Open 475, Twin Trap GAME OVER

[Human Destroyer]

VOTE: uct

Hai

[Human Destroyer]

VOTE: unseencamo

Serious vote.

[Human Destroyer]

K I have a free period so I'll explain quickly

unseencamo is attacking Lincolm for no real reason; supposedly for "active lurking" yet Lincolm is clearly here and posting

The vote so conveniently happened to put Lincolm at L-2. I find that opportunistic.

[Human Destroyer]

Do tell how my vote is opportunistic though Disturbed, I'm quite interested in your reasoning

[Human Destroyer]

Active lurking = posting nothing beneficial. Tazaro you never gave your own reason, just sided with HD. Is he your scum buddy or something?

Your definition of active lurking is twisted. Active lurking is keeping up with the thread and not posting until being called out for doing so. Considering Lincolm has been posting, he's not active lurking.

You've also accused both me and Tazaro of being scum without voting either of us.

Vote stays.

[Human Destroyer]

I'll admit, I honestly thought Lincolm's lurking comment was more of his way of characterizing it than legitimate lurking, but that's just me. I'll also again point out that he isn't lurking if he's posting.

Monkey, what is your read on unseencamo?

[Human Destroyer]

It's scummy because I found his L-2 vote opportunistic. I already said this. If he is attacking Lincolm over nothing, why put him at L-2?

[Human Destroyer]

^So if it is so brash that he accuses the both of us of being scum while he is still voting Lincolm, in a

2 scum setup

, don't you see something off here?

[Human Destroyer]

Depends on if it's a strong reason to be voting Lincolm. Which, as I've said, the current one isn't. Attacking someone with a really weak case like this one to put them at L-2 seems orchestrated to me.

[Human Destroyer]

Active lurking = posting nothing beneficial. Tazaro you never gave your own reason, just sided with HD. Is he your scum buddy or something?

Also, just in case you missed this.

Scum reads: HD and Tazaro
Voting: Lincolm

Do you see the disconnect in thought process here?

[Human Destroyer]

Independently, no and no, BUT if combined with an L-2 or L-1 vote, I'd say very much yes.

[Human Destroyer]

Seems you agitated with someone in L-2 with weak case. May explain why it seems orchestrated? For me it just same like the other random vote.

I always have problems with RVS wagons. Especially ones that aren't explicitly stated to be wagons.

Unseen, could you explain exactly what you learned from that "reaction test" of yours?

[Human Destroyer]

I'm still here, just waiting on unseen's response >.>

@Mod: Shouldn't uct be replaced or something?

[Human Destroyer]

So you've learned nothing from everyone else's interactions with you and Lincolm?

At all?

[Human Destroyer]

He is? OK.

unseen's response doesn't really satisfy me tbh

[Human Destroyer]

Hi I'm here and quote walls yay. If some things are redundant, it's because I multi-quoted and just responded as I read.

Spoiler: Wall of Respondiness

Most games have at

least

a two week deadline for Day 1.

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=83&t=23424 (10 Days for a MICRO game of 7 People)

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=55&t=21855 (2 Weeks for 16 Players)

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=52&t=21383 (2 Weeks for 14 People)

Calling 12 Days for 9 People somewhat of a gift is absolutely absurd.

In addition, the last game even shows that Page 4 is going as slow as this game. Sure--the other two are different but the other two are drastically different then normal games.

Also, just because it's in the rules doesn't make it a good rule. You basically made it so that an extension was a gift to an already suffering deadline.

Finally, you must've seen that rule literally in one or two games because I've NEVER been in a game where time was taken away. That's absurd and extremely scum-oriented.

Scum could be lurking just so that rule could go into effect.

I'm going to have to agree with this.

@Mod: Request a deadline extension to at least 2 weeks, it is too short as is.

Was the time taken away thing approved by a reviewer?

>Open Games
>review

wat

No. This is an Open Game. Nothing is reviewed setup/game-wise.

Also, just to fact check, the little "leme take away time if I feel that everyone isn't posting enough" isn't in your rules. It's a little note that's added in the first post. I'd like a final declaration on your motives toward this and other opinions on this, thanks.

Yeah this.

Hello.

Unseencamo so are you saying Lincoln outright scum slipped by saying lurk?

Pretty clearly not what he was saying; he was calling Lincolm scum for supposed "active lurking".

Crap I didn't see extra pages, that question directed at post at bottom of page 1.

Need to catch up on this then more tomorrow.

oh ok

@ #122
Good response.
@ Hiraki
I believe it is more scum to just pursue one person in a dogmatic way. Being open and weighing out options is a good town oriented strategy. I disagree w/ #104.
@ uctriton
Nice of you to join us.

1) There was no #122 (future edit: unless you had the foresight to know about ArcAngel's post, which was IMO sucktacular), so what are you talking about here?

2) Why would scum want to dogmatically pursue one player instead of keep their options spread out? Other opinions should be weighed, but sometimes if you're confident someone is scum you don't really need to take heed of every other person's opinion.

Hey MonkeyMan, you're still voting Lincolm. Does that you mean you still find Lincolm suspicious? If so, what exactly about Lincolm is it that you still find suspicious?

Why did you ignore my question?

Also, I completely agree with Hiraki. Just saying.

I'll just nod my assent to this post.

I'm here, if anyone wants me in some capacity.

Um yeah. More scumhunting, please and thank you.

@ HD 101
No, of course not. When I have some time I will create my complete read list.

I eagerly wait. (future edit: posted already)

My reads as of now.

HD

He has targeted me since my skirmish with Lincolm, however he does not lack all reasoning. That being said it looks like HD is going to be that one guy that I don't like very much. Sorry. There is always one in each game, but they always turn out to be town in my short experience. I'll refer to it as DB town. And with regard to the claim of optimism in his vote, I really don't see it, all I see is less than sufficient reasoning. Off of the small amount of posts I have to draw from, instinct tells me town. Town that I don't like.

DB town

MonkeyMan576

MM has barely posted anything, and his posts are never that helpful. I need to see more from this guy. What is your opinion about HD?

Unknown

Uct

Obviously nothing to say, unknown.

Unknown

Lincolm

Reasoning can be found in previous posts.

Rather cluless town

Hiraki

I disagree with this guys push on me and his view of fencesitting. Do you want me to dogmatically vote and potentially lynch a town? Your claim that just because Lincolm is a new player he is definately prone to strange behavior is erroneous, he has been here longer than me. That being said, he does indeed actually lack the meta, but sometimes new players have experience elsewhere so you can't just always blame suspicious behavior on being a noob.

Unknown (Slightly Scummy)

Tazaro

This guy hasn't posted too much either, he did however almost buddy up with HD pretty quickly.

Unknown (Possible Slightly Scum

Damn it I have to go.... Will finish later

Okay let's look at this post:

What does DB stand for?

I go off whatever reasons I currently think might be scumtells. Does that mean they might end up being weak? Maybe. Does it make them fundamentally untrue? No.

I agree on Monkey.

I wouldn't say Lincolm is clueless, but I find him likely town.

I disagree with your Hiraki read in its entirety. A good townie believes in his reads and doesn't sit on the fence saying "Well maybe he's this, but maybe he's this, or

maybe

he's this..." Therefore, I think he's completely correct to be pushing you for it.

Tazaro I agree with though.

This is town flavored posting. Keep it up. However, if you have no strong scum reads, why are you not poking and prodding your weaker scum reads?

but sometimes new players have experience elsewhere so you can't just always blame suspicious behavior on being a noob.

This doesn't matter because mafiascum meta=/=randomforumsite meta

Besides, that's a probability. It's not like there's a decent chance of it.

This.

@ unseencamo:

I completely agree on your MonkeyMan read.

How do you feel about Tazaro's reasoning for backing off your wagon? Post #63, I will link to it for convenience. http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... 5#p4679935

I agree with this post; Tazaro backing off when called out is a pretty big scumtell.

perhaps MM is the scum..who knows!!

Scumhunt moar, thanks.

tl;dr

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Tazaro

[Human Destroyer]

See this why I hate school

Expect a post when I get home in an hour or so

[Human Destroyer]

ArcAngel

Stop being such a terrible VI >.>

I mean seriously this is how you play every fucking game and it needs to fucking stop

ANYWAY ENOUGH RANTING

Tazaro is still scum

On the off chance he isn't, however, unseen and Monkey are the scum team.

Why is this?

Monkey's reason where he stated he was convinced on AA9 scum was her OMGUS. However, unseen's OMGUS was FAR WORSE.

You can use draft rather than post in separate like that in #131. Yes, I didn't pay attention in #131. I don't even care someone think I'm scummy or not. My opinions is more important than myself. Also other opinions.

No. Even you said you want to judge her post, it doesn't make sense because you already said she is your strongest scum read. Is your judge make many differences with your read? If yes, then why you don't try to ask something to Tazaro and Hiraki also? Is your vote hurt much to her? I don't see she is in L-1. You can vote and unvote, not hold your vote.

I'm completely didn't see your attack for something. What I saw you tried to more activities and you pushed it on me. I already said it also.

VOTE: Unseencamo

^ This is clearly OMGUS, am I right?
Lincolm, I'm starting to think you are not so clueless. "I don't care someone think I'm scummy or not" (sic). First of all, if you could clear up some of that grammar I would appreciate it, it would be easier to read. And that statement is completely anti-town. You are trying as a townie to PROVE that you are not scum, and if you are town but you "don't care" to prove that you are, you are HURTING the town. Therefore, scum. I can't believe the way you are playing this game. So inelegant. I'm not sure if you are clueless or scum, but you are getting my vote. A mistake like that on your part is inexcusable. This is forum mafia, a TEAM game. It's not about "[your] opinions".
VOTE: Lincolm

I mean seriously my god this is so bad

Monkey is holding these two to a double standard, and that's a very bad thing.

I am not interested in an AA9 lynch, nor a Lincolm lynch.

[Human Destroyer]

UNVOTE:
VOTE: MonkeyMan

Changed my mind, I'll lynch Monkey-->unseen-->Tazaro, in that order of preference

[Human Destroyer]

Explain how Arc is more OMGUSy than unseen.

[Human Destroyer]

No.

Quite frankly, I don't believe your claim.

Arc is a complete VI and this is her normal play. The fact that you're trying to read her using it is laughable.

P-Edit: Okay, seriously Arc, start contributing or replace out. I've had enough of these crappy "NO U" posts that usually end up insulting the target.

Get the fuck over it and start being pro-town.

[Human Destroyer]

Since I think Monkey is scum fakeclaiming to draw out the PR (which did happen to be Arc), I think we're better off lynching Monkey.

If I'm wrong, whatever, this isn't LYLO

P-Edit: I think Monkey is scum. Therefore, by virtue of counterclaim, Arc is town.

[Human Destroyer]

Monkey's claim is such obvious rolefishing

It came far earlier than it should have, AND had a counterclaim (despite it being someone under pressure)

I also haven't seen anything from Arc to give me scum vibes, this is just her normal (albeit bad) attitude every game and is therefore null.

[Human Destroyer]

If town doesn't win this I'll be legitimately mad

Like seriously this should be hilariously easy at this point

That was my bah post, so now I DIE

[Human Destroyer]

lol that was easy

[Human Destroyer]

Just some tips (I know I'm new, but I'm a nice noob )

-unseen: If you're a Track-Immune Goon and Watcher has claimed...there's really no reason not to shoot them. It creates at least a small degree of uncertainty in the town.

-Monkey: That claim came at the worst time it possibly could have for you. Try to make your rolefishing more subtle next time.

-Arc: Please, lrn2scumhunt. I don't think I need to say more.