Why?In post 1885, Raskolnikov wrote:Gonna cover every push by shannon so far (impoetic, transcend, titus, now gerry) and why the read progression doesn't make sense to me.
FirstImpoeticin 394Uhhh yeah this read to me like someone is making a town read based on scum knowledge, and then trying to cover their ass.This is a hop onto the impoetic wagon putting it l-2, the context being impoetic called someone a townie and explained it as everyone is statistically more likely town than not.
Shannon's vote here is not terrible for the situation (the impoetic slip does look awkward) but not a statement that necessarily required much time or thought; we see the judgment but shannon doesn't go into detail or show she's thinking critically about the game rather than taking an easy way on the wagon. So far this read isn't a problem but follow the progression through.
Note: in retrospect the slip by impoetic, her accidentally referring/assuming rb as a townie actually reads town given the flip, it seems unlikely mafia would accidentally refer to their partner that way
404 reads kind of bullshit as a response to impoetic's defending of herself. The issue shannon has that "Having scum reads on townies is sub-optimal for town." and of wifom doesn't seem like actually trying to understand impoetics point of view but moreso just make her look bad for defending herself on the grounds it's not "optimal play" which is eeh.
How you come away from votes is important too (the tail end of read progression) and a lot of people don't look at that part. It's the later unvote; fluffyrabbit unvoted impoetic for the tone of her defense and asked shannon to do so as well. 414 Shannon agrees and said she sort of buys it but doesn't feel comfortable going all the way, and the subsequent unvote next day is without comment and when she was the last one left on that wagon.
2 things here, first something I love to look at is what I call reads-momentum. The more self-conscious scum tend to have 'heavy' reads in terms of momentum because they don't feel right quickly turning and want to look consistent, whereas town is more variable i.e. 399 fluffly (who looks town) feels better from the defense right away. On top of appearance, making a fast retraction of a read puts you in a position where you have to have a new read or direction to go to, which for scum is more of a hassle given they like to be on one thing at any given time. This doesn't apply to every scenario and is pretty weak as a tell tbh but I could see that being the case here. Second is positioning; shannon came to put the wagon at l-2 but holds off on judgement or committing until everyone leaves it for the unvote. Because she doesn't really follow-up the read it's indistinguishable as to her genuinely changing her mind or if she was waiting to see which way the wind blew; that if people stayed on the wagon she would've as well, but the wagon's complete collapse didn't give a choice. Although this is more suggestive than anything hard-and-fast.
Follow this read through and she has impoetic as town until d2 where after kyoukyo's titus-impoetic theory she votes on 1557A vote because impoetic isn't voting as she's lurking at the time. Again the concept of the vote isn't terrible, but when she had impoetic as lock for town d1 the worry on her specifically vs any other lurker (my slot for example) doesn't particularly follow. Finally impoetic doesn't show in her 1593 "want to lynch" pool and she then move votes again but I don't understand any of the progression regarding this. Impoetic doesn't post anything in between that vote and the pool and the next vote-change.I am also wondering why Impoetic has never been shown as voting, in any of the vote counts. Care to explain that one please? I can see a vote on RB on 156 (called a joke), and a skim reveals no other votes.
Overall given neither time she backed off she said anything substantive, and because her townread from the first time randomly disappeared I don't think it's a genuine read as opposed to voting for the sake of voting.
TranscendI'll go into later but I can summarize; she scumread transcend but didn't pressured him one bit until the end of the day or asked any questions. Transcend himself asked shannon why she didn't do anything about her only scumread or vote him (817) to get more information but she didn't on the experience and apparently role-crumb basis. Beyond "bad vibes" and a problem with transcend's style changing there's no critical thought until her vote post 911 which finally gives a theory.
Titusstarts in 1539. Based on kyoukyos theory in 1531 shannon votes titus for being obtuse and "for info". Nothing wrong with pressure though this still isn't scumhunting, but follow this read through:
she unvotes titus inexplicably to go back to impoetic (1557) and in 1593 commentsD7 is probably my strongest town read and he wants Titus. LUV has supposedly cleared me, and he wants Titus. SSBM made that interesting point yesterday about the Impoetic/Rabbit(Titus) interactions. I think that's where today has got to go.
Which is essentially saying titus is good because other people say so and sheeping.
Finally 1611 we have the revote to l-2.Now you have to go back and look at this as a whole to see why this is a problem.In post 1611, shannon wrote:I'm going to go ahead and put Titus at L-2. I really want some proper responses from that slot and not just obtuse posts questioning minor points or pretending not to understand things.
VOTE: TitusL-2
Shannon originally wanted titus pushed for info but unvotes fast without asking anything. Then with the appeal that other people want titus so it's good she revotes because she wants proper responses from the slot.
Shannon herself never actually asked titus any questions. She didn't go into detail as to what info she wants; i.e. pressuring her. She votes her on the nebulous "more info" to sort of sheep, but doesn't have specifics she's interested in... what does shannon want here? Titus at this point has given reads, several directions where she wants to push and somewhat self-consistent VCA even if you hate it. What you do next if you're interested is pick it apart and go into why it's not good and your personal thinking as to why it's scummy. If shannon were interested I think she'd engage titus and ask about each of these but I don't think she genuinely was.
Titus then claims and shannon unvotes without much comment (1646), and asks for more info on the neighbour claims (1713) along with a brief summary as to why titus is being wagoned, though moreso facts than much of shannon's stance or opinion. Before in 1794 finally saying she should be lynched if she's still alive tomorrow...
I don't see critical analysis beyond setup stuff or actual scumhunting at any point here, since then just role and future speculation comments via titus/luv.
What I also don't get too is why shannon lost her townread on the slot here either. If you remember fluffyrabbit day 1 was actually shannon's strongest expressed townread in the game which shannon made a huge deal out of, and shannon made a post recognising that titus replaced her so there is no benefit of the doubt. Unless she is the type of player to completely throw out a read after replacement this townread backtrack looks just like the impoetic one.
Finally there's thegerryoatvote which is naked but shannon does talk about him earlier, as to why his wagon didn't go anywhere (1575). The thing is the gist of shannon's theory there isn't a case for gerryoat scum, it's an explanation as to why there was no strong counterwagon to rb, and the reasoning was because gerryoat was that counter, scum where already on him and that's why it didn't take off, i.e. gerryoat town. It's not a case for gerryoat scum. 1593 that becomes a bad thing though for gerry (???) and especially it's weird because shannon herself opposed the rb wagon but didn't go onto gerryoat, so I feel like she herself having a problem with that is odd given she even seems partially responsible.
Kyoukyo has his own case and theories regarding association shannon like-sort-of agrees with in 1793 but I highly doubt shannon has any of those same thought processes (uhhhhh) rather than just agreeing for the sake of voting. I might be missing something about this particular read given it's recency though.
Basically I don't see shannon think in-depth about the game for any read or show critical thinking, and when she does explain things I see inconsistencies and have a lot of trouble trying to understand her point of view. She appears to join wagons based on if they're already gaining traction (except for transcend, where people expliclty asked why she and non-voters in general weren't voting) rather than take any independent action, and doesn't put much effort questioning or engaging her scumreads (transcend, titus). Finally when a previous townread of her becomes a potential wagon that townread isn't mentioned again and seem to sort of disappear.
Because Raskolnikov.