Open 548-WiFom City: The Invasion (Over)

[Profont]

Hi, I am bad probably, don't know ,pretty new that is.

VOTE: Profont
Not a creative Hydra name.

This coming from MTD.

VOTE: Vote: Hoopla
Serious vote.

[Profont]

I probably should have specified that was the font head of the Hydra.

MTD: Post 32 is opportunistic and the tone differs from Hoopla's tone her other two posts.
-font

[Profont]

FoS on Profont.

"This coming from MTD" regarding the creativity is repeating what Aisa said, and sheeping Hoopla also seems to follow what others have said.

Not voting yet because wanna discuss with the dog

(and Sakura wagon is too good to leave)

~Wis

Did you really have to attack this before Hoopla responded?

Unless you're counting both heads of the Beast hydra, I'm fairly certain only one person pressured Hoopla before me. Why did you say "others"?

~Fixed.

[Profont]

Nhh, sorry. I'm still getting used to this site's formatting.
-font

[Profont]

Dragon was attacking Hoopla for an unexplained vote. I attacked her for a post that felt wrong. There's a difference. I don't think the reasoning is terrible. Sure, it's not the strongest thing ever, but then, I didn't expect to find anything truly scummy coming out of RVS.

[Profont]

I'm here.

Hi, I am bad probably, don't know ,pretty new that is.

Explain to me prefacing your RVS vote with "I'm bad"? It feels out of place. Do you have a meta of doing this?

MTD looks kind of town so far.

Why? What gave you a townread on him based on three contentless posts?

why omgus ns and not me?

~Wis

Because notscience is obvtown and im obvscum so i need to get obvtown lynched

I mentioned to fontisian inside our QT that I disliked Sakura's first few posts. It feels a bit too forced/contrived for a joke, and scum love to joke about claiming scum.

Also, this felt off to me too, especially the "sooo yeah" - those words didn't need to be there:

In all seriousness tho, it's just some sort of thing with ns that he's always obvtown soooo yeah.

UNVOTE:
VOTE: sakura

Reasoning? I'm assuming you caught on to that?

Bring it! I'm not scared of you or your shenanigans

This also feels a bit forced, and the "bring it!" feels like an attempt to show off bravado - it's quite a rapid tone change from her previous posts.

Shoot TAMMY FFS
~ Dog

What does this mean, as an outsider who has no idea of what previous games you've played?

I don't agree with fontisian re: Hoopla - I don't see the tone changes, and nothing really raises alarms for me.

I'm not sure on Dragon Alliance yet, as their posts are confusing me. I'll take another look at them when I have the chance, and break down their sentences in isolation.

Hoopla and Rottweiler seem to ne leaning town atm. Now to sort the rest of you.

You know I want reasons.

@Aronis

In your #96, what exactly made you townread Dragon Alliance based on those posts? It's not enough to simply quote the posts that made you think DA is town; I want you to explain

what in those posts

that made you think Dragon Alliance is town.

---

To clarify for the mod -

Unvote, vote Sakura Hana

.

-p

[Profont]

Meaning I am not good at mafia, it had nothing to do with the vote.

Ah, didn't catch that as a response to Hoopla's thing. Thanks.

So you're the kind of player who wants explanations for everything huh? That's such a pain.

Think of it as it's easier to reason and use logic to figure things out if you have partial information vs. all of the information.

Thanks for the explanation - I *think* I can see where you're coming from from that first post? That sentence is quite disjointed, though.

no, i just wanted to build a wagon.

Hm.

---

@notscience

Is there a reason you didn't follow up on your question to Rottweiler?

also, ABR: do you have any reads so far? what's up

/barn this.

@ABR

If you don't like the Sakura wagon, how come you aren't pushing anyone *you* think is scum, and holding onto your RVS vote?

[Profont]

@MTD: Because I don't really have scumreads.
I guess I could put my vote somewhere for pressure, though.
VOTE: Profont

Also, this felt off to me too, especially the "sooo yeah" - those words didn't need to be there:

In all seriousness tho, it's just some sort of thing with ns that he's always obvtown soooo yeah.

What's the bottom line?

Why did you vote for us?

I don't really understand you question. Proph doesn't like the way the extra words are used to pad Sakura's post. I disagree, as the extra wording seems to be a normal part of Sakura's posting style.

Of course you want reasons.

I'll start with DA: The posts appeared genuine townie, asking for reasons, appeared to be scumhunting and gut tells me their town.

Hoopla and Rotweiler: The hard ones.
People want me to give reads early in the game and I'm not that really comfortable giving reads that early, so I just randomly picked a couple active people that seemed null-townish and boom, my town reads.

Hoopla is more VIstyle/Null-leant atm. Seems town, but not enough yet for me to make a decent read.

Rottweiler seemed to be trying to scumhunt/helpt at first glance. I should prob reassess the read soon.

... Did you just admit to randomly picking town reads because it looks good?

Unvote, Vote: Aronis

-font

[Profont]

Why me over Aronis? It seems we are both on you potential scum radar but you decide to vote me over them. I already have people voting me so a pressure vote seems a little unlikely. If it is a pressure vote then it would have served more of a purpose on Aronis.

-Beast

What makes you think making your wagon bigger over a vote that probably would have ended up useless is less useful?

PEd: @ns: then vote DA with me.

You dodged the question. Why do you think DA is scummy enough to merit a vote? Why do you have Aronis as null-scum?
-font

[Profont]

You addressed a minor subset of the question. I care about your reasons for voting DA over Aronis nearly as much as I care about your reasons for suspecting them in the first place. Are you going to answer that or not?
-font

[Profont]

Why did you vote for us?

I don't really understand you question. Proph doesn't like the way the extra words are used to pad Sakura's post. I disagree, as the extra wording seems to be a normal part of Sakura's posting style.

Partly random vote, but I also don't agree with Proph's stance on Sakura and wanted to get a better feel for the reasoning behind it.

My question means "What does her extra wording tell you? Do you think that is scummy?"

A pressure vote then. I'll let Proph answer this, though the answer to the second question should be obvious. He wouldn't have voted for Sakura if he didn't think it was scummy.

Quick question:
@Font, do you think that Aronis randomly picking some town reads is scummy? Why/why not?

I'll let you know after he responds.

MTD is likely town.

notscience: You seem to be voting for town reads. Do you have any scumreads?
-font

[Profont]

VOTE: puppy


I don't think you guys are actually scum but I figure a good old fashioned tunnelfight should get htis game going

this seems kind of pointless if you're going to preempt your vote with "i don't think you guys are scum". how is this reaction test supposed to do anything?

Because we spend time arguing and then gauge how people react to it

But it does jack shit now

Could you explain this to me? How did you intend to start an argument with a vote that you immediately backed off of? Why not naked vote and then work off of Rottweiler's reaction?

[Profont]

Prod dodge; will post more tomorrow.

-p

[Profont]

Hi ika.

Are you going to read the last 200+ posts, and if you are, can you grace me with a t/s list?

--

From a brief skim of things, we both think that beastcharizard is town low-hanging fruit, and I want to engage with ika to discern his alignment better.

I'm not getting the Rottweiler votes.

~p

[Profont]

Just cause this is here and want to interact

Hi ika.

Are you going to read the last 200+ posts, and if you are, can you grace me with a t/s list?

Already posted mine, now how about you post yours instead of being useless. I want your reasoning as well before i give mine

--

From a brief skim of things, we both think that beastcharizard is town low-hanging fruit, and I want to engage with ika to discern his alignment better.

2 post gives you low-haning fruit? where did that come from?

I'm not getting the Rottweiler votes.

so you think hes town or are you jsut fence sitting?

~p

Yay.

1. How did you make your town/scum list? You posted the list, then on your next post you stated "I don't feel like reading all of the posts; I will later". If you haven't read the thread, how did you make your town/scum list?

The logic doesn't mesh there, at all.

2. I think I'm perfectly fine with being useless, for the time being.

3. fontisian thinks that DA is town, and I have a gut-feel of him being town as well. I'll ask her to substantiate the read later.

4. I pop into the thread and see Rottweiler get some votes. No reasoning attached for them, and it feels like a wagon for the sake of a wagon. I have no idea what my read on Rottweiler is, so you can call this fencesitting, I guess.

~p

[Profont]

ika, I'm trying to say - if you haven't read the thread and people barely made any posts since you replaced in, how did you get that (very minimal) reads list?

And we're not "engaged" in the game right now - hence the useless comment. I have time for a few short posts here and there, but I've stalled on actually processing the game for weeks now.

For three, we were waiting for a big wagon to build on beastcharizard before we started defending him - we wanted to catch opportunistic scum.

[Profont]

Let me get this straight - I don't need reasons for your reads; I want to hear /how/ you got them, because there's a glaring inconsistency in there.

You're refusing to do anything until I comply to your demands - is this correct?

-p

[Profont]

ika: This fight is pointless. We will engage when we engage, and your refusal to explain how you got your reads does nothing.

Moving on to opportunistic scum, iamausername, let's talk.

You picked up on the issues with our Aronis vote, and you look like a pretty experienced and thoughtful guy. So, why did you jump on the low-hanging fruit? More to the point, where did this post come from?

really not feeling this rottweiler wagon. if we absolutely must dismantle the beastcharizard wagon (and i'm far from convinced that we must), can we lynch Aisa instead?

like, is Aisa giving off any indication that she gives the slightest crap about who gets lynched today? has she offered any opinion on any of the prospective lynches on the table? has she offered any opinion on

anything

?

UNVOTE: Beastcharizard
VOTE: Aisa

c'mon

The Beastcharizard wagon was dismantled because you dismantled it. Before that, only Sakura had unvoted, we spoke out against it and Shockwave Rider had actually rescinded his town read of DA. If you had wanted a Beastcharizard lynch, you could have easily pushed it. Why didn't you?
-font

[Profont]

Sakura: Please stop. Just attack someone or explain some of your thoughts. I don't really care, as long as it's something.
-font

[Profont]

Thank you. Can you offer some evidence (past games with Wis) so I can see what you're talking about and judge it for myself?
-font

[Profont]

ika: This fight is pointless. We will engage when we engage, and your refusal to explain how you got your reads does nothing.

-font

No it shows your ignorance and refusal to engadge with me. porio did and you dont. Your not out yet. I would like to find out more. Whats pointless about it? how does it do nothign? how come porio cares but not you?

It's a pissing contest. You're both posturing about and refusing to do anything before the other does. Frankly, it's a waste of my time.
-font

[Profont]

ika is probably town. His anger and scumreading of me are townie.

~p

[Profont]

If I'm still acting like this by Day 3, shoot me.

I will do everything you asked for before the end of the Day. Until then I'm just observing and letting font do most of the legwork.

~p

[Profont]

Too much to respond to, not enough that I care about.

Unvote
Vote: Aisa

This needs to happen.
-font

[Profont]

Going to reread game, and do everything that ika requested tomorrow.

~p

[Profont]

Alright, let's do this.

Rereading now.

~p

[Profont]

*skips over first page*

I'm getting a number of towntells from beastcharizard, hence the townread.

Because town should give reason for everything they do especially voting. Until Hoopla gives a good explanation I don't want our vote to change.

He's believes what he's saying, and that's all that ultimately matters when determining mindset.

It could be a scumtell. Needing to discuss a vote so early in the game doesn't make sense for town. But as scum, you don't want to jump on the first viable wagon, or maybe voting a person may be later seen as bussing, so you need to try to plan ahead.
But your reasoning makes sense.

There's an odd disconnect there. "It could be scummy!" switching to "your reasoning makes sense". It's not much, but grasping content from this thread has been difficult as-is.

A naked vote in RVS isn't RVS to me, it is opportunistic.

We do not agree there then, to me a naked vote in RVS is either an RVS vote or an attempt to get out of RVS, but not opportunistic as scum does not gain anything from that vote.

IIoA.

Why is Wisdom's #66 arguing about theory?

Yes it was. I will try making sure I address my posts from now on so that it is easier to understand who I am talking to.

A naked vote is not town. not town = scum. That is all I have at this time. Wisdom called me out on it but this is what I have and am going to go with. Now, how am I scum?

See above post.
You look scummy for your reaction to Hoopla's attempt to get you playing, getting defensive when there was no attack there.
But yeah, this isn't strong, but my strongest atmo.

The bolded is pretty darn self-conscious.

Note how he uses "you look scummy" instead of "You're scum for..." - finding things that are scummy is the mindset that you want to lynch someone you can justify. vs. finding reasons why someone is scum.

Not a huge fan of Hoopla's #79 - feels like she's attacking beastcharizard for doing "scummy" things when the mindset they're coming from isn't from scum.

And Wisdom is seeing the same thing I'm seeing in beastcharizard.

Yeah, Hoopla's vote for beastcharizard isn't showing much passion, and lots of nitpicking logic tells. It's like, while Hoopla is attacking beastcharizard, I feel like she's going after low-hanging fruit and not actually

believing

that she's scum.

profont's initial reason for pressuring me seems pretty abstract and gut based, which i cannot really criticise (other than for being incorrect) as that is often how i derive my reads (and also subsequently find them hard to explain). his followup explanation in post 54 seems sincere in its simplicity.

This feels noncommittal to me - Hoopla's hiding behind words like "sincere" without really holding herself up to choice words like "townie" or "scummy".

ika/Wisdom unaligned pair, based on Wisdom calling out Aronis. Probably useless though - ika is town.

Dragon Alliance (Beast) was being clearly hypocritical, but it doesn't tell me much. It could be town or scum.

And heh, I made a series of questions on page 5 that I never responded to.

I have no idea why anyone has a read on ABR at this point - he's posting one-liners to catch up with the thread, IIRC, and hasn't done

anything

. I'll reexamine him on Day 2.

I don't have any serious reads yet, I will bandwagon hydras until I do.

You're basically absolving yourself of accountability at this point.

I have no idea if this is just mafiascum idiosyncrasy or scum active lurking. Knowing ABR's experience I'll go with the first, but ugh.

@MTD: Because I don't really have scumreads.
I guess I could put my vote somewhere for pressure, though.

If you don't have scumreads, how come you aren't trying to question people to get them?

(And you do realize that voting, then labeling it as a "pressure vote" with no reasoning attached doesn't add a lick of pressure, right?)

I *want* to townread Shockwave Rider.

The bolded part was a question I had for you.

i have no real read on MTD. have barely noticed his posts while i've been playing. i guess that means his posts appear to be filler-y noise.

I agree with you on this.

Note that MTD asked a question to ABR - "why hydras". ABR doesn't respond. Does MTD care about his question?

I didn't follow up because I got my answer. .-.

Would reply to this more in-depth if it was earlier in the Day, but not interested in talking about theory now.

As I mentioned to fontisian inside our QT, I *liked* #122 - it felt genuine to me. Dislike how she hops on the DA wagon, though - again, she's absolving herself of accountability on the DA wagon.

(I swear this game hates me - I can't do my voting analysis when all of the highest wagons are at L-3)

Holy god I'm only at the end of page 5. I thought the thread ended at page 11 or something.

--takes break, comes back--

Your gut is failing you horribly right now, so I wouldn't trust it to much.

@ns:
Why do you like the wagon if you think that me and my other head are lynch bait?

I like this post - the gut phrasing in particular is something that's giving me townvibes, on reread.

Dragon Allliance's wagon, as previously stated, seems to be votes with empty bandwagon vote after empty bandwagon vote with absolutely nothing behind them - I'm not a fan of the pushers of the wagon, either.

Vote: DA

Case in point.

I swear I need a votecount there -

Dragon Alliance (6) - MTD, Hoopla, Sakura Hana, notscience, Albert B. Rampage, iamausername

Probably the only 5+ vote wagon in the game, hm.

And MTD doesn't follow up on the "hydras" comment. Lowered.

Albert is probably town here. This is one of those games where I have a ton of town reads and not really any scum reads so far.

I'm kind of curious about what Rottweiler's doing here. Their posts don't seem to be oriented toward scumhunting. Might seem a little hypocritical coming from me, but there it is. Rottweiler, who are your scumreads?

I want to ask you how you got your townread on Albert, but proof of verbosity regarding that will probably make me feel like an idiot.

My question means "What does her extra wording tell you? Do you think that is scummy?"

Yes, I consider unnecessarily tacked on words to be scummy.

And I see the reasoning provided for townreading Albert, though I don't think I'm convinced.

Not sure what to make of the notscience voting for Wisdom, but I do recall that a Rottweiler wagon building up so I'll be on the lookout for that.

Vote Rottweiler

I guess this is where it begins?

Explain how it was wrong please.

I think I responded to this but it got lost. My townread on you was based on thinking you were saying that you actually had a townread on Sakura. But actually you were just saying that you considered it a "mislynch wagon" because there was no reasoning behind it.

Unvote. Vote: Rottweiler.

I think this was the only vote with any actual reasoning - notscience started the wagon as a "reaction test", ABR added a vote without reasoning, and Shockwave listed Rott as one of his three scumreads.

It's not like sakura to be so apathetic when wagoned.

You do realize that it's actually quite the opposite?

Unvote
Vote: Rottweiler

...yeah.

This feels like a wagon for the sake of wagonning.

And I think this is the time where I go out of hibernation and start talking to ika.

Already posted mine, now how about you post yours instead of being useless. I want your reasoning as well before i give mine

They will be at the end of this post, hopefully!

(If I missed anything, please requote them - the only thing I saw was my reads)

Well since Wis considers me doing nothing a scumtell, im going to continue to do nothing and then when I flip town that'll stop being a scumtell so there.

Have fun~

o/

This.. is lack of self-awareness? Hm.

Again, I'm getting a townread on ika. His last posts show clear town-energy.

a contributing factor in this decision was the fact that during the break, i read over Aisa's one completed game on site and found a town Aisa who was vastly more proactive in pushing lynches than she has been in this game.

fontisian used this reasoning when she voted for Aisa, I think.

Know what now im getting pissed off, i dont know sakeras alignment nor yours nor anyones for that matter, but if you are just gonna be a shithole like this then maybe you should replace out. You obviously dont care for a persons emotions right now and the fact that you cause her to replace out and have no regrets make me just want to lynch you out of policy. If you are going to drill someone to a point where they replace out like that, then you should be the one being replaced.

How about makeyourself useful and think of someone else who might be fucking scum or scum hunt now instead of going "replace out, you suck"

This is a fucking game and if you are going to take it to a point where you are forcing a player to replace out. You need to be slapped and take a hard face of reality. Not everyone can deal with death tunnles and the shit you are doing. I was like that (and sometimes still am) but i dont replace out. If you take it to a point where someone is forced to rplace out. The falt is yours. Now how about you shut up and stay off this thread and do a hard rest or have your partner post for a bit. You have already done enough damage as is.

Again, case in point.

When they're useless and anti-town and refuse to do anything, it's better for the game if they replaced out. The thing is many times people are hesitant to replace out so that they don't give the mod a hard time, so they remain in the game and continue doing nothing. In those cases, they need encouragement to replace out.

Hm, going by that logic, how come you haven't really pushed on ABR? He's been very useless this entire Day, moreso than Sakura.

Beast: Leaning scum. Well, there hasn't been anything to change my read there. Still not a strong read, mind.

ika: Scum. Aronis was hard to read because of not doing much, still, what he did was strange, he did give some "townreads" in his first post, just to say "Oh they weren't actually townreads, I just picked some where it would look good", stating people had asked him for reads, when actually afaik nobody did.

You have beastcharizard as leaning scum, yet your vote was still on him while you had a stronger scumread on ika. Reconcile this.

@ika: What were your thoughts on ABR? You had him as

townish: ABS

..Yet you don't expand on him.

I will maintain my cautious townread on Greymarble; Llamarble is very good as town, and Sakura Hana has some genuineness and lack of self-awareness.

Scum is too scared to talk about the Rottweiler wagon. Though unfortunately it's dying down now.

The most people got from the Rottweiler wagon was "Why is he being run up?", and the lack of responses to that question. What reactions were you expecting?

I've decided to give up on analyzing Sakura's replace out, and just look at the rest of her posts, plus Greymarble.

I don't care about what it is preventing, it makes me facepalm how you can townread the two most scummy people in the game.

~Wis

This reads slightly genuine to me? The 'facepalming', at least. It's a natural town reaction.

Scumteam is Shockwave, Profont, & Notscience.
MTD is the backup in case one of them somehow flips town.
This game was surprisingly easy.

Hm, did that read on notscience flipped 180?

wisdom shut up and lynch sakuras slot. im not following you if you are going to be dense here

my scum paring idea

graymarble/hoopla/abr

So, ABR moves from "townish" to "not even mentioned" to "a third wheel on a scumteam"?

Explain to me your thought process regarding ABR; I'm very interested.

IF NS FLIPS TOWN, DO YOU AGREE SAKURA'S SLOT MUST BE SCUM? YES OR NO?

Ugh man why is ika setting up dichotomies?

so basically you would lynch ns just to prove grey is scum? What guarantees to you they're not both town? Why would you want me to make a "promise" that I'll be lynching Grey if ns is town? Sounds like lining up lynches.

~Wis

I agree with this but does it make ika scum? He's doing something blatantly scummy, though I know his scum meta is pretty darn bad (Olympian Gods). Hmm.

I have no idea why Wisdom is defending us. We've both been pretty disconnected from this game, and it shows.

Generally it is inadvisable to lynch somebody who just arrived and is likely to win you the game if left to their own devices.

I agree with this and don't think that Greymarble should be the lynch toDay.

My Ika townread is dying.
I am up for lynching MTD or Profont; NS' "You can't lynch me Ha Ha Ha" refrain is somewhat more common from town than scum.

Now there's some justification for the 180.

Why is the ika townread dying? Did you get a similar progression?

Why are people self-voting? That's just blatantly anti-town.

[L-2] Aisa - iamausername, Hoopla, Greymarble, Shockwave Rider, Profont

I guess we can ride this wagon? I don't have a townread on Aisa, and I'm interested to see if the meta theory brought by IAAU holds weight.

And I am done! Wow, that took an hour.

Analysis and Certainty:

Profont: 10/10. I should be more engaged in this game now to prove my towniness.
beastcharizard: 8/10. Very strong townie signals, early in the game.
iamausername: 7/10. I don't see much bad things from him, and the effort he's using to push Aisa seems legit.
Shockwave Rider: 5/10. Very consistent, almost all of his posts have purpose.
ika: 5/10. Very townie when replacing in but got weird end of Day 1.
Greymarble: 3/10. Call this a slight townread but I liked Sakura's genuineness in one of her posts, and the lack of self-awareness.
Rottweiler: 2/10. Despite nodding my head with many of Wisdom's posts (he's also one of the people who kept this game alive) after the Newbie game I'm hesitant to townclear him. I don't trust my reads of him.

?
ABR 0/10. Nothing. Normally I'd be scumreading him hard for this but this is mafiascum.net, where people can fluffpost through the day and be declared obvtown. I'll wait for Day 2.

Scum:

Hoopla 4/10
notscience 5/10
Aisa 5/10
MTD 6/10

This is very much process of elimination. I am perfectly fine seeing any of those four lynched.

Current votecount:

GreyMarble - Aisa, Rottweiler, MTD, ika
Rottweiler - Albert R. Rampage
Aisa - iamausername, Hoopla, Shockwave Rider, Profont
MTD - Greymarble, beastcharizard

Not voting: notscience

Wow why is Greymarble one of top wagons right now.

Vote MTD.

More townreads on this wagon.

----

That should be it. If anyone wishes to ask me more questions, lmk.

~p

[Profont]

however the case you have presented is much better and this is what i am willing to follow for now.

What "case" did I present? I only looked at a few of MTD's posts and voted him being more townreads on wagon logic.

There are several inconsistencies about you that I want answered toMorrow.

Greymarble: 3/10. Call this a slight townread but I liked Sakura's genuineness in one of her posts, and the lack of self-awareness.

There was absolutely no genuineness in Sakura's posts.

If we're both still alive let's talk about it on Day 2.

Again, I *want* to say Wisdom is town - my gut is feeling it. Hm.

I agree with this but does it make ika scum? He's doing something blatantly scummy, though I know his scum meta is pretty darn bad (Olympian Gods). Hmm.

I have no idea why Wisdom is defending us. We've both been pretty disconnected from this game, and it shows

Olympian gods is not a good example. He replaced in after tons of pages, in a heavily suspected scumslot, there was not much he could do. Here it's a quiet game, which means he didn't need much effort to get in. My gut keep fellng me he's town, but I could see him being scum. I greatly dislike his wanting to lynch town as a way to figure out who is scum. That's what scum do to line up lunches. And he's doing it again now with MTD.

I don't care that you have been distant (I actually do, but it doesn't affect my read), I think you're quite obviously town from early on.

Hm, really? Can you tell me what posts affected your read?

You FoSed us and only really started to show the townread when you started defending us.

Note how he uses "you look scummy" instead of "You're scum for..." - finding things that are scummy is the mindset that you want to lynch someone you can justify. vs. finding reasons why someone is scum.

You are forcing yourself to find something scummy about MTD. There is nothing scummy about this. It could easily mean uncertainty from MTD's side. There is no necessity for town to show their confidence with "you are scum" statements all the time.

Note that MTD asked a question to ABR - "why hydras". ABR doesn't respond. Does MTD care about his question?

This too is bad. ABR is answering nothing to nobody. It's completely normal to become apathetic.

It's more than a little frustrating seeing all of my scumhunting skills shrivel up and die on mafiascum.

but at least this is better energy from everyone, ripe for analysis tomorrow.

You really think that you can analyze deadline lynches?

I've found them to be fairly useless in terms of info, because everyone switches at the last moment and they can easily justify their vote.

---

As a general note, quit posturing about being killed - the scum will kill who they kill, and any speculation on it is pointless if we're going to see the answer in a couple of days.

it's cute how Rottweiler and Greymarble are both so sure they're going to be killed tonight.

^
I'm fine with the bulk of this being answered on Day 2.

~p

[Profont]

technically she could be a scum JOAT using a ninja kill, but i don't see scum using their goon to make the N1 kill when they were already a man down if they had the JOAT power available.

Explain this to me. Why would scum waste a strongman shot on Night 1?

I don't think Aisa is cleared at all. We've had two revealed power roles, which means that scum went for at least two of the five options. Both notscience and MTD flipped as goons, and if MTD was not recruited, the last scum

has

to be some sort of role. JoaT makes a lot more sense to get then bulletproof or rolecop. Then there's the fact that JoaT is the first role notscience thought of when he was trying to save himself.

Aisa's behavior has been just as bad as her interactions with the flipped scum. Just look at the way notscience treated her, going from having a scumread on her, to claiming that he had no scumreads, to asking why there was a wagon forming on Aisa.

VOTE: Aisa
-font

[Profont]

How about you explain you problems with it right now instead of doubtcasting?

Seriously, what is wrong with you people? I can't be the only one not blind enough to clear Aisa.

[Profont]

Ugh, I'm an idiot. Forgot that town starts with two roles.

Unvote

Vote: Hoopla

-font

[Profont]

ABR: Outline the case against Shockwave for me.
-font

[Profont]

Let's see if I can get back into this. First off, we're VT.

Rottweiler is confirmed town, as is Aisa unless someone else claims a power role. I believe that Shockwave and Greymarble are town (still waiting on ABR for that explanation). In an ideal world, I would have us lynch our way through Hoopla, ABR and iamausername until we hit scum. Since that's probably not going to happen, I'll go through them individually tomorrow.
-font

[Profont]

Since that's probably not going to happen, I'll go through them individually tomorrow.
-font

I'm both lazy and a liar. Anyway, let's do this.

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Iamausername
That's L-1. If you guys are ready, Shockwave can hammer.

Hoopla: Fyi, Proph and I had a theoretical discussion before the game started, and agreed that if we rolled scum, we would probably go for nothing. So, I'm a little skeptical of the validity of your evaluation.

[Profont]

<I>Finally.</I>

[Profont]

Think it's time to PoE + logic the game out, I suppose.

I've been mildly skimming this thread ever since Day 1 ended but never really had a chance to pore over the thread, or look at interactions - I told font that she could have control of the hydra, and see where the IAAU lynch went.

Since the IAAU lynch didn't pan out I'll go over the thread in a bit more detail, et al, and try to narrow the scum pool down.

We're fine with being PoE lynched toDay as well - my performance in this game hasn't been exactly stellar (hydras make you lazier) but I want a chance to look over the thread, et al.

~p

[Profont]

We're fine with being PoE lynched toDay as well

why are you saying this?

..Because I've had periodic on-off moments about this game, and I accept that I'm probably going to be lynched, which is fine - don't want to survive to mylo with our slot alive, and I haven't done that much to make people seem to think I'm town.

Just ask you to hold off the hammer until I've had a chance to pore over the thread, which I admit haven't done since around Day 1 or so. Hydras make you lazy, and I'm confident that my lategame analysis should net the final scum.

Hm. Wondering if I should do my reads in two "worlds" - one in where the scum recruited MTD, and one in where they didn't.

ika
iamusername
beastcharizard
Rottweiler

Profont

Bertkerberos

Greymarble

Albert B. Rampage
Shockwave Rider

Hoopla
[/quote]

notscience
MTD

I'm town.

Bertkerberos is confirmed town, I think? From the Wisdom track.

I remember having a townread on Greymarble for.. Sakura's behavior, but I might need to reread them.

Literally haven't read any of ABR's posts. Actually need to reread Days 2/3 - I was following along but didn't keep track.

Hm.

[L-2]

Aisa

-

iamausername

,

Hoopla

,

Greymarble

, Shockwave Rider,

Profont

90% chance we win if we lynch through Hoopla and Shockwave Rider consecutively.

This is really the only wagon I can discern through vote analysis, realistically - other beastcharizard wagon had notscience and MTD on it, et al.

Have we massclaimed yet? That could help.

Currently leaning toward a Hoopla vote, at the moment (she's the only one who gives me bad feelings), but eh.

Take your time, re-read if you need to, and let's solve the game today.

~p

[Profont]

..Because I've had periodic on-off moments about this game, and I accept that I'm probably going to be lynched, which is fine - don't want to survive to mylo with our slotslot alive, and I haven't done that much to make people seem to think I'm town.

This looks like bs. There's no reason to be fine with your lynch if your town. It just makes town more likely to lose. Heck I haven't done anything to make myself look like town, but I'm not okay with being lynched. I'm a survivalistic little shit.

..Which is why I'm going to try to analyze and solve the game toDay.

I'm not advocating my own lynch, but it's fairly likely that I will be the lynch, and that's fine - I haven't gotten into this game (I don't think any of us have) and I've been super lazy when it comes to putting my own time into this game. Just let me poke people with sticks, and take a look at interactions, and try to find the last scum. Let's see if my endgame analysis here convinces you that I'm town.

Profont is town

Depressing

Will talk with llama tomorrow I promise

May I ask why?

You guys have been scintillating on our slot for a while now - everytime I post it feels like you've been townreading me, and everytime font posts you're more fine with lynching our slot.

How does everyone feel about a massclaim? There was some talk about it on Day 3 but it never took off.

[Profont]

Fair enough. Who do you think is scum?

Right now I think the best way to move the game forward is to massclaim, then figure out game state from there.

~p

[Profont]

We already mass claimed everyone is VT, Bert is confirmed town. God stop it. Say things that make sense.

Also I really don't know I want to talk to marble

OK.

Profont

Bertkerberos

Greymarble
Albert B. Rampage
Shockwave Rider
Hoopla

Lesse. If the scum didn't recruit:

MTD

- Greymarble,

beastcharizard

,

Profont

,

ika

, Hoopla, Shockwave Rider,

iamausername

This is treated as a townie wagon, for votal analysis purposes.

This effectively narrows down the last scum to.. Greymarble/Hoopla/Shockwave? Don't want to draw too many conclusions from this, considering it was deadline.

I just want to solidify my opinion on Greymarble/ABR toDay. If I'm solid on them being both town, then we just lynch through Shockwave/Hoopla and collect win. It would be cool if I solved the game Day 1, though (scumreads on notscience, MTD, and Hoopla).

Realistically, it's a PoE game - we aren't lynching Bertkerberos, and I hope that I can prove my town alignment though my analysis toDay.

That leaves Greymarble, ABR, Shockwave, and Hoopla. We just need to perform behavioral PoE on all of them to narrow down the scum.

Also since scum decided to have notscience make the kill that probably means the other scum was more scummy than him, because they would be more likely to be tracked/roleblocked. I think that makes Profont and iamausername less likely to be scum.

What does everyone think of this? Who would be "scummier" than notscience?

I want Bertkerberos to do something useful, as confirmed town.

I'm not sure that MTD would "forget" about Shockwave, as when scum do a read list the most important thing in a scum's brain is the placement of his buddies.

My gut wants to lynch Hoopla because "lol experienced player" but I like her performing causal mindset analysis, in #675. Conflicted.

I like Greymarble's string of #707 posts - looks like they're trying to solve the game.

I honestly don't think this is scummy, because it's too fucking STUPID to be scummy.

In an open setup with KNOWN three scum, two of whom are DEAD, ABR unvotes IAAU because profont's vote is "scummy", then votes for confirmed town, then votes for someone who ISN'T PROFONT.

ABR, do you have some meta of going FULL FUCKING RETARD you can link to?

I chuckled at this, but hm, probably.

ABR, why are you interested in my reread + catchup post?

And I'm caught up.

I want a second opinion about Greymarble/ABR (maybe Nacho? Has he posted or read this game?) but once we're solid on those two, we can just lynch through Hoopla/Shockwave Rider and win the game. I liked Greymarble's gamesolving posts yesterDay, and I think I agree with logic on clearing ABR.

I was going to dive through interactions but I already saw that Greymarble had already done so.

So, yeah. Just clear up Greymarble/ABR, lynch through Hoopla/Shockwave Rider, collect win.

~p

[Profont]

ABR, why are you interested in my reread + catchup post?

Or are you one of those guys who makes it clear that they're not answering questions?

[Profont]

Why were you concerned about my big catchup post, near the end of Day 3?

I would like everyone's thoughts on Profont's vote on MTD. It was at the end of a very long post. ISO him.

Profont wrote a very long post when he voted MTD.

What are everyone's thoughts on #513?

Bertkerberos, read #513 and tell me if Profont is town or scum

---

is profont a prophylaxis alt?

A hydra with me in it, yes.

~p

[Profont]

Grey is grey ice and Llamarble?

Yep.

[Profont]

Nevermind Profont. I forgot scum don`t know who traitor is.

Fair enough, I guess?

Like literally, I voted MTD because "more townreads", "already a wagon" and I PoE'd everyone else as town in that post.

I'm glad there's still a while before deadline.
We DO have 6 people alive; we should probably no lynch today or tomorrow.
Recalculation soon!

I know that someone talked about no lynching in a 12 player setup as a strategy on 'Scum, but what does this accomplish other than having Bertkerberos die?

~p

[Profont]

This game is stagnating.

llamarble and Nacho, please get out last words so we can lynch through Hoopla and Shockwave Rider successively. fontisian is thinking about Hoopla first, and I agree with her.

[Profont]

Good to go?

I'm all ready.

Greymarble and Bertkerberos are probably the two most experienced players/hydrae in this game, though, and I want their wisdom before we start placing our votes.

font and I have settled on Hoopla toDay, though. She says that Shockwave just "feels" town.

i agree with this. no point no lynching today.

i've suddenly lost motivation for this game. don't know why, but i'm happy settling on my vote for profont. he needs to be one of the lynches either today or tomorrow, so lets just get it done.

We're never going to be lynched.

~p

[Profont]

@Mod: Votal + prods?

In 24 hours without new discussion I will vote Hoopla.

~p

[Profont]

I had a dream last night that we lynched Hoopla and she flipped town.

Due to that, I'll wait for last words from Hoopla and we can lynch her.

~p

[Profont]

I still don't think Shockwave is the correct lynch for toDay.

I just want everyone's thoughts on: If Hoopla flips town, and when Bertkerberos gets killed, we enter endgame w/the following players:

Greymarble
Profont
Albert B. Rampage
Shockwave Rider

What are we going to do? Have Greymarble and ABR been thoroughly cleared by behavioral PoE?

(We probbbbably no lynch at that point?)

Unvote, vote Hoopla

Ideally her lynch ends the game, but we should plan for the worst-case scenario.

[Profont]

Hoopla -> No lynch -> intensive rereading at three player lylo seems correct, in the worst case scenario.

[Profont]

Still here, still unlynchable.

Look somewhere else.

[Profont]

Proph's sick and may be out until the deadline, which means I have to pull myself out of my apathy hole.

MTD was new, but meticulous. He wouldn't have forgotten to put a scummate in his reads wall. Shockwave is town. I don't expect to convince you guys of this, as I haven't even convinced Proph, but w/e.

I think Hoopla's fallen into her own trap. Remember this?

[ scum are more likely to overcompensate imo, because that is the nature of lying, and that is exactly what he's doing.

Hoopla's entire game has been overcompensating with her reads, and explaining the minute details behind the mentality she expects scum to have.

Normally I'd be sort of alright with being POE'd lynched (well, expect for the ego bruising parts) but it's pretty clear that once we're lynched, you guys will go after Shockwave over Hoopla which is just ... not ok. Likewise, unless I'm horribly off about Shockwave, lynching him toDay probably ends with Hoopla leading a lynch on us. Other than that, I'm a bit worried about ABR, and a large part of me wants to lynch him for just being so fucking annoying. The way he woke up in the game after both scum were lynched was weird.

Greymarble: You went from calling notscience town to likely scum. Why is it strange for Proph to call you out? I don't think the "essentially never mentioned NS" part is true at all. I pressured him at one point and Proph had him as strong scumread. Call that bussing if you like, but don't say it never happened.

So yeah, lynch Hoopla, hope ABR's town and I'm right about Shockwave, win game. Let's go.
-font

[Profont]

Is anyone OK with us no-lynching, then talking about this on Day 5, with us switching from evens to odds?

Bertkerberos is not providing any meaningful content, and deadline lynches are the worst.

[Profont]

This would suck a lot less if I felt the suspicion on us was warranted.

No lynch toMorrow and lynch Hoopla the Day after. Seriously. Don't do the stupid thing where you ignore the dead guy's reads.
-font

[Profont]

First post was Proph. I also like the idea of no lynching toDay, for obvious reasons.
-font

[Profont]

Nope, still town. Lynch Hoopla. Good luck, guys.
-font