911: What's Your Emergency? (Postgame)
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You meta'd someone on page 3 about their RVS behavior?In post 72, tris wrote:I took a look at some of Baezu's games, and her RVS's there seem pretty consistent with how she was here. Even sometimes when there was more relevant content to react to. UNVOTE:-
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Oh no not fun
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Insomnia is overly defensive but probably town
Rooster had a weird entry to the thread and I dont know why THAT wasnt the reason for insomnia's vote.
I get the impression that insomnia is enthusiastic tryhardy newbtown who demands substance for everything but he'll grow out of it I hope. I dont really agree with his reasoning but i get it from a newbtown perspective-
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I assure you I don't.In post 114, GuiltyLion wrote:well no that vote doesn't make me happy because I think roster's townie
I'm more just asking why you have to be prompted to vote an apparent scumread
I tend to free form babble what's in my head and I just wanted to get a word in edge wise when making that post frankly and I wasnt super concerned about my vote. Rooster struck me as tonally awkward and I dont see how he would think that anyone was "onto something" based on
Or why you think that he "saw what you did". Why are you townreading him exactly?
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In post 118, GuiltyLion wrote: well at this point he has explicitly stated that he did:
and since his post 30 is consistent with this explanation, I don't see a reason to disbelieve that.In post 46, rosterfoster wrote:
Ya. I thought the same when I read it so I was happy when you had the same reasonsIn post 40, GuiltyLion wrote:several people had already posted, you didn't engage with any of them or any of the page 1 content, instead voting somebody who hadn't gotten to the thread yet with an explanation that pinged me as awkward
So you're satisfied that his reasoning is "uhhh yeah what he said"? I find it difficult to believe that he both shares your hackneyed reason for scumreading baez (not engaging enough by page 1? Uh-huh.) and that it made him "happy". Reads like justifying after the fact.
No-no, I'm not having a semantic battle with you about burden of proof. Dont deflect. I'm asking you why you're townreading Rooster, because I'm trying to sort *you*. As it stands I think you're bullshitting, and yes it is up to you to show me if I'm wrong about your alignment.In post 118, GuiltyLion wrote:
I would say it's far more important to argue for scumreads than townreads right now. If you think rooster's scum because you think he's tonally awkward, the responsibility is on you to vote him and make your case to everyone else. I'm not interested in giving reasons for my townread, I expect you will argue with them and the result will be to drag this game into a noisy disagreement that's of no real value. further, he has ~75% odds of being town in the objective sense, so to calling him scum is the claim that's less likely to be true by default and the one that requires justification.
unless/until rooster's at risk of lynch, my focus is on finding scum, not defending town.
UNVOTE:
VOTE: GuiltyLion-
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Dude I don't fucking care. We are on page 7. I am explicitly not team building at this stage, nor am I going to establish preflip associations, nor have I ever, because they're bullshit. I'm probing and prodding at behaviors and actions that I want to understand better because I am trying to sort people's alignments. Two people can be independently scummy and I can try to sort the both of them as such.In post 137, GuiltyLion wrote: also unpack this for me: what do you think the interactions are between rooster and I, S-T or S-S?
like
- do you think we're scum together and we decided to open with him sheeping me, then us mutually agreeing it was a good vote? why is that likely, especially considering how unlikely it is a priori that we're both scum?
- do you think he's scum sheeping misguided town!me?
- do you think I'm scum and he's the misguided town? in which case your reasons for scumreading him were wrong to begin with?
I'm not really seeing which of any of these makes sense from a town!you.
Lion I've been playing on this site since 2014 and I've never had this much of a fucking problem getting someone to just tell me what they're thinking. I don't care about your hypothesis that faking a townread as scum is easy, I don't care that you apparently believe that explaining yourself is beneath you, I don't care for your internet boy genius soliloquy's about the proper way to play this game. I could not have possibly asked you an easier question relating to the game state. I don't want a towncase, I don't want a wall of text about why someone with like 2 posts is town. You have stated that you have a reasonably confident townread on Roster, I don't see why that is, if you are town and want trust and cooperation with me, a townie, then please dumb down like I am five years old why this is. It can be a single sentence. The sentence can even be as simple as "I townread Roster because of gut", or "I townread Roster because he sheeped me and being agreed with feels good". I'm not trying to trap you or "poke holes" in your townread, I want to have a stated reason for what you are thinking.In post 137, GuiltyLion wrote:
I'm not trying to get into a semantic battle, I'm straight up telling you why I don't care to answer your question. Do you agree that faking townreads as scum is significantly easier than faking scumreads as scum? Because your question is a pretty bad way to sort me if that's your intention. If I'm scum it's easy for me to make up reasons why town!rooster is town. If we're scum together, I point you back to asking you why you think we're scum together and why we decided to open the game this way, because that's even more unlikely than the odds of one of us being scum to begin with.In post 133, Elbirn wrote: No-no, I'm not having a semantic battle with you about burden of proof. Dont deflect. I'm asking you why you're townreading Rooster, because I'm trying to sort *you*. As it stands I think you're bullshitting, and yes it is up to you to show me if I'm wrong about your alignment.
If you can't see that I'm town and rooster's town, that says a lot more about your game than it does mine.
Baezu's entry to the thread was post #19. I'm not saying there wasn't anything to engage with, but there certainly wasn't so much that I find it worth stinkeyeing someone for throwing down their RVS vote to ego the thread and waddling away. See Also: Me doing the same thing in post 18. Also: Every game of Mafia that has ever been run.In post 138, GuiltyLion wrote:
also just to be thorough and explain why this is a discreditIn post 133, Elbirn wrote:your hackneyed reason for scumreading baez (not engaging enough by page 1? Uh-huh.)
my reason was never "not engagingenough". it was more the fact that she straight up did not engage with any of the content before her with her first post.
it's pretty straightforward reasoning:
- town do not have the information and needs to probe people to figure out their alignments. this fact doesn't change if it's page 1 or page 20.
- scum have most information, are scared of making disingenuous looking pushes, and benefit from when town is chaotic/disengaged/not-reading-eachother
so who is more likely to make an empty vote on page 1 that does not generate information? town or scum? I argue scum, and that's why I saw baezu's opening as potentially a scum-indicative one. does that make her lockscum? absolutely not, I'm 100% open to re-visiting and I have already since done so. Is it worthy of making a non-random vote on page 2? Yes.
this is easy stuff, it's not hard to understand. and it's not hard to believe that roster felt the same way.
And I think that's largely where we are at. I'm having difficulty seeing where you're coming from on this because, stating the obvious, you and I have radically different play styles, and I've attributed you making a mountain out of a molehill to being disingenuous when no you're just like this.
I at no point called this AI or suggested it was fake.In post 142, GuiltyLion wrote:
also now that tris has answered this, I want to jump in - I also thought this was a fairly scummy/bad question from Elbirn.In post 95, Elbirn wrote:
You meta'd someone on page 3 about their RVS behavior?In post 72, tris wrote:I took a look at some of Baezu's games, and her RVS's there seem pretty consistent with how she was here. Even sometimes when there was more relevant content to react to. UNVOTE:
tris already looked town to me at this point, and it isn't hard to believe someone could or would quickly meta RVS behavior for a slot when that behavior is specifically under contention. meta-ing RVS is easier/simpler than meta-ing entire games.
further, what's the scum!incentive or explanation for tris to do a fake "meta" and then unvote? why does Elbirn think this question will help him sort tris? If he thinks she's lying about it, why would he not just come out and say he doesn't believe it? There's no answer to this question from tris that would genuinely help read her, it reads more like a question meant to shade and fake engagement.
Meta is largely bullshit that I don't believe in and someone jumping to it as their first tool to get a read on someone, when it's page 3 and that someone has all of like 3 posts, makes my soul die
I feel like I'm just over here trying to play a normal game and there's at least 3 super try hards in here ready and waiting to crawl inside everyones assholes over every bit of minutiae and I'm like fvxking ughhhhhh
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UNVOTE:
I don't even want this I just want my question answered-
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I don't see what's so confusing. Please get off of your fence and tell me what you think about Me/Lion?In post 135, Invisibility wrote:i feel like someone comes out scummy in this gl elbirn thing but my mind literally cannot compute whats happeenenign-
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In post 167, Enigma wrote:guys what happened to rvs and where did the walls come from
Respectfully, you couldn't read 7 pages in the 3 hours between these posts?In post 168, Enigma wrote:sorry was going to read tonight but ran out of time, ill catch up over the next few days
I understand if you have things going on irl but please come play the game, you beetlejuicing into here and then not doing anything is a bad look-
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People see walls and angry people and they get scaredIn post 180, Baezu wrote:Honestly, invisibility did that too.
I’m not really sure why there is so much lurking...
I don't blame them so do I-
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Okay I have a question for you and then I'll fuckoff because most of this page is me now
What's up with the Yes Mafia vote, you never explained a read here? What do yousee-
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What did you mean by this?In post 186, rosterfoster wrote: Really sticking your neck out there aren’t you YM?
And what prompted this vote, aside from what you were replying to?
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YM, why these four in particular as a group? I can draw names out of a hat but that wouldn't mean much. Do you see a connection between these four that I don't?In post 185, Yes Mafia wrote:I think theres scum in at least 1 of insomnia/gl/rooster/skittles-
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"Town should mislynch the players that scum wants us to mislynch."In post 263, insomnia wrote: No, getting rid of mislynch bait, which scum want alive, is what town should do.-
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In post 271, Invisibility wrote:ehhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh
VOTE: yes
don’t claim or I will suck your shoes like pastaIn post 275, Invisibility wrote:ugh yes is probably doing this crap as playstyle because eogiiekejhowknwgiosbegh
UNVOTE:Vizzy are you okay
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Well that's uhh...a thing, but you didnt quite answer my question, which I will now reiterate with your new lynch pool in mind.In post 286, Yes Mafia wrote:
Senor Elbirn, my lynch pool now = tris/gl/rooster/skittles/enigma/volxIn post 258, Elbirn wrote:
YM, why these four in particular as a group? I can draw names out of a hat but that wouldn't mean much. Do you see a connection between these four that I don't?In post 185, Yes Mafia wrote:I think theres scum in at least 1 of insomnia/gl/rooster/skittles
Why these six in particular as a group? I can draw names out of a hat but that wouldn't mean much. Do you see a connection between these six that I don't?-
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.....Eh.
Playing poorly =/= being scum
I want to lynch the latter, not people who are guilty of the former.
Your idea is well intentioned but I can already imagine that YM is going to be the inevitable low charisma/lurker/"Bad at mafia" Day 1 "Compromise" lynch (tm) and I'd rather spend this day phase....not on that.-
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UNVOTE:In post 401, Enigma wrote:i think there is someone else i want to vote for now though, someone join me on this pls
VOTE: Baezu
Sell me-
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I'm not going to argue against lurkers being a liabilityIn post 407, insomnia wrote:Explain what’s wrong about it and how you deal with lack of apathy from players and their unwilligness to spew themselves town and how that makes them not a liability later in the game and argue how slots that fit into this cathegory benefit town
But we gain nothing in terms of information/associations, being bad at mafia still =/= being scum, and these are the exact sorts of people to be vigged if anything and you insisting the opposite is haha nah man-
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A good vig shoots liabilities, not makes unilateral decisions based on their own reads instead of the good of the people
We should be lynching contentious slots that generate info, not nothing nobodies who give no information
I'm also not arguing for a cop to check these slots you'll notice, and none of this semantic babble is even helpful if theres no vig so you got me I just dont like making people dead because "hurr they're not doing anything shit down their neck", I want to make people dead because they're scum
Pedit: this was to insomnia-
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Like
I'll lynch YM push come to shove
But if we cant come up with anything better in 10 days that's just sad-
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@EnigmaIn post 405, Elbirn wrote:
UNVOTE:In post 401, Enigma wrote:i think there is someone else i want to vote for now though, someone join me on this pls
VOTE: Baezu
Sell me-
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In post 495, insomnia wrote:Can we just all agree YM is the best lynch for today and stop acting like we don’t believe that
Stop trying to bullshit through lynches on weak players and start trying to lynch scumIn post 498, insomnia wrote:You can’t pressure a player like YM, just lynch.
Thanks in advance-
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In post 466, Elbirn wrote:
@EnigmaIn post 405, Elbirn wrote:
UNVOTE:In post 401, Enigma wrote:i think there is someone else i want to vote for now though, someone join me on this pls
VOTE: Baezu
Sell me-
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UNVOTE:In post 564, insomnia wrote:Prod dodge yeet
Ah, game relevant content? I’m town
K see ya tomorrow, I’ll be doing this until we reach a consensus
Or when I get on my pc
VOTE: Insomnia-
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This isnt entirely necessary I dont think, better to just let this whole business go awayIn post 574, Enigma wrote:
also, i wanted to mention:In post 444, rosterfoster wrote:
Sorry but that family emergency business screwed up the wagon on Insomnia which would have got good reads. I am not comfortable voting someone who has RL issues D1.In post 381, Baezu wrote:I really don’t like this post from roster- he’s been tunneling insomnia the whole game if you look at his iso, it’s scummy
see the ban announcements thread about this "family emergency business"
Remove Roster I think, but I am currently looking at skitter and bae as today's lynch pool yeah. I'd vote skitter but idk where shes at now that I've hopped offIn post 573, Enigma wrote:i just noticed volxen has noticed some of the same things ... i didnt read that until after i posted sorry
rn im feeling lynching between skitter, baezu and maybe rooster
likely other comments incoming as i catch up
UNVOTE:-
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Me neitherIn post 609, ofrhz wrote: I don’t think a wall post readslist from skitter makes her townier
I just wanna see what happens if we wagon two scum versus each other-
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I'm really not sure what your read on volxen is after reading the above. Is he only a scumread if baezu is town? Theres nothing independently scummy about him and he's a townread otherwise?In post 618, insomnia wrote:Volxen has good posts as always, if baezu flips town then he would be the next person I'd look into. He knows how to build a proper scum case and knows when to take advantage of an easy push. If Baezu is town then his actions are really scummy and therefore he's an easy scum read / push.
Given volxen's lurkiness, I tend to believe he's a really analytical person, because even though he's not that active, when he is, he goes for quality rather than quantity. You can see the amount of time and effort behind a scum read ; the lengthy thought process.
I townread volxen I just want to poke your brain-
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In post 627, light_ganski wrote:Vote Count 1.12
skitter30 (6)- tris, ofrhz, Enigma, GuiltyLion, rosterfoster, MariaR
Baezu (2)- Elbirn, insomnia
tris (1)- skitter30
Enigma (1)- Yes Mafia
Yes Mafia (1)- Invisibility
Not Voting (2)- volxen, Baezu
As there are 13 players alive, it takes 7 votes to lynch.
You have(expired on 2019-04-16 23:24:30)until the deadline.intent to hammer
@Skitter speak now or forever hold your peace (aka claim)-
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Hi skitter I'm giving you until like 24ish hours from this post before hammer because I respect you and all but I'm not gonna let you low activity lurk the wagon away not saying you are just saying it's a possible thing people do idkIn post 629, Elbirn wrote:In post 627, light_ganski wrote:Vote Count 1.12
skitter30 (6)- tris, ofrhz, Enigma, GuiltyLion, rosterfoster, MariaR
Baezu (2)- Elbirn, insomnia
tris (1)- skitter30
Enigma (1)- Yes Mafia
Yes Mafia (1)- Invisibility
Not Voting (2)- volxen, Baezu
As there are 13 players alive, it takes 7 votes to lynch.
You have(expired on 2019-04-16 23:24:30)until the deadline.intent to hammer
@Skitter speak now or forever hold your peace (aka claim)-
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Yeah I figured she just hasn't been here, like I dont mean to be a dick I just want to be firm on the "not being ignored" thingIn post 655, ofrhz wrote:She’s usually vla at this time but she’ll probably be here in ~12 hours-
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Okie tyIn post 665, skitter30 wrote: vt; i regularly don't have internt access for part of the weekend
Anyone have anything to say or do we want to end today?-
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VOTE: BaezuIn post 685, Baezu wrote:Woohoo! Good lynch guys!
Cheerleading the scum lynch
Associatives with skitter
Let's skip to day 3 fam-
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Because its phony and fake. 48 hours later and you're excited about the scum lynch? That you didn't vote for?In post 690, Baezu wrote:
How is this scum indicative?In post 689, Elbirn wrote: VOTE: Baezu
Cheerleading the scum lynch
Associatives with skitter
Let's skip to day 3 fam
It's just the latest of your tonally awkward posts-
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In post 701, Invisibility wrote:i did some more of the catch up
I'll be honest I haven't felt like what you're doing is...useful.In post 702, Invisibility wrote:or reread or whatever
Can you at least do this with Skitter/ofrhz flips in mind?-
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- Content Aficionado
- Posts: 5384
- Joined: November 16, 2014
- Location: [GMT-4]
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Elbirn Content Aficionado
- Content Aficionado
- Content Aficionado
- Posts: 5384
- Joined: November 16, 2014
- Location: [GMT-4]
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Elbirn Content Aficionado
- Content Aficionado
- Content Aficionado
- Posts: 5384
- Joined: November 16, 2014
- Location: [GMT-4]
1. I dont scumread volxenIn post 805, rosterfoster wrote:Why not Volxen? I’m happy to go with GL but I want to know why/if you townread Volxen? And why the change in heart over Baezu?
Cos I feel a Volxen flip gives us info about Baezu.
1a. I kinda feel as though GL should be your main scumread based on what you said, but in all fairness I read those posts days ago
2. I have not changed my mind about baezu. I unvoted because I dont want the day to be only several hours long. Also, I want to play with my food a bit. If shes town she should be able to show us that. If shes scum I want her to drop more associatives for us to work with.
In post 810, Invisibility wrote:hey roster could you organize all the reasons you scumread volxen into one post
Low post count is meaningless.In post 811, rosterfoster wrote:-Only has 12 posts
-Skitter jumped to tris wagon to try to save herself, then Volxen almost seemed to be trying to direct Skitter to Baezu as he thought that would work.
Skitter not taking the obvious route of voting for Baezu is a strike against baezu, not volxen. This point is bananas.
Plausible but too easy. I'll be disappointed if this game is that simple. I've had lingering misgivings about GL, though I want their replacement to come play now that they're out.In post 820, insomnia wrote:I think you’re scum, roster. Along with baezu.
Qctually I just want eveveevevereveveeveveryeveveevevereveveeveveryo wow fuck you phone, actually I just want everyone to come play
UNVOTE:-
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Elbirn Content Aficionado
- Content Aficionado
- Content Aficionado
- Posts: 5384
- Joined: November 16, 2014
- Location: [GMT-4]
Oh I forgot about my snappy one linerIn post 805, rosterfoster wrote:Why not Volxen? I’m happy to go with GL but I want to know why/if you townread Volxen? And why the change in heart over Baezu?
Cos I feel a Volxen flip gives us info about Baezu.
I dont lynch for information. I lynch to kill scum like a normal person.-
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Elbirn Content Aficionado
- Content Aficionado
- Content Aficionado
- Posts: 5384
- Joined: November 16, 2014
- Location: [GMT-4]
A hunch
I mostly just wanted to see if roster would vote GL, its weird that he didn't.-
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Elbirn Content Aficionado
- Content Aficionado
- Content Aficionado
- Posts: 5384
- Joined: November 16, 2014
- Location: [GMT-4]