MINI 1688 — BEES!!! — game over

[EspeciallyTheLies]

JESUS FUCK MARQUIS YOU SO LOUD.

hi i'm ETL. I'm replacing UT. i know nothing about the setup or what's happened. i dont even know how many players there are.

how about somebody yell some shit at me and i'll take it from there?

[EspeciallyTheLies]

@ETL:

do this too:

@Tere:

- ISO frogger to read his Bella/Tammy case

- ISO Tammy to read her Glork case

- ISO RC to read his UT case

what do you want me to do?

i thought these would be fun questions. they are not. they involve reading things out of context for a part of the game i wasn't in and therefore setting me up for failure.

do you like doing that GC? you like to see me fail?

[EspeciallyTheLies]

Oook. look. I really want to be useful here. That will require a rundown of what's going on. I need information.

What major events happened D1? Any notable wagons? Can one of you give me a reliable synopsis? Who died, what happened, any claims made? Any results claimed?

Give me info. Help me get rolling.

pedit: Unfortunately, RC, I am not scum. I'm a Penis Master 5000.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

aka vanilla townie.

Now. Info. Please.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

@ETL:

yeah, I'm a pretty big proponent of setting folks up to fail, ya caught me

I was just telling you which players' ISOs contained the cases on the most talked about D2 lynch candidates (Tammy, Glork, and UT). Since, ya know, there's only 24 hours left in today.

Well that's just fucked. Ok. I will take a look at those. I can tell you right now that any case made on me is either extremely confbiased or made by scum. Look at that person. I am town.

Second, I will look at the others.

Third,

Marquis

, a deadline extension please. 48 hours?

[EspeciallyTheLies]

Well I mean, what stood out to you on D1, GC? I'm sure it will be different for everyone. Aren't there any major events that a replacing player should know?

[EspeciallyTheLies]

I work really well with interaction, and only half as well peering through ISOs. I definitely plan to do that but I would like to get a focus first. GC, since you're here, what do you have against giving me your version of events?

[EspeciallyTheLies]

ETL, are you town? I am town

I am super duper town! I already claimed VT on the last page.

That's how I know that RC's case is already either bullshit or confbias. That's why I know I don't need to bother reading UT's ISO. That's why I'm super confident that given an extension, I can find scum TODAY.

p-edit: HI TAMMY. I'VE GOT MY EYE ON YOU AFTER THAT FAERY GAME!

[EspeciallyTheLies]

@ETL:

I don't really have anything against you. I inthread masoned myself with UT because I can't read UT for shit and I figured if UT was scum it would mean I would stay alive longer.

RC replaced Shaddox, who I originally suspected but those feelings died down + TTH told me to get over my bad Shadox suspicions = RC is a town read. RC is a Really Good Player and he made a good case against UT. Prit Tee Compelling.

Well I mean, what stood out to you on D1, GC? I'm sure it will be different for everyone. Aren't there any major events that a replacing player should know?

One big thing for me was that Glork suspected <Kay, Bella/Tammy, Shaddox>, got distracted by BiBob making a Glork-case, voted BiBob to lynch (with help, obv, including from me), but then started D2 with a vote on a player outside of his scum pool.

Another big thing for me is that TTH was town, appears to have been killed as a random PR search and/or because she was onto something, and suspected Glork, Bella/Tammy, and Bulge. That doesn't make them scum, but I credit TTH for being good at the game.

Hm.. ok. I think we need to go back to looking at RC. No offense TTH, love, but you haven't got it just yet. I'll ISO him first.

I take it BiBob flipped town D1 lynch, then yes? Hm. What do we think about Glork?

MARKWEE 48 HOURS EXTENSION PRETTY PLEASE

[EspeciallyTheLies]

GC why did you decide to ITT mason with UT? Is it just like, well, I'm just going to assume he's town until someone yells at me so I can focus on other people?

p-edit: Oh ok. What do you think of Tammy? If she says he's scum, I kind of really really want to sheep that.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

^^^ You'll note that I find Tammy's Glork case hard to actually buy into because it requires being able to distinguish between scumhunting that is genuine and scumhunting that is only made to look genuine, and frankly that's some BS fine line distinctions that escape me.

The best thing against Tammy is not Tammy but her prior slot's occupant Bella who had a habit of (twice or three times, I forget which) not affirmatively acting until someone called her out for failing to act. It isn't a thing from whence great cases are made, but seriously IDK.

The thing about Tammy is this: she's an emotional player, and as such, she can feel the subtleties of a player's tone more easily than people who work better analyzing words. Like me, she's a lot of gut, and meta is a glorious thing for her. So this thing about Glork feels really good for today. At least for the time being. Let me catch the VC and go through some quick ISOs tonight. and hopefully mod agrees to extension to give me some time for that.

p-edit: RC whatever you said about my slot is bullshit. If you are town, reexamine and give me your thoughts.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

Also F you I am not a non-factor, as you will quickly see.

p-edit: Ok.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

I saw that RC liked his posts and points,

What do you think about RC/Glork team?

[EspeciallyTheLies]

If you are town, reexamine and give me your thoughts.

What is there to reexamine? I've got a strong scumread on your slot, that's not something that's just going to up and change. I'd say it could evolve over time as I see how you scumhunt and react to wagons/other players, but we both know there's no time for that.

Lucky for you, however, I do have other scumreads. lalala, for example, would be a player I would be content to lynch today.

That said, I do not want to lynch Glork. I don't really want to lynch Tammy, either. I don't know if either of these players could sell me on those wagons today.

Do you not know how to reevaluate reads? I'm telling you right now that you are incredibly wrong. I don't care what your scumread is based on. It's incorrect. Plain and simple.

Now, if you decide to reevaluate the information that you have - which is more than I have since you've been here and playing the game - and find that you still feel the same way, then fine. But at least take the time to do that. Fit me into your little reads as town and see what changes based on the reactions you have already witnessed. If nothing changes and you still think I'm scum, then so be it.

You'd still be wrong, but at least you'd be wrong after some research.

p-edit:

MARQUIS. PLEASE.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

address RC's case.

This would be an exercise in futility. It's based on the actions of UT, which I can't explain because I'm not him, and I already know the case is bad because I know I'm town. I would much rather sort him out and figure out his motivations here and whether or not the scumread is genuine or fabricated.

In any case, I do need to leave work soon, and it would be nice to hear from some other people before that happens and

beg marquis to give me some more time again.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

RC, you don't understand at all what I'm asking you to do. It certainly isn't "just take my word for it".

Mafia is a puzzle. Treat it as one. You have a set of reads based on things you have seen/observed. I am saying, "try out this piece this way and see how it looks." If you don't like it, then you don't like it and you can go back to rallying for my lynch. But at least try; consider that I have information about my role you don't, and perhaps I am telling you the truth. There is nothing stopping you from continuing on your previous path if it doesn't work for you.

But. At least. Try it out. Because I personally know that you are wrong, and I cannot change your mind. The only thing I can do is convince you to look at your own evidence in a different light.

I do not have enough information right now to "make a case" for someone else. I will be spending the rest of this day relying heavily on information provided by other players, including you. To expect me to be able to convince you to lynch someone else based on a case I come up with in 24 hours is unreasonable and doomed to failure. It's not good. Don't ask me to provide something that will be disgusting and dirty and full of problems. I wont do it. I'm sorry.

If I die tonight, what I will leave in my ISO should be concrete conclusions with a thread to where they came from. Not some forced case on someone because you asked me to.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

lalala/KayP both saying they liked my case and voting with me

This is problematic and something that should be looked at.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

I need a VC, but consider be voting for glork at the moment.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

HI GLORK. Forget Tammy for a second.

Where do you stand on the rest of the players and why?

[EspeciallyTheLies]

Bicephalous Bob, Town Odd-Night Role Cop, was lynched on Day 1.
TellTaleHeart, Town Backup Innocent Child, was killed on Night 1.

what... the... wtf is this game

[EspeciallyTheLies]

I'm not "too lazy". I'm just doing the best I can knowing the limited time I have. I can read the game more in-depth over the night, but I'd like to get some solid observations into the thread before that happens in case I die.

Can you elaborate a little bit on your Fro99er townread?

[EspeciallyTheLies]

Can you elaborate a little bit on your Fro99er townread?

No need to quote things, just give me the off-the-top-of-your-head impressions of why you feel so strongly that he is town.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

So your fro99er read is solely based on your experience with him IRL?

[EspeciallyTheLies]

Can you elaborate a little bit on your Fro99er townread?

No need to quote things, just give me the off-the-top-of-your-head impressions of why you feel so strongly that he is town.

His approach to D1 (seeking meta to get a baseline and then going from there) is consistent with what I've experienced with him F2F. He's new enough at mafia in general to use that same approach in forum games. Is arguments have come from generally sound/reasonable place.

Hm. I think it's a bit weird to look for meta as a newbie. What arguments in particular come to mind as sound and reasonable?

[EspeciallyTheLies]

i dont know anything about bulge. UNVOTE:

i'm going through VCs and looking at the vote posts and reasoning behind the votes. however, i gotta go rightn ow so i will post it later.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

actually Layla I have been waiting for you!! give me your thoughtses

[EspeciallyTheLies]

Omfg. Ok. I need to start PoE.

I feel kind of good about Tammy, I think... I need to reread her ISO from that faery game where she whooped me, but I definitely remember her feeling more hands off there than here. Tere's null. I'm pretty sure Fro99er is scum. I was warming up to Glork and beginning to believe Tammy's wrong about him; glad to see a familiar face replace the slot -

hi ms!

GC is nullish; feels town but really superficially. KayP is null. SK is null. Lala... null but there are feelings there, whereas there are no feelings re: KayP, SK or Tere. Meaning I have thoughts about the slot I just cant decide what they mean. RC is... I don't know. The indignation at Bulge seemed genuine, but it could just be build up frustration - I know I've taken the same rant as scum (at notscience several times) and it's always read as towny, so I'm more inclined to disregard it and say that he's nullscum with more scum than null. Bulge/NM is a good candidate for PoE scum.

Too much null. I need more interaction. Replacing at deadline sucks.

Alright.. new posts.

ducks is a splendid town player

she is underperforming

Yes. Bingo. You put into words my exact issue with her right now.

pedit: thanks but no I'm not a splendid town player

really

am not, ask everyone

You know you can't pass this by ME, right?

Ok. KayP. His posts are full of words but none of it is relevant or useful. Lots of commentary

around

the gamestate but no conclusions. Lots of unrelated statements. "I couldn't understand the vote count. Didn't you do this thing? I forget this other thing. I can't get a read. I'm posting from work." It's all kind of BS.

MS take a look at KayP ISO.

Hi ChaosOmega. I only remember you briefly from one game, was it maybe "there is no cop"? or something else?

*sigh* replacements.

Ok, so here's where I'm at:

Town {MS, Tammy}
Null town {Tere/CO, GC?}
Null {NM, Skrew}
Null scum {lalaladucks, RC}
Scum {KayP, fro99er}

Egh. I don't really feel great about this list. Gonna go read some ISOs.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

my issue with fro99er began when i was trying to sort out the wagons and how the votes happened. his vote posts are all particularly.. not good. especially his vote on BiBob. glork (your predecessor) said he had F2F experience with him, and believed that his arguments were sound/reasonable, and i asked which ones but i dont think he answered before getting into it with tammy again and replacing out.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

glork is like frog's brother right?

if that is the case then i'd trust his read over anything else. i mean. yeah. unless, like, frog can fool his bro. i will need to check if this caveat has ever been mentioned

thanks for highlighting this.

i'll look at kayp... later.

yeah this is pretty much the only reason i'm not voting him right now. when i first replaced in yesterday afternoon, i wanted to sheep tammy onto glork but after talking with him, i felt less inclined to do so. my read on your slot is definitely stronger than my read on tammy but i do feel good about her. the thing is that they seem to have a lot of meta/familiarity with each other, so maybe one is right and one is scum? or maybe they know each other so well they are misreading each other? i dont know which is more likely. i really should re-read their interaction, it was just so many words and a lot of it was regarding circumstances i'm not yet familiar with (i have not read the game page to page - just ISOs).

[EspeciallyTheLies]

You know you can't pass this by ME, right?

you want to share this story?

i modded her first newbie game where she called out the scum team correctly and stuck with it but no one listened to her. she was quite impressive.

p-edit ah ok. i wasn't aware of that. i'm fine with that.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

i'll also take a look at you when i shall.

I replaced UT who was apparently on the chopping block when I came in. I don't know why. RC has a case on the slot. I was asked to refute the case or address it or something, and I just said I didn't need to because I'm not UT and I already know it's wrong. RC's responses to me haven't given me any warm and fuzzies - i wanted to see if it was something he really believed or if he was willing to reevaluate his reads. he was not. he's a suspect for me.

p-edit: okie dokie.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

okay gal talk to you later~ any more stuff just highlight to me

come back soon. i think we can both sort things/catch up a lot faster bouncing ideas off each other.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

okay gal talk to you later~ any more stuff just highlight to me

come back soon. i think we can both sort things/catch up a lot faster bouncing ideas off each other.

im back. you still there?

i went to lunch but i'm back now!

i read kayp's iso. what the fuck did you make me read. it was so long

and so town. all the stances are clear. this guy is new, right? i would think that newbscum would be less assed and more 'scummy'.

what you said about his posts being irrelevant or not useful... is not true? i saw that he posted a huge readlist, and its pretty OK. seems like he's been on this guy called Shaddox the whole game... who became RC. whom you have issues with.


i really think it would help me out if you pointed me to the parts that you find scummy, i'm not seeing it; i'm seeing a pretty strong town honestly. maybe its cause I was just skimming his ISO at 1.25x speed but yeah nothing flagged as much as you made me believe.

it stood out to me when i read KayP's posts on the last couple pages while I was catching up from yesterday. I didn't get to the ISO at the time i asked you to look at it, but i wanted to see if you saw the same thing. newbies are hard for me to read. lemme go grab the posts.

what do you think of RC?

[EspeciallyTheLies]

Why wouldn't Tammy just point out that she could NK Glork? She never pointed it out once in all her walls, and that's the first thing you thought of.

fucking excellent actually.

Why wouldn't Tammy just point out that she could NK Glork?

Why would she?

because, if she was town, that would be the first counter-argument to someone's idea that she was trying to "get rid of glork" via lynch, no? "if that was true and i was scum, i would just kill him!" but she didn't say that, perhaps because she didn't want to call attention to it?

but conversely it's kind of a weird argument because if she was actually scum, then yes why would she waste her time trying to lynch him when there were several easier options, my slot included?

[EspeciallyTheLies]

I do think that having people think that sentiment - why go after the hard target when she could just NK him? - is I guess a valid reason why Tammy-scum would have gone after Glork-scum.

ok what? You're saying that scumTammy

would

go after Glork oh wait what.. if they were scum together?

Ultimately, I think the question "why would Tammy-scum push Glork-town" as a basis to townread Tammy is flawed and based on way too many assumptions.

But MS is in Glork's slot now so it doesn't really assume anything since if he is town he knows he is. What other assumptions are you meaning?

oh, there are a lot of scum motivations for going after a hard target.

if your "target" is not "mislynched", then you can continue tunnelling that person all game and not need to scumhunt.

Oh yeah this too. Do you think Tammy would do that? The game I played with her as Orion she was more... agreeable, which I town read. She was scum there.

what you you think of tammy? you've been giving hedgey answers up till now actually

Liar liar pants on fire. I put her in my town list before you ever acknowledged that I existed in this game. Go look. I think she's town.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

Do you think Tammy would do that? The game I played with her as Orion she was more... agreeable, which I town read. She was scum there.

this is the main reason why tbh. lemme get you deh link.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

Arcadia: http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=84&t=54228

she was playing by herself. very agreeable. i did townread her for a very long time and only zeroed in via PoE (iirc - i can go check the hydra qt for that game). Anti disagreed and we pushed someone else instead for the loss.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

Liar liar pants on fire. I put her in my town list before you ever acknowledged that I existed in this game. Go look. I think she's town.

DEEEEERP

whoops, I remember that now. I did remember you keeeeep mentioning about "faery faery i need to check faery" which was what gave me that idea.

sorry!

what do you think of The bulge / Not mafia?

literally nothing!

[EspeciallyTheLies]

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=56&t=60046

more juicy

ok so... Tammy didn't post at all in 700 posts I do not have time to be checking which posts are tammy's and which are mollies (all the ones I read were mollie's. I gave up after that). since you played in that one, is there anything in particular that stood out to you between there and here?

[EspeciallyTheLies]

yeah i got suckered by mollie. tammy did post walls too but yeah they were agreeable


BUT! i haven't seen tammy do this either in her towngames. and I have seen more towngames than scumgames!


either that or im a big fat liar and remembered wrong too

i dunno about the walls. i was looking more at her attitude and her aggression. i think she is more convicted here. if we're in agreement on tammy i'd like to look at some nulls. like GC.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

@ETL:

I do think that having people think that sentiment - why go after the hard target when she could just NK him? - is I guess a valid reason why Tammy-

scum

would have gone after Glork-

scum

.

ok what? You're saying that scumTammy

would

go after Glork oh wait what.. if they were scum together?

I'm saying that it is possible that Tammy-scum would go after Glork-town under the theory that people would read it as town because of how "hard" it is to mislynch Glork.

I don't know why you're asking about Tammy & Glork being scum together, but I've already stated to RC that that is also a possible scenario (but I don't know if it is likely).

Because... that is what

you

said. I bolded for clarity.

Ultimately, I think the question "why would Tammy-scum push Glork-town" as a basis to townread Tammy is flawed and based on way too many assumptions.

But MS is in Glork's slot now so it doesn't really assume anything since if he is town he knows he is. What other assumptions are you meaning?

I agree. Sonic

is

in Glork's slot now. That... doesn't really matter? The basic question - would Tammy-scum push Glork-slot? - requires making assumptions about Glork-slot's alignment, along with how Tammy-scum would react replacing into a game faced with a L-3 or -2 (I forget) wagon on her slot.

yeah except it was MS making the argument, to which you said it was inappropriate because it requires one to make assumptions about Glork/MS slot, which is not necessary for MS, since it's his damn slot.

The point being, is that there are reasonable hypotheses for Tammy-scum AND Tammy-town to attack Glork-scum AND Glork-town, and suggesting that one scenario is more likely than the others requires making assumptions about how Tammy and Glork play in the particular circumstances of this game. I don't think that question is useful for discerning alignment.

You are making this more confusing than it needs to be for no reason.

p-edit: i disagree.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

Ok, so I didn't really like him asking me to "address" RC's case on UT. It felt like a busy-noise request that he could use for fuel. It's a faulty request, as I'm sure you understand, since I'm not UT. Then trying to pick apart your logic to make you drop your townread on Tammy is sketch as fuck. Read what I just said about it.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

yeah except it was MS making the argument, to which you said it was inappropriate because it requires one to make assumptions about Glork/MS slot, which is not necessary for MS, since it's his damn slot.

i think he was responding to frogger?

who took the idea from you.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

1.

I obviously misspoke when I mentioned "Tammy-scum" and "Glork-scum" when talking to frogger. Do you have a point here?

What? I asked you to clarify because I didn't understand the statement. No it is not "obviously", obviously, as I was confused and asked about it, and then you go "I dunno why you're asking about this thing I mistyped but didn't say I mistyped". So I respond by showing you what confused me, and then you ask me "Do you have a point?"

2.

I was talking to frogger, not Sonic. Also, although if you want to make the argument that frogger was originally responding to Sonic, which somehow made me responding to Sonic as (which is convoluted but whatever), I'm also having the conversation while keeping in mind that RC has previously voiced the "why would Tammy-scum vote Glork" justification to townread Tammy.

The initial argument for townreading Tammy this way was made by MS, correct. Fro99er asked some questions about it. You proceed to tear it apart while forgetting where it came from. It's not convoluted.

It's fuckin weird that you are creeped out by someone townreading someone else.

3.

I refuse to believe you think

The point being, is that there are reasonable hypotheses for Tammy-scum AND Tammy-town to attack Glork-scum AND Glork-town, and suggesting that one scenario is more likely than the others requires making assumptions about how Tammy and Glork play in the particular circumstances of this game. I don't think that question is useful for discerning alignment.

is confusing.

It's pretty clear. The question can't imply Tammy's alignment.

The only way to figure out a logic puzzle is to consider the possibilities, in this case being her alignment. The question goes, "If Tammy Town, then ...." and "If Tammy Scum, then..."

For you to then go, "No you can't do that," is silly. So yeah. You're intentionally making it confusing, and the only purpose I can see for it is that you are skeeved that a town core is forming.

VOTE: GC

[EspeciallyTheLies]

btw i am lazy to explain my townread on GC, i am going to call it 'gut'

hope someone can translate

it is bad.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

omg RC might've been right

go ahead then. lynch me and see what happens. you'll go tomorrow. i have no problem with that.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

Ok, so I didn't really like him asking me to "address" RC's case on UT. It felt like a busy-noise request that he could use for fuel. It's a faulty request, as I'm sure you understand, since I'm not UT. Then trying to pick apart your logic to make you drop your townread on Tammy is sketch as fuck. Read what I just said about it.

i see.

have you interacted with RC yet?

minimally. he was only around for a hot minute, in which i tried to get a feel for his conviction on the case and whether it was confbias or scum. i did not leave the interaction feeling any better about him.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

and

"It's fuckin weird that you are creeped out by someone townreading someone else."

just lol

"It's fuckin weird that you are arguing that <basis to townread Tammy> is not alignment indicative when you are scumreading Tammy."

Ok.

So she is your one and only scum read?

[EspeciallyTheLies]

NM is the best vote for today.

So.... "lynch the lurker b/c wtflol?"

[EspeciallyTheLies]

I do not believe that is our only option. I believe we can lynch scum today.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

Your attitude is irritating me. I'm gonna take a break. I'll be back in a few hours and hopefully MS will be around again at that time.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

fucking hell that's a scum post.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

KayP - it was a gut reaction to your posts in the last few pages - I mentioned to MS. I'm undecided and feel more strongly about GC/RC.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

VOTE: RC

[EspeciallyTheLies]

also KP I trust MS a lot.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

Lol, GC is far and away the most town player here, ETL. It's a wonder he hasn't hightailed it out of here with the rest of 'em yet.

Also... you weren't, like, waiting for me to unvote you before voting me, were you?

what? please explain how this makes any sense to you. vote or no vote, your "apology" to whats his nuts sounds super pre-emptive and fake.

Also also, why did you abandon one 1-vote wagon to start another? Also also also, do you honestly expect either wagon to be successful in 24 hours?

Yes I hope so.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

ETL, when is the last time we played together?

I don't remember you being quite as temperamental

, but maybe I'm just getting you confused with someone else. I'll have to see if I can dig anything up.

I dont know that we ever have, tbh. sthar, AP, Jingle, Anti, mollie, mastin, pretty much anyone that knows me will tell you the bolded is hilariously ironic though. MS can probably attest to it. I get heated. It's ironic because I think I'm being pretty laid back here, cuz I just don't feel like getting stressed over nonsense.

Anyway, I think lurker lynch is dumb. I agree he's a good candidate for scum, but by PoE only, so my confidence there is very low. Especially on D2. Terrible. We have enough information at this point, regardless of replacements. I don't see why town is being so lazy here.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

Okay, I guess we've never played together.

I think I am thinking of penguin_alien.

And both of us were in your Resistance Mafia together, so perhaps that's where the confusion comes into play.

In any event, duly noted.

yesyes. PA and I do share a birthday though!

[EspeciallyTheLies]

lolk.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

Well hello to you too

Well, I mean, you're basing your current vote on reads from page 12.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

Where the fuck did these pages come from

I could probably be convinced to lynch this too.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

I think it's better than NM, who is obviously trying to catch up and contribute.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

uh... yeah. worst ISO ever.

VOTE: Skrew

[EspeciallyTheLies]

kitty was no better. buncha hedgy bs.

pedit: ohh ok. I missed that but i got the feeling you knew each other. that changes things but I really like you both for town and won't lynch that slot without heavy proof otherwise.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

lynch the blatantly not-playing player Skrew with me, Tammy.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

sorry mod - replace me

This slot is town.

OMFG NO TAMMY.

RC - no on lala. not today.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

well whatever. bb. at least I don't have to read you. we are lynching sleepykrew. there is less than 24 hours left.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

ok lala what drugs have you taken? are you not interested in finding scum this time around?

[EspeciallyTheLies]

vote Skrew. let's do this.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

Tammy ← Bellaphant: read Bella as scum for a p weak reason; have been slowly reading Tammy as town

ChaosOmega ← Tere ← Bob Loblaw: Bob was a super town read

Fro99er: town read from about 1/2 way through D1 to present

Metal Sonic ← Glork: my lizard brain had funny feelings about Glork, but I don't think that they were very good and Tammy's entire case is "real scumhunting v. just TRYING to look like real scumhunting" which I can't possibly discern

Green Crayons: me

KayP: town read since D2

SleepyKrew ← Kitty Galore !: no read

lalaladucks !: minimal read, lean town whose like idgaf

RedCoyote ← Shadoxx8 !!: I don't like his posts grandstanding against Bulge; a few of his other posts have struck me the wrong way (ugh effort) but idk

Not_Mafia ← The Bulge !!: wanted to kill Bulge for being shitty, but NM's "welp I'm just going to start reading and tell you thoughts" strikes me as protown

EspeciallyTheLies ← Untrod Tripod !: no thoughts about UT, but was leaning town because UT; ETL had a good replace in, but her suspicions on frogger and GC were bad; but x2, her jumping around on votes looks more town than not

so... everyone is town?

wth. you people. ms. this is not town.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

ok. Skrew/GC/lala.

calling it now.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

shut up and vote Skrew.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

he knows why we want to lynch and yet has nothing else to say.

it's called active lurking.

it's called scum reading the game and pretending not to have anything to say.

it's called, lynch the scum bucket Skrew.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

pretty much anyone hedging on lynching this right now is suspect.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

Chaos I really don't like your vote on NM who is actually contributing and adding to the discussion.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

Is this a Normal??

[EspeciallyTheLies]

I don't think he's scum.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

Bulge had no content but slot isn't scummy because NM is doing effort catchup.

Kitty had no content and slot is scummy because SK isn't doing effort catchup.


Did I accurately capture your position on these slots?

No.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

Skrew has been here and reading, as I pointed out yesterday, and yet makes no comments about anyone or anything. Yet you can't see the scum motivation in that?

NM is actually trying to understand the game, asking questions, ya know, scum hunting.

To reduce my argument to catch up/no catch up is disingenuous.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

Not to mention the serious effort to keep Skrew alive and lynch NM instead.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

also... um... two "backup ICs" in a Normal game? no.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

Also bulge and Kitty ISOs are distinctly different in motivation. Bulge wanted to and couldn't. Kitty didn't even try.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

No, I do not see the scum motivation of showing up and being like "yup, I'm worthless."

That is a problem with you then, not the case. I've seen scum do this a ton of times, because it fucking works. Look at you, eating it up. "Admitting to being crappy" doesn't change the end result of being crappy.

I don't really care to argue this anymore.

p-edit: Ok. Not really.

p-edit: Maybe that's just fuckin wonky. You can only have one non-normal role in the game.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

It's a crap claim from a crap slot. Fucking lynch it.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

Like, how can you sit there and excuse blatantly refusing to contribute, a bad claim, and actively lurking?

[EspeciallyTheLies]

Versus lynching someone because you have a null read on the slot......

HELLO? WHAT ARE YOU SMOKING? CAN I HAVE SOME?

[EspeciallyTheLies]

You're not very good at this whole discussing things, bit.

Never mind.

So you're just going to ignore what I've said because....?

[EspeciallyTheLies]

I am trying to understand your logic of "lynch null" vs "lynch obvious bullshit".

[EspeciallyTheLies]

ETL, why would SK claim something so outrageous as scum?

UNVOTE: SleepyKrew; VOTE: Not_Mafia

SK's claim is effectively provable at some point. SK does not need to be lynched today.

Effectively provable? Are you kidding me right now?

omfg. This is unbelievable.

I quit.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

Such effort to lynch a null and save a partner. Incredible.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

Or he's scum with a bad fake claim. Which happens all the fucking time. Especially with lazy players. I forget what game it was but Titus' partner fakeclaimed the same shit she did, by accident, because he wasn't paying attention.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

MS would know I think.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

How much time do we even have left? This is a cluster fuck.

p-edit: You're clutching to a "scum read" on me because you need to. You're scum just as much as SK is. The moment it got real momentum - because you thought NM would be the one to go - you hopped off with some bullshit excuse. Anyone protecting SK at this point is fucking. suspect.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

Actually I don't know. I think GC is more likely scum than RC, definitely not scum together.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

All I know is it sounds too fake to be fake.

This makes me want to cry.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

man reading D1 is like reading an entirely different game.

this game is the zombie that wont die.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

RC your UT vote was horrific. I'm town. (Which reminds me, GC, I already claimed VT in like my 3rd post or something).

[EspeciallyTheLies]

You're all fucking scummy.

Except MS. Tammy/BB, Fro99er. I don't even remember who is who anymore.

p-edit please MS. This is insanity.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

I think we only have a few hours left. I dunno.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

She just calls everyone town until the winds blow another direction.

DID YOU READ GC'S READSLIST...??

[EspeciallyTheLies]

You're missing a case for townLala/townETL in your options there, RC. Though lala could defo be scum. This is nothing like the game I modded.

p-ediot:

[EspeciallyTheLies]

MS you would be incorrect and you will be upset about it.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

My only solace in this is that this game is possibly a lost cause and my death may at least help point you in the right direction.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

freudian slip?

Scumslip.

Point me to the game where marquis did that?

VOTE: Metal Sonic

stahp this please.

Town {MS, Tammy, Fro99er}
Null {NM, CO, KayP}
Scum {one of RC/GC, lala, SK}

MS - I will vote NM at deadline if I really can't get anyone else in my scum list. But I don't really want to lynch him.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

BB is tammy in the above list.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

If you think conciseness is a scumtell for me you shouldn't be professing a meta read on me. I think even ETL could tell you it isn't

My impression of your play is "non-existent". I remember vaguely being surprised that you were active in gerrymandering mafia or something like that.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

ETL - respond to me about Sonic's deal please.

what?

[EspeciallyTheLies]

fro99er, did you think glork was scum?

[EspeciallyTheLies]

so, when i replaced in, tammy and glork were at each other's throats. before reading anything, i had a townish feel on tammy and was just gonna sheep her on glork (i also assumed at the time that they had more meta with each other than they did). then after talking with him, i changed my mind, and decided that both were wrong about each other, and then tammy corrected me on how familiar they were. that also lends to probably being wrong.

then ms replaced in and did his ms thing, and strengthened my read on the slot a lot. i disagree with your read on ms. i think you may be very confbiased here. when i read his post about encryptors, it made sense to me as a typo. i dont think it's a slip.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

if i'm wrong about ms, then we've already lost really..

[EspeciallyTheLies]

like, if skrew flips town, tomorrow is lylo and i dunno. it will be a fight between lynching nm again and some other flavor of the day i'm pretty sure.

see now i dont fucking know. i wanna trust ms and just get rid of nm but i know that skrew is gonna do fuck all and it's likely he is scum.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

etl we need to talk about nm or skrew

skrew is indeed going to do fuck all and he is more scummy than what i've seen of him

but his claim...

yes i know. the claim is problematic. i hate this choice.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

I strongly believe one of RC/GC is scum.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

I strongly believe you strongly believe that.

Then you must believe I am town.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

but he's not useless :/

[EspeciallyTheLies]

I strongly believe you strongly believe that.

Then you must believe I am town.

Yes, that is what I believe my posts have indicated.

We just aren't on very agreeable terms.

oh. i see.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

Of the two I am leaning towards RC more.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

i believe GC has earned a slam dunk

well I said as much before that.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

LALA IS A GOOD CHOICE

[EspeciallyTheLies]

oops caps lol

[EspeciallyTheLies]

i'm pretty solidly sure MS is town.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

the real IC should claim now

NO.

N. O.

wtf is wrong with you

[EspeciallyTheLies]

If there is an IC existing, there can't be two backup ICs.

why

[EspeciallyTheLies]

i mean, i agree it would be a dumbass set up and i dont think marquis is a dumbass,but it's still conjecture. the claim, by itself, is dumb. his play is super shitty. i'd rather sort nm another day than fuck around with sk.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

if he's town... i'm pretty sure i'm just gonna blacklist.

fuck people who dont give a shit and throw the game for their team. seriously.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

see... if NM was scum, I really don't think he'd be arguing that his counterwagon is probably town.

Can we maybe think about RC? And just get it done? I'd even compromise on lala I think.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

goddammit skrew. i apologize, but i dislike you very much.

VOTE: RC

[EspeciallyTheLies]

Only 3 hours left.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

BBMolla isn't really helping with my Tammy/Bella slot scumread

And he likely wont. I'm fairly certain the slot is town.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

okay 8 more pages happened when I was sleeping

have more people claimed?

I would really like it if you did something useful.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

I'm only here for another 45 minutes, so a decision needs to be made otherwise I wont be around to change my vote if necessary.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

okay 8 more pages happened when I was sleeping

have more people claimed?

I would really like it if you did something useful.

uh me too

but I don't know what's happening

is there something in particular you want me to weigh in on?

You know very well what is expected. If you are town, you need to be providing your thoughts about who you think is scum. You are not doing anything and have not been doing anything.

p-edit: what?

[EspeciallyTheLies]

VOTE: lalalafucks

I'll vote RC if this goes nowhere

[EspeciallyTheLies]

(2) lalaladucks — Fro99er, Not_Mafia
(2) RedCoyote — EspeciallyTheLies, lalaladucks
(5) Not_Mafia — KayP, ChaosOmega, RedCoyote, Metal Sonic, Green Crayons (L-1)
(0) EspeciallyTheLies —[/quote]

p-edit: ok bb. did you manage to read anything?

[EspeciallyTheLies]

Okay hate the switch and I've played with lala town before, behind the goofy personality there was actually tangible thought processes and effort

VOTE: lalalasucks

you hate the switch but you agree with it?

[EspeciallyTheLies]

I read first 10 pages and the last 12ish

so what else do you think?

[EspeciallyTheLies]

ETL I think Frogger is kind of scummy, why do you think he's town

glork is his brother and thinks he's town. glork is a seasoned player and fro99er isn't. MS replaced into Glork's position. don't really think newbie fro99er would be able to fool his vet brother.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

i thought he was kinda scummy too, but I agree with MS.

p-edit: yeah i was saying tomorrow would be LYLO if we mislynch today. is that not correct? mini's usually take 3 mislynches for scum to win.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

Wait wtf

ETL did you say something about LYLO?

Cause we're not even close

...

what do you mean we're not even close?

[EspeciallyTheLies]

Mini's are typically 10-3, it takes 3 mislynches to get to LyLo

that is what i said.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

ETL, who is scum

I think you're town trying to herd cats

lol herd cats?

i think one of GC/RC are scum, leaning more towards RC than GC. I definitely feel like they are not scum together but they are both incredibly scummy to me.

i think lalaladucks could be scum. i modded her first newbie game where she caught and stayed on both scum and no one listened to her. she was clear-headed, focused, involved. i dont see any of that here.

i think you and MS are very strongly town, and fro99er by extension via Glork's read.

skrew can go die in a hole i dont even care.

NM is a waffle read for me. the original slot was pretty dead. since NM has replaced in, he's been trying to be involved and I'm less inclined to lynch him than someone else.

am i missing anyone?

[EspeciallyTheLies]

1. BBmolla
2. ChaosOmega
3. Fro99er
4. Metal Sonic
5. Green Crayons
6. KayP
7. SleepyKrew
8. lalaladucks
9. RedCoyote
10. Not_Mafia
11. EspeciallyTheLies

oh yeah. kayp... i wanted to lynch but meh. i will poke at that tomorrow. chaosomega is a total null. no read.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

alright yall. i'm leaving in 10 minutes. what are we doing?

I'd be willing to lynch in {RC, lalala, skrew?}

[EspeciallyTheLies]

(1) lalaladucks — Not_Mafia
(5) RedCoyote — EspeciallyTheLies, lalaladucks, BBmolla, Green Crayons, fro99er (L-1)
(4) Not_Mafia — KayP, ChaosOmega, RedCoyote, Metal Sonic

[EspeciallyTheLies]

that's a slot i need to look at.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

I dunno if I see NM/RC on the same team

[EspeciallyTheLies]

I mean.. maybe...?

[EspeciallyTheLies]

alright it's time. fingers crossed, and hopefully i will see you on the other side. have a good night yall

[EspeciallyTheLies]

oh oh and his jump to SK.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

ok really i'm leaving this time. byebye

[EspeciallyTheLies]

ETL is never townreading me again

lolnope.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

if i'm wrong about ms, then we've already lost really..

oh the irony

[EspeciallyTheLies]

lol jerks