Open 556: Fire and Ice (Over)

[4 Heads of Insanity]

Town-read on Tr1ckster.

Hello there, Pasche.

;3

Figure I should introduce myself. I am

Chrimi

and

Viomi

.

The two of us make up half of this four-headed hydra. Pleased to meet you, if we haven't already. My other two quarters should be joining us shortly, if they haven't already.

Good luck.

Have fun.

VOTE: Baezu

[4 Heads of Insanity]

Hello everyone,

I am No one.

Also Who.

I disagree with my other heads, scumread on Tr1ckster.

[4 Heads of Insanity]

vote 4 heads

If they had been reading through the thread, they would know that we were out of RVS. Mafia lazy? Also, not really sure how I am buddying.

Firstly, I am not lazy as Mafia. Mafia is the only role where I would have read thoroughly.

Secondly, what made you think that was RVS?

Also, apologies to my other heads for not discussing things first.

Scum is on Tr1ckster wagon.

Scum is definitely not on Tr1ckster wagon, no scum is stupid enough to be on D1 wagon.

I've seen some stupid people.

True.

Scum is either dumb and on Tr1ckster wagon or smart and off of it. All smart players on Tr1ckster wagon we consider town for the moment, all dumb players on Tr1ckster wagon give us a scumread.

[4 Heads of Insanity]

Actually, @ 4 heads: Was the logic in that post I refrenced earlier serious?

VOTE: 4 heads

Yes.

No.

No?

No.

Why not?

You should know better than that. It's called Reaction tests.

Oh.

What?

I just figured that you were serious, considering that mafia wouldn't want to be on a D1 lynch because it kind of screws them for the rest of the game.

Right, but you forgot about the part where it was super early D1, so we would've lost a lot of info, and any scum could've been like "Oh I was just voting for RVS."

Good point.

No, we weren't serious. We were looking for a scummy reaction. Like suddenly quick and bad unvotes. Which I think we have one or two of. Let us check.

[4 Heads of Insanity]

2) Voting "No Lynch" is allowed.

Self-votes will be ignored.

Unvotes are allowed, but are not required.

Well, at least there won't be any self-hammers. More info for town, yeah?

[4 Heads of Insanity]

I wanna vote tman, he is being vote hoppy and unvoted on the same page as my reaction test.

Right, but look at Baezu. You can't just drop a wagon for every scum that comes around, you can lynch one and then get their scumbuddy the next day.

Hmmfh. Fine.

Town-read on idk

[4 Heads of Insanity]

I hate hydras.
I think that Baezu's case on Tricks is more or less baseless assumption.
I'm not sure what to make of tman, gonna wait a bit till everyone has posted more before I start giving solid scumreads.

So, you going to make a case on me, or continue voting me just because you hate hydras?

I think he's just butthurt.

P-edit: Purple = Red + Blue... E.g. things we agree on.

[4 Heads of Insanity]

When is green showing up?

Who? I don't know. Probably later tonight. To answer Tr1ckster:

I'm Viomi.

I'm Chrimi.

Who is green.

No one is black.

[4 Heads of Insanity]

I mean, it's in my signature, I don't know how you missed it.

[4 Heads of Insanity]

The color scheme is not in your signature.

What happens when all four of you agree?

It is if you have colored signatures enabled.
And what do you mean? When all of us agree we all agree.

Although I don't think that's very likely.

Is No one a user or is no one no one?

No one is no one.

[4 Heads of Insanity]

I JUST CAN'T HANDLE THE IRONY IN THAT FUCKING POST

Settle down. VOTE: BoroPhil

[4 Heads of Insanity]

my reason remains: you were focussing on something rubbish as a reason to go after someone.

He is focusing on something rubbish as a reason to go after someone, and that rubbish reason is that Tr1ckster was focusing on something rubbish as a reason to go after someone. Except Tr1ckster's was back in RVS, which rubbish reasons are fine in.

[4 Heads of Insanity]

Honestly, Tr1ckster's riding something out for towncred of RVS is very towny in my opinion. As town it is often in me to skip RVS, which sets some players off and makes me the first wagon, starting us on good information by page 2, and then notifying the town that it is indeed a town thing to do. I don't think that's scummy at all, as it reflects my town play a lot.

BoroPhil, notice the R in RVS? The part that says RANDOM? The part where

THERE IS ALWAYS SILLY REASONS FOR VOTING PEOPLE AT THE BEGINNING OF THE GAME?

Or did you somehow fucking miss that while you had your head up your ass?

[4 Heads of Insanity]

Trickster, and Moonlight for that matter, stop trying to treat your reason(s) as an isolated RVS post, you were building a case off it, that's the difference.

Quotes, please.

[4 Heads of Insanity]

so hang on Moonlight, you are saying that you think I'm scum because of a football avatar?

Did he say he thought you were scum?

well he does appear to be voting for me?

He's voting you because you're trying to make someone look scummy for something that isn't scummy at all.

He meant I want quotes of them "trying to build a case off of it", please, not whatever THAT is.

[4 Heads of Insanity]

EBWOP: Last part was to NM

[4 Heads of Insanity]

And Trickster that doesn't change the fact that you misrepped his case

Exactly! Finally, someone is seeing the light.

Also four heads is acting scummy as fuck and veiling it as a 4 person hydra

Thanks for the accusation without quotes, examples, or really anything but your butthurt whiney ass. Really helpful for town.

Really.

THIS IS

NOT

TOWN TR1CKSTER

I don't care what anyone says

VOTE: Tr1ckster

I'm parking my vote here for the rest of the day

VOTE: Baezu

"I don't care what anyone says because I don't like listening to logic, I'm going to uselessly park my vote here without reason or a case for the rest of the day."

Can someone else say anti-town?

[4 Heads of Insanity]

THIS IS

NOT

TOWN TR1CKSTER

I don't care what anyone says

VOTE: Tr1ckster

I'm parking my vote here for the rest of the day

Have you even

seen

town!Trickster? And by town!Trickster, I mean vanilla town!Trickster.

Role claim?

@Baezu, the easy wagon has been Tr1ckster so far. Your comment only makes you look scummier.

Townread on Moonlight, Scumread on NM

[4 Heads of Insanity]

Yes! I read your game that you referenced me to where you and moon were VTs. You started that game with an RQS as well. And say what you will, PEOPLE DONT CHANGE. At least not so quickly. I've lived on this planet for 36 years and there's one thing I've learned people just don't change that quickly.

I've seen it happen many, many times.

@NM Indeed, the two of us do share a body. We are very different, however.

[4 Heads of Insanity]

My wiki is the best. Just thought if any of you wanted to meta me:
http://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=User:Chrimi

[4 Heads of Insanity]

VOTE: 4 Heads of Insanity

I rather see the hydra lynch on d1, not because they're scummy, because I don't want to deal with hydras. Period.

So you'd rather lynch hydra over scum?

That's called being a

horrible fucking player who needs to replace out if you can't handle how the game works.

Go fuck yourself too, buddy.

[4 Heads of Insanity]

"I don't like hydras so instead of doing anything useful in this game or scumhunting or

anything

, I'm just going to vote the hydra because I'm new around here."

Like seriously, all a hydra means is that: I now have four chances to fuck up, four different personalities to slip up and for you to read, and four different opinions that you can pull for a much easier way to read me as scum or town. If anything, you should

love

hydras because of it.

Tempted to policy lynch this guy because he's anti-town, and working against my wincon.

[4 Heads of Insanity]

No policy lynches.

If worst comes to worst we'll see if we can get a modkill on players who lynch people they dislike.

Still. No policy lynches. Then you become just like him.

So wrong.

Policy lynch = killing someone who is acting not necessarily scummy, but still

anti-town

. Someone who is anti-town is playing against town's wincon, and is trying to lynch townies just because "they don't like them". They can't be mod-killed, since it isn't against the rules.

I think a policy lynch is very viable on townies who insist on lynching townies. It doesn't make me "just like him" at all. It teaches him that if he continues to do such, he will be policy lynched in any game he tries that bullshit.

[4 Heads of Insanity]

Oh, the joys of head dissonance. I'm finally starting to get some reads:
Not_Mafia is town.
Tr1ckster is town.
Moonlight is town.
Yuriko is town.
Who disagrees with several of those, but Who doesn't have reads yet so he can't argue.

I don't think Zeph's suggested policy lynch makes him scum. I mean, said policy lynch would help scum, but I can't see any scum rationally suggesting it, therefore the suggestion could just as easily have come from a person of any alignment.

But look at what else he's doing.

What?

Exactly.

That doesn't make him scum.

In this case it does.

Why?

Just accept it.

VOTE: Zephyrus

[4 Heads of Insanity]

And Heads, get your vote off Zephyr or give me good reasons he's scum.

Read his posts. He's doing nothing.

[4 Heads of Insanity]

Thanks, Zeph.

@Heads

I read them. Are you on a lynch the people with no content then?

Because there are several far scummier people out there than Zeph.

It's the way in which he's doing nothing. My gut is telling me "SCUM SCUM SCUM SCUM SCUM" and I'm listening to it.

[4 Heads of Insanity]

It's the way in which he's doing nothing. My gut is telling me "SCUM SCUM SCUM SCUM SCUM" and I'm listening to it.

And it's not doing that for you on Boro or tman? What about NM?

And what do your other heads think about this?

Finally - your gut always tells you the player voting for you is scum. It's a thing that happens.

It's also doing it for tman, it's unsure about Boro. About Notmafia it's going "TOWN TOWN TOWN TOWN TOWN". Same with Yuriko.

Who sees no reason why Zeph is scum but Who doesn't know anything. Haven't spoken to the other two.

[4 Heads of Insanity]

Agreeing with Tr1ckster, our vote could go somewhere better, Who and No one.

VOTE: Tr1ckster

[4 Heads of Insanity]

I don't like the way you're telling us what to do as if you've been playing longer, Tr1ck. I'm not upset for his illegitimate vote, and I don't think No one is either. He's just voting people he doesn't like instead of scum, and hiding in the background and lurking like a scummy bastard. Step off.

Vi, voting him because he's doing something you like is ironic. Let's VOTE: Zeph instead.

Fine...

[4 Heads of Insanity]

Non onNONONO NO TOWN BLOCKS

Town blocks = Scum gets to act towny, hide with townies, push townie lynches and act like "

Well it was the town block's lynch.

" and get away with whatever the fuck they want.

HELL NO TOWNBLOCKS

[4 Heads of Insanity]

For the sake of argument, assume I'm Town when you read this post, even if you're scumreading me. I want you to see what I see.

In 141, Zeph examines the possibility of a team of me and Tricks. (If he is scum, his lack of voting there suggests distancing, and I know I'm Town.)

In 246, he defends Tricks without providing reasoning behind his read and with his next post he goes after a hydra... for being a hydra.

In 284, he wonders if Baezu is scum with Tricks, but with his next post he townreads Tricks AGAIN without reasoning.

The way I see it, Zeph is scum and his flip will say a lot about Tricks.

I like this. Hardens my townread of Moonlight. My read of Tr1cks is based on his flip. So let's get this flip, shall we?

VOTE: Zeph

[4 Heads of Insanity]

Non onNONONO NO TOWN BLOCKS

Town blocks = Scum gets to act towny, hide with townies, push townie lynches and act like "

Well it was the town block's lynch.

" and get away with whatever the fuck they want.

HELL NO TOWNBLOCKS

Ummm... maybe I have misunderstood the concept. I thought a townblock is a group of players that are townreading each other and work together, not a group of players who won't re-evaluate their townreads on each other for the rest of the game.

As an example, I hopped on the Zephyrus wagon because I was townreading Baezu and lacked a read on him, but I am fully responsible for that vote, not Baezu. My scumread on him formed from his reaction to his wagon and me noticing things I didn't like afterwards.

Suppose we lynch Zeph and he flips scum. Does that mean Baezu is clear? Nope, it just makes it very hard for me to scumread her, but the thought of being wrong about my townread on her (and every read on every player for that matter) is always in my head.

I hope that clarifies what I mean when I use that term.

Idea IS NOT what happens.

What happens, is block of players who all 'trust' eachother, agree with eachother and are subtly guided to lynch a bunch of innocent townies until late game, they're the only ones left and don't know who to lynch because the only survivors are the town block. And then it's random lynching since everyone did the same exact thing the entire game and nobody stepped out enough to be seen as scum.

It's a great idea, but absolutely

horrible

in practice. Always results in a bullshit group of players thinking they're better than everyone else and leading wagon after wagon and scum can just get away with it because them and their 'town-block' all agreed on the lynch in the first place.

It's shitty. I refuse to let a town block happen.

I will vote any members of any town block should you 'decide' for it to happen immediately.

[4 Heads of Insanity]

I don't like either of them. Regardless of Zeph flip, I think I'll be pushing for a Baezu lynch tomorrow.

P-EDIT: Oh look, Pasche's buddy showed up. That's nice.

[4 Heads of Insanity]

The counter-argument to that is that such an extreme form of attention seeking points to some manner of disorder, which brings us back to mental health, and whether we should treat a person the way they want to be treated versus how we judge they should be treated.

An interesting ethical dilemma with no right or wrong answer in my opinion, it's a matter of choice. I choose to treat them as 4 different persons and everyone should decide for themselves.

@Viomi: What is the difference between a townblock and several players townreading each other without putting "borders" and a label on it?

@Chrimi: You considered Baezu's play anti-Town. What do you make of her change of heart? Do you see scum motivation, or are you still suspecting her because of anti-Town play?

@Who and No one: Any changes in your reads?

A townblock is a block of members that think they can pronounce themselves as all town, which scum ends up hiding in, while they go around lynching everyone. A group of players that townread eachother and are more willing to understand eachother's votes and follow is fine; And in fact what happens in most games.

Still anti-town. Her change of heart reads as "Oh no, they realize how scummy this is, shit, better do a U-turn!"

And I can assure you, all four of us are real. No one and Who share a neck, and the two of us share a neck, but none of us are fake.

[4 Heads of Insanity]

Trickster they're just page 1 reads, you seem... jumpy

Jumpy would describe it well, I think. WHy is she posting if she's only read page 1? The last time I saw someone do that they were scum trying to set up a lynch on town.

Worst town player 2014: Tr1ckster.

Learn to play the game. Posting reads page by page isn't somehow scummy.

Mastin, read the damn rules and stop using spoilers.

Hm.

This may be unfair of me, but this is where I'm at.

Had mastin been any other player, I would townread them as misguided/confused town or VI. But mastin is a highly respected as an excellent mafia player, so I read her as scum right now.

Tr1ckster: How the actual FUCK does this make her scummy AT ALL?

I have a hard town-read on you just because of how bad you are at making cases. No scum would be stupid enough to try and push a lynch based off of doing page-by-page read catchup posts. Jesus.

[4 Heads of Insanity]

Here goes:
I'm vanilla town.

Accepting VI claim. I don't think scum would be dumb enough to claim

twice

, unless that previous claim was somehow supposed to be considered soft.

Tempted to vote just because your horrible logic is anti-town, and you're doing better at confusing and distracting town than actually helping us.

[4 Heads of Insanity]

Sending Llama a PM now.

[4 Heads of Insanity]

Scum, please don't NK Moonlight. Her logic is needed to get Viomi back on track.

... Shut up. VOTE: Tr1ckster

[4 Heads of Insanity]

I didn't see Mastin say "no" to a Trickster lynch?

My apologies to @Mod for using blue, will use this color from now on. ~Chrimi

[4 Heads of Insanity]

Apologies. Been working hard on school so I can pass this semester P: I'm still here though. Reading.

[4 Heads of Insanity]

Are you guys fucking kidding me?

Moon is obviously the most pro-town person here. They have done the most scumhunting, and been the most help to town.

I will actively push a lynch on every single member of that wagon if someone dares hammer.