Mini 1610 - House M.D. Mafia! (Day 5!)

[shaddowez]

VOTE: kthxbye

The name says it all.

Beck, what medicines are you taking that you've lied to us about not taking?

[shaddowez]

3. It is in town's best interest to massclaim only the "ability to cure types of diseases" part of roles on day one. Specifically, this forces scum to follow town consensus for healing.

An extra benefit of this is that killing the "healer" for a sick person effectively makes them an innocent child while they suffer before their death, which can be HUGE in forcing scum to make sub-optimal kills.

4. We need to treat whoever is infected like they are up for a second lynch, following (3) happens. A simple vote of "heal" or "do not heal" would likely be sufficient.

3. How does this help force scum into making sub-optimal kills? Wouldn't getting rid of the healer help them eliminate two townies for the price of one?

4. If the healer is dead as a result of point 3...how can we heal them?

If I'm understanding the theory properly, if scum kills the healer, they're making the diseased person conftown. Since they won't necessarily die right away, that gives town a slight advantage.

[shaddowez]

3. It is in town's best interest to massclaim only the "ability to cure types of diseases" part of roles on day one. Specifically, this forces scum to follow town consensus for healing.

An extra benefit of this is that killing the "healer" for a sick person effectively makes them an innocent child while they suffer before their death, which can be HUGE in forcing scum to make sub-optimal kills.

4. We need to treat whoever is infected like they are up for a second lynch, following (3) happens. A simple vote of "heal" or "do not heal" would likely be sufficient.

3. How does this help force scum into making sub-optimal kills? Wouldn't getting rid of the healer help them eliminate two townies for the price of one?

4. If the healer is dead as a result of point 3...how can we heal them?

If I'm understanding the theory properly, if scum kills the healer, they're making the diseased person conftown. Since they won't necessarily die right away, that gives town a slight advantage.

Or a free poisoner-like ability?

That's true, too. You also have to think about the fact that the diseased could be scum, though. If they're consistently killing healers, they're auto-killing one of their own. If they all of a sudden decide not to kill a healer, there's a good chance the diseased person in scum. Otherwise, they have to not kill the healers on a regular basis to give diseased-scum a chance of staying in the game.

[shaddowez]

UNVOTE:

I don't like the fact the kthx wagon is over half full already. Mine was an RVS vote, and we've had two naked votes on him since RVS (though one of them is supposedly just for sheeping).

Also, possible MS?

[shaddowez]

What a boring vote.

He looks more town than he does scum atm.

Referring to the Brian vote or the Jingle vote?

[shaddowez]

VOTE: kthxbye

He's contributed so much to the game, I'm not sure how we'll proceed without him. [/sarcasm]

[shaddowez]

The reason I'm voting shaddowez (and the reason other town should be voting him) is because he jumps off my wagon because is suspicious that others are jumping on for no reason and his vote is RVS. He then turns around and jumps right back on with regurgitated reasoning of my activity level being weak...while at the same time having no actual activity himself (hypocrisy is for the scum).

That's funny....you voted me before I jumped back on your wagon, so how can the reason you're voting me because I jumped back on your wagon?

We should treat for both and see if he improves.

This goes against the whole idea of deciding as town if we should heal people or not before treating them.

Unvote

Vote: Anatole Kuragin

Any reason for this vote? Pretty sure we were out of RVS by then.

kthxbye - talk to me! who on your bw,

if you are town

, looks scummy to you?

The bolded part in Mantis' post feels a little forced. There should be no reason to have to add that in there, unless you know the person is town and want to try and make it sound as if you don't.

Mantis also doesn't give any explanation for her vote on MC, except for stating in Post #154 that that's one of her scumreads right now.

On top of the buddying with kthx and lack of actual content in her posts, I'm going to add my vote to this wagon.

VOTE: Mantis

Also, is it me or do we already have multiple people due for a prod?

[shaddowez]

@Mod

, can you fix my url tag in the previous post please?

[shaddowez]

I forgot that all wagons happen randomly, and that other people voting/looking at scum possibilities doesn't lead to other people looking into them. I'll go back to rolling a die to see who to vote for now.

[shaddowez]

I forgot that all wagons happen randomly, and that other people voting/looking at scum possibilities doesn't lead to other people looking into them. I'll go back to rolling a die to see who to vote for now.

who is town to you?

At this point Beck and ABR both seem town to me. They're contributing and keeping discussion up. (Side note - as for my activity, I will generally only be posting from 7:00 PM - 3:00 AM EST, so don't expect to see much from me outside of that).

I'm wary of kthx...his initial argument on me was extremely weak, and he's trying to substantiate why he voted on me based on interactions afterwards. The interaction between the two of you is making me nervous as well, especially considering both of you basically placed OMGUS votes on me. However, I don't necessarily think that he's scum at this point in time.

I have a null or no read on pretty much everybody else right now.

slight

defense

there?

Not being defensive, showing the ridiculousness of your statement.

ya but he's my friend. i'm gonna get a little

defensive

.

So you're allowed to be defensive of someone without being scum, but when you accuse me of being defensive it's scummy enough for a vote?

Do you wish to claim?

ABR

- why would you ask for a claim so early?

[shaddowez]

ABR randomly harassing people without content is not "keeping discussion up". It's certainly activity but I think you'd be hard pressed to make the case that it's of any particular use beyond "activity is good"

I'm not necessarily saying it provided a lot of content (either his posts or the responses), but he has done more than a lot of other people in this game (myself included).

Unvote
Vote: Kthxbye

Why?

[shaddowez]

you give no reasons for any of your votes

. just "i would like to lynch kthx, here's a naked vote on mantis"

I'm glad that you give such in-depth reasoning for all of your votes. Makes us really understand you.

UNVOTE: kthx
VOTE: mc maraca

UNVOTE: mc maraca
VOTE: shaddowez

UNVOTE: shadowez
VOTE: mc maraca


i'm reading it pretty closely brian (?)
fairly familiar...

what is the purpose of these questions?

shadowez and mc maraca for scum
(i think)

Nice fencesitting here. Giving yourself an easy way out when you decide to change your lynch target?

the reason for my mc maraca vote is because i expected more to be said, since they've been mia lately.

So is he scum or just inactive? There are plenty of people with less posts than him (myself included).

DDD

- Do you think ABR is scum, or just not doing anything to help town/forward the game right now?

For me, this game is really hard to read with so few people actually posting

[shaddowez]

If I was trying to justify it I would be explaining why I don't have many posts, not just saying I don't. What I am doing is providing full disclosure, so people don't think "Oh, look, he's saying such-and-such about other people but it applies to him too, wonder what he's hiding"

[shaddowez]

well ok.. let me ask you what your thoughts on mc maraca's posts? take a look at the iso

Mostly a prod postponement post, but wanted to let you know I haven't forgotten about you....things went crazy at work today and didn't get a chance to read/post much. Will do my best to do so tomorrow.

[shaddowez]

Changed my mind, there's not much to read in her ISO.

She suggests a mass claim early on D1, which is a terrible idea. Assuming she's town, she could be doing a reaction test to see if anyone latches onto the idea, or just genuinely think it's a good idea. If she's scum, it's a terrible ploy and makes you look scummy. That being said, I'm not going to say "she's acting too scummy to be scum", especially just from this one play.

She has a couple of posts just throwing out possible diseases, then places a naked vote on Brian. In her next post she makes a comment "Not that anyone cares about me". Possible AtE, feels a bit forced.

Very little content in her later posts outside of defending her earlier vote on wrong understanding of the setup.

In general, she's done a couple of scummy sounding things, but I don't have enough content to read her as scum. Final read is null, leaning slightly scum.

[shaddowez]

This weekend turned out impossible for posting, will be back tomorrow night

[shaddowez]

Whose content is "enough" for you to see scum in?

Your reasonings seem to be in two categories - (1) scummy for lack of contributing discussion (2) town-ish for producing continued discussion

Going to start with your second point first - You're right - those are the reasons I've used so far this game, because of the people that I provided reads/theories on (except for Mantis, which you left out), that is what I felt. I don't feel that any of those people had said anything particularly scummy, or acted in a way that I usually associate with scum in enough of a manner for me to vote them.

Lack of post count/activity isn't necessarily the same as content, either. In a lot of my games I end up posting at different hours than a lot of people, so I don't engage in the back and forth that ups post count, but I try to include a decent amount in my posts. When somebody has a ton of posts, but one or two lines in each that don't offer anything to help the game, either by trying to scumhunt, or doing much to reveal their alignment, I tend to find that scummy.

To actually answer your first question, Anatole and Mantis are pinging me as scum based on what they've posted so far (still not completely convinced on kthx, but more of a town read than I had initially). I have a couple of town reads, but most people in this game right now are null as I'm unable to get a read on them based on not enough interaction with the game.

[shaddowez]

Which posts did you find scummy, shadow?

Not going to do a true PBPA, but I'll do groups:
Your first ten posts are nothing but fluff, without even an RVS vote until you sheep ABR.
When ABR tells you that that's not a good idea yet, you vote somebody who had voted for you, with this as your only explanation:

VOTE: Anatole

Do you plan on fluffposting all game?

The symptoms so far sound like a heart problem to me, so diagnosticians related to the cardiac system might be useful right now.

I don't like this post either. what a tryhard

You then hop back onto the kthx wagon with another naked vote, and then vote Mantis, presumably because of her defending kthx, but you never say that you don't think kthx is scum.

There is absolutely no evidence of scumhunting in any of your posts, and the only people that you've named as scum are people that have either voted you or called you scummy already. Pretty much the only thing of worth you've said all game is that we need some direction heading to deadline.

I'm still not fond of Mantis, but I'm definitely less fond of you right now.

VOTE: Anatole

Why do you feel kthx is more town now than he was early on?

He started actually interacting with more people in the game, and seems to be upfront with his responses. It also looks like he's digging for answers and reasons behind things, not just letting people say stuff without knowing why. There have been a couple of posts I still haven't liked, but they're being outweighed by what I am liking.

[shaddowez]

@shaddowez: How do you go from being uncomfortable of my RVS wagon building quickly to your p110? It looks like your reason for voting me is lurker hunting. Are there any other 'lurkers' that peek your interest? If no, why not?

kthx

- I just found this while doing your ISO - sorry I hadn't responded to it yet. I'm keeping an eye on Wolfy because nothing he's said has impressed me yet, but nothing that screams out scum either.

[shaddowez]

I really don't like the Bert flashwagon that happened. He's been answering questions and looks like he's genuinely trying to determine who is/isn't scum. I still like my Anatole vote, but I'd prefer a lynch than a standalone vote, so I'm putting it back on my second favorite scumread:

VOTE: Mantis

[shaddowez]

^it's understandable that you don't want to put a vote on bert, your scum buddy

And if I did vote Bert, you'd just say I'm scum for being follow-y again. You've got me as confscum with pretty much no case. Nice try, though.

[shaddowez]

which says to me off the bat that Bert's death "arrest" wasn't scum but town

So you think we have a vig? Bert was likely to be lynchbait D2, why do you think a vig would have gone after him?

I'm thinking I'm ok letting Wolfy die from his disease....

Why the sudden deathwish for Wolfy? The only times you've mentioned him were when Anatole was listing him as a suspect. Actually, what are your reads?

[shaddowez]

lazy thinking. don't you want to know anything first? Or do you already know everything you need to know?
do you think the diseases are here just for flavour or does who gets them and what they get have any significance?
Surely having a better understanding of what I've got and how I might have got it would be useful to somebody who is interested in scum hunting...

VOTE: Wolfy

Wagon me up bitches.

UNVOTE:
VOTE: kthx

Better to let the disease ravage Wolfy and to die that way rather than using our lynch there.

So, kthx, who you've been trying to lynch for a while, makes a comment about just letting Wolfy die from the disease. Wolfy comes back with reasonable questions, then you do nothing but post back Wolfy's reponse and vote for him....then you go back to voting kthx and saying the same exact thing about Wolfy that kthx did....yeah, not liking this.

VOTE: DDD

[shaddowez]

The speed of the DDD wagon concerns me, but the fact that there's no counterwagon concerns me even more.

ABR

- Do you have anything to contribute today other than two naked votes and just pushing for DDD to claim?

[shaddowez]

The speed of the DDD wagon concerns me, but the fact that there's no counterwagon concerns me even more.

ABR

- Do you have anything to contribute today other than two naked votes and just pushing for DDD to claim?

This looks reeeeally scummy.

Ah right, this coming from someone who's provided next to nothing for this game. And that's saying a lot, considering how low activity this game has been in general. Could you please elaborate on what sounds scummy about it, other than the fact that you think I'm scum with no case at all?

There's cognitive dissonance because he keeps his vote on DDD while voicing major concerns. Let's see what he posts next.

I don't see an issue here, because I never said I don't feel that DDD is scummy. Concerns about the wagons don't automatically negate all reads I had, and considering he had already dropped to L-2, and based on activity I wasn't really concerned about a two vote speedlynch, I decided to leave my vote where it was. However, Anatole's lovely post has reaffirmed my feelings on him, and I believe him to be scummier than DDD, so now I will move my vote.

VOTE: Anatole

[shaddowez]

This is at least the second time, with a cursory glance, you can see that he votes popular wagons while hedging his bets and expressing reservations. It's scummy because it looks like he doesn't really believe the wagon will lynch scum and doesn't want to look as bad after the flip.

I like how you're mixing up the timeline of my posts in order to make your story sound better.

My very first post was 17, where I place the

first

RVS vote on kthx. In 81 I unvote because I didn't like the speed of the wagon, when I basically had nothing to go on for my vote other than it was RVS. I then jump back on in 110, because between my unvote and that post, I did feel like his posts were coming across scummy. In 180, I move my vote to Mantis because I found her scummier, and make no mention of kthx's wagon. At no point during this vote chain did I "vote a popular wagon" while "hedging bets" or "expressing reservations".

My next vote was on Mantis, and the only vote change I made was to you, and I never made any sort of comment about disliking Mantis' wagon.

The next comment I made expressing dislike about a wagon was in 576, which was about the Bert wagon that

I was never on

.

On D2, I voted DDD because he was coming across as scummy to me. In 692 I say I don't like the fact that there's no counterwagon, and then in 702 I move my vote. Ten posts later, and the only two posts that have anything to do with me are you saying it looks scummy, and ABR saying to wait to see what I post next (abridged and paraphrased). Again, not continuing to vote the popular wagon while hemming and hawing.

If you'd like to try again to explain how I've done this more than once, let alone at all, I'm willing to listen.

[shaddowez]

Mmm... I think you're probably town. Maybe help me get shaddowz lynched?

Want to explain any reasoning, since all you've done (Cabd) is place a naked vote on me and then ask to help have me lynched?

kthx

- What do you think about Anatole?

(PS - attending a wedding tomorrow, so won't be back around until Sunday night)

[shaddowez]

Wolfy

-

Believing

you'd be alive 24 hours from your last post shouldn't have been enough to not post content. If there was more activity in general, I would definitely see that as a stall tactic.

Nope, I am what I claimed.

Forgot about the vt claim.

Yeah, let's lynch the PR over VT...genius.

I'm not avoiding anything.

How bout this, I'll even self vote tomorrow if DDD flips town.

I don't like this post on a number of levels. First, DDD never claimed - Mara asked if he did, but nowhere in his ISO did he. Secondly, if DDD

had

claimed, would you be looking at him differently if he had claimed a PR? The line about lynching the PR over the VT sounds opportunistic at best. Offering to self vote is also a terrible idea - first off, if you are actually town and you're doing that you're playing against wincon. Secondly, it's just as likely that some excuse will come up to vote someone else.

I still think Anatole is scummier than kthx though, and don't necessarily think they're buddies, so I'd rather see Anatole hang first.

[shaddowez]

@everyone not voting myself or DDD: If you had to choose right now between lynching me or DDD, who would you switch to and why?

Right now, I'd have to say DDD. He hasn't done anything toDay that looks anything like scumhunting. As a matter of fact, it doesn't look like he's doing anything but defending himself or answering questions. Even saying he's answering questions is a bit strong, as more than once he's replied with "I've already answered that" or something along those lines.

[shaddowez]

kthx, I believe

[shaddowez]

kthx, I believe

I was right, in Post 766

[shaddowez]

just want ABR to explain his read because I think he is bullshitting

How about you give us a reads list, or something to explain your thought processes? Every vote you've placed has been naked,

occasionally

with a post before or after it giving some lame excuse.

Actually, let's look at who you've called scum and your votes:

3.

Bert

- called scum and voted
4. Wolfy - said should be a lynch candidate, never explicitly called scum or voted
7. Albert B. Rampage - called scum, never voted
10.

Mantisdreamz

- called scum and voted
11. Jingle - never called scum, voted
12. Kthxbye - called scum and voted
13.

shaddowez

- called scummy, never voted

1. Beck - Almost no interaction
2. MC Maraca - Almost no interaction
6. Rogue - Almost no interaction
8. Brian Skies - Almost no interaction
5. Debonair Danny DiPietro - Almost no interaction, but an interesting comment here:

I'd rather go off that hunch than vote myself or forcing DDD to claim as a townie.

So, according to this list, taking out the two people who are already dead, there are still five scum, and that's only out of people you've actually talked about. Yep, leaving my vote on you.

[shaddowez]

Damnit shaddowez....

That actually looks pretty damning. Nice post.

VOTE: Anatole

I didn't vote on bert's lynch and wasn't going to by the end of the day because it was clear ABR had lost his marbles.

Shadow is misrepping either as OMGUS or as a defense mechanism and you're brainless enough to go along with it.

Bert was a NK, he didn't die as a lynch, so if you're saying that your vote wasn't on him when he was lynched, you're absolutely correct. Other than that, posting evidence proves your lying:

VOTE: bert

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Votecount 1.5

[0] Beck:

[0] MC Maraca:

[5]

Bert:

Albert B. Rampage, Anatole Kuragin, Kthxbye, Jingle, Mantisdreamz

[0] Wolfy:

[0] Debonair Danny DiPietro:

[0] Rogue:

[0] Albert B. Rampage:

[0] Brian Skies:

[0] Anatole Kuragin:

[6]

MantisDreamz:

MC Maraca, Bert, Brian Skies, shaddowez, Rogue, Wolfy

[1]

Jingle:

Beck

[1]

Kthxbye:

DDD

[0] Shaddowez:

Not Voting (0):

Deadline:

• Wednesday, September 24th, 2014

Mod Notes:

• With 13 alive, it takes 7 to lynch.

[shaddowez]

Actually, I should have quoted this one, where Mantis was lynched at the end of day, and your vote was

still on Bert

Last Votecount of the Day

Votecount 1.6

[0] Beck:

[0] MC Maraca:

[5]

Bert:

Albert B. Rampage, Anatole Kuragin, Kthxbye, Jingle, Mantisdreamz

[0] Wolfy:

[0] Debonair Danny DiPietro:

[0] Rogue:

[0] Albert B. Rampage:

[0] Brian Skies:

[0] Anatole Kuragin:

[LYNCHED]

MantisDreamz:

MC Maraca, Bert, Brian Skies, shaddowez, Rogue, Wolfy, DDD

[1]

Jingle:

Beck

[0] Kthxbye:

[0] Shaddowez:

Not Voting (0):

Deadline:

• Wednesday, September 24th, 2014

Mod Notes:

• With 13 alive, it takes 7 to lynch.

Flip will come in a bit.

[shaddowez]

The person I need to move is you and that's what I'm trying to do because as I already said, if I move you, then discussion for everyone else narrows to Anatole or kthx and that should be an obvious choice to even the most blind

What makes this so obvious? You haven't said anything whatsoever about the Anatole case, one way or the other.

[shaddowez]

I definitely agree with kthx and ABR. I still think Anatole is scum, but I'm fine with moving my vote back to DDD. Between the dodging of questions, the lack of willingness to claim, the repeating disappearing wagon (which neither Jingle nor Anatole have ever been on, btw), and his tunneling of kthx even when there was a case for Anatole being made, DDD has done nothing to make me think he's town since I moved my vote off of him. Since it appears more likely that a DDD lynch is going to happen than an Anatole lynch, I'll move my vote back to DDD. (I believe this may be L-1 based on kthx's vote count and ABR's move).

VOTE: DDD

I think the wolfy/DDD votes on each other look too messy to actually be bussing, but I could be wrong. An anatole/DDD/Jingle team seems much more likely, especially with the logic kthx spelled out regarding Jingle's last post.

[shaddowez]

wait nvm hes l-1 he has to claim or i hammer

What are your current thoughts on kthx, since that's where your vote has been?

[shaddowez]

I'll be around intermittently tonight, but then V/LA for the weekend.

@MOD - I'll be V/LA until Monday, 10/13

[shaddowez]

DDD is probably town. ABR and one of or both of kthx/shadow are probably scum.

So, again, it's everybody (aside from MC) that decided to vote for you, because you're acting extremely scummy?

Good call on DDD. I'll admit my skepticism was colored a bit by the fact you thought I was scum too.

Wow, that's a good excuse. "Person x thinks I'm scum, there's no way that they could be voting for actual scum".

See;

I wouldn't mind being lynched because I'm not actually invested in the game and nor is Notty.

I don't mind the Beck kill because he was pissing me off all last day.

There's probably a busser on the DDD wagon. Off the top of my head I want to say Wolfy, but that's because I think his vote looks like a votepark vote than anything else.

Considering there was not two kills, either one was blocked or someone chose not to shoot. Could be either or.

ABR explain to me why Ika is scum? I was leaning slighty town tbh. Kkthx is town, but is wrong about the conclusions of the VCA.

Shaddowez might be scum.

VOTE: Shaddowez

Going to place that for now. Might be back on wednesday at the latest.

~R

Yes wifi go fuck yourselves. I hate that you drop me every 2 minutes

So, there was one kill N1, and one kill N2. Granted there was different flavor, but there was still only one kill each night. The phrasing of the bolded part makes me think that you know something more than you should. Care to explain?

I can see a wolfy/rogue team, and am willing to vote either of them or Anatole.

For now, I'm going to stick with my gut and put my vote where my mouth is.

VOTE: Anatole

[shaddowez]

ABR

- I actually did read your case, and agree with quite a bit of it. Meant to say in my previous post, but your post is what made me actually read scum on him, rather than null/lean scum.

I've had quite a few people call me scum this game, and a couple of them actually put their vote on me. I know I'm not, however, and having people call me scum without being able to back it up doesn't bother me.

[shaddowez]

@shaddowez - what are the bits of ABR's case on me you agree with? And where do you disagree?

Agree

:

• Your change of opinion regarding DDD, from scum to town to scum, seemed a little too well-timed, considering your last flip around wasn't until a wagon was forming on him.
  
• Your lack of posting relevant info with the possibility of dying when you were sick definitely seemed either scummy, or like you
  knew
  you were going to survive.

Disagree

:

• I don't believe that low activity indicates scumminess. I am much more swayed by content in people's posts than the number of posts they have.
  
• I don't agree that you should claim yet. (ABR changed his mind about this, but I am answering as of the time of the posting).

[shaddowez]

It's shadowez.

Nice try, but you're incorrect. Assuming a three-person scum team (going off all the minis I've been in, don't know if that's standard or not but it's all I know), that would complete your team. Your scum reads are jumping all over the place this game.

I take 1030 back. I don't want to be premature, there's still a lot of room for error.

My strong townreads are, in no particular order, MC Maraca , Rogue, kthx.

That leaves Wolfy, Anatole, Jingle, ika and shadowez. I'll be focusing my attention on these players.

You've now said you believe Rogue and kthx are scum, so that leaves MC as the only person in this game you haven't thought is scum at one point or another.

You also flip-flopped

a lot

on the DDD read, and outright said at one point "we've already gone down the DDD road", as if you were giving up on it.

I haven't been in any other games with ABR, can anybody give insight on to whether or not he is likely to hard bus a scum buddy?

[shaddowez]

I never said that Rogue is scum. You're flailing and it's apparent.

Vote Rogue

You're right, you never said it. I guess you just voted her because you thought she was town then.

[shaddowez]

It's important to know that disease and infection does not discriminate! The mechanic is global both in definition and functionality,

and has a chance to infect either no one in a given day

, or 1 player in a single day.

[shaddowez]

scince you have enough time to point that out to me, how about some reads or imput?

That's actually kind of funny coming from you, since you've provided almost no reads yourself and have almost all naked votes, but I'll oblige.

I'm still pretty sure Anatole is scum - if you don't know why, check my ISO.
MC and kthx are my solid town reads right now, though I also think that Jingle and wolfy are.
You, Rogue, and ABR (in that order) are my next set of scum reads.

As a matter of fact, I can definitely see an Anatole/ika scum team. Brian Skies has one mention of Anatole before replacing out, and that was only talking about a game he modded that had ABR/Anatole in it. Anatole says absolutely nothing directly to Brian outside of one line in RVS that was pretty much useless. There's also this interesting post.

Once Ika replaces in, Anatole and Ika have exactly one mention of each other in their ISO, and they're both quoting the same post from ABR about the Anatole/Ika scum team.

So, yeah, I'm keeping my vote on Anatole for now, but will gladly compromise on an Ika lynch.

[shaddowez]

Sorry for the absence, life got busier than expected. Will be back Sunday night

[shaddowez]

What I'm trying to say is I want people to explain to me why Mc Mara is an universal town read. What have they done to get there?

~M

Actually, that's a good question. I was in a rush to post, and honestly don't know why I was thinking that upon review of their ISO. I don't know if I read them as scum, but definitely not a "solid town read" like I said in my previous post.

Why do you have such a town read on Wolfy, or is it purely meta?

If you aren't going to follow onto Jingle, the only one of those 2 I'd even consider today is shaddowez, but I still have a town read on him. Maybe it's because I feel he is seeing my logic of how absurd it is to still think I'm scum at this point. /shrug.

So you no longer have a scum read on Anatole? His wagon is becoming similar to DDD, the one that keeps forming but never actually ends up getting lynched.

[shaddowez]

At this point my only real townreads are ABR and ika. I don't want to lynch Wolfy for *reasons*.

I can't believe that kthx is still slipping the noose. Hopefully I won't be puking tomorrow and can set aside some time for this game.

@mod: what is the current VC?

What about Ika makes you think he's town? I'm convinced there's scum in AK/Ika, and there's a good chance that it's both of them.

2. MC Maraca

4. Wolfy

6. Rogue

7. Albert B. Rampage

8. Ika

9. Anatole Kuragin

11. Jingle

12. Kthxbye

13. shadowwez

truth be told this game has been dead so i have like had nothign to do with it

lets move on with our lives with wagons:

VOTE: AK

That's a pretty list - mind explaining it? I can assume what it's supposed to be, but would rather hear it from you so I know exactly what I'm looking at.

VOTE: AK

L-1

It's never been reflected in the votecounts, but I don't think this is the first time AK has hit L-1 and the wagon's fallen apart. I don't like it. I'm willing to compromise on an Ika lynch, or maybe a wolfy lynch if it's that or no lynch.

[shaddowez]

Sorry for the absence everyone - went V/LA while the thread was locked, PMed Ven but he never put it in a VC.

you need to tell me what you think of it first.

if you think its a read list go ahead and tell me what you agree or disagree with, if you think its something else tell me

My best guess is that greens are town reads, reds are scum reads, and yellows are somewhere in between. You have yourself in blue as a conftown, which I'm not positive about yet. I also wasn't sure about the Wolfy read, which I realize is easy to say now that he's flipped, but I also wasn't on his wagon. It's hard to agree/disagree with your yellows, since there's no evidence of which side you're leaning with any of them.

^idiot

honestly, I hope you're NKed

can scum NK themselves? If so, do the world a favor

slip

How do you see that as a slip?

@Mod: Replace Rogue with Mala pls

Also, AK is bothering me because he's seems to have slipped off the radar waiting to see if the pressure on him might go away.

So I'm okay with a Mara lynch or a AK lynch.

VOTE: Mc Mara

I know you've been asking about Mara, but you talk more about AK in this post. Why the vote on Mara over AK?

VOTE: kthank

Assuming I was right on how to read your list, why the change of vote to one of your "yellows" instead of your other "red"?

actually...

VOTE: Anatole

Wolfy's lynch yesterday most likely has scum on it and between Anatole and MC, I'm saying Anatole.

I know you're reading ika as town because of the VCA, but a lot of people use VCA and many know how to manipulate their vote placement due to that. If you're that confident there was scum on the wagon, why aren't you even considering ika as a possibility?

@shaddowez: Do you think DDD was bussed? If yes, then do you think ika is scum given my reasons why I think he's not? What's your read list looking like?

I generally assume that bussing is occurring, partially because of VCA. Anyone not on a scum flip generally gets looked at with a little more scrutiny than the people on the wagon. I still think it's very possible that ika is scum, and actually disagree with your view of what happened in twilight. There's no way to know when the mod is going to lock the thread, so it's possible he hammered before he said he was going to to attempt to cut off discussion even more.

My reads are like this:

Scum --> AK
Lean Scum --> ika, Jingle
Null - Mara
Lean Town --> Rogue
Town - kthx

AK has still not done a single thing this game that slightly resembles scum hunting, and of the people that have flipped has not placed a single vote on somebody that hasn't flipped town. It may be tunneling, but I'm still trying for that AK lynch that somehow keeps almost-but-not-actually happening.

VOTE: AK

Also, I haven't noticed anyone do it recently, but I know a few people claimed after it was called for. I'm Dr. Rowan Chase, Town Immunologist. I healed Beck Day 1, though I'll admit, it was partially accidental. I did think he was town, but I also didn't realize I'd actually cure him, my role PM made me think I would just diagnose him.

[shaddowez]

I healed Beck Day 1, though I'll admit, it was partially accidental.

Explain.

I also didn't realize I'd actually cure him, my role PM made me think I would just diagnose him.

It was before Ven clarified in thread.

http://house.wikia.com/wiki/Rowan_Chase

VOTE: Shaddowez

Wow, you can use Google (or some other random search engine), I'm so proud! I like how you managed to not involve yourself in the conversation regarding whether or not scum can have healing powers, or the conversation regarding whether roles/characters lined up, and are now voting me because of one (or both) of them.

For anyone that is still thinking I'm scum, let's revisit the "Can scum have healing abilities" conversation. If you don't think so, let's examine the following facts:

• Beck was cured of Sepsis, listed as an autoimmune disease
  
• The only doctor that's flipped with a healing ability was town
  
• That doctor was a neurologist, so couldn't have been the one to cure Beck
  
• Nobody has CCed me yet

If you do think that scum has healing abilities, why would any of them have healed Beck on D1, knowing he was town, when there was discussion about voting to heal people? That could have easily slipped through the cracks and been an easy town death early in the game.

kthx

- What are your most recent thoughts on MC?

[shaddowez]

Small Clarification:

Any hypothetical player or role that could hypothetically create a diagnosis on a sick player, will automatically begin to treat and/or cure the player. Achieving a diagnosis will function the same as curing the player, so keep this in mind, being right means having to do the humane right thing!

point moot

I'm not sure I understand this - I said it was before Ven clarified in thread; Hell, Beck was cured well before this post.

scums or town can have it its besides the point that you did.

herees a better question: do you think jingles is scum?

I listed him as leaning scum in 1375, though I think MC Maraca is working their way into that pile as well.

[shaddowez]

For anyone with a diagnostic role, are you able to use it in thread, or do you have to use it in a PM?

Also, if anyone other than MC cured Wolfy, now would be a good time to out yourself and prove MC is lying. Knowing that I cured Beck is enough reason for me to vote.

Interesting note: While we have had VT flips, the scum flip didn't have a role, while two of our townies did. While it almost seems like it would make it too easy, if only townies have actual roles, the two people claiming to not have abilities could be our two scum. Don't know the setup, but it's possible.

Oh, and here's an interesting link regarding DDD's role. A quote from the page:

Robert Chase agreed to spy on House for Vogler, essentially in a bid to save his own job.

Leaving my vote where it is.

[shaddowez]

How do you know you cured Beck. Did Ven send you a PM saying such?

I use a PM, and I already sent it. I'm assuming that if we don't cure MC before Ven gets it, the results will be in the next VC.

Yes he did. I need clarification from Ven on how much more I'm allowed to say about it though....I'll PM him, and depending on his answer will say more.

the two people claiming to not have abilities could be our two scum

I thought everyone claimed an ability.

Everyone claimed a role - AK said he's a cardiologist, but has no ability. MC didn't specify what they could do, only that they're Cameron and that they can cure diseases by posting in thread. Everybody else said they had an ability to use.

[shaddowez]

Town immunologist. Can check if the patient has am autoimmune disorder, or if their immune system has been compromised

[shaddowez]

Jingle

- kthx already sort of did in 1414 with the names... Do you think it's remotely possible he's trying to do this to do the same thing with powers?

Also, while I'm still not convinced AK is town, somehow other people are looking scummier.

In going to offer to 1v1 MC. They had their vote on me before we claimed, then claimed the same role as I did after I claimed. Neither of the other two people who got diseases were as vocal about getting healed, and they both flipped town. Lynching me today will put you in Mylo tomorrow, unless I did my numbers wrong.

UNVOTE:
VOTE: MC Maraca

[shaddowez]

I thought about self-hammering, since I'm pretty sure town is going to lose this game, but decided I care just a little too much to actually do so.

It's awesome how fast my wagon got to L-1.

Mala

- considering how much crap you were giving about MC not being town, why switch your vote to the person who's directly CCing them? What makes me that much scummier than them, especially considering their claim makes no sense? (How it's used, not who they are).

you understand that MC has the disease right now?

I do, but firmly believe they are scum. We don't know how long the disease will take to kill them, and if scum do have healing powers, it's possible that they could be cured. I see no reason why I shouldn't vote my highest scum read, despite the fact they are currently diseased....I'd rather "waste" the lynch on a diseased person than mislynch town.

Reads:

Town: Ika
Lean-town: Jingle, kthx
Lean-scum: Mala
Scum: AK, MC

[shaddowez]

If I get lynched today, it's yet another day that Anatole has managed to not be lynched. Make sure he dies when I flip town.

[shaddowez]

This game doesn't really seem to be going anywhere. That being said, I'm pretty sure both scum are on my wagon already. Since I'm town, if they weren't I'd have been hammered by now.

[shaddowez]

Mod - I will be V/LA over the weekend (until 11/10)