Mafia of the Raptured (Game Over!)

[Pjovek]

Town:
1) enomis
4) Katsuki
5) MattP
6) mrbungle
9) sword_of_omens
10) Syryana
11) Tammy
8) Pjovek
12) Tierce

Mafia:
3) implosion
7) Oversoul
13) Whimsical Eggplant
14) Zachrulez

Third Party:
2) fferyllt
15) Zdenek


I am never wrong.

[Pjovek]

Battery-Powered Deadlines. Deadlines in this game (outside Apocalypse) are measured via a meter that starts at 100% and counts down each real-time day by a varying amount. The amount is based on true activity.

^Zdenek your plan is a double-edged sword

People can post and say game relevant things without spamming the thread. There's also the comment about "true activity;" I don't know exactly how to take it, but presumably it means that we couldn't spam the thread in order to prolong deadlines.

No, Mr. SK this does sound wrong.

There is no meaningful way to differentiate between "true" activity and spam activity, thus, I find it more likely the battery feels warm and cozy in the embrace of posts.

Therefor, needless spam is encouraged.

[Pjovek]

For the sake of the universe and contiguity, I need everyone to claim the game/universe their character is from.

Nothing important, just a lil dash of flavor.

It's no big deal guys.

What could possibly go wrong.

[Pjovek]

No, Mr. SK this does sound wrong.

There is no meaningful way to differentiate between "true" activity and spam activity, thus, I find it more likely the battery feels warm and cozy in the embrace of posts.

Therefor, needless spam is encouraged.

The embrace of posts yes, as I think the battery also drains when there is lack of activity, but not needless spamming.

What is your opinion on my case on Oversoul?

[Pjovek]

No, Mr. SK this does sound wrong.

There is no meaningful way to differentiate between "true" activity and spam activity, thus, I find it more likely the battery feels warm and cozy in the embrace of posts.

Therefor, needless spam is encouraged.

The embrace of posts yes, as I think the battery also drains when there is lack of activity, but not needless spamming.

What is your opinion on my case on Oversoul?

This is the type of pointless spamming that needs to be avoided. I couldn't possibly had an opinion on your silly reads list including people who have not posted.

But, if you or Oversoul ever flip scum, thank you for this potential link.

Also think claiming universes is a bad idea.

I'm talking about the case, not the list.

The incredibly correct and awesome list, if I do say.

[Pjovek]

For the sake of the universe and contiguity, I need everyone to claim the game/universe their character is from.

Nothing important, just a lil dash of flavor.

It's no big deal guys.

What could possibly go wrong.

This is not happening unless you have a damn good reason for it.

Reason?
Oh yes I do have a pretty good one.

So?

[Pjovek]

hey pjo are you town?

totes

cos i am... you probably know that by now tho don't you

totes

I've been thinking about that newbie game. I assume pjo gambits no matter what alignment he is.

totes

mrbungle, where, what games do you and pjo know each other from?

fiery, pjo, tell me about pjo's scum game, or at least point me to the ones that you are talking about.

My scumgames are mystical creatures of ancient power, just without the power.
I'm actually quite bad at it if I do say so myself.
Almost as bad as bungle. Not quite, but almost.

Cool. Why is it suspicious. And I'll totally admit to it being suspicious, if you can point to where I was posting at this site in the meantime and then hopped to it to do some scumhunting because I was called out. And if you really think someone saying I'm not scumhunting on page two of a mafia game makes me get all skittish and run to scumhunt, you clearly don't know how I think as scum.

Why don't you ask me why I'm finding the Matt town reads suspicious? Show me you're actually interested in determining my alignment.

It's completely irrelevant whether you were posting elsewhere on the site. The point is, Whimsy-boy over there calls you out for not scumhunting, then you make a post yelling at him, and two minutes later you start scumhunting.

I already know why you find the Matt townreads suspicious. And I've already figured out your alignment

Pedit: And more self-meta! This is glorious!

This is a bad post and you should feel bad.

Why are people not allowed to hunt scum after you tell them they are not hunting scum?
And when are they supposed to start?

There is mafia motivation in these words.
Indeed.
Mafia would really love people who are not contributing to continue doing so.
Indeed, if mafia are able to paint scum motivation on people FOR starting to contribute (even if it's just a lil' dash of it), that would be a good thing.

I'm taking both my eyes. And I'm watching the shit out of you, brother.
Yeah.
Even when you're under the shower, yeah.

I haven't seen his scum game.

So why do you think that he gambits as either alignment?

I was asking mrbungles because they've played together elsewhere.

But, if he doesn't gambit irrespective of alignment he'd be awfully easy to spot as scum. So yeah, I think he gambits no matter what his alignment.

While it is true that i do that specifically as either alignment, I am easy to spot as scum anyways.
¯\_(ツ)_/¯

But, if he doesn't gambit irrespective of alignment he'd be awfully easy to spot as scum. So yeah, I think he gambits no matter what his alignment.

You're lying

You didn't actually come to that conclusion

Would you like to stop lying now or should this be a power lynch? [:

Why do you think ferryllet unable to come to a logical conclusion?
This looks like you want to lynch here on the basis of her being actually stupid and not able to think, true/false?

ffery, needs to explain how pjo tripped up scum in the game she lynched because it looks like she buddying with him for an illegitimate reason at the moment.

I'd like it if mrbungle told me what game he knows pjo from.

Whimsy is actually scum, so people should vote her.

Pjo was so obviously town by page 2 of that game. MsM, however, just could not let go of the idea that he had initially behaved as though he were very newb and then a page later showed some depth of mafia strategy. She focused on the ruse and ignored or couldn't see the reason behind it. She moved on to other targets but kept coming back to that slot and arguing with Pjo and later his replacement. It was painfully scummy looking.

I was happy to see he signed up for this game and I'm looking forward to playing with him.

Oh stop it, you
*blush*

VOTE: Whimsical Eggplantl

Scum man. She tripped up.
@whimsical: You recalled mattp saying releasing flavour is a bad idea in your scum pregame qt?

Those who have no avatar need to get one. I can't differentiate people without avi.

I thought scum only had a QT during nightphases?
If so then this is silly.
Or are pregame QTs actually a thing?
Sounds useless, theres like nothing to talk about without any posts.

Hey Zach--want to obvTown so I can stop worrying about players 10-15? That'd look really cool on my notes.

Want to help me lynch Pjovek? It would fill me with warm feelings inside.

If you want, I could fill you up with something warm.

Hey Zach--want to obvTown so I can stop worrying about players 10-15? That'd look really cool on my notes.

Want to help me lynch Pjovek? It would fill me with warm feelings inside.

Why do you think he would troll like that as scum and not as Town? He's not an insecure newbie, regardless of his post count in MS.

Here, have a cookie. It comes with free townreads.

Hey Zach--want to obvTown so I can stop worrying about players 10-15? That'd look really cool on my notes.

Want to help me lynch Pjovek? It would fill me with warm feelings inside.

Why do you think he would troll like that as scum and not as Town? He's not an insecure newbie, regardless of his post count in MS.

My friend Jason a while back ran a theme game. It featured the scum pushing a mass claim on day 1 and getting away with it. Seeing that kind of action again in another theme game, and nothing from Pjovek's iso to indicate to me that he's town, I'm more than fine to say DIESCUMDIE as of this 5 minutes.

How is this relevant to this game at all?


@Katsuki, do you like playing scum?
yes/no question.

[Pjovek]

Pjovek--walk me through the thought process of writing Post 16.

Not yet, no.
Suffice to say I was feeling a bit lazy.

Also I'd like to note that I never asked for a massclaim. Just a claim of really minor flavor. Not even rolenames or anything. Really minor. I honestly didn't (and don't) see the harm in it.

[Pjovek]

Alright, if pregame QTs actually exist, then I'm okaaaay lynching Eggplant, but I don't really like the wheels the wagon is driving on. They spin in different directions.

On one side, we got the fabricated looking townread on MattP
On the other side, we got the "scumslip"

These contradict each other in conclusion, since, assuming Eggplant flips scum, the fabricated townread on Matt would mean Matt being town, while the slip would obviously mean he talked with Matt in the scumQT, making matt scum.

Which leaves me looking at an unresolvable situation, and I don't like how people want to lynch Eggplant for BOTH, when they blatantly contradict each other.

Resolving the situation, and then looking which explaination is more likely is what should happen, instead both are used in an overarching theory.
Overarching theories are rarely correct.

The thing is, that either one of those could well make Eggplant scum, but without any effort into determining which, it looks too much like people don't actually care if their accusations make sense and come through, as long as they get the job done (=a lynch)

While Eggplant is currently the biggest lead, I'm not sold on his scumminess at all.
And I don't know why nobody noticed this yet.
I'll read through the push again, I guess.

[Pjovek]

This is a bad post and you should feel bad.

Why are people not allowed to hunt scum after you tell them they are not hunting scum?
And when are they supposed to start?

There is mafia motivation in these words.
Indeed.
Mafia would really love people who are not contributing to continue doing so.
Indeed, if mafia are able to paint scum motivation on people FOR starting to contribute (even if it's just a lil' dash of it), that would be a good thing.

I'm taking both my eyes. And I'm watching the shit out of you, brother.
Yeah.
Even when you're under the shower, yeah.

You're missing the point of the post.

Feel free to watch me in the shower though, my viewer count has been dropping lately!

Oh, I'm watching you so hard. You better believe it.

Also I'd like to note that I never asked for a massclaim. Just a claim of really minor flavor. Not even rolenames or anything. Really minor. I honestly didn't (and don't) see the harm in it.

What if the scum are looking for a specific flavor name/type?

I don't know, why don't you tell me what flavor scum is actually looking for? :3

[Pjovek]

Pjovek--walk me through the thought process of writing Post 16.

Not yet, no.
Suffice to say I was feeling a bit lazy.

Also I'd like to note that I never asked for a massclaim. Just a claim of really minor flavor. Not even rolenames or anything. Really minor. I honestly didn't (and don't) see the harm in it.

My main concern is the inherent risk involved in making a post like that. You appear to be an intelligent player (trolling notwithstanding), and there is an immediate risk that someone

will

think it's not a big deal indeed and start claiming info about their character. I expect you to be aware of this risk--so why take it?

Putting things simply: the scum might know which character is the Apocalypse one. Revealing universes/continuity might help them. Why do you think this is a risk worth taking, either in a trolling form ("let's see who jumps on this!") or genuinely thinking a partial flavor claim is something we should do?


PEdit: I don't see how scum having a fabricated Townread on anyone makes the second person Town.

The thing is, IF scum have additional information on the nature of this role (and we don't know that), then I would expect them to also have some kind of flavor-checking power to look for it directly.
Like a rolecop, just for flavor, I guess.
And that is if the assumption is correct.

Which means if just the universes are claimed, scum still need to investigate people seperatly for exact rolenames (no harm done).

If that is the case, and this is a rather flavor-heavy game, then I would also expect this role to have a sensible fakeclaim.

So, even under this assumption, I don't see too much of harm that may befall us.


A scum-made townread can have basically two motivations: either it's a townread on a scumbuddy to tone down suspicion on him (there was no substantial suspicion on matt at that time, so this is not the case), or it's a "buddying attempt", for lack of a better word. Basically a "look at how cool and correct my reads are, scum would never be this cool and correct"
This specific situation looks more like the second.
Keep in mind that scum already know who is town. (or not-scum at least)
In that situation, it is not rare to see people come to "correct" conclusions for bogus reasons, since the correct conclusion is already known, and only really good scumplayers put in the raw effort to fabricate a logical and sound argument for their conclusion.
It's an ends-justify-the-means thing, where they will say "but I was right so it was not wrong!"

And as a general tendency, weaker mafia players (under which category i'm already putting Eggplant considering that if he's mafia he just made a pretty newbie mistake) are also more reluctant to post a read of any nature of their buddies. They basically mistake "distancing" for "not interacting".

Looking at the situation at hand, by association it would make matt likely town, but this is what it is, preflip associations.
I don't generally like those, but they're kinda relevant in this case.

[Pjovek]

A scum-made townread can have basically two motivations: either it's a townread on a scumbuddy to tone down suspicion on him (there was no substantial suspicion on matt at that time, so this is not the case), or it's a "buddying attempt", for lack of a better word. Basically a "look at how cool and correct my reads are, scum would never be this cool and correct"
This specific situation looks more like the second.

I don't think either of them are scum, but I've seen plenty of scum giving their scumbuddies a Townread from the get go.

It's easier to prevent suspicion from ever arising

than having to fight it back down later.

Except this doesn't happen, especially if you put zero effort and explanation into giving out this read.

I almost never see mafia do this tbh.

Then again, on my homesite, mafia don't give townreads to their scumbuddies at all, unless they play REALLY baller and get strongly misread by the majority of town already.
And even then, some weak and subtle suspicion you put on them works far better for at least one of the parties involved.

Maybe mafiascum is different in that regard.
I know I was very surprised when the two scum defended each other hardcore in the newbie I played (that was after i had already replaced out), right down to the noose, right after the situation was already unsalvageable.
But I didn't think newbies were too indicative of global site meta.

[Pjovek]

tl;dr: atm I might be WIFOMing myself into thinking a scumtell is not a scumtell because scum wouldn't tell scumtells.

That, or Eggplant is town.

Decisions, decisions.

[Pjovek]

VOTE: Sword of omens

[Pjovek]

VOTE: Sword of omens

Do something useful.

I am.

[Pjovek]

Pedit: Hey Pjo, I can guarantee you voting sword is not going to make him talk to you any faster.

And I lynch him.

Easy.

[Pjovek]

VOTE: Unvote
VOTE: Whimsical Eggplant

Perfectly able to post elsewhere on this site.
Yeah.
Let's put this on L-1, shall we.

[Pjovek]

Did it occured to you: (zach, fferyllt and pjovek) that he did not read this thread considering his post is only 2 at other forums and they are only 2 mins apart. Which means there is a high chance that he viewed other forums on mobile and did not read this thread( my interpretation) Thoughts?

A mobile driveby did not occur to me, no. Though you're right that the activity level suggests a driveby.

Do you have a problem with him being at L-2 given your case?

Stahp it.
He's at L-1.

[Pjovek]

Did it occured to you: (zach, fferyllt and pjovek) that he did not read this thread considering his post is only 2 at other forums and they are only 2 mins apart. Which means there is a high chance that he viewed other forums on mobile and did not read this thread( my interpretation) Thoughts?

A mobile driveby did not occur to me, no. Though you're right that the activity level suggests a driveby.

Do you have a problem with him being at L-2 given your case?

Stahp it.
He's at L-1.

You sure? zachrules voted twice because he wasn't sure the name abbreviation would count.

Yes.
I can even count up to ten, my mother is very proud of me.


And I'd rather not have a random quickhammer because people think he's at L-2 when he's at L-1, that always leads to undesireable situations.

[Pjovek]

Maybe mother should have teach you too by hit with stick when do error.

This makes learn fast.

[Pjovek]

All it took was for Tierce to ask nicerly ffery?

pretty much. I don't think one vote (which I'll put back on the wagon if whimsical eggplant's eventual response is underwhelming) makes a huge difference pressure-wise, and removing it mitigates the risk of a derphammer.

Au contraire

Maybe it makes no difference in regard to Eggplant himself, but it is a glorious game of chicken in regard to the people on the wagon itself.
It is sad you flaked so early.

[Pjovek]

I suppose not eating yourself may be wise, but i digress.

[Pjovek]

Because sword was a great day1 lynch (and still is)

In the meantime he has dodged replacement forcing with promises of more lurking, so yeah. A good lynch indeed.


Also should I share my super-secret way of reading ffery as town?
It'll cost you though.

[Pjovek]

Because sword was a great day1 lynch (and still is)

In the meantime he has dodged replacement forcing with promises of more lurking, so yeah. A good lynch indeed.


Also should I share my super-secret way of reading ffery as town?
It'll cost you though.

Ah fuck it I can't hold my bowels.

Behold the power of my scumhunting:
http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... overview=1
Scum is Eggplant, sword and implosion.
fferyllt is the most town.
Don't get mislead by actiondan, he's not actually in the game.

Pjovek™ Scumhunting™ Inc.

[Pjovek]

Because sword was a great day1 lynch (and still is)

In the meantime he has dodged replacement forcing with promises of more lurking, so yeah. A good lynch indeed.


Also should I share my super-secret way of reading ffery as town?
It'll cost you though.

Where did sword promise to do more lurking?

When he posted to let us know he'd actually play the game later.

[Pjovek]

Emphasis on "later"

[Pjovek]

Because sword was a great day1 lynch (and still is)

In the meantime he has dodged replacement forcing with promises of more lurking, so yeah. A good lynch indeed.


Also should I share my super-secret way of reading ffery as town?
It'll cost you though.

Where did sword promise to do more lurking?

When he posted to let us know he'd actually play the game later.

It looks like the opposite of promising to do more lurking.

Do you think that policy lynching in this game is appropriate? Would you be willing to risk outing the apocalypse role base on a policy?

No, it is "I am lurking, but I'll read the thread eventually and maybe one day I'll even post"

Policy lynching is very appropriate, yes.
If you don't lynch people because they could be apocalypse dude, you'll never get anywhere. Literally the same thing can be said of any wagon ever and it has no value at all.
Why are you trying to instill fear and paranoia about this particular wagon, with a meaningless non-argument like that?

This game's daylength is based on activity, so I'd argue that lurking in this game is an even worse offense than in your regular normal game. BTW.
I'm sure I don't have to tell you that longer days generally favor town (up to the "plateau of boredom" that is)

[Pjovek]

No, it is "I am lurking, but I'll read the thread eventually and maybe one day I'll even post"

hmmm?

hey all!!!
back from V/LA and glad to see this one up and running...
gonna read up this morning and get to posting today...9 pages shouldn't be too bad....

If you don't lynch people because they could be apocalypse dude, you'll never get anywhere. Literally the same thing can be said of any wagon ever and it has no value at all.
Why are you trying to instill fear and paranoia about this particular wagon, with a meaningless non-argument like that?

Policy lynches are already questionable because they don't take into account a persons alignment, couple that with the fact that there's a role that we should avoid lynching, and I'm pretty sure that policy lynching is a bad idea.

I'm not trying to instill fear or paranoida in the Sword wagon. I think that your reasons for pushing it are false, since he promised to post today and we are just back from a weekend.

I would expect that someone who was going to be unable to post either for more than a weekend or regularly over the weekend would replace out.

No that's exactly what you're doing, and it's not even an argument either.

Literally everyone and anyone in this game could actually be the apocalypse dude.
Yet you take sword of all people to diffuse a small, short and insignificant push with your emotional fearmongering.
Why do you not say the same of whimsical?
or fferyllt?
or anybody else who has been pushed, ever?

It's like you want to have an argument against it, but you don't have an argument against it, so you have to use a valueless non-argument instead. That's what I'm getting.

[Pjovek]

And people don't policy-lynch nearly enough, actually.

Policy lynches are the best thing since sliced bread.

[Pjovek]

So why do you appeal to emotion instead of just saying that?


PS: You have no balls

[Pjovek]

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[Pjovek]

At sword

[Pjovek]

I already did.

I now additionally suspect you of not reading.

[Pjovek]

4. When I questioned him about what he thought of policy lynching in this game rather than just answering he attempts to cast suspicion on to me for trying to instill fear and paranoia about the wagon. Now he's asking me why I chose to appeal to emotion, which never happened, and he's refusing to point out what he's talking about, and deciding to accuse me of not reading.

That's the same one thing, bambi...

It's an appeal to emotion, because you, like, appeal. To an emotion. Yeah.

[Pjovek]

But please point me to where you made a rational and logical argument instead of appealing to the inherent fear of lynching the apocalypse dude.

You may quote it.

[Pjovek]

Why pjovek is scum:

1. Anti-town proposal of the mass universe claim.

2. Vote on Sword of Omens looks more like trying to look like he's doing something than actually doing something.

3. He made up a false reason to be suspicious of Sword - that Sword promised to continue lurking. When I called him out on it he kept pushing it.

4. When I questioned him about what he thought of policy lynching in this game rather than just answering he attempts to cast suspicion on to me for trying to instill fear and paranoia about the wagon. Now he's asking me why I chose to appeal to emotion, which never happened, and he's refusing to point out what he's talking about, and deciding to accuse me of not reading.

I thought your theory is that I am scum and buddying pjovik up.

It's possible that you are scum doing that, but it's also possible that you liked his play in that past game, so I don't know, and it's not such a big deal.

Pjo misrepresenting SoO's post and inventing reasons to attack me is much worse.

Oh please, keep misrepresenting like all my posts while pushing me for misrepresenting posts.

The hypocricy is tasty and sweet.

[Pjovek]

But please point me to where you made a rational and logical argument instead of appealing to the inherent fear of lynching the apocalypse dude.

You may quote it.

I asked you some questions to try figuring out what you were thinking, you could have just answered, but you decided to accuse me of fear mongering and AtE.

There is still no logic, and only emotionalities, when I ask you for logic instead of emotionalities.
what am I to think of this, heh?

Oh please, keep misrepresenting like all my posts while pushing me for misrepresenting posts.

What have I misreped?

Oh, just like half my filter. No big deal.

[Pjovek]

I could.

But it's funnier not to.

[Pjovek]

There is remarkably little to be gained by waiting around and doing nothing.

[Pjovek]

I'm already restraining myself.

[Pjovek]

It's nonsense to say spam makes the battery go down.

Let's read the OP. I'll take you by the hand.

2. Battery-Powered Deadlines. Deadlines in this game (outside Apocalypse) are measured via a meter that starts at 100% and counts down each real-time day by a varying amount. The amount is based on true activity. If the meter reaches 0%, the Day immediately ends.

The amount is based on true activity.

based on true activity

Oh my.
The amount is based on "true" activity.
Therefor, "non-true" activity has no impact on it.
So, spam is utterly irrelevant to it.

Bask in the light of my shining spears of logic.


That said, due to popular request, I will not be posting anything else today.

[Pjovek]

Yeah my vote is staying.

[Pjovek]

How about you read the actual thread instead of giving worthless and irrelevant reads.

The only thing this can be ever good for is that it makes you look like you're "contributing", and even that only to a cursory glance.

Why are you more interested in looking like you're useful as opposed to finding scum?

pedit: This @Antagon

[Pjovek]

complete coincidence.

[Pjovek]

Oh yeah sorry for flaking, I temporarily forgot this site existed.

I didn't plan on it.