Mini 1683: <<11 PM>> [THE GAME IS OVER] [[BUT WHO WINS?!]]

[Klingoncelt]

/confirm.

Aston Villa my butt. Go Mersey!

Annddd...

VOTE: RedCoyote

[Klingoncelt]

@shos - So Town have a couple of bulletproofs. Scum don't, right? So if Scum shoots Scum, a Scum dies, right?

[Klingoncelt]

Isn't Guinness supposed to be served warm?

VOTE: dramonic

RedCoyote's Scum partner he is.

[Klingoncelt]

Oh man i wish. We would destroy yall :3

Not the first couple of Nights, at least.

[Klingoncelt]

Oy. I'm not some random chav, y'know.

[Klingoncelt]

*waits patiently for Blue Moon Rising to stop by*

[Klingoncelt]

Isn't Guinness supposed to be served warm?.

Klingon will be modkilled for this lolz

/jk

It's going to happen for some reason. May as well be this one.

(Just teasing grandma)

Stout heathens!

[Klingoncelt]

UNVOTE:

Too early in the Day for wagons.

[Klingoncelt]

UNVOTE:

Too early in the Day for wagons.

Why did you unvoting matter to the wagon? Your vote was on dramonic, not red coyote, unless I completely missed something there.

Two separate comments, that I didn't clarify.

I unvoted because RVS is over, and I made the wagon comment because it's true. (That said, I'm not happy about Coyote's odd statement.)

[Klingoncelt]

Hey, Dragonspawn, are you Scum this game?

[Klingoncelt]

Hey, Dragonspawn, are you Scum this game?

Weird. I answered this earlier but no post is there. Second time I've sown I responded to something and it didn't post. Maybe I'm going crazy.

No. I'm not scum this game. Are you?

Why ask anyway? Is anyone going to answer that they are scum? Seems kind of pointless.

How come you were worried about starting a wagon with one vote? Is harmonic looking so scummy to you that you were worried he would be lynched this early in day one? Are you his scum buddy bussing him in rvs so we don't associate the two of you later on? (Like I did with you last game)

I like seeing wagons form. You can usually find scum on them early on.

No, I'm not Scum this game.

It never hurts to ask. Once in a while someone will go fullblown derp and make a very telling paranoid panic denial wallpost. Good times.

I wasn't worried about the wagon starting, I'm worried about a speedlynch this early on Day1. Quick lynches almost always end up being Town. I'd rather have everyone do a few days' worth of posting so I can get some reads.

And no, I'm not anyone's Scumbuddy. As far as that last game goes, that was the best Scumteam ever. Other Scums just don't have the cajones to do the crazy stuff we did!

[Klingoncelt]

Actually, I think he

is

Scum. I just want to move slowly on this. Last time I was sure someone was Scum they flipped Town.

[Klingoncelt]

So why is he scum?

19: "Whats the point of All these bp?
Like... coulda just not given scum a kill n1"


It's odd that the setup is being questioned like this. The 2-shot BP is part of the 11PM mechanics, not some random element that Shos threw in. It made my scumdar ping loud.

I said Dramonic and Coyote were partners, in 23 Dramonic sez: "Oh man i wish. We would destroy yall"

So it's possible that they're on different teams.

This needs looked into more.

[Klingoncelt]

VOTE: Dramonic

For his posts on page 3. He's not even trying to look Townish.

[Klingoncelt]

It makes me nervous when I'm not even sure where red thinks I was going.

Well Red's Scum, so...

[Klingoncelt]

It makes me nervous when I'm not even sure where red thinks I was going.

Well Red's Scum, so...

Why do you think Red is scum?

Sorry, alt. Why do you think red is scum?

*gigglesnorts at alt slip*

Red's "Town" comment as 1st post wasn't very Townish. His OMGUS overreaction to my pressuring him definitely moves him into Scum territory.

[Klingoncelt]

It makes me nervous when I'm not even sure where red thinks I was going.

I'm curious why Suzune made the assumption that dram's "own team" was town. Where were you actually going?

---

His OMGUS overreaction to my pressuring him definitely moves him into Scum territory.

So I wasn't in scum territory before that post?

A post you continue to ignore, btw. :/

What post are you referring to? Link, please.

[Klingoncelt]

I don't like anyone on dramonic's wagon right now.

Anyways, I'm going to go to VOTE: Klingoncelt.

Don't know how to feel about RedCoyote's playful buddying of dramonic and visa-versa. Like it was funny at first, but now it's starting to get weird.

@RedCoyote - I can

kinda

see your point with the whole "s" word business, but I don't honestly believe it was what you think it was.

You're voting for anyone on Dramonic's wagon? You know better thanb to vote for someone on a wagon until that wagoned player flips, right? You must be his partner then.

[Klingoncelt]

I'm not voting you

because you're on a wagon.

[Klingoncelt]

I'm voting for you because I think you're Scum.

[Klingoncelt]

I don't like anyone on dramonic's wagon right now.

Anyways, I'm going to go to VOTE: Klingoncelt.

I doubt he's voting you

because you're on a wagon

either.
I don't like the dram wagon =! I don't like anyone on the dram wagon. One's a byproduct of the other.

He SAID he's voting me because I'm on your wagon.

Scumpartners. You & Oz.

[Klingoncelt]

Fair enough. I think it could also be bad scum players desperate to bag a town mislynch because that's the only way the scum teams can get town dead for at least the first day/night cycle.

Klingon, you mentioned that RedCoyote's OMGUSy reaction "moves him into Scum territory" for you. What have you to say about your own OMGUSy reaction later on?

Voting me because of the way I vote deserves some sort of reaction. But now you're saying you think I'm scummy for other reasons. Care to elaborate?

(If you'd like we can play WIFOM all day Saturday. I have something I have to do elsewhere today.)

[Klingoncelt]

Don't know how to feel about RedCoyote's playful buddying of dramonic and visa-versa. Like it was funny at first, but now it's starting to get weird.

I know, I know. I ought to stop. Truth be told, I don't even have a townread on him at the moment. Though he's in my good graces by default since we're on a wagon together and the arguments against him so far are laughably bad.

I don't honestly believe it was what you think it was.

I want to hear more from Suzune, but I appreciate your candor.

---

What post are you referring to? Link, please.

The post you accused me of committing OMGUS in... 77

Though I can see how you'd be confused as you have ignored seemingly every post I've made except my first one.

I'm not voting you

because you're on a wagon

.

Perhaps try asking Ozgin why he's voting you before accusing him of being scum for it? Is everyone that suspects you scum?

Scumpartners. You & Oz.

And me. Don't forget me!

---

I think her reasoning is too fucking stupid to come from scum.

Anyone can draw a scum role. I don't think her reasoning is stupid though, honestly. I see quite clearly where she's coming from, and I don't like it all. I think it's poor, but it's not stupid. Big difference.

It looked like Oz voted me simply because I voted Dramonic. That wouldn't be a very Town move now, would it? Oz has since clarified.

And I didn't forget you. You're on the

other

Scumteam!

[Klingoncelt]

I think very little of the town.

Not a good thing to say.

So why'd ya say it?

[Klingoncelt]

I was responding to RedCoyote.
Isn't that just SCANDALOUS!

You can reply to whomever you want.

It's the content of the reply that bugs me.

[Klingoncelt]

...Why?

"I think very little of the town."

It reminds me of something I saw in another game, over on Wake's forum. It was so bad both of her Scummates voted for her.

@Dragonspawn

- remember when Rosie the JimmyJohns delivery driver had her anti-town meltdown?

[Klingoncelt]

...Why?

"I think very little of the town."

It reminds me of something I saw in another game, over on Wake's forum. It was so bad both of her Scummates voted for her.

@Dragonspawn

- remember when Rosie the JimmyJohns delivery driver had her anti-town meltdown?

Yes. I do. You lynched me over her

Yeah, but I never lynch you on D1 anymore and Rosie was lynched with fire. For the children.

[Klingoncelt]

So you don't have a proper response.
All you have is anecdotal evidence you aren't quoting.

...

Please refer to post 72.

Here's a link to the game:
http://www.usmessageboard.com/threads/o ... er.355143/

If you can figure out how to use the search function over there, then congratulations.

Not liking the Town isn't exactly a townish thing to say. It's kinda scummy, no?

[Klingoncelt]

Marcell, any thoughts on klingon or dramonic?

I forgot that Marcrell was even in this game.

[Klingoncelt]

Fair enough. I think it could also be bad scum players desperate to bag a town mislynch because that's the only way the scum teams can get town dead for at least the first day/night cycle.

Klingon, you mentioned that RedCoyote's OMGUSy reaction "moves him into Scum territory" for you. What have you to say about your own OMGUSy reaction later on?

Voting me because of the way I vote deserves some sort of reaction. But now you're saying you think I'm scummy for other reasons. Care to elaborate?

(If you'd like we can play WIFOM all day Saturday. I have something I have to do elsewhere today.)

Don't twist my words, dear. I was asking you a question, not saying why I think you're scummy. And you dodged the question.

My vote stays standing.

I didn't dodge the question. I was very busy yesterday. I'll answer it later today, sometime after after 6pm.

[Klingoncelt]

Marcell, any thoughts on klingon or dramonic?

I forgot that Marcrell was even in this game.

Yeah, get used to that.

I wonder what one has to do to get Klingon's attention? She's so popular this game that she's only responding to the softballs and dodging the real, juicy questions.

Did I mention I was busy yesterday? I had a few seconds to reply to the softballs, but anything in depth would take more time than I had.

[Klingoncelt]

So anyway, it was Dragonspawn's comment about the absent Marcrell that turned on the little lightbulb over my head.

I was thinking, Oh he's hiding, he must be Scum!, and realized that I'm reading almost everyone as Scum.

So... I'm sorry. I'm being paranoid because I only know 2 players in this game, Oz and Dragon - and they aren't easy reads. (I think I played a game with Red too, but I can't remember.)

I'm still reading everyone as SuperUltraMegaScum, so I'll just be quiet and let you all sort it out for the next couple days until I get my scumdar recalibrated.

UNVOTE: for now.

[Klingoncelt]

I'm still reading everyone as SuperUltraMegaScum, so I'll just be quiet and let you all sort it out for the next couple days until I get my scumdar recalibrated.

Noooo... but I have questions! D:

Suzune and Klingon are not arguing with me. What am I supposed to do with this? How can my reads evolve and adapt if we don't get a little drama going on?

Ask away, I'll answer.

[Klingoncelt]

Day 1 No lynches are good if you are scum or if you don't want to be held accountable for day 1. Otherwise day 1 no lynches are bad.

This setup is a little different, and regardless of the setup it's almost always a Townie that gets lynched D1.

I'll consider a No Lynch.

[Klingoncelt]

I'd rather we found some scum to lynch.

Agreed.

[Klingoncelt]

Kind of tl;dr, so I'll try to tidy it up a bit.

Let me make a mini-wall to show y'all how frustrated I am with Klingon especially. I don't know if this is an act or something, but she keeps giving me the runaround and acting like she doesn't know what I'm talking about. As much as I have been acting fun-loving with her, it's starting to get on my nerves.

Klingon and me

You're not voting me anymore. Or did you forget that?

Klingon never responds to this.

I unvoted because RVS is over

I thought I answered this one.

I've seen it happen where someone makes a very silly RVS vote, someone else will RVS the same player for pressure, then suddenly a bunch of others jump onboard and there's a mislynch wagon rolling out of control.

Someone (can't recall who) made a serious vote, so I unvoted. RVS over, potential for mislynch wagon started.

So you would consider your votes on me and dram to be random then? If so, why did you call us scumbuddies? If not, why unvote if your vote is already a "serious" vote?

I actually think you're on different teams. "Think" as opposed to "know." More info needed.

I wasn't worried about the wagon starting, I'm worried about a speedlynch this early on Day1.

Again, it seems to me like you're referencing the wagon on me. Or can you explain why exactly you were worried about dram getting quicklynched on the back of your one vote? You are conflating us in a very bizarre way. I can't recall a time I've seen someone non-sarcastically claim to have found a scum partnership on page one.

As I said later, I'm not familiar with all the players, your interaction didn't read as being perfectly Townish.

Actually, I think he

is

Scum. I just want to move slowly on this. Last time I was sure someone was Scum they flipped Town.

But how does taking off your one vote help you learn his alignment? That's what I don't understand.

Not voting for someone slows down wagons. Slowing down wagons usually sparks conversations. Conversations aid in discerning alignments.

I need much more from you, dear. I do not like your vote movement at all.

I've seen much more vote movement than mine from Town before (in other games) so your dislike is noted and not cared about.

Klingon never responds to any of this, despite me telling her, straight up, that I needed much more from her.

So I wasn't in scum territory before that post?

You were in Scum territory with your very first post. Others have commented on it as well.

And I call her out for ignoring 77, which she has just referred to when she called me scum because I OMGUS'd her.

Town rarely OMGUSes

My latest plea, seen here, and Klingon has come full circle. She tells me to "ask away", when I've asked her questions on five separate occasions, been ignored, asked repeatedly for her to go back and address me... and she acts oblivious to all of this.
I apologize for how long that is, but I think y'all may not fully appreciate how much this woman is dodging unless I paint the picture.

Not so much how long it is but how fucking redundant.

What has me even more convinced that you're Scum is the trivial matters that you're willing to wallpost about. I could see such obsession on day 3 or later, but this early in Day 1 is ridiculous.

[Klingoncelt]

VOTE: klingon

Sorry grandma. The more I think about this game the more it feels like you are scum this time.

I'm basing this on previous familiarity with your meta and with my gut reaction.

You're wrong.

Red's obsessive wallposting over an RVS vote doesn't strike you as scummy?

[Klingoncelt]

I still do not understand what the big deal is about post 75! You guys keep commenting on it but I simple do not get it?

alas I am not

how distressing to think that you think lowly of your own team.

you think lowly of your own team

your own team

your

Your

team, not

our

team.

The very first game I ever saw (I didn't play in it but Dragonspawn did) a player (Moonglow) made a very similar slip. He was lynched and flipped Scum.

VOTE: Suzune

[Klingoncelt]

Are you guys even reading the game. Dramonic was saying things about how he thinks little of town in 72. And assuming Dramonic is town, Suzune comments about how Dramonic thinks little of his team. How town!dram thinks little of town.

I don't see the slip.

Suzune comments about how Dramonic thinks little of his team.

HIS team. Not OUR team. Or OUR Town.

However, since there's still some debate over No Lynching, I'll

UNVOTE:

for the time being.

[Klingoncelt]

Welcome, Wanderer.

[Klingoncelt]

Hi Klingon

How do you feel about a no-lynch today?

I'm not a huge fan of no-lynches. But in this game I'm so paranoid that it's too likely that I'll vote for the wrong person.

At this point in time

if enough people want a No Lynch I'll go along with it.

[Klingoncelt]

Hi Klingon

How do you feel about a no-lynch today?

I'm not a huge fan of no-lynches. But in this game I'm so paranoid that it's too likely that I'll vote for the wrong person.

At this point in time

if enough people want a No Lynch I'll go along with it.

Why would you be afraid of voting for the wrong person?

It's a small game with 2 Scumteams. We can't afford more than a couple or 3 mislynches.

[Klingoncelt]

... I also think Klingon intentionally dodged a crucial question I asked her in 153, which is a post also being questioned by RedCoyote in his 257, which tells me that Klingon is ducking questions and letting Suzune take the brunt of a hit right now. She claimed she'd actually answer some of these questions in both her 154 and her 168, but the next day posted some fluff and then again the day after (and later that night of June 15 she picked up posting a little, worth noting because I don't want her to point to that and say, "I wasn't posting fluff look! Ozgin scum!").

I -also- think her reasoning for unvoting Suzune in her 219 is stupid. She's basically saying, "She slipped because <reason>, but I'm gonna unvote her because someone replaced in and asked me a question about no-lynching."

I answered in 169 that I don't know most of the players and was thus being overly paranoid and seeing everyone as Super Ultra Scum Deluxe. (As yet that hasn't changed. )

Red is the one with a problem, not me. He's totally obsessing over my RVS vote.

I've seen this sort of thing before, in an offsite game. Dragonspawn had just been lynched D2 as the Fire Godfather. The Ice Godfather accidentally outed himself and was to be the D3 lynch.
A player we'll call "Derptex" got me lynched instead.
Why? Because as a Meat Shield she should have protected the Cop. She refused to, Fire Mafia NK'd the Cop and I gave her hell for it. Derptex bullshittunneled me and got me lynched.
I was Town.

I'm seeing the same sort of bullshittunnel from Red. Big fucking deal, I RVS voted then removed my vote. He needs to get past it. If this is all he can do towards scumhunting then he's useless to Town. You know, the way Scum is useless to Town but tries to look good by blowing smoke up everyone's asses.

And I'm not "letting" Suzune take the brunt of a hit. Suz made the "your team" comment, and I've seen Scum do that before. (So has Dragon.) Suz has to deal with that, not me. The problem I'm having is that there's an apparent ESL issue here. There's also the No Lynch being considered.

And yeah, Oz, I think you're Scum. Like I said, I think everyone's Scum. I need to get better reads on everyone.

Oh yeah, I come here at night, so if I'm the main wagon - any Day - have the courtesy to let me claim before dropping the hammer. It pisses me to no end to discover that I was mislynched while I was in bed sleeping.

[Klingoncelt]

@Klingon: you're not scumhunting. All you do is defend yourself and make statements. How are you going to change that?

As long as I'm not being derptunneled I'll be better able to hunt Scum.

[Klingoncelt]

Not really seeing much to make me want to vote suz. I actually like her foxy in some of the posts.

I also don't like grandma not wanting to get things wrong day one. Yeah we might make a mistake but we have a good chance at hitting scum too. And the information from a flip would be more useful than doing nothing and hoping the scum and watcher do all the work.

I need to worry about getting things wrong on D1 in this game - so does everyone else with this setup. We can't afford a lot of mislynches with only 7 Townies.

[Klingoncelt]

This answer is not satisfactory. Being tunneled does not preclude you from scumhunting. Also, I don't like your no lynch stance, which seems to strategically support your lack of scum hunting, and I don't like your defensiveness.

Vote: KlingonCelt

Actually it does preclude me from scumhunting. It's extremely distracting. Like I said, I wound up being mislynched before due to a derptunnel. (Looks likes it's happening again. )

[Klingoncelt]

We can afford the same amount of mislynches as a 9 townie game, possibly more.

How many is that? How many are you willing to risk?

[Klingoncelt]

I have a house full of noise right now, I'll be back in a couple hours with some reads.

[Klingoncelt]

Well good news, you all can have another nice long post from me.

I am sure Dram this thrilled~

I read through the entire topic and I took notes on interactions between members and created a reads list. Since we have none of them yet this game. Now remember these are my reads, you are more then free to complain about them.

Scum

Klingoncelt:

Spoiler:

Spends the majority of the game back peddling. He has a comment, someone comments on it and the has to rephrase. It happens three times in the course of the game. The first time is with the unvote and the train comment. The second is involves a voting for people on trains and whether or not they flip comment. The third being the most recent after Red pushed him to respond. He also appears to have a huge fear or voting and being wrong, since it has come up many times throughout the game so far. Not for or against the case but a curiosity: on 29 he posted that he was waiting for BlueMoon…why? References: post 36, post 55, Klingoncelt"], post 115, post 113, post 135, post 199, post 223

unvote:Red

You confuse backpedaling with clarifying.

I never backpedaled at all, certain other players either misread my intent or deliberately tried to paint me as Scum.

I don't have time for lengthy wall posts, so I make my posts and replies as short as possible. Sometimes in doing so I evidently leave room for ambiguity and misunderstanding.

Anyway, I clarified my positions, I didn't backpedal anything.

[Klingoncelt]

But that was an extremely scummy presentation.
Once again, you're playing self-preservation as opposed to town-interest.
I'm excited to get you lynched

EDIT: Oh no, you're definitely backpedaling.

For it to have been a scummy presentation I'd have to be Scum. I am not.

Self-preservation my ass, I was replying to a spcific post.

I'd rather see you swinging.


btw, reads list nearly done. Laundry and sorrow distracted me.

[Klingoncelt]

Town:
Soren
Wanderer-nl
Ozgin

Lean Town:
BlueMoonRising
Suzune

Null:
Papi Bear
Dragonspawn
A Simple Plan

Lean Scum:
RedCoyote

Scum:
Dramonic

[Klingoncelt]

Someone ask Dramonic what his read on Klingon is please. Because that's the vote he got RC off of.

Last I recall he said I was too stupid to be Scum. Misogyny or Scum!ego, you decide.

I've had about enough of him.

VOTE: Dramonic

[Klingoncelt]

This is a game of mafia, not a daycare center.
If you can't handle getting called out on your shit, replace out.

Do I see sour grapes?

[Klingoncelt]

Sorry I've been a tad inactive. Been a busy little bee.

I have read Klingoncelt incorrectly in almost every game I've been in with her, but I really don't buy this as town. She plays off the discrepancies in her posts with shitty reasons like in her 313 saying, "Oh the shortness of my posts account for the ambiguity of my posts, and if you interpret my posts in a way that I don't like I'm gonna say you misinterpreted and blame the ambiguity."

I also noticed, upon rereading her ISO, she fos's RC a

lot

but never actually votes for him. She spends a lot of her time crusading for the lynches of others, claiming she thinks everyone is scum, etc., but she doesn't actually push a wagon or lynch on Red who she's so sure is scum. Even her vote on dramonic is off, and it looks to me like she's using her emotion/anger/offended state as a reason to get on dram's wagon.

But you know,

Red

is scum, which is why we should be lynching dramonic.

I have Red as Scum, and Dramonic as more Scum. I'm voting for Dramonic. Problem?

[Klingoncelt]

Yeah, I do have a problem. You talk about how Red is scum all the time, much more than dram. And you think that Suzune slipped. But no, I get it, let's lynch dram. That makes the most sense.

Red is Scum. Dram is Scum. I can only vote for one at a time. I'm voting for Dram right now.

I said Red more often because Red made more posts that I replied to. At present I'm pretty much ignoring anything he throws at me because he's Scum.

As far as Suzune goes, I was (finally) seeing her as Town before the "slip." But with the language barrier, it's possible/likely that there was no slip.

[Klingoncelt]

After Dram is lynched today I'll go for Red tomorrow. Happy?

[Klingoncelt]

Wait, you've never mentioned her language barrier as a reason for her slip to be invalidated and you never actually said you don't think her slip was a slip, so as far as I've been concerned you think (or thought I suppose) she slipped.

267:And I'm not "letting" Suzune take the brunt of a hit. Suz made the "your team" comment, and I've seen Scum do that before. (So has Dragon.) Suz has to deal with that, not me.

The problem I'm having is that there's an apparent ESL issue here.

There's also the No Lynch being considered.

You also say you were finally seeing her as town

before the "slip"

. Are you implying you're scumreading her for a scumslip you now no longer think exists?

What a stupid question.
I was reading her as Town before the "slip."
The "slip" would prove her to be Scum, no?
Except it may well have been an ESL thing, not really a slip.
So she's back on my Town list.

As far as happiness with lynches, I'll be happiest when your head is on the floor beneath the guillotine of fate, friend. That is, until someone else looks scummier than you.

Look in the mirror, dear.

[Klingoncelt]

267:And I'm not "letting" Suzune take the brunt of a hit. Suz made the "your team" comment, and I've seen Scum do that before. (So has Dragon.) Suz has to deal with that, not me.

The problem I'm having is that there's an apparent ESL issue here.

There's also the No Lynch being considered.

I'm ESL too, can I take part in this magically delicious BS townread?

You clearly are more fluent.

My vote stays on you.

[Klingoncelt]

Going to re-read this game in the next day or so and make a read list. But I can tell you kling is still my major scum read.

Okay, your opinion I'm interested in. Why do you think I'm Scum?

[Klingoncelt]

(And I like the Aang avi more.)

[Klingoncelt]

Klingon - starting with leaping off the one person wagon for fear of an early lynch she has been pinging me like crazy. She asks me if I'm scum, as if that's a serious scum hunting question. She unvotes dramonic because she doesn't want to rush a wagon on someone she thinks is scum. Feels like she has been trying to buddy me all game. There are just lots of things.

That's it?

I explained getting off the 1-person wagon. Single votes sometimes turn into flashlynches. I'm usually offline when the boards are most active. I didn't want to chance a flashlynch (read: pile on by Scum) when I knew I wouldn't be around to unvote.

"She asks me if I'm scum, as if that's a serious scum hunting question.:
Oh yeah, tell me you've never seen anyone do that before. You know I have a bitch of a time reading you, I'll try just about anything.
Plus you never know who will jump in and slip something stupid.

I've done absolutely nothing to buddy you - I'm not Scum and I'm too paranoid to trust anyone.

Avi, you're bullshitting.

[Klingoncelt]

not sure why that duplicated. Everyone should probably comment on the three wagons.

The three wagons:

Dramonic (3) - A Simple Plan, Wanderer-nl, Klingoncelt.
Suzune (3) - RedCoyote, Dramonic, Papi Bear.
Klingoncelt (3) - Ozgin, dragonspawn, BlueMoonRising.

I'm not Scum.

I don't think Suzune is Scum.

Vote for Dramonic.

[Klingoncelt]

Of the current wagons, Klingon is the best, Dramonic is second best, and Suzune is worst.

Not exactly. Vote Dramonic.

[Klingoncelt]

*shakes head*

Seriously. Lynch Dram. You can lynch me tomorrow, that's fine, but get Dram today.

[Klingoncelt]

*shakes head*

Seriously. Lynch Dram. You can lynch me tomorrow, that's fine, but get Dram today.

This sounds like caught scum.

Actually, no it doesn't. I'd have to be Scum for that.

Seriously, I am 100% absolutely convinced that Dram is Scum.

[Klingoncelt]

Gepetto: You are caught scum.
Pinoccio: No I'm not! I'd have to be scum for that! Dram is scum!
Gepetto: Your shirt says, "I joined scum and all I got was this lousy t shirt."

Except that for that to work my nose would have to grow.

Plus I'm not into novelty t-shirts.

[Klingoncelt]

I think Klingon being convinced I'm scum just made me conftown :3

Think again.

You're in a pretty flippant mood, aren't you? Nothing but a Mod confirm makes you confTown.

I am so bummed out that none of you see how Scummy he is.

[Klingoncelt]

I think Klingon being convinced I'm scum just made me conftown :3

And that line just made you drop to a scumier level on my list.

Thank you. Finally someone sees the light!

[Klingoncelt]

You are still scummier this game.

I don't get why you think that.

[Klingoncelt]

First of all: Suzunne you failed to mention you put Klingon on L-1 and you've been around for a while so you know that happens.

Second: intent to hammer.

@Klingon: Your readslist. Explain why people are where they are in your list. What have they done to earn a town/scumread and what do you need to get the rest off null? Also, time to claim.

I'm not one for wallposts.

The Townreads are players that are looking for Scum, and not letting themselves get too caught up in nonsense and wifom.

Town:
Soren
Wanderer-nl
Ozgin

Lean Town:
BlueMoonRising
Suzune


The Nulls are our two V/LAs and Dragon. I always have trouble reading Dragon the first Day. But this time I can definitely move him to Scum. Dead serious, he NEVER reads me as Scum on Day 1 unless he's got something to hide. Keep in mind, there are 2 Scumteams, I'm sure that he's on one and trying to make it look like I'm on the other. TWO Scumteams. I promise you Dragonspawn is Scum.

Null:
Papi Bear
Dragonspawn
A Simple Plan

And my original reads... I've been stuck all Day trying to clear up the shitstorm they created around me. You must lynch Dramonic.

Lean Scum:
RedCoyote

Scum:
Dramonic

[Klingoncelt]

My claim:

Town. Citizen. I'm not the Watcher.

[Klingoncelt]

How can you possibly be NKd unless you're Scum?

[Klingoncelt]

That was one hell of a slip.

VOTE: BlueMoonRising

[Klingoncelt]

Why are you worried about a NK when there won't be one for Town? Only Scum can die Tonite.

Yes, I'm serious.

[Klingoncelt]

From the OP:

[quote="In post 0, shos"]
Hello, PLAYER.

You are a vanilla townie. You have no night nor day actions.
However,

you are a conditional Bulletproof: if you are one of the first two people to get nightkilled - you will live through that night.

You win with the TOWN, when all threats to town are dead, and one townie is still alive.

[Klingoncelt]

Dun-dun-Dunnnnn!

[Klingoncelt]

That doesn't make me scum. It means I forgot about that part of the role pm.

Except that it's not part of the role pm, IT'S PART OF THE GAME MECHANICS.

[Klingoncelt]

That doesn't make me scum. It means I forgot about that part of the role pm.

Even if this were the case, why would you assume you'd be nightkilled? That whole post just seems rather strange.

Additionally, half of the discussion today was over the prospect of not lynching today versus lynching. Did you just check out of that altogether?

Klingon's desperation does not give me good vibes at all. We know she suspects dram. She's suspected him all game. Her repeating it over and over, especially with the addendum, "You can lynch me tomorrow, please, just lynch dram first" is troubling. I'd be interested to see if this is normal for her in pressure type situations because it's unlike how I'd act in a similar situation.

If you want to site meta me, go ahead, but my playstyle changes game to game based on RL distractions. (Right now we're dealing with a terrible, tragic death in the family, and we just found out that an old family friend committed suicide last Wednesday. The Grim Reaper has me totally mindfucked right now.)

Yes, I very much suspect Dram. And you, and Dragon.

Funny, I thought Blue Moon was Town until that bizarro slip. Now he's ObvScum.

[Klingoncelt]

My claim:

Town. Citizen. I'm not the Watcher.

You really don't have much room to complain about blue when you claim citizen. A role that isn't mentioned in this game.

So why is his unfamiliarity with the role pm a scum flip but yours not?

I said Town. Citizen.

The new normal rules outlawed "Vanilla Townie", so I've been trying to remember to say it that way whenever I pull a VT.

[Klingoncelt]

You really don't have much room to complain about blue when you claim citizen. A role that isn't mentioned in this game.

So why is his unfamiliarity with the role pm a scum flip but yours not?

His unfamiliarity isn't just with the role PM, but with the game's setup. A setup that's linked to. A setup that was highly publicized in the contest.

[Klingoncelt]

The new normal rules outlawed "Vanilla Townie"

There was a bunch of noise over it a couple months back. No, I'm not going into the assorted forums and looking it up for you. Try Mafia Discussion and And Site Ideas as starting points.

[Klingoncelt]

The role pm specifically says vanilla townie, but it's outlawed?

You claimed citizen. That's impossible because it's not a role in this game.

Citizen is synonymous with VT. And yes, there was a lot of noise about it.

I didn't reference the Wiki, I avoid that because it's just recently been updating. Note the "ing," the process isn't finished yet. You may recall my complaining on Wake's board about how outdated the Wiki is.

Anyway, look for threads onsite here dealing with new normal rules.

[Klingoncelt]

I tried the wiki on Normal Game Guidelines and saw no mention of anything like that... I've heard of Citizen as a synonym for VT (although it's heavily, heavily in the minority), but I've never heard of anyone trying to "outlaw" the term VT.

I had no issue with your claim until you made that statement, which seems rather bizarre. Almost like you're adding extra stuff ("the reason I said it this way is because the administration prefers this term now... get with the times!") in to make your claim seem more legitimate.

My claim is legitimate.

You're trying to find ways to make me look Scummy.

It's getting real old, Red.

[Klingoncelt]

I searched this topic, and the word 'citizen' does not appear once. I've also search MD for the word 'citizen' and it led me nowhere. The closest I could find is some thread from 2013 asking people what term they preferred.

http://forum.mafiascum.net/search.php?k ... mit=Search

[Klingoncelt]

This game continues to baffle me with its weirdness.

@Kling~
I have played many mafia games and never before even in the simplest of games have I heard of a citizen. So if you were looking to appeal to anyone but the other mafia scum players then I believe the claim fell flat. Truth be told is that a vanilla townie has no power to prove their innocence and clearly if pressured even the town tracker would claim vanilla townie just to protect their role. So I fail to see how your claim proves anything? In a game like this actions dictate a lot of how a person is perceived. Since the majority of us do not have a power role. The fact that you game a claim against the game list and constantly need to back pedal to correct yourself is an interesting problem. I would be able to handwave a few clarification errors but at this point everything you say has to be rewritten. While I find it hard to imagine a scum would be so inconsistent with their thoughts, in a two party setup, it is easy for the mafia to act as townies. Town people have been lynched for less, so I think the case on you is not poor.

I'm starting to get pissed off.

You've been here 2 months, Noob, don't imagine that you have the slightest idea how I play.

I don't backtrack. Someone has a question, I answer it. That's not backtracking.

If I'm on the way to the gallows, I should claim, right? Does that make sense to you? So I claimed potato/potahto. In other words I'm not the Watcher, which is a PR. One of the Townies has it. Not me. Problem?

I believe I mentioned a tragic death in the family, followed by the suicide of a family friend, both in the past month. Fuck yeah I'm inconsistent.

[Klingoncelt]

Now, now, no need to be nasty. I have never once claimed to know how you play. I simply mentioned that you seem to have to re-explain things a lot. I apologise if there is some kind of misunderstanding here.

I do not have a problem with your claim persay, and while you were in the right to and probably should, I simply meant to imply that in a game of this size and considering the roles it makes is not very helpful to claim.

Goodness, I was not aware of such tragedy. I apologise if I offended you.

I'm sorry.

Very sorry.

I didn't mean to blow up like I did. The grieving process is... unpredictable. It's like ocean waves, most of them come and go and I can handle it, but sometimes there's a big one that knocks me down. I should have stayed away from his Facebook page tonight.

Anyway, about the claim, now that my head's straight, I don't want anyone to worry about the possibility of my being the Watcher. (Although I very much doubt anyone thinks I am.)

And I am having to re-explain things.
I'll explain myself to Player A, then Player B asks the same damn question, same with player C, then a few posts later Player A brings it up again.
It's hard to scumhunt when I'm buried in someone else's wifom. Maybe that's what some people want...

[Klingoncelt]

No longer confused. I just can't count

It's that Avatar. Bring back Aang.

[Klingoncelt]

I hate being the Day 1 lynch.

[Klingoncelt]

Hi, Flames.

Ignore everyone voting for me, please. I'm not Scum.

[Klingoncelt]

Just remember to look hard at what I said, and one more thing - the underside of this bus ain't a pretty sight.

[Klingoncelt]

It was a good game. I'm annoyed i was killed so early.

You gave yourself away coming after me so hard.

[Klingoncelt]

Shos, the flavor was most excellent, great job!

Congrats, Town, good game, all. <3

[Klingoncelt]

TellTaleHeart, definitely you're my choice for MVP!

[Klingoncelt]

Ok, explain; how did TTH play well? I'm here to learn. I was on to her for 3 days. How did she play well and how do I convince people of what I think?

You may have been on to her, but you didn't get her lynched for 3 days.

[Klingoncelt]

I know. I want to know how I can improve to get my fellow-townies to actually take me seriously. And please don't tell me I need to use hearrts and sweet words. I don't do that. Maybe I should have signed up as a male after all...

Meh.

People get caught up in their own beliefs. In some games they obsess on their own egos. If everyone always listened to the voice of reason Town would win every game.

Do what you can and hope for the best.

[Klingoncelt]