Mini 192 - Circus mafia - Game Over! Discuss?

[Stewie]

Nightfall

, I'll assume you're new. Its how I play. If you don't like it, that's fine.

You mean Rubric? Anyways, I kinda agree with the reason you voted PBug. It's good enough for day one.

Vote: pbug

[Stewie]

This is only my second game on mafiascum, but I have played several games online at boardgamegeek.com, including moderating one.

I have never seen anybody base their vote on

who posted first

.

That's not the case here either. LML did not vote PBuG because he voted first, but because he said the following:

Man, that sucks, two deaths.

Although there are reasons for complaining about deaths, one that complains about the deaths is often scum. Further, this feeling that he's trying to hard to "fit in" is amlified by what he complained about. It's a mini game, but even then there's a fairly good chance there are going to be two deaths. Three would be something to complain about, two is just something you could expect. Most people caught doing this are usually caught for complaining about the cop or doc dying.

Having said all this, once PBuG claimed I couldn't come up with an scenario in which he would be lying. Therefore I will assume that he is a mason and

unvote: PBuG

As for who to vote for now, I'm kinda suspicious of Rubric for "misinterpreting" LML's reasons to vote PBuG, but it might be an actual misentrepretation, so I will

fos: Rubric

and wait to see what he thinks about LML's reason for a vote now.

[Stewie]

I, too, need some time to think. My brain tells me it's a misunderstanding, but my gut tells me Rubric's lying.

[Stewie]

My vote is staying on Rubric for a number of reasons.

If you are a mason, I advise your partner coming out to help you. I still don't quite believe you.

So, until I hear otherwise, my vote is staying.

If he is mason, and he claims mason, which he hasn't, it would be pretty stupid for them to come out, since masons are more powerful when hidden. What I want from rubric right now is a full claim, abilities and all, next post of his or he gets my vote.

[Stewie]

Ok. What does the Clairvoyant do?

[Stewie]

Random speculation: what if the clowns are the mafia? Clowns are obviously evil .

I know you said it was a random speculation, but about 90%* of the time when someone says "random speculation" they end up knowing something.

As for Rubric... I believe that a role like the one he got is possible, specially since it would not be the first time I've seen it. I actually got the same role in a game I played last year. If anyone has any doubts, I can tell you what game it was. The role was designed so that only one role could be eliminated night one. Sometimes two roles lost can be a big loss to the town. However, as mentioned before by someone else, Rubric's role can be proven or disproven later on. Right now, let's focus on someone else. The two people I have my eyes on are Phoebus (a little timid, even for him) and LML (using the "that's how I usually play" card every other post, and being a bit paranoid, although that I can understand).



*Note: number pulled out of my ass, not actual figure.

[Stewie]

Timid? Me?

What do you want me to do, Stewie? Wrestle a tiger?

I meant you were posting less than usual. Not really a quality count, more of a quantity thing.

I find the whole conversation between PBuG and Rouge rather disturbing. I know that PBuG is most likely not scum, otherwise someone would have counter-claimed, but he seems to be trying too hard to twist what Rouge says against him. Rouge never said anything that would lead me to believe that he was SURE that there is a clown mafia, he even said that he was shooting in the dark. He never even implied that Pbug was scum, yet PBuG asks if Rouge thinks that he is scum. I'm not sure what to make of this, but I'll keep my eye focused on PBuG.

[Stewie]

I don't really think rouge did anything suspicious, he has threw in some speculation to promote discussion. I am rather skeptical, however, of all this secrecy of roles. I am willing to believe him mainly because I found no reason to think he was scum in the first place.

Escapalogist is perfectly believable too. Not all circus have one, but it's basically a guy that they put in a difficult situation, close the blinds, and the guy escapes, which leaves little to the imagination as to what he could do.

[Stewie]

I'll assume you're new, Brush.

Lynch and lose means if I, being innocent, vote on an "innocent", the scum can just pile on their votes and cast the final votes necessary.

That hasnt happened yet.

Scum aren't stupid. If two of them put on their votes, but you unvote before the third one gets back, you get two scum right there.

Has anyone else other than LML seen this mod slip?

As for you claiming last, I can't say I'm confortable letting you do that, mainly because you asked to go last. There's also the fact that there's a mod slip nobody saw but you. If Rubric is not scum, you probably are. I think it's best if you are one of the first few to claim. I think d_rouge should claim last, and second last brush, because they are both pretty clean. Other than this, I have no preferences.

[Stewie]

I'll assume you're new, Brush.

Lynch and lose means if I, being innocent, vote on an "innocent", the scum can just pile on their votes and cast the final votes necessary.

That hasnt happened yet.

Scum aren't stupid. If two of them put on their votes, but you unvote before the third one gets back, you get two scum right there.

Has anyone else other than LML seen this mod slip?

As for you claiming last, I can't say I'm confortable letting you do that, mainly because you asked to go last. There's also the fact that there's a mod slip nobody saw but you. If Rubric is not scum, you probably are. I think it's best if you are one of the first few to claim. I think d_rouge should claim last, and second last brush, because they are both pretty clean. Other than this, I have no preferences.

[Stewie]

I am the circus owner, and I can save someone from a lynch, but only once during the game.

[Stewie]

I can't save myself... it's like a doctor.

[Stewie]

What else is there to say... It seems strange that LML says that the fact that he wrote phoebus's name on the first post proves him wrong. Phoebus was a SK, and it seems kinda out of place to me to have one mason group which is normal and one mason group which is inflitrated by a sk. It would make more sense to me if they were both scum, even if one was sk and the other was mafia. I'd be pure genious, actually, because the death of one would make the other one stronger.

The two people that are clear in my mind are drouge and jereic. Drouge because he has proven that he is not lying about his role, and jereic because his role goes hand in hand with drouge's. One can escape a lynch, the other can escape a night kill.

[Stewie]

Well, what you said makes more sense that what anyone else said, but I'm not really done talking yet.

This is not correct.

Then what is your ability? I obiously missed an important post somewhere.

[Stewie]

Does anyone else think that drouge's role is way too powerful? Either that, or he's lying. However, we do know that he can survive a lynch. I think lynching him is completly out of the question today because we are in a lynch or lose situation, but he should be considered later on.

[Stewie]

Does anyone else think that drouge's role is way too powerful? Either that, or he's lying. However, we do know that he can survive a lynch. I think lynching him is completly out of the question today because we are in a lynch or lose situation, but he should be considered later on.

d_rouge, PRO-TOWN ESCAPOLOGIST, is NOT LYNCHED!

Could we please lynch this scum who's still arguing against a mod confirmed innocent?

[/quote]

Post 214:

I obiously missed an important post somewhere.

The reason I asked what I asked in post 214 is because you previously said you were cleared by the mod, and I wondered why, so I asked questions. Jesus Christ.

mepmuff: if they both target the same person, how do we know which one is lying, that is if there is someone lying.

[Stewie]

EVERYONE! WAKE UP!

Stewie and Rubric are definately scum. Here's why.

Stewie has been sitting at 2 votes for a long time. His first vote, of course, was by d_rouge, whom we KNOW IS PRO TOWN.

Since we're in a lynch and lose situation, it's simply that one wrong vote would lead to something called "a bandwagon jump"

I know this isn't a newbie game, but let me tell you.. some of the raw newbies have better mafia sense than what i'm seeing.

Simply. If Stewie was innocent, he would have been lynched already, and the game would have been over based on that. The same goes for rubric.

I'm telling you right now, the scum faction is Brushhopper, Stewie and Rubric.

Don't make stupid mistakes. Kill Stewie off, please.

That's based on crap, and I already explained why. I'll do it again:

I'm town. There are three scum around. Assuming that you are not scum, you'd say that they could just all jump on. However, you are not considering the fact that if someone puts a vote on me right now, it'll look suspicious. Scum don't ever rush a lynch unless they only need one more vote, otherwise the town will pick up and lynch them.

[Stewie]

By that logic, you are scum, and that's why you don't have enough votes.

[Stewie]

No, by my logic, since I know Rubric and you are scum, that's why I won't have enough votes. An innocent hasn't voted for me yet.

vote: LML

You don't "know" whether or not I'm scum, unless you are scum with me, or a cop. Your logic is pretty faulty, and I can prove it by saying that using the same logic, I know you are scum. Unless you get lynched really fast.

If he survives we still don't know if it's because you/Brushhopper has been lying or JereIC telling the truth.

They could also be both lying, and be on the same side while saying they aren't, or both telling the truth. The only way we would learn anything is if Jere dies, in which case he was lying, so we would be glad he's dead, and at the same time we would know that bush was telling the truth. I don't know if we should go for it to see if jere is lying and bush is telling the truth, or be a bit more carefull and not try anything at all. If Jere was mafia, I don't think he would claim something like that that could get him killed unless he had that ability anyways.

[Stewie]

Why is LML even suspect? He's claimed a mason role. Is somebody else here actually Phoebus's co-mason, and too ashamed to reveal it? Or are y'all assuming that Phoebus was a third mason with PBuG and Quailman? Or, do you think he's another serial killer?

I think it's kinda odd to have one normal mason, and one mason with a sk and a townie in there. I figure that a normal mason and a mason with a sk and a mafia member is quite possible, specially given the crap LML keeps saying.

[Stewie]

I have no time right now to make something out of this, but I will say this. We are in an almost lynch or lose situation. I will not use my ability even if I am pretty sure we are lynching the wrong person, because if I am wrong I would be decreasing the town's chances too much, even extinguishing them. If I'm right, we lose either way. If I'm wrong, then I'm better off not stopping any lynches today. I personally think that my role is kinda useless, because town don't usually want to stop a lynch. Town want to use the lynch because it's the only way they can lynch scum. Scum would want to go to night, because then they have more control.

I'm kinda changing my mind about Rubric. This is more lying than I can normally take.

[Stewie]

I still challenge Stewie to use his power to save Rubric to clear him.

Do I have to explain again why this is a stupid idea? If I'm right, it doesn't change anything, and if I'm wrong then we lose unless I don't save him. Besides, I am changing my mind about Rubric, and right now I'm most likely to put a vote on him than saving him.

Btw, there are earlier games with pro- and anti-town masons. Here's two:

Can you point out exactly where the masons are? I can't find even a normal mason.

Besides, my concern is over the fact that we have a normal mason and a mason with only one good player. The games you pointed out, although I can't find it, they probably have one mason with evil guys and good guys and no other masons which are normal.

[Stewie]

Btw, there are earlier games with pro- and anti-town masons. Here's two:

Can you point out exactly where the masons are? I can't find even a normal mason.

In Minivational 4, the Serial Killer, Cop, and Mafia Godfather were part of a mason group, and none of them were told the others' roles.

In New York City Mafia, the serial killer and a otherwise regular townie formed an investigative mason group.

But no game had a normal mason. Both games have a mason with one or more evil guys, but neither has a normal one in addition to the abnormal one, and that's what worries me about LML. Maybe the mod, to balance the game, put a mason with evil of two different groups so that they would both think that they have a partnership with a pro-town player when they are actually not. Perhaps LML wasn't even phoebus's partner, and it was someone else in the scum group, and they decided to kill phoebus to have something safe to claim, which LML took.

[Stewie]

Perhaps LML wasn't even phoebus's partner, and it was someone else in the scum group, and they decided to kill phoebus to have something safe to claim, which LML took.

This doesn't make any sense: if someone else was Phoebus partner, why wouldn't he just claim that? Why have another member of the mafia claim it? I don't see a reason for that.

Because the other person had a safe claim or had already claimed something else.

if he wasn't he would be so very dead right now since I'm a confirmed innocent and I got my vote on him since forever.

Mechanically that would work, but scum can't just come and put their votes on fast to lynch me, or they will look suspicious for it. If I were just one vote away from a lynch for a long time, then I'd understand why you would think I was scum. Furthermore, there's also the fact that the mod corrected himself. We are not in lynch or lose. If mafia fast-lynch me, and the town manages to survive the night, they are pretty much screwed.

Then, if the ringmaster can fire people, why would there be a circus owner in the first place?

One fires people, the other one stops the firing... and do we even know what the ability of firing actually was?

[Stewie]

Weird, I thought I targetted drouge tonight. With no docs, he should be dead.

[Stewie]

Clarification: That's more towards the mod, asking whether he got the choice or not, rather than to the rest of you. Just ignore me.

[Stewie]

Because I was feeling really lazy and couldn't come up with anything else.

I personally think that the town was way overpowered, specially d-rouge. Every town player was a power role, and the mafia didn't have any power roles to balance it out.

Roles please?