Mini 1867 -- TBD Mafia [game over]
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Desperado Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 12582
- Joined: February 18, 2013
- Location: Raleigh, NC
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Desperado Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 12582
- Joined: February 18, 2013
- Location: Raleigh, NC
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Desperado Survivor
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Desperado Survivor
- Survivor
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- Posts: 12582
- Joined: February 18, 2013
- Location: Raleigh, NC
Could be ya.In post 261, Narna wrote:Is Lane town?
Faking the PR; no meaningful response to his wagon; no thoughts on dreal responding to his wagon for him.Find scum intent in mcmeemo posting.-
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Desperado Survivor
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- Posts: 12582
- Joined: February 18, 2013
- Location: Raleigh, NC
Even if everyone answered truthfully both on the questionnaire and in their answers here I don't think we'd be able to deduce anything from that information. We don't know what kind of assumptions xyzzy was making to interpret the data and make design decisions.
I don't know if it's necessarily anti-town, mainly because merely discussing this issue can provide alignment indicators, but I do think it could end up dominating the discussion and give scum an easy IIoA avenue.-
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Desperado Survivor
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- Survivor
- Posts: 12582
- Joined: February 18, 2013
- Location: Raleigh, NC
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Desperado Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 12582
- Joined: February 18, 2013
- Location: Raleigh, NC
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Desperado Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 12582
- Joined: February 18, 2013
- Location: Raleigh, NC
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Desperado Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 12582
- Joined: February 18, 2013
- Location: Raleigh, NC
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Desperado Survivor
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- Posts: 12582
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umIn post 349, drealmerz7 wrote:you call that effort on a snarky lynch???
noooo, again, that is you just framing a narrative how you want to see it
HORRIBLY OBVIOUSLY TOO
No it's not. "Participate or die" cannot be interpreted any other way than as a threat to vote him for lurking.-
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Desperado Survivor
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- Posts: 12582
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- Location: Raleigh, NC
So is he sitting there waiting to twist what you say into something else, or is he doing nothing of his own?In post 354, drealmerz7 wrote:you're literally SITTING THERE WAITING TO FIND ANYTHING YOU CAN TO TWIST IT INTO SOMETHING ELSE
AND DOING ACTUALLY NOTHING OF YOUR OWN-
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Desperado Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 12582
- Joined: February 18, 2013
- Location: Raleigh, NC
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Desperado Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 12582
- Joined: February 18, 2013
- Location: Raleigh, NC
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Desperado Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 12582
- Joined: February 18, 2013
- Location: Raleigh, NC
When a player is wagoned he has four options:In post 383, ɀefiend wrote:My thoughts concern the second part Re: McMenno. Note that Narna's request was for Desperado to point out things about McMenno's posts that had scum motivation. However, two out of the three reasons Desperado gives imply that a lack of specific posting from McMenno is scummy. (The PR thing is up in the air, since we are talking about "McMeme-o" after all. I'm not going to digress to argue the strength of this reason.) McMenno didn't have a meaningful response to his wagon, but neither did Davsto, and Davsto's was bigger. The last reason is misapplied to the actual situation, so I cannot discern whether it is bogus scum reasoning or an honest mistake. However, I can explain the misapplication. Drealmerz wasn't responding to the McMenno wagon per se, he was responding to Lane questioning him about his own concern for the wagon.
1) Ignore it and do nothing else
2) Ignore it and continue scumhunting
3) Address it and do nothing else
4) Address it and continue scumhunting
1) and 3) lean scum, 2) and 4) lean town. McMenno and Davsto clearly reacted differently to their wagons so I'm curious what leads you to suggest that I'm "misapplying" anything here.
As for the last bit, Drealmerz questioned multiple McMenno votes--that is a response to the McMenno wagon, by definition. He carried a conversation on with lane regarding it, but if another player goes out of his way to question multiple votes on my town slot in RVS, I would want to know why and I would expect other townies to feel similarly.
Up to now Kain and Dreal are the only people truly engaging the questionnaire discussion and I have shared my Dreal read so I'm not really sure where you're going with this.In post 383, ɀefiend wrote:The last sentence pings me because (1) it reads as fence-sitting about the discussion as a whole, whereas most (active) players have taken a hard stance on it, and (2) KainTepes and drealmerz had just gone through a lengthy back-and-forth about the discussion at hand, but Desperado doesn't elaborate about what, if any "alignment indicators" he picked up on from their exchange -- this begs the questions
-If the KainTepes/drealmerz exchange didn't provide any alignment indicators (side note: I think it did), what type of indicators should we actually be searching for with regards to the questionnaire-reveal discussion? &
-If the exchange did provide alignment indicators, why didn't Desperado share these at the time? Why bring up the fact that the discussion can provide alignment indicators if you aren't going to talk about them?-
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Desperado Survivor
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- Survivor
- Posts: 12582
- Joined: February 18, 2013
- Location: Raleigh, NC
"Snarky steps back up to the plate down 0-2 in the count, and the pitch..."In post 390, SnarkySnowman wrote:If you're not voting davsto, you're wrong.
Lane is a good choice otherwise though.-
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Desperado Survivor
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- Posts: 12582
- Joined: February 18, 2013
- Location: Raleigh, NC
Are they?In post 392, McMenno wrote:I mean twou ouf thouse points are literally I was nout oun at the time sou I've resigned to him being either a lyncher oun me our bad scum
In post 130, McMenno wrote:I will OUVERTHROUW this nefarious britIn post 149, drealmerz7 wrote:why the vote on mcmenno?In post 155, drealmerz7 wrote:mcmenno, did you poop inside or something?
You're active lurking, you aren't outwardly attempting to game solve or help anyone else do so, and I want you dead.In post 173, McMenno wrote:are you nout oumgusing, davstou-
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Desperado Survivor
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- Posts: 12582
- Joined: February 18, 2013
- Location: Raleigh, NC
@ zefriend: "Hell, he even voted himself" come on. Davsto self voted in RVS. Once RVS was over, he began scumhunting. McMenno has not.
I don't care if there was a bigger wagon on someone else, I care that McMenno didn't care to comment on the votes on him, or on dreal's questioning of the votes on him, or on lane's questioning of dreals' questioning. McMenno was a key player in the early game and he doesn't have any thoughts on anything that happened. He's scum.
As for your last point, the alignment indicators are still going. The questionnaire discussion isn't over. Dreal was suggesting that we should never talk about it ever, I was suggesting that we should because even if the information isn't trustworthy or relevant, each players' response to it will be meaningful. Saying my methodology is bunk when it isn't even remotely close to be complete is pretty silly.-
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Desperado Survivor
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- Posts: 12582
- Joined: February 18, 2013
- Location: Raleigh, NC
I mean...3/10 of frank's post game in pre game. 2 more are prod dodges. And now he won't be active for another 8 days, at least?
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Desperado Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 12582
- Joined: February 18, 2013
- Location: Raleigh, NC
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Desperado Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 12582
- Joined: February 18, 2013
- Location: Raleigh, NC
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Desperado Survivor
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- Survivor
- Posts: 12582
- Joined: February 18, 2013
- Location: Raleigh, NC
Awesome man, enjoy his birthday.In post 432, FrankJaeger wrote:Also the day after my sons bday
....what does that have to do with the fact that you will have essentially not played the entire day phase tho?-
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Desperado Survivor
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- Posts: 12582
- Joined: February 18, 2013
- Location: Raleigh, NC
What am I being dodgy about? You're asking me for reads I don't have.In post 437, ɀefiend wrote:Idk why you're being so dodgy about this.-
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Desperado Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 12582
- Joined: February 18, 2013
- Location: Raleigh, NC
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Desperado Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 12582
- Joined: February 18, 2013
- Location: Raleigh, NC
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Desperado Survivor
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- Survivor
- Posts: 12582
- Joined: February 18, 2013
- Location: Raleigh, NC
If you've read my ISO then you would have seen the reads I've seen fit to divulge. They are reads I feel strongly enough about to give and support if necessary. If I haven't given a read on someone, it's because they don't lean one way or the other yet, or there's conflicting information, or any other of a number of reasons why I wouldn't have given a read on someone yet.-
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Desperado Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 12582
- Joined: February 18, 2013
- Location: Raleigh, NC
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Desperado Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 12582
- Joined: February 18, 2013
- Location: Raleigh, NC
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Desperado Survivor
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- Survivor
- Posts: 12582
- Joined: February 18, 2013
- Location: Raleigh, NC
Aye. That doesn't make them scum, either, but the hard townreads raise eyebrows for sure.In post 468, Aristophanes wrote:What do you think of Narna's tone and approach to the game? They seem to be narrating more than giving opinions (with a few exceptions) and playing it rather safe in general. In my quick Iso of them, I saw a lot of almost content, but not much that really had anything to it.-
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Desperado Survivor
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- Posts: 12582
- Joined: February 18, 2013
- Location: Raleigh, NC
Think I already have. Lane, dreal, and davsto are all town.In post 481, Azral wrote:Can you elaborate on this?-
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Desperado Survivor
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- Posts: 12582
- Joined: February 18, 2013
- Location: Raleigh, NC
Davsto wagon is definitely the worst. Like, early contender for Worst Wagon of the Year.In post 486, xyzzy wrote:"none of you have actually changed your votes since the last votecount," says the omnipotent voice in the sky, "but there's a couple of prods in the mod notes, so here's another votecount!"
"what the fuck is a votecount, and what the fuck is a mod notes," says everyone in exasperation simultaneously. it's actually pretty impressive.
"well," says the voice in the sky, "wait until I tell you about 'pedits'. that'll blow your minds."
mod notes: Gamma Emerald is V/LA until January 17 and has been prodded. Narna and Davsto have been prodded. p-edit: Davsto was able to post in the thread in the like 2 minutes between me sending the prod and making this post. good job, Davsto.
Frank's vote on lane looks the worst, for sure. Dreal and Narna have at least been open about why they think lane is scum, they're just mistaken.
@ Davsto and lane; stop voting dreal and help me lynch McMenno, ya?-
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Desperado Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 12582
- Joined: February 18, 2013
- Location: Raleigh, NC
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Desperado Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 12582
- Joined: February 18, 2013
- Location: Raleigh, NC
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Desperado Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 12582
- Joined: February 18, 2013
- Location: Raleigh, NC
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Desperado Survivor
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- Survivor
- Posts: 12582
- Joined: February 18, 2013
- Location: Raleigh, NC
I don't care if McMenno has been lynchbait in the past or whatever your experience with him. In this game his active lurking and lack of engagement are scummy.In post 496, drealmerz7 wrote:you didn't address my point-
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Desperado Survivor
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- Posts: 12582
- Joined: February 18, 2013
- Location: Raleigh, NC
In post 263, Desperado wrote:
Could be ya.In post 261, Narna wrote:Is Lane town?
Faking the PR; no meaningful response to his wagon; no thoughts on dreal responding to his wagon for him.Find scum intent in mcmeemo posting.In post 393, Desperado wrote:
When a player is wagoned he has four options:In post 383, ɀefiend wrote:My thoughts concern the second part Re: McMenno. Note that Narna's request was for Desperado to point out things about McMenno's posts that had scum motivation. However, two out of the three reasons Desperado gives imply that a lack of specific posting from McMenno is scummy. (The PR thing is up in the air, since we are talking about "McMeme-o" after all. I'm not going to digress to argue the strength of this reason.) McMenno didn't have a meaningful response to his wagon, but neither did Davsto, and Davsto's was bigger. The last reason is misapplied to the actual situation, so I cannot discern whether it is bogus scum reasoning or an honest mistake. However, I can explain the misapplication. Drealmerz wasn't responding to the McMenno wagon per se, he was responding to Lane questioning him about his own concern for the wagon.
1) Ignore it and do nothing else
2) Ignore it and continue scumhunting
3) Address it and do nothing else
4) Address it and continue scumhunting
1) and 3) lean scum, 2) and 4) lean town. McMenno and Davsto clearly reacted differently to their wagons so I'm curious what leads you to suggest that I'm "misapplying" anything here.
As for the last bit, Drealmerz questioned multiple McMenno votes--that is a response to the McMenno wagon, by definition. He carried a conversation on with lane regarding it, but if another player goes out of his way to question multiple votes on my town slot in RVS, I would want to know why and I would expect other townies to feel similarly.
Up to now Kain and Dreal are the only people truly engaging the questionnaire discussion and I have shared my Dreal read so I'm not really sure where you're going with this.In post 383, ɀefiend wrote:The last sentence pings me because (1) it reads as fence-sitting about the discussion as a whole, whereas most (active) players have taken a hard stance on it, and (2) KainTepes and drealmerz had just gone through a lengthy back-and-forth about the discussion at hand, but Desperado doesn't elaborate about what, if any "alignment indicators" he picked up on from their exchange -- this begs the questions
-If the KainTepes/drealmerz exchange didn't provide any alignment indicators (side note: I think it did), what type of indicators should we actually be searching for with regards to the questionnaire-reveal discussion? &
-If the exchange did provide alignment indicators, why didn't Desperado share these at the time? Why bring up the fact that the discussion can provide alignment indicators if you aren't going to talk about them?In post 394, Desperado wrote:
"Snarky steps back up to the plate down 0-2 in the count, and the pitch..."In post 390, SnarkySnowman wrote:If you're not voting davsto, you're wrong.
Lane is a good choice otherwise though.-
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Desperado Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 12582
- Joined: February 18, 2013
- Location: Raleigh, NC
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Desperado Survivor
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- Survivor
- Posts: 12582
- Joined: February 18, 2013
- Location: Raleigh, NC
Not following your meta read that amounts to "he gets lynched a lot d1" doesn't mean I'm evading. I legitimately don't care.In post 506, drealmerz7 wrote:you are evading
why is it scummy here and not at other times?
what makes it scummy here
how can I learn to differentiate between the two? tell me what you see is what I'm asking
quit evading
It's not a matter of learning to differentiate, it's a matter of lynching what's scummy. And being active while not adding anything substantive, especially when you should be a part of the discussion but you aren't,is scummy.-
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Desperado Survivor
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- Posts: 12582
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- Location: Raleigh, NC
Everything that occurred between he and Kain was town. I said this at the time.In post 503, Aristophanes wrote:
I don't see the town motivation from Dreal. Lane I agree with, and Dav I'm still sorting but want to play with longer, so not voting there.In post 502, Desperado wrote:Me consistently townreading the three leading wagons and then declaring all three of the leading wagons being on town (with the implication being that we should go another direction) isn't elaborating on it?
Tell me fhy you townread them.
I'm really not being cagey about any of this so I don't understand why people keep making me repeat myself.-
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Desperado Survivor
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- Location: Raleigh, NC
@ Dreal, relax man. I'm not evading anything.
McMenno is active lurking and is not even bothering to attempt to solve the game.
^Scumtells. I think he's scum. I want to lynch him for playing this game in a scummy way, because that's what you fucking do in Mafia. You lynch people who do scummy things.
Him lurking in a previous game and flipping townis irrelevant.-
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Desperado Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 12582
- Joined: February 18, 2013
- Location: Raleigh, NC
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Desperado Survivor
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- Survivor
- Posts: 12582
- Joined: February 18, 2013
- Location: Raleigh, NC
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Desperado Survivor
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- Survivor
- Posts: 12582
- Joined: February 18, 2013
- Location: Raleigh, NC
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Desperado Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 12582
- Joined: February 18, 2013
- Location: Raleigh, NC
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Desperado Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 12582
- Joined: February 18, 2013
- Location: Raleigh, NC
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Desperado Survivor
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Desperado Survivor
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- Posts: 12582
- Joined: February 18, 2013
- Location: Raleigh, NC
Is that what I'm doing tho?In post 549, Azral wrote:No, I mean you're projecting your own interpretation onto Desp's posts to try to make sense of his read. But without Desp actually saying the words, that's all it is and quite likely to be wrong. Is he the type to recommend we just policy lynch all the active lurkers? I kind of doubt it.
Cuz...I'm pretty sure it isn't.-
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Desperado Survivor
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- Posts: 12582
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- Location: Raleigh, NC
I'm pushing McMenno and not Frank or Snarky because McMenno is lurking AND he's doing it in a scummy way AND he isn't trying to solve the game AND all of the key players thus far look town to me so my working theory is that scum saw the dreal vs kain > dreal vs lane > dreal vs davsto (is anyone seeing a pattern here???? dreal isn't scum) battles and said "hahahaha NOP"-
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Desperado Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 12582
- Joined: February 18, 2013
- Location: Raleigh, NC
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Desperado Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 12582
- Joined: February 18, 2013
- Location: Raleigh, NC
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Desperado Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 12582
- Joined: February 18, 2013
- Location: Raleigh, NC
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Desperado Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 12582
- Joined: February 18, 2013
- Location: Raleigh, NC
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Desperado Survivor
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Desperado Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 12582
- Joined: February 18, 2013
- Location: Raleigh, NC
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Desperado Survivor
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- Posts: 12582
- Joined: February 18, 2013
- Location: Raleigh, NC
OK, 489 is two days old and absolutely nothing has changed. We have five days.
@ Azral, KainTepes, zefriend, dreal, Gamma:
Why aren't you voting one of dreal/lane/davsto? Your wagon/non vote is doing nothing but you also aren't doing anything to diffuse the leading wagons.
@ Davsto, lane
Seriously, stop voting dreal. Look elsewhere.
@ Narna
Your lane vote blows and you've offered two alternatives "if lane doesn't have any takers." Well, we're here.-
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Desperado Survivor
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- Survivor
- Posts: 12582
- Joined: February 18, 2013
- Location: Raleigh, NC
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Desperado Survivor
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- Posts: 12582
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- Location: Raleigh, NC
No, I'm asking the 5 people who aren't voting one of the leading wagons why they aren't voting the leading wagons.In post 591, lane0168 wrote:... Did you just suggest dreal as a viable wagon? And then ask why we're voting there? Cause that's weird.-
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Desperado Survivor
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- Location: Raleigh, NC
I could vote Azral, but I don't feel compelled to switch my vote right now, especially if the leading wagons disperse as I anticipate they will, which will obviously change the voting landscape.In post 594, Davsto wrote:So you don't think any of dreal, lane, I, zefiend, Azral or Aristophanes are scum? And you're too stubborn to push a lynch which at least has a good chance of flipping scum and instead will push a lynch that you're certain is scum but is unlikely to flip?-
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Desperado Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 12582
- Joined: February 18, 2013
- Location: Raleigh, NC
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Desperado Survivor
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- Survivor
- Posts: 12582
- Joined: February 18, 2013
- Location: Raleigh, NC
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Desperado Survivor
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- Survivor
- Posts: 12582
- Joined: February 18, 2013
- Location: Raleigh, NC
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Desperado Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 12582
- Joined: February 18, 2013
- Location: Raleigh, NC
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Desperado Survivor
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- Survivor
- Posts: 12582
- Joined: February 18, 2013
- Location: Raleigh, NC