Mini 1837: Family Mafia (GAME OVER)

[Postie]

vote: postie

VOTE: postie

youre always scum

no u

[Postie]

VOTE: Camn

[Postie]

Actually

VOTE: SpicyJalapeñoKnocks

3 (probable) scum? 3 unconfirmed players?
SpicyJalapeñoKnocks/Papa Zito/Nachomamma8 for scum gg

[Postie]

Ehhhh.

Hm. I like your vote, but what was this about?

Hey giga why did you feel the need to question House on something so inconsequential?

[Postie]

I thought he saw something I didn't.

Like what?

[Postie]

Something that would make you think "Ehhh". I wasn't seeing anything particularly strange, so I didn't know what prompted House to post that.

Yeah but his "Ehhhh" was in response to the SpicyJalapeñoKnocks wagon. Did you think he'd found a reason to townread a player that hadn't posted yet?

[Postie]

Okay I like you.

[Postie]

UNVOTE: SpicyJalapeñoKnocks

No ty.

[Postie]

look at this post

vote: SpicyJalapenoKnocks

Will you listen to me this game Spy?

LOOK AT IT

VOTE: dramonic

[Postie]

LOOK AT IT

[Postie]

Dear lord I want to put you right back in quickhammer range Dwlee

[Postie]

Are Jesters possible in this game?

[Postie]

Is it possible your game has any of the following bastard roles or mechanics?

No

Apparently not.

Dwlee, pls give me something to work with. Anything.

[Postie]

Hey dram

Who's scum? Who's town?

[Postie]

Cakez, who's scum that isn't Nacho?

[Postie]

I think Kraska, gigabyte, and camn are town

Reasons?

Also- I am trending toward nachoscum here, as well.

Why?

[Postie]

Probably because you tried to get me lynched in bacanno and then I solved the game (although idk why that makes you want to kill me since you were town..) but uh
~Dwlee

What

[Postie]

and although I would rank him as SUPER HARD to pin down lately...

Links?

[Postie]

Probably because you tried to get me lynched in bacanno and then I solved the game (although idk why that makes you want to kill me since you were town..) but uh
~Dwlee

What

was talking to camm

I know but
What

[Postie]

Kraska because Nacho's push on her is terrible. If Nacho was town then I'd reevaluate this.

Pre-flip associations oh goodie

[Postie]

Tbh I'd be fine with it if he was saying "if Nacho is scum, then I'd townread kraska."
But that's not what he's saying. He's saying "I'm townreading kraska

right now

because of this other read I have" which is terrible on so many levels.

[Postie]

Hi postie got any reads?

giga's town. House is probably town. I think SpicyJalapeñoKnocks more likely town than not but I really wish they were scum.
dram is still a good lynch.

What about you?

[Postie]

Err when he's voting nacho the intent is pretty blindingly clear. He thinks nacho is scum and it isn't a bus therfore town.

It's drunk but the logic itself is whatever

I know that, but unless he's close to 100% sold on Nacho-scum I fail to see why using that as a reason to townread kraska isn't completely stupid. Like you could have a read on a single player and use that to get a read on every other player in the game if you wanted but you wouldn't because that would be ridiculous. Doing it with one player is just as bad in terms of logic.

[Postie]

House, can you tell me more about your SpyreX townread?

[Postie]

Sky blue.
Water wet.
SpyreX town.

It's like death and taxes only bluer

Uh, sure, SpyreX, you can weigh-in on your towniness too. Why are you town?

[Postie]

Does

scum

SpyreX!scum open the game banging the quicklynch kickdrum in 2-Pac "All Eyez On Me" fashion?

Granted, I don't have a ton of meta on him, but that'd be balls as hell.

He strikes me as a ballsy player in general, so yes, I think he'd be willing to give it a shot as scum.

P-Edit - yup thought so.

[Postie]

What is this some deep philosophical question?
Or am i supposed to quote the town handbook about how we're better dead then red and GOOD TOWN ALWAYS ON THE HUNT.

F all that.

Idk man I've seen some responses from people when asked about their own towniness that were genuinely helpful.

[Postie]

@camn and SpyreX

- how many games have you two played together?

[Postie]

VOTE: Spicy

L-1

pls no there are players that literally haven't posted yet

[Postie]

i doubt anyone's going to quickhammer

This is how quickhammers happen.

[Postie]

Oh hey dramonic can you PLEASE POST SOMETHING USEFUL ITO£REWJFSDSMKLTFDSJ<M

[Postie]

Can we not risk a lynch less than 24 hours into the game jfc

[Postie]

Ty!

[Postie]

Alright that makes me feel better about the buddying.

[Postie]

<3

[Postie]

*shrug*

I don't have a read on Spicy, but I

do

have a read on dram. We can come back to Spicy if dram stops being both scummy and active lurking.

[Postie]

???

Oh yeah I said that. It's mostly a gut thing I keep going back and forth on so it's close to not a read.

[Postie]

VOTE: Nacho

Every single one of his posts just scream scum to me

It's uncanny

Do go on.

[Postie]

I just went through your ISO Cakez and I can't follow your push on Nacho very well at all.
Can you do a case or something

[Postie]

I'm not really buying that Elyse as town would stretch quite that much

I really wish I could agree with you.

[Postie]

329 makes me want to both scumread Elyse for how fake it sounds and townread her for how ballsy the push is.

[Postie]

Why do you disagree?

Never underestimate town's capacity for stupid.
That said she could totally be scum I'm just not outright scumreading her at this point. I wish she'd post more though.

[Postie]

Also where the fuck is hiplop

[Postie]

i don't find your playstyle scummy though

[Postie]

Spicy should probably just claim at this point.

[Postie]

Also

SpicyJalapeñoKnocks is at

 

L-1

If anyone lolhammers I swear to god

[Postie]

Ehehehehe

[Postie]

I almost

Bloodly hell don't scare me like that

[Postie]

Oh

Oops

[Postie]

Elyse promised a catch-up and hiplop hasn't posted anything substantial. I'm not okay ending the day before one or both of those things happen.

[Postie]

There is so much data to be had on a Jalepeno flip now.. I think we need it.

Also what data are you talking about here, camn?

[Postie]

I'm going back to what I said orginally about SpicyJalapeñoKnocks being town after re-ISOing them. Aaand for the following reasons:

1) As scum, why lurk out your own lynch?
2) Along the same kind of lines, why would scum lurk out their partner's lynch at this point rather than bus the fuck out of them? Presently, no one's really shouting about their lynch with any real conviction except SpyreX, and if you want to convince me they're partners then glhf.

Really super not convinced that scum would respond to their own lynch by trolling the thread and egging people on either, which I think is what was pinging me as gut town earlier.

Right now, I'm not even close to happy with this lynch happening. There are plenty of days left before deadline and I'd like to not immediately fuck shit up. Thanks guyz.

[Postie]

Dwlee can you please give town a good reason to not lynch you rather than sitting around on your butt doing absolutely nothing. You're literally active lurking at this point.

[Postie]

I'm townreading you but I'm this close to saying fuck it and agreeing to policy lynch you.

[Postie]

If you can't manage a few sentences of game-related content, then at least announce that you're V/LA.

[Postie]

Really super not convinced that scum would respond to their own lynch by trolling the thread and egging people on either, which I think is what was pinging me as gut town earlier.

Mostly this. Like if you've got the pressure of your death actually being a large loss to your team and potentially your partners yelling at you to do something over daytalk then I don't buy that you'd come in and do... that.

[Postie]

No, I'm saying that if your death means your faction loses 1/3 of its' members, that provides strong incentive not to dick around and do things that make people want to lynch you when you're at L-1.

P-Edit - HYPE

[Postie]

postie what do you think about the anti-dramonic wagon sentiment? i.e. the people saying that dram is just being dram? i'm assuming you have some experience reading him

I've played one game with dram but I don't remember much of it and I was scum there so I have very little experience reading him. I do think he'd probably post like this regardless of alignment but his opening post was still terrible and I want some pressure on the slot because regardless of whether he normally plays like this or not, I don't want to allow him to hide behind it as scum.

[Postie]

VOTE: Elyse

Too much blind attacking, not enough thinking. I know she's capable of actually taking a step back and showing some element of *game-solving noises* and I'm not getting any of that here.

[Postie]

VOTE: Elyse

Too much blind attacking, not enough thinking. I know she's capable of actually taking a step back and showing some element of *game-solving noises* and I'm not getting any of that here.

Can you talk to me about why you thought the Dwlee hydra was town because they haven't been bussed yet?
The argument assumes that 1) every scum partnership busses immediately, 2) scum aren't already bussing, and 3) town will suspect their play to such an extent to where they would be dead if scum jumped on. Can you walk me though it?

1) Not really, but with the slot having reached L-1 at several points already and no one except me really being sold on them being town you can't honestly believe they'll survive to endgame. May as well grab the towncred while it's still on the table.
2) Why would SpyreX tunnel their partner for the whole day phase from page 1? Why would camn swipe at their partner from the sidelines and encourage the wagon without actually making sure to be seen making a big push on them? Anyone else on the wagon was basically "meh whatever sure I'll see where this goes" and I'm not sure you could even call that bussing.
3) See 1). Unless I'm misunderstanding what you're saying here.

[Postie]

I don't think that lynching scum Jalapenos at this point earns a lot of town credit for whoever kills them.

More towncred that they'd get for doing nothing or defending them though.

[Postie]

Actually yeah Zito hasn't been doing a whole lot.

SpyreX, why is Zito town?

[Postie]

HI RANMARU

[Postie]

Postie, why did you ask Giga about their question to House in #22?

Because I wanted to move the game out of RVS.

Read on Camn and Giga?

Camn is meh Giga is obvtown.

[Postie]

Yo Ranmaru, why aren't you townreading kraska?

[Postie]

She stated she wouldn't wagon Nacho D1 but when the opportunity arrived, she took it, saying he was being scummy. (When he wasn't)

Yeah this bugged me enough that I'd consider voting camn. I prefer my Elyse vote though.

[Postie]

Why are you townreading Cakez, Ran?

[Postie]

Also no one should be townreading Zito wtf.

[Postie]

I already explained my Cake reasoning twice, Postie.

No, you've explained why you believe his actions aren't scummy; you haven't explained why you think he's town.

[Postie]

No it's not.

"Not scummy" and nothing more = null

[Postie]

It says he expects new town would believe it, not that it's towny or that scum wouldn't use the same reasoning.

[Postie]

He says he has been around for a year or so but I don't think scum would purposely push defensiveness after being around for a year.

This is what I was looking for. Thank you.

Follow up question - why not?

[Postie]

Because it's dumb to still believe in that.

Why would his grasp of Mafia theory improve while he was scum? If he can fail to see why it's dumb as town he can fail to see why it's dumb as scum.

What.

[Postie]

Not scumreading her based on theory disagreement. Scumread remains the same.

I wasn't saying you were, I was posting about Cakez and those who are casting shade on him over an unpopular belief.

Doesn't matter if we agree or even if his belief is provably suboptimal. All that matters is whether he genuinely believes it.

I'm not scumreading Cakez. I just don't understand Ranmaru's townread on him.

[Postie]

My read on Postie breaks rule 5

<3

[Postie]

Got it. That's the important part, and I feel he believes it.

Why would his grasp of Mafia theory improve while he was scum? If he can fail to see why it's dumb as town he can fail to see why it's dumb as scum.

What.

I think Postie is trying to fake a misunderstanding yet continues to press it.

Why?

[Postie]

Sup ran glad to see you're town.

Why are you townreading Ran?

[Postie]

94, 344

These feel genuine. Which is the gist of what I'm saying, and I feel like you are purposely tuning that out Postie.

I don't understand

why

you're reading them as genuine though.

What is your read on Sir Cakes?

Null.

[Postie]

Postie why you so concerned with my town reads yo

Because I don't have a read on Ranmaru and would like one.

[Postie]

I'm interested in Postie's response to Spyrex.

Do you want me to give an updated read on you in light of SpyreX's read on you?

[Postie]

so you must have a conclusion from that, unless you didn't really mean to ask him.

False and misleading assumption.

[Postie]

Ranmaru how pissed would you be if I just ignored you from hereon out

[Postie]

Yeah ima just pretend you're not in this game for now

[Postie]

Because I feel I stand about as much chance at convincing you I'm town as Nacho does at convincing Cakez he's town.

[Postie]

I'm here, willing to listen.

From what I've seen so far you're likely deluding yourself, or scum. Either way I'm not interested in getting into an argument with you because that usually kickstarts my tunnelvision, which will prevent me from getting an accurate read on you if you're town.

[Postie]

You can explain why I am deluding myself then. I don't see you refuting what I'm saying. Also tell me what you think of your wagon at the moment.

Okay putting you back on ignore.

[Postie]

As scum, she likes to nitpick on stupid things and tunnel on them.

What? No, that's exactly my townplay. It's when I'm

not

tunneling on stupid things that I'm scum.

[Postie]

I don't see how he as town could be so certain Spicy isn't scum

The amount of times I've been called scum for this

It's not a thing.

[Postie]

It's day one.

ONE.

And it's not like they've given anything to townread them on.

Did you have an actual point, or is that just ghosts of butthurt past talking?

Are you trying to say that it's fine for you to scumread people for stupid reasons because it's day 1?

[Postie]

House was talking about Nacho there, not Jalapeno.

No, I'm saying that just because you heard something in the past doesn't mean it's never a valid point.

"Too confident to be town" is never a valid point. There I said it.

[Postie]

Guys I'm pretty sure Giga's town.

[Postie]

But that's why I townread her? Like look at Kid's TV Show mafia in the Theme Park, this didn't look like her scumgame to me.

I too have past experience with scum!kraska and am slightly impressed with the transformation from that to this.

[Postie]

VOTE: Kraskaalso i don't mind being lynched/vigged at all i really have not been pulling my weight here lol

Town don't say this.

Yes they do.

[Postie]

Giga has been my top townread the entire game. If there was one person I'd stake the game on being town it would be Giga.

[Postie]

Interesting

Elaborate.

[Postie]

Yup. Conclusion?

[Postie]

Good thing Giga's town then.

[Postie]

I went back to see why I townread kraska and now I feel a lot better about this guilty.

[Postie]

Postie, can you show me where and why you townread Kraska originally? Thank you.

Tonal + I remembered her scumgame being a pile of garbage and didn't think she'd have improved already. But actually looking at her ISO it's pretty bad.

[Postie]

Yo Ranmaru, why aren't you townreading kraska?

Consider this an implied townread.

[Postie]

So which post did you look back at to feel better about the guilty?

All of them.

[Postie]

Postie, do you agree with me that Kraska flipping scum means that Elyse is most likely town and Nacho probably is too? Asking since you were scumreading Elyse yesterday (or at least I assume so because that's where your vote was left off).

Because she would have been bussing Elyse and she doesn't have a history of bussing? Idk man doesn't seem like the best reason to "clear" someone over.

[Postie]

They're both scummy af

Do go on.

[Postie]

I'm tingling with anticipation.

[Postie]

Uh oh

That doesn't sound good

[Postie]

oh my god stop being cryptic and give us that juicy juicy info kraska

[Postie]

Pedit: yeah I switched with myself obviously

What
Why??

[Postie]

Should we wait for everyone to check in before hammering?
(And if so, someone should probably unvote.)

[Postie]

Oh right.

[Postie]

inb4 kraska self-hammers

[Postie]

Look this is the first time I get rolled a role like this...I dont really know what is the optimal way to use it. But it looked like I'm def not getting protected over zito or spy, I figured if anyone targets me it'll be investigatives so I switched myself with nacho who was a nullish read
I chose nacho bc he's a controversial read and in the offchance that were wrong about elyse, he could be scum

Then you should be happy to let us lynch you since your flip proves Nacho is scum.

[Postie]

And I protect Cakez tonight, then?

Are you softclaiming a protective PR? And if so why?
Did I miss something?

[Postie]

Well that explains why you haven't self-hammered yet and this was so different to what I remember from your scumgame.

P-Edit - Nacho hasn't posted yet so hold off for now please.

[Postie]

Group scum decided to take the night off, then?

Either the Mafia targeted SpyreX too or camn or someone blocked the kill. I doubt kraska is lying because it's not like we're going to keep her alive for offering up this info.

[Postie]

So you think camn is a bulletproof protective role? Okay...

I assumed she was trying to bait or fake baiting the nightkill but yeah not much point going along with it after you've pointed out the elephant in the room. Not that I buy scum would have been dumb enough to shoot someone who is allegedly both bulletproof and a protective role anyway.

[Postie]

What on earth is Nacho going to add to this, anyway?

Likely nothing, but there's always a small chance he has some kind of info that could be important.

[Postie]

I appreciate your efforts, kraska. <3

[Postie]

As much as I would love to keep you alive and say hey let's team up and use you as a vig and then we'll kill you later anyway but give you a cookie post-game... who knows what other awful night powers you have.

sori

[Postie]

I don't know what to believe anymore.

[Postie]

Congrats, town! Was fun.

[Postie]

Sorry for scum reading you early on, and I totally understand your actions now (cuz mazons). I just totally didn't understand you. My bad.

Haha, that's perfectly reasonable though. I would have scumread me too, and I wasn't trying to not be scumread.

[Postie]

Sure; sounds good!