Smoke-Filled Antechamber [Endgame]

[fferyllt]

Greetings, Gentlebeings!

[fferyllt]

Townblock application line is here in my circular file.. or firing squad?

If you're town, I really need to know it within 4 pages. I'm deathly afraid how things might go otherwise.

[fferyllt]

Townblock application line is here in my circular file.. or firing squad?

If you're town, I really need to know it within 4 pages. I'm deathly afraid how things might go otherwise.

You will literally never have to worry about that this game.

Because you're nightkilling me. amirite?

[fferyllt]

I have a "get out of this game before endgame if it becomes a toxic hellhole" coupon, ffery. Be jealous. Be very jealous.

That does incite a little envy!

[fferyllt]

I have a "get out of this game before endgame if it becomes a toxic hellhole" coupon, ffery. Be jealous. Be very jealous.

That does incite a little envy!

It's name is "Ffery's day three freakout" and it's a 100% guarantee.

This suggests you know the colors of my rolecard.

[fferyllt]

I have a "get out of this game before endgame if it becomes a toxic hellhole" coupon, ffery. Be jealous. Be very jealous.

That does incite a little envy!

It's name is "Ffery's day three freakout" and it's a 100% guarantee.

This suggests you know the colors of my rolecard.

It's purple, right?

Sharp question.

Blue and red.

Anyone who can read the OP knows that.

[fferyllt]

I have a "get out of this game before endgame if it becomes a toxic hellhole" coupon, ffery. Be jealous. Be very jealous.

That does incite a little envy!

It's name is "Ffery's day three freakout" and it's a 100% guarantee.

This suggests you know the colors of my rolecard.

No riposte?

[fferyllt]

I have a "get out of this game before endgame if it becomes a toxic hellhole" coupon, ffery. Be jealous. Be very jealous.

That does incite a little envy!

It's name is "Ffery's day three freakout" and it's a 100% guarantee.

This suggests you know the colors of my rolecard.

No riposte?

Firstly I have no need to and secondly I am currently food telling

169 reasons would be more comforting, but I get what I get, I guess.

[fferyllt]

It was an unsubtle request for spicy cakes.

Also, also, FF we can be town block buddies if you have a secret code to share.

If you, Cabd, petapan and Syr are all town and can make me believe it this will be the best game ever.

[fferyllt]

I'm not fond of that type of pizza.

Noted!

[fferyllt]

much like day 0 i am not outside my scum range

Are you outside RVS?

[fferyllt]

I'm not fond of that type of pizza.

Noted!

Now. Why me before Syr?

You're scarier. And you're around! I feel like I'll know pretty quickly if Syr's town. He and I have some of the same weaknesses as scum, especially interacting with each other.

[fferyllt]

Alright I'm done tbh I only joined cuz I wanted to play with Syr again but I'm not sure if I should have considering I kinda wanna marathon the rest of the series but I joined the game so I'll play it.

Ima read up

Good enough for me
VOTE: Alisae

Hai gaiz
-f

OH HERE YOU ARE. WHERE'S MY DAMN MASONRY?

[fferyllt]

FUCKIN HELL FFERY I JUST GOT HERE

DON'T MAKE ME BREAK OUT THE BIG GIFS

2 POSTS! IT TOOK 2 POSTS, DUDE. WTF IS GOING ON HERE?

Yo, midway, you want to hash out whatever is in your paw?

Uh why did you claim part of your role and call SS partner. You don't seem like the type of town player to openwolf start of game.

Oh you sweet summer child.

[fferyllt]

Pooky did a roleplay act in micro 935 as Tracer Bullet. He was scum. I'm not saying that it translates to this game, but sometimes I think people townread people who do what pooky is doing. Hopefully he just stops doing it asap

Good to know. Me. I'm one of those people that townread things like that early. Mostly because I love it when people role play and it makes me smile and I town read people who make me laugh.

Porkins amirite?

[fferyllt]

It was an unsubtle request for spicy cakes.

Also, also, FF we can be town block buddies if you have a secret code to share.

Do you really need a secret code? We don't have nearly enough games together to speak a robust language of meta metaphors. I was named an infomancer once. You're an actual meta bro.

[fferyllt]

I have three town reads already. Woo.

Page 7. I should hope so.

[fferyllt]

Pooky did a roleplay act in micro 935 as Tracer Bullet. He was scum. I'm not saying that it translates to this game, but sometimes I think people townread people who do what pooky is doing. Hopefully he just stops doing it asap

Good to know. Me. I'm one of those people that townread things like that early. Mostly because I love it when people role play and it makes me smile and I town read people who make me laugh.

Porkins amirite?

Yeah! That was awesome. I don't remember the game, but I remember the role play.

Maplewood. Something like that.

Cabd, I remember early in that game (page 1 or 2) you said you had figured out how you thought I would interact with you in my first scum game back on site and that's exactly how I'd opened in that game. We know how good that prediction was.

Did you have expectations here?

[fferyllt]

nah because the bear's town

Spoiler: People Town Reading Archer Masonry PT

Hi!

Spoiler: PTRAMPT

Subscribing

[fferyllt]

nah because the bear's town

Spoiler: People Town Reading Archer Masonry PT

Hi!

Spoiler: People Town Reading Archer Masonry PT

Pop Quiz, who are my other town reads and why?

Spoiler:

Me. ~reasons~

[fferyllt]

nah because the bear's town

Spoiler: People Town Reading Archer Masonry PT

Hi!

Spoiler: People Town Reading Archer Masonry PT

Pop Quiz, who are my other town reads and why?

Spoiler:

Me. ~reasons~

Did you and Syr end up in a black hole? Or are you moon gazing with blue balls?

It's dark, but I think I'll be ok.

[fferyllt]

This needs to go. The amount of absolutely nothing you're adding is, as the kids say, whack.

So many LHF in this game darn. I'd say give him a day or two to do stuff before arriving at this vote though.

Fucking seriously. We could start a jam factory with how much there is.

Like I get this is sorta still RVS/shitposting stage, but

come on

You seem pretty worked up.

[fferyllt]

This lack of genuine conversation just makes it hard to find a solid tell on people.

Not everyone has been roleplaying and doing stuff like that
Any thoughts on the dynamic between Cabd, fferylt, Tammy, and Syryana or is it similarly unreadable to you like the roleplay? Also, let me know what you think about SirCakez

I'm surprised you're not curious about what Bell or S_S thinks about us.

[fferyllt]

Last time I swear.

Anyways, I’m annoyed, true, but not really worked up. This lack of genuine conversation just makes it hard to find a solid tell on people.

Be the change you want to see in the thread. Got a question for me?

[fferyllt]

I’m trying to engage with DS not Bell or SS

<3

[fferyllt]

I’m trying to engage with DS not Bell or SS

<3

You should be mad I beat you to it.

You're still missing a guess.

I'm wondering if you can read Bell.

Do you think I'm right about Syr?

[fferyllt]

Last time I swear.

Anyways, I’m annoyed, true, but not really worked up. This lack of genuine conversation just makes it hard to find a solid tell on people.

Be the change you want to see in the thread. Got a question for me?

i do! what color would you say your hair is?

Dark brown with sick bride of frankenstein stripes.

[fferyllt]

This lack of genuine conversation just makes it hard to find a solid tell on people.

Not everyone has been roleplaying and doing stuff like that
Any thoughts on the dynamic between Cabd, fferylt, Tammy, and Syryana or is it similarly unreadable to you like the roleplay? Also, let me know what you think about SirCakez

Aight, so I've played a couple games with Cabd and fferylt so I'll start with them.

This reads heavily like town fferylt. It's hard to explain, but the general demeanor has a lot of direction that kinda lacks in her scumgame.
Cabd is a null!scum read. It really reads as if he's begging for validation from other folks in the crowd, specifically Tammy, but that's not as hard of a read on Cabd as it is with some others.

Tammy equally reads null!scum, but I'm not sure if I like these two together. For someone as experienced as them, they're giving a whole lot of half-assed content. Plus, they've interacted really poorly with you and fferylt (for the record, I've got you as a null!town rn, but we'll see). But back to what I originally touched on, I don't think that Cabd+Tammy is scum theater. That's the only strong read I have rn in this pair.

Syryana reads a decent null!town rn. Her reaction to your engagement sounded natural, but beyond that there's not much else. A lot of posts that had a lot of words, but didn't really

say

anything.

PEdit: Holy shit a lot of posts while I was digging through. Umm, yeah, fferylt, my main question is what are your reads on some of the lesser posted people (so not the other 3 in the quad above, and not midway)

Aside from snap-reads on players I know pretty well, I don't have much yet.

I don't think you've ever played against scum-me so I'm curious that your townread is that strong. I'm thinking back on the Perpetual Mylo game that I modded a while back as a sord of yardstick to measure against your play here.

I like that Bell did a quick reach-out to me, but I'm kinda meh in terms of follow-up.

I'm also kinda meh about petapan and that saddens me.

I've seen s_s do a couple things that look like decent town maintenance and from that one time I meta'd him that's more of an attribute of his town game.

These are mostly not reads. They're sort of proto-reads - the first building blocks. There is noise in the thread, and for now I'm not trying to sort the players in the middle of those swirls.

[fferyllt]

hydra with you and Titus

This ain't never going to be a thing.

[fferyllt]

I know that gut.

What's going on, Bell?

[fferyllt]

You should go to sleep, too then.

So should I.

[fferyllt]

VOTE: DS

Voting for my pocket scumread.

I like this.

[fferyllt]

That wasn't Nacho's tell and I doubt he introduced it to MS.

[fferyllt]

Halfway there. Challenge accepted.

Cabd or petapan?

Yes

Cheeky.

So are we townblocing or no?

[fferyllt]

Halfway there. Challenge accepted.

Cabd or petapan?

Yes

Cheeky.

So are we townblocing or no?

You didn't dream me voting there, you know.

Stop consorting with the enemy.

Did I ask you for a dance?

I didn't think so.

[fferyllt]

Voting for my pocket scumread.

Nooo why do you scumread him?

The griping about RVS looked a little overdone.

[fferyllt]

Did I ask you for a dance?

Uh, yes?

I'm wondering if you can read Bell.

And what I got back was no real help in that regard so I'm on my own here. I mean, I see why you're voting him. I think we've sketched in different landscapes around his play. I want to see if mine makes any sense.

[fferyllt]

The griping about RVS looked a little overdone.

How was it different from my own? That's probably the main reason I'm townreading him right now btw

You were working on stuff proactively. I felt like DS had to be pushed a little to get beyond complaining and into doing stuff about it. I liked his question to me, but his reason for townreading me really had no basis. We've played one game together and I think it was probably in 2016. He was scum and I was town (and in a hydra).

On another note do you remember how you and Lancer/Chara "scumread" me early in the FGO game. Any thoughts about the players expressing dislike of some of my posts here?

[fferyllt]

Fine. Just know that if this is a case where I've lost two, and we're down to only 167 reasons now, that I told you so.

Pizza fixes many things in life.

[fferyllt]

Do I need a reason to townread folks beyond “what they do sounds town”? I was wrong about having seen your scumgame (I swore I’d played with you more than once but I guess not. Your name just stood out to me on the list), but I still do think that what you’ve said sounds genuine and town.

I feel blandished. I dunno. Of the oldtimers I probably am easier to read, but people who don't know me tend to get it wrong at least for a while. Telling you you're giving me too easy a townread is for your sake if you're town, not mine.

The bigger issue I had was the RVS irritability. You might come off better on reread than my in-the-moment reactions to your posts. We'll see, I guess.

[fferyllt]

Fine. Just know that if this is a case where I've lost two, and we're down to only 167 reasons now, that I told you so.

Pizza fixes many things in life.

....I suddenly have a lot of thoughts about this setup.

We're going to need to go even another layer deeper to be able to talk about it.

But it's urgent.

Let's see how far we can get, Dathon.

[fferyllt]

Fine. Just know that if this is a case where I've lost two, and we're down to only 167 reasons now, that I told you so.

Pizza fixes many things in life.

....I suddenly have a lot of thoughts about this setup.

We're going to need to go even another layer deeper to be able to talk about it.

But it's urgent.

Let's see how far we can get, Dathon.

You know that thing Andy collects as games go onwards that he love-hates? I think he's going to get a LOT of them quickly. VERY quickly.

That wouldn't surprise me. If I'm at the right level of depth, then it's safe to say that in moderation, I'll be in love.

[fferyllt]

...Fuck

Hm.

Maybe I misunderstood. What I thought you meant about Andy's love/hate wasn't exactly seismic.

[fferyllt]

It's not an in-thread-masons level read, but I like him for town.

[fferyllt]

Cabd.

[fferyllt]

DS kinda LHF here

what makes you come to that conclusion exactly

the games I've played with him before
also the fact he went against the nostalgia-y grain of the thread with his entrance makes him an easy target to pick on

I like this post.

[fferyllt]

A somewhat leisurely lunch would be good. More to say about Syr?

If I've missed something seismic, try again?

[fferyllt]

I had 3 heart attacks, plus a couple false alarms during that timeframe.

It was a combo. 23, 32 (I pushed back because I wanted to see something more). 66 was the moment your av hit the bin.

It's possible I was conversing with an imaginary Cabd I made up in my head, but nothing since 66 has made me want to question my sanity and go cry myself to sleep.

[fferyllt]

That game.

Pretty sure I've gotten at least a little better as scum since then.

[fferyllt]

so i wont have time to catch up until later tonight, but here's some content to read me on

i maintain 33 is a bad look. that kind of perspective-discerning logic always reads super ingenuine to me, and while it can come from town, i think scum are likely to throw it out because it's one of those "technically correct" points. that said, obviously there's a lot more content from that slot with which to read now, so my read may well change

didnt really get anything from peta's vote on me or the subsequent reactions, at least at first glance.

I get a sense of conviction from this post that I like.

However, it bothers me that neither you nor the other 2 players who don't like some of my early posts have directly engaged me.

mine
(How does one pronounce fferyllt)

^^ This is not direct engagement with a scumread.

It's ffer IHLT. Emphasis on the second syllable.

I answer to pretty much anything that looks vaguely like my user name.

[fferyllt]

That's underwhelming. I was spoiling for a good argument.

[fferyllt]

we can argue about something else
like the economic value of low-supply high-demand yeast in the pandemic economy

Yeast grows naturally out in the fields on wheat and other grains. There's no need to buy yeast at all if you have the minimal patience needed to be a microbe rancher.

[fferyllt]

But that has an opportunity cost of time of growing microbes + time of finding the land to grow grains on and/or the monetary cost of getting access to said land
Does that outweigh the convenience of grocery-store yeast?

If all that were involved, maybe.

Any old sack of flour contains yeast. And lactobacillus floats around in your kitchen. Water, flour, a warmish place in the kitchen, some benign neglect, and stand back, you're a microbe rancher.

Also, the bread is far superior in taste to bread made with commercial yeast.

[fferyllt]

But that has an opportunity cost of time of growing microbes + time of finding the land to grow grains on and/or the monetary cost of getting access to said land
Does that outweigh the convenience of grocery-store yeast?

If all that were involved, maybe.

Any old sack of flour contains yeast. And lactobacillus floats around in your kitchen. Water, flour, a warmish place in the kitchen, some benign neglect, and stand back, you're a microbe rancher.

Also, the bread is far superior in taste to bread made with commercial yeast.

But not everyone has the space and conditions to do this. You need certain humidity levels + certain warmth levels + levels of yeast in your air. It's not just a given that the correct microbes are in your kitchen.
This bread does taste better but it's much trickier to pull off. Your average bread baker is not gonna be able to pull this off and won't have the interest in doing so.
You could counterargue this with people are trying new things because of spare time in quarantine but that's not really holding true anymore, people have gotten apathetic and moved on.

You don't need yeast in your air. The kinds of yeast that eat wheat are in your bag of flour. Humidity doesn't really factor in. Dampen a towel and throw it over the starter/dough. Worst case, a completely acceptable temperature can be obtained by turning the light on in your oven if it's too cold everywhere else in your kitchen. I have a friend in Nebraska who wakes up his starter with the oven light.

I guess it's a lifestyle that not everybody would want to adopt. I don't really get why someone would go to the effort of making all their own bread and yet not dabble with sourdough, though. There's plenty of decent bread on store shelves where I live. There was a time this spring when it wasn't easy to buy flour because everybody was into bread baking there for a while. I'm guessing that's when commercial yeast was scarce, too.

[fferyllt]

I'm looking at this source-wise: https://www.theverge.com/2020/3/31/2119 ... self-bread
This yeast also doesn't work for many types of bread

Possibly of interest: viewtopic.php?f=50&t=73915, iso me.

[fferyllt]

I find it somewhat weird that two players choose to have a completely unrelated conversation while ignoring the rest of the thread. I suppose the fact that they BOTH choose to be like this goes against my initial thoughts though. I guess I'll look at this as NAI, but it's just a bit off ya feel?

What did I miss while talking about bread?

[fferyllt]

I townread him before that
Now he is henceforth known as Yeasty Boi

So did I! Or I wouldn't have talked boulangerie with him.

[fferyllt]

preemptive: FOOD TELL!

[fferyllt]

I'm not fond of that type of pizza.

Noted!

Now. Why me before Syr?

You're scarier. And you're around! I feel like I'll know pretty quickly if Syr's town. He and I have some of the same weaknesses as scum, especially interacting with each other.

This post stands out to me. Are you holding your cards close to your chest here until you get a read or would you care to elaborate?

Nah, my read was pretty well town on page 3. In this post, Cabd is wanting to know why I made reading him a priority over Syr (who I consider to be a much easier player to read. Syr and I have some similar weaknesses as scum and I suspect the next time one of us draws scum against the other, it's going to reaaaally apparent reaaaaaally quickly). After getting completely snowed in a couple games where Cabd was scum, I was paranoid as hell about playing with him. I've gotten better at reading him and we have a huge vocabulary of game-metaphors that we often use to speculate together, publicly but very obscurely, on game stuff. I'm townreading him, and I presume he's townreading me (or is trying to mislead the hell out of me! But I don't think so...). We've also just shot the shit trolling each other and some other players who were in the game about a recent game several of us played and Cabd modded.

But the real reason Cabd was my priority was because Cabd was here at the start and Syr wasn't.

[fferyllt]

Jake just needs time and pizza.

Bell needs an exorcism.

Not even comparable.

I get this.

I'm just not on board atm. His yesterday sounded pretty hellish.

[fferyllt]

I feel so much better today, yet still tired.

Anyway, I think I want to town block FF. I think you would actually be a terrible town block buddy as scum. So that should make things easier.

@Petapan:

What does town blocking mean to you?

[fferyllt]

Jake just needs time and pizza.

Bell needs an exorcism.

Not even comparable.

I get this.

I'm just not on board atm. His yesterday sounded pretty hellish.

Did I miss context?

Up all night stressing and then a 9 hour medical certification* class?

*I think

[fferyllt]

lets solve this game

Correct@ FF.
To me, town blocking is just another word for working together and sharing thoughts on who's scum/town in a more relaxed setting/communication style. There's a layer of friendliness that usually isn't present. Kind of like what you and Cabd don't have yet, while SYR and you in that neighborhood did. It's not just hunting though it's sort of just a positive, hey we're in this together vibe that I don't think you'd be able to fake easily given what you act like when you actually think someone else is town.

If Cabd and I were in a neighborhood, our convos would be a lot easier! And my regularly scheduled paranoid freakout might happen considerably earlier than day 3. But, this is about as friendly as we get when we're not sharing a role PM. Which is QUITE friendly compared to when I'm actively suspicious of him. That's the kind of mafia friendship we have.

Syr neighborizing me on day 1 was an incredible leap of faith. We didn't talk about it in detail in the neighborhood, but the last time he neighborized me, he was a dead neighborizer and I/Morph was scum. I had to spend an entire game day in a neighborhood with Syr and Nacho, keeping their townread of me strong somehow while they used our hydra as a conduit for continuing to solve the game. We even had an extra vote that they gave us that game day.

Such a gift after we shot them right through the heart on Night 1. Such guilt I had to hide!

Syr neighborizing me, rather than the actual mod confirmed town, this time in FGO was the most incredibly strong townread I've ever earned from anyone. Or he was scum, finally exacting his revenge. And I knew which world I was living in.

Sorry I confused you about the nature/existence of our neighborhood in FGO!

I'm down to talk reads after or as you catch up.

[fferyllt]

Hi Gamma,
hating your life yet or hating your life yet?

Irl or in game, cos those are very different answers

Just opening up a line. How're you feeling? You said you didn't like the pace of this game, is there anything I could do to help you in that regard?

@FF, that must have taken a lot of will power. But I was worried you would say that you actually had managed that.
I think I want to be in the moment with you and the other players and see what happens.

I would have melted into a puddle of pure terror if I hadn't had Cabd's spine to borrow. I'm a high maintenance hydra partner when we roll scum. And sometimes when we roll town.

[fferyllt]

I'm not sure which quotes to include in the corpus. :/

[fferyllt]

I'm not sure which quotes to include in the corpus. :/

What quotes are you looking for?

Which of Bell's quotes, if any, are relevant to his words.

[fferyllt]

This is part of the reason I feel okay with FF so far.

But I'm not neutral on Cabd.

[fferyllt]

This is part of the reason I feel okay with FF so far.

But I'm not neutral on Cabd.

Go on

Eh, forget it. I'm getting nowhere.

And the fact that this is happening re-assures me we aren't in the doom and gloom scenario at least.


Instead, let's talk about why you are already trusting of me enough to make these moves?


What post did it for you?


(P.S. You owe me a heart attack count)

I had 3 heart attacks, plus a couple false alarms during that timeframe.

It was a combo. 23, 32 (I pushed back because I wanted to see something more). 66 was the moment your av hit the bin.

It's possible I was conversing with an imaginary Cabd I made up in my head, but nothing since 66 has made me want to question my sanity and go cry myself to sleep.

[fferyllt]

You don't seem to be collaborating.

We don't agree on some things. You, for instance. But we are most definitely collaborating.

[fferyllt]

That or the imaginary Cabd in my head is talking to me.

I should get that checked.

[fferyllt]

But I don't need to make people feel good about me this game tbh.

Cabd? Thoughts?

[fferyllt]

You know what would make me happier?

More votes there!


I don't want a 500 page slog day one when we can live in a better world.

I'm fully embracing my vote inertia tendencies until I find a player I want to burn.

[fferyllt]

midway, Cabd, Syryana, give me your rational on why you're voting Bell. His is the biggest wagon and I'm curious why.

Also, we entirely positive they're an alt? Who for?

This is his new main. He's come back to the site after a few years. I played with his former main, Remembrance several times. He was one of my favorite players of that era. He mentioned being Remembrance in one of his prior games.

[fferyllt]

I'm officially not happy with the Bell wagon

[fferyllt]

I'm officially not happy with the Bell wagon

Do you have any better ideas?

If I had someone I want to burn right now, I'd be voting them.

The optimum play as a cop with the master mechanic is not optimum play in a game without that mechanic. I don't have a good read on Bell yet, but your argument doesn't hold water, and petapan jumping on it bugs the hell out of me.

I'd like for Tammy to talk more about petapan's normal play range.

[fferyllt]

This bell wagon really pings me as similar to perpetual mylo's string.

I don't know this reference, can you please enlighten me

More directed at fferylt. But anyways, outa the gate 3 of my scum buddies started immediately hard-bussing me, and I didn't take the fake pressure well, so it really hamstrung us and pretty much lost us the game. Bell is not looking hot at all right now, but that wagon stinks.

Also, I don't have a decent alternative.

Open vs closed setup makes a huge difference, and yeah, your scumteam hardbussing you on day 1 of that game was nooooooot well planned.

[fferyllt]

I'm going to elaborate a little on my 731.

Syr, Cabd and midwaybear have expectations of bell's play, somewhat informed by meta. petapan has much of the most salient meta front and center of his brain, too.

You three come to the same conclusion about Bell's alignment without openly discussing it.

I did not come to that conclusion, and at the point where Syr vocalized the meta, I went on high alert to see what happens next.

petapan happens next. Which means that he didn't reach my conclusion. But, why would he wait until the meta info hit the thread before voting if he was in the "I miss Avenger" camp?

[fferyllt]

Urge to burn rising a little!

[fferyllt]

i actually voted him earlier (354) but got distracted by shiny object gamma emerald

i am liable to move my vote again if i find anther shiny object i like

If you were on that meta train of thought, I'm surprised that shiny object gamma emerald was a distraction.

I hated Gamma's first post with the fires of a thousand suns, and if he'd continued in the vein of punishing noise I'd have yelled HITO'S TELL! at the top of my voice and voted him with extreme prejudice.

That didn't happen, so meh.

[fferyllt]

your posts feel so incredibly monochromatic to me.

[fferyllt]

your posts feel so incredibly monochromatic to me.

it's probably the avatar

The assassin avatar was also monochromatic. Somehow the posts were quite poly-chromatic.

[fferyllt]

assassin is not walking through that door, i'm afraid

I don't expect Assassin in this game after Tammy's comment. I did expect someone more lively.

To be fair, I have liked some of your posts between Gamma's entrance and this Bell vote.

[fferyllt]

...maybe I was being too subtle about my engagement in this game

Yeah. I felt like you made a serious reach-out earlier and then you decided the implied level of cooperation and info exchange wasn't possible for some reason. It feels like you're having trouble finding a comfortable approach in this game. Which does harken back a little to GiF's ancient Touhou game. What was missing there was the the sharp observations, not the relatable, huggable hobbes.

The what's present/what's missing is inverted here. And the missing part would stand scum-Bell in good stead. You could be more incisive, but you're not making much effort at being relatable.

[fferyllt]

I'm not familiar with vosorslash. Thanks for the rundown, though!

You spectated FGO. How do you feel about the split regarding Bell's play here vs there? I know playing a game is very different from watching one unfold, but still. Would like your thoughts.

[fferyllt]

I can't do it
UNVOTE:

I can't not give Bell time and pizza if we're already giving other people I don't love as much time and pizza

Ffery if we had scum!Bell and I let you talk me out of it I'm never letting you hear the end of it

Now i need a new target. Hm. Back later.

I haven't townbinned Bell. I'm leaning a little in that direction, partly because I don't expect Avenger any more than I expect Assassin, and because I liked that he entertained the idea of working with me, and I liked that (it appeared) he put his guard up a little about my (actually Cabd's!) scumgame when I told the tale of the evil neighborhood.

My play's pretty different here, too. The amount of spine I'm feeling while playing on my main is promising! I hope it lasts.

[fferyllt]

That can be sliced so many ways.

[fferyllt]

My time to approach this game will be limited for a few hours, but when I'm back, ffery, we can talk about why I still like my Bell vote, if you'd like.

My weekly dnd thing starts in about 3 hours.

[fferyllt]

My time to approach this game will be limited for a few hours, but when I'm back, ffery, we can talk about why I still like my Bell vote, if you'd like.

My weekly dnd thing starts in about 3 hours.

How many people sit above me a tier or two right now in your eyes? You don't have to tell me who, just how many total, and how many tiers.

My top tier is empty. You're with the rest of the potential candidates for top tier.

[fferyllt]

thank tlaloc you're not putting me in the position of arbiting a fake guilty.

[fferyllt]

Because I would assume it is fake and then go down the rabbit hole of which Cabd does that in a game where I exist.

[fferyllt]

does cabd make those kinds of mistakes as scum?
@cabd,
@ff

Spell out what you think the mistake is?

[fferyllt]

Doesn’t he make those sorts of grammatical mistakes less as scum because of auto filtration or is he pretty loose either way?

His mind in some ways is less convoluted when he's scumming. It comes very naturally to him. (should use past tense, I guess)

I sometimes wince, thinking about the potential clean-up of holes dug when in Morph-town.

[fferyllt]

Not that I have any room to cast asparagus.

[fferyllt]

What was the other time?

[fferyllt]

What was the other time?

Before my mafiascum days.

Back on 6P/Poekgym, don't recall which or who it was any more. MANY many moons ago.

Must not have been waynegg.

[fferyllt]

Did I ever tell you I mentally pronounce it wayne-egg? I don't think I did.

[fferyllt]

@midwaybear, you never stood a chance.

Thanks Cabd, i’m glad you enjoy me as a player. I can’t do anything with that and so I shall ask you what else you got?

I'm super afraid I'm going to end up lost if I'm wrong about you, nothing else has jumped out to me as mafia.

I have plenty of town reads, though.

To answer my own question to ffery; There is at least two tiers above her, and 2 people in it; one each.

I'm winning the meta arms race!

[fferyllt]

Are you? Or are there just people well above you in shining beacon of towniness?

I, being possibly not in the best position to judge, feel that I'm at my personal peak beacon state.

Maybe we can talk reads when I'm done getting beat up by gricks tonight. I'm probably sticking with GiF-style tiers initially.

[fferyllt]

I'm planning to do some Jake metadiving tonight.

[fferyllt]

You guys were busy. I've skimmed the last few pages but I'm going to need to go back through with more brain cells.

I've had a wait and see approach to Nahdia. Haven't played with them in the past, was intrigued by the vote, wanted to see some followthrough.

It's the weekend. I'm patient.

@Cabd was there stuff you wanted to talk about tonight?

[fferyllt]

I'm going to elaborate a little on my 731.

Syr, Cabd and midwaybear have expectations of bell's play, somewhat informed by meta. petapan has much of the most salient meta front and center of his brain, too.

You three come to the same conclusion about Bell's alignment without openly discussing it.

I did not come to that conclusion, and at the point where Syr vocalized the meta, I went on high alert to see what happens next.

petapan happens next. Which means that he didn't reach my conclusion. But, why would he wait until the meta info hit the thread before voting if he was in the "I miss Avenger" camp?

Is this why there is a Bell wagon? Insider meta that was not really shared with the thread? Hmm ok..

Very fresh meta, with a caveat of unusual mechanic, creative design, anon game so not all players were into their usual playstyle, and a fairly dense game to get into because most of the avatars blended together. Some of the players, like Syr and me, came out of retirement to play this game, so there were varying amounts of rust to shake off.

Have at it!

viewtopic.php?f=3&t=84090

Avenger = Bell
Assassin = petapan
Alter Ego = fferyllt
Archer = midwaybear
Rider = Syryana
Mod = Cabd
Spectator = Tammy

[fferyllt]

GiF-style tiers

Do you feel like you have enough data yet?

I'm going to know in a bit!

Do you?

[fferyllt]

Only 19 pages left...

Shhhh Cabd. I am basking. Do you hear that? That’s the sound of people playing mafia.

It's awesome. Shame it took off while I was dnding.

[fferyllt]

GiF-style tiers

Do you feel like you have enough data yet?

I'm going to know in a bit!

Do you?

I have enough for around 5 chapters in my novel.

I have 7 I feel are sortable enough to put in tiers

The rest, I need more data from them, or I need to marinate, reread, meta, something. There's enough data that I feel like I should be able to draw initial conclusions, but I'm not there yet.

[fferyllt]

But that has an opportunity cost of time of growing microbes + time of finding the land to grow grains on and/or the monetary cost of getting access to said land
Does that outweigh the convenience of grocery-store yeast?

If all that were involved, maybe.

Any old sack of flour contains yeast. And lactobacillus floats around in your kitchen. Water, flour, a warmish place in the kitchen, some benign neglect, and stand back, you're a microbe rancher.

Also, the bread is far superior in taste to bread made with commercial yeast.

Okay how do I stop this for real, I keep having bread go bad and I always notice there's a lot of moisture on the inside of the bag, so that's definitely the water in the formula

I'm happy to talk more about breadmaking. This is probably not the place, though! There used to be a cooking thread somewhere in the speakeasy. I'll bump it tomorrow.

[fferyllt]

I wonder how much overlap we have!

You feeling cocky enough to go first, or?

yeah. I'd rather not be influenced by whatever you've got.


{...........} <-- This makes me sad
{Syryana, SirCakez, Cabd*}
{Tammy, Bell, Something_Smart, petapan} <-- Some of these surprised me
-------------------
{midway bear} <-- may be too influenced by opinions in my peripheral vision. I'm going to spend some time with his iso when I'm more awake.
-------------------
{............} at a guess,
{............} I'll wind up with at least two more tiers.

* I'm treating you as unequivocal town and seeing what my gut thinks about it. You've made yourself vulnerable in a player list like this one with you Bell stance, and I don't think that's something you'd do as scum.

As for the rest of the player list, some I need more post data. some I need to marinate on. some I need to meta. Some have enough data in the thread that I feel like they should be sortable, but I don't have a first approximation. maybe it's my failing. maybe it's their content. I have work to do tomorrow.

[fferyllt]

anyone else you have an opinion on that I don't?

[fferyllt]

I hope that's a sort later tier because there's no way I should be below anyone at this point. Ye Alisae is fine, and I somewhat agree with Syr down. Didn't really like his attitude surrounding Bell and I doubt it is w/w.

You took a hit in your interaction with Bell, but I'm not sure it was a deserved hit.

[fferyllt]

One day I will make it into ffery's top tier, that day will be nirvana and then I'll never play again

You've been there before. I think you were the only player I really trusted in Tales of You by day 3.

[fferyllt]

anyone else you have an opinion on that I don't?

Yep!

Diamond should be at your midway tier. I really do think this is a play style clash. Not saying I townread the nitpicking on my style, but I don't objectively scumread it either! I was hoping you'd intervene to explain why pizza talk had to happen, but upon further consideration of us not being in defcon 1 world, I don't care any more.

Diamond, Gamma and Alisae are the players I feel like I should already have an opinion on. I'm probably close, but data overload, I guess.

[fferyllt]

One day I will make it into ffery's top tier, that day will be nirvana and then I'll never play again

You've been there before. I think you were the only player I really trusted in Tales of You by day 3.

You're oddly determined to give as many players trauma as possible toady, aren't you?

Sharing is caring.

[fferyllt]

the ghost of past me has been screaming in my ear that something_smart is obvious scum and i've mostly been tuning it out but i have no idea what you're seeing there

Have you played with him much?

I meta'd him recently. I feel like he's doing these game-health-maintenance posts and from the meta that's more of a town thing with him. He feels relaxed and sort of floating above the game in some ways. He sticks more of an oar in as scum.

Not a lot of recent experience with him, and he's matured incredibly as a player since way back when.

[fferyllt]

I meta'd him recently. I feel like he's doing these game-health-maintenance posts and from the meta that's more of a town thing with him. He feels relaxed and sort of floating above the game in some ways. He sticks more of an oar in as scum.

And mine isn't this one~

Wouldn't expect it to be.

[fferyllt]

I didn't know you'd surrendered you can read ffery card.

[fferyllt]

I'm going to go eat a box of pizza about it.

[fferyllt]

I didn't know you'd surrendered you can read ffery card.

?

Was this @me?

Yes.

3rd tier.

[fferyllt]

On page 43.

I don't even

[fferyllt]

I'm going to feel pretty stupid if Cabd turns out to be right about you.

[fferyllt]

I'm more concerned abut keeping my store-bought bread from going bad. I'm not much of a DIY guy.

Do you live in a super humid area? When I visit family in Florida I buy 1/2 to 1/3 size ciabattas, baguettes, etc. They're easier to get through before they succumb to the humidity. Could also freeze half the loaf, but that's suboptimal imo. I'd rather buy sizes that can be consumed quickly enough while fresh. You could also try storing in a paper bag instead of plastic.

[fferyllt]

I think you would probly be better served if you just read the last 2 pages and play rather than continuing the futile task of keeping up with the greatest team of shitposters ever assembled.

I enjoy your presence in the game!

[fferyllt]

I'm not fond of that type of pizza.

Noted!

Now. Why me before Syr?

You're scarier. And you're around! I feel like I'll know pretty quickly if Syr's town. He and I have some of the same weaknesses as scum, especially interacting with each other.

what are those weaknesses and what are the strengths

I ignored this question. You didn't follow up?

VOTE: Bell
Why?

I'm rereading today and am probably going to be dredging up more ancient posts. dealwithit.

Because something something Sword of Damocles something something.

Is this a read that still exists?

Ffery and I are currently having a lovely moonlight waltz.

Watching them dance across the floor with such elegant moves, Eliza couldn't help but help but feel a sense of loneliness in her heart, she turned to SS and wondered why he continued to ignore her. A slight tug on his shoulder - perhaps he would notice her here? She blinked and wondered what had caused him to ignore her.. perhaps it was something she had done wrong?

ffery heads over to the DJ's booth and asks her to spin up some Fishbone. "pogo, anyone"?

[fferyllt]

Ooh a pagetop.

Anyways, I'm mostly just gonna go to the backline until Nahdia posts more. I can read them fairly well.

They've posted more. Thoughts?

Oh shit you right. I swore I played against a scum hydra with you and Titus, but no. That wasn’t.
:/
Time to go do some research, I guess.

So what's my scum game like and is this it?

And quite frankly I think everyone may have a slice of life this game.

Quite possibly! I'm grabbing life with gusto here.

...Fuck

Revisiting this. I think you misinterpreted me. I miss Andy. And I evidently missed the import of your Temba, his arms open. You know what I love in mafia, and you know that variants are also well-loved.

Does anyone with experience with Grumpy Emerald know if he sounds this mechanical all the time

Do you mind if I give an answer after somebody else does? I want to weigh in myself but also don’t want to tamper with what your plan with this is

I like this.

Ah Cabd, no I didn’t really need a response I guess, but my self-absorbed self likes responses :p

Ffery and syry are a little higher priority read for me right now, so that’s taken up the majority of my headspace.

Don’t worry I’ll get to you and well the you is tied up in the ffery and to a lesser extent syry space if that makes sense.

How's this coming along?

No, I'm here and town. I didn't think the town block frisbee throw was serious but more of an attempt to see how people might react to it. Some players might be drawn to it. Scum might slap it down if they're insecure. Though it doesn't look like anyone other than me really even attempted to engage, perhaps due to it being too early. I didn't want to artificially engage with you earlier because I didn't want to force myself to town read you, or perhaps better said I didn't want to speak with you in a mindset where I was less confident that you were town, while pretending I was.

I'm always huggable.

For me, the frisbee throw is always serious

and

always a reaction gatherer.

And you're right. There was little engagement outside the usual suspects who tend to initially engage Cabd with squinty eyes.

I didn't post the townbloc invitation in this game, so you inviting me felt like a high enough level of engagement that I responded, and wanted and see where it went. It didn't go anywhere. I chalked that up to your class and sleeplessness, and reached back to you a couple times. This is why I said it felt like you weren't sure how you wanted to approach the game (or something like that).

[fferyllt]

There's a reasonable chance that you're scum and hoping we dont
Why don't you try reading or engaging with any of us instead of taking potshots from the sidelines

Pedit: Yes, you

i mean ive engaged both fferyllt and tammy but okay.

Your engagement with me is entirely 3rd person and phenomenally low key.

Maybe it's a playstyle thing. I've already registered my disappointment that you're not engaging me.

You're talking about me. Not to me.

[fferyllt]

Well, not entirely. there was that one "you" question. My reply got nothing back.

[fferyllt]

You very much missed my meaning but that's okay. The fact that you COULD miss it means we aren't as badly off as I'd feared.

At some point, the nightmares that are waking

me

up in the middle of the night are going to hit this thread and the implosion will be spectacular.

For now, I'm white-knuckling it and trying to sort some shit on my own.

[fferyllt]

At some point, the nightmares that are waking me up in the middle of the night are going to hit this thread and the implosion will be spectacular.

For now, I'm white-knuckling it and trying to sort some shit on my own.

what nightmares are we talking about ?

Not ready to talk about them.

[fferyllt]

Which read are you wondering about? You, Cabd, syry or just the whole?

This morning when I woke up at seven I was super optimistic and sure. In that moment I was sure you all were town.

Fell back asleep and woke up in a different mood and more uncertain than I was.

But he sum of it is that my town read of you is getting stronger. Cabd got kicked up a notch and is merrily skipping behind you. He has balloons but I don’t trust what’s in those balloons.

Syry is much the same as he was, which I know will cause you to start squinting at me but *shrug*. This morning I went through midsummer’s where syry was scum last, and well I want to go back through it again when I’m not feeling like I am right now.

Mostly I was wondering if the chain-read leading to Cabd was happening, and this post says "yes".

[fferyllt]

Can we get some coverage on Jake? I still feel pretty good about my vote on him. Others I'd be interested in voting include peta, cabd, and maybe Syr.

Bell's response really doesn't make me feel any better about them, but I'm not really sure what else we'd get out of it.

Syr I think just deserves a bit of pressure. Not a hard read on them by any means, but something's bugging me.
Oh, and Tammy should get some of the pressure pie. Kinda forgot about that read, but there isn't much to make me feel any better.

This net. So wide.

It's begging for you to agree with them, or at the very least grant his reads merit. In my experience, it's been a horrible scum-tell, where a player asking for someone to validate their reads is just trying make them seem legitimate.

If you're reading Cabd as begging for anything (except possibly my vote on Bell) - in any game - you're almost certainly misreading him.

Oh also. I think I saw them a while back (I might be wrong), but who are the heads of morph? Is that Cabd and fferylt?

Yes.

I need translators for Pooky and Cabd

For Cabd, just talking to him usually works. He'll explain what he's willing to explain, anyway, and then you get to explore the dimensions of what he won't explain and think about things that fit into that size and shape.

There are some good Cabd translators in this player list.

SC is probly scum - he's way too sweet here.

I'd vote him but MWB still hasn't apologized for causing the death of poor Eliza yet.

Idk about "too sweet" but his Nahdia push ain't great

@DS that seems fair, it's less about pushing people you think are shady and more about sorting people who you can read but don't have a read on

I personally think that pushing people because you want them lynched is a shitty strategy. It doesn't actually get scum, and instead just gets people who are unsure of their footing.

I push people because I want something set in stone that I can refer to at a later point.

Pedit: ooh pagetop

I like this post.

I don't know how to approach the relationship between this group Tammy which is kind of what I was getting at with the bias thing - I feel like you guys want to townread each other because you're all friends.

I think there's some truth to this.

But.

You have never seen me get paranoid about Cabd. It's not a pretty sight.

So I don't remember what my thing I was doing for the RP catchup was (probably due to only really ever doing that RP while in a specific location a lot of the time) so I'll just not do it. I'm sure someone's happy.

I have three town reads already. Woo.

Page 7. I should hope so.

How serious was this and why?

Mostly running semi-serious joke. My (not recently tested) ability to accurately snap-read a few players by page 4 or so led to a running gag about how if I wasn't townreading them by page 4 I was scum, and if I WAS townreading them by page 4 I was also scum. The snap-reads often went both ways.

I thought there was enough data in the thread for Cabd's black box mafia game processor to have at least 2 townreads by page 7.

nah because the bear's town

Spoiler: People Town Reading Archer Masonry PT

Hi!

Spoiler: People Town Reading Archer Masonry PT

Pop Quiz, who are my other town reads and why?

Spoiler:

Me. ~reasons~

Did you and Syr end up in a black hole? Or are you moon gazing with blue balls?

This might just be a general in-joke but I thought of Advance Wars when I saw this

It was a question to me couched within an Advance War metaphor.

I'm not going to explain the question or answer at this time.

[fferyllt]

Diamond, Gamma and Alisae are the players I feel like I should already have an opinion on. I'm probably close, but data overload, I guess.

How's this going?

Alisae town. Diamond was bugging the hell out of me but he posted something I quoted recently that put some of his playstyle into focus for me and I can see what he's doing as potentially town play, but I'm gonna need more time/data/interaction I think to feel confident. Gamma is distinctly up from fire from a thousand suns territory. Settling on a tier is going to take some interaction.

I'll feel more like interaction after I get a nap, I think. My usual sleep deficit increased the last couple nights.

[fferyllt]

On page 43.

I don't even

Think about it incredibly hard. You're good at this kind of thinking.

Let me know if you don't have it by the morning.

WE ALL GOOD HERE?

I was mostly giving you shit.

And yeah, I know.

Mafia bleeds into DnD so hard my DM has taken to turning off his webcam so I can't read his eyebrow movements. DnD bleeds into mafia, too. I come back with swagger wanting to unleash some Bardic Hideous Laughter.

[fferyllt]

Can we get some coverage on Jake? I still feel pretty good about my vote on him. Others I'd be interested in voting include peta, cabd, and maybe Syr.

Bell's response really doesn't make me feel any better about them, but I'm not really sure what else we'd get out of it.

Syr I think just deserves a bit of pressure. Not a hard read on them by any means, but something's bugging me.
Oh, and Tammy should get some of the pressure pie. Kinda forgot about that read, but there isn't much to make me feel any better.

@ffery are saying that 950 made you go back and read these as town?

I called them out because I disliked them regardless of alignment because they felt indiscriminate.

understanding what he means by pressure helps some. But, it's weird that he throws this stuff out and asks for non-specific other players to help him apply pressure when he's not coming off as all that much of a team player, if that makes sense. With him, next step is figuring out if my ideas about how he approaches the game are accurate and if they are, then what motivation am I seeing here. Surface level, he's reminding me a lot of scum-Diamond in the Perpetual Mylo game I modded a couple years ago.

[fferyllt]

I wonder how much overlap we have!

You feeling cocky enough to go first, or?

yeah. I'd rather not be influenced by whatever you've got.


{...........} <-- This makes me sad
{Syryana, SirCakez, Cabd*}
{Tammy, Bell, Something_Smart, petapan} <-- Some of these surprised me
-------------------
{midway bear} <-- may be too influenced by opinions in my peripheral vision. I'm going to spend some time with his iso when I'm more awake.
-------------------
{............} at a guess,
{............} I'll wind up with at least two more tiers.

* I'm treating you as unequivocal town and seeing what my gut thinks about it. You've made yourself vulnerable in a player list like this one with you Bell stance, and I don't think that's something you'd do as scum.

As for the rest of the player list, some I need more post data. some I need to marinate on. some I need to meta. Some have enough data in the thread that I feel like they should be sortable, but I don't have a first approximation. maybe it's my failing. maybe it's their content. I have work to do tomorrow.

Diamond, Gamma and Alisae are the players I feel like I should already have an opinion on. I'm probably close, but data overload, I guess.

How's this going?

Alisae town. Diamond was bugging the hell out of me but he posted something I quoted recently that put some of his playstyle into focus for me and I can see what he's doing as potentially town play, but I'm gonna need more time/data/interaction I think to feel confident. Gamma is distinctly up from fire from a thousand suns territory. Settling on a tier is going to take some interaction.

I'll feel more like interaction after I get a nap, I think. My usual sleep deficit increased the last couple nights.

And?

Which one(s) are you not townreading?

[fferyllt]

Scum me in PMyLo was motivated by frustration and hatred at my other scum members.

What's motivating you here?

[fferyllt]

Scum me in PMyLo was motivated by frustration and hatred at my other scum members.

What's motivating you here?

Now ain’t that the question of the hour

Another question before I answer. What do you do once I answer? Would you not expect me to lie out me ass if I were scum?

I think about it and contextualize it. And yes, I would.

[fferyllt]

You know full well which one. But it was just a throwaway meme and if I full-reads I'll probably have less than 4 myself.

I think I do know. I'd have liked confirmation rather than snark.

[fferyllt]

Anyways, besides my dodging of the question, I’m not sure if I like the question. It seems like it’s a leading question, and the destination is some nefarious form of entrapment.

It's an open-ended question. I love those. They signal I'm starting from a place of listening, and dropping preconceptions. They are start of so many mafia dances.

[fferyllt]

Diamond, you're making me sad.

I hope you're quiet because you're writing me a wall right now, but I don't need a wall.

I need a conversation.

[fferyllt]

Hmph. Very well.

I’m mainly acting out of a few mental states.
1. Frustrated with this dance of double meanings and inside jokes.
2. Frustrated with this incessant shitposting despite numerous attempts at steering the conversation into a direction.
3. Annoyed at the number of lurkers. While I understand being busy, it does not make it any easier to stomach.
4. Confusion at this odd town bloc for, what I’ve seen, nearly non-existent reasons. I’ve yet to see a solid reason why Cabd’s behavior is town motivated, and I also fail to see that for Tammy and Syr, yet a fair few of my more confident town reads (specifically you, although that’s dropping faster than I’d like) proclaim that they are acting consistently with a town mentality.

Thanks.

1. We are doing more code-talk than we normally would. It's error prone because we haven't used this channel of communication heavily in quite a while, and I for one am rusty at it. I think it's nearing the end of its usefulness in this game, though. We'll see.

2. If your attempts aren't working, attempt differently. You can't stop people from playing the game as they wish to, but you can engage people individually. And if someone

won't

allow that engagement, that's data, too. This is where I'm at with Nahdia at the moment, for instance. I'm going to try something different when the opportunity presents.

3. This is another place where engaging differently might help.

4. Yeah, this is a thing. It may become less of a thing in this game with a little more time. But, I can't just erase years of play-experience and ignore players doing town-for-them stuff. I don't want to write essays about players. Maybe I'll need to eventually, but it's way too early in the game to start. I don't want to wear my diplomat hat. I really haven't earned it in Year of Our Lord 2020 on mafiascum dot net.

[fferyllt]

You know full well which one. But it was just a throwaway meme and if I full-reads I'll probably have less than 4 myself.

I think I do know. I'd have liked confirmation rather than snark.

My vote is very much where it is still.

Dork. I was talking about the three names you tossed at me.

[fferyllt]

Oh.


Is it really time to talk about that already?

Fiiine.

It's gamma.

I was going to be annoyed if you were scumreading my grumpy old man shouting at clouds null-town read.

[fferyllt]

I don't think gamma-scum makes 979 in the main thread if he can make it in the scum PT.

I don't see why that's something gamma-scum doesn't make in the thread. You're better at putting yourself in scum-headspace than I am, but posting it in the scum-pt doesn't get anything revealing from the players who made those posts?

[fferyllt]

If that's how town-Gamma reacts to my post, how does scum-Gamma react differently?

I'm confused because I thought you said Gamma was your scumread in that group of three. :/

[fferyllt]

I'd still like you to answer my question in 1280. I am but an egg.

[fferyllt]

Since you think he wouldn't have asked the first question as scum, it makes sense you think he wouldn't follow up.

Your points would hold true with scum-me. I'm not that great a yardstick for measuring most scum.

[fferyllt]

I only write five page essays on paranoia reads.

[fferyllt]

{Something_Smart, Midway, Ffery}
{Tammy, Cake, Syr}
{Alisae, Petapan}
{Gamma, Nahdia}
~~~Line of How low Can You Limbo?~~~
{Diamond, Bell, Taylor}
~~~Line of Enough Data (I don't know where to place this players yet)~~~
{Bulge, Pookey}
{Jake*}


*To be meta'd, I know syr mentioned having done some research but I need to fact check.

Excluding Bell, what are your adjustments here if you gun-to-head?

Me?

I'm going to contemplate my top teir tonight. If I think of your top tier as my second tier, then:

Pookey up,
Cake up, maybe. Gonna put him up and see how it feels.
Syr up. (I'd bolt with him).
Diamond pending. That scummoning was kinda odd though.

Pookey has charmed me. this is going to be my pet read, I'm afraid.

I too have a homework assignment on Jake.

[fferyllt]

Can we get some coverage on Jake? I still feel pretty good about my vote on him. Others I'd be interested in voting include peta, cabd, and maybe Syr.

Bell's response really doesn't make me feel any better about them, but I'm not really sure what else we'd get out of it.

Syr I think just deserves a bit of pressure. Not a hard read on them by any means, but something's bugging me.
Oh, and Tammy should get some of the pressure pie. Kinda forgot about that read, but there isn't much to make me feel any better.

@ffery are saying that 950 made you go back and read these as town?

I called them out because I disliked them regardless of alignment because they felt indiscriminate.

understanding what he means by pressure helps some. But, it's weird that he throws this stuff out and asks for non-specific other players to help him apply pressure when he's not coming off as all that much of a team player, if that makes sense. With him, next step is figuring out if my ideas about how he approaches the game are accurate and if they are, then what motivation am I seeing here. Surface level, he's reminding me a lot of scum-Diamond in the Perpetual Mylo game I modded a couple years ago.

Scum me in PMyLo was motivated by frustration and hatred at my other scum members.

The timestamps on these 2 posts are 2 minutes apart. And you were phoneposting.

[fferyllt]

Nah, that was the last post I made before I left to pick up pizza.

Plus, I compulsively check the thread.

What kinds of posts warrant quick replies?

[fferyllt]

DS could you put together a reads list? Doesn't have to be detailed.

[fferyllt]

DS could you put together a reads list? Doesn't have to be detailed.

[fferyllt]

VOTE: Bell

Woke up because my subconscious wanted this before I drift back off. Something is wrong here.

Dream crumb lol

I just point this out because there was a part of me that was a bit suspicious of the dream explanation, which I know is silly. But scum have claimed dreams before and people tend to think those are little indicators that someone is town, and I was like is Cabd just planting this in his iso to look town. It's partially silly because nobody is going to follow him on a dream, so if Cabd scum really wants to get Bell lynched he's going to have to do something more than a dream.

Anyway with this and the post where he says he woke up and still felt good about the vote make this feel like it was something real, and my silly thoughts were silly.

The stronger argument to me is that Town-Cabd once dragged me along in our hydra to fake a daycop guilty in a game, based on a dream. I didn't know the basis at the time or I might have dug my heels in.

From his posts, it looked like he expected me to be able to save him if he went there this time and it blew up.

[fferyllt]

- have i once again wrongly inflicted misery on Scheherazade?

i was very proud of this and the intended audience did not give it the recognition i wanted

I laughed.

[fferyllt]

VOTE: Bell

Woke up because my subconscious wanted this before I drift back off. Something is wrong here.

Dream crumb lol

I just point this out because there was a part of me that was a bit suspicious of the dream explanation, which I know is silly. But scum have claimed dreams before and people tend to think those are little indicators that someone is town, and I was like is Cabd just planting this in his iso to look town. It's partially silly because nobody is going to follow him on a dream, so if Cabd scum really wants to get Bell lynched he's going to have to do something more than a dream.

Anyway with this and the post where he says he woke up and still felt good about the vote make this feel like it was something real, and my silly thoughts were silly.

The stronger argument to me is that Town-Cabd once dragged me along in our hydra to fake a daycop guilty in a game, based on a dream. I didn't know the basis at the time or I might have dug my heels in.

From his posts, it looked like he expected me to be able to save him if he went there this time and it blew up.

You wouldn't have gone along anyways?

I dunno! Maybe? You were mod-confirmed town to me by virtue of our role PM, and I owed you for moving our vote of scum in errrantparabola's game. I thought you were using something from your meta binder. But the overriding factor was errantparabola's game.

[fferyllt]

Cabd, want to talk Jake meta?

[fferyllt]

@FF: I don't have enough of a backlog to jump in here. I have two skims and one full game on him. I believe him when he says he gets miseliminated a lot though.

I'm pretty sure Cabd had a look at Syr's list of games from a couple pages ago. So have I. I don't expect he'll share any high caliber meta tells with me, but we can still talk in generalities. The only time I learn about the ~100% tells is when he's going to burn one.

[fferyllt]

fferyllt

*Mostly aimed at you and Syrana. Even though Syrana hasn't done anything but look pretty yet. (On page 40 at the time of this writing).
#856: Going forward.
#1010: Enjoy the moment.
#1023:

Highly townie.

#1032: No! Why did you go first?! 8 reads. Midway in the middle. Why is syrana so high. Besides being tonally exactly the same down to the orange jacket. Well, actually that's not true this game. He's tonally similar to how he was at the end of that game. But friendly tell. Which ones surprised you?

I went first because I didn't want Cabd's reads to influence mine at that point. Probably not an issue, but sometimes I'm highly influenceable, for good or ill

If you're townreading me, just let me have my Syr read for now. It's subject to reevaluation if more data calls for it.

I think you and I start at very different points when processing a game. I feel like you start with everyone's dial set at null or null/scum, and we get to work our way up from there. I start in a very happy place where everyone is null-town or higher and the game is full of good friends having fun and nobody's going to do murder in the night. And players get to prove me wrong. This game mostly started there, but with a lot of new-to-me players I tend to be more cautious about my reads. And there are a few players who've traumatized me often enough that they start at true-null to null-scum. I tend to interact very heavily with those players until I feel like the dial has moved in some direction. Cabd is one of the players in that category. Syr is not.

something_smart and petapan were the surprises.

#1038: Ground run. FF/Cabd out.
#1064: Defense. FF/Cabd out X2.

Do you want a response to this?

#1095: Clearly a villager that bakes bread in their spare time.
#1152: Why did you ignore it? Nope! Not really. It was an RVS poke.

maintenance of what I hope is a meta competitive advantage.

#1182: I like this post. Look at all the wheels she's spinning.
#1230: Right? ...right? The fitting size and shape thing is a lot harder than it needs to be though.

Kinda depends. I'm reading a lot into silences and ~other stuff~ with a few players this game.

#1231: Rest well.

I did!

If I didn't elaborate on something you wanted me to, let me know.

[fferyllt]

that is pretty uncharitable. bell's catchup on peta.

Not done reading them all yet.

[fferyllt]

Ready to vote Bell yet?

[fferyllt]

@ff: makes sense to me. But I'm more concerned with the other way around.
Your reads are yours. I'm pretty sure I'm more scared of town binning scum than the other way around. I try not to let personal biases on favorites effect my reads. I rarely think "I can sort X later, but not Y" preferring to try to solve right then and there due to limited time/ getting nked/regrets for not doing the thing that I think will unlock the puzzle of that player/feeling like I didn't give the player a fair shot.

Yes, actually I want to make sure I can accurately understand what you were doing on those two posts. I'm glad you rested well.

All of it.

Do you understand now?

I get what you're saying about limited time, too, though I'm not as frequent an N1K as I used to be. I feel like what you're calling "biases on favorites" is what I call "experiential meta" and the "biases" go many ways: easy to read, hard to read, near-impossible to read.

[fferyllt]

Cabd, want to talk Jake meta?

[fferyllt]

Cabd, want to talk Jake meta?

This won't happen until late tomorrow night or Wednesday afternoon most likely.


Do you think it's particularly urgent? Do you see yourself voting there today or disagreeing with syrs take?

I don't see myself voting there. I kinda want to put that read to bed for the time being. We meta in very different ways which is why I want to discuss it with you.

[fferyllt]

I'm sorry you feel this way!

I'd be happy to talk to you or Eliza though. Except right now, sorry, I took more than one night time sleep aid in an attempt to get a full night's sleep tonight.

Do you have any reads you feel super strongly or really conflicted about?

Or more important. What is your favorite drink?

I TR you and would be shocked if you were scum. You're like the cool girl at the dance that everyone seems to be on a first name basis with, you know you're popular but you don't put up any airs. It feels refreshing to talk to you.

My favorite drink hmm.

Probably 10 Yr Talisker. It tastes like being hit by an ocean wave, it's strong and unapologetic, makes me remember happier times when I was younger, dumber and less jaded about life.

Have you and Tammy played together before?

Do you have thoughts about petapan vs Bell?

[fferyllt]

I've never played with Tammy.

I haven't read peta/bell

I tend to not read anything that goes over 10 lines this early in the game because I find it to be mostly a waste of time and energy.

What kinds of content do you like to deal with in the early game?

[fferyllt]

It looks like you're picking up some reads along the way!

Iso isn't a very good tool for tracking your trajectories because of the 1v1 content, I think.

[fferyllt]

How can you assume this

Because when I force reads they come out hot garbage. Speaking from experience.

Do you have a plan for tackling the game? Are you thinking to kinda sit out day 1?

[fferyllt]

@ff: makes sense to me. But I'm more concerned with the other way around.
Your reads are yours. I'm pretty sure I'm more scared of town binning scum than the other way around. I try not to let personal biases on favorites effect my reads. I rarely think "I can sort X later, but not Y" preferring to try to solve right then and there due to limited time/ getting nked/regrets for not doing the thing that I think will unlock the puzzle of that player/feeling like I didn't give the player a fair shot.

Yes, actually I want to make sure I can accurately understand what you were doing on those two posts. I'm glad you rested well.

All of it.

Is it fair to say that you're trying to use my interactions with him to form a read of Cabd?

If yes, how do you think that works out? I felt like maybe you wished you had been around to change the course of things a little when we've compared reads.

[fferyllt]

Do you feel like you're good at reading Bell?

[fferyllt]

yes

but also do you uhh want to talk about reads now

May I attend?

[fferyllt]

do you feel like youre good at reading, bell?

Urge to burn: Rising

[fferyllt]

{Midway, Ffery}
{Tammy, Cake, petapan, Cabd}
{Alisae}
{Gamma, S_S, Jake, Pookey}
~~~Line of How low Can You Limbo?~~~
{Nahdia, Bell, Taylor}
~~~Line of Enough Data (I don't know where to place this players yet)~~~
{Bulge}

Pedit: Hi ffery!

Hi!

Where does Diamond go?

{Syr, Cabd, Tammy}
{Sir Cakez, S_S, midway, Jake, Alisae} << putting Alisae here to see how my gut feels about that
{Gamma, Pookie}
------line of quantum wtfery----------
{Bell} << Shrodinger's box, but still leaning a little townward. I'll explain why in a bit, probs
{Diamond} << Brain says scum, gut says not
-------------------------------------
Tayl0r, Nahdia



Bulge unplaced.

Bulge if there's stuff I can do to help you get your foot back into the game, let me know!

[fferyllt]

im having a lot of trouble parsing the 2012 cohort and the rest of the thread is much lurkier.

l
m
f
a
o

Ffery. With me?

VOTE: Tayl0r Swift

Vote: Tayl0r Swift

I thnk it's time. Do you?

[fferyllt]

Ok Listen up!

This game has a dethy in it: A neighborhood with 4 town cops of unknown sanity, one each of {naive, paranoid, insane, and sane} And a scum traitor rolecop.

We were going to see how today plays out and try to solve the dethy on our own. But, we're extremely sure who the traitor is and we want our fuckin masonry now.

The dethy is Tammy, Syryana, Jake, Tayl0r and myself.

I crumbed the dethy in my second post.

We want to elim Tayl0r.

Will you help?

[fferyllt]

well hell

Pretty much my reaction to my role pm!

Syr and I hydra'd in a game with a dethy in 2013. We weren't in the dethy itself, but it was a huge mess. The problem with it is that once there's consensus on who the traitor is in-game-thread pressure on that player will cause the player to out the dethy.

Since we're locked and loaded on who we think the traitor is, I wanted to out the dethy in a far less troublesome manner than happened in the Death's Diner game.

[fferyllt]

CABD GET YOUR ASS OUT OF THE SCUM PT AND COME TALK TO ME

[fferyllt]

Townblock application line is here in my circular file.. or firing squad?

If you're town, I really need to know it within 4 pages. I'm deathly afraid how things might go otherwise.

otherwise he will probably betray you!

This post raised the fuck out of my hackles. I think Tayl0r was trying to signal to the scum team.

[fferyllt]

CABD GET YOUR ASS OUT OF THE SCUM PT AND COME TALK TO ME

All of the setup spec and crumbing I did to you is useless now.

I'm in a meeting for the next hour.

Solving the dethy can come first but you're not off the hook for Bell.

I am aware and I do have issues with him, so.

[fferyllt]

Townblock application line is here in my circular file.. or firing squad?

If you're town, I really need to know it within 4 pages. I'm deathly afraid how things might go otherwise.

otherwise he will probably betray you!

This post raised the fuck out of my hackles. I think Tayl0r was trying to signal to the scum team.

Don't you dare steal my fucking thunder,

I

brought this to the attention of the Ya-Ya sisterhood of the traveling pants

<3

[fferyllt]

CABD GET YOUR ASS OUT OF THE SCUM PT AND COME TALK TO ME

All of the setup spec and crumbing I did to you is useless now.

For what it's worth, I think I caught most of it.

[fferyllt]

Townblock application line is here in my circular file.. or firing squad?

If you're town, I really need to know it within 4 pages. I'm deathly afraid how things might go otherwise.

otherwise he will probably betray you!

This post raised the fuck out of my hackles. I think Tayl0r was trying to signal to the scum team.

are the mechanics of the traitor specified or implied at all? if the word traitor is used in the PT is it capitalized? what was the purpose of all that fakegod-spec earlier about traitors?

The word is capitalized and the color is brown (I think, purple skin). Syr asked Fakegod about what kind of traitor this is and Fakegod declined to tell us!

[fferyllt]

i see i am so intimidating to read i apparently no longer exist in this game

You're actually oscillating between the first and second tier. I feel like I ought to just commit to first tier. I was going to make a decision before I posted it and then forgot that I hadn't.

[fferyllt]

If we have a protective role, please target within the dethy tonight!

[fferyllt]

I don’t particularly like all the vote’s raining down on Taylor.

But then again I’m the paranoid one in our dethy

What do you think would be a better reaction?

[fferyllt]

Ok Listen up!

This game has a dethy in it: A neighborhood with 4 town cops of unknown sanity, one each of {naive, paranoid, insane, and sane} And a scum traitor rolecop.

We were going to see how today plays out and try to solve the dethy on our own. But, we're extremely sure who the traitor is and we want our fuckin masonry now.

The dethy is Tammy, Syryana, Jake, Tayl0r and myself.

I crumbed the dethy in my second post.

We want to elim Tayl0r.

Will you help?

Interesting. You're dead set on it being Taylor here as opposed to Jake?

I agree that Taylor looks scum, but Jake looks way more scum in my eyes.

All those games Syr linked? I read them. And I also have the benefit to Jake's behavior in the neighbhorhood when we were scumreading him. His reaction to that pressure didn't feel scummy. I think the pressure he was feeling in the PT was greater than the pressure he's experienced in the game thread. He did feel kind of defeatist in some ways. Reading those games gave me a context for why he could feel defeatist here.

[fferyllt]

Ok Listen up!

This game has a dethy in it: A neighborhood with 4 town cops of unknown sanity, one each of {naive, paranoid, insane, and sane} And a scum traitor rolecop.

We were going to see how today plays out and try to solve the dethy on our own. But, we're extremely sure who the traitor is and we want our fuckin masonry now.

The dethy is Tammy, Syryana, Jake, Tayl0r and myself.

I crumbed the dethy in my second post.

We want to elim Tayl0r.

Will you help?

Interesting. You're dead set on it being Taylor here as opposed to Jake?

I agree that Taylor looks scum, but Jake looks way more scum in my eyes.

All those games Syr linked? I read them. And I also have the benefit to Jake's behavior in the neighbhorhood when we were scumreading him. His reaction to that pressure didn't feel scummy. I think the pressure he was feeling in the PT was greater than the pressure he's experienced in the game thread. He did feel kind of defeatist in some ways. Reading those games gave me a context for why he could feel defeatist here.

This doesn't scream defeatist though. This screams "I want to act as an agent of chaos so that even if I get eliminated, our stance isn't crippled."

What is "this"?

[fferyllt]

I agree with petapan. Read the flip info in the OPs and gave a look at his isos in the games Syr linked.

[fferyllt]

Did everyone just ignore 1606? That is very weird

What do you think about the post?

[fferyllt]

Tammy sorry if you've gone more in-depth somewhere already, but im wondering about your bell placement. from what I remember reading youve spent far more time elaborating on why bell is not town than why he is not full informed scum and I'm not sure I understand what's stopping you from scumbinning him. how set are you on the double traitor theory, or were you just wanting to put your thoughts out?

I am paranoid about so many things. One of my first thoughts when I saw that I was in a dethy was about the word "neighborhood

s

" in one of Fakegod's PMs. "What if there are MULTIPLE dethys? What if there are THREE dethys?"

I can see there being more than 1 traitor here, but the traitor roles would have to be explicitly not normal to be at all fair to a small grpscum team.

[fferyllt]

I did some counting and by my calculations taylor is at E-2

UNVOTE:

Want some more of that sweet sweet conversation

Has taylor been pushing for jakescum in the hood?

To a minor extent. Jake said something about us needing to solve for the traitor quickly in case they are able to talk with grpscum.

Tayl0r called that TMI'ing that the traitor isn't already in the scum pt.

Which to me is an incredibly bizarre reaction to Jake's post.

She told jake she wanted his scumhunting her to happen in the neighborhood, not the game thread, and that she was not scumhunting him in the game thread - not throwing punches in the game thread. And I think that was the last time she mentioned jake in the neighborhood. That post was made on Oct 11.

[fferyllt]

I thought what Jake's post revealed was that he didn't know how traitors work.

[fferyllt]

Is that accurate FF?

Specifically what are you asking if it's accurate?

[fferyllt]

Is that accurate FF?

Specifically what are you asking if it's accurate?

17.6% or 23.5% outside versus 20% inside.
What's the rationale behind each player's approach inside of the QT versus out of it?

Initial discussion was around whether/under what circumstances to out the dethy. I was on the "soon" end initially because of the weird effects that huge neighborhoods have on quantity and nature of game activity. There's a huge unknown thing in the game that's shaping the behaviors of almost 1/3 of the player list.

We decided to play that slow, try to solve the dethy using the strategy that applies in a game with only a dethy, and not actively hunt our neighborhood scumreads in the game thread.

We were all aware that if one of us gets run up then the dethy becomes public because regardless of alignment that's what a player is gonna do.

Jake asked at one point if we should vote as a block. I suggested we each should vote where our reads lead us.

And I should mention that although my reaction to the post that Tayl0r called TMI was that it suggested not understanding the traitor role. Jake later mentioned he'd played a game offsite where the scum were all traitors (which I doubt were normal traitors in the MS normal sense because how the hell would that work?

[fferyllt]

You aren't the only big neighborhood with a conundrum

I know!

[fferyllt]

You aren't the only big neighborhood with a conundrum

I know!

Your readslist gave that away as much as your crumbing did.

[fferyllt]

Why did Jake say there was a third party in game in response to Taylor's post?

You should probably ask Jake that.

[fferyllt]

You aren't the only big neighborhood with a conundrum

I know!

I would go as far as to say that mine is a direct counter to yours

This will probably make more sense to me when I know more about your neighborhood.

[fferyllt]

That's who I'm asking.

Might I suggest "Jake, why would etc."

I thought you were asking the neighborhood at large.

[fferyllt]

I don't think claiming more details about my hood is a good idea until we resolve yours for reasons that I just realized sorry

I wasn't expecting a reveal. I just wanted you to know that I didn't have lightbulb moment reading your post.

I kinda want to tell you what I initially thought "pizza" meant, but since I could be right-ish by accident, I won't!

[fferyllt]

@ff: makes sense to me. But I'm more concerned with the other way around.
Your reads are yours. I'm pretty sure I'm more scared of town binning scum than the other way around. I try not to let personal biases on favorites effect my reads. I rarely think "I can sort X later, but not Y" preferring to try to solve right then and there due to limited time/ getting nked/regrets for not doing the thing that I think will unlock the puzzle of that player/feeling like I didn't give the player a fair shot.

Yes, actually I want to make sure I can accurately understand what you were doing on those two posts. I'm glad you rested well.

All of it.

Is it fair to say that you're trying to use my interactions with him to form a read of Cabd?

If yes, how do you think that works out? I felt like maybe you wished you had been around to change the course of things a little when we've compared reads.

Speaking of questions asked.

[fferyllt]

damn.

You made me look back at that post, and I misinterpreted it initially. It's #78 in the neighborhood.

So, Jake didn't appear naive about how traitors work.

One of these nights I'm going to get some serious sleep.

[fferyllt]

I will literally never get anything done this game if I answer every question posed to me.

I'm kinda standing in the doorway blocking Cabd's dream of eliming you. That puts a responsibility on me.

This question is important to me.