NY 151: Playground Mafia (Game Over-Mafia Win!)

DeasVail · Post Post #212 (isolation #0) » Thu Apr 12, 2012 9:16 am

/confirm

but no time now. I'll be free in 12 hours.

DeasVail · Post Post #297 (isolation #1) » Thu Apr 12, 2012 11:15 pm

I have time to read now

Also, I'm sorgster.

I've been deliberating over this, but I've decided to be open with my townreads considering the size of this game. If anyone thinks this is a bad idea, persuade me.

2:

Nihilistic perhaps too eager to get involved in conversation.
Nero and Maxous are just posting for the sake of posting.
Hez is probably town for 38

drmyshotgun:

Why did you mention the questions if you didn't think it was a good idea?

3:

Nihilistic:

Why did you take an accusation of buddying as an accusation of you being scum with LLD? Also, how were you attacking shotty?

I think Nero is scum. I'll explain after if I still feel it.

4:

Nihilistic:

Why didn't you just look at his games? [Note: I've seen Rack's question, so don't worry.]

Rack is probable town. Nihilistic is looking more town.

Kublai:

Why did you feel the need to say you were taking Candy off your scumlist? Why was he there in the first place?

5:

I really don't see how Rack is scummy. The first post with questions is exactly what I expect from a town hydra. I'll be interested to see who jumps on them.

6:

Nihilistic:

How is Rack not an easy mislynch?

Benmage:

Point of 141?

7:

Benmage might be scum. I'll get back to you on that.

9:

Pretty strong townread on Psyche. May explain later.
I don't like Pine either. I promise I'll explain this stuff afterwards.

10:

Oh ok. That's interesting.

Rack:

Why do you need your partner to get you out of the shitstorm?
Skipping MAstin's posts for until I make my own reads post.

Ohhhh. Shotgun is so, so, sooooo town. This is not sarcasm. (And that's not sarcasm either)

11:

Eh, I'll read firestarter's post properly later.

Ok, just pretend that I've finished reading. I'll get to reads, important thoughts and stuff soonish.

DeasVail · Post Post #298 (isolation #2) » Fri Apr 13, 2012 2:04 am

Town

Mini-Librarian

NihilisticNinja

I can understand how people could have a scumread on him, but for me his play on the whole is so much like town and so little like scum. Note: I don't really like providing reasoning for my townreads, but if requested, I'm happy to oblige.

HezLucky

I can only really see his posts as coming from town.

drmyshotgun

Because of vote on rack and subsequent posting.

Mastin2

Weak Town

Psyche

Not as town as I originally thought, but I think he can be put here. His posting generally feels quite natural. His vote on rack is a towntell because it is bound to attract attention because of the wagon and lack of reasoning provided with the vote. The thoughts on Shotty are more likely from town. Scum would only likely post this if planning to lynch him, and this feels more like town having a thought for the future and wanting to note it down. His unvote of Rack makes more sense from town than scum.

Kublai Khan

Eh. Mastin's reasoning doesn't do much for me. The "was Jesus Jewish?" and *talking about the game starting* points are ok, but the others are really pushing it and overall KK feels like town.

Scooby

Especially if Pine is scum, but waiting for more posting.

Rack

I don't have any problem with the questions. And their posts aren't really different from what I'd expect from a town hydra. The whole *waiting for head B to fix things* thing requires explanation though.

Drmyshottyizsik

Candy Corn Vampire

LLD

Vijay

Null

JasonT1981

Macros

Benmage

Torn on him. Hopefully I'll make a decision later.

RedFF

I can't read him. Someone help me.

Junpei

Praetyre

Weak Scum

Firestarter

This read really depends on future posting. I don't really get the significance of IIoA accusations. My main problem is the rack read and vote, as he does not acknowledge agreement with everyone else and presents his reasoning as his own.

Pine

First off, I don't really find much that's town about him. I don't like his focus on the distancing thing, but I'm not sure that this is alignment-related. I do think that his reaction to pressure on Scooby is scummy, in particular 217, which is more of a justification than I would expect. I think saying that people were ready to lynch scooby and going on about how he hates people who haven't posted getting attacked are exaggerations used to make himself look more reasonable. 222 is off. The answer seems a lot like scum trying to have an appropriate response to the question, while I don't see how town wouldn't say something along the lines of "yeah sure, why not?" Additionally, the vote on Gunny is bad.

Nero Cain

Very weak read. I no longer agree with some of the things I found scummy about him before, but the play around shotgun is bad and I don't find him that town.

Maxous

Can't really explain though. MAybe another time.

Questions:

Psyche: What's your opinion on whether rack should or should not be lynched today?
Mastin2: Why does your big post about Kublai convey the sense that you don't believe you'll be listened to?
drmyshotgun: Why did you vote for rack?

DeasVail · Post Post #328 (isolation #3) » Fri Apr 13, 2012 11:02 am

Mastin2:

Are you just asking for the sake of asking, or do you actually want the reasoning? Also, why do you find the reasoning for my other townreads satisfying?

Mini-lib:

Why does drmy need to be vigged?

Hez has moved to weak town, mostly because of his jump on benmage.

Jason:

What reason is there for scum to avoid/refuse to answer questions?

DeasVail · Post Post #336 (isolation #4) » Fri Apr 13, 2012 12:04 pm

Not my reaction at all, but ok.

DeasVail · Post Post #342 (isolation #5) » Fri Apr 13, 2012 1:54 pm

Mini-lib-

Combination of appearing genuine, short posts with limited explanation of his opinions, little things like the compilation of townreads and the read on firestarter and not being scummy.

Mastin2-

I can't see you as scum doing what you're doing with KK unless it's as an excuse to look town while tunnelling. Your posting that is unrelated to KK makes this unlikely.

Shotty-

His posting seems good. I particularly like his recent thoughts on rack and psyche.

Candy-

This read is really weak. Not much more than a weak feeling really.

LLD-

Seems quite genuine, and I find the little inconsistencies that have been pointed out in her posts to be towntells.

vijay-

Looks like natural town posting overall. Main thing is his reasonless vote for drmy and reaction to being called out for it.

Null reads basically mean I can't work out whether their posting to date has been indicative of town or scum.

PEdit: Move macros to weak town. I'll decide what I think of Benmage later.

DeasVail · Post Post #346 (isolation #6) » Fri Apr 13, 2012 2:36 pm

Actually shotgun might be scum.

DeasVail · Post Post #349 (isolation #7) » Fri Apr 13, 2012 2:40 pm

Hmm, i'll leave it for now, but there may be things I want to discuss later.

DeasVail · Post Post #366 (isolation #8) » Fri Apr 13, 2012 5:43 pm

KK answer my question please.

And I disagree about shotgun. His play has been interesting.

DeasVail · Post Post #368 (isolation #9) » Fri Apr 13, 2012 5:55 pm

Interesting as in:

Different in a not necessarily bad way.

And yes we do.

DeasVail · Post Post #370 (isolation #10) » Fri Apr 13, 2012 6:14 pm

You only answered one of the questions.

DeasVail · Post Post #373 (isolation #11) » Fri Apr 13, 2012 6:40 pm

In post 371, Kublai Khan wrote:
In post 370, DeasVail wrote:You only answered one of the questions.

No real reason, just being open with my reads. Why were those questions so important to you?

I thought your comment about Candy moving off your scumlist was less likely an attempt to help the town and more likely an attempt to look like you were town and scumhunting.

Mastin2:

I can't see it. Show me?

DeasVail · Post Post #375 (isolation #12) » Fri Apr 13, 2012 7:08 pm

I don't remember Khan being in 142. Was it a different game?

Hmm, I understand and may join you in voting him, but I was thinking of voting Pine and I still have to sort out my Benmage read.

DeasVail · Post Post #384 (isolation #13) » Sat Apr 14, 2012 1:49 am

I must say that Rack is no longer a townread, but I am looking forward to more of his posting though.

LLD:

I'm quite tempted to jump on KK as well. Why do you think he's town?

KK:

Do you consider OMGUS scummy?

Vote: Pine

This is the only vote I feel comfortable with right now.

DeasVail · Post Post #484 (isolation #14) » Sat Apr 14, 2012 2:01 pm

Mastin:

I'm not sure why exactly, but this is my first game that has started post-crash and I'm trying to improve my play.

Firestarter:

From what I remember, you basically said that Rack's post was bad, which was what everyone else said, but you didn't acknowledge what anyone else had said.

DeasVail · Post Post #490 (isolation #15) » Sat Apr 14, 2012 6:54 pm

It's a good thing I have a full brain then

DeasVail · Post Post #494 (isolation #16) » Sat Apr 14, 2012 8:19 pm

Could you explain your Nero and Khan townreads?

DeasVail · Post Post #498 (isolation #17) » Sat Apr 14, 2012 10:26 pm

In post 496, drmyshotgun wrote:Explain my Town reads?

Are you saying here that you want people to explain their townreads on you or something else?

DeasVail · Post Post #519 (isolation #18) » Sun Apr 15, 2012 2:29 pm

In post 518, Antihero wrote:Better

DeasVail · Post Post #520 (isolation #19) » Sun Apr 15, 2012 2:57 pm

My relevant thoughts at this stage:

I need more posts from rack and firestarter.

Pine is scummy.

DeasVail · Post Post #523 (isolation #20) » Sun Apr 15, 2012 4:05 pm

In post 521, Junpei wrote:
In post 520, DeasVail wrote:I need more posts from rack and firestarter.

But not from me? Why those 2?

I haven't attempted to read you yet.

DeasVail · Post Post #531 (isolation #21) » Sun Apr 15, 2012 8:53 pm

Out of all the things you could say, why so something useless that you know to be hypocritical instead of soemthing else?

DeasVail · Post Post #563 (isolation #22) » Mon Apr 16, 2012 11:48 am

Scumreads are now:

Firestarter

Jason-

Very weak, but posting is not that impressive and thinking I'm scum for coasting (which is not any different from how he's seen me as town and it's a very large game too) is off.

Macros-

Nothing town about his play. Scumread is more gut than anything else.

Pine-

I still like my vote on him.

I still think it's too early to tell for rack. Maxous's recent posting has been good, so I don't have a scumread on him anymore. I'm also going to trust antihero on Nero Cain.

Rack:

Could you out your heads? I'm thinking it may help me get a better understanding of how you feel in relation to your partner. Could you also answer my question in the post after your previous one?

Maxous:

That was directed at Rack in case that was unclear.

Macros:

Would you like me to vote benmage?

Jason:

How could those words be said of me too?

DeasVail · Post Post #568 (isolation #23) » Mon Apr 16, 2012 12:23 pm

In post 567, Antihero wrote:rack isn't acting like a townie being wagoned.

I know, but he's not really acting like scum either.

/need more posts

DeasVail · Post Post #572 (isolation #24) » Mon Apr 16, 2012 12:52 pm

Do you want me to agree with your assessment?

DeasVail · Post Post #575 (isolation #25) » Mon Apr 16, 2012 1:01 pm

In post 573, Benmage wrote:Macros, do you agree or disagree that scum are more likely to remain in the backdrop than steer the town on D1.

I actually disagree.

DeasVail · Post Post #577 (isolation #26) » Mon Apr 16, 2012 1:04 pm

Unvote

Vote: Macros

There you go.

DeasVail · Post Post #580 (isolation #27) » Mon Apr 16, 2012 1:10 pm

I would likely do it as scum, but no. Steering the town/not remaining in the backdrop are different from going out of one's way to gain spotlight attention.

DeasVail · Post Post #582 (isolation #28) » Mon Apr 16, 2012 1:19 pm

Yes, I agree, but people should take a look at Macros' answers to my questions- Scum trying to give reasonable, logical answers, which are actually not what town would think.

DeasVail · Post Post #592 (isolation #29) » Mon Apr 16, 2012 7:05 pm

8 is actually possible...

DeasVail · Post Post #615 (isolation #30) » Tue Apr 17, 2012 11:16 am

GreyIce:

How likely do you think it is that Shotty will be lynched today?

Pine:

Who are the scum?

DeasVail · Post Post #617 (isolation #31) » Tue Apr 17, 2012 11:28 am

Well you'll have to try a lot harder if you want him lynched.

DeasVail · Post Post #628 (isolation #32) » Tue Apr 17, 2012 11:54 am

In post 623, Benmage wrote:
In post 621, GreyICE wrote:
I'd prefer to see his reaction to the vote anyway.

And reaction ruined.

But not really...

DeasVail · Post Post #630 (isolation #33) » Tue Apr 17, 2012 12:04 pm

No, I think the reaction is all the more interesting when scum know their reaction will be scrutinised.

DeasVail · Post Post #632 (isolation #34) » Tue Apr 17, 2012 12:21 pm

In post 631, Nero Cain wrote:What did Sotty do to make you drop your weak town read for a scum read, DV?

My read hasn't changed.

DeasVail · Post Post #634 (isolation #35) » Tue Apr 17, 2012 12:29 pm

In post 633, Nero Cain wrote:
In post 630, DeasVail wrote:No, I think the reaction is all the more interesting when scum know their reaction will be scrutinised.

So this is just a MD type statement and not about shotty. ok

Yes, but it's not like I'm sure that shotty is not scum.

DeasVail · Post Post #637 (isolation #36) » Tue Apr 17, 2012 1:01 pm

In post 635, redFF wrote:I can get with a shotty wagon.

SCUM!!!!!!!!!

Oh wait...

DeasVail · Post Post #642 (isolation #37) » Tue Apr 17, 2012 3:56 pm

What does Prae lurking have to do with anything?

DeasVail · Post Post #649 (isolation #38) » Tue Apr 17, 2012 4:25 pm

Grey, you do think Nero is town, right?

DeasVail · Post Post #651 (isolation #39) » Tue Apr 17, 2012 4:27 pm

Obviously I'm the only decent scumhunter here, so there's no point in arguing

DeasVail · Post Post #655 (isolation #40) » Tue Apr 17, 2012 4:30 pm

In post 652, Antihero wrote:
In post 649, DeasVail wrote:Grey, you do think Nero is town, right?

lolwat?

?

In post 653, GreyICE wrote:
In post 649, DeasVail wrote:Grey, you do think Nero is town, right?

Yeah, Shotty isn't gonna do a back and forth with his scumbuddies like that.

So, pretending to dayvig him is rather silly, yes?

DeasVail · Post Post #656 (isolation #41) » Tue Apr 17, 2012 4:31 pm

In post 654, Nero Cain wrote:obviously.

ALL BOW BEFORE THE GREAT DEASVAIL!!!!

Yes, this must happen now.

Also

VOTE: peregrineV

I really think he's the scum here.

DeasVail · Post Post #658 (isolation #42) » Tue Apr 17, 2012 4:44 pm

What makes you say that?

DeasVail · Post Post #660 (isolation #43) » Tue Apr 17, 2012 4:59 pm

I've never understood why people express desire to vig players they read as town for saying something they find stupid.

DeasVail · Post Post #664 (isolation #44) » Tue Apr 17, 2012 5:09 pm

I don't think he did Antihero. Why do you care so much?

DeasVail · Post Post #668 (isolation #45) » Tue Apr 17, 2012 5:18 pm

Well that was my question.

DeasVail · Post Post #674 (isolation #46) » Tue Apr 17, 2012 10:35 pm

Thanks for your post Hez.

Now I've just realised something. In the last 5 games I've played with RedFF, he's been scum and I've always read him as town, so I'm just going to sheep whoever sounds the most convincing when it comes to him.

As far as your scumreads go, I have Nihilistic as strong town, Psyche and Benmage as weak town, Junpei as null, and redff as (see above). I'll probably take closer looks at them, but I don't think I'll be supportive of wagons on them at this stage.

DeasVail · Post Post #693 (isolation #47) » Wed Apr 18, 2012 11:36 am

In post 689, PeregrineV wrote:I gave myself unlynchableness just in case something like this happened.

Bastard modding right there

Hez:

Are you familiar with Benmage's meta?

DeasVail · Post Post #694 (isolation #48) » Wed Apr 18, 2012 11:37 am

In post 692, FakeGod wrote:man..... 30 pages?

I thought you would have known this when you decided to replace in, which leaves this being a fabricated reaction as the only option I can see.

DeasVail · Post Post #699 (isolation #49) » Wed Apr 18, 2012 11:52 am

In post 698, Junpei wrote:
In post 696, redFF wrote:^^ good post dv

This post does not add validity to DV's arguments, thus I must assume it is blatant buddying.

It is. Your problem?

DeasVail · Post Post #702 (isolation #50) » Wed Apr 18, 2012 11:57 am

In post 700, Junpei wrote:I'm also pointing out the flaw in your logic; but I don't know if you noticed.

I don't really care to be honest.

DeasVail · Post Post #731 (isolation #51) » Wed Apr 18, 2012 11:46 pm

Good luck Hez!

[insert scumhunting here]

DeasVail · Post Post #735 (isolation #52) » Thu Apr 19, 2012 2:40 am

I think Junpei is town, but I'm not liking the theories that have been around about scum going for easy targets and not harder ones. Honestly, as scum, I'd feel uncomfortable going for easy targets. Maybe it's just me though...

DeasVail · Post Post #750 (isolation #53) » Thu Apr 19, 2012 10:57 am

Junpei:

Why didn't you realise that it is not the logic of my attack that's important, but the response I get to it?

DeasVail · Post Post #754 (isolation #54) » Thu Apr 19, 2012 1:36 pm

Maxous:

When town think someone is scum they want people to agree with them. Macros, on the other hand, seemed to be trying to avoid saying yes to my questions, instead giving answers that would objectively be considered more logical and reasonable, instead of what I'd expect him to think as town. This is what I find scummy.

DeasVail · Post Post #770 (isolation #55) » Thu Apr 19, 2012 9:21 pm

Tempted to vote rack.

DeasVail · Post Post #772 (isolation #56) » Thu Apr 19, 2012 9:54 pm

But I'm curious to see what Head B will be like (if he turns up)

DeasVail · Post Post #794 (isolation #57) » Fri Apr 20, 2012 1:53 pm

In post 793, GreyICE wrote:Make a real vote FG

i.e. Macros/pine/rack/firestarter

DeasVail · Post Post #814 (isolation #58) » Fri Apr 20, 2012 9:57 pm

Hmm Hez. I don't really know if you can use coasting against someone here, as I don't really have that much motivation to post considering I probably will want a rack lynch, and things are quite boring at the moment, so I'm coasting.

(and I'm town)

DeasVail · Post Post #823 (isolation #59) » Sat Apr 21, 2012 12:14 pm

Rack should claim now

DeasVail · Post Post #853 (isolation #60) » Sun Apr 22, 2012 9:56 pm

Big post?

DeasVail · Post Post #858 (isolation #61) » Mon Apr 23, 2012 12:08 am

Hez, that's the most town thing anyone's done all game.

DeasVail · Post Post #884 (isolation #62) » Mon Apr 23, 2012 10:41 am

Rack:

If you vote for me, I'll believe that you're NS.

DeasVail · Post Post #892 (isolation #63) » Mon Apr 23, 2012 12:01 pm

/doesn't approve

DeasVail · Post Post #894 (isolation #64) » Mon Apr 23, 2012 12:03 pm

DeasVail · Post Post #902 (isolation #65) » Mon Apr 23, 2012 12:40 pm

This is why I hate this. The wait is so annoying.

DeasVail · Post Post #933 (isolation #66) » Mon Apr 23, 2012 2:34 pm

Er, I see no point in pulling this any longer.

It's not twilight, and rack gets scumpoints for not realising it.

Rack:

Please vote for me now.

DeasVail · Post Post #942 (isolation #67) » Mon Apr 23, 2012 2:44 pm

I missed Junpei's vote.

/Fail

DeasVail · Post Post #945 (isolation #68) » Mon Apr 23, 2012 2:45 pm

In post 943, mastin2 wrote:The weakest read is DV.

Because I'm town obv

DeasVail · Post Post #959 (isolation #69) » Mon Apr 23, 2012 3:15 pm

In post 957, GreyICE wrote:
Replace out unless RedFF is force replaced

And fucking blacklisted.

I think it's unfair to put the mod in this kind of position.

DeasVail · Post Post #961 (isolation #70) » Mon Apr 23, 2012 3:21 pm

fair enough, but please do reconsider if red is not force-replaced.

DeasVail · Post Post #1049 (isolation #71) » Fri Apr 27, 2012 1:08 pm

Nero:

Why did you comment on GI's replace out now? Why did you feel the need to mention me as possible scum?

Also, I completely disagree that there was any kind of scumslip.

VOTE: Pine

DeasVail · Post Post #1055 (isolation #72) » Fri Apr 27, 2012 2:10 pm

Scooby:

I'm pretty sure that part was lost in the crash. It was NY 142, but I don't think it'll help.

Nero:

I'm pretty sure he's being replaced (from the replacement thread anyway).

Why would it matter that I was possible scum if agreeing with me on an unrelated-to-the-game issue?

Prae had everything to do with GI. Prae's lack of posting and then replacing out shouldn't have had an impact your read on the slot whatsoever.

What makes you think I'm concerned about him? My question demonstrates concern about you.

DeasVail · Post Post #1056 (isolation #73) » Fri Apr 27, 2012 2:12 pm

Also, about the Pine thing, I do remember Sky claiming VT and then someone saying he was town for the way he acted. I do think it quite likely that it was Pine, and am quite willing to trust Maxous that it was the case. This is not the only thing that makes Pine scummy in my mind though.

DeasVail · Post Post #1062 (isolation #74) » Fri Apr 27, 2012 3:06 pm

In post 1061, Nero Cain wrote:I don't understand why you or Hez or Mini feel like I should have dropped my LLD scum read overnight.

I don't think that's what they're saying at all.

DeasVail · Post Post #1066 (isolation #75) » Fri Apr 27, 2012 3:44 pm

Nero:

Answer my questions please.

DeasVail · Post Post #1071 (isolation #76) » Fri Apr 27, 2012 5:28 pm

In post 1069, Pine wrote:No, that was definitely me. Maxous is taking my comment completely out of context, however. I'm not calling Scooby scum for the wagoned-to-VT thing, that was entirely irrelevant. I'm calling Scooby scum because he said he was clarifying something about his role with the Mod. WHAT DOES A VT NEED TO CLARIFY?

Also, I'm pretty sure Gunny is scum too. Universal Backup DOES NOT WORK THAT WAY. Mason is not a Power Role, you don't inherit it. Fakeclaim is fake.

Vote: Scooby

The more egregious of the pair.

We're talking about rack. And the clarify thing is a really bad reason to think someone scum. Also, mason is a power role.

DeasVail · Sat Apr 28, 2012 12:23 pm

The Junpei votes are not good. I may try to post my new reads.

DeasVail · Sat Apr 28, 2012 12:24 pm

Actually should I differentiate strong town and weak town, or not? I'm worried about my strong townreads dying.

DeasVail · Post Post #1121 (isolation #79) » Sat Apr 28, 2012 1:21 pm

Strong Town

Psyche-

This is mostly because of his vote on rack.

Code_X-

Ninja was a strong townread and code looks pretty town too.

HezLucky-

I don't like his recent attacks very much, but I still see him as very likely town.

Drmyshotgun-

The mason QT post doesn't seem very likely to be faked to me.

Maxous-

His posting just really feels like it comes from town. Again, I'll only explain further if he's likely to be lynched.

Weak Town

Kublai Khan-

I can't really find anything very scummy about him, but I wouldn't feel comfortable calling him a strong townread, so here he goes.

Scooby-

My idea of him as a player gives me the impression of town. I think he tries harder as scum.

Mini-Lib-

I don't really find anything scummy about him and he does seem fairly townish overall, but still not strong town.

Benmage-

He seems fairly townish I guess.

Nero Cain-

Pretty much just sheeping Antihero here. I don't really think he's scummy either.

LLD-

I was hoping to read her as stronger town, but I don't feel I can.

Junpei-

I don't think him saying that drmy shouldn't be considered confirmed town is scummy. He seems like town to me.

GreyIce-

The circumstances in which he replaced out seem a lot like town to me. I would like to see the replacement, but if the replacement appears town this could very well be a strong townread.

Null-Weak Scum

Fake God-

Jason didn't make much of an impression on me. Fake God is slightly scummy, but I don't have anything strong on him.

Firestarter-

I wasn't sure whether to put him here or weak town, because I don't really know if I think he's scum. I didn't like his rack vote, but I agreed with him thinking Psyche or others were bussing. I still could easily see him as scum though, based on what he's posted so far.

Drmyshottyizsik-

Moving him here because any town read on him is a fair bit weaker than my other weak townreads.

RedFF-

I still don't know.

Mastin2-

I haven't found him very town since my last reads post. Also, his asking about my reads without reasoning from my last reads list was scummy I think because a lot of my reads with text next to them were very vague. His play also just seems less... natural, I suppose.

Scum

Macros-

First, there's nothing about him that makes me think town.
542: He's much more focused on justifying why he's staying on Benmage than convincing others to vote Benmage too. Also, his talk about the rack wagon seems scummy to me.
As I've said before, Macros' answers to my questions in 569 and 576 are the kind of logical, reasonable answers that scum would think to give, but they aren't actually how I think town would think or react.

Pine-

I like how I explained my scumread on him back in my first reads post: "First off, I don't really find much that's town about him. I don't like his focus on the distancing thing, but I'm not sure that this is alignment-related. I do think that his reaction to pressure on Scooby is scummy, in particular 217, which is more of a justification than I would expect. I think saying that people were ready to lynch scooby and going on about how he hates people who haven't posted getting attacked are exaggerations used to make himself look more reasonable. 222 is off. The answer seems a lot like scum trying to have an appropriate response to the question, while I don't see how town wouldn't say something along the lines of "yeah sure, why not?" Additionally, the vote on Gunny is bad."

Additionally, calling drmyshotgun "definitely newbtown" here seems like overcompensation for voting him earlier. I thought it quite possible that shotgun was going for the "too controversial/newb/VI to be scum" angle as scum, so I don't see how someone could go from thinking him likely scum to definitely town. And Pine accusing rack of wanting mod clarification because he wants to fakeclaim is a really bad one.

I'm worried that Pine as scum wouldn't make such bad attacks on rack and shotgun because it would be bound to make him look bad.

Obviously rack wouldn't tell us he was communicating with the mod if it was regarding a fakeclaim. I am questioning how relevant Maxous' point is. I'm starting to think it's not, but I still think Pine is scum.

DeasVail · Post Post #1173 (isolation #80) » Sat Apr 28, 2012 7:17 pm

Er... Psyche's vote on rack only really made sense as a bus, not as scum voting town.

Why didn't people have a problem with my original reasoning presented in 298.

DeasVail · Post Post #1175 (isolation #81) » Sat Apr 28, 2012 8:07 pm

In post 1174, Psyche wrote:Not to mention as town voting town.

So you're saying that doesn't make sense?

DeasVail · Post Post #1177 (isolation #82) » Sat Apr 28, 2012 8:18 pm

Hmmm....

DeasVail · Sat Apr 28, 2012 10:04 pm

Code:

I don't really feel that I've been ganged up on here. I've had it much worse in other games.

To link to a post:

[ post=? ]Text[ /post ]

Without the spaces, where ? = post number

DeasVail · Sat Apr 28, 2012 10:11 pm

In post 1184, Nero Cain wrote:probably b/c I didn't "see" [as in read it but didn't compute at the time) it. I still don't really get the logic here. Is it like a "too scummy to be scum" type thing?

Yes, but the thing is, how Psyche did it was not actually that scummy.

DeasVail · Sat Apr 28, 2012 10:20 pm

In post 1186, Nero Cain wrote:I'm going to have to disagree. All he did was bandwagon. H didn't even tell us he felt Rack was scummy till later.

Exactly!

As if scum are just going to jump on a serious bandwagon without justifying it. That's just asking for attention.

DeasVail · Mon Apr 30, 2012 11:41 am

Eh, the last few pages are pretty much all town squabbling with town and it's annoying.

Pine:

What led you to change your mind?

Everyone:

Does Mastin do this kind of thing as scum?

DeasVail · Mon Apr 30, 2012 11:46 am

Unvote: Pine

Vote: Mastin

Too scummy to be scum.

DeasVail · Mon Apr 30, 2012 11:58 am

The "pretty much" means mastin is the exception.

DeasVail · Mon Apr 30, 2012 12:06 pm

In post 1282, Nero Cain wrote:So you no longer think Pine is scum?

No. I'm just bored.

DeasVail · Mon Apr 30, 2012 12:19 pm

In post 1285, Psyche wrote:Mastin IS the page. Who says "pretty much" excepting a glaring exception?
"Pretty much" means "more or less", "basically", etc.

Ok.

Does it matter?

DeasVail · Post Post #1312 (isolation #91) » Mon Apr 30, 2012 2:25 pm

Mastin:

Has your wagon influenced your recent posting?

DeasVail · Post Post #1321 (isolation #92) » Mon Apr 30, 2012 2:55 pm

In post 1314, mastin2 wrote:
DV wrote:Mastin: Has your wagon influenced your recent posting?
Heck no. I came home with the thought in mind that I was going to explain the interactions between Junpei, Khan, and Macros. Heck, I had it in mind as I was leaving my house, in fact, and have been thinking about it throughout the day. I knew what I was going to be posting the minute I got home, and got to work on it as soon as I could. (I haven't even had supper, yet, because I came straight to this game.)

Oh, I assumed it would have if you were town.

DeasVail · Post Post #1323 (isolation #93) » Mon Apr 30, 2012 3:01 pm

Junpei:

If you think mastin is scum, why are you also expressing dislike for him based on his posting here?

DeasVail · Post Post #1330 (isolation #94) » Mon Apr 30, 2012 3:17 pm

In post 1326, Junpei wrote:
In post 1325, drmyshotgun wrote:If he is scum, he is scum. But you seem genuinely annoyed at his presence.

Oh. The question is asking if my emotions and prejudices are blinding me.

No, don't worry, I have a grind with Mastin and express this, however when I actually analyze things I have the presence of mind to turn off the blinders if necessary.

What I meant was this:

You make comments about Mastin thinking he's intelligent and having a big ego. Do you feel his scumplay here is a reflection of his personality? Because I would have thought not.

DeasVail · Tue May 01, 2012 10:29 am

Psyche:

What was scummy about the inconsistency?

DeasVail · Post Post #1455 (isolation #96) » Thu May 03, 2012 7:42 pm

StrangerCoug:

Why didn't you see who died before reading through?

DeasVail · Post Post #1460 (isolation #97) » Thu May 03, 2012 9:29 pm

I'd usually say Pine being fed up is a towntell, but I've seen scum act that way before, so am avoiding thinking it town. I think he's an alright wagon. RedFF not so much, but don't care about my opinion on him. I really don't mind the idea of Mastin as scum because of his desire to change his playstyle, while still (seemingly) sticking to the same way of playing.

His answer to my question whether the wagon influenced his posting should be a obvious yes, so his "no" is scummy and only adds to the likelihood in my opinion that he was making more of an effort to look town after being put under pressure. Also, mastin-town (especially if he's considering a playstyle-change) would be more focused on making his posting more concise and more effective in persuading others. The sheer amount instead suggests scum under pressure wanting to post as much content as possible (which I myself am quite eager to do as scum) without actually caring about who listens to it.

DeasVail · Sat May 05, 2012 11:12 am

I'm not a fan of a junpei lynch.

DeasVail · Sat May 05, 2012 11:23 am

I find him a bit scummy. I do think it likely that Benmage is town and did actually forget that we lynched rack (a very similar thing happened to me before), but it also crossed my mind that he could be faking it, and I think it scummy of KK to attack you for thinking it. I don't know how to explain it but his posts this page do seem a little off to me and I have been entertaining the possibility of KK and mastin being scum together (considering mastin's illogical obsession with KK early on and later drop of it), but I don't want to go too far with this because I am not sure at all about mastin being scum.

DeasVail · Sat May 05, 2012 12:03 pm

KK:

I considered the possibilities and decided that he probably wasn't faking it. Also, by "off", I mean exactly that, and mastin's suspicion of you was illogical.

DeasVail · Sun May 06, 2012 8:30 pm

Nero Cain:

What do you think of GreyIce's replace out?

DeasVail · Sun May 06, 2012 9:33 pm

KK:

I hereby accuse you of being scum. I hope you're feeling better now.

Nero Cain:

I can easily relate to GreyIce's feeling of apathy toward this game as town. I'd expect scum to be much more motivated in this game considering they're part of a team and things had obviously been going quite well for them. I also don't see scum having Red (unless scumbuddies with him) influence their decision to replace out.

DeasVail · Sun May 06, 2012 9:45 pm

In post 1599, Nero Cain wrote:So you think scum don't replace out?

No.

There are, however, reasons for which town are more likely to replace out than scum (in my opinion).

DeasVail · Sun May 06, 2012 10:03 pm

The other "replace-outs" were not revealing as the alignment of any of the slots. The fact that you would ask that means you are either scum or didn't understand my point to begin with.

DeasVail · Sun May 06, 2012 10:17 pm

They didn't replace out right after someone said a "bad word". I realise that I didn't properly express my reasoning for thinking GreyIce town. I have replaced into scum slots, so I obviously know that scum replace out too, but I don't think someone such as GreyIce would have RedFF's "word" be the turning point nor do I think he would have justified his replace out in such a way that I could easily relate to as scum.

DeasVail · Mon May 07, 2012 11:23 am

<- NEVER SAID THAT SCUM ARE MORE LIKELY TO REPLACE OUT

DeasVail · Mon May 07, 2012 11:24 am

*LESS

DeasVail · Mon May 07, 2012 1:08 pm

TML wagon is bad.

SC:

If you thought TML was implying a cop innocent on LLD, why did you bring it up?

DeasVail · Mon May 07, 2012 1:43 pm

I don't like mastin's *not posting*, but:

Unvote: Mastin2

Vote: Pine

DeasVail · Mon May 07, 2012 1:54 pm

In post 1659, Psyche wrote:DV's is the scummiest hop so far. Not that he hopped, but how he did it.
It reminds me so much of my bandwagoning on D1 mislynches. A very sparse — the minimum for the ambitious scum, which makes me think gunny is town — justification for the wagon to show that it makes you uneasy and to avoid commitment...

Eh.

What is your read of Pine and how does his alignment affect your view of me?

Also, for what it's worth, if I was scum and Pine town, I would not have jumped onto his wagon, instead commenting that his replace out and in again followed by his lack of posting made me less sure and I would instead push on either a scumbuddy or a different townie. Probably a scumbuddy actually. If I was scum with Pine, I would work out a way of distancing that wasn't so obvious.

Conclusion: I must be town.

DeasVail · Tue May 08, 2012 9:15 pm

I haven't read up, but we need a claim from Pine before lynching him, which is a problem if PV can't get a replacement before deadline.

If I was to go for anyone else, it would probably be Kdowns, but I'll need to put some thought in before deciding on anyone else to go for.

DeasVail · Wed May 09, 2012 12:37 am

Unvote: Pine

Vote: Kdowns

DeasVail · Wed May 09, 2012 1:39 pm

Maxous:

I don't feel that strongly about anybody.

Biggest scumreads probably are:

FakeGod
kdowns
Pine
Mastin2

DeasVail · Wed May 09, 2012 7:08 pm

In post 1754, OhGodMyLife wrote:There's not going to BE a shotgun lynch because he's town.

There's not going to be a DV lynch because DV's town!

DeasVail · Wed May 09, 2012 7:26 pm

/is not hesitantly calling Junpei scummy.

DeasVail · Wed May 09, 2012 7:30 pm

Not really, no.

What should I be doing?

DeasVail · Fri May 11, 2012 1:43 pm

SC:

I was pointing out that town get voted for/lynched all the time, so the fact that he's town would hardly be a reason why he's not voted for.

The reason I was voting for kdowns was because I thought Macros was scum and didn't want to be voting Pine anymore.

Unvote: kdowns

Vote: Seacore

DeasVail · Fri May 11, 2012 1:45 pm

Oh whoops, I hope I didn't hammer.

I think it's L-1.

DeasVail · Fri May 11, 2012 2:23 pm

None, as far as I'm aware.

What do you think of the slot?

DeasVail · Fri May 11, 2012 2:30 pm

In post 1803, HezLucky wrote:Really? I thought it was an opportunistic jump.

By me?

DeasVail · Fri May 11, 2012 2:44 pm

The problem I have is that there have been times where I have manipulated the town by acting like town when very close to being lynched, so whenever I think someone may be acting like town, I always think, well I could really see myself doing that to have that kind of effect.

DeasVail · Fri May 11, 2012 10:19 pm

I thought it possible.

DeasVail · Sat May 12, 2012 12:01 am

In post 1816, Code_X wrote:@ Maxous. Possible yes. Unlikely though. I just don't think either of these wagons are great truth be told. Macros had a lot of people suspicious of him - kdowns hasn't really done anything. Compare his content since replacing in to Ohmygod for instance.

Why do you think kdowns would be more likely to post content as town?

DeasVail · Sat May 12, 2012 12:26 am

Would you post content in his shoes as scum?

DeasVail · Sat May 12, 2012 12:45 am

Well the way I see it, both town and scum in kdowns' position have reason to post content, so I don't really see it as related.

I'm kind of eh on junpei claiming. It's kind of pointless if we're just going to lynch seacore no matter what he claims.

DeasVail · Sat May 12, 2012 12:55 am

*no matter what Junpei claims.

And I think that considering "scumminess" of wagons is a bad influence on scumhunting, but each to their own.

DeasVail · Sat May 12, 2012 1:06 am

I've looked through a fair bit of Junpei's ISO and am confirming my weak town read of him. Really, I don't see anything scummy. Can I have the main reasons for him being scum summarised? All I remember is suspecting shotgun, and I think that's a bad reason.

DeasVail · Sat May 12, 2012 1:40 am

I didn't like the Junpei wagon, Pine was getting replaced and I was too busy to convince people to join the wagon.

DeasVail · Sat May 12, 2012 10:55 am

Obviously get a claim from Junpei before hammering him.

Still, I think he's town and don't understand why he's scum.

DeasVail · Sat May 12, 2012 3:04 pm

I'm betting town.

DeasVail · Sat May 12, 2012 6:41 pm

Now we get to argue about the possible explanations for Junpei's reaction! Yipee!

DeasVail · Sat May 12, 2012 7:46 pm

^Lining up lynches

DeasVail · Sun May 13, 2012 8:19 pm

Please lynch seacore guys.

His scumread on Junpei seems predetermined, as in he decided to have a scumread on Junpei and demonstrate this with his posting, instead of considering things first. Junpei's actually not very scummy, so I don't really believe that Seacore would replace in and think Junpei was scum. The part where he says Junpei knew he'd been hammered comes across as too sure that Junpei is scum, and is what I feel fuels my above point. I'd expect more consideration of whether he really wanted to make Junpei the only viable counterwagon to himself. In any case, I think he's a better lynch than Junpei and if nothing else, you should just vote him for this reason. (I'll feel really embarrassed if Junpei is scum and Seacore town)

tl;dr LYNCH SEACORE. TRUST ME.

Code_X, why say that now?

DeasVail · Sun May 13, 2012 8:39 pm

In post 1916, Code_X wrote:I've been saying it for days. Keep up.

It's futile though in the state of the game.

That doesn't answer my question.

In post 1917, FakeGod wrote:Sorry I didn't post in awhile. I am incredibly sick at the moment.

However, this is long overdue.

VOTE: Seacore

Good move.

DeasVail · Sun May 13, 2012 8:50 pm

In post 1919, Seacore wrote:Um, DV, do you actually read my posts, or just skip them and decide what I've said separately ?

A bit of both, why?

DeasVail · Sun May 13, 2012 8:56 pm

I haven't read your most recent post yet, sorry.

DeasVail · Sun May 13, 2012 8:57 pm

It actually doesn't make much of a difference to my point. Why did you think it did?

DeasVail · Sun May 13, 2012 10:16 pm

That is scummy too, I think.

This better not turn into a wagon.

DeasVail · Sun May 13, 2012 11:04 pm

Hmm,

If Seacore is scum he would have done the 'townie' thing and would have come up with reasons to think I'm scum.

Discuss.

DeasVail · Sun May 13, 2012 11:50 pm

I think it's scummy, that's what I said.

DeasVail · Mon May 14, 2012 12:06 am

In post 1931, Code_X wrote:It's more the "I think" - just makes you sound unconvinced.

That's a correct observation.

DeasVail · Mon May 14, 2012 1:07 pm

Is that lynch?

DeasVail · Fri May 18, 2012 11:06 am

Vote: Kdowns

DeasVail · Fri May 18, 2012 12:51 pm

The Nero Cain vote isn't bad, but I still think kdowns is the best lynch because of macros being scummy.

I kind of think Nero is town, but he's not one of my stronger reads.

DeasVail · Fri May 18, 2012 3:44 pm

In post 1980, Nero Cain wrote:You think I'm town but you like SC's vote on me. lololololololol

sigh

DeasVail · Fri May 18, 2012 4:09 pm

I just don't know how to tell with Nero.

So, instead,

Let's vote kdowns!!!

DeasVail · Fri May 18, 2012 4:19 pm

In post 1994, Nero Cain wrote:Me and Mastin are scum? lol Either you aren't thinkin' or you really are scum. Think really hard and tell me whats wrong.

What's wrong with it?

DeasVail · Fri May 18, 2012 4:38 pm

In post 1997, Junpei wrote:You should know I don't like meta, I get "a pretty big kick out of" you suggesting I care about your meta beyond the fact that you're highly immature.

Why do you choose not to let yourself be influenced by meta?

DeasVail · Fri May 18, 2012 4:42 pm

I do agree that meta can be used in very wrong ways, but I found it hard to believe you could completely disregard it. I'm satisfied with your answer though.

DeasVail · Sat May 19, 2012 11:06 am

Um, I haven't read up, but al I said was that SC's vote wasn't bad...

DeasVail · Sat May 19, 2012 11:30 am

OhGodMyLife.

Reasons for Junpei scum would be nice.

DeasVail · Sat May 19, 2012 11:49 am

Not impressed, sorry.

DeasVail · Sat May 19, 2012 11:50 am

Sorry, it's just that I don't think any of it is that scummy.

DeasVail · Sat May 19, 2012 12:12 pm

In post 2019, OhGodMyLife wrote:Let me try to explain why this is scummy.

Over the course of the game the town is trying to confirm enough people as town to hopelessly trap the scum. This can be done through claims, cop results, anything. Shotgun's claim essentially confirmed him, but Junpei insisted it didn't, trying to create enough doubt to keep him in the pool of possible lynched. Its an incredibly pro-scum, anti-town move. Town have no reason to cast doubt on a confirmed innocent.

Similarly, though benmage is not confirmed in the way that shotgun was basically confirmed, strong reasons have been given to believe him town. Once again junpei tries to cast doubt on this conclusion.

I understand what you were getting at, but I disagree that it's scummy. Scum are more likely to go with the flow than worry about shotgun being widely considered town.

I don't think it unlikely that town would have doubts about someone like shotgun.

DeasVail · Sat May 19, 2012 12:45 pm

In post 2012, DeasVail wrote:Um, I haven't read up, but al I said was that SC's vote wasn't bad...

DeasVail · Sat May 19, 2012 12:54 pm

What I meant was I didn't read properly what had been said since I last posted.

And, it's the fact that my town read on you is only slight which makes a vote on you not bad. My junpei townread is stronger than the townread on you.

DeasVail · Mon May 21, 2012 11:44 am

Blatantly deflecting the Junpei wagon is fun.

DeasVail · Mon May 21, 2012 10:54 pm

LLD:

Can you tell me why Junpei is scum please?

DeasVail · Wed May 23, 2012 12:41 am

Ok, at some point soon, I will make an effort to get a better grasp of this game, because all I really have now, are a whole bunch of townreads and a whole bunch of meh reads.

Probably at this point I'm liking FakeGod and Kdowns as scum, except I'm really not sure.

DeasVail · Wed May 23, 2012 2:15 pm

Oh, ok then

I will make an effort to be more involved soon-ish. Probably this weekend. Sorry again.

DeasVail · Wed May 23, 2012 10:51 pm

V/LA for ~48 hours. Long day at uni tomorrow followed by no internet access.

DeasVail · Fri May 25, 2012 11:41 pm

Get excited guys!

DeasVail is back in the game.

So town that I'd rather kill myself than lynch them:

Code_X-

I've become a little less sure recently, but a quick look over him again and he seems to be really town.

What changed between your vote for me and later unvote? How do you feel about the game right now?

Maxous

Probably town:

Benmage-

His lack of involvement in the game recently seems similar to how I've been feeling. His posts don't give the impression of trying to look town as scum would.

Fallman7-

Pretty much because of Junpei, but his post does make my tail tingle.

Why are you concerned about getting into trouble?

HezLucky

Mastin2-

I'm not sure about him, but I think I'll put him back here for now.

Mini-Lib

LLD-

Why did you vote kdowns instead of me? Based on what you posted, I'd expect a vote on me. Also, how do you feel about the game?

Psyche

Scooby

StrangerCoug-

Do you think the kills themselves could give an indication of whether it's multiball or not?

Could be scum:

Maxwell-

Eh.

FakeGod-

What's been preventing me from putting him as stronger scum is 1774, which I find to be the kind of interesting post that would only come from town. Otherwise, it really seems like he could be scum to me. His posting has been minimal, but not controversial and I think it's possible he's just purposely flying under the radar. However, another thing I question is whether he would be more pro-town if scum.

Nero Cain-

I'm not sure about him and don't really see him as particularly townish or scummy. Antihero seemed convinced he was town though.

RedFF-

Eh. Maybe slightly leaning town.

Probably scum:

Kdowns-

Because of macros, but his lack of posting makes me sad

Come back please so I can attack you better.

OhGodMyLife-

I think he's scum based on a quick read. I don't see anything I find to be indicative of town and there are things about his posting, which I can't articulate right now, that make me think scum.

Hmm, sorry, I didn't put in as much effort as I had hoped. I'll try to focus more on individual players later.

DeasVail · Sat May 26, 2012 10:46 am

In post 2260, OhGodMyLife wrote:Sticking with my vote. DV, maybe some day you'll be able to articulate what suddenly made you list me as apparently the scummiest player in the game, but for now I'm just going to ignore you because there is nothing to respond to in what you said.

Thank you for claiming to me.

Unvote: Kdowns

Vote: OhGodMyLife

DeasVail · Sat May 26, 2012 12:02 pm

I don't expect it to get him lynched.

DeasVail · Sat May 26, 2012 12:10 pm

That question was so obviously coming that I would have answered it beforehand if I planned to.

DeasVail · Sat May 26, 2012 12:15 pm

Oh yeah, and SC's accusation that only scum would assume it's multiball is not good.

DeasVail · Sat May 26, 2012 12:32 pm

In post 2274, Maxous wrote:I don't see how OMGL's response is particulary scummy though.

Hmm ok. How do you think scum would respond differently?

DeasVail · Sat May 26, 2012 12:37 pm

Oh sorry LLD. That was meant for Mastin. Ugh.

DeasVail · Sat May 26, 2012 12:38 pm

And also, I see what you mean, but I don't think it's nearly as conclusively scummy as you think it is.

DeasVail · Sat May 26, 2012 1:01 pm

In post 2281, HezLucky wrote:It's possibly DV is just maf trying to feign stupidity [durr I dont know why he's scummy durrrrrrr]

Is that what you're doing?

DeasVail · Sat May 26, 2012 7:13 pm

In post 2292, Maxous wrote:Not saying it is a town looking response, he just said he is'nt responding because there is nothing from the line to respond to.

Which is a response?

DeasVail · Sat May 26, 2012 8:35 pm

Andrew:

Sorry, but I don't really know what to tell you. Not much has happened really.

Maxwell:

What did you find scummy about Macros?

DeasVail · Sun May 27, 2012 1:30 am

About OGML's recent post:

It demonstrates that his attitude to my suspicion of him is based upon the fact that there is ~seemingly~ nothing behind it. For some reason, he feels the need to mention it, dismiss it, and make a show of the fact that I don't have any solid reasoning behind it and that gives him the right to ignore me.

Town does not think like that.

Town would instead think about what my vote on them indicates regarding my alignment. I don't know if I'm able to explain it right, but I basically feel that it comes from a scum attitude- wanting to look town by making a somewhat snarky response (except it doesn't actually say anything), which does not at all seem like how town would respond to it.

Maybe I'll be able to explain it better when I'm less tired, but hopefully someone gets how I feel.

I'll probably go through his and firestarter's posts again at some point as well, but I urge everyone to consider OGML as scum and give thoughts on him.

DeasVail · Sun May 27, 2012 10:24 pm

Here's the thing. I'm not going to support a lynch of fallman until he posts more and I think lynching him based on one post is a bad idea. I think he's the kind of player that will be easy to read after a few posts and I think all the rallying is premature.

Instead, I would like to say that Kdowns, maxwell and OhGodMyLife (preferably one of the last two) are all good lynches and would love one of them to happen today.

OhGodMyLife

First, as I've said before, Firestarter's rack vote was scummy because:

->It was lazy- No real effort put into trying to get a proper read of rack, which doesn't match the amount of effort put into the summary of the first part of the game. This indicates that his effort was going into furthering his scum agenda (wanting to post lots to look town) rather than town motives (wanting to put effort into reading people and discussing reads with others).
->There was little acknowledgement of the abundant rack suspicion at the time- possibly wanting to avoid sheeping.

477: In his response to me he says that if he had reasoning of his own then it's not scummy, when there was pretty much just one line about rack so he hardly had reasons of his own. I would think town more likely to comment that they didn't really have much reasoning and were just jumping on a wagon they thought was good.

He also doesn't think to unvote rack despite obviously not being able to engage in the game. This isn't conclusively scummy, but I think it is a little.

I still think that my suspicion of OGML is hardly the kind of thing he as town would come in and post for, considering his response does nothing to help the town and is basically saying "I'm not responding".

I'll try to explain again without looking at what I said before and hopefully I'll be clearer.

When a townie learns that someone suspects them and is under very little pressure, I think the first thing they would do if they decided to pay any attention to it would be try and work out whether it's coming from town or scum. A lack of content could be considered scummy perhaps, or it could even be considered more town. In a case of low content, as it was here, I wouldn't be surprised if town asked me to expand on my suspicion in an attempt to better read me. However, things that OGML said such as "I'm just going to ignore you because there is nothing to respond to in what you said" is not what I expect town's concerns to be at all. I do not think town would think this. They wouldn't want to ignore someone for the reason he said. It's not what they'd think at all. Instead, it sounds a lot like an awkward scum response, figuring out the best way to counter my suspicion of them and actually displays scum thought processes.

I feel quite happy with what I've said above, so hopefully people can read and respond with what they think.

Things that make me unsure:

-Firestarter's vote on rack seemed perhaps too badly justified to come from scum.
-I liked Firestarter's accusation of Psyche bussing rack.

Maxwell

There's not much behind this one, and I really don't know how to read shotty, but I found his comment about Macros being scummy, scummy at the time because I didn't really believe it. I can't really explain why though.

Also his latest post has a really scummy part that I'm not sure I want to point out right now.

If neither of the above two wagons look viable and I don't begin to read fallman as scum, I will probably reiterate my reasons for wanting a kdowns lynch.

Code_X

: What do you think of LLD's reason for wanting a Fallman lynch?

DeasVail · Mon May 28, 2012 10:24 am

In post 2330, HezLucky wrote:Are you high? How is "wait for Fallman to post a few things" better than "wait for Fallman to post a few things and PRESSURE HIM MASSIVELY"?

Its not. You are out of your mind.

OH GOD SO MANY SCUM IN THIS GAME

Are you serious? You're not pressuring him massively (which is not nearly as useful as you think it is by the way), you're making it so we won't be able to lynch anyone but him today.

I don't want to lynch someone after one questionable post when I had a townread on the predecessor. Even if fallman doesn't post anymore today, I'd rather lynch someone else and deal with fallman later when I can better read him.

Future posting from the fallman slot will greatly improve our ability to read him. Future posting from someone like OGML won't.

Yes. I am deflecting a fallman lynch. Deal with it.

DeasVail · Mon May 28, 2012 6:27 pm

Hmm...

Should I hammer?

DeasVail · Tue May 29, 2012 10:58 am

In post 2356, Fallman7 wrote:Ok I'm just a vanilla bystander for this matter. What I was trying to say is that I wanted to start scum hunting on a new day since I was replacing someone. The only one that I am quite suspicious of at this point is ladylambdadelta I hope I spelled that right but I am suspicious of him alone. That's all I can say. Hammer if you choose.

Can someone tell me whether this is from town or scum? I don't know how to tell.

DeasVail · Tue May 29, 2012 11:11 am

Can we not lynch him then?

DeasVail · Tue May 29, 2012 11:21 am

UNVOTE: OGML
VOTE: Fallman7

DeasVail · Wed Jun 06, 2012 11:48 am

Hmm, I'll have to have another look through things.

DeasVail · Wed Jun 06, 2012 8:16 pm

I agree that TML should claim.

From the mafia perspective, they should have thought it possible that TML did indeed have a cop innocent on LLD considering their knowledge of LLD being godfather. It's possible they wanted to wait for TML to actually claim an innocent result on LLD, but if they killed TML and he flipped as some sort of cop, it would have been obvious that LLD was an innocent result, so there shouldn't have been any need to keep him alive.

On top of that, having a godfather on their team would have indicated that there must be a cop, so my big question is, why is TML still alive? There is obviously a reason for mafia keeping him around. The only thing I can think of is that they had information (rolecop/track result) suggesting TML was not a cop, and that's why they didn't kill him.

So yes, I think a claim is necessary, because I don't think it will change the chances of mafia night-killing him and will only help us read him.

DeasVail · Thu Jun 07, 2012 1:28 am

Ah, 349! Just looking over it again, I'm reminded of when MS was all new and exciting. It feels so long ago now...

I must say though, I'd expect my scumplay now to be different, considering that I hadn't even completed a game there and had never actually been town.

Now I feel all good inside

Thanks DLG! And thank you so much for replacing in and catching up.

Back to business:

DLG:

I feel that your scumreads are a bit lazy, as in you're going after people who aren't contributing as much, and I don't agree that it's a great place to find scum.

Regarding Benmage, I haven't made my mind up yet. Don't have time to read through his posts now, but I will later.

DeasVail · Thu Jun 07, 2012 9:18 pm

OGML:

Why don't you think TML is an investigative PR?

DeasVail · Sat Jun 09, 2012 1:11 am

Thoughts on Recent Posts

I feel that Psyche's lack of involvement is a nulltell. Overall, I have a very weak townread on him, although I will try to have a limited reread of the game in light of LLD's flip.

Hez's 2402 is not very good in my opinion. It's basically *Benmage said he wanted to lynch LLD the next day, but he didn't know that she would die, and now that she's dead and flipped scum he's obviously scum because he was obviously planning to bus her!*

Hmmm...

Also the point about knowing Junpei-slot was town is bad too. Scum, if anything, would try to avoid predicting a townflip from an upcoming town lynch.

OGML's 2411 is ok, but I don't understand why he no longer considers TML cop.

I'm not liking Hez's posting.

Psyche's 2436 has no purpose except to look town.

In response to OGML, I think that what TML did was good. He made himself a bit too obvious with the LLD innocent thing I think, but he should definitely have lied when pushed on it. I don't understand why you think differently.

Also, about RedFF, I always have trouble reading him and decided to have a good think about him. I've decided he's probably town because he tends to try and be slightly more consistently involved as scum rather than going for periods without posting anything (as far as I recall) and I don't really think he's scummy.

DeasVail · Sat Jun 09, 2012 1:23 am

I was going to start formulating updated reads on players, but now I can't. I will do later.

DeasVail · Sat Jun 09, 2012 10:27 am

In post 2466, Code_X wrote:Deas - do you believe Andrew's claim?

Yes, and I haven't read through properly, but maxwell saying that he's more likely SK than Vig because scooby didn't shoot makes no sense.

DeasVail · Sat Jun 09, 2012 2:40 pm

I don't think there's much indication either way.

DeasVail · Sat Jun 09, 2012 2:58 pm

Pretty much. If anything it's more likely she started attacking a buddy or two than just attacking town, but I haven't had the chance to have a good look back at her play yet, so I don't know.

DeasVail · Sat Jun 09, 2012 3:15 pm

That was one post very early in the game. Did she attack anyone different later?

DeasVail · Sat Jun 09, 2012 3:43 pm

I still think he could be scum, but his reads on Benmage and Hez are good, so I'm really waiting until I can have a proper read-through before making up my mind on him.

DeasVail · Sat Jun 09, 2012 6:55 pm

I think I may delay going back through the game, as I'm pretty sure maxwell is scum.

Vote: Maxwell

Might get a case of sorts up later.

DeasVail · Sat Jun 09, 2012 7:09 pm

By the way, this is where I'm at right now. And I have skimmed through a couple of these ISOs to check that I still think they're town.

Town

Andrew94

TML

DLG

Code_X

Benmage

RedFF

Maxous

StrangerCoug

Some of these are strong, some of them weak, but I'm pretty sure most of the people in the list above are town, and with me that makes 9 out of the 14 players alive.

DeasVail · Sat Jun 09, 2012 7:09 pm

By the way, this is where I'm at right now. And I have skimmed through a couple of these ISOs to check that I still think they're town.

Town

Andrew94

TML

DLG

Code_X

Benmage

RedFF

Maxous

StrangerCoug

Some of these are strong, some of them weak, but I'm pretty sure most of the people in the list above are town, and with me that makes 9 out of the 14 players alive.

DeasVail · Sat Jun 09, 2012 7:10 pm

Ugh, sorry about double post.

In post 2492, andrew94 wrote:no sir vote ohgodmylife.

or hezzlucky.

I honestly wouldn't mind either, but what's wrong with maxwell?

DeasVail · Sat Jun 09, 2012 7:54 pm

ok

Vote: OGML

DeasVail · Sun Jun 10, 2012 1:08 am

In post 2499, Code_X wrote:Dream on.

What makes you think it's so unlikely?

I'm not even trying yet.

DeasVail · Sun Jun 10, 2012 1:24 am

In post 2501, Code_X wrote:Not that I'd consider directing PRs either way - but we have a claimed cop who I believe more.

Oh, I thought you were talking about the sheeping (which you should totally do by the way).

DeasVail · Sun Jun 10, 2012 1:29 am

Well that's embarrassing.

Sorry about that.

DeasVail · Sun Jun 10, 2012 12:19 pm

In post 2516, Psyche wrote:based on less than a full reading of the thread.

And these opinions are bad, how?