Mini 1685: BooneyToonz II - Looney Tunes

[massive]

I'm kinda thinking all of a sudden I shouldn't blindly accept pre-in requests.

[massive]

No response for me? Did you actually roll scum massive?

Weren't we scum together in our last game?

Can you reference who you're talking to in your posts please?

Oh between horrible pronoun use and RC's continued resistance to using the Quote button, we're all in for a fabulous confusing game.

[massive]

I'm totally disappointed in you Aneninen, that you didn't at least make the effort to find one of the Looney Tunes pigeons.

[massive]

I'm actually all for a shorter D1. I think most D1s become a horrible 100 page mess that's filled with rubbish.
I suppose the idea is to tease out some scummy rhetoric from a player (both sides want this) so a lynch can be justified.
Honestly, I think we're just as good with a roll of the dice.
Then we've got a lynch and NK analysis we can do D2.
Jump right into the nitty gritty and all that.

This is town bee tee dubs.

[massive]

massive is probably scum?

Because I didn't call you morons out for calling our neighborhood a masonry?

[massive]

There will be one scum in that neighbourhood. We should find out who it is.

That's how I felt. I figured I'd keep quiet and take the night to figure out which one of them it is but this whole game is gonna give me a migraine at some point so fuck it.

[massive]

I really hate neighborhoods, and I know they're all the fashion in Mafiascum now, but they're honestly the dumbest mechanic out there. They come out early in the game because everyone inside the neighborhood is convinced someone is scum, and then the game reduces down to "lynch inside the neighborhood." No one wants to sniff around the neighborhood and figure out if / who the scum is before just blabbing it out there. I will say the masonry thing was a nice twist, even though I'd really like to look at who was blanket-believing that horseshit since we have an Innocent Child in the game.

[massive]

My neighbourhood decided we're all going to claim.

The residents are me, DrDoLittle, and Boonskiies.

You know, it's funny, when I finished Boon's first game, I was like "Oh I probably want to avoid Boon as a player but I don't mind him as a mod" and now ... yeah.

[massive]

I don't have any problem with that. I'd certainly like to hear from both of them regarding the mason nonsense.

[massive]

I hope to high heaven that RC was being a snarky ass. Otherwise we start there because I know our neighborhood doesn't have daytalk.

[massive]

Pisskop, do you think we should stick with the idea of lynching someone from one of the neighborhoods?

[massive]

If the setup is exactly that then nobody should ever play a Boon game again.

And you still haven't mentioned why you went along with the mason claim.

[massive]

This should make your decision voting in the neighbourhood pretty easy then, no?

Woulda been nice for him to continue in this vein and NOT start the mason claim, right?

[massive]

The problem I'm immediately having wrapping my head around it is that either of them is immediately screwed if the other dies. Specifically, I guess:

I'm a fucking neighbor, drawing the nightkill is a #winning move

If you believe this, you must then have been OK with us immediately lynching Varsoon the next day when you turn out to be a liar. Which means you must think it's possible he's scum. Which means WHY GO ALONG WITH IT IN THE FIRST PLACE?

I think the only reason you go along with it, knowing you aren't masons, is if you can control the kill. Varsoon, at the very least, could actually BE a mason outside our neighborhood. You however, tied your wagon to him, creating mutually-assured destruction if one of you dies. Guess you weren't planning on one of you dying.

vote BBmolla

[massive]

massive, at least, impliesld he bit off more than he could chew here.

I what now? What does that even mean?

[massive]

unvote

My immediate issue with all of this mason nonsense is that it is based on the predisposition that one of the members of the neighborhood is scum. I still believe that, if that is the case, then BBmolla is it based on his half of the mason claim. But I'm less certain of that after 30-some pages, and the fact that there's a second neighborhood makes me even less sure. I still kinda think the fake mason claim is dumb.

I don't understand the pisskop case at all and that group of voters looks horrible to boot.

Anyone want to remind me who's in the other neighborhood so I don't have to wade back through 31 pages to find it before I wade back through 31 pages with that info in mind?

[massive]

I really hate when people counter a meta argument with "huh uh see my meta over here!" This is exactly why meta is junk. BOTH WAYS.

[massive]

Since you like meta so much, it wouldn't be hard to go look at my games and see that I'm generally quiet on Day 1. I don't have a "yammer" switch stuck in ON like some of you guys.

[massive]

You told me to replace out! What did you expect me to do, just go "YUP"?

[massive]

i eagerly await the sagely knowledge of hello kitty who has thus far been at the no-content table as massive.

Is this not the "they" in 909?

Also, I was the SK in 1645, so I'm not sure why we would have bonded.

[massive]

Do you think the case I presented on BBmolla was better or worse than the case you are currently running on Zeb?

[massive]

Yeah that. Seems at least less than "lack of participation" huh?

[massive]

Well, yeah, I was assuming BBmolla was at least a somewhat serious player, and as the third member of their neighborhood, I knew at least *I* was taking it seriously, since I knew they weren't really masons. But why wouldn't they be taken seriously? I mean, in retrospect, it's been 37 pages of yuks up to this point, but that was pretty early on. And so help me if you call RC's posting "content" I'll slap you.

[massive]

lol. So why BBM over Varsoon?

Because, as slim a chance as it was, there WAS a chance Varsoon was actually in a masonry outside of our neighborhood.

[massive]

There's the fact that he has only two scumreads, aka the two most anti-town players (and one of whom has done nothing decidedly scummy in their own right), and the fact that he's putting everyone else in the town pile to engender good feelings.

How come you don't mention that this is you? Why are you surprised at his scumreads being the two most anti-town players?

[massive]

Yeah, but none of that addresses (a) pisskop or (2) why you are one of the two most anti-town players in the game.

[massive]

Hey, what ever happened to BBmolla?

[massive]

vote Mainez

[massive]

Good morning and good grief. Reading.

[massive]

I claimed Doctor in my hood btw

You claimed it in the game thread too. (1298). No one believed you either time. Well, except Varsoon.

I'm not scum, molla, but even I could tell you were trying to bait the kill really hard.

This was not how I read your reactions in the neighbor thread. I guess it was all a show for me, since I'm such a big guppy and fell for you two's clever mason ploy.

actually nvm - why would anen choose to shoot another person in his own neighbourhood. that makes not much sense

I would agree with this statement if not for the second neighborhood. If Anen kills pisskop, then he still has an entire second neighborhood to deflect suspicion onto.

[massive]

So seriously, we can lynch Mainez tomorrow, right?

[massive]

Why are you guessing no-kill if you just thought it was Dr. D in the post right above it?

[massive]

given that bb is town massive has to be scum. And I'm town reading bb so far

I need to remember, in the future, that fake mason claims and fake doctor claims get you town read. Honestly I had never considered that before.

[massive]

given that bb is town massive has to be scum. And I'm town reading bb so far

I need to remember, in the future, that fake mason claims and fake doctor claims get you town read. Honestly I had never considered that before.

why argue that I'm scum instead of arguing that there doesn't need to be scum in the hood

?

Because I don't think you're scum. The point is how dumb the entire read is.

[massive]

I'm not here on the weekends.

If anyone in my NH is scum, it's Varsoon. BBmolla's antics were obvious, but still at least somewhat trying to figure out the NH.

Mainez D1 was totally "scum caught for the wrong reasons."

[massive]

Because Sala is scum and I'm never scum with Sala.

Here's the problem. I'm town and you and I are never the same alignment. So if you're not scum with Sala, that means you're scum with other people?

I see the counterclaim and am going back to re-read. I guess if it was obvious to BBT it should be easy for me to spot.

[massive]

The best you MIGHT be able to convince me is that Mainez has a hard-on to lynch Salamence D1, and continues to say "I think his claim is fake" without giving ANY kind of reason why she thinks that. What would have been nice if she would have voted for him D2 with her "I'll be back" post (1350) but ... it's hard to hold any part of D2 against anybody since that was a stellar storm of feces all around.

Looking at the target claims:

N1 Sala jails pisskop. This claim is what led to the shitshow, in some part. His switch from voting pisskop to Anen is the hammer, which looks pretty shitty if you really think pisskop is the scum.
N1 Mainez jails TSO. Why, if you know Salamence is lying here, do you not JK him?

N2 Salamence jails DrDoolittle. Probably the only claim that makes sense.
N2 Mainez jails Salamence. Why switch it here? If you thought TSO was town, why wouldn't you expect them to try and kill him again?

I'm OK to vote Salamence based on the hammer, mostly, but I'd like to see a vote count.

I said that at the start and you refuted it like it wasn't a valid argument and we both know it is.

It isn't a valid argument. It's anecdotal at best. Just like your Salamence argument. Neither holds any actual mathematical basis. And you throw it around whether you're scum or town.

[massive]

I did, though, miss your 313. Or, at least, when I read it, it didn't make sense to me at the time. I just looked at Mainez's ISO back there, and looked at the vote counts, and it seemed like the suspicion on Salamence faded away fairly quickly once we got back into the neighborhood fog. Afterwards, Mainez was shouting like a broken record but I wouldn't have connected it back to your post. And apparently no one else was listening to her either.

I like that Mainez stayed on Salamence all of D1 even after everyone has abandoned her. That's a point not to be overlooked.

[massive]

massive are you actually doubting my claim and asking me to explain my targets?

I'm trying to work this through logically, which I don't think is outside the realm of sanity. You may be happy with the people who are blindly jumping one way or the other, but that's not how I operate.

[massive]

There's also the fact that, in a game that already had fake mason claimers and later had a fake doctor claim, that claim-gambitting was going to be a "thing."

If you think I'm scum who bussed Sala that hard on D1 for no reason at all then you must be scum. Town cannot be that bad.

There's another reason -- if you know Salamence is going to be CC'ed. Huh.

[massive]

I don't intend to vote Mainez. I certainly wouldn't on your recommendation. I'm much more likely to vote Sala.

[massive]

The tentpole for me is whether or not Sala's D1 JK claim makes any sense. He was voting for pisskop for some portion of the day but his case on him was pretty crappy (960, basically meta) and he never pushes it after that, AT ALL. I guess if it was me, and I felt like I was going to ACTUALLY die overnight, I'd be making a lot more noise to try and lynch my scumreads. And I certainly wouldn't move to lynch the guy that my scumread is actively pushing.

And obviously now, pisskop wasn't the killer N1, and it's VERY unlikely he was the night target N1.

[massive]

Oh I meant to add

VOTE: Salamence

[massive]

What's the point of Mainez NKing night 1 if she planned to CC you D3? Alternately, what's the point of CCing you D3 if she already worked around your 2 jailkeeps?

[massive]

No. In order for any of that logic to work at all, you would have to believe Mainez seeded D1 with enough posts to be able to falsely counterclaim you AND THEN no-killed N1 to prove you actually are a jailkeeper. Exactly how many gambits do you think Mainez is working on here?

[massive]

unvote

This game is giving me a headache.

Varsoon: Why, if you're a rolecop, do you run the mason gambit D1? Ostensibly the primary reason was "to draw the kill to you." That's not really optimal PR play.

[massive]

I'm OK to hammer. If Salamence actually is a JK, there's still no way to resolve the pisskop jailkeep N1. Scum aren't going to gambit N1, especially when they can just kill an actual JK.

[massive]

There's still scum to be found elsewhere, and I really, really think massive might be it.

We have two counterclaims, your own supposed role contradicts one of them, and you want to vote outside of either of them? That was one hell of a smokescreen.

VOTE: Salamence

[massive]

Salamence: None of your defense makes sense unless you believe that Mainez is just HANDS DOWN THE WORST Mafia player on the site. Why counterclaim you after your two shots are used up? You're just a townie now, it doesn't benefit scum at all to get you off the board. Why would Mafia no-kill on night one as a gambit to get you lynched, when by the time they could do it, you'd be half-spent? Why would Mafia no-kill on night one as a gambit, when there are (evidently) plenty of townies willing to engage in anti-town behavior and get themselves mislynched?

Scum didn't no-kill N1. It's completely impractical. If they want you off the board, they kill you N1. They don't gambit. And therefore your N1 result from jailing pisskop is invalid.

FIN

[massive]

There's m gotta be better information in the D1 jailkeep to help us. If TSO isn't scum, who's most likely to kill him? Somewhat VLA through the holiday but looking for a slow time to reread D1.

[massive]

Slow weekend for everyone since it was a holiday. Not like I didn't post "likely VLA" in the thread or anything.

I'm looking back to see if I think TSO was killer or killee N1.

[massive]

TSO reads fine to me. I would have liked for him to weigh in D1 on the neighbor-mason thing (which he avoided) but he's trying to figure out his problem areas. DrDo's an obvious protect target so it makes sense for scum to target someone who's actually trying to decode the game rather than posture.

And I just don't see any reason scum DON'T send Salamence out N1 to do the kill. He's unlikely to be blocked, he has potential answers if he's tracked.

[massive]

That's all I got on TSO. I'm currently thinking about my neighborhood. Do you want constant status updates?

[massive]

BBT, why massive? I mean, besides him being the odd man out in my neighborhood.

I am definitely the odd man out in our neighborhood. I am, for example, the only one who hasn't tried a horrible gambit or tagged along with a horrible gambit, hasn't tried to fake asking the other neighbors for targetting assistance for non-existent PRs, and hasn't offered to put even more unbelievable lies into the neighborhood. Neither of you are treating anyone in the neighborhood like townreads, despite your proclamations in the game thread that we could all be town.

Because he is coasting by, giving very little content, expressing very little opinion and generally going about the game making as little noise as he possibly can.

As someone who has played with me as both alignments, you should know that this is not alignment indicative. In fact, the only time I take any kind of leading role early in games is when I'm an SK. But I think you already know that and are hoping that no one else here does.

Massive feels like he's been playing on eggshells. The early townread on me, reluctance to push me over all my shenanigans (he's in my 'hood, he could probably deduce the mason claim was rubbish despite him saying otherwise), etc. all builds to an ethos I don't really understand.

It's neighbor paranoia. If it's just our neighborhood? Then it's likely BBmolla is the scum, with tagging along with your mason claim blindly and then trying his own reverse gambit after being called on it. With the second neighborhood? I don't know. With the second neighborhood confirmed town? I really don't know.

But for the record: I haven't needed to push anything with our neighborhood. D2 happened in a blink and D3 I had plenty to figure out with Sala v. Mainez.

The real question is, how many ignored gambits does it take before scum can feel confident that their next gambit will also be ignored? Scum have already shown that they aren't going to succumb to "gambits trying to draw the kill"; they ignored both you and BBmolla (who fakeclaimed doctor even!) to try and kill TSO N1. Varsoon's gambit N3 wasn't to try and draw the nightkill because any lynch proves it was fake. I practically had to stop BBmolla from claiming in the neighborhood to prevent him from "testing" Varsoon's fake PR. Varsoon's gambit was followed by him immediately voting Mainez -- so the answer HAS to be Varsoon was trying to save Salamence, figuring that (a) if town lynched Mainez, he still had Salamence as confscum to lynch D4 and (b) if town lynched Sala, he could shout about how he was trying to draw the nightkill and hope that the town would just ignore the boy who cried wolf one more time.

So yeah.

VOTE: Varsoon

[massive]

Are you implying I am scum in this post?

I am implying you have an agenda. I think you're working overtime to find scum motivation in my perceived lack of actions, instead of analysing the HUGE amount of data points you have on the other players. Not sure why. In the past you have said that you find me hard to read, so this could just be you trying to get more information on me, but you definitely have an agenda.

Stay first-level.

I'm gonna add that to my sig.

[massive]

If you disagree with my assertions, can you show me why I'm wrong?

I don't disagree with your assertions. I disagree with your conclusion.

[massive]

Really? Because I just accused your actions in this game as being scum motivated and you attributed them to your play-style, that looks like a disagreement to me.

My actions, I assume, being:

Because he is coasting by, giving very little content, expressing very little opinion and generally going about the game making as little noise as he possibly can.

I can't disagree with providing little content, I can't disagree with not making noise, and you know it. Asking me to "disagree with your assertions" is something you know I can't do, so you ask me to do it so you can leap out of the cake and go "AHA!" and point another finger at me. And now you're ignoring my response (again).

[massive]

I don't disagree with your assertions. I disagree with your conclusion.

[massive]

Varsoon

: Since you did pretty much exactly this thing yesterday with Mainez / Salamence, why

wasn't

your first reaction "oh it's a gambit"?

[massive]

massive, same applies. They'll push your mislynch eventually.

I feel WAY better about Varsoon, having played with BBT-scum plenty before. BBT-scum is content to let me read him on my own time and doesn't push the issue; BBT here is trying to push the issue and the confrontationality of it feels more town.

In order for me to vote BBT, you have to convince me that BBT-scum figures out Mainez is going to counterclaim Salamence at Some Point In Time, and immediately starts bussing him D1 to set up eventual town cred. That seems an awfully subtle play for BBT.

But I'll re-read once I get through the rest of todays' updates.

[massive]

It's a closed setup and your scum partner is claiming something they are not. Massive aside, this assumes that your partner will never be hit by a rolecop, cop, tracker, etc. There are so many roles that could've shut Salamence's claim down. If anything, the goal of Sala's claim was to draw out another PR claim and trade Sala's worthless goon-ass for a strong town PR. Like, y'know, sort of what actually happened. In that case, busing from early on is likely to happen.

The goal of Sala's claim was to save his bacon. And I feel like any smart scum would at least give it half a chance of working, and not immediately slam it:

Yeah so Im a 2-shot Jailkeeper.

2-Shot Jailkeeper sounds pretty fake tbh.

How exactly is this helping to out a town PR? 2 posts (with Sala again in between), 1 minute between posts.

[massive]

In fact, given the short breadth between those posts, it's hard not to see it as some sort of co-ordinated bussing ploy.

And when exactly did they co-ordinate this?

[massive]

I also feel like someone thinks/knows you're fake-claiming but doesn't want to come forward.

Puts it all in Mainez's hands to essentially CC Salamence. Then bails.

By the time BBT comes back, the neighborhoods have broken loose and he completely forgets about Mainez / Salamence, and instead focuses on the hoods. And actually DEFENDS Sala in 438. That's a hell of a 180 if you really believe Mainez is soft-CCing Sala.

The I Told You So is a little heavy-handed and ties him to Mainez (1655-1658) when in actuality he did nothing to try and go back to the Salamence lynch.

Which brings me all the way back around to 1755.

All right.

VOTE: BBT

[massive]

massive is coming and going just posting enough to get by without being suspected.

Some day remind me to discuss this with you. I think it's a product of being from a different era of Mafiascum. Back when I first started back here, minis rarely went over 20 pages, and even normal-sized games were lucky to approach 50 pages. I've never been the "back-and-forth banter" type like you are, I've never been the type to have fourteen-posts-in-a-row explosions. You and I have played a lot together, and my general level of activity is pretty consistent. I have about 1/3d-1/4th the number of posts you do, ha. You saw this level of activity in Guardians of the Galaxy from me as town, you saw roughly the same in English Premier League from me as scum. So I'm curious why you think it's alignment-indicative.

[massive]

Interesting. That wasn't your earlier argument in 2119.

[massive]

Umm, still no reasons given for why I'm scum.

So I guess this is all fluff?

I also feel like someone thinks/knows you're fake-claiming but doesn't want to come forward.

Puts it all in Mainez's hands to essentially CC Salamence. Then bails.

By the time BBT comes back, the neighborhoods have broken loose and he completely forgets about Mainez / Salamence, and instead focuses on the hoods. And actually DEFENDS Sala in 438. That's a hell of a 180 if you really believe Mainez is soft-CCing Sala.

The I Told You So is a little heavy-handed and ties him to Mainez (1655-1658) when in actuality he did nothing to try and go back to the Salamence lynch.

Which brings me all the way back around to 1755.

[massive]

I'm on my phone but I bet my interaction with DrDoolittle looks the same. I bet were also scum together! When you criticize someone for underposting, using "he didn't mention Sala at ALL" as your next argument is absurd.

[massive]

am i reading this wrong? but i feel like the whole fucking case on epm and bbt is that the sala wagon got big too fast and they were on it

BBT was never on the first iteration of the Sala wagon (threatening to hammer but retreating after the claim) so ... yeah, you are reading this wrong.

Also, people should note that massive completely avoided commenting on the Sala wagon when he was at L-1 and being pushed.

Looking at my ISO, yeah, I did avoid commenting on it, because I was busy blowing the neighborhood thing open. My ISO shows 152 and then 314 as my next post, so it couldn't possibly be because you guys had run Sala up, forced his claim, and then all started to unvote by then, now, could it? I had bigger fish to fry at that moment in time, excuse me. And I'm sure you'll say "you had plenty of opportunities to comment and just avoided it" since that seems to be your overarching argument against me: That I'm not playing often enough to be town.

[massive]

BBT, I don't know what made you change your mind from Salamence being scum D1 to pursuing other targets. You declare intent to hammer, then you call his claim fake, and then suddenly decide you want to lynch in the neighborhood, call Varsoon's Salamence vote bad and in general take a completely different direction to what you were doing earlier and nothing at that point is clear to me.

THANK YOU. This is exactly what I said in 2299.

[massive]

BBT, I don't know what made you change your mind from Salamence being scum D1 to pursuing other targets. You declare intent to hammer, then you call his claim fake, and then suddenly decide you want to lynch in the neighborhood, call Varsoon's Salamence vote bad and in general take a completely different direction to what you were doing earlier and nothing at that point is clear to me.

I don't either.

My play this game has been really erratic and it's purely down to playing too many games - when this started I had 10 games running at the same time and I just got overwhelmed.

That's an interesting response. When I said it, you yawned and called me scum. I guess you really can't do that with the IC.

[massive]

Massive has done the least to make me think he's town.

If you're going to read the whole game, read the whole game, don't punk out at page 33.

[massive]

Massive, does it not bother you how set I am that the scumteam is you and BBT?

I honestly haven't been paying much attention to you. And you have a tendency to always present your opinions as "set in stone" despite the fact that they are as malleable as everyone else's. But I don't think you're the nightkill -- it was fine to leave DrDo around while he wasn't doing anything, but now you have Pegasus in that slot actually being functional.

[massive]

Welp, that's what I figured.
I claimed Cop in my 'hood with an inno on Mainez and was talking about copping one of the other folks in the hood.
I don't think the kill came from in-hood, but it probably could've come from massive, just to fuck with me like that.
Anyway, Let's lynch someone and be done with?

I will never believe another word you say after this game. I learned that early on and will apply it to every game from now on. How you have avoided Lynch All Liars in this game is maddening. Oh and by the way, you might want to make your fakeclaims more believable in the future -- claiming you had an inno on Mainez from N2 and that's what led you to your "gambit" D3 is outright laughable. What cop tries to swerve a lynch onto their innos? In fact, I should instead thank you for reminding me about how you tried to save Salamence D3 from a counterclaim with this fake-claim nonsense.

I find it incredibly hard to believe that Varsoon could say, within 2 minutes "We should lynch player A, I want to lynch player B, aside from that player C is a great vote, player D can work either maybe!", but it's not impossible, especially with this game.

I don't either. The question isn't "would he say it" but "is it alignment indicative"?

[massive]

I need to re-read RC and EPM. They seem like white noise generators to me. I'm very unlikely to vote TSO.

[massive]

So .. you ARE a rolecop with an agreeing result on Salamence's role claim? oh, OK.

VOTE: Varsoon

[massive]

OK thanks for playing!

[massive]

You can't feed me fake claims every night and then complain that I'm not willing to play along with you. I offered you a chance last night at talking to me about EPM and you said, and I paraphrase here, "You can go read my ISO." And when I did and asked more questions, instead I got a fake cop claim. So no, you do not get to bellyache about people not working with you. You had your chances and you punted it.

[massive]

See--just like I said. You're just gonna cross your arms and be all "EH FUCK YOU VARSOON! EAAAACH"

I can't believe you're actually trying to argue against this reaction. Did you not pull this shit in other games with sensible people?

My vote does not change, regardless of circumstance.

Talk to me about yesterday's Varsoon as compared to today's Varsoon. Specifically, if this is still the only pairing you see Varsoon as part of:

EPM/Varsoon

why you won't consider swapping to EPM.

[massive]

unvote

I keep getting sidetracked when I start ISOing EPM / RC, mainly because of the neighborhood stuff on D1. I want to have a think about Varsoon and his "gambits."

[massive]

I wanted to reread EPM and RC and every time I started, I got to the part where Varsoon mason-claims and then the neighborhoods come out, and I get distracted, mainly because I keep thinking about Varsoon and his mason claim. So I figured I was better off looking at Varsoon and trying to figure out if his actions made sense from one alignment or the other.

----

Why does scum-Varsoon fakeclaim mason blindly? Well why not, it's not like anything bad can happen to him. But why? What's he hoping to gain immediately at that time? It comes when RC states he's trying to "sort [Varsoon]'s alignment" and serves to fend RC off. It also comes right after a vote for Sala (in a string of votes for Sala) that no one seems interested in justifying. (The way RC and Varsoon vote together onto Sala and then Varsoon fakes the mason claim to put RC off ... they aren't scum together.)

Why does town-Varsoon fakeclaim mason blindly? He claims it's to draw the nightkill. With an IC already announced, it seems unlikely that Varsoon immediately jumps to the top of the scum target list. If you put in context of trying to swerve RC's attention -- is there a town reason to do this?

----

Why does scum-Varsoon fakeclaim rolecop? Obvious answer is "to save Sala and get Mainez lynched" but ... assume he gets that outcome. Sala gets lynched D4 (8p) and Varsoon then has to actually fight to survive D5 (6p). Best play then, I guess, is to seed reasons for being wrong (which he does in 1910), but he needs to be very careful about reading the room and NOT getting too much attention, especially when it looks like Sala is the lynch and not Mainez. (He does that too, bailing to vote Sala despite his own "results" in 1921 and promising to "recheck Mainez" in 1927.)

Why does town-Varsoon fakeclaim rolecop? I have no earthly idea. His argument is still "trying to draw the kill" and yet there's still an IC out there. (Not to mention that, with Sala lynched, Mainez is the obvious kill that night.)

----

Why does scum-Varsoon fakeclaim even-night cop in the neighborhood? Molla is arguably townreading him and I make it clear to him in the neighborhood that I'm not buying any of his dumb fakeclaims any more. How is a third fakeclaim going to help him here? Especially if he intends to kill Molla that night anyways? I actually think he screwed the pooch here -- Molla's been biting on his fakeclaims all game, but when Molla reacts to Varsoon's claimed N4 action (to cop Molla) with "just cop EPM and 1v1 him" I think he realized he might have weakened Molla's townread on him. It obviously doesn't matter how I react, since I've been reacting the same all game.

Why does town-Varsoon fakeclaim even-night cop in the neighborhood? If it's "to draw the nightkill," why does he tie his N2 result (Mainez, inno) back to the D3 fakeclaim and horror show? Why make it obviously fake and push the "oh no I shouldn't have said anything in this chat" aspect of it? Molla's going to townread him and I'm going to think his claims are bull. This one isn't going to change either of our minds. And if Varsoon thinks one of is scum, then this certainly isn't making it any MORE likely that he actually has a PR.

[massive]

There I got that off my chest and hopefully won't be distracted when I try and re-read EPM / RC tonight.

[massive]

Don't ever use fucking neighborhoods again. They are a blight on scum-manity.

PS BBT was right, I really hate being scum and I can't imagine how obvious it must be to anyone who's played as many games together as he and I have.

[massive]

I was just trying to be serious over all. Consistency was about the only weapon I could have rolled out this game.