50 pm

@baby spice,

....

Do you not see how ironic it is that you say that?

@eijo

eijo wrote:But the thing is, you didn't add anything new to this case, besides "why don't people see this?"

Oh yeah, sorry, my bad. What with her being the shining paragon of content I should have picked up on some other stuff.

Maybe if I add a

emoticon, it'll better explain my case. Yeah?

She's lurking, she's tunneled me all D1 for ridiculous reasons while accusing me of "misrepresenting" her. She's scum, and you're ignoring this for some reason.

eijo wrote:I know this altogether doesn't make this a really strong case

Oh, hey, something we agree on.

eijo wrote:Alternative lynchs I would agree on are the flaker I have absolutely no read on - that would be jakesh - or lobstermania who has produced a great total of 4 lines of discussion. And hell, we just really SHOULD lynch someone.

I have a better idea. Lynch BS. How's that sound?

zMuffinMan · Post Post #235 (isolation #34) » Tue Jun 28, 2011 12:06 am

So, er, I'll stop being lazy if it'll get people to actually kill Baby Spice with me.

Her ISO#1, she votes me. I never really had an issue with this, I knew I was coming across as scummy early, it's a strategy I employ to gauge reactions sometimes. The issue I have with baby spice is that she's done... absolutely nothing but tunnel me.

Yeah, no jokes. She hasn't even once looked for scum outside of me, even when I suggested it might be a good idea for her to start doing it. Instead, she calls me wanting her to participate in the game more "deflection" - because that makes a whole lot of sense. Who's misrepresenting who?

Go through her ISO and try to find one time, just one single time after her ISO#1, where she responds to or comments on anything else in the game.

She's been lurking all game (although, apparently I was misrepresenting her because she hadn't read the game at all - sorry about that) and hasn't done anything to actively move the game forward in any way.

How can you call this town behaviour? How can you be so blind that you can't see her as scum?

Instead, you actually think there's some sort of case on me. What case? That I voted for xofelf, then changed my mind and voted for baby spice? That's it. That's the whole case on me, summed up nicely in one little sentence: I voted for xofelf, then I changed my mind and voted for baby spice. Apparently the level of scumminess behind this eclipses the lurk-and-tunnel-and-don't-even-try-to-contribute-in-any-way scumminess of baby spice.

zMuffinMan · Post Post #236 (isolation #35) » Tue Jun 28, 2011 4:00 am

Woo, so 8 hours from now, I'm probably going to be asleep. Which means I get to miss the lynch (or lack thereof, depending on activity).

Reminder... If you want me lynched, 4 new people need to vote for me in the next 8 hours. And if you want Baby Spice lynched 5 new people need to vote for her in the next 8 hours. Considering no other wagon has more than 1 vote, these are the two most likely lynches. Which kind of sucks. I should have been paying more attention to the deadline, I didn't even realise it was this close until someone brought it up a page ago.

Still loving the activity.

Fun game.

zMuffinMan · Post Post #238 (isolation #36) » Tue Jun 28, 2011 4:31 am

tox wrote:Why would scum ever voluntarily ask for an extension on the deadline? Don't they normally want the Day to end as soon as possible?

If that is enough to merit town points, then it's a good scum strategy, right?

That's a null tell, if anything. I think Eijo is more likely to be scum because of fence sitting at the deadline.

zMuffinMan · Post Post #242 (isolation #37) » Tue Jun 28, 2011 1:06 pm

So, tox, you don't have any sort of scum read on babyspice or I, and you don't see anything in #235 that makes you even consider the possibility that she's scum? That's just standard town play to you?

zMuffinMan · Post Post #247 (isolation #38) » Wed Jun 29, 2011 6:17 am

Wait, what are your scum reads, tox? Or do you have any? I sort of haven't been paying much attention to you lately, and all I've seen is you arguing with andrew.

zMuffinMan · Post Post #249 (isolation #39) » Wed Jun 29, 2011 6:32 am

Oh, missed that question.

I think flakers should just be replaced. I'm more confident I can read someone that actually posts content and I'd rather not lynch someone just because they flaked.

zMuffinMan · Post Post #251 (isolation #40) » Wed Jun 29, 2011 7:18 am

It's not about re-reading their posts knowing they are town. It's about re-reading others posts, knowing they are town. You lynch because it gives you information. And you get to look at who said what about the person who was lynched.

zMuffinMan · Post Post #261 (isolation #41) » Wed Jun 29, 2011 11:33 pm

@Baby,

So this is what you posted:

bs wrote:Gods Muffin, do you ever stop with the misrepresentation?

The denigration of others posts with, well with no support.

And I called it ironic.

Because your posts this game have all been 'denigrating' my posts with, well with no support, not stopping to consider any 'misrepresentations'...

And now you come out with another post designed to sling mud in my direction without actually contributing anything useful to the game (e.g. answering questions, looking for scum outside of me).

I don't know whether to laugh or not.

zMuffinMan · Post Post #270 (isolation #42) » Fri Jul 01, 2011 6:11 am

It would also be nice for like... the half of the people in the game that are prod-dodging to actually post something useful. Updated reads or comments on anything or just plain posting would be nice.

zMuffinMan · Post Post #272 (isolation #43) » Fri Jul 01, 2011 1:08 pm

No.

You have a point about xofelf's #240, it was a rather pointless question that

could

have been designed to look town if xofelf is scum, but she's not earning any town points for it, so.....

Her ISO#8 was terrible, but not really scummy. Just lazy/bad (as either alignment).

What do you think of baby spice, andrew?

zMuffinMan · Post Post #276 (isolation #44) » Sat Jul 02, 2011 4:53 am

I guess people are gone for the holiday weekend. Or taking advantage of it so they don't have to post. Either way, this game is really depressing.

zMuffinMan · Post Post #285 (isolation #45) » Sun Jul 03, 2011 10:22 am

That was suspicious? Really? That's the reason you've been tunneling me all game?

Unvote

You're really, really lost. The only one of your suspects I'd actually agree could be scum is andrew.

VOTE: jilynne

zMuffinMan · Post Post #289 (isolation #46) » Sun Jul 03, 2011 1:48 pm

Stop tunneling me and consider for a moment that you could be wrong (I know this is a real stretch considering how good your case is on me, derp). You're playing shockingly bad.

There's nothing suspect about me agreeing andrew could be scum and then voting jilynne. The only reason I agree andrew could be scum is because he's been avoiding your wagon like the plague while posting mostly irrelevant crap about xofelf. But, I'd rather lynch scum on your wagon than start making guesses about who the scum is off the wagon.

At this point I'd say jilynne is scum on your wagon. Early vote on you that she kept all game for poor reasons while making comments here and there that really just look like scum coasting. I also think one of {eijo, tox, shotty, xofelf} is likely scum. But I have either null reads or slight town reads on them, so I'm going after jilynne.

zMuffinMan · Post Post #291 (isolation #47) » Sun Jul 03, 2011 3:41 pm

Thanks for helping the game along, Vifam. Appreciate the input.

zMuffinMan · Post Post #294 (isolation #48) » Sun Jul 03, 2011 6:50 pm

Wait, are jakesh and Toro still in this game or have they been replaced? Because neither have posted in 2 weeks and I never saw them replaced. And lobster and jil haven't posted in 4.5 days.

And we're back down to 1.5 days to the deadline. Cool.

It'd be cool if the people who aren't inactive would actually put a vote down. Or at least say who they're thinking of voting and why. Or do anything. Talk about your favourite type of cake or how long you can hold your breath under water. I don't really care at this point. It's just sad how little people are posting and it's giving scum the opportunity to follow suit.

zMuffinMan · Post Post #296 (isolation #49) » Sun Jul 03, 2011 8:54 pm

#284 isn't content. But at least this is the first time she's mentioned anyone other than myself so that's a step in the right direction, I guess. meh. That was kind of funny by xofelf, though.

andrew wrote:and fyi: roleblocker+ doctor is the most crap combo. since cop+doc is deadly etc/

No shit, sherlock.

zMuffinMan · Post Post #300 (isolation #50) » Mon Jul 04, 2011 1:54 am

If we don't have enough players, then we don't have enough players. Not really much we can do if over half the game is inactive.

Personally I'd rather lynch jilynne over the other lurkers. Although at this point I'm not too concerned if we don't even lynch. There's so little information to go on, I don't think lynching is all too important. Like really, if we lynch lobster and lobster flips town, what then? It's not like there's any solid way to do VCA.

zMuffinMan · Post Post #303 (isolation #51) » Mon Jul 04, 2011 2:33 pm

So like. Is this a lynch just for the sake of lynching? Any thoughts on what I said in #300?

zMuffinMan · Post Post #305 (isolation #52) » Mon Jul 04, 2011 3:21 pm

Probably.

But I'm considering all aspects here.

There's a chance lobster really is scum, and a lobster lynch is full of cookies and chocolate milk.

There's also a chance lobster is a mislynch and we learn virtually nothing because it was a last-minute scramble against time and people are just voting for the sake of a lynch.

Now, a no lynch today also makes this a odd-numbered game if scum do NK (8:3 ratio) which I personally prefer over a 9:3 ratio anyway. And we're not risking lynching a PR who couldn't claim.

All this said, I just read through Lobster in ISO, and there's little to no content, so I'm not opposed to a lobster lynch. Then again, I could ISO a majority of the players in this game and say the same thing.

zMuffinMan · Post Post #307 (isolation #53) » Mon Jul 04, 2011 9:26 pm

Are you trolling? You need 7 for a lynch, shotty. Even if you want to lynch me, you'd need 5 more players to be active in the next 6 hours to agree. If you really wanted to avoid a no lynch you'd be voting for lobster.

zMuffinMan · Post Post #309 (isolation #54) » Tue Jul 05, 2011 12:55 am

VOTE: lobster

zMuffinMan · Post Post #313 (isolation #55) » Tue Jul 05, 2011 1:23 pm

Bit late, shotty, considering the deadline expired a few hours before that post.

Not that it matters, there aren't even 7 active players to get a lynch to occur.

And now we enter the twilight of the no lynch.

zMuffinMan · Post Post #315 (isolation #56) » Wed Jul 06, 2011 1:51 am

We could play the counting game.

I'll start.

1

zMuffinMan · Post Post #324 (isolation #57) » Sun Jul 10, 2011 12:01 pm

ftr, we wouldn't have even had enough players around to lynch shotty.

zMuffinMan · Post Post #327 (isolation #58) » Sun Jul 10, 2011 3:21 pm

Well, we couldn't lynch anyone at that point Llama. There were like 8 active players. Babyspice wasn't voting for anyone but me, so unless it was a lynch on me, there was no other way to get 7 votes unless someone self-voted.

VOTE: jilynne

zMuffinMan · Post Post #329 (isolation #59) » Sun Jul 10, 2011 3:40 pm

Ya.... and?

I personally wanted jil lynched at the end of yesterday, but nobody else wanted to hop on the wagon.

zMuffinMan · Post Post #334 (isolation #60) » Mon Jul 11, 2011 3:35 am

#330 is like a much more eloquent version of the case I was trying to get across yesterday. I like it.

zMuffinMan · Post Post #340 (isolation #61) » Mon Jul 11, 2011 7:54 pm

For the record, jil was also here, but not here, at the end of D1.

As for why I haven't made a case on anyone else, it's because you made the case on the person I was most suspicious of yesterday.

FTR, I think there were 2 scum on the BS wagon. 1 I think is jil, the other I'm not too sure about. As for why I think it had 2 scum on it, gut.

My thoughts on Vifam? null->scum. I didn't like his weak push on me at some point yesterday, and his reasons were suspect. I said it yesterday; I think one of eijo and Vifam is likely scum. The fact that he avoided the BS wagon like the plague was awkward and the fact he's been sort of coasting along without actually doing much is also awkward. He's not my top suspect, though.

zMuffinMan · Post Post #357 (isolation #62) » Wed Jul 13, 2011 2:14 pm

xofelf wrote:I realize that the consensus has been made to put pressure on jil but has anyone else noticed just how bad andrew posts? At most i saw 6 lines in a post. He'll say something once and then someone will ask him about it, and he says the same thing again and it doesn't clarify anything regardless of which time he said it.

No one who tried to derail my policy lynch gets a say in when andrew gets lynched. Sorry, but you had your opportunity and you called me scummy for wanting andrew lynched. The window of opportunity for an andrew lynch has closed. Get on jilynne now.

That is andrew's style. It's crap but that's what he does. I actually think he puts a little more effort in as scum, but meh.

zMuffinMan · Post Post #369 (isolation #63) » Sun Jul 17, 2011 3:38 pm

I'd rather you wait a while before announcing it.

Better for people to give reads and such beforehand.

There's probably at least one scum in the lurkers {jakesh97, lobstermania}

And it wouldn't surprise me if both of the other scum were on the lynch yesterday. 2 of {Vifam, andrew94, drmyshottyizsik} most likely. I am not too sure about xofelf but he's still reading as town for me. As is Llamafluff, for actually giving a shit.

zMuffinMan · Post Post #382 (isolation #64) » Tue Jul 19, 2011 4:11 am

@andrew,

... why?

@bs,

Target, please.

zMuffinMan · Post Post #385 (isolation #65) » Tue Jul 19, 2011 4:29 am

er.

We had like... half the game inactive D1, so we didn't lynch. BS claimed roleblocker. D2 we lynched jil, N2 no kill occurred, waiting on BS claiming roleblock target.

That's pretty much everything in a nutshell.

zMuffinMan · Post Post #388 (isolation #66) » Tue Jul 19, 2011 5:33 am

who were the inactives at the end of D1.

jilynne1991, jakesh97, Toro, lobstermania
^ jilynne is dead, you're Jakesh and I think Llama is the new Toro.

Ignoring all that shit what are your reads?

Llama town.
BS is probably Roleblocker
xofelf probably town

One of you and lobster is probs scum. Two of {eijo, vifam, andrew, shotty}

That's about as much as I'm narrowing it down prior to flips.

zMuffinMan · Post Post #399 (isolation #67) » Tue Jul 19, 2011 2:46 pm

tbh, I still think Llama is town, and this just confirms my suspicion that it is a doc/RB setup.

VOTE: Vifam

I'd rather be voting someone I know couldn't be a doc if the kill was due to protection (Ellibereth, for example) or someone who I think actually has a good chance of being scum (Vifam, for example).

Ellibereth wrote:Contrary logic: Llamascum thinks he would less likely be blocked.
No?

No.

zMuffinMan · Post Post #404 (isolation #68) » Tue Jul 19, 2011 2:54 pm

Yeah, but consider that BS thinks both andrew and I are scum. While I'm not sure about andrew, if she's wrong about him too, that means they could pick just about anyone to submit the kill and have a decent chance of succeeding.

Like... if you're scum, they could have just forced Jakesh to do the kill each night, because even in worst-case scenario that BS blocked you, it's possible to play it off as doc protection. That argument also goes for Llama being scum, too, but the point is: It really doesn't matter all too much who submitted the kill, and I really don't think LLama-scum would have submitted it <- that self-wifom from him was genuine.

ftr, if there is a cop in this setup, now would be a good time to out yourself, because it would mean LLama is lying, and you should also have 2 nights worth of investigations, anyway.

zMuffinMan · Post Post #409 (isolation #69) » Tue Jul 19, 2011 7:50 pm

hm.

I'm not actually sure what to make of these two posts.

If Vifam is scum, I'm going to have to seriously look into #408 being a slip.

ftr, Llama was roleblocked, not Vifam.

Also not sure what to make of #406 either.

Need to read through that properly when I'm more awake.

zMuffinMan · Post Post #416 (isolation #70) » Wed Jul 20, 2011 4:57 pm

I've played with andrew quite a bit (unfortunately). It's really hard to read him because he furthers scum's win con just by being alive. I'd say this is more likely andrew-town than andrew-scum, though. I think he tries to come off as more thoughtful when scum, and he's more aggressive tunneling as town.

zMuffinMan · Post Post #421 (isolation #71) » Thu Jul 21, 2011 1:28 am

xofelf wrote:With the amount of people inactive during the last day, i can see this being a case of scum not putting a kill in because they weren't there.

Nope. Maybe 1, possibly 2 scum are in the inactive players, but not all 3 (as evidenced by the N1 kill).

Wondering where Vifam has disappeared to.

zMuffinMan · Post Post #428 (isolation #72) » Thu Jul 21, 2011 3:04 pm

Considering he thought Vifam had been blocked a page ago, I wouldn't look into that as being a slip of any sort. A VI tell, maybe.

zMuffinMan · Post Post #433 (isolation #73) » Thu Jul 21, 2011 9:58 pm

llamafluff wrote:Got up to five people, two of which have flipped town already and just hung out there for a while. I really dont see a full town wagon just resting on town for that type of time period without at least memberlist fluctuation, so that makes at least one of muffin/Ejio/DMSIK scum. The problem is... I lean those guys town more or less.

I actually don't remember it being stuck at 5 for all that long, all things considered. It got to 6 btw (just doesn't show in votecount because kunkstar left out xofelf's vote). There were a number of AFKs who couldn't vote, so that could be one factor in it stalling. Like, I'm a fan of doing VCA, but... this game, not so much.

zMuffinMan · Post Post #443 (isolation #74) » Fri Jul 22, 2011 6:27 pm

elli wrote:lobster scum = llama scum is more of what I'm thinking.

Ya, I know what you were suggesting, but I'm not really sure that's a slip. Poor choice of words, maybe. Poor line of thinking, maybe.

It's worthy of looking at if one of LLama and lobster is lynched and flips scum, but I wouldn't make a big deal out of it at this point.

--

Interested in this content from Vifam.

Will be going back and taking a better look at how that BS wagon built up some time later today.

zMuffinMan · Post Post #444 (isolation #75) » Sat Jul 23, 2011 2:39 am

OK, so took a quick look back over D1 and what happened around the bs wagon.

It was basically me calling her scum for 5 pages and everyone going "nah uh" then suddenly going "oh wait maybe you're right". I'd say one of eijo+shotty is scum, and at least one of vifam+andrew is scum (that tox kill was pretty weird). If there's scum outside of that, it's probably Elli.

Maybe

Lobster, but I'm leaning town on Lobster after re-reading his ISO.

zMuffinMan · Post Post #446 (isolation #76) » Sun Jul 24, 2011 3:06 am

So, yeah. Game stalling again due to lurking. Needs to stop.

I want to lynch one of Vifam/eijo/shotty today

zMuffinMan · Post Post #448 (isolation #77) » Sun Jul 24, 2011 3:57 am

Pretty much.

zMuffinMan · Post Post #467 (isolation #78) » Mon Jul 25, 2011 2:26 pm

andrew wrote:you also look like you know you got roleblocked. hence the waving the flag and saying (claim your rb target bs).

I disagree with this statement, but part of the reason I wanted people to out their suspect list before BS revealed her target last night is that, in the event scum felt it was likely the kill was roleblocked and not doc-protected, there was a good chance there'd be some admissions of guilt in the suspect lists. Was kind of disappointed that people just wanted to hear the target with no discussion, but meh.

zMuffinMan · Post Post #486 (isolation #79) » Thu Jul 28, 2011 8:52 am

llama wrote:@Muffin - What are your thoughts on andrew/DMSIK/Ejio?

andrew and DMSIK are like... unknown variables. I find it really, really hard to read players like them because they play like scum every single game. I do have a fair bit of experience with andrew (unfortunately), and if I had to call his alignment, I'd say town in this game, but I wouldn't be willing to place any bets on it. I feel he at least puts a bit more effort into his suspicions when he's scum (not simply "eijo is scum") and at least a bit more effort into trying to appear town. DMSIK I have absolutely no idea. I think his play has been terrible, and if I wasn't under the impression that this standard of play was somewhat normal for him, I'd be certain he's scum. But then I could probably say the same about andrew. I literally have no better answer than this. I can't read players like them properly, except in special circumstances where they say or do something that I think could only come from them as town or as scum - and that hasn't happened in what I've read so far.

As for eijo, I'm really iffy on him. He's at least putting in some effort, and in a game like this, that's a good sign. But I haven't liked a lot of what he's said so far and there have been various points where I've thought he was scum based on something he had posted. I'll have to go back over this after some sleep to clarify what I actually mean here.

I literally have no solid scum reads right now. This game has been really hard for me to get into because of the low activity and the play style of a lot of the players. Vifam flaking doesn't make me feel better about him, but he's flaked in another game I'm in too, and I'm pretty sure it's not an indication of alignment.

All in all, I wouldn't be opposed to a shotty lynch. Or a Vifam lynch. I'm not sure Eijo is a worthwhile lynch today.

And BS continues to impress with her scum hunting ability.

zMuffinMan · Post Post #490 (isolation #80) » Thu Jul 28, 2011 5:40 pm

I really don't think andrew is scum. Going to reread some things and I'll post my thoughts about everything.

zMuffinMan · Post Post #491 (isolation #81) » Fri Jul 29, 2011 7:28 pm

Look, it's probably too late now, but I'd really rather see this Vifam wagon through.

I think andrew is town. I'm not entirely sure on shotty, but the composition of his wagon is giving me mixed vibes about it. eijolend, ellibereth, lobster. There's at least one scum in that trio. How likely is it that there's bussing going on there over lynching andrew, who's pretty much equally lynchable on a policy basis.

And thinking through wifom like that is making me doubt my reads completely.

If it comes down to a decision between shotty and andrew, I'll probably be voting shotty. With a little under 2 days to the deadline, that's looking to be the case.

It's interesting that people have completely ignored Vifam today, and I'm not sure what to make of it.

zMuffinMan · Post Post #494 (isolation #82) » Fri Jul 29, 2011 8:43 pm

OK, so, suppose andrew is town, and we lynch him, and no NK occurs. Scum reads and why? What would you think of the current andrew wagon (which is like..... Llama, BS, xofelf?)

FTR, both andrew and shotty require 3 more votes for a lynch.

zMuffinMan · Post Post #496 (isolation #83) » Sat Jul 30, 2011 7:24 am

eijo wrote:If andrew is town I think it is assured at least one scum is between Llama, BS and xofelf.

Why?

And who?

eijo wrote:I don't understand this.

He means that you're implying you're unwilling to vote for him unless you must, as in distancing yourself from a mislynch.

zMuffinMan · Post Post #503 (isolation #84) » Sat Jul 30, 2011 5:44 pm

Nah, andrew is town. I'm sure of it.

If it's a choice between andrew and shotty, it's shotty

VOTE: drmyshottizsik

zMuffinMan · Post Post #671 (isolation #85) » Tue Aug 30, 2011 7:56 pm

Town apathy was a problem in this game (myself included, for a lot of this game). Found it really hard to care about this game at all when no one else did.

I don't think the Eijo lynch should have ever happened after the Vifam lynch. I think I said it like 10 times while I was alive:

one

of Vifam and Eijo was scum. andrew was fairly blatantly town to me the day before I died and I really don't know how no one else saw this. xofelf did something D1 that also made me think she was town (I think it was her reaction to my suspicion of her early). The whole xofelf-andrew conflict really needed to stop but they were stubborn about it for some reason. Quilford came across as rather blatantly town after replacing in. And, in hindsight, it should have been a rather obvious choice to lynch Llama after no kill occurred, but I wasn't thinking about this game properly and I didn't feel like lynching LLama when a) Vifam needed to die, andb) Llama gave a shit about the game (or appeared to).