Mini Normal 1814 Machiavellian Mafia (Game Over)

[Skold]

"The lion cannot protect himself from traps, and the fox cannot defend himself from wolves. One must therefore be a fox to recognize traps, and a lion to frighten wolves."

A variant of this quote is used in Medieval 2 Total War except referencing how a prince must act around his enemies. Cewl.

Vote: Zap Rowsdower

becaue your vote on BYF got me temporarily hyped thinking I was playing with BBT.

[Skold]

"The lion cannot protect himself from traps, and the fox cannot defend himself from wolves. One must therefore be a fox to recognize traps, and a lion to frighten wolves."

A variant of this quote is used in Medieval 2 Total War except referencing how a prince must act around his enemies. Cewl.

Vote: Zap Rowsdower

becaue your vote on BYF got me temporarily hyped thinking I was playing with BBT.

[Skold]

That doesn't seem like anything scum wouldn't do. I really don't like that townread at all.
My vote becomes serious so I'll do it again for the sake of it.
VOTE: Zap Rowsdower < forgot actual vote tags existed.

[Skold]

Maybe for a first ever game but in that first game people generally realize that other players like activity.

[Skold]

also could the mods use a darker color plox.

What board colour do you use? I've been using mafBlack since I've started and only just started messing around with it.

[Skold]

k but there's a difference between trying to be active so people won't scumread you and pushing other players to be active because you think the game is moving too slow...less than a full day after it opened

I guess if you wanted to have a townread based on next to nothing but why?

off topic kinda - I tried to do a metasearch on you for this kind of thing but it seems you haven't played any other games on this account. This an alt or did you just not feel like doing a newbie game?

[Skold]

mmmhmm. would you like to elaborate?

[Skold]

VOTE: MariaR

Anyone who can point out the scumslip can join my townbloc

Alright, I'll bite. What slip?

[Skold]

Was it my avi I get that a lot

I highly doubt you get read for your avatar. Or do I not understand what an AVI is?

[Skold]

I think that actually fried my brain. I was about to place a vote on Elyse till I saw the ''jk bro it's a prank'' post and then I lost cognitive function. This is recovering, lifesupport on memes Skold. Expect better.
Dwlee is town because that risks scumcide even knowing it probably wouldn't lynch.
Blackstar's vote isn't too bad given that if he was town and believed Dwlee he shouldn't be trusting Elyse when she says ''He's probably trolling'' but his unvote was premature and seemed to be a reaction to the pressure from Elyse more than an actual moving away from reaction test. I'm going to count votes because I lost track but pretend I just voted Blackstar.

Thoughts on Wolf to follow when I am at 100%.
pedit to those last 4:
Thoughts to follow

[Skold]

I'm not sure why this clears Dwlee as town, Skold. What town motivation does he have for that action? To get some reactions. What scum motivation does he have for that action? To get people saying scum wouldn't do that, that would be suicidal for scum. I don't know which one is more likely but he's definitely not cleared.

Also UNVOTE: Elyse

So he's not town because he could have orchestrated the entire discussion for the conclusion that one person thinks he's confTown? I don't see a world where scum do suicidal stupids for maybe getting a couple townreads.
@Rosske same goes to you. I don't see why scum would try for that kind of strategy. It would just be a poor play. Plus I like the play itself from a town perspective ignoring the WIFOM.
pedit: STOP IT PEOPLE. I HAVE TRIED LIKE 10 TIMES TO PUT THIS POST OUT. GAAAAA

[Skold]

Also itlepip your votecount bump failed. hawhaw.

it is called it is 1am I am not tallying now

[Skold]

I don't at all mind Blackstar's and Mapwolf's votes regardless of whether they read Elyse's ''it could be a troll'' comment because really why would they believe that if they thought that Dwlee was actually a daycop. I was also about to vote for Elyse without reading the rest of the thread because I was fooled as well. But Blackstar's claim it was a reaction test strikes me as off.
@Blackstar why do you say Elyse probably isn't scum?

I don't understand why Mapwolf agreeing with Blackstar's line of thought in the form of ''Exactly'' is a scumtell, want more from Elyse on that. I also don't see the argument against Mapwolf's ''DW will stand responsible if she flips town'' that sounds like exactly the kind of thing I would say if I thought I was giving L-1. The argument against Mapwolf seems really nitpicky and doesn't hold much water imo.

Never played a game holding onto my vote before, so I'll try it this game.

FOS: Blackstar

UNVOTE:
pedit: @Iraonavp I'm going to ignore the WIFOM okay. Now it's going to sound like I'm hanging up on you, but that's just because I'm hanging up on you. Or the tinnitus idk.

[Skold]

Also itlepip your votecount bump failed. hawhaw.

it is called it is 1am I am not tallying now

Ee

Then explain this mister. Huehuehuehuehuehue

[Skold]

I'm never scum. This is just how every day 1 goes for me. Someone gets to l-1 extremely fast, I unvote so that the day won't end prematurely and then everyone suspects me of being scum.

The day isn't going to end prematurely because of an early L-1. I don't buy any of this defence.

[Skold]

Skold looked promising at first but I don't like how he's trying to shift focus from Map.

I haven't seen a focus on map and my questions about it haven't been answered. That or I forgot to phrase them like questions because I am a moron from time to time. So here they are.
Why is agreeing with Black's post with ''exactly'' bad?
Why doesn't it make sense to disregard Elyse's post suggesting that Dwlee might be trolling from the perspective of someone who believes the daycop claim?
Why is it bad that he said Dwlee takes responsibility if Elyse is lynched?
It feels like you decided Map is bad and worked backwards.
Finally - I'm not taking attention from Map. I'm redirecting it from ''He's scum, lynch lynch lynch'' to ''He might be scum, answer these questions and let me decide later''.
Oh and Map you can answer some of these questions too - Rephrase them to the point where they make sense. In other words, explain yourself.
@Elyse - Black is a better wagon until you prove otherwise, come join my side it generally makes more sense.
Map is null(scumish) till these are answered honestly and the answer makes some degree of sense.
Pedit: Agree about Dwlee, don't about Zap. It would be if it was an actual scumtell but it's worth mentioning who hasn't been around for what parts of the game.
pedit again: clearly you don't. Perhaps you should though.

[Skold]

Jesus Christ I am honestly sorry about how difficult that post is to read. I just tried going over it again for mistakes I missed and wtf.

[Skold]

Skold do you only care about answers to those questions if they come from Map or Elyse, or are you asking in general?

Both? Either? They are questions I want answered from people who think Map is scum.
pedit: get to this in a moment, but basically, what do you think of how this was elaborated on by both sides.,

[Skold]

Iraon that was so impossible to follow. Can you read the whole thing, then post? Because I feel like I just read the entire thread again but from someone else's viewpoint and none of it made any sense.
Early reaction tests like that might be handy, idk I never use them, and might be scummy (again I never use stuff like that as either alignment and haven't seen much of it to comment on). How do you get that laying traps like that is more likely to attract town than scum? I could see town trying to look for a slip that isn't there but I can only see scum posting a slip that they didn't found to pick up the town cred.
PEDIT: Jesus I'm going to struggle this game.

[Skold]

Well, all "reaction test"'s are bad, but Elyse's "reaction test" was the only one which looked scum-aligned and fake.

Because??? Just because? I get tone can play a part but really I don't see how you read it that way. This whole read looks awful.

[Skold]

See, this is such a suspicious thing to post...

Why do you even care? You are suspicious because I don't like your posts.

No, no it isn't. Why is someone pushing you for why you don't like their posts suspicious. This all reeks of scum. More on Iraon to follow.

[Skold]

I'm just gonna post as I read.

Can we actually stop this as a habit that mafiascum has in general? It's an awkward way to catchup. I get that as you read you have stuff you want to say, but this isn't helpful when you mention something and 3 or 4 posts later when you've actually caught up you say ''nvm, I got it''.

[Skold]

Skipping that entire BYF/Ira exchange because that is TvT and I really don't care. Also because I dislike Ira's posting style. It's annoying to read.

Int to hammer Mapwolf

because I want stuff to happen rather than 5 pages of 1 on 1 action.

[Skold]

What if I, town-aligned Skold, do it? Do I get a pass? :p :p :p

[Skold]

HAHAHAAHHHAHA. I've never actually been so amused by 3 words. Bravo, sir, bravo.

[Skold]

@BYF seriously stop with the quote walls. Have a feeling you missed Elyse saying this. Just reference post numbers and give a brief summary of what you're referencing. If I'm not lazy I might even fact check you.
pedit: @Maria well that's okay, you don't need to.
@BYF Mod's discretion I think but it's usually alright as long as it isn't mean.
@Mod Can we pretty please use big boy words?

[Skold]

UNVOTE: Map Wolf

Please don't hammer yet, some people haven't even posted!

Dude I just wanted to spark some content. Chill. Though I do want this guy sitting at L-1.
VOTE: Mapwolf.

[Skold]

I'm interested to see what Map Wolf has to see when he gets back, and depending on his response I'll potentialy be down to hammer.

For now VOTE: BigYoshiFan

I disagree with you on some aspects, Iraon, but I really didn't like BYF's defense. I don't think the fact that he's offended is a good reason to let up.

You never explained this vote

A lot of BYF's wording feels fake and forced.

And it's scummy of him to get so defensive over one vote. Especially because he was town-reading Iraon. If you're town-reading him, why do you care so much about WHY he's voting you? If you're town and you think he's town, then he's wrong, and whatever its just one vote, and it'll work itself out. BYF derailed the entire thread over it. The reaction and defense were just off completely. Also, it felt like BYF just conveniantly started scum-reading Ira when he realized his town read was getting questioned.

Town do very often focus overly much on their defence. It's something that gets ironed out as you play more but I rarely see it being a good scumtell.

[Skold]

This town read on me is terrible. I HAVE shut up, barely contributed in forever. That post was nearly 100 posts ago and I don't think I've posted since and it certainly hasn't been substantive. I don't like even theoretically pretending you have a scum-mate though I do agree.
Other catchup stuff to follow, but I like my vote where it is.

[Skold]

This town read on me is terrible. I HAVE shut up, barely contributed in forever. That post was nearly 100 posts ago and I don't think I've posted since and it certainly hasn't been substantive. I don't like even theoretically pretending you have a scum-mate though I do agree.
Other catchup stuff to follow, but I like my vote where it is.

[Skold]

you know who else looks like scum? you

Had a good long stare at his ISO, and then in context. Not sure why you guys think Rosske is scum - maybe bullet point it for me and I'll understand. I'm liking him. Won't follow his BYF case because it does have many a hole which I'll talk about later if you like but I don't see it as being scummy.
On the map crumbing - VT...I don't see why mafia would bother doing that because it adds zero credibility to the claim as there is no risk in being counterclaimed as VT. Either way it doesn't make sense so I'm not going to bother with it. Map stays as the best lynch for now.
Like as town MariaR on a gut level, sticking with Dwlee as town for now. Everyone stays null.

[Skold]

And it's never before been a problem for me to use that terminology, Elyse is probably just trying to make a big deal about it because she is scum-aligned and trying to make an excuse to policy lynch me.

I'm going to assume Elyse isn't boldfaced lying when I vote you for this. Will check later and if she is and has acted like she is scumreading you, I'll swap but I highly doubt someone would do that. Though I don't mind the ''aligned'' thing so much it just breaks up your posts a bit, this seems like a really shitty reason to scum read someone.
VOTE: Iraon

@Peoples - I will be moving soon so I will post but not often. You won't notice a difference, because I'm hardly active anyway, probably should have mentioned it like 3 days ago.

[Skold]

Wait never mind he's just being silly. Nothing in that ISO jumps out at me as something any scum player would want to say.
UNVOTE:
Imma need a while to think on this. Back to the lurk-cave.

[Skold]

Ira is spouting nonsense bs

Why is his nonsense bs different from town being playing poorly?

[Skold]

I've been keeping myself updated I've just completely forgotten to post. I have literally nothing I want to say. Didn't get an answer to why Iraon is not just being stupid rather than scummy, I'm going back to when I posted that to see who that was for. Like Comparing Realities. I'm sorry about not posting it just went completely over my head that I had to contribute. I blame you people for being so active but not actually saying much new.

[Skold]

@Dwlee/anyone on that Iraon wagon. Why is he scum and not just playing poorly? Seems to be a lot of accusations based on his actions and almost nothing to do with why scum would do what he is doing. Dislike that entire wagon, going through it player by player.