Mini 630: Council of Eville: Game Ovah!

[forbiddanlight]

The only reason to be so upset is if you are in some way losing.

Well, you see, I am losing. Because if you all continue to play like this, then town will lose. I'm not sure I'm much help alive, and as I said, I came home in a bad mood. I really shouldn't have come here after that, but anyway, good luck town. You'll need it unless you pull your heads out. Especially alvinz and SC if somehow both of them are town.

[forbiddanlight]

Unvote

More to come.

I'm intrigued. You do realize the town's basically decided to kill me today. What possible revelation could have caused your brain to turn on?

[forbiddanlight]

Didn't you say you were the correct lynch today? After some attention (and votes) turned to alvinz, you decided to get all belligerent and insult us for wanting to lynch you. So are you the correct lynch or not?

I am, in a way, and I'm not, in a way. I am unless people are willing to go beyond me, which everyone has demonstrated they are. Since other cases started cropping up, etc. The way I'm not the correct lynch is because I'm town and I know it, and it's usually a bad thing to kill a town player. Basically, when I was consuming the day like some good chocolate ice cream, I was the good lynch. Since people have gone past that, I'm not.

As for goat's case...damn I'm conflicted now. I wonder if my meta read was accurate on him, but there's also the fact if I decide he's not scummy anymore because he made a case on someone that's not me, it's scummy. I have no good recourse here. I can't honestly say I'm as certain as I was of goat's scumminess, but I also can't say that without automatically garnering even more suspicion since that just makes my previous accusations obvious OMGUS. To be honest, I have to sleep on this and revisit it tomorrow.

PS, it wouldn't surprise me if it were emotionally induced OMGUS.

[forbiddanlight]

This looks like an opportunistic attempt to save your partner in a quick bandwagon right before the deadline now that there has been enough suspicion cast on some other people.

How about this? Take me to L-1. I'll help if you need. If we haven't got any better ideas by deadline I or whoever else is around will hammer. Fair nuff? I'm really interested to see where goat's going with this. Honestly, I am an INCREDIBLY easy mislynch right now, and to throw that away seems...rather counterintuitive for scum. Now, it's WIFOM in the end but my suspicions are slightly eased (and yes, this does put my previous feelings in the realm of OMGUS)

[forbiddanlight]

Actually, to me it seems like scum doesn't want to lynch one of their own, not that you are an easy mislynch

Well, that's wrong. But what have you to prove that except my word. It's beside the point though.

And, please, don't just say "I know you're scum, Rage", because that will most definitely get you lynched.

Since when does your vote count for 6?

Therefore, I don't think you are an unhelpful townie, I think you are unhelpful scum. And therefore, my two most suspicious suspects are Alvinz and Forbiddanlight. But, you know what, alvinz? I'd love it if you proved me wrong! Find something to base your suspicions on, and something to prove you're just an unhelpful townie

Not gonna make me this offer? You sadden me .

Overall, this is taken some dangerous turns. Much as I'd love to stay alive and actually lynch scum today, the deadline is going to make that difficult, especially with new cases coming up. I'm rather ambivalent on what to do. Part of me really wants to survive just because it'd be nice, and the other part of me would rather not end up with a no lynch because no one can make up their minds. So, the best for me would be someone else, hopefully scum to be lynched, but I'm not sure that will happen.

[forbiddanlight]

AND, I could have a case on veerus, so I would be scum-hunting by voting, but this day, there's no way anyone but FL is going to get lynched.

I'm tempted to take this challenge since I love proving people wrong.

Therefore, this vote on veerus would not really be progressing his lynch.

It might. I'd probably jump on it for survival and depending on my thoughts on goat's case if/when he presents it, and goat probably would too. That's halfway there. I'm sure if goat makes a convincing case, others would too. Basically, what I'm saying is there is no way to know what votes progressed to a lynch til the hammer

I have mentioned numerous times that the bulk of my case is based on your connections to FL. It's why I'm not voting you or anything. I need to be sure of FL's alignment before I see whether my case on you is much worse or much better.

I'm not sure whether I should laugh or cry when you all founder because your cases fall apart. At least you seem partially to be thinking beyond it.

[forbiddanlight]

@forbiddanlight, still not commenting on any of alvinz plays? How.. peculiar.

I thought I did? Didn't I say the tunnel vision is stupid as hell? And also that his house of cards is very fragile being based on my flip? I don't think I've been ignoring him. His cases are crap. Except it's invisible crap since they don't really exist.

[forbiddanlight]

@forbiddanlight, I forgot to mention, but you still seem to be set on the fact that the Town has decided to lynch you. If that were the case, the deadline wouldn't have been implemented and you would have be eliminated. That is not what has happened, because there are other options. And we have to put this day to use anyhow.

Sorry, part of me is still bitter since as you can see people like BridgesandBalloons are pretty sure I'm going to die and are just coasting along it seems. And I'm glad you only had to waste 3/4ths of the day before people got their act together and started looking beyond me. The problem is a lot of the people they look at are based on my flip which is going to be rather frustrating. And you can't really base any connections of me being town, so it's not like that'll further many cases :S.

[forbiddanlight]

is there any major reasons to keep this day going on? I know I personally am stuck focusing on FL, and her possible scum-partners, and I really would benefit from seeing her alignment and having a couple days to look over this game during the night.

I haven't read too carefully, but is there anything that still needs to be resolved?

And this is yet another proof of my point, Rage

page 31, alvinz and SC have a ridiculous argument.

I don't want to defend one of them, but does anyone else see what I see?

alvinz idiotic sticking to his guns, my hypocrisy, or SC's "I'm so town my death will cause people to LEARN" gambit? Oh, or SC's false dilemma?

[forbiddanlight]

Oh, weren't you going to kill yourself SC? I love how that thought went away when it looked like I could get lynched .

[forbiddanlight]

Haha, true nuff. Maybe I shouldn't have if you flip scum :p. I still say it's a slight scum tell to offer yourself up as a "sacrifice" to teach someone how to play mafia.

[forbiddanlight]

Also, if I'm alive tomorrow, then I'll be glad to defend myself against Goat's attacks on me. (regardless on if he's alive or not) I just don't really see the point of defending myself when I'm not going to be lynched.

Why are you so sure of that? And also, wouldn't it make it a bit easy for you to defend yourself if goat were to accidentally die overnight? Oh dear, there goes any case against you, and you can claim it was WIFOM that goat died. No dice. If someone hammers me I will HAUNT their ass for doing the exact same thing I did. Yes, I am that hypocritical. And obviously Rage is haunting me .

[forbiddanlight]

I am ready to end the day, but if it were my decision, I would try to give Rage some time to post his PBPA. I hope, however, that someone who is not yet voting for FL will monitor the situation and hammer before the deadline, regardless of whatever other empty threats she can conjure. A No Lynch at this point is very damaging to the town.

What if another case appears that actually lynches scum? And if it's a deadline lynch, I have less problems with that. I agree No Lynch is retarded. But I meant if someone hammers early before everything is done.

[forbiddanlight]

What is this, the Too Mafioso argument?

Wrong, it's too townie. Just phrased differently. Honestly, Sthar's defense does boil down to "OMG, hypocrisy" and seems to ignore other points. And it seems that when Goat stirred the pot the outcry for my lynch started up. If and when I die, you would be wise to take a look at who wanted me dead before goat could say anything. You'll find your mafia there.

[forbiddanlight]

How do you explain away her earlier inconsistant behavior that got her into her current predicament?

How about I explain that. Or try to. For some reason, no matter what alignment I am, I react horribly to pressure and pretty much always get lynched for it. I guess after I accepted I was being lynched I calmed down enough to think? It's rather odd. Ah well, I tried.

[forbiddanlight]

How about you let goat explain his own reasoning?

How about I do what I want, when I want, since you are far from confirmed, and much less the boss of this town. Goat can explain his reasons for switching, but I figured I'd explain my inconsistencies since I'd like to think I'm the only one who knows what I'm thinking. Do any of you claim to be mind readers? Cause if that's the case I think you'd know I'm town as well. Will any psychics please come forward to clear me?

Yeah...didn't think so.

[forbiddanlight]

Ooh ooh!

Ok, If I'm town, sthar, BaB, and alvinz are scum

If I'm scum, Goat and SC are my partners

Fair nuff?

[forbiddanlight]

No. You're essentially clearing five players without much reasoning to it.

How am I clearing anyone? If I'm scum, you can't trust a word I say, and the case of you and Goat is complete WIFOM. If I'm town, well, I guess I'm pseudoclearing you two, but actually that was more based off the obvious connections between us that were rather accidentally put there. My scum list is mostly based of people who started pushing my lynch harder when goat started having different ideas and alvinz because he's been scummy all game, but that's been exhausted.

[forbiddanlight]

forbiddanlight - (4) Goatrevolt, alvinz95, veerus, sthar8
alvinz95 - (2) StrangerCoug, forbiddanlight
BridgesAndBalloons - (1) Megatheory

With 11 alive, it takes 6 votes to lynch a player - YOU ARE IN L-1.

No we aren't.

[forbiddanlight]

I'm going to grab some dinner. I'll answer veerus/sthar later tonight.

Goat, BaB is scum in both possiblities. Is there any reason not to vote him?

[forbiddanlight]

In addition, if you are scum, as far as I'm concerned you could have decided on two mislynches you want to see.

SC, just because you might be...trusting enough to take scum at their word, does NOT mean the whole town would. These suspicions would be taken as a null tell.

Your post says absolutely nothing about your thoughts on cerebus3, Megatheory, the second incarnation of Rage, skillit, or veerus yet implies all five of are town. I don't get it.

All that was asked for was scum list based on my alignment. That's all I gave

alvinz95 I share suspicions with you on. Why BridgesAndBaloons and sthar8, though?

Explained that:

My scum list is mostly based of people who started pushing my lynch harder when goat started having different ideas

[forbiddanlight]

Scummy as hell. Even if you were town, you've shown no evidence for any of those assumptions.
I like the buddying you've been doing with goat, now that he's less suspicious of you.
I also like how I'm now one of your chief suspects, with no evidence against me, now that you think you can get away with it without being called on OMGUS yet again.

ACtually, I'm beginning to assume I'm going to be deadline lynched, and there's also the fact it's not quite OMGUS, so much as scummy as hell to be pushing hard for a hammer before Goat can attack you. And maybe I am buddying...which will amount to NOTHING when I flip town .

How is that scummy?

I dunno, maybe rushing to end the day before a player outs scum is a bad idea and anti town?

How about you cut the manipulative "victim" crap and ridiculous, immature, emotional hyperbole. It's not working.

Because it's fun being ridiculous, immature, and emotional? I mean hell, you are reacting to it in a way that's rather unbecoming and immature yourself.

There is no protown reason for this kind of behavior.

Well, maybe I'll annoy the scum so much they slip .

[forbiddanlight]

If she's town.. then I'm truly at a loss.. She has shown such a mountain of tells that if she's not scum, I would have to re-read the whole game from the start. It would make sense however that the possible scum would be the ones she attacked -- skillit and alvinz.

Well, a re read is always good. Sorry to add extra work. I suppose I fill the too scummy tell?

[forbiddanlight]

Well, I could definitely get behind a BaB lynch. Though I'd like an alvinz one as well.

Unvote, vote BaB

That's L-3.

[forbiddanlight]

That is just plain MORONIC because you're scum. Way to completely blow your cover and help my case =). Goat, stop trying to attack random people to get attention off forbiddanlight, it just makes me think harder and more assertive that you are scum with StrangerCoug. Your case against Sthar failed to pull votes off, so now you attack BaB. Also, I'm leaning towards trio of scum of the obvious.

After the game, I will look back at this statement, quote it. Then I will look back at the mod telling you how I flipped. Quote that. I will then very snidely laugh at your foolish tunnel vision and refusal to substantiate a case that DOESN'T depend on me being scum.

[forbiddanlight]

Have you also noticed I honestly don't care what you call what I say? Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar kid. And may I ask what you call your non cases?

[forbiddanlight]

I didn't really ask you if you cared. Razz Still Appealing to Emotion and just disregarding it rather than defending. And NO you don't have to say if you care or not.

Just to be contrary, I don't care. And what am I to defend? From you, um...I honestly can't think of anything you've accused me of except for some random fallacies that really don't matter at this point.

[forbiddanlight]

Alright, with 5 days left, I will state I am all for a sthar, BaB, or alvinz lynch. I also, however, realize the need for the town to lynch someone before deadline for info purposes.

I will

Unvote, Vote Forbiddanlight

and hope for the best.

[forbiddanlight]

EBWOP: I want it to be known I will hammer any of those if the occasion arises since I believe them to be scum and favor a scum lynch over a town one. So, know this and be cautioned.

[forbiddanlight]

Note to players: votes for yourself will not be counted, unless you are actually serious about wanting out of the game, at which point I will modkill you or have you replaced.

I'm serious about voting myself, but not because I want out of the game. This is a fast approaching deadline. My only move as a townie left since most of the town has decided on my lynch is indeed to self vote and hope for the best after I flip. I do not need to be modkilled since I have conditions for switching my vote. This is one of my best tatical moves since I screwed up so badly. I believe because of this my self vote should count. Despite doing it earlier when it was the incorrect move, now it is the correct move thanks to deadline.

[forbiddanlight]

is that you aren't at all using any information from "Rage 1.0" rather saying you are someone else, which leads me to wonder if you are scum. You seem to be pretending to be townie (or being scum) very hard.

He can't, actually. For all intents and purposes he

is

a different person. Using any of the information he had as "rage 1.0" would be cheating in a way.

[forbiddanlight]

I've already told you I wasn't going to respond. Its no surprise now.

FULL STOP!

We are ignoring this WHY!? Well, to be fair, not all of us are...but seriously, can ANYONE ascribe pro town motives to this!?

[forbiddanlight]

You and forbiddanlight are playing awfully similarly to each other.

Nyeh, well, I'm actually acknowledging the fact that my death will assist the town. I think alvinz will assist us more since he's more likely scum. I also phase in and out of presenting cases and woe is me behavior. How many votes is alvinz at? I am reserving immediate hammer since I do think he's scum and I know I'm town, and since anything is preferable to no lynch, but scum lynch is preferable to town lynch. So, we return to what got me in trouble in the first place. And I'd like everyone to realize that L-1 is the hammer vote this time :p.

[forbiddanlight]

EBWOP: Sorry, L-1 is hammer for sthar, BaB, and alvinz. I won't hammer someone I don't find suspect. Well, except myself but I'm already voting me and hopefully Dean will see it's still my best move.

[forbiddanlight]

I think I'm the only person voting him.

Actually, Rage is too, but that's it. BaB is a more likely play at the moment, though I'm the likliest.

[forbiddanlight]

Apparently it's going to stick that I'm no voting by voting myself. In that vein, forget what I said about hammering. Right now, I feel as if alvinz is ridiculously scummy. I'm going to

Unvote, Vote:alvinz

based on that.

[forbiddanlight]

I now expect Goatrevolt to magically say the BaB wagon is wack and vote me. Expected scum play. See? I know your plans. Forbiddanlight is now pretty clear she's scum. I'm a bit more fuzzy on Goat, until FL dies. Well it seems I'm the expected lynch. Just remember what I said, and hopefully you'll apply it.

Actually, I expect Goat to stick to his guns, or vote me before deadline comes. I dunno how he feels about you as scum though.

[forbiddanlight]

Heeey, that's true! Awesome, I made scumbuddies without even trying! Skillz right there. I'm sure gonna be lynched for playing awfully (for townie OR scum), but at least I made scumbuddies along the way .

[forbiddanlight]

Basically, i want to settle the issue of whether or not Alvinz is actually a neutral. If so, I don't have an issue lynching him, but my preferred method would be to wait it out a day and let someone vig him if we have a vig.

The way I read that post was that he is supposedly a vanilla townie but he's sick of this game and basically going to ignore any and all attacks on him, making him effectively neutral so that post game he can laugh at the town despite doing absolutely nothing to help it. I don't see where you picked up a neutral role after he claimed town in that very post.

[forbiddanlight]

I don't like how both Alvinz/Forbiddan tried to approximate my reactions

To be fair, I was countering alvinz so that you could freely take an action without alvinz being "But you only did that because I SAID you wouldn't". I'd do that for anyone if I felt someone was trying to pen them in.

[forbiddanlight]

The tide is turning in favor of an alvinz lynch. What do you expect of me if I somehow live through this day?

[forbiddanlight]

not calling us morons in your signature is a good first step

Whoops forgot about that . I should probably change that even if it does come true ^-^;

Really, you must be happy your mates got you through this. This is like 'HAHA! YOU GUYS DIDN'T GET ME!'

No, because even after you die I'll still be on the plate tomorrow unless I shape up. On the EXTREME off chance you are townie I'd rather prevent another townie death by actually playing less scumilly.

[forbiddanlight]

Theres also an EXTREME off chance that you are townie too. Really, stop exaggerating.

I'm not. You played the frustrated townie card once already. People aren't going to fall for it twice. It's just a matter of who dies first between you and me. I personally plan to live in this dichotomy because scum lynch > town lynch, even if I'm the only one who knows the latter part for sure.

[forbiddanlight]

alvinz95 is at L-1, is that correct?

L-2, actually.

[forbiddanlight]

My role will reveal EVERYTHING. Uncooperative I may be, but right I am (yoda!).

Nah, can't you tell I'm the prize lynch? You're second place. My lynch basically will shatter loads of theories and force new ones to be made...yours feels more like it will leave us with a dead scum and a lot of sighs of relief.

[forbiddanlight]

By doing this you're just planting an even larger Day 3 target spot for tomorrow after I die. Don't make the same mistake you made yesterday. You were super positive that Rage was scum (according to your tone and word choice), but you were wrong, and you again will be wrong today.

Nah, Cassandra is rarely wrong twice. I think we got it right today.

[forbiddanlight]

Vigilante's don't always shoot. I'm not saying that we have a vig, or even suggesting whatsoever that if we do have one that they should claim. All I'm saying is that if we do have one, Alvinz is a good shot, because I don't want to waste a lynch on him but people want him dead anyway.

Ah well, in the end the town has made their mistake. I honestly can't blame them, but I am a bit sour that I ended up with such a false hope that you'd actually lynch scum today.

[forbiddanlight]

Hey FL.. what are the odds of you volunteering to replace cerebus3? It's obviously not the best solution but I'm sure it's not easy to find a replacement for a 2-day, 40-page game. This way it would at least preserve a player and not force the mod to modkill him due to inactivity or whatnot.

I won't say anything either way until I flip provided I die. Anything I do say concerning it would just be taken as WIFOM.

However, provided I'm town, I will discuss the option with the mod.

I am glad you want to give me a second chance to play despite my horrible attitude.

[forbiddanlight]

What made those on the SC wagon look worse than SC?

Wow, that's ancient history. I think I answered that at the time. But it was too the effect that the wagon took place very fast and SC didn't do incredibly much to warrant it.

[forbiddanlight]

Unvote: alvinz95 since I got what I wanted. I still suspect forbiddanlight, but I'm not hammering her until everybody's ready for it.

Might as well. I'm anxious to find out who is scum, hoping GR is scum and can tell me .

[forbiddanlight]

Good nuff. Had fun. Hope you guys figure things out with my flip. Go Town and all that.

[forbiddanlight]

I'm much more suspicious of Alvinz, but a Forbiddanlight lynch gives more information than the so-called "unhelpful townie" lynch. Although, I want Alvinz to tell me if everything is quoted correctly so far, so I can continue it for tomorrow.

I was already hammered, but ok .

[forbiddanlight]

Wait, are you serious?

I attacked two of the three scum, and DROPPED THE CASES!? And I think I even threw some dirt at sthar for a little bit too.

Seriously, sorry about my bad play, but I'm still amazed that I was worse than I thought. Letting scum go like that...just UGH. I suppose I'll update my wiki with another town loss.

Well, skillit, I'm sorry I attacked you for the wrong reasons, even if I called you right. I definitely DID have a solid case on cerb and screwed up hard by not pushing it harder. I just didn't feel that I had enough leverage. And goat, I'm glad you read me as town, I'm just pissed that no one believed you with sthar.

Dean, you made a few modding mistakes, but honestly, I don't think they were too game breaking. Just remember in the future that a closed set up is a CLOSED SET UP. When titling and flavoring, you are only supposed to know as much as the town knows. Secondly, you need to establish all rules when the game starts, and not change them. I honestly feel that you disabled a town tool by not letting me self vote.

Finally, town...


WHY THE FUCK DID YOU LYNCH!? EVEN NUMBER OF PLAYERS IN LYLO=NO LYNCH! YOUR CHANCES OF VICTORY WERE HEAVILY DECREASED! Hell, you shouldn't even have CLAIMED! Should have gone for a seven person lylo and gone from there.

[forbiddanlight]

Also, no hard feelings, FL? Some of the things I said about you were entirely untrue and only meant to slander your image for the rest of the town.

I forgot whatever they were. This game was horrible for me. Honestly, this is basically a prime example why too scummy actually IS a towntell for me, lol.

[forbiddanlight]

ok jk, but MY SCUMHUNTING SKILLS FAILED ME. I was wrong. Who would have known Sthar/Electra/Skillit were scum? Now I add new skills to my repertoire such as noticing that scum protect townies usually. Apology to SC and FL if they found me as a dumbass bastard that was being cruel for no reason.

Nah, I just thought you were scum attempting to do your job and trying to fit the too scummy tell.

I'll state now that I'm one of the few that actually applies to, and I can never bring it off as town or scum to prevent my lynch, lol.

Forbiddan, to be fair you suspected almost the whole game Smile.

Yeah, but notice who I actually attempted to CASE.

FL i...i missed you.

Why? Needed another easy lynch ? Also, are you seriously that long winded as town as well? Because that inconciseness is not going to be your friend.

[forbiddanlight]

What was with quick-hammer? You could have claimed it and then just waited for a while when he was at L-1. Why didn't you do that?

I only addressed this 9 million times in thread. I wasn't lying, yanno

No it isn't.
If you act too scummy, I will still vote for you. I encourage everyone to do the same.

Oh, I agree. I don't WANT to use that as a towntell. I'm just stating that it seems to be the case for me. I'm not trying to play it. Though meta should be a shield to an extent if I can also prove myself a useful townie while seeming scummy :S. I dunno, it's a weird balance.

[forbiddanlight]

FL, why is it bad to claim with an even # of people?

It's bad to lynch, actually. But as a result, there was no point in claiming. So both apply.

Except now I realize I got it backwards after reading the article. My complaint is withdrawn. For some reason, I thought odd numbers were better for town @.@

Although, I would think you all would get more information from the one more nightkill you had left :S.