Open 348 - JK9 Game over (Who won?)

[apple_singer]

vote: smallpeoples343

because I know him from another website.

[apple_singer]

14/m/i don't know what l stands for
us pacific
golf, math
high school student
i'm not very good at making up interesting facts about myself

[apple_singer]

Hmm L-2 at RVS is kind of suspicious, and also nobody's unvoted...I think that's dangerous.

As to the RQS, I would not claim unless someone expressed that they wanted to hammer (maybe I'd claim earlier if I was a PR, but a lot of bandwagons die near/at L-1 and I probably wouldn't want to expose myself if it wasn't necessary).

Question 2: How many games have you played before?
I've played 1 complete on MS, am in the middle of another on MS, have finished 2 on another site, and am in one on that site.

[apple_singer]

It's a pressure vote, which now has no pressure since it's been revealed as such. And as we just argued about, an L-2 isn't really scummy.

Mattman just did the same thing Apple_Singer did. Discuss.

I still say L-2 is kind of scummy, which led to my

L-1

bandwagon (nice votecounting there ). L-1 is very scummy, especially with no reasoning. Not that I have too much to go on, but for now

vote: kondi

and sorry if this seems too OMGUSy.

[apple_singer]

I thought we were not in RVS...
And L-1 is dangerous for the reasons that Mattman mentioned, also it encourages people to claim and then PRs are exposed. Generally it's not good to leave a lynch opportunity hanging there; at the very least, it gives mafia a chance to end the day and limit discussion.

Sorry for the limited input; I've been busy. Expect more by Friday.

[apple_singer]

Well I don't think "squawking" at an RVS vote is scummy; at the very least, it's the only way I've seen conversation started in my 4-5 mafia games. I consider this more town than scum.

[apple_singer]

Well a) Where the heck is Dsquared? I know he's been active on another site...
b) Well, even if I have negative attention on me, my play to get some non-RVS conversation worked. I feel that this conversation isn't particularly helpful, though...

[apple_singer]

In a heartbeat I'd prefer a rushed lynch to a no-lynch. With 9 people and 2 mafia town gets 2 kills before LYLO with a lynch every day but only 1 kill before MYLO with a no-lynch one day. Seeing the activity level, I'd be fine with a kondi lynch AFTER he posts a defense/reads if said defense is no good.

Have to go, can't say anything else. Sorry.

[apple_singer]

Replace.

Hmm, the no kill does seem suspicious. Probably jailkeeper either roleblocked mafia or protected the person that was killed.

[apple_singer]

duckhunter

for the jailkeep question

Jon was not helpful in the short time he was here, but I do think that Skenvoy has done a decent job explaining himself.
I stand by my point that L-1 is very scummy and you should have a reason for putting someone at L-1. Smallpeople's L-1 unvote isn't too scummy/suspicious for me as I probably would have done the same.

@mod -- votecount?

[apple_singer]

I don't see any reason to rush either. As for the lynch/no lynch issue, I'd prefer a lynch because it's town's greatest weapon, but I am aware of the mathematical arguments and reasons to no lynch. I propose that we don't rush anything, and discuss for a few days. When the deadline comes close we can determine if we have sufficient leads to warrant a lynch, and if not we can no lynch.

[apple_singer]

FoS: duckhunter

When voting, please give more reason than "he is scummy". That's about the worst argument you can make; it's not an argument at all!
Especially when placing someone at L-1, please give more reason. I will maintain this FoS until you provide a reason for voting.

[apple_singer]

FoS: duckhunter

When voting, please give more reason than "he is scummy". That's about the worst argument you can make; it's not an argument at all!
Especially when placing someone at L-1, please give more reason. I will maintain this FoS until you provide a reason for voting.

Anytime when an inactive player comes out of nowhere and votes/attacks someone is a tad suspicious.

What was the point of this? Is it referring to me or duckhunter? (because we've all kinda been lurky) If I post, are you expecting me not to attack someone? Just to post fluff? That's very anti-town.

Right then...wagon on Pom, go.

This seems a tad desperate for a wagon IMO. I understand why you find Pom scummy; however, begging for a wagon seems like scum trying to rush a lynch or at least create pressure. Shouldn't your argument speak for itself, rather than having to explicitly ask for votes?

[apple_singer]

Desperate? Desperate would be pushing the wagon I was already on, not starting a new one. I want you lumps to

participate

, not lurk your hearts out. And you

just said

my arguments

do

speak for themselves, so what's your deal, Apple?

1) Well you're currently on the Pom "wagon", so I don't really get your first sentence.
2) I'll try to stop lurking, but I've been busy.
3) I said I understood why

you

found Pom scummy; I actually don't find Pom's posts to be terribly scummy myself. I don't think he/she's done anything wrong really. If you're going for a lurker, this game is full of them. Why Pom?

[apple_singer]

@above -- it would have been L-2, not L-1? Whoops, I miscounted the votes apparently. If it was for L-2 I definitely would have voted.

Although right now, seeing the proximity to deadline and the fact that duckhunter hasn't posted in forever, I will

vote: duckhunter

[apple_singer]

I'm liking Meji Fan's case on smallpeople. I could settle for smallpeople as a compromise lynch.

UNVOTE: ;VOTE: [L]. The case is rather strong, and I think I ultimately prefer this lynch to duck/meji, due in part to meji replacing duck.

I think though that I agree with Pine that if necessary, I can compromise with the smallpeoples lynch.

These 2 posts reek of scuminess to me. First of all, Pine seems to be wagon hopping and just trying to get a lynch. While I understand this is near deadline, the tone and the buddying up to whoever has a good case seems very suspicious.

However, Pom's post looks much more suspicious. What case Pom? I see NO CASE WHATSOEVER that has been brought on L since your last post. I understand the not wanting to lynch a replacement, but at least explain the case, as it seems to be nonexistent. If our math is right, that's L-1 for no reason. Really?

unvote
vote: Pom

@mod -- Votecount?

[apple_singer]

Yay for replacements.

So anyways the main thing I take away from the last day or so is this:

small looks scummy at first glance, but due to [REDACTED] I'm more on the side of dumbtown.

In mafia, the only legitimate reason you'd hide information is if you're mafia (obviously) or if you're a PR and don't want to be revealed. Seeing as he suggested for the JK to claim, I doubt he is one; thus, I think he is either mafia or tracker. Not sure which is more likely; I'll have to read that spot in ISO.

[apple_singer]

Whoops misinterpretation sorry.

I have a question to everyone based on accusations I've seen: Is it OK in mafia to go back on what you said some time earlier?

I'll answer it myself first: Usually, I'd say no; going back on what you said is to me a sign of scum trying to place attention on whoever's scummiest and start a bandwagon; on things like No Lynch, it's just going with the flow and trying not to get noticed.
If a significant piece of information arises (aka a flip, PR claim, etc) and the change in opinion makes sense, I say it is OK; but only here is that the case.

[apple_singer]

Sorry guys, didn't realize day had started and now have 2 pages to read.
A few questions/comments:
1) What is a "softclear"?
2) I don't really see how IceGuy or Skenvoy are clear.
3) Skenvoy's abrupt L-1 seems kind of suspicious to me.

Well I'm just a VT, I don't know what to say. Nor do I understand why I am so scummy per se. I notice the conversation's just like "OK, I think this person is town for [reason I find semi-flimsy], and this person is town for [another flimsy reason], so thus Apple must be scum" and nothing about my play or anything like that. I'd try to make a defense but I honestly don't know what I'm defending against -- I just see townreads for everyone but me, instead of a scum-read for me. This doesn't seem worth it for a lynch 2 RL days when you can use 14. Can someone please elaborate on why I'm about to be hammered?

Anyways, I find Skenvoy the most suspicious, especially with the L-1 vote on me with no reasoning attached. Thus,

vote: Skenvoy