Open 615 - Hope Plus One [Game Over: Town wins]

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

VOTE: Skybird because you're first.

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

Only a few days, lucky me.

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

VOTE: TheManWhoSoldTheWorld for having such a long name and of course for OMGUS!

Classic scum, I like my vote.

VOTE: TheManWhoSoldTheWorld (L-5)
because even the abbreviation is too hard to type. (P-edit: See?) Also, Ziggy Stardust is better.

@FRB: A few days plus 10.5 hours. (TMWSTW and I were in a game that ended Saturday night and separately /in'd for this game on Sunday.)

@Jeanne11: I assume the deadline is UTC/GMT?

I owe you a win, even if your taste in classic rock is horribly misguided.

Hello everyone, how is it going?

What is your biggest fear in life?

Good.

Stupid questions.

VOTE: Creative

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

Liking my original vote was a joke, I was making fun of her self OMGUS claim.

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

I dont see anything alignment indicative about it.

You don't see anything alignment indicative about liking a vote and then changing it? Because that implies TheMan was lying, either with his words or his actions. You don't think lying is alignment indicative?

You seem awfully eager to let him off the hook here. I know a townie would have pushed that lead until he struck gold. Could it be because you are paired with him and are unwilling to push an early bus too far?

I wasn't lying, I think it was very clearly a joke in reference to Skybird self claiming OMGUS.

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

UNVOTE: Creative

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

You are acomodating the facts to your reads, the bias is so strong you say you caught the whole team day 1 out of rvs interactions, its very deflective the way you discredit my point without adressing it, so again, wouldnt mafia also push something untill they get what they want? and how should we differentiate that from your play, if you are town.

This really doesn't merit a response.

-AreSee

VOTE: Dictator

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

My vote wasn't naked, that fact I quoted means it wasn't naked.

My point is that Dictator has locked onto scum so hard that apparently if you don't agree with him, you're scum, if you defend the person, you're scum, and if you question him about it, you're scum. He's a swirling vortex of association tells with no actual evidence, or basis.

Sadly I'm starting to wonder if he's just bad or something, because if he's scum he's getting a lot attention on himself and if he flips one of us town he can't hope to continue this lynch train he's setting up.

I don't have much thoughts on anyone else so far, except that I like Kim, Erran, and Creative.

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

Finally. The guy with the big name... From here on out, I am calling you Tom. If you don't like it, shouldn't have picked that name. So Tom, what do you think of the Benevolent hydra?

Did you read? Like you read enough to see there is something happening with me and Dictator, but not enough to see what I already said on them.

Anyway shorter version, they are either stupid scum, or SUPER stupid town. And, judging by the fact one of the stronger players we had in this game replaced out, the second they learned who was in the hydra means other people share my feelings.

I will also not respond to Tom because I will most likely forget it's directed at me. There is a list of names on all my posts that I respond to, use them.

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

I actually do admit that was a mistake, I confused him with Erran, do to similar profile pictures.

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

If you can't say about the others, why are you trying to divert my push on them? Why the fuck bother defending someone who you don't townread when they're not even close to getting lynched?

Like, absolutely it's RVS and my push is exaggerated to gather reactions. Where do you get off jumping in and crying that my shit hasn't gotten a guaranteed scum pegged.

This was 2 pages in the game, this isn't me hammering a lynch on LyLo. There's absolutely no reason for your behaviour to be caused by what you claim it is.

he simply changed his mind during posts

Why are you driven to defend him if the only counter argument you can offer is a complete and utter stretch?

Like, the reason you pressure people, news flash, is to FIGURE OUT WHAT THEY ARE THINKING WHEN THEY DO THINGS.

By trying to push against my wagon, you're best case scenario saying that you don't give a shit about TheMan's alignment and worst case scenario trying to defend a scumbuddy.

I like this post, seems really town perspective.

Spoiler:

My son is starting to cry so I can't post a whole reads list but I fill pretty confident about my vote.

VOTE: Kim

Bit of an ego boosting post this. How are you the only town agenda worth following?

Ok sweetheart. Which other town has an agenda currently worth following?

I mean, every single other player besides the other hydra has half or less of my posts and even of those posts I daresay mine are hugely more alignment indicative.

If I'm ego boosting that means I'm being honest fmpov so that should mean that I'm town. Is this correct?

Skybird, you pointed Kop out. Why? And you're remembering me from 1661, correct? Where PK insisted on pressing all my buttons to get me to scumread him then bitched that I scumread him?

There's a reason I don't like playing with PK.

I haven't seen any agenda worth following to be honest. I think the Creative link is the best course of action, right as of now.

I read through her reads, nothing in those that really holds any substance. I don't know whether that's down to everybody playing there cards close to there chest, or Creative just gave those reads, to appease the audience.

VOTE: Creative

I should never have removed that vote in the first place.

How can everyone need days of catch up when there's only four pages to read?

I posted that just shortly after 8PM gmt time, which is roughly the time I go to bed as I work during the night. I had been working all day pretty much yesterday and only got onto mafia scum scarecly. I am here now for the next few hours.

Like, cooperate with what? your shitty scum agenda?

News flash: I'm town. With the players in this game, I'm pretty sure I am the only town agenda worth following.

"coop or burn" is a horribly inappropriate response to someone that you think is scum, regardless of the circumstances.

In fact, this just became the best vote.

VOTE: Creative

Bit of an ego boosting post this. How are you the only town agenda worth following?

I hate all these, VOTE: Kop

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

I'm getting real sick of half the posts in this game being excuses for why people aren't posting.

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

Alright, I had a chat with Accountant and we're gonna

VOTE: Skybird

VOTE: TheManWhoSoldTheWorld for having such a long name and of course for OMGUS!

I found it really weird that Skybird says OMGUS with an here. Usually you OMGUS because you're irritated or scumread someone, it's not exactly a happy emotion.

I'll read the rest of your post in a second but right now, DOES NO ONE IS THIS GAME KNOW WHAT A FUCKING JOKE IS!?

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

I like the rest of the post, the last two points being the strongest. However it leaves me with a question for Dictator, is there anyone who didn't look like scum to you in RVS?

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

Why are you so mad over it?

Why are you so emotionally affected by my read on Skybird? She your scumbuddy?

that's me.

It makes me mad because people were calling em scummy for my response to that joke, which was another joke. When I pointed it out multiple times I was completely ignored. Now you've gone one step beyond and called the first even MORE obvious joke scummy, and implied it was serious.

That's my main point and frustration I guess. You can find jokes scummy, but if you read them as scummy not for the joke but for if it was a serious post then your read is OBJECTIVELY wrong, and at worst manipulative and misleading people.

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

I mean I literally just made a joke about Nirvana and I note that others have made jokes without me calling them out for it unless there's something scummy inherent.

I find your reaction bizarrely over the top.

Also, no I did not find everyone in RVS scummy. Off the top of my head, I liked EP, Kim, and the Firebringer hydra from very early on.

Just because you made jokes or let jokes go at other points still doesn't change that it is was a bad point you made on that joke. And the reason the point was bad because you took it seriously.

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

Why are you telling me it was a joke?

Is Skybird your tiny female puppet who dances on your strings?

It may have been a joke but it being a joke doesn't preclude it from containing alignment indicative comment; maybe it was a joke.

But she did give it two reasons which makes it look sorta not jokey and on top of that she's scummy in general so that makes me look harder on things that I would otherwise overlook.

Why are you so caught up on this?

Because it was a joke. Also by your own logic, and joke in this game you JUST called a joke, means that players is your puppet and you're scum.

I already made that point, but you didn't give evidence of that, you treated it like it was serious.

Point those out.

I'm not caught up, I'm responding to you. we have differing opinions on reads, and are discussing them, that's how you play the game.

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

Any joke in this game, not AND joke in this game.

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

Not your own, you called other players posts jokes. Which according to you is scummy.

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

TheMan you're blatantly whiteknighting Skybird right now. If you agreed with our last two points that would indicate that you at least think there is some reason to suspect them - and any townie in your position would be interested in looking at Skybird's reaction instead of defending someone you've just said had some scummy and inconsistent points. Unless you don't actually agree with those points, and you're just saying that to buddy with us.

- Accountant

I'm not whiteknighting, I disagree on ONE point, and yes I do find them suspicious, and yes I am waiting for their response. I can discuss this point with you while waiting.

P-EDIt

You guys calling something a joke in no way makes me disingenuous, it MAKE YOU DISINGENUOUS! Because you basically said me defending something as joke is scummy, and implied me calling jokes "jokes" is me being scummy and manipulative.

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

If you find them suspicious why do you care so much about us pressuring them based on their joke?

Why are you getting so defensive over someone you claim to scumread getting pressured on their scummy actions?

Just because I agree with some points does not mean I agree with all.

And no, I will not and should not let bad points slide no matter who says it to who.

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

Okay. I don't see how it links back to me before I got involved in the first place but okay.

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

I didn't say it did link back to you.

I say you seem concerned that it does somehow link back to you, with 187 only amplifies.

~Radiance

k I'm literally the worst at this.

Imagine if this was supposed to be a secret hydra.

Okay that's a fair point.

Anyways, now that I'm in a better mood I'll sum up. I think your last two points are good, it not only makes me suspect Skybird more but I also find Kop less suspicious. However I am waiting for their response.

I think you're treating a joke far too seriously and reading it as scum for the wrong reasons because of it. If you had stated why it was a scummy joke it would have been better. I think you saying I shouldn't care about that just because I agree on the whole is rubbish.

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

If you find them suspicious why do you care so much about us pressuring them based on their joke?

Why are you getting so defensive over someone you claim to scumread getting pressured on their scummy actions?

Just because I agree with some points does not mean I agree with all.

And no, I will not and should not let bad points slide no matter who says it to who.

It seems like significantly townier play to let the burden of defense of a point you think is bad to fall on the person you scumread. That way if their reaction is similar to yours, you might see their defense as towny. Thoughts?

I understand where you're coming from, I just don't think it always works. I think that if someone is making an objectively poor point, that shouldn't at all serve as evidence, I should express my dislike of the sentiment.

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

Honestly, I don't give a shit that you think I'm scummy. I'm town, I know I'm town, and you are proving yet again that your reads are shit.

Bravo.
Golf clap

TheMan I still need you to explain your townread on Dictator.

You know what makes me uncomfortable? How whenever Dictator pushes on people, they back off and start townreading them. It seems to me either one of two things: either scum using the townread as some kind of mitigation strategy to reduce the pressure on them, or town seeing aggressiveness as an action exclusive to town. Either way I don't fully understand how people are comfortable with Dictator, or their methods, as town. At all.

I don't remember you asking for the explanation and I thought I did explain.

His play seems to be actually focused on scum hunting, and coming from a perspective of not knowing peoples alignments. It seems to me why he keeps jumping from one scum read to another because he legitimately doesn't know player's alignments. I also previously stated that I just don't see scum playing the way he does, it draws so much attention to him, and doesn't give him much wiggle room when he starts being proven wrong.

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

@Skybird, I didn't ask you any questions, I just wanted to wait to see your response from Dictator's accusations.

@Erran, I forgot to ask when I originally responded, but can you point out where people town read Dictator to get rid of him? I remembered this question because I noticed it a lot in the last two pages, firstly I explained my town read and Dictator immediately unvoted, then Kop and Skybird had a exchange where they both didn't really say much but both agreed Dictator was town, and lastly Pignash called Kim scummy for pointlessly pointing out her thought read on Dictator when most people agree right before saying he also town reads Dictator.

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

@Erran can you please answer my question.

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

Wanderer, why did you vote Skybird over Rave Bird? You spend equal time talking about them, it to me even seems like you find Rave scummier, care to elaborate?

I don't like that when people started suspecting Kop they vanished from this game, and yes they have been on the site in the last few days, they just ignored this.

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

Okay yes, can we kill Kop please?

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

But what about Kop how is Kop not scum? Excluding my original reason to vote Kop, they vanished when from the game (not the site) when the heat turned up, suddenly returned without comment on any of that once it was pointed out, then immediately sheeped a vote without providing any actual content.

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

Because I really want Kop more than Skybird who is more null to me at this point, though I REALLY don't like the Kop wagon.

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

I do see your logic, but I also think there are a number of reasons why scum wouldn't do that, and this conversation will just become WIFOM.

Can you just tell me what you think of Kop? Like they're caught red handed actively lurking.
____________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________
I'm leaving the above in because I already wrote it, it's still content, and I do want Dictator's thoughts but after re examining the Kop wagon, it fucking sucks!

Reasons why Kop wagon sucks below.

Spoiler:

You do make some good points towards the quotes you quoted, over reading those facts, it's hard to disagree. I can go with that.

VOTE: Kim

Wow. That's scummy enough to make me think this is a bad vote.

VOTE: Kop

Bad vote.

OK, quick read through complete.
Dictator, BBmolla, TheMan are town side of null.
Creative, Kop give me scum vibes.

We need a

wagon

to get things going.
VOTE: Kop

@MOD: perhaps consider moving the deadline to Saturday, given Thanksgiving?

Bad vote. Points our we're running out of time, then casts a vote basically saying they are voting this person because they have the most votes, seems like major set up for mislynch.

VOTE: Kop

This is likely scum?

Bad vote. With worse explanation, that they player seems "forced" now continues to say nothing but Beep Boop.

Kop is bugging me lately.
VOTE: Kop

Got a good feeling that Kop is scum!

-Fire

Bad Vote.

@Dictator Read Kop posts so far and tell me he actually is trying to scumhunt, because it doesn't look like it at all.
I mean, I think Kop has tendency to play like this and i have tendency to scum read a player because they act like this, but man its hard to see him as town in some games.

-Fire


Also, activity in this game could be improved a lot.

Okay explanation but really after this long should have improved reasoning or changed vote.

UNVOTE: Kop I want to think.

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

Why is mine a bad vote? He sheeped me over a vote that was based on 3/4 posts that don't even look that bad in retrospect. Kops action in that one post is worse than all of Kim's stuff so I switched. Explain how that's a bad vote.

Yes I agree the sheep was bad, but your flip on Kop also felt disingenuous. He asked why you found Kim scummy, and you immediately linked to a post you made trying to convince people to vote Kim. So when he agrees and votes Kim, you vote him back. Like what did you want Kop to do? Agree then find his own separate reasons to vote Kim, agree then not vote, or call your reason shit?

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

Dude I don't give a shit Kop could literally scum claim and I wouldn't lynch it because I've already found scum.

Kop is clearly a scum led wagon and it's disgraceful that you don't see it considering how it originally formed.

Did you not read? I unvoted, and started grilling people on the wagon.
Also if you're so certain it's scum founded why aren't you voting Rave Bird, or me? I don't understand you!

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

Why are they legit?

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

I'm still waiting for your your case. Glass houses dave, glass houses.

Also Dictator, I ask again, why not vote me or Rave Bird if you're so certain the Kop wagon is scum founded?

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

What's not meshing with Kop's meta?

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

Wait so Dave is scum too?
And again why aren't you voting Rave Bird or myself if you think the wagon on Kop is started by scum?
VOTE: Dictator

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

Dictator is not who we are lynching today, move that vote somewhere useful Big Boss.

I would much rather go for:
VOTE: Skybird

So why is it Skybird?
Why is it not Dictator?
And why are you only voting Skybird now, when you've been voting Kop the whole game?

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

Dictator can you just answer my question already?

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

Okay thank you.
VOTE: Rave

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

Anything else?

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

Dictator is not who we are lynching today, move that vote somewhere useful Big Boss.

I would much rather go for:
VOTE: Skybird

Dictator is spewing a bunch of noise. Why wouldn't you want to lynch them?

VOTE: Skybird
Is Dictator scum or town, what is?

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

It doesn't go with pattern. Also Dictator's case was already posted.

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

Dictator's Case

Spoiler:

Alright, I had a chat with Accountant and we're gonna

VOTE: Skybird

VOTE: TheManWhoSoldTheWorld for having such a long name and of course for OMGUS!

I found it really weird that Skybird says OMGUS with an here. Usually you OMGUS because you're irritated or scumread someone, it's not exactly a happy emotion.

Hi again everyone. I'm sorry I was a bit MIA since the first page, I was out of town and supposed to be back yesterday.

I didn't think I had played with very many people in this game, but looking at the hydra's I see a few familiar names.

UNVOTE: I want to take a closer look at the last couple of pages.

I find taking the time to unvote in general incredibly scummy. The main reason to worry about your vote being down as town is because you're afraid it's leading to a lynch on someone you don't want it to. This is the middle of RVS and I find it extremely bizarre that such a thing would be done in general, leading me to suspect that Skybird is scum who doesn't want to be responsible for pushing a wagon quite yet.

Sinsun, why do you want to drive TheMan insane?

This is just a weird thing to say in general. But the big thing is her questions.

Kim, do you have experience with mafia off-site or IRL?

Note that Kim was defending me here.

P-edit - thanks Kim. Does anyone stand out to you so far?

Absolutely no follow up on that question at all, besides to ask another generic question, which at least with regards to me the answer should be known.

Why do you see Dictator as town? I'm leaning the other way on them.

Then we here hit the nail on the end. Literally the only purpose of this entire line of inquiry was to try to peel off Kim's townread on me.

So why did Skybird unvote me? Why did she approach it in such a roundabout way if that's clearly all she was interested in.

What's the point of the first question, anyway?

Also,

RC, are you seriously telling me to be quiet?

Yes RC, I do remember you from that game. I don't remember you being quite this annoying though.

There's absolutely no force behind this.

Like, "be quiet", really? Not "shut up"? Not some variant of "fuck off"? That's absolutely bizarre and I'd expect if she had as much of an issue with my play as she's claiming to that she'd react a lot more viscerally.

Then the rest of her questions are absolutely not followed up on.

Fire, what do you think of Kop?

Says nothing further about it. Note Kop is looking like a leading wagon here.

Kop, what are your thoughts on Dictator?

Then she asks the person she was ostensibly scumreading what the read on me is?

That's an absolutely bizarre change in the direction of questioning, plus all this "what's your read on X" without pushing anything doesn't come across as coming from town at all.

After that, and an argument between the two, Sky said this...

Kop, as much as I would like to scum read Dictator, I have them as town.

Them saying...

Dictator is spewing a bunch of noise. Why wouldn't you want to lynch them?

Is extremely against pattern as it basically passive aggressively accuses Dictator of being scum without doing anything about it themselves.
Dave had you read the full game?

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

What is your scum read? Or do you just not want to no lynch?

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

What is your scum read? Or do you just not want to no lynch?

That was poorly written, I'm tired.
What is your reason for voting Skybird? Or do you not want to risk a no lynch?

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

Much prefer FRB lynch today anyway. Anyone else who thinks the same wanna consolidate?

Yo

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

Like, how fucking obvious is it that with all the effort I've put in she'd have been lynched by now if she was town?

Come on. This isn't your first games people.

No, really no. At this point you still need three votes for this lynch (aka the whole mafia team) and I really doubt all mafia would toss themselves on the same mis lynch day one. So Skybird is not scum for not having been lynched yet, it doesn't mean anything. How obvious is that, come on. This isn't YOUR first game.

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

Actually that's exactly what's happening. So by your logic Wanderer-nl, Fostering Rave Bird, davesaz, and TheManWhoSoldTheWorld, is your scum team (minus one of course) and you just can't convince actual town onto this wagon.

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

So by your own logic Skybird is town and you should vote me now.

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

@Kop I think this...

Dictator is not who we are lynching today, move that vote somewhere useful Big Boss.

I would much rather go for:
VOTE: Skybird

So why is it Skybird?
Why is it not Dictator?
And why are you only voting Skybird now, when you've been voting Kop the whole game?

Counts as pointing it out. I also never got answers to these questions so thanks for reminding me.

However I must point out that this is the second time you've vanished from the game when the heat turned up, and you only returned to change your vote to the biggest not you wagon there is.

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

VOTE: RaveBird

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

Remember that time you told another player to shush because you didn't think they were being helpful or constructive? Yeah, you should shush now.

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

Firstly the only way you could know who is town and who is scum is you are scum or you're cheating.

Secondly you are entitled to your opinion on who think is scum or town, and you can argue what ever you want, that's the game. However don't think you can insult and belittle us as players to try and bully your way into getting what you want like a spoiled brat.

Thirdly I can't believe you're actually trying to dictate the PRs and asking for a mass claim like your some kind of town leading genius. Yes the general thought from players is that you're town, but people also seem agreed that you're obnoxious, wrong, and they'd rather not deal with you, not great for leading town.

Last point, wagons that have competed with the Skybird wagon can't both be scum lead as they are lead by different people. So which one is it, pick.

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

That rave bird wagon went up uncomfortably fast. But I'd rather cop check me than Dictator because dictator seems like they're wrong about things.

Considering that until the extension happened, town only had hours to get a lynch to happen. I don't think it went up too fast. Honestly it went up to slow for me, so did the Skybird wagon, it makes me feel that possibly most if not all scum currently aren't voting or on the wagons.

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

WE ARE THREE HOURS FROM DEADLINE THAT IS NOT AN OPTION. VOTE NOW.

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

VOTE: Kop

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

VOTE: Kop you're wrong, but I'm not outing people yet.

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

Also I need to check but I got an eye for BB, Rave, and Kop as a scum team.

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

Right now I am feeling Skybird and EP are scum, but I feel like I am just conf biasing myself.
Not sure on Kop though and feel like Kop is tryign to buddy me.

-Fire

Without doing a double check I have this to say, you three really helped split the vote, helping a no lynch for day one, all of you are agreed that Skybird's opening is bad when it was good. That has reasons that also point to three of your being scum together. That's all I really have now, I hope to get more on a reread.

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

UNVOTE: Kop I need time to think.

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

UNVOTE: BBMolla

I think the best course of action regarding him, is that he proves his soft claim over night. If he can't prove anything come day three, then I'd highly consider lynching him then, simply because he lied about what he said, and that there is a higher chance that he might be scum because of that.

How would he do that.

Now @Kop all the reasons you're wrong. I'm aloud to think you're scummy, and think voting you is a good idea while disliking the votes placed on you. As I pointed out, they were bad votes, however I prefer the votes placed on you today. I unvoted this time for a different reason, it has something to do with the fact I like your interaction with BB.

I did have a follow up to vote analysis hence why I went after Rave Bird at the end of day 1.

Now for why I voted you today, and unvoted you. I didn't want to out people, but since the conversation with them is going nowhere, I need to explain myself, and I'm certain one is scum, I have to. Both Skybird and BBMolla soft claimed cop. The reason I think Rave Bird, Kop, and Molla are a scum team is because they were the only people (besides Dictator or SKybird) to comment on the soft claims. Skybird also commented on BB's claim, but called him scum for it, because Skybird had already soft claimed cop, so it's a great reaction, however Kop and Rave seem to disagree and took BB's side. This instant jump to his defence, especially when it didn't make sense, is why I think you're a scum team. Being V/LA right now I still haven't had a chance to ISO, it would help if someone could for me.

So I voted you because you were the first to defend BB and call Skybird's vote scummy. I didn't vote BB because I didn't want to out Skybird, so you were the second best option.

Now I unvoted because you did eventually turn on BB, forcing him to fully claim or back down, this was a move I liked and made it extremely unlikely you are his partner.

So now why didn't you vote me?
VOTE: BBmolla

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

Agree, if cop can lynch a guilty without claiming that's even better.

TheMan trying to say that Skybird had softed also pings me. You don't point out things like that when town.

Really? Did you not see the part where I didn't have much of a choice? My whole argument against BB basically falls apart without being able to point out the soft claims.

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

I can think of no logical reason for BB to soft cop as a town person. I even asked him about it and he didn't respond much at all.

I find it to be suboptimal strategy for scum to soft cop as well. Really unlikely that bb would do such a thing as scum in my opinion

It isn't if soft claiming is scummy or not, it's that both Skybird and BB soft claimed the same role, meaning one is scum.

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

Pig, why are you voting Kop and why is it suddenly okay to put them at L-1?

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

Your wagon hasn't stopped, and I'm not even sure what you're trying to say about Molla.

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

Oh, Frozen, you've gotten into the game smoothly but I was wondering if you could share your thoughts on some more general stuff already passed. Like what did you think of the no lynch? What did you think of the NK? Who are your strongest reads, and why?

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

Pig, why are you voting Kop and why is it suddenly okay to put them at L-1?

I was on the wagon yesterday and wanted to see the flip. He seemed me immediately onto Kim scummily day 1 and he's role fishing today.

But why did you go from advising people to unvote, to putting Kop at L-1 so suddenly?

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

Wanderer, I'm lost in this game, I need to reread to get my barrings back but currently don't have time. So as of now my eyes glaze over whenever I look at this thread. When it comes to Kop the best I can say is I don't think lynching them would be a bad idea. They're flailing and just threatened which is bad on paper but in practice so far I've seen be just as likely from town. Also in keeping with yesterday I'm torn on what to think of the wagon, some people look opportunistic but I'm starting to see the argument that it's suspicious they've survived this long at all.

@Kop can you give a read list?

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

It's hours from deadline and you're trying to start another wagon instead of hammering. Sure why the fuck not, let's no lynch again!

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

I'm here though, ready to lynch if need. I'm not actively trying to lower the chances of a lynch happening.

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

VOTE: Kop

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

VOTE: Celt L-1 Do scum have a roleblocker? I'm certain they don't but people said claiming was bad for town in this set up, and I can't see how.

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

What? What the fuck? What the actual fuck?!

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

Koggz.

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

Congrats again Pig. As for this game, I'm just posting this as a prodge till Skybird gets in.

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

Um, Skybird you wanted discussion but you didn't ask us a question. Did you forget or do you just want us to state our ideas for the last scum?

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

WHY HAVE CONFIRMED SCUM IN THE GAME ARE YOU READING?!

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

@Skybird, I have an off the cuff read of the players going from towniest to scummiest coming, but first I want help deciding. Do we think the last scum bussed his partner with Mykonian, or do you think he decided to avoid it? I'm leaning he avoided it right now, but my heart hopes we can shrink the lynch pool even more.

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

Also if you don't find scum tomorrow do you guys think we should no lynch? I think so, because currently it's just a race of who gets hit in the night first. The scum trying to kill two hidden doctors before he can get Skybird VS Skybird just trying to hit one more scum. It we try lynching we risk exposing the doctors and evening the odds for the scum. Maybe I'm wrong and stupid, it's just a thought that crossed my mind, feel free to tell me off.

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

KOP IS DEAD!

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

A list from town to scum, discounting you, Mykonian, and me, because they would be pointless to include.
Frozen/Kim: I like them both, and it's a bit more than gut. Also lynched scum.
BBmolla/Smudger: Liked his intro, didn't like his soft claim but after everyone told me I was stupid I guessed it may have been a way to try and take a bullet for Skybird.
davesaz/Euclid: Not really making an impact on me, but they voted scum and their content has been fine.
Koggz/Wanderer-nl: Annoying but likely town IMHO, putting in to much effort for this scum at this point in the game.
Errantparabola: I liked them, but it's gut, and they were off the wagon.
pignash: Hasn't had any impact on me in the slightest, but their excuse for missing the last day lines up with the other game I played with them.
PhantomCobalt/Sinsun1: Most likely scum by default I guess.

Hope this helps Skybird, I know it isn't much. This also hasn't been double checked with ISO of the scum slots with these players, that would probably help, but it also sounds like a lot a work due to all the replacements so I don't know if I'll even do it.

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

I agree with Angel, let's check Koggs, BB, or Pig. Also sorry that I forgot who was cleared.

[TheManWhoSoldTheWorld]

GG guys, this game may have gone differently if Pig got to kill me like he wanted. I'm still blown away scum didn't see Skybird sooner.