Alisae V Pine: Trees Apparently Make Good Treestumps

[Dannflor]

So you pushing such a point makes me doubt YOU are town.

hey look great

what other reads do you have

[Dannflor]

Maria who do you wanna lynch that's not PP?

[Dannflor]

Like this is not a very scummy post independently but the important thing to bear in mind here is that Dann never follows up on this ever.

objectively false

[Dannflor]

He defends his tone there with this post, but again, why is saying he is scum on tone "extreme"?

you literally did not respond to me beyond saying "lol dann scum"

like it's the exact same tone you're accusing me of and I don't know how else to take that besides you're scum who doesn't actually want to engage with me in good faith

[Dannflor]

@Krazzy
simple question: where's this read been?

dormant until I called him out for his lack of tunnel on me

[Dannflor]

Krazy.

You seem very confident that I would not say certain things as town.

I can assure you that I can and do use hyperbole and call things "disgusting" as town. Especially in a game like this where I've been slowly getting more and more fed up. I'd say in the dead thread of Vengeful Ghosts I acted similarly, and I was conf town.

Here, my reaction is based off of your refusal to actually engage with me. Even now, you come out with "lol Dann is hilarious as scum" instead of like, directing anything that I can respond to at all. You haven't been interested in sorting me ever since I started scum reading you it feels like.

[Dannflor]

Like this is not a very scummy post independently but the important thing to bear in mind here is that Dann never follows up on this ever.

objectively false

btw

his reads list is what directly feeds into my initial scum read of Krazy

Since this is singleball I'm thinking Mena's town, when he was scum he had a very particular feel to his posts and I'm not getting that here. Thinking of Micc's Pokemon game where I was on my Pikachu account and he replaced into scum.

right okay that's one read

I definitely need more and I think it's unlike Krazy to be this shallow regardless of his activity

that's basically where I'm at re: Krazy, he's a player I really want to read but I haven't been able to yet this game

is it a spicy reads list?

didn't you want to talk to me about reads? what ever happened to that? what did you think of my last reads list?

I'll get to that in my post dw

it's unfortunate that you're probably scum this game

And then I case him based on his reads list and other posts he made in my big reads list.

Krazy is looking for reasons to scum read me at this point to justify his tunnel and actually just straight lying about our interactions now.

[Dannflor]

In post 8929, Dannflor wrote:
In post 8928, Krazy wrote:
Dann why do you think Ank chose "Buffy" among your tv choices?

Buffy is the best tv show ever created

In post 8942, Dannflor wrote:
I'm okay getting lynched for my Buffy read I will die on this hill


Actively downplaying the guilty

like what

why are these shit posts a part of your case

Why is it

A GUILTY

all of a sudden when you shrugged it off so many times before

[Dannflor]

Here, my reaction is based off of your refusal to actually engage with me. Even now, you come out with "lol Dann is hilarious as scum" instead of like, directing anything that I can respond to at all. You haven't been interested in sorting me ever since I started scum reading you it feels like.

Sure except I don't interact with people to form reads, I analyze what they do and then I reach a conclusion. I might talk with people about the merit of a read but I have never been good at generating content with provocative questions or shit like that. It's the reason I hate playing day 1 as town. Whereas you have spent the game trying to present yourself as interactive when you never seem to actually care

What about my ability to form reads?

That's how I form reads. You've not considered the possibility that I am town long enough to actually help me sort you. From your perspective, on the off chance that I am town, why wouldn't you want to help me see that you are town?

[Dannflor]

From your perspective, on the off chance that I am town, why wouldn't you want to help me see that you are town?

You mean like in all the times I started talking to you and you said "I'll get to that later" or outright ignored me? Or where you said you wanted to talk about reads but then never asked me about any actual reads?

The thing is you keep *finding* reasons why I'm town, and then two posts later you decide I'm not again when the reads of other people in the town change or something else happens like my read of you changes. I don't feel like you've approached me in good faith at all this game. You use random AtE arguing my posts are bullshit when you want to scumread me and then fabricate meta when you want to downplay your push.

The progression was

1. I asked you for a reads list because I was uncertain about your slot
2. You took a while but eventually posted said reads list
3. I thought said reads list was scummy when combined with your other posts and then cased it.
4. You responded by saying "ok dann is scum."

Like, I'm sorry I haven't been the absolute best at interacting with you all game. But you can hardly say I was the one who started engaging in bad faith.

I also think saying "You use random AtE" to dismiss your posts and scum read you shows you are either purposefully not trying to see my perspective or you are unintentionally twisting my posts to fit your narrative.

[Dannflor]

Like there's enough people pushing me that some must be town in addition to Ali but it's pretty obvious there's an attempted scum dogpile in mylo.

Yes I am the one using random AtE

[Dannflor]

why are these shit posts a part of your case

Why is it A GUILTY all of a sudden when you shrugged it off so many times before

because you don't crumb and a mechanical action by discussing TR or SR
you discuss shit orthogonal to that because you are communicating a special action
did 222222 ppl miss this

The whole point of that line of discussion was whether you were Ank's guilty via Buffy being the crumb and you tried to downplay it with a joke

I mean...

What do you expect me to say

I know it's not a guilty

Why would Ank choose Buffy other than that it was a joke

since that's what it was

You're failing to see things from my perspective

[Dannflor]

You assumed that me saying "dann is scum" was an OMGUS -- you were trying to poison the well against me. You didn't ask, "okay why am I scum?" You didn't ask for a deeper interaction. You made a knee-jerk reaction to my accusation.

I don't think the interpretation of it as an OMGUS was entirely off base. I also did say I would want you to detail how you came to that read in order for me to town read you.

idk man I feel like you're just misrepping me

[Dannflor]

transparently ignoring Ank's guilty

Like actually

when the fuck did this become a guilty for you

Your initial reaction to pops was

"eh seems like it could be a meme"

[Dannflor]

that pop in

Dann: "You're not solving me in bad faith"

Krazy starts posting

Dann: "lol pop in"

sure Dann, this is definitely how you play town

KRAZY

YOUR 'POSTING'

WAS

"LOL DANN IS WOLFING"

THAT'S NOT TOWN POSTING

WHAT AM I SUPPOSED TO SAY TO THAT

if you're town you are confbiasing to the extreme here and it's actually ridiculous

[Dannflor]

I didn't say "lol pop in" after you started making posts with content

instead I actually started responding to stuff and talking with you

please stop misrepping me jesus

[Dannflor]

I know it's not a guilty

Why would Ank choose Buffy other than that it was a joke

why would Ank choose movies when she doesn't even watch them

but okay, why if you are town, are you not pushing Mena? Who else could she have plausibly hid behind?

Like you continue to want to just drop it altogether but this is mylo and there is no reason to argue that it's a bad time to talk about a mech guilty

I am pushing Mena

read my posts maybe

[Dannflor]

THAT'S NOT TOWN POSTING

WHAT AM I SUPPOSED TO SAY TO THAT

if you're town you are confbiasing to the extreme here and it's actually ridiculous

you came in and said that I stopped tunneling you for political reasons when MASTINA was happening

that's so insane and laughable I refuse to believe you would drop that shade as town dude, there's no way. That's such a gross and incomprehensible misrepresentation it frankly is astonishing.

you didn't pick the tunnel back up until just now

not really

that's what I found sus

[Dannflor]

I didn't say "lol pop in" after you started making posts with content

Yeah instead you said it IMMEDIATELY after I make my first post of the day

give me a break, if you want to interact with me why the fuck would you immediately go to poisoning the well?

because I can't interact with that post you made

the timing of it was just so wolfy

I'll interact with the content you actually post and I have been doing that

but like...

what

I'm not seeing your logic here at all

[Dannflor]

I am pushing Mena

read my posts maybe

okay then why the fuck is your argument "WHY DID THIS BECOME A GUILTY" and not "actually I think it's Mena"?

Why do you launch immediately into defensiveness?

I think I've stated before that I'm not really considering whoever Ank hid behind because we've already had that discussion and I don't think it's productive to continue the mech talk 300 pages later

I'm defensive because your interpretation of the "guilty" switched on a dime and I don't see the progression as to why

Like

Why isn't Mena more likely the guilty from your perspective? It feels like you switched that to fit this narrative you're pushing about me.

[Dannflor]

following through on the mech guilty until now

this is exactly the part I take issue with and why I accused you of dropping your tunnel Krazy

[Dannflor]

I'm just gonna let you talk to Wooper because I don't think us flaming each other is actually gonna produce anything readable or productive.

Let me know if there's something specific you'd like me to respond to still.

Otherwise, I don't think me engaging you further is changing my read of you at this point given the way you've been approaching me this phase.

[Dannflor]

Why isn't Mena more likely the guilty from your perspective? It feels like you switched that to fit this narrative you're pushing about me.

If this is how you feel why did you not join me on Mena ever until now? Why did you only flip your read on Mena when he flipped his read of you?

why are you answering my question with questions dude

I also didn't say I feel like Mena is guiltied

I'm not considering the guilty in my reads

I flipped my read on Mena for reasons that I detailed to duck earlier

I promised a reads list and case on Mena but I got distracted with this so it'll have to come tomorrow

[Dannflor]

Like I don’t see how you can look at these posts Krazy is pushing out and say confidently “Oh yeah, that’s town for sho”

i don't townread his push

but

i questioned dann's not reconsidering when Krazy was doing what he should be doing according to dann

and I don't think scum is gonna start fighting against Ali for 'gaslighting' when that helps scum more then town

i know, unpopular opinion and all but i'm not here to sheep you blindly

Can you unpack this for me? I’m not following

When/where exactly were you questioning me?

[Dannflor]

HURT: Krazy

PP might theoretically be a safer lynch? But that doesn’t progress the game and then I think we lynch Krazy anyway so

I’ll vote krazy after sleeping on this game since I have permission and I really don’t see myself voting elsewhere this dayphase

I feel like the gamestate is finally moving in a positive direction though so I’d like this phase to go for a couple more days at least

[Dannflor]

what was your gamestate read on pops again?

it's just like the timing of her interventions in the thread and the direction that they've gone in

I didn't really see it until early today (D4 today) when she was interacting with krazy

like the game was going in one direction which I thought was healthy and then pops actively seemed to derail that through those posts with krazy

so thenI started wondering about "what if pops is just scum" and everything just seemed to fit into place

I know that's not the best explanation ever but it's really hard to put my finger on exactly what it is that makes pops scum because I think it's v subtle. but I think if you look at pops' ISO then everything makes more sense coming from scum!her than town!her

I haven't been pushing her bc I don't think I'm likely to get her through and I think PP is a good option + thought building the wagon would be useful information-wise

@Duck, this is the stuff that has me doubting Menalque.

I could not track his though process in regards to Pops, and the way he kinda just gave up on explaining it felt like he just needed to have the scum read to pad his reads out and was hoping he’d get town read off tone.

Can you look at this and some of the stuff before this in his ISO

I’m struggling with seeing this as a genuine town thought process

[Dannflor]

I think Krazy is town here, because I can relate to his feelings. He was being called scum for not pushing reads, which he would do as town. But this is a hard game to 'work in', and once you guys started playing with each other, you could really see Krazy get into his element. Yeah, I townread that.

GE felt more survivalistic, focusing more on not being scumread then actually scumhunting.

Dann, I don't know. His meta push on Krazy was good, but once Krazy started what should be towntelling for Dann: basicly playing the game, he wasn't reconsidering. This could very much be scum.

Oh wait I missed this

Do you think I’ve not been trying to engage Krazy in good faith this day phase?

[Dannflor]

dann, any reason why you did the hurt instead of a vote?

I’m very tired and a little emotional

I want the chance to just sleep on what happened tonight

99% I’m just voting Krazy tomorrow morning but I’m not in a hurry to end the day and MYLO status has me queasy

[Dannflor]

like I know 5 scum coordinating a hammer isn’t likely

but I’m little more remotivated for this game and I would very much like to win

[Dannflor]

The answer is in the quote you made tho

I feel like I’ve given Krazy plenty of chances to help me reconsider

I’m not sure how you can read me like that tbh

[Dannflor]

okay thank you

I will sleep on that too

[Dannflor]

and now I sleep because I have to wake up in 5 hours

Gn

[Dannflor]

The way he's playing this game is so blatantly obvious town along with the way he went at Mastina his tone is consistent it fits the narrative and I think scum are pushing him. There was 1 point I could see for Krazy scum and no one has brought it up and I feel like it's a pretty obvious point so scum clearly are just pushing it to push it.

townie tone is not a good reason to town read Krazy!! Especially considering Mastina's push on him

Your logic is also backwards here. If there was an obvious point for Krazy scum and scum were looking for reasons to push him, it would have been brought up by now.

[Dannflor]

HURT: Krazy

PP might theoretically be a safer lynch? But that doesn’t progress the game and then I think we lynch Krazy anyway so

I’ll vote krazy after sleeping on this game since I have permission and I really don’t see myself voting elsewhere this dayphase

I feel like the gamestate is finally moving in a positive direction though so I’d like this phase to go for a couple more days at least

Oh Dann since you're so eager of me making a better read on you: this is the only post I've seen from you that made me lift an eyebrow. Saying that PP is a safer lynch seems too calculated for a town pushing a scumread
on Krazy point of view.

If PP is town, you could be trying to put the idea of lynching him as an option.
If PP is scum, seems like a "in case PP is lynched I must say this for credit".

If you were town I wouldn't expect a post like this, but even with this in mind I think you're town. Big deal, I don't get your point, you're still town.

I'm only hesitant because I got yelled at when I voted Krazy earlier today, and honestly I don't wanna rush anything.

I do see PP as like, objectively scum. If I wanted a world where we went for the highest odds of flipping scum I'd vote there, but I don't think voting there gives us the highest odds of winning the game. Does that make sense? I realize it sounds fence sitty but that's honestly my thought process here.

Having a Level 1 basic read on me is fine PB, it just feels like you've never wanted to even try to reevaluate me despite a lot of the game changing since you formed that read.

[Dannflor]

VOTE: Krazy

[Dannflor]

i thought it kinda... flowed
like, messily, but the way thoughts flow
i don't know

gngn

I guess. And when I look at it that way I want to town read it. It just feels like a tone read at that point when I'd love to be able to logically follow his reads instead.

Do you think he's had a consistently townie tone through out the game?

[Dannflor]

good morning Ali

[Dannflor]

who do you want to vote Gamma

[Dannflor]

I wanna play that League based fighting game

[Dannflor]

Why do both of them disappear just around the point where I'd expect them both to get furious and indignant? I think Krazy's disappearance is more guilty conscience indicative than Dann's but like aaaghhtrhffhf

nothing that was happening was progressing my read on Krazy's slot and Krazy did not seem like he was about to start approaching me differently

I opted to disappear and go to bed over spawning 10 more pages of unproductive shit because this game really doesn't need anymore of that

[Dannflor]

I stg D1 scum lynches are a plague

[Dannflor]

i have this theory that i was the designated game-ending mislynch today and scum maybe jumped the gun on seeing a win in sight

like throw Krazy's case into the thread 3 day phases ago and it looks a lot more natural versus saving it for mylo

[Dannflor]

also I don't understand Krazy's replace out :/

[Dannflor]

he wasn't faking any of his reactions

not an argument for town!Krazy

scum!AtE is based in reality just as much as town!AtE is

I would expect you to know that

[Dannflor]

he wasn't faking any of his reactions

not an argument for town!Krazy

scum!AtE is based in reality just as much as town!AtE is

I would expect you to know that

This is a really bad way of looking at my post but dw Dann I get that you're scum and need to come up with a really bad way to get out of the hole you're in.
Do I even need to respond to this in any other way? No, I don't think so.

I see you justifying a town tone read on Krazy and I just plain disagree that his tone spews him town.

Specifically I have a hard time wrapping my head around why Krazy is such a strong town read for you based purely off tone, which imo is like one of the weakest ways to read people

[Dannflor]

Yall can't just make a blanket statement as
'scum can ate too so your argument is invalid'

no fucking shit scum can ate.
Scum can make any post in the game

but you're like

"Krazy isn't faking his emotion"

That's not a town case???

[Dannflor]

dw Dann I get that you're scum and need to come up with a really bad way to get out of the hole you're in.

this is a very strange thing to say

[Dannflor]

Krazys tone coming up to this makes perfect sense

and proves without a shadow of a doubt he wasn't faking any of his reactions. If you read the way he's played it's clear

it comes from town unless you think scum him can fake his tone like that

...
What else did I miss

Did I misinterpret your post?

It seems like your read is based mostly off tone

[Dannflor]

It killed the user last time

I think Pine confirmed that protection can stop that effect though

[Dannflor]

VOTE: PP

[Dannflor]

UNVOTE:

Ali tell me when you’ve made up your mind

Also, relax, no one will hold this game against you if we lose

[Dannflor]

VOTE: PP

yeet

[Dannflor]

Actually Gamma is trying to townread Ceph who is just constantly scumposting so I'm not sure how much I like that

?????????

scum post

[Dannflor]

case closed everybody can go home

[Dannflor]

case closed everybody can go home

[Dannflor]

fuck you mafia scum

[Dannflor]

who's idea was 24 hour twilight

[Dannflor]

have we had any real discussion happen this game post hammer

[Dannflor]

i think all the people complaining about twilight are scum

[Dannflor]

wait duck you realize im joking right

[Dannflor]

I was complaining about twilight lol

[Dannflor]

VOTE: Cephrir

[Dannflor]

if it's not lylo anymore im not even gonna try to fight my lynch

im past the point of trying to obv town my slot any more than ive already tried

my flip should GUILTY cephrir

[Dannflor]

[pb, Mena, Ico, cephrir] solve

If I’m wrong on one it could be Maria

I have a hard time believing her town read on cephrir

[Dannflor]

why aren't you pushing mena for his reads like yesterday?

I was?

[Dannflor]

@ what's left of Pine's scumteam: I can feel you circling around me, looking at me like i'm a mislynch. Let me tell you right here and now that's not gonna happen

If it makes you feel better, I think you're the towniest of my solve rnow

[Dannflor]

Ico who is your top scum read now that Duck is more or less off the table

[Dannflor]

Question
How do I meet people

find and go to events/clubs/websites/classes for interests/hobbies you have and bond with people through said hobby

[Dannflor]

btw I've only read half of today because day start coincided with 2 super busy days IRL this week and that's why i prodged yesterday

but I'll try to get caught up tonight

[Dannflor]

i lied im too tired

tomorrow it is

[Dannflor]

give me a chance to post a reads list before I go

[Dannflor]

it's ok fire just bus me

[Dannflor]

we weren't supposed to give away that this game was multi ball yet

[Dannflor]

am i and wooper the only ones nodding their heads and going "yep yep, thats theater"

no I am also nodding my head

[Dannflor]

I feel like I have those same interactions with fire every time regardless of either of our alignments

[Dannflor]

also, between Dann and ceph, dann came out a lot uglier then Krazy. I've went through this already.

this feels like a political read and not a real reaction to what happened

[Dannflor]

@Jingle to everyone

vote Dann
I'm done with this day.

put me to L-1 or whatever but please give me a chance to post a reads list before hammer

I’m not intentionally stalling it’s just been a hellish week

[Dannflor]

just post your reads now dann even if they're not fleshed out

I’m not gonna post them from my phone but I’ll post them from my computer before I go to sleep to ight

[Dannflor]

okay well I got home too late last night to do a proper one and I don't wanna keep people waiting

so I'm just gonna do a really shitty tier list with some thoughts real quick here since I can't seem to find proper time to devote to mafia this week ;_;

[Something_Smart/Duunstral]

[the_worst/Firebringer/Gamma Emerald]

=====

[MariaR/Menalque/Pinkball]

[Iconeum/Cephrir]

I'm sort of here-ish give or take.

In my 360 no-scope I-want-some-spicy-credit-after-the-game solve I had [Mena/PB/Ico/Ceph] but I think I'd like to replace Mena with MariaR. I still struggle to see where like, any of Menalque's thought processes came from earlier on in the game. I've liked his posting today a lot more though including his more recent pushes. Doesn't look like scum pushing a mislynch. MariaR on the other hand I know is pushing a mislynch and I'd expect her to town read me here given my play being pretty similar here to the game we just finished together. I struggle to find anyone who hard town reads Cephrir and hard scum reads me off our 1v1 as having genuine reads. (another reason I scum read Ico) It feels like a forced political read that MariaR can get away with because she got that "I know better than you also I'm good at this game" tone that everyone wants to town read and sheep. And like that may be true, but occam's razor tells me she's more likely to be scum this game.

PB I just think reevaluates me at some point? Like it's fine that he wants to town read me but uhhhhh why has the wagon on me not forced him to at the very least ask me a few questions, especially given my absence. It's weird because in the same way I find MariaR's read on me political, I feel the same way about PB's town read on me. I don't understand why it's there given what PB has used to justify it. But idk, maybe he just has a soul read on me and he

has

been townier than the other slots.

I'm depending on Duck to take up the reigns of tunneling Iconeum when I'm gone. None of what he says makes sense coming from town imo. Just reading what he's said about me—which is mostly all I've been able to skim this day phase—75% of the time he's hedging and 25% of the time he's justifying a scum read on me for bad reasons. Which is really really really weird. Because most of the consensus scum read or what have you on me currently is for pushing Iconeum in a lazy way, and yet Iconeum didn't think I was scummy off that. In fact at the time, he argued I could be town off that. Now he's switching that around and finding reasons for me to be scum? Like my 1v1 with Krazy? That's not a town read progression.

Cephrir slot I've said enough on. I think Cephrir has come in with some "better" posting that has saved his slot for the time being but um... It's not anything particularly towny. I also think coming around to a town read on me now makes perfect sense from a scum!him perspective. He wants to look better when I flip. Because when I flip his slot is almost assuredly next. So yeah, uh... Don't forget that Krazy used to be this slot?

And that's all folks

I'll flesh out my reads in a stylish Q&A or AMA fashion since that's easier to do via phone

[Dannflor]

uhhh I thought I saw something about it but didn’t know how hard it was, I’ve skimmed most of the day

Gamma I haven’t read wrong so far and I feel like tonally he is just very town, more so than Menalque

I haven’t played with Mena!scum, is his meta pretty distinct? Expand on what broken scum tonality means?

[Dannflor]

If I'm an inevitable lynch I'd rather be lynched today

The fire wagon is really icky right now

[Dannflor]

I feel like countering whatever iconeum says is scummy about me, but the only things I found was him saying I was shading him, which is buzzwords for "he scumreads me", and a thing about my push on him was because I thought he was a more realistic lynch than gamma emerald, which makes me go ???? does he townread gamma now? did I miss something there. I am lazy someone tell me if he townreads gamma because that is only way that line of logic makes sense of why I would push him over gamma in his mind.

anyways, yeah that's pretty much not true, I scumread iconeum more than gamma because I think my mind is way closer to iconeum conf scum by the way he has acted in this game than gamma.

My points on gamma are:
> Absent minded towards game and eternally in catchup
> No real discernable scumreads
> He questions things and isn't really interested in answers

and my feeling on those are like only one of them hard tells me that is a good scum indication, but even then I am like....eh maybe it isn't that good.

My reasoning on iconeum:
> eternally locked out of game and playing catchup
> no reason to be apathetic given the recent scum lynch, but is playing as though he is.
> interactions with players don't make sense in a general kind of way of solving.
> he could be playing to the crowd, I see that in general ways like just this page he is agreeing with alisae on 'scum theatre' when that isn't even scum theatre.
> and yeah heavy on the never mentioning engaging with penguin except to call him town, and nothing when he got voted by penguin. With a iso as empty as penguin, if I was iconeum, I would be heavy looking into that and iconeum been very reactionary with my vote. So that's a huge red flag.

SO yeah, I am more sure on iconeum.

Anyone hve questions?

I agree with all your Ico points

Gamma, your points are somewhat true but they apply just as much to town!Gamma. And tonally I think he's much better than any of my lower reads. I'd also disagree he isn't really interested in the answers. I think /what/ he questions is sometimes silly but he doesn't drop his questioning until he gets his answers. It's not like he's asking questions and then just fine if they get ignored or lost into the thread to fill space.

Also I don't understand where Ico's scum reads come from except he follows whatever will look good for Ali

[Dannflor]

uhhh I thought I saw something about it but didn’t know how hard it was, I’ve skimmed most of the day

Gamma I haven’t read wrong so far and I feel like tonally he is just very town, more so than Menalque

I haven’t played with Mena!scum, is his meta pretty distinct? Expand on what broken scum tonality means?

I ctrl + F fire and didn't see anything for him in ur post at all

he's town

the wagon on him has like at least 2 scum right now which I think should be a red flag

none of the governer fruit shit ever happens if Fire is scum

I feel scum have been playing this carefully since the LLD lynch D1, the brazen act of Fire that practically begs for another policy lynch ala DGB is really risky

I doubt Pine would allow that to happen even if that was what fire!scum would do. I also find his continued obstinate about protecting his own town reads and not really wanting to work with anyone to read as stubborn town a lot more than scum deliberately trying to force an unhealthy game state. If that's what scum wanted to, there are other ways to do that and they aren't as blatant I think

[Dannflor]

Yeah Menalque is town

I don't think Pine sends that message to scum and no offense but based off his play so far this game I don't think Mena can fake this

[Dannflor]

I think Gamma is prob spewed pine here.

Dann, if you were probably the lynch anyway, in a world where you're town, why would pine try to get me to lead a counter wagon to you?

I think even if Pine didn't think you were gonna out the message, he at least accounted for the possibility you would.

I'm town, and with Ali's read locked, I think I'm dying inevitably. It probably doesn't matter to him whether it's today or tomorrow. If he can get another mislynch like Fire done first? It might just win him the game

[Dannflor]

Like I said, I lightly think that this spews gamma town for going after the pb case and then starting to worry about me abandoning it. Icon hopping onto what I thought was a fairly poor case is concerning. Ducky voicing support for it is the main thing that worries me and I really want him to talk about why he said that he'd prefer (or whatever exactly it was he said) an fb lynch to a dann lynch.

Dann -> Cephir -> Firebringer

sound good?

Literally could not pick 3 worse lynches

No one has offered me one solitary reason to think dann is scum. Why are you pushing it? Can you not ignore me just because you think I'm scum? You need to give me the opportunity to show you otherwise because we are not in a good enough spot to just lynch whoever.

D4 ICONEUM PUSH BAD

IM SORRY

[Dannflor]

@Jingle,

could the fruits be exclusively bargained via PM? Or must the bargains be public

[Dannflor]

@Jingle,

could the fruits be exclusively bargained via PM? Or must the bargains be public

Why would you want to bargain with scum privately?

I'm wondering if the Mena/Pine deal could've gone through completely under cover

[Dannflor]

I agree Wooper is unlikely. But I'd still like him to elaborate more on what it was that made him shift his opinion to fb being the best lynch and how much of that was my case and why. I don't think he should be lynched until lylo, and probably not at all. But if he is in lylo, then I think it's something that needs to be considered as possible.

After Vengeful Ghosts I'm not going to fall into the trap of questioning a doctor inno

I think it's foolish for Pine to no kill and move the game out of LyLo

[Dannflor]

@Jingle,

could the fruits be exclusively bargained via PM? Or must the bargains be public

I asked this and he said he couldn't clarify.

Me: jingle can you confirm here that this would be mechanically permitted? i.e. the offer of fruit here is something allowed without bargaining in game?

jingle: I cannot.

Me: can you confirm that it would not be permitted? as in, explicitly runs against the way fruit works in the game

jingle: I cannot.

Me: You know, I had a feeling you'd say that

also, just ftr between a player and a mod, I'm not actually going for it

I'm gonna pretend that I'm going for it to see who backs my push or (as I suspect is pine's idea) tries to argue that my push is scummy and comes after me, then out the message to Ali

jingle: I cannot.

I really like this coming up organically

another reason for Mena town unless you think we're scum buddies who just coordinated that

[Dannflor]

VOTE: Iconeum

[Dannflor]

dannyboi i would like u to join the fire empire as an honorary member and serve as an advisor on the war council against alisae.

do i get a cool title

[Dannflor]

dannyboi i would like u to join the fire empire as an honorary member and serve as an advisor on the war council against alisae.

do i get a cool title

i think ur current title as "the deepwolf" is too cool to surpass already.

i will serve ur cause master fire

[Dannflor]

Something_smart seems to be a neutral Switzerland so maybe we don't have to deal with him.

perhaps we can entice him with cookies

[Dannflor]

No.

no one is asking for your opinion!

ahem

fire what is your opinion

[Dannflor]

then lynch me already oh my god

[Dannflor]

the empire did nothing wrong

[Dannflor]

bye fire

[Dannflor]

i rlly wish you'd lynched me today

[Dannflor]

bye fire

u are the new leader of the fire empire. Bring everlasting glory to it the deepwolf.

I shall miss u too

it wont be the same without u

[Dannflor]

woooo

[Dannflor]

Hilariously I'm actually nervous dann is the game losing mislynch but he'll probably end up living as late in this game as possible I'm so sorry dann

dude it's fine man

I don't blame anyone but myself

if my death loses the game then so be it

it's only rlly gonna feel bad if I die before slots like Ceph

or Ico WHO I STILL THINK IS SCUM

[Dannflor]

Also wooper, we already established that scum was super okay with bussing LLD.
MariaR, Krazy, Dann, GE, all voters on that wagon (from memory)
Why would Icon decide to defend LLD. He’s the odd-man out in this situation.

I think it's rare a scum team all takes the exact same stance. Unless the situation really calls for, generally a scum team that large can have players all over the different sides of a wagon/issue.

[Dannflor]

Neither of us shall fall. The walls are closing in on u alisae.

VOTE: Fire
I don’t like the way this feels

Gamma were you town or scum reading Fire here?

What is your top scum read right now, if you even have one?

[Dannflor]

Idunno u tell me
If u knew u were going to lose the game, would you want to lose it on D7, or D10?

We don’t know we’re going to lose though
It feels like you’ve given up which makes me super angry. I recently finished a game where I fought rather hard to not get screwed by bad timing.

Hey Gamma, this probably isn't a productive use of the thread, sorry

focus on your own play and doing some sorting of your own if you're town

[Dannflor]

Also wooper, we already established that scum was super okay with bussing LLD.
MariaR, Krazy, Dann, GE, all voters on that wagon (from memory)
Why would Icon decide to defend LLD. He’s the odd-man out in this situation.

I think it's rare a scum team all takes the exact same stance. Unless the situation really calls for, generally a scum team that large can have players all over the different sides of a wagon/issue.

You are also scum

you can ignore me posts like you said you would instead of spamming the thread thank you

[Dannflor]

if icon is scum he was probably hoping to swing a wagon over lld but his townread of her was pretty ineffectual and the chennwagon remained vanity. not sure he was trying anything fancy here; i'm not sure scum!icon wouldn't have just voted one of the established wagons. regardless; opening lld wagon is insanely pure and i think if ico/lld is a thing krazzy actually was probably town ;s

The one point for town!Ico here is that his presence was so low that I can't believe he actually thought he'd have any sort of affect on the LLD wagon. Striking out on his own is ballsy.

[Dannflor]

Also wooper, we already established that scum was super okay with bussing LLD.
MariaR, Krazy, Dann, GE, all voters on that wagon (from memory)
Why would Icon decide to defend LLD. He’s the odd-man out in this situation.

I think it's rare a scum team all takes the exact same stance. Unless the situation really calls for, generally a scum team that large can have players all over the different sides of a wagon/issue.

You are also scum

you can ignore me posts like you said you would instead of spamming the thread thank you

I feel like its important to remind people

I can put "btw Alisae thinks I'm scum" on the end of each one of my posts if that'd make you feel better

btw Alisae thinks I'm scum

[Dannflor]

Current top scumread is PB

Why?

[Dannflor]

11104 i don't knowwww if i have any feelingssss about thissss

It can be written off as NAI either way but also works as a form of PR fishing for a portion of the setup the scum team would be greatly interested in

or just derpy!town but I feel like it's a stretch to read all of Ico as derpy!town

[Dannflor]

Current top scumread is PB

Why?

The case on him looked solid, his response looked too well timed, and the drop of pressure on him didn’t seem natural.

Who did the case on him? I didn't read most of yesterday.

These are all reasons outside of his actual play. What about his play do you find scummy?

[Dannflor]

Current top scumread is PB

Why?

The case on him looked solid, his response looked too well timed, and the drop of pressure on him didn’t seem natural.

Who did the case on him? I didn't read most of yesterday.

These are all reasons outside of his actual play. What about his play do you find scummy?

Menalque. And do you want me to summarize the case or write my own thoughts?

I want to hear it from you, either what part of the case stood out to you or what part of PB's play has

just saying "the case on him was good" kind of shifts responsibility for the read to Menalque

[Dannflor]

and the drop of pressure on him didn’t seem natural.

also going back to look, the only one pushing PB seemed to be Mena??

What about the switch away from PB looking unnatural? And what does that even mean? Like do you think Mena and PB are partners?

why would this be scum indicative

[Dannflor]

Now I’m gonna have to go soon so don’t fuck the game up ffs

yo next time you're in here please do something that's not whining at Ali thank you

I feel like getting content out of you here is like pulling teeth

[Dannflor]

and the drop of pressure on him didn’t seem natural.

also going back to look, the only one pushing PB seemed to be Mena??

What about the switch away from PB looking unnatural? And what does that even mean? Like do you think Mena and PB are partners?

why would this be scum indicative

Yes I do think Mena and PB are partners. It looks completely choreographed.

You think the whole Menalque/Pine debacle was staged?

[Dannflor]

The one point for town!Ico here is that his presence was so low that I can't believe he actually thought he'd have any sort of affect on the LLD wagon. Striking out on his own is ballsy.

it's a point. I considered the vote somewhat towny on reread until I realised he vanitywagonsits Chenn who he cased in extremely bad faith while defending LLD and refusing to check that read. it's not sitting right rn.

yeah...

I'd consider it townier if the vote had been someone with a less LHF status

[Dannflor]

Gamma!

Please stop arguing with Alisae! It's not going to make this game easier! What can make this game easier is you focusing on playing it!

Thank you!

[Dannflor]

Yes

why? like do you have reasons aside from a gut "it feels fake" read?

I thought it town spewed Mena

I'd be really impressed if he was capable of faking/coordinating that

[Dannflor]

Danny~ Gammy~ if town is about to fall off a cliff we need you guys to save us!

I'm gonna sleep now so I don't die but if the poe team including both of you is wrong we need to lean on you guys a little. no offense but everyone has leaned on Ali quite a lot. this is a heavy load, we can share it around better than we have been.

(self included)

this game isn't lost for town yet and we can still pretty easily salvage it. just help. please please pleaseeee

I do want to win this game

I have an interview to go to now but I'll be back this afternoon to try and sort some stuff out

Kinda resetting my reads at this point because LyLo and I feel like over 500+ pages this game HAS to be solvable

[Dannflor]

Let's get
KRAZY KRAZY KRAZY WHEN WE HIT THE SCUM

I should probably just stick to my gut on Krazy

VOTE: Krazy

VOTE: krazzy

LET'S GET KRAZY KRAZY KRAZY TILL WE LYNCH THE SCUM

UNVOTE: Krazy

This day was exhausting, I'm not having fun anymore. Sorry.

hi, opinions on whether this is w/w?

I feel like it'd be a really weird way to bus and then suddenly drop it

[Dannflor]

although I don't really get #6822 given the context

[Dannflor]

Ceph, reads on Gamma and PB?

[Dannflor]

How much of the game have you read?

[Dannflor]

Your slot became widely scum read based off your predecessor, I don’t know if it super has a lot to do with you

The biggest ? I have with you (not your slot in general) since you came into the game is the 180 read on me. Now, I know you ISO’d me or whatever but why have you given such little credence to your predecessor’s biggest tunnel? I know you read at least part of the tunnel that lead up to his replace out

you think Krazy was that confident in a scum read on town?

[Dannflor]

is everyone online?

I just got home but it'll be a couple hours before I can play

[Dannflor]

what does lhf even mean

low hanging fruit

easy to lynch

[Dannflor]

Ceph is AtEing

how do you expect people to respond when you tell them they're garbage

don't think you're garbage at all. actually I've stopped myself on your slot several more times since your rep. this might sound a bit like, impersonal but we need to solve your alignment not how good or garbage you are..AtEing makes that a stack harder

yeah agree with this

I think I'd be town reading the Ceph slot alone but the existence of Krazy means I have to be very careful in sorting this slot

[Dannflor]

im surprised it's the guy who hated my predecessor's guts who's giving me the time of day

honestly, i don't really care what my predecessor thought. sure, i know his push came from town, but the part of it i read didn't seem grounded in logic.

town aligned players are deeply wrong all the time! surely you know this. the inability of town to reevaluate is a huge flaw that contributes to probably a majority of scum wins (including this one). i think part of the power of lategame town replacements is that we're less tainted by having been in the game and can see more clearly at times than someone who's been enduring the drudgery for a long time. they get tired. apparently tired enough to replace out in this case!

also about this

I did not hate Krazy's guts. I quite like Krazy and tried as hard as I could to engage him in good faith this game. Maybe I didn't always succeed.

your paragraph about towns needing to reevaluate sounds nice, but that's all

less whining about people shutting you down and more trying to solve regardless of that plz and ty

[Dannflor]

Speaking as someone who has been scum read by Ali for a while now

Eir not the person you have to solve or honestly show your alignment to

If you want people to reevaluate your slot then your efforts will be best spent interacting with the non ICs of the game

[Dannflor]

I've run out of motivation to solve this game anyway

VOTE: Gamma

[Dannflor]

oh that seems bad

[Dannflor]

god i hate when you're "'':""town"" who ""accidentally"""" participates in a scum quickhammer he he right dann

this is just such an unfortunate game for me rlly

[Dannflor]

Sorry guys didn't mean to quickhammer, it's all Dann's fault I think

i think it's cephrir's fault?

[Dannflor]

im sorry duck dont hate me

[Dannflor]

FIRE EMPIRE WITH DANNYBOI WINS!!!!

YEA BOI

[Dannflor]

There are only two things I'd like to talk about in postgame.

One, the setup, which I would like to see in its entirety, because Pine somehow insisted that town had resources that I sure as hell never saw.

And two.

WHO

DID

ANKAMIUS

TARGET???

dude it was obviously me lol

[Dannflor]

why am i listed 4 times

[Dannflor]

It would have been so easy to work something like "I'll be at your house tonight" in.

she said she was coming over to watch movies

idk

[Dannflor]

gg everyone love my scum team

special shoutout to Krazy and LLD

sorry to town and duck and Ank especially

I feel bad for rolling scum against all you lovely ppl

fire team wins

[Dannflor]

sorry to town and duck and Ank especially

also pops I feel like I tried to pocket you plz forgive me

[Dannflor]

she said she was coming over to watch movies

She actually didn't, she avoided the phrasing of saying she was "coming over" which would have been so easy to say inconspicuously and so obvious in retrospect...

Like, come on. The hider was the only thing even approaching investigative power we had.

ah

yeah if it was clear enough I would not have survived till end game I guess

[Dannflor]

What were your roles/factional powers?

jailkeeper + visitor

[Dannflor]

How mad was Ank that I didn't get lynched

[Dannflor]

I mostly just feel really sad

Gonna take a lil break from here I think

im sorry Menalque

If it's any consolation I think you played well

just very hard game I think, I would have hated to be town in it

[Dannflor]

Wait Wooper wasn't an investigative???

[Dannflor]

yay now time to get yelled at by people wooooooot

how dare you accurately accuse me of being scum and see through my theater with Dann!

wait that was theater?

[Dannflor]

I feel like the message mechanic is somewhat town sided

[Dannflor]

oops sorry ank

[Dannflor]

Third, inviting Dannflor. DANNFLOR, WHY HAVE YOU FORSAKEN ME!

draft me next time?

[Dannflor]

I just got messages about fast night

I don't think scum team ever wanted a fast night

[Dannflor]

Pops, what was your mechanical incentive for thinking the worst was town?

[Dannflor]

thanks for modding jingle

gg all

[Dannflor]

fuck you Dannflor for surviving against all odds! XD

i thought i was doomed at several points tbh