Mini 1626: Duck Tales Mafia (Game Over)

[DOMO]

We have no idea what is happening, but based on the last 6 posts, we assume that this is scum v scum.

Ok now this had me thinking town at the time. It felt weird that a scum hydra replacing into a game would wade into the current thread argument (me vs pine) without first of all calibrating with the other head or reading up to get some level of context. But knowing from my pov that the pine vs domo argument was scum - town, well it could be opportunism from PN's pov, giving him a mislynch target in the event pine gets lynched. He's already laid the groundwork to dismiss my contribution to the pine lynch.

PN I think you should read me in ISO with pine before you reply to this.

[DOMO]

We have no idea what is happening, but based on the last 6 posts, we assume that this is scum v scum.

[DOMO]

I don't understand the bolded. Or, what your point is other than "those posts (change of mind) make no sense as scum." Which isn't a point.

Assume I'm scum.

I push at farside. Now assume she's scum. Why am I preparing to bus a buddy and then immediately winding my neck in?
Now assume farside is town. Why the hell would I prepare to mislynch farside and then immediately town her?

My position makes no sense as scum, other than to make this very argument.

pedit - that post might be null. At the time it felt town motivated, I explained why a few posts ago. Now it feels scum motivated because you're linking a townie to scum. My comments might be wifomy? Everything is potentially wifomy. Did you say that because you're town who thinks it, or scum pushing a mislynch? Nearly everything in this game can be wifom if you try hard enough. wifom is not a scum tell, and certainly not with me. It's a consequence of my style.

You're implying things that might or might not be there. That's what I'm trying to figure out.

[DOMO]

What? I haven't even gathered a real read on you. If I wanted to push you, I would vote or say I think you're scum.

No, but you've already said that me and pine is scum-scum. That looks bad now, and you should at least understand why I'd think that.

[DOMO]

Look at the timestamps. It is not possible to replace in, then immediately have real opinions about a 60 page heavy game

Indeed. That's why it felt town motivated at the time, it seemed unnecessary for scum to wade in so quickly. But now it feels dodgy du to pine's flip.

I don't even know if I think you're scummy. You're currently in a pool of five, along with bulba, pasch, NM and farside. That's basically where I see the scum.

[DOMO]

i did not know the last lynch was between you and pine

I was never in any serious threat. It was me who pointed out that pine's vote on me was tactical - it left him free to jump on a wagon, or dodge the mislynch, whichever suited him best.

Look, you feel town to me. But shit like "give me a break", just no. If you're town, then from your pov I'm either town scumhunting, or I'm scum pretending to. The last thing you should want is for me to stop doing what I'm doing. I'm trying to get a read from someone in my scum pool, in an attempt to narrow that pool down. I think it's bulba-pasch, but that doesn't mean I'm ignoring everyone else.

[DOMO]

Ok.

bulba pasch nm farside

farside talk to me. Convince me you're town.

[DOMO]

I'm guessing pasch doesn't like my methods of narrowing down the pool.

[DOMO]

It bothers me that I actually agree with Pasch.

It bothers me too. I was on point yesterday? Relating to who? How does pasch know?

Let's assess my d1 performance... first of all I'm swinging for mastin, who now looks like a town PR. Next up is shiny, who is now conf town. Then when I slap a pine vote down, I town bulba, who now looks super scummy. Now there's the bit where I metadive bulba and conclude he's scum. Hmm I'm right about bulba one way ro the other, seeing as I call him scum and town. Continuing, my read on bulba develops into a fully fledged scumread. Then I vote wreck, who feels town to me, despite him suddenly finding my suspect. Next up is aronis, who is now PN, who is starting to feel town. Then there's my faggot dayvig gambit, which was me trolling. Hmm reading my aronis case at #1101 has me worried about PN again. The I jump on pasch himself, despite having not scumread him, based on what I thought was deadline panic. Then back on aronis, then wreck, then mastin, then doubleslap, back to mastin, then finally I'm onto pine and stay there.

Basically my d1 was spazzy as fuck. I probably managed to vote the entire scumteam by throwing my vote around so casually.

I do not consider my d1 play to be "on point", in fact I felt like throughout most of the day I was basically trying to keep myself up to date. On the other hand, I feel like today I have launched myself out of the blocks, intent on being more productive.

wreck agreeing with pasch is weird, but I don't think wreck is scum, I think pasch is scum and wreck is derping.

[DOMO]

Why are you keen to cast doub over mastin? Eventually she'll be forced to claim and we can decide from there if she's worth trusting. Until then, she's a claimed PR and should be treated as such.

Yeah PN can be scum here.

his is more compelling than anything PN has done...

Oh yeah. Let's have a look where that scum read emerged from...

I feel like Domo is probably town and Wisdom is his usual annoying self.

Ok so I'm town here.

I was thinking more like: kitty/wisdom/bulba.

I guess I'm still town here.

Wisdom/kitty/[one of:DOMO/Bulba] is the scumteam!

Oh here we are. Now I'm scum.

Solid thought process.

So, care to explain where that scumread came from? Because it looks to me like it came out of your arse.

aronis responded with this...

400 posts in between my change in reads. That's not a 180, quit pretending like it is.

Yet, as I pointed out, he made no effort to interact with me at all.

After I point this out, aronis really steps up his activity, and makes a long flurry of posts, including a huge post explaining why he thinks I'm scummy. My initial reaction is to town him, more so for his exchange with shiny. But as soon as I put him in the town pile, he never mentions me again, despite him scumreading me.

Yeah aronis is scum, which means PN is scum. Aronis did enough to convince me, and PN here is trying to make mastin look bad when mastin is either a town PR who's getting NK'ed or scum who faked too early.

[DOMO]

can't argue with this point as i am not aronis

Well I don't expect you to be able to defend against what aronis did, but at the same time I'm not ignoring the scummy things he did, furthermore I'll present it as evidence against you because you're unfortunate enough to have replaced into a scum slot.

[DOMO]

I'm not trying to make mastin look bad. Not buying completely into Mastin-townread does not mean making Mastin look bad. And I for a while glossed over mastin's claim.

You're mocking people who town mastin. I've towned her with good reason... she's fucking claimed to have been roleblocked. From there she goes into the town pile so I can poe the scum that little bit easier. That's why you're casting doubt... you're starting to realise that the scum are getting poe'd and you're trying to ensure mastin remains potential scum in our minds.

[DOMO]

Oh, mastin claimed a PR. So that's why he's being wildly townread. I am being so terrible, lol, I read the "someone blocked me last night" but didn't come to my senses.

LOL

Are you serious here? Because it really comes across as massively sarcastic, but I might be misreading the tone.

[DOMO]

mastin is very probably town and I'm working under that assumption until I see reason not to.

[DOMO]

Are you serious here? Because it really comes across as massively sarcastic, but I might be misreading the tone.

You think I was mocking people who townread mastin. Now, you think I was sarcastic in this post.

I have been completely serious in all my posts the last 24 hours.

Ok.

Read that post from my pov, with me assuming you're being sarcastic. That's why i felt you were mocking those who were towning mastin.

I misread your tone, I retract my accusation that you're mocking those who are towning mastin.

[DOMO]

I understand your confusion.

I interpreted on point as pinging town, not accurate reads.

Oh. Well I'll ping town all day today too. Because I'm town.

[DOMO]

I'm dying to vote Pine, myself.

I hope he townies his ass up, and soon.

@Pine: I saw what you were capable of as a scum hunter, so now I'm spoiled and expect it all the time.

This feels really strange. Why would town say he hopes pine towns his ass up? Why would town want someone who looks scummy to stop being scummy? I think wreck had this very same thought process as he read back what he had posted... hence the explanation two minutes later.

This is really odd.

I found this while looking at wreck with pasch and shiny past post 506. I'm starting to agree with shiny that wreck's flip onto pasch is a huge red flag, and certainly wreck's inability to explain himself, along with these awkward posts I quote above, has me thinking that wreck would indeed be optimal lynch for today.

I'm sold.

VOTE: wreck

Oh yeah. This.

mastin why is wreck town?

[DOMO]

Oh I thought I posted this, but it seems I left it in preview while I made tea...

Tell me why you think I'm scum.

I don't. I think you're in the scum pool and I would like you to not be.

My big problem is if NM is town, the you were doing your utmost yesterday to shift votes from scum to town. That and the fact you didn't hammer scum when you were obviously frustrated.

Tell me why PN is town, because I'm struggling to shake off my aronis scumread.

Why are you vying so hard for towncred from the Pine flip?

I'm not. My interest is to judge the sincerity of PN's response. I don't give a crap how much towncred I have or haven't got.

But it's cute how you wave your finger at me. You're more or less caught scum and your intereactions now need to be kept under control to give your last buddy the best possible chance. I'm a safe target because it's already obvious that I'm not scum with you and pine.

This line of reasoning makes no sense, and this is the third time you've pulled something like this and is the entire basis of your scumread on me.

[DOMO]

My money is on bulba/wreck.

[DOMO]

I strongly believe my #655 is a smoking gun case on wreck, taking into account pine flipping scum. He absolutely dropped the ball there. He basically admits that he's gonna bus pine if he doesn't town it up. I don't see why town would want someone scummy to town it up. wreck quickly realised he fucked up and posted a response. But notice it took him two minutes to write that one sentence. Two minutes? Nah he had to think of something.

wreck is scum, all day long. Pine flip confirms it.

VOTE: wreck

[DOMO]

Seriously just read from post #655 for a few and then either vote for wreck or explain why not.

[DOMO]

I'm like 99.99999 sure about this.

Here's a monster wall for the lazy...

Spoiler:

I'm dying to vote Pine, myself.

I hope he townies his ass up, and soon.

@Pine: I saw what you were capable of as a scum hunter, so now I'm spoiled and expect it all the time.

This feels really strange. Why would town say he hopes pine towns his ass up? Why would town want someone who looks scummy to stop being scummy? I think wreck had this very same thought process as he read back what he had posted... hence the explanation two minutes later.

This is really odd.

I found this while looking at wreck with pasch and shiny past post 506. I'm starting to agree with shiny that wreck's flip onto pasch is a huge red flag, and certainly wreck's inability to explain himself, along with these awkward posts I quote above, has me thinking that wreck would indeed be optimal lynch for today.

I'm sold.

VOTE: wreck

I'm dying to vote Pine, myself.

I hope he townies his ass up, and soon.

@Pine: I saw what you were capable of as a scum hunter, so now I'm spoiled and expect it all the time.

This feels really strange. Why would town say he hopes pine towns his ass up? Why would town want someone who looks scummy to stop being scummy? I think wreck had this very same thought process as he read back what he had posted... hence the explanation two minutes later.

This is really odd.

I found this while looking at wreck with pasch and shiny past post 506. I'm starting to agree with shiny that wreck's flip onto pasch is a huge red flag, and certainly wreck's inability to explain himself, along with these awkward posts I quote above, has me thinking that wreck would indeed be optimal lynch for today.

I'm sold.

VOTE: wreck

So being am idiot and interact with me instead of taking scum at their word.

If you want to know something, all you have to do is ask.

I'm not taking scum at their word. I found my own reason to suspect you, which in turn reinforces what shiny is saying, which in turn makes me think it's you that's scum, not him. Them. Whatever.

So the truth is you have no interest in my vote and simply wanted an excuse to vote me.

Also, calling me an idiot is not going to make me think "holy shit I'm an idiot", it's going to make me believe that you're more likely caught scum. And even if you're not, I'm not going to consider myself an idiot, because it's d1 in a game of mafia. If only idiots make misreads, than this site is brimming full of idiots, of which I'm proud to be one of them.

pedit - if you say so. Whoever I vote for, I was just looking for an excuse. Sure.

domo please ask him to quote where i defended pasche since "all you have to do is ask"

R~

Hey wreck, can you quote where shiny defended pasch please? Thanks.

Hey wreck, can you quote where shiny defended pasch please? Thanks.

He's been undermining the Pasch wagon ever since he jumped off with the pathetic excuse of solo voting Pine for "pressure".

Instead of lynching his alleged scumread, he'd rather waste his vote on a D1 enigma and discredit anyone else who reads Pasce as scum, which is why I didn't bother wasting time answering him.

So why is shiny scum but I get ignored for, um, undermining the pasch wagon by trying to lynch pine. And masin. And bulba.

ok, new questions for him - a) where did I discredit anyone who reads Pasche as scum (with quotes), b) why shouldn't I try to figure out "D1 enigmas", and c) Since when having a scumread means I'm ready to end the day without attempting to read anyone else.

R~

Thing is wreck, whatever your alignment, I think shiny is town as fuck. If he's not, well done. But from my pov he's more town than anyone not called DOMO. I'll worry about shiny if he hasn't been NK'ed as we approach lylo.

dw, we always die N1

R~

So why is shiny scum but I get ignored for, um, undermining the pasch wagon by trying to lynch pine. And masin. And bulba.

Show me where you were voting and hard scumreading Pasche before you abandoned his wagon for a flimsy excuse and I'll scumread you, too.

Like if we were on a Bulba wagon together, and I hoped off and stated voting, say SH out of the blue With no scumread on SH when I was hard scumreading Bulba, what do you think that would look like to you?

So why is shiny scum but I get ignored for, um, undermining the pasch wagon by trying to lynch pine. And masin. And bulba.

Show me where you were voting and hard scumreading Pasche before you abandoned his wagon for a flimsy excuse and I'll scumread you, too.

Like if we were on a Bulba wagon together, and I hoped off and stated voting, say SH out of the blue With no scumread on SH when I was hard scumreading Bulba, what do you think that would look like to you?

Well it would perhaps occur to me that you might be trying to drive conversation and generate information. But sure, you have a point here, if I were paying attention and you did that, it would stike me as alarming.

But your unwillingness to engage directly with shiny, that suggests to me that he's getting somewhere, and it's easier for you to ingore him.

So why is shiny scum but I get ignored for, um, undermining the pasch wagon by trying to lynch pine. And masin. And bulba.

Show me where you were voting and hard scumreading Pasche before you abandoned his wagon for a flimsy excuse and I'll scumread you, too.

Like if we were on a Bulba wagon together, and I hoped off and stated voting, say SH out of the blue With no scumread on SH when I was hard scumreading Bulba, what do you think that would look like to you?

Well it would perhaps occur to me that you might be trying to drive conversation and generate information. But sure, you have a point here, if I were paying attention and you did that, it would stike me as alarming.

But your unwillingness to engage directly with shiny, that suggests to me that he's getting somewhere, and it's easier for you to ingore him.

Odd suggestion. I simply have no interest in engaging with scum.

But how can you be so sure? I'm engaging now with someone I think is scum, because, well maybe I'm wrong.

pedit - sure. Why whatever shiny asked you?

But how can you be so sure? I'm engaging now with someone I think is scum, because, well maybe I'm wrong.

pedit - sure. Why whatever shiny asked you?

With his other wagon hoops, he was jumping from one scum read to another.

He left the Pasch wagon for an entirely different and scummy as fuck reason.

Pine was also a scumread.

Also, more questions you dodged.

R~

But how can you be so sure? I'm engaging now with someone I think is scum, because, well maybe I'm wrong.

and you dodged this as well

R~

DOMI, I'm pretty sure I've completely undermined his bullshit "case" on me and he is now simply throwing shit against the wall, so I've lost interest in his b/s.

If you have any further questions about my read on Pasche, I'd be happy to address them.

Also DOMO, notice how he has completely lost interest in my Pasch read? Apparently, my willingness to answer questions simply leads to more questions in the hopes that he can find something else to twist another question out of.

Scummy Wisdom is scum.

[DOMO]

There's just no way wreck is ever town here. No way.

[DOMO]

I'm dying to vote Pine, myself.

I hope he townies his ass up, and soon.

Town does not say this. Ever.

Case closed.

[DOMO]

Well ok maybe if that was all then I'd be stretching it.

The whole exchange from #655 onto the next page, you're scum scum scum. You're doing your best to discredit shiny while selling us pasch, doing your best to protect pine.

This isn't close. If somehow you are town, well you need to die while we're comfortable because you're a massive liability in late game, and potentially a magnet for multiple PRs. You have to go, and if you were town, you'd realise that and get reading the thread for your final reads. Hint hint.

[DOMO]

Curious, if that is the only reason you have not to trust me, why is guy not on your list?

I can't even remember anything he's posted. I had to look to see what slot it is. It's the drjeckle slot. Town by virtue of the fact I would be very surprised to see a scum slot need filling so often. It's a lame reason to town someone but it's what I think.

[DOMO]

Because scum with fucking daychat NEVER, NEVER, EVER IN THEIR ENTIRE LIVES, EVER, would say this in-thread. Why not?

Town doesn't say it ever, either. WHY DOES TOWN WANT SOMEONE WHO IS SCUMMY TO TOWN IT UP?

[DOMO]

I don't know how anyone can think wreck is town with the case I have on him. He blatantly tells pine he's gonna bus him. Why did he say it itt instead of in the scum QT? idk, ask him after the game, but he did it, and then immediately realised how stupid it was, and tried to bullshit his way out of it. It's clear as daylight. That is not town, it's just not.

[DOMO]

mastin could be scum with wreck. I consider it unlikely, seeing as the likes of bulb and pasch, amongst others, also have compelling reasons to be scum. But mastin is committed to a claim involving being blocked n1, so if she's scum the she's also committed to doing everything possible to keep her buddy alive, becuse mastin is vulnerable to a cc. It would explain why she's giving him townpoints for literally the scummiest thing in this thread.

pedit - I wondered how long it would take you to omgus me. Do it. Turn this into a 1 vs 1. I dare you.

[DOMO]

And me getting lynched is a win why exactly? Do you actually think I'm scum?

[DOMO]

If I am lynched, no more putting up with idiots that can't see my obvious town meta. Win.

This is not town. If wreck is town, then he'd at least acknowledge that my case on him is compelling. But he's pretending it's his obvious town meta? Fucking hell.

Lynch this.

[DOMO]

And why in the hell would you expect me to know your obvious town meta?

I don't know you, house.

Scum it up more please, I want mastin's vote. That I will consider a victory all by itself.

[DOMO]

I hope shiny is reading along thinking "fuck yeah domo"

[DOMO]

I don't believe it unless I see pie charts.

[DOMO]

From this...

I'm not voting Pine D1 outside of a confession.

I'm still feeling a Pasch or Bulba lynch.

to this...

VOTE: Pine

Bye D1

[DOMO]

GuyInFreezer Rumia x Cirno DrTJEckleburg* Phidragon

[DOMO]

farside, have you read the posts after #655 where me shiny and wreck are bitching at each other? Does that not look ultra bad for wreck now that we know pine is scum and shiny town? This is not just about him saying itt that he's gonna bus pine. He also brushed shiny off as scum while trying to rally up pasch votes which would've saved pine. Not only is he saying outrageously scummy shit, he's doing outrageously scummy shit. The hammer with no claim after saying no way he ever votes pine stinks. Yes I was happy about it at the time, and I was even more happy when pine flipped, but that doesn't make it any less scummy.

Wreck is scum, it's not close.

[DOMO]

Just because two players argue doesn't mean they have different alignments, brainchild

Is this really all you have? A piss poor attempt at misrepping me?

[DOMO]

Look he said mislynch, he must be town.

[DOMO]

PN, if I get lynched, do you promise to lynch wreck when I flip town?

[DOMO]

This support wants Domo lynched now.
Who is Total Wreck?

total wreck is house. titus was supposed to be the other head but hasn't bothered.

[DOMO]

Not that I'm aware of.

[DOMO]

Yeah I'd have expected to be able to read titus better. That said, I'm utterly convinced wreck is scum. I don't see how there's a debate to be honest. He gets lynched today while we're ahead. If he somehow flips town, I should eat a bullet or get copped or whatever. I'll confirm right now I'm not miller. But wreck isn't flipping town. I'm more convinced he's scum than I am pine. There's more of a probability that the mod is trolling than there is that house is town. That's the kind of odds I'm seeing.

[DOMO]

I do wish I was a bookie, though.

DOMO would be my favorite

sucker

customer.

I'm a poker man, bookies are for losers.

[DOMO]

Haha counterclaim!

claim: innocent child

[DOMO]

Oh no good shot, you got me.

[DOMO]

It's a shame you're scum wreck, I like you.

[DOMO]

If we're going to PL then do it pre-Lylo, Pasch and Bulba are both better lynches for today

Not pasch. wreck is scum and was trying to deflect the pine wagon onto pasch. I'm not touching pasch, he's as likely to be town as wreck is to be scum.

[DOMO]

Coincidentally, DOMO's also my second-strongest townread...

This push on him is EXTREMELY scumdriven.

You realise you're contradicting yourself here? You say I'm town, but the wreck wagon is scum driven? I'm driving the wreck wagon.

I think you're wreck's buddy. I'm so glad you claimed to have been roleblocked already because I can be certain you're not protecting wreck due to night info. It's ok to think that my argument doesn't hold as much weight as I think it does, disagreeing with me is ok. But this strongly? It's not like my case on him is horseshit. You're not reading the exchanges after #655. Or, if you are, you're dismissing someone who is incredibly scummy as town. I don't understand why you'd do this if you're town. I don't see where such a strong town read on wreck comes from.

Why did he post itt what he should post in the QT? Maybe because he's trying to play in a spontaneuous style, knowing that appears town motivated. Only problem with that is it's easier to make mistakes. Some people think that "too scummy to be scum" is a thing, and some people will play ultra scummy as scum because wifom. Who knows what he was thinking.

[DOMO]

If he didn't post two minutes later in an attempt to clarify where that comment came from, it wouldn't look nearly as suspicious.

[DOMO]

You should all be ashamed of yourselves.

No. Your desperation to slam the brakes on this wagon does the opposite of encourage me to change my mind.

[DOMO]

He's not getting mislynched.

Maybe you're not scum mastin, I believe that you can hardcore WK people you think are town. I'm not nearly so sure about you as I am wreck. But I'm utterly convinced you're wrong. But please, by all means carry on doing what you're doing, because to be fair, if it's me that's wrong, then your analysis here tearing apart his wagon is gold. I'd give your opinions a lot more respect in the event of a wreck townflip. But that wreck townflip isn't happening. Post #655 to #700 or whatever, he's gotta be lynched for that. If you think I'm town, well shiny was town too and was screaming that wreck is town. Why are you dismissing the dead townie's opinion? Why the hell would shiny get NK'ed when he's pissing everyone off? He's a dream for scum to leave around, because he was causing apathy from other townies. But he got killed. Why? Because he was fucking right.

[DOMO]

If you think I'm town, well shiny was town too and was screaming that wreck is town.

Yeah it's obvious how that should read.

[DOMO]

Domo: I don't get your hyperactive omgus hypocrisy of mastin or why you attacked her just now for what she said. I don't recall you being this spastic....like ever and wonder where it is coming from.

I see someone who has claimed to be roleblocked n1 saying that the person who seems like the most obvious scum in the world is obvtown. I wonder where that is coming from.

Freudian slip, my man.

Yeah I have a feeling you're gonna be the only one baging this drum.

[DOMO]

Get a big enough bag, durrr.

[DOMO]

Aw wreck, you missed a chance to have me reconsider. Imagine if you removed your pasch vote with a "that's better from pasch" and you might cause doubt to creep in, like maybe, just maybe, you're also looking for reasons why your scumreads might be town.

[DOMO]

You're asking me to sheep you? Hahahaha.

[DOMO]

There's no way that Mastin buses her encryptor, especially if that encryptor is someone she can work with, a la Pine. Mastin is town.

Ok this inspired me to read mastin's ISO highlighting "pine", and I have to say I agree with you. mastin seems very sincere when she talks about pine. She's pretty fucking ruthless if pine is scum, there's no need for her to bus him like that.

wreck, on the other hand, his vote for pine came after he spent the best part of the day trying to sell us pasch. After saying he never votes pine, he hammers him without unclaimed. That is insincere.

[DOMO]

bulba and pasch both mislynch bait.

It's wreck and one more. idk who, but it's not mastin, bulb or pasch.

[DOMO]

It wreck and not mafia.

Fun game for everyone - do an ISO of rom + NM and ctrl/f pine.

That's scum interaction.

[DOMO]

You were not the only one on tw and mastin pointed out ds vote, which I agreeded with.

I've read this four times now and it still makes no sense.

[DOMO]

We've got someone at L-1, if there's consensus for me to hammer or declare intent to curb apathy I will

As far as Rom/NM-pine interactions go, there is just this -which doesn't really feel like busing. He's not getting anything out of this as scum. So, if you're seeing something else Domo, please point it out more specifically, because I'm missing it.

I was getting at the zero interaction. I consider that more than a little suspicious. Why don't either rom or nm mention pine at all? We're talking about the guy who got lynched. I can accept rom saying nothing, he replaced out before pine really became a thing. But NM says nothing except this post quoted above, and it's a relucatnt vote at that. He's looking for town permission to hammer? Doesn't feel town to me, not one bit.

As for wreck, I agree that sometimes his tone is town. But I've just finished a game at my homesite where I towned scum on d1 based on tone, and turned on him d2 due to scum motivated behaviour. Motive is much more compelling than tone, imo.

Hey wreck, can you quote where shiny defended pasch please? Thanks.

He's been undermining the Pasch wagon ever since he jumped off with the pathetic excuse of solo voting Pine for "pressure".

Instead of lynching his alleged scumread, he'd rather waste his vote on a D1 enigma and discredit anyone else who reads Pasce as scum, which is why I didn't bother wasting time answering him.

He's trying to save pine at pasch's expense. Tone = town, motive = scum. Net result - scum.

[DOMO]

Why did shiny get NK'd if he wasn't right? To secure wreck's mislynch? Wouldn't it make more sense to leave shiny around to continue shitting all over the thread, making it easier for scum to skate by? Shiny was killed most likely becaus ehe was a problem for the scum, rather than an asset. When someone as divisive as shiny gets NK'd on n1, then it probably means he was onto something.

[DOMO]

Or to create WIFOM.

This can be the answer to nearly everything in mafia.

I prefer to just assume that scum are acting rationally and not in a manner to deliberately cause circular reasoning. Last game as scum I made a really strange n1 kill, and all everyone did was go "why did scum kill him" and then ignored it. There's no WIFOM in the shiny kill. It's either because he was right, or because the scum predicted that I, or someone else, would tear wreck apart based on the pine and shiny flips. That is possible, but much less likely that simply removing a serious threat. If it's the latter, then that is further evidence that wreck is scum.

[DOMO]

Ok I grant you kitty that my case on NM is weak as hell. You're convincing me that I'm wrong to consider that telling.

But I'm not shifting on wreck. If I'm wrong, well he still needs to die because everything I have on him now will still hold valid at lylo. If he's town then scum will obviously use this against him. There's too much stacked against him imo.

[DOMO]

Yeah my problem with the is that bulb pasch and farside all looking a lot better than wreck at this moment.

[DOMO]

That post was his instant reaction to the hammer. At first it would be natural to assume that a pine scumflip looks good for wreck. But I don't think that's the case.

[DOMO]

Who's the obvious scum kitty? Because I think the obvious scum is wreck. Look at him scumhunting while he gets wagonned. All he's done since I turned the screw on him is vaguely wave his finger at me, before telling us he was voting me in an attempt to get himself lynched, and that actually I'm obvtown. Then he swings for pasch, yesterday's counterwagon to the scum lynch.

pedit - if wreck is scum, the shiny was right. I'm not going to hold one snap post after hammer as his final reads. He hasn't read the thread taking into account pine being scum. He's not factoring in the comments about pine towning it up, and the comment that he never votes pine d1. That's why wreck is so scummy. So shiny's post that you're pointing to, it's not relevant to me.

[DOMO]

I called farside out as scum yesterday too, and with my track record of targetting farside, she'd be more likely to pick me off if the scum are protecting her with the kill. There was basis to the logic behind me towning farside. I've tried to poke her a little bit today in the hope of figuring her out more, but yeah she's in my town pile.

pasch isn't obvscum, not in my opinion. Tell me why he's obvscum.

[DOMO]

Ok so I've just scanned through pasch's ISO and all I'm left with is a reasonably strong town read. He's far from the obvscum kitty seems to think.

Someone wall a case on pasch please.

[DOMO]

I'm still thinking wreck and x.

[DOMO]

No, I'm basing it on you being outrageously scummy.

[DOMO]

No, I'm basing it on you being outrageously scummy.

It's so obvious that only you see it, eh?

Yeah. Bascially I'm right and everyone else is wrong. It wouldn't be the first time.

And no, I'm not interested in anyone else because I'm not going to have anywhere near as much confidence in another lynch. I'd rather hunt based on your flip.

[DOMO]

Pasch, it is no wonder you are mislynch bait.

Are you trying to string yourself up?

This is not what town says. This is what scum says. Town thinks that scummy pasch = scum, not scummy pasch = mislynch bait.

You are scum.

[DOMO]

Amsuing.

Your vote is on pasch. Not only that, but you've basically gone from thinking he's scum to talking to him like he's conftown, all because suddenly you think the scum is farside and bulba.

PN is right though. I'm gonna take a step back and let other people have their say.

[DOMO]

It pleases me that farside finds me hard to read. It displeases me that I'm coming across as illogical. I think I'm the logical one. I guess that makes me deluded.

Can you explain why you have this hard on thing with TW and the Wifom of shiny's death?

You already know why I think wreck is scum. If you can't accept it, that's not my problem. I'm not gonna stop thinking he's scum just because other people like you and mastin are telling me I'm illogical or that I have things up my arse. I have nothing up my arse. I just think wreck is scum, and I'm stubborn. I trust my reads more than I trust mastin's. She can shout all she likes about how wreck is town. She's either scum, or she doesn't know wreck's alignment.

You think I'm being illogical farside. Well, either I'm locked on to scum, or if I've created a wagon that has generated a great deal of information. See mastin's #1980. Which, incidentally, is what wreck should be doing. If he thinks I'm town then he should be looking at those who are sheeping me. But he's leaving mastin to do all his fighting. I don't see the town motivation there.

[DOMO]

I think a lot of what you've said has made sense and I agree with a lot of it. But what do you think of Kitty? I think it's insanely obvious that she's scum and I don't know why others don't see it as well. Do you?

I don't see her as obvscum, far from it. Having scanned her ISO, I could probably argue a case either way.

Still, I'd sooner lynch her than you.

[DOMO]

I read it but will need to read again to really absorb it. one thing I'm happy about now is kitty being town.

[DOMO]

Whetehr she's right or wrong is besides the point, she's sincere.

[DOMO]

As for modkilling wreck, that's not how I want to progress. He hasn't done anything that is going to negatively effect the game. I don't think modkill is necessary, that will only stain the game.

[DOMO]

And how exactly is the fact that Pine and I didn't talk to each other much yesterday somehow an indictment of me? I didn't talk with Farside or the Aronis/PN slot much, either. Are we scumbuddies now?

This is townposting. Scum doesn't post this because it's leaving a trail. If pasch flips scum, I'd be quite comfortable putting farside and PN into the town pile based on this comment. And don't anyone give me fucking wifom. Scum is just way more likely to think carefully about the people he links himself to. Pasch is posting freely. That is a town tell in my book.

Now, pasch, please reply to kitty's wall point by point so I can share my thoughts. I'm not going down the same road mastin is going down. You can defend yourself, I'm not doing it for you.

[DOMO]

I respect the mod's decision. Please let's not allow this to dominate early discussion tomorrow. Just accept it, regardless of the flip.

I'm just about to go out, so no in depth analysis from me. Pasch is town though. Kitty, not so sure. Her post on pasch feels town motivated, but she's female, and females are naturally devious and manipulative. She's the more likely scum between the two, if there is one there. But I'm thinking town-town.

I'm still expecting a scum flip from wreck. If that's the case, pasch and ds look really good to me.

If wreck is town though, then look at those who sheeped me. ds and bulb look worse than pasch in that respect. marquis here seems to be excusing his presence on the wreck wagon pre-flip, so he's my top suspect in the event this is town.

[DOMO]

Flip him while I'm drunk!

[DOMO]

If blah blah blah and blah blah blah, then scum is him and her.

Oh yeah I had a thought, the fact this has ended the day hints that he's town. But I like to think we're getting another scumflip here. If not, it was his fault for getting modkilled, not mine for driving his wagon. Don't blame me mastin.

Ok blame me.

[DOMO]

lol did mastin just vote? Haha.

VOTE: mastin

[DOMO]

But dammit, I told you so!

Save it! He might flip scum yet. I'm less convinced now than I was, but I haven't given up hope.

[DOMO]

bulba yes, pasch I'm townreading so I'm gonna need some serious convincing.

[DOMO]

You're feisty. Would you like a bong?

[DOMO]

I'm pretty sold on kitty being town, especially if wreck is town. I mean why the hell would kitty be so keen to get pasch lynched if I'm pushing wreck's wagon? Why not see if that succeeds?

[DOMO]

pasch, do you still think kitty is obvscum?

[DOMO]

The fact that he didn't suggests that he not only didn't use the investigation, but that he forgot he had it.

lol I can't be bothered to defend myself against obvscum.

He didn't forget. A cop doesn't forget he's a cop after he realises he's getting modkilled. He prob didn't share his info because he was worried it might get a siteban. Doesn't matter. You're scum.

VOTE: bulba

[DOMO]

Personally I think notmafia and doubleslap look scummier than pasch, but I realise I'm in the minority here.

[DOMO]

Personally I think notmafia and doubleslap look scummier than pasch, but I realise I'm in the minority here.

you have a case?

Not this side of xmas. Drunk now and V/LA from tomorrow.

[DOMO]

counterpoint: drunk reads are the most honest.

The honesty of my reads depends more on alignment, rather than how much I've been drinking.

How would revealing an investigation result lead to a site ban?

idk but I find it easier to believe that was his concern rather than forgetting he was a pr.

[DOMO]

bulba + one of nm and ds obviously

[DOMO]

okay, this is a very good question to ask. DOMO, please give some reasoning/evidence as to why these are obvious scum reads. why is bulba scum? why is one of nm or ds scum, and do you really care which one it is?

By "obviously", I mean they're obviously who I think is scum, because I had said so in previous posts today. I didn't mean to imply they are obvscum, I'll be a little more careful using that phrase after wreck flipped town.

Also I forgot about aronis, who is now PN. That slot is a tenous scumread too, but his interactions with bulba look fishy to me.

Allow me to bullet point my scumread on bulba -

- meta link that I found in the games wreck linked - see post #411,
- defends by taking my attack seriously, not how I'd have replied if town - see posts #516 and #631,
- complaining about the d1 hammer pre-flip when everyone else was happy the day had ended,
- starts d2 with a really obvious fake crumb,
- responds to my accusation of dropping a fake crumbs by talking to me as though I'm town, rather than accusing me of rolefishing him,
- swinging for me, I believe because it's obvious that I'm not scum with bulba + pine, so I'm a safe target in terms of leaving a trail if he flips.

Ok that pretty much sums up why I think bulba is scum. However, I was very wrong yesterday about wreck, and I've put less effort into figuring bulba out. That said, bulba is clearly our best lynch today. mastin demanded my vote today (and tomorrow for that matter) and I owe her at least bulba before stopping to reassess.

As for the others, my scumreads are based on gut and memory, I'd need to read their ISOs and I haven't got the time before xmas to really look into them. They're not in danger so I'm not in any hurry.

Also, L-1 already is too fast, especially given that most people are starting to V/LA...

UNVOTE:

Oh and on that note -

V/LA until 28th, thanks

Happy Christmas everyone!

[DOMO]

This kitty thing is something else I might be wrong about. I've found it difficult to trust pasch simply because so many people are scumreading him. So it's difficult to judge the sincerity of his attacks on kitty. There have been a couple of pings from kitty, which is more than pasch. That's why I'd sooner lynch kitty.

I think scum is almost certainly in this group, loosely in order of confidence -

bulba, nm, ds, pn, kitty

But like I say, I need more time to expand these mostly gut reads into something with more substance.

[DOMO]

kitty is townpinging to me pretty hard.

pasch seems to be piggybacking off my townread on him with just a little too much enthusiasm.

I can see myself changing direction here.

Also I'm drunk. Did PN hammer bulba and pretend that it's L-1? Or am I missing an unvote?

[DOMO]

I thought I unvoted at L-1, there's been two votes since.

[DOMO]

Hammer should wait until after xmas when everyone's back and sober.

[DOMO]

What fake crumb? You have refused to say what I supposedly crumbed. Just because you say something repeatedly doesn't make it true.

Your whole post is just you pretending to be dumb, but this quote here really sums it up the most.

You were pretending to crumb a mastin clear so you could later claim cop. And if you don't claim anything then it's just an innocent comment saying you think mastin is town.

The rest I can't be bothered to counter right now, it can wait. I'm not getting lynched, not today anyway.

[DOMO]

Quick hammers are bad, and I'll lynch them all day, every day.

This is your fake town mindset, I believe. You were alone in being annoyed with the hammer. That suggests to me that your reaction is forced, as opposed natural. I didn't give a fuck if a PR was killed, I was glad the day was finally over. That's a natural town mindset.

[DOMO]

I've already explained why this meta case is bad, and I even offered for you to use the games in my wiki to double check your theory. You have refused to do so, which means that you were never interested in doing so in the first place.

My meta case is certainly tenuous alone. Why didn't you question my motive at the time?

[DOMO]

Oh and no I was never interested in metadiving you. Laziness is a null tell for me. I looked at those games because wreck made it nice and easy for me.

Um...what? Let's say, for argument's sake, that I were to flip scum. How would swinging for you be safe if it's so "obvious" that you're not scum with Pine, especially if I were to flip? There's no way you come up with this as town. This feels like you just made up a new point, because you didn't want to be accused of not adding anything new.

More playing dumb.

My point is that you are trying to minimise interaction tells after your eventual townflip. I'm not getting lynched, I'm a future NK. You're swinging for me because whoever you try to get mislynched to save your own ass will end up being cleared as a result. Well I'm already virtually cleared if you flip scum. That's what I mean by a safe push.

[DOMO]

eventual townflip

* eventual scumflip.

Cider.

[DOMO]

You were pretending to crumb a mastin clear so you could later claim cop. And if you don't claim anything then it's just an innocent comment saying you think mastin is town.

Also, the fact that the rolefishing concept totally went over your head betrays your true mindset. If you're town, you *should* consider my comment to be potentially that of scum trying to figure out if you dropped a crumb or not. That's what I'd think if someone accused me of dropping a fake crumb when I didn't. The fact you said you didn't shows you're not thinking like town. You're thinking like scum, trying to play down what I found, rather than town trying to figure out the motive behind my comment.

[DOMO]

It's not a crumb. I reevaluated Mastin after the Pine flip.

This.

Why does town post this? Why does town clarify if the comment was a crumb or not? Why doesn't town vote for me?

[DOMO]

I'm glad I'm wrong.

Let's just be nice to each other for 48 hours or so. Less killing and more drinking.

[DOMO]

Well done kitty, finding another bullshit fake crumb. + town points for you.

[DOMO]

In fact I'm just spewing, that "crumb" comes from the same post as the VT claim.

I should go to bed.

[DOMO]

Do you want to know how I know this is fake? Because you've seen my promise to quick lynch anybody who quickhammered in NY165. I was town and you were scum, so for you to say that my reaction was not natural is huge lie.

jeez I don't bloody remember this kind of shit, that was my first game here. I thought you were scum in the game I played with you until I looked.

I think it's fairly clear that I meant scum read. It's disturbing me that you are honing in on a nitpicky wording mistake and using it as a means to discredit me.

I have to say I agree with this. When I read "townread" I had to read it again for context. Once I'd read the post I realised it was a typo. I left it alone. I mean I made a similar mistake recently, only I corrected mine. Why isn't that of interest to pasch? He's having to look hard for reasons to point the finger at people.

Also, the kitty inventor post is probably a good reason why she's scum. Why wouldn't that get her killed? If I were scum, I'd be looking for that kind of shit through the night.

[DOMO]

jeez I don't bloody remember this kind of shit, that was my first game here. I thought you were scum in the game I played with you until I looked.

This is wrong, I'm getting you mixed up with pasch here. Ignore this.

[DOMO]

Ok I'm saying it out loud... kitty and pasch are trying to bus the shit out of each other for the creds.

[DOMO]

I'm not doing very well ignoring the internet while I'm with the family.

[DOMO]

I'm also noting nm you've been less then active till I called you out. Any reason for that?

I was thinking this, as I was lurking the shit out of this exchange.

[DOMO]

1) DOMO was doing it in a way were it dominated the thread though, and me hoping for the modkill was a clumsy way of me wanting a flip but not wanting to be on a TW wagon at that time

Ok so notice that despite me practically begging for a wreck flip, I was against the idea of modkill. That might suggest a different agenda. Scum knew wreck was town, so naturally they have less problem with a modkill than town.

Also, why would you NOT be on a wagon if you want a flip? Just because I'm tunnelling? If you think he's scum, then vote for him. If not, then tell me to stfu. But don't hope for a flip while not joining the wagon, because that fucking stinks.

nm is not looking good here.

[DOMO]

I knew we needed the flip to progress the game but it was a wagon I was reluctant to be on so I was hoping the mod would make my decision for me. I'm not saying it's logical because it isn't, it was my feeling about the lynch.

How the fuck is this town? Since when is town reluctant to vote for someone whose flip they want? I'm thinking you were reluctant to vote for him because you wanted to avoid the mislynch wagon.

[DOMO]

VOTE: notmafia

I can't accept that explanation. You can basically claim derp every time you're scum pushing scum agenda. Advocating the modkill of someone you won't vote for is scummy as fuck, considering the flip.

[DOMO]

Waiting for mod to show up and hopefully modkill House so we can move on from this to either DOMO gloating or ending this tunnel. There's still a lot I dislike about TW from D1 but late D1 and today looks like frustrated town to me, the later parts frustrated town resigned to his lynch.

Timing of Pasch's vote noted

This is where you advocate the modkill. You remind us all that I'm tunelling, and then say you think he's town, whilst telling us with a straight face you want him modkilled.

Yeah this stinks. If you felt he was starting to look like town, you'd prefer him to NOT get modkilled and then perhaps looked at by a cop, or whatever. Knwoing now that he's town, I'd have preferred him to not get lynched. Of course at the time I wanted him lynched. But not modkilled, because it deprives us of so much late wagon action, which can be hugely telling later. Modkill is ideal for scum, especially if they anticipate it ending the day.

[DOMO]

Just because wreck flipped town, does not mean I should stop harassing those I think are scum. I understand that I'm going to be wrong sometimes. I don't have a problem with that. I'm happy to accept responsibility for my misreads and my actions. What I'm not going to do is change my methods just because they are not always successful. I know full well that town do scummy shit all the time. I'm no different. Sometimes I get mislynched for it. I'm notnearly as convinced you're scum as I was wreck. But that doesn't matter. You're still currently my strongest scum read. That's possibly a bad reflection of my performance this game, or maybe it's a reflection of how well scum are playing. Or maybe I'm right on this occasion. I don't like your exchange with farside, I think she makes some solid points and I'm happy with her sincerity above anything. So my vote is where I want it to be.

[DOMO]

You're assuming town is going to be rational and/or act with their head 100% of the time

Why would I assume this after wreck's flip? I don't assume this. I assume that someone exhibiting scummy behaviour has a greater probability of being scum than average. In my opinion, at the time, wreck had a much greater probability of flipping scum than average. As a poker player, I am not results orientated. If I go all in with KK and lose to AA, did I make a mistake? Of course not. If I get all in with KK, I'm likely to win significantly more than I lose. Even if I run into AA three times in a rown, and then lose to AQ next time, I'm still not going to stop doing what I'm doing. I'm playing the probabilities.

Based on what I see, at this moment, I would say that the probability of you being scum is higher than that of anyone else. Yes I'm making assumptions, of course I am. But I'm certainly not making 100% assumptions, especially immediately after being proven wrong.

[DOMO]

You 're just honing in on "not behaving how town should; more likely to be scum".

fyp

[DOMO]

What is the distinction beyond the extra words?

the level of certainty, mostly. domo is not certain about who is scum.

So I'm his biggest scumread, but he's not calling me 100% scum. I've never said he's doing the latter and that does nothing to change my argument, this is semantics.

My problem is you doing scummy shit, ie advocating the modkill of someone you won't vote for. This is not semantics, certainly not from my pov.

[DOMO]

Ok well you're wrong about it being semantics, there is a distinction between your post and my fyp. You are suggesting I am making definitive assumptions about how town behaves. I'm arguing that I'm adjusting probabilities in response to events.

nm, let's make some assumptions for the sake of argument. You are town and I suggested that I wanted wreck's flip while not voting for him. Do you at least consider that I'm more likely to be scum than I was before I made such a comment?

[DOMO]

As a standalone event, yes it is scummy, I'm not saying it isn't. House's behaviour in a vacuum is also scummy. This is not what I'm disagreeing with. I'm saying you're not looking at these in context or looking at scum motivation.

Well you're clearly wrong in your final point here. Of course I'm looking at scum motivation. Wanting the modkill of someone you are arguing looks town is the opposite of town motivated. I'm struggling to see how it comes from a town mindset. I don't want modkills, even when it's my top scumread, and certainly not when it's a townread.

If you acknowledge that as a standalone event, that your actions are scummy, then you should understand that it at least makes you more likely than you were to be scum, that your scum equity just went up, from the pov of uninformed town. So my premise is not flawed. It's just that recent results are unfavourable.

[DOMO]

Right I'm disappearing for another day or so. I don't trust you lot enough to not speedlynch someone in the next 24 hours so I'm backing off for now.

UNVOTE:

[DOMO]

I could see science being some weird 3rd party that's not much fun to play, or perhaps miller, idk, but I'd be very surprised if a scum slot needed filling so much. I think it's pretty rude to replace into a game and then replace out without good reason, it's even more so when the slot role is significant. I mean gif replaced out of that slot. gif isn't some noob who took on more games than he could handle, he's a site reg. Why the fuck would gif replace into a scum slot and then not bother? I doubt very much that slot is scum.

[DOMO]

My V/LA is over now, I'm back home and done with celebrating a religious festival I have no spiritual interest in. My weekend of hypocrisy is over for another years.

[DOMO]

The Robin williams game I modded had a scum slot replaced 3 times.
You were in that game, why would this even be a town tell.
At best null.

Yeah we're at six here. Three is the most I've seen for a scum slot.

notmafia, I took the link and it's not immediately clear what I'm looking for. Spell it out for me please.

[DOMO]

Seems like a pretty dangerous gamble to lose a second scum so early in the game, especially since it would have been much easier to just cooperate with the Bulba wagon. I'm not scum and I'm not bussing anyone. I'm town and scumhunting Kitty because she's scummy as shit and needs to die.

Well some would argue that you're scummy as shit and need to die.

I'd like to point out that when I bus buddies, it's not something I want to happen. I just want to emerge smelling of roses when someone analyses the wagon. It's insurance.

Too many people think you're scum for you to have any serious influence. That being the case, if you're scum, you can safely push your buddy knowing that those scumreading you won't jump on board.

I'm not sure if I think you're scum with kitty, it was a fit of paranoia and I think notmafia is scum. But it's still possible. Bussing is a thing, and so is mutual bussing, even when it might seem stupid.

[DOMO]

There I believe is on the 4th replacement.
this game had a sk that replaced a bunch of times you were in, so again how is replacing alignment indictive?

Vote: Domo

farside, sk is 3rd party, not scum. A lot of people don't want to play 3rd party. You realise that you're supporting my suggestion that the science slot is 3rd party or unfavourable role and not scum, don't you?

And I was wrong, it's five, I counted rumia x cirno as two people because I couldn't remember who the hell it was.
EXAKT Science
GuyInFreezer
Rumia x Cirno
DrTJEckleburg*
Phidragon

Slot is likely town. I realise that scum won't like me towning people like this because it's poe, but you surprise me farside. I might be wrong, but I fail to see why you think that me thinking this makes me scummy, not unless you think I'm scum with science anyway. If I'm scum and science isn't, then I'd want to keep his mislynch options open, I wouldn't be trying to convince people that it's not a scum slot.

[DOMO]

I would also like to point out that my terrible memory is far from alignment indicative. If I forget that a scum slot needed replacing so much, that's me making a mistake, not me being scummy.

[DOMO]

Your basing a town read on a player for shitty reasoning.

Well it looks to me like you're basing a scumread on shitty reasoning. Is there another reason you're voting for me?

This doesn't explain why you have deemed chronic replace outs a town tell in the first place

Because I would anticipate that, genrally speaking, people prefer to play as scum than town. I might be wrong, I'm not suggesting that those who argue against me are wrong to do so. But farside scumreading me for this is a lot more tenuous than me towning people for not being interested.

[DOMO]

I think farside just doesn't understand where I'm coming from. On the other hand, I think notmafia is trying to ensure science remains lynchable.

[DOMO]

VOTE: notmafia

[DOMO]

You're basically conf towning a slot for reasons that are demonstrably wrong, it's not a matter of "understanding where you're coming from" .

Oh it is a case of understanding where I'm coming from. I'm not conftowning science. I'm saying he's likely town. Big difference. I'm also not that interested in science, I'm more interested to see who doesn't like me poe'ing in this manner. You and farside have emerged to slap me down. farside seems confused by me. You seem annoyed. That, I believe, shows that youre agendas differ. farside is scumhunting. You are looking for mislynches.

pedit - I'm suggesting you're scumreading me on shitty reasoning.

pedit 2 - ok but what if I'm reaction baiting, rather than faking townreads?

[DOMO]

Yet you're still insisting on it

I am? I thought I just said I was reaction baiting.

Let me be a little more clear. I think science is town because I think notmafia is scum, and I do not see science being scum with notmafia. That being the case, I pulled a townread out of my arse to see how people reacted. farside seems sincerely confused by me. notmafia is posting charts and graphs to show why I'm wrong. At the very least, I'm even more convinced now that notmafia and science are not scumbuddies, and I'm even more convinced that farside is town. So while you lot wave your arms suggesting I'm being dumb, I'm making some progress.

and Domo, why is Science scumreading me? Science couldn't answer me, and neither could farside, and I still don't know.

From what I can see, science felt, like I did, that notmafia was being dishonest in his exchange with me.

[DOMO]

Are you just pretending it doesn't say "i still think you're scum"?

[DOMO]

Your point being? Come to think of it, I've been in this exact same situation before, a player claiming a townread on a slot because of their replace out, guess what my response was then? And guess what everyone flipped

Show me.

[DOMO]

I don't know why science is scumreading you notmafia.

science, why are you scumreading notmafia?

[DOMO]

I want the bold answering first. I posted charts and graphs, what's your point?

My point is that you're showing a vested interest in keeping him lynchable, while farside is trying to figure me out. I sense different agendas.

Okay good, shouldn't this tell you something?

It tells me he's not really thinking through what he posts. Which, incidentally, is a town tell.

[DOMO]

Domo: why is not mafia scum?

Most of all...

I knew we needed the flip to progress the game but it was a wagon I was reluctant to be on so I was hoping the mod would make my decision for me. I'm not saying it's logical because it isn't, it was my feeling about the lynch.

How the fuck is this town? Since when is town reluctant to vote for someone whose flip they want? I'm thinking you were reluctant to vote for him because you wanted to avoid the mislynch wagon.

[DOMO]

This too...

1) DOMO was doing it in a way were it dominated the thread though, and me hoping for the modkill was a clumsy way of me wanting a flip but not wanting to be on a TW wagon at that time

Ok so notice that despite me practically begging for a wreck flip, I was against the idea of modkill. That might suggest a different agenda. Scum knew wreck was town, so naturally they have less problem with a modkill than town.

Also, why would you NOT be on a wagon if you want a flip? Just because I'm tunnelling? If you think he's scum, then vote for him. If not, then tell me to stfu. But don't hope for a flip while not joining the wagon, because that fucking stinks.

nm is not looking good here.

[DOMO]

It's mostly because his agenda seemed to differ from mine, regarding the modkill. wreck was my top scumread and I needed his flip to pull my head out of my arse. But I still didn't want him modkilled. notmafia let his guards down there and showed his true motivation. That's what I think anyway.

[DOMO]

Alright well you're at least showing that the graphs and charts are null at best. But I'm still unhappy with you advocating the modkill of wreck when you were saying you felt he was town. That's the basis of my scumread, and yes ever since I've pretty much been viewing this game through a nm=scum lens, that is a fair observation.

[DOMO]

Actually call my DOMO townread officially weaker, realised my "he seems like he sincerely believes his reads" reason for townreading included his now self admitted fabricated Science town read

Nice misrep. I didn't fabricate a townread on him, I just bullshitted a reason for it. The actual reason I'm townreading him is because I'm scumreading you, I explained that already.

[DOMO]

But speaking of your Science read, if someone dayvigged me now and I flipped town, what would your Science read be? And where your vote move to?

science would be null pending review, and my vote would probably move to bulba.

[DOMO]

Yea I have no energy today for looking into Domo.

I'll make it easy for you.

I'm town.

Honest.

[DOMO]

I laughed.

[DOMO]

I'm not reviewing him now because I'm playing two games of poker.

[DOMO]

I must remember to play to farside's paranoia in the future when I'm scum and she's town, just for balance.

[DOMO]

look i misread that series of posts a little bit because my eyes glazed over when you started decrying real things as semantics. mea culpa. i still think you're scum, and that was easily the weakest point of my case! respond to the substance.

Town.

Why would scum retract his reasoning for a scumread here? I'm gonna ask people to make an assumption just for a minute... that both nm and I are town. Well if science is scum, he's backing away from a line of attack that is still being used by a townie that could result in a mislynch. I don't see the scum otivation in this at all.

Either they are both scum and he's looking for ways to avoid bussing (not likely), or science is town (likely).

Furthermore, as I scan his ISO, I'm getting town vibes from tone alone. Someone case science please, because I'm obviously missing something.

[DOMO]

So your scumread on him revolves entirely on the fact he won't explain why he's still scumreading you, right?

Why would town retract his reasoning for a scumread yet inexplicably continue to push for that persons lynch here?

You're not answering the question. You're not explaining what his scum motivation is. Instead you're just saying the opposite of what I say. I believe town are more likely to pull this kind of shit off rather than scum because town is less likely to give a shit about what he posts. Scum is more interested in consistency. More to the point, scum is very much interested in mislynches, which means not backing away from what isn't awful reasoning for a lynch.

I guess he could be doing it in the hope someone like me comes along and gives him town points for it. You lot like to think that scum play these wifom games. I happen to think that scum are just trying to obtain mislynches, and tend to stick to their guns a little more than town do.

[DOMO]

Enough. kitty is right, town are just arguing about shit while scum sit back and hope for a mislynch.

UNVOTE:

I think I'm wrong about notmafia. I don't think I'm wrong about science.

Let's lynch bulba.

VOTE: bulba

nm, I don't know what you're getting at with the bolded, spell it out for me please so I can facepalm.

[DOMO]

pasch shamelessly buddying me makes me uncomfortable. That said, bulba's "mastin is town" still stikes me as a fake cop crumb and that for me is the single most compelling post I can recall.

[DOMO]

That said, bulba's "mastin is town" still stikes me as a fake cop crumb and that for me is the single most compelling post I can recall.

I don't think Bulba is scum, considering I'm alive. If you think Bulba is scum, you should probably vote me first, since it's unlikely he's scum while I'm town.

Oh right, the inventor thing. I'm not towning him for that alone. If that was on d1, then maybe. But it was d2, and n2 a claimed PR got killed. Granted, your comment was d1. But bulba didn't highlight it until d2. Yes he might have seen it on d1. But then again the same can be said about anyone. I don't know why you're alive. I'd guess either scum did not see your inventor post, thought it was nothing, or found something that hinted shiny was a PR. You didn't die n2 because mastin did, and that doesn't give bulba town points.

[DOMO]

pasch the main reason I want to lynch bulba, you just quoted. Are you just trying to look like you're doing things here?

You expect good reasons from me? And why is that? How many times have we played together pasch?

[DOMO]

We are running behind (many pages since Christmas) mainly due to holidays.

Allow me to summarise what you've missed...

DOMO - blah blah blah
nm - yadder yadder yadder
kitty - will you people shut up
DOMO - blah blah
farside - I'm confused
nm - noise
DOMO - more noise
kitty - SHUT UP
farside - vote domo
DOMO - hi5

[DOMO]

pasch, yes bulba claimed it wasn't a crumb. That in itself is hugely scummy. Why would he do that? It didn't occur to him that I'm scum trying to rolefish him because he knows it. If he's town, why doesn't he stop to consider my motive for pointing the finger at his crumb? I've said all this already.

[DOMO]

What if it's just not a crumb and neither of you are lying?

Ok let me explain this super clearly to you so you can't even pretend to be dumb.

bulba signs off his opening d2 post with a definitive "mastin is town".
I suggest it's a blatant fakecrumb.
Bulba says it's not.
If bulba is town, then why the fuckity fuck does he clear up the crumb issue? Why would he not want the scum to be unsure about whether that was a crumb or not?
Bulba is not thinking like town, as demonstrated by the fact he wasn't concerned about me rolefishing.
If he's town he's stupid town.

Bus him pasch.

[DOMO]

I'm probably not gonna be back on you nm. I hate backing off when I'm tunnelling but you were townpinging so fucking hard in our exchange. I just didn't want to admit it because I was so wrong about wreck. I have to be right baout someone, right?

Anyway, my head is out of my arse. It's pasch and bulba.

[DOMO]

I like to keep scum in the dark about PRs as much as possible.

aaaaahahahahahaha

Oh my god did you actually just say this?

[DOMO]

Sup bulba. I'm not scum. Of course you already know that, so carry on. I look forward to getting NK'ed after you flip scum.

Except they don't. I've played enough scum games to realize that scum players aren't always too observant.

Ok well you might be right here. I like to use the night to hunt PR's, but I'm also lazy. So maybe I just scan ISO, looking for obvious shit. If kitty was scummy, then her not being NK'ed for the inventor thing would simply be supporting evidence. As it is, that alone is not nearly sufficient for a scumread. Kitty seems very much town to me, so I concede the point about her being alive. It's one point against vs a lot of points for.

This feels less accusatory and more like coaching.

lol that's possibly the crappest attempt to make me look scummy that I've seen in some time. I'm coaching pasch? He has been at this site longer than I have, he'd be coaching me if anything. Haha!

I think you made this all up on the spot.

Nope. Why the hell would I make all that up, as either alignment?

Why would you include the bolded? There's no need for that, and it only serves to weaken your stance.

Because I'm rambling, posting my thoughts as they come. Are you suggesting that weakening my own position is scummy? I can't think why I'd do that as scum. Maybe because of distancing from an eventual town flip. Ah but then I wasn't exactly concerned about wreck flipping town, was I?

Highlighting this is odd, it seems really nitpicky, like idk, maybe you're trying really hard to make me look scummy.

So back to the BS that has proven to be wrong

Proven? Show me, I must have had my eyes shut for a minute or two.

But haven't you bragged before about how you're a logical player?

No, actually it's farside who thinks I'm logical. I would say I'm a fruity cocktail of logic and spastic, with a hint of stupid.

[DOMO]

So, how about it Domo and Bulba?

Let me tunnel bulba for a bit, I feel like I need to tunnel at least one scum to emerge from this game not looking really stupid.

[DOMO]

I promise nothing.

Except that I'm not scum.

[DOMO]

kitty do you not think the "mastin is town" comment is fishy as hell? Am I alone in thinking that's scum fakecrumbing?

[DOMO]

farside, notmafia, answer that question too. If all three of you tell me to shut up about it, I will.

[DOMO]

Ok but why would he say that it wasn't a crumb? Why would he tell me that? That's the real sticking point with me. If his reaction to my comment was to vote for me, or to accuse me of rolefishing, I think I'd like bulba a lot more.

Are you towning him purely because you're not dead?

[DOMO]

On the other side, why did you ask if it was a crumb? If answering that question is so bad, why ask it? Like, what if it had been a crumb? Why put him in that situation?

I didn't ask if it was a crumb. I said it was an obvious fakecrumb. He told me it wasn't a crumb at all.

This is coming from the person who just told us he likes to keep scum in the dark about PRs.

Can you at least see why I think it's scummy? Do you not think he should have qusetioned my motive right there and then, instead of just assuming I was being honest with my intentions?

[DOMO]

Regardless, what if it hadn't been fake? Did you think about the position that would have put him in? Why risk that by doing something you knew was rolefishy?

I basically spewed. I only realised how rolefishy my comment was after it was posted.

[DOMO]

fwiw I've found scum like this at my homesite. Gut reaction to what appeared to me too obvious a crumb for a seer/cop. That might explain why i consider it more compelling than others do.

I think he could've been town fakecrumbing to draw the NK. That's something else I see at my homesite. Only, I wouldn't expect him to say it wasn't a crumb, if that's what he was playing at.

[DOMO]

@Domo: What is it about #2410 that made you read NM as town?

I missed this when I first read through your wall.

It wasn't that post in particular. I was thinking he felt like town as I engaged him but I wanted to persist in the tunnelling because I wanted him to be scum. I don't even care if that makes sense or not. The basic point is that pre tunnel, I thought he was scum, but by the time I was done I had him as town.

There's method to my madness. I've got it poe'd to you, pasch, ds and pn.

[DOMO]

I wondered why you were quick to call it fake with no counter claim.

How amusing that I can immediately see potential rolefishing when it smacks me in the face. If we didn't have a flipped cop already, I'd be concerned about your motive here farside. It just emphasises all the more why I think bulba is fishy for telling me he didn't drop a crumb.

[DOMO]

farside, read my #2450 then ask me again if it's not obvious to you.

[DOMO]

I like how you don't really address my points and instead deflect them with non-points (Pasch being on the site longer and why would you do that?). Nothing you've said here actually addresses what I've said. It's just meant to make it look more insignificant.

Well it is insignificant. You're accusing me of coaching pasch, right? I have no idea how I'm supposed to defend aginst that kind of crap. I'll just say I proved it wrong, that I've debunked it, and hope everyone is stupid enough to believe me.

[DOMO]

pasch obviously ignoring where I said that I felt notmafia was scum pre tunnel and town by the end.

pasch, here's what I did... I challenged a scumread of mine, engaged him, and decided that it was a misread. That's not the first time I've backed off a scumread, and it won't be the last. You talk a lot about trust. You shouldn't trust me at all, not unless you know I'm the same alignment as you. What you should be doing is looking for the scum motivation in me backing off notmafia. Am I trying to avoid bussing? Am I recognising I'm not going to get his mislynch? Or am I just town who thought he was scum and now doesn't?

The fact that you're so concerned about me backing off nm, it has me thinking that you prefer it when I have multiple lynch targets. I'm down to four, and you don't like that.

It's time to stop dicking around and give kitty what she wants.

VOTE: pasch

[DOMO]

Now THAT is what buddying looks like.

Actually, after you flip scum, we have to decide if that's what BUSSING looks like.

[DOMO]

pasch, if you want to push the idea that I'm scum, then you might want to tie me to your other scumreads, y'know, so it doesn't look like you're just pulling OMGUS votes out of your arse.

[DOMO]

pasch, here's what I did... I challenged a scumread of mine, engaged him, and decided that it was a misread. That's not the first time I've backed off a scumread, and it won't be the last. You talk a lot about trust. You shouldn't trust me at all, not unless you know I'm the same alignment as you. What you should be doing is looking for the scum motivation in me backing off notmafia. Am I trying to avoid bussing? Am I recognising I'm not going to get his mislynch? Or am I just town who thought he was scum and now doesn't?

So you have to put on a show in order to make up your mind about someone? Just to lay a foundation so that other people can buy into your real conclusion, despite strongly supporting the contrary position. It's all a ruse, isn't it? Just one lie on top of another to push a predetermined conclusion. You're right about one thing, I shouldn't trust you. You've proven that you can't be trusted.

The fact that you're so concerned about me backing off nm, it has me thinking that you prefer it when I have multiple lynch targets. I'm down to four, and you don't like that.

No, I don't like it when one of my townreads blow their credibility straight to hell all at once.

It's time to stop dicking around and give kitty what she wants.

So you're Kitty's buddy? I guess I really was wrong about NM. Was this whole thing just a way to get him to follow you when you switched gears? Or were you genuinely trying to push the lynch and now are just abandoning it for what looks like an easier mislynch?

VOTE: Domo

Putting on a show? That's what I do pasch. I'm usually near the top of the post count because I have a lot of time and a lot to say. I tend to get reads off people by interacting with them. I try to read the sincerity of people's tone.

You don't like it when a townread blows his credibility? How did I do that pasch? By voting for you? I certainly didn't do it by shifting a read from scum to town, because I must do that every game. Did I do it by being confident about my read and then admitting maybe I was wrong? I'm guessing you had your eyes shut when wreck flipped. His townflip is obviously going to impact on my other reads. I really though he was scum. I was wrong. Is it that crazy that I stopped to consider I was wrong about nm before his flip?

pasch, you're now "scumreading" me for doing what town should do, and what I regularly do as town.

So you're Kitty's buddy? I guess I really was wrong about NM.

lol really. You should probably metadive me to get some idea of how I play scum. I'lll give you a clue - I don't buddy my buddies in thread. If I'm scum, you should probably consider kitty conftown.

nm would be much more likely my buddy, seeing as I was all over him and then found a reason to back off him. That's more my scum-scum style, not namedropping as I make votes.

[DOMO]

It's notmafia, I tracked him to farside. Unless you have an explanation?

[DOMO]

Doesn't it tell you I'm not scum?

[DOMO]

I am lying, I'm just amusing myself.

[DOMO]

VOTE: bulba

I like nm's reaction to be honest. I wasn't expecting to get a read from such a shitty gambit, but I did. hi5 nm.

[DOMO]

I suppose nm could know I'm not tracker thanks to a 1x shot rolecop froom the JOAT. But that's thin.

[DOMO]

pasch told us in the QT obviously.

[DOMO]

Calm down I'm joking.

I'm suggesting it's possible. I have no idea what the JOAT powers were, but a 1xshot RC is'nt outrageous. Although saying that, we've seen nothing but vanillas flip, so that's unlikely.

[DOMO]

nm do you really think that as last scum I'd spew like this today? You're pretty much the only person left who might vote for me with farside gone, until I started talking anyway. If I'm scum, well I had a decent shot at winning. So why a faggoty gambit and utter nonsense? Maybe it's because we're miles ahead and I'm more concerned about amusing myself than I am about survival.

[DOMO]

And yeah I was confident in my townread on you yesterday. But you were most likely to engage with me quickly because noone else has posted yet today.

[DOMO]

So all the town flips are vanilla.

I can't wait for the massclaim. I'd assume we're already won tbh.

[DOMO]

I'm BORED. Let's liven things up.

I'm vanilla. popcorn to bulba.

[DOMO]

Oh damn I forgot, I was gonna say I was goon and then post immediately after awkwardly saying haha I meant vanilla, just to make you all paranoid. Oh well too late now.

[DOMO]

Why not?

[DOMO]

Domo y u trollin?

Blame the bong.

[DOMO]

bulba should definitely claim though. Today's lynch is between me and him, I've claimed so he should too and then we can go from there.

[DOMO]

bulba claimed? Shows how much notice I've been paying.

PN does not look good voting for me right now. My play today makes even less sense from a scum pov than a town pov.

[DOMO]

VOTE: DOMO

L-1

Kill me I'm vanilla. It helps us win.

[DOMO]

Perpetual Nonsense - aronis was scummy as fuck, but PN has been a lot better, certainly in their tone. That said, they have been pushing softly at me for a while, and then today when I spazz all over the thread purely to amuse myself (yes I'm easily amused), instead of thinking that it's way too derp for last scum standing, they throw a vote at me before people like bulba have even turned up, and without making any effort to link me to the two dead scums. Fishy as hell.

Bulbazak* - obviously bulba needs to be lynched

Doubleslap - could be scum but probably isn't

DOMO - confirmed idiot

Not_Mafia - 90%
EXAKT Science - 99% town
KittyCupCake - 99% town

[DOMO]

I bet farside still thinks I'm scum. I'd totally have NK'd her last night rather than kitty. That was a decent kill tbh, not sure bulba takes that shot. I reckon that's PN's work.

[DOMO]

not_mafia and DOMO, why the votes on me?

I'm not voting for you, I'm voting for me. Furthermore, NM explained his vote in the very same post he votes for you. And I explained why I think you're scummy.

Your vote is deserved because your "trolling" is annoying Us and not helping matters any

I think you should be voting for who you think is scummy, not who is annoying you. I suspect I'm annoying you because it's pretty obvious now that I'm town, which is awkward for the last scum because I'm in the pool of hopeful mislynches. If you still think I'm scum, then you must be assuming that my great winning plan is a shitstorm of wifom. Three days of wifom, no less. For me to be scum, I'm shooting my load too soon, and fucking up a reasonable spot in the process.

So... shift your vote or continue to look like scum desperately trying to keep bulba around for as long as possible.

Here, let me encourage you...

VOTE: p-nonsense

[DOMO]

i still want to lynch doubleslap if domo's circus acting is comin from town

Explain this please. I'm curious why you have me and doubleslap ahead of bulba.