Ninja-edit: Parama, your #2 doesn't make much sense to me. Why are you attributing not paying attention to the thread as a scummy action? It's obviously WIFOM either way, but scum do have inherently more motive to pay close attention to what they say in the thread, because they're trying not to look scummy. Town have the same motive in a way, but it's not as prominent.
Song Contest U-Pick - GAME OVER
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Mastermind of Sin Cassandra Complex
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This is for all you new people: I only have one rule. Everyone fights. No one quits. You don't do your job, I'll shoot you myself. You get me?
Vote: evilpacman18
Ninja-edit: Parama, your #2 doesn't make much sense to me. Why are you attributing not paying attention to the thread as a scummy action? It's obviously WIFOM either way, but scum do have inherently more motive to pay close attention to what they say in the thread, because they're trying not to look scummy. Town have the same motive in a way, but it's not as prominent.Permanent V/LA.-
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I'm not saying there isn't motivation for town, but I do think the motivation is stronger for scum. Both town and scum have to read the thread to find scummy posts, because scum have to fake scumhunting just as much as town have to do real scumhunting. However, scum have the additional onus of needing to make sure that their posts don't look scummy, whereas that is less of a concern for town. Some will argue that town should make an active effort to look town because it helps us (and they're not necessarily wrong), but scum have a very strong and obvious reason to watch what they say and how it might look, which on a basic level means that they will probably pay more attention to the thread than the average town player. This will all eventually devolve into WIFOM, though, but at the most basic level it prompted me to question why Parama thought that particular facet of Garruk's play was scummy.In post 36, Agent Minnesota wrote:I really disagree that scum will want to pay attention more to the thread than town. Town needs to be constantly looking out for scummy posts to play to their win condition. I personally think the motivation is equal but if one is more likely than the other it would be town.
~Agent Minnesota
P-Edit: Parama is doing good things, and I agree that site meta for the beginning of a game is stupid. However, that meta has not really changed at all for the 8+ years I've been on this site. People have always fucked around for no reason at the start of a game, it's just how they do it that changes over time.
Also, pecanpie is making absolutely no sense and I'm pretty sure they sucked his brains out.Permanent V/LA.-
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Dat bandwagon vote... We must meet this threat with our valor, our blood, indeed with our very lives to ensure that human civilization, not insect, dominates this galaxy now and always!
Unvote, Vote: Porkens
Also, Garruk is pretty town. We can move on to more important things like lynching scum now, rather than continuing to flood the thread with pointless back-and-forth wall posts between town. K?Permanent V/LA.-
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Prana, I'm pretty sure that vote only counts if you actually bold the name of the person you want to vote.
Wait, wait...let me get this straight. I've made three votes so far this game:In post 88, Paschendale wrote:I don't think there's anything wrong with Porkens so far. But you? Wagon hopping like crazy. Definitely nothing authentic in Garruk vote. It's absolutely as much a bandwagon vote as you accuse Porkens of. Moreso, really. So, bad votes and calling someone out (inaccurately) for doing something you're doing.
VOTE: Mastermind of Sin
50 Shades, Desperado, Formerfish, Sajin, Pacman, and Generic haven't even posted yet.
1) evilpacman (no one was voting him)
2) Garruk (5 people voting him)
3) Porkens (1 person voting him)
...and you accuse me of "Wagon hopping"? What wagons did I hop between?
Let's not even forget to mention that there were 5 people voting Garruk when I voted EPM, and there were still just the same 5 people voting him when I changed my vote a page later (literally no shift in momentum whatsoever), so I'd be very interested to see you justify that as a "bandwagon vote".
LOL. If we lynch people based on your twisted logick, mankind just became an endangered species.
Isn't it obvious? Porkens tried way harder to justify his bandwagon vote than any of the rest of you. No one else up to that point had really tried to hide the fact that they were just wagonning, and my vote was more for reaction than anything else. Porkens, on the other hand, stretched to try to find multiple reasons to vote for Garruk (who is looking pretty town), so that he could get on the wagon.In post 89, SpyreX wrote:I like Pasch too.
Yo MoS what makes Porkens more of a wagon vote than, ohh, me?
This kind of post is classic scum. Everything comes full circle...In post 87, Porkens wrote:A verdict of scum has yet to be rendered, but the suspect is charged with the following crimes:
1. Wriggling like a fish in the first degree.
2. Meta defense AKA "You would trust me if youknrewInternet."
3. Why me = Fry me
4. Multiple counts of misdemeanor AtE
5. At least three counts of OMGUS
Now, I'm willing to settle out of court if the defense can show signs of rehabilitation. Otherwise, The state will proceed with indictment and seek the death penalty.Permanent V/LA.-
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Everybody needs a friend like me.In post 95, Garruk Relentless wrote:I agree mostly with MoS right now with regards to the gentleman who was my primary source of entertainment this evening.Permanent V/LA.-
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We got reinforced. Most of them are fresh out of newbies.In post 99, Generic wrote:Wow, is there anyone in this game i know?
...
We're the old men, Spy.Permanent V/LA.-
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When you vote, you are exercising political authority, you're using force. And force, my friends, is violence. The supreme authority from which all other authorities are derived.In post 141, Sajin wrote:This style of bashing the person voting you tends to come from your scum game MoS. Also lots of noise from your posts. Why even post troopers flavor?
Vote: MoS
My mother always told me that violence doesn't solve anything.
V/LA 11/22-12/1, very unlikely to be able to post except maybe Monday/Tuesday.
Also, Porkenscum is loving the counterattack that's being mounted for him while he hides out without posting for over 24 hours.Permanent V/LA.-
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@Nacho: Porkens was making a classic scum post because of the way he tried to wrap up his accusations in a light-hearted feel. Going with the whole "lawyer" gimmick is a form of the AtE fallacy; he's hoping the "amusement" of his attack will make the rest of the town like it better. This form of AtE is pretty common from scum.
For example, this reaction is a perfect example of why PorkenScum did what he did.
I want to see more content from EPM, Maenara, and Messiah Complex.In post 145, Desperado wrote:
The case is really bad but the roleplaying is entertaining and feels way too comfortable to be put-on. Who else is scum Porkens?In post 87, Porkens wrote:
A verdict of scum has yet to be rendered, but the suspect is charged with the following crimes:
1. Wriggling like a fish in the first degree.
2. Meta defense AKA "You would trust me if you knrew Internet."
3. Why me = Fry me
4. Multiple counts of misdemeanor AtE
5. At least three counts of OMGUS
Now, I'm willing to settle out of court if the defense can show signs of rehabilitation. Otherwise, The state will proceed with indictment and seek the death penalty.
I've liked Agent Minnesota so far, but something in the back of my head keeps nagging at me that he's playing me. IGMEOY.
Porkens can wait for now, especially since he's decided to try flattering me by calling me tunneling town.
In post 185, Mastermind of Sin wrote:V/LA 11/22-12/1, very unlikely to be able to post except maybe Monday/Tuesday.
You're 0-for-Everything right now, but sure, keep trying to take cheap shots at me after your attempt to get me lynched failed.In post 297, Paschendale wrote:VOTE: PranaDevil
MoS can wait for now, especially since he's decided to just clam up.
Unvote, Vote: Paschendale
The only good bug is a dead bug.Permanent V/LA.-
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I expect the best and I give the best. Here's the beer. Here's the entertainment. Now have fun. That's an order.In post 307, 50 Shades of Purple wrote:nono
we are trying to help you bus porkens so you can get town cred don't wimp out now
Also, I don't need town cred. I'm me.Permanent V/LA.-
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Well, this is boring. The guy who's on V/LA is making more of an effort to be here than the people who are supposed to be here. I'm from Buenos Aires and I say, KILL 'EM ALL!
Mod, it probably doesn't make much sense to even bother with replacements until Saturday at the earliest, what with the holiday and all. It's going to be hard enough for us to keep people posting, but imagine trying to find a replacement while everyone's off on holiday...what's the point?Permanent V/LA.-
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Figuring things out for yourself is practically the only freedom anyone really has nowadays. Use that freedom.In post 400, Maenara wrote:Now, I'd like to grow to not suck at this game, which I evidently do 'cause I get five votes in two pages, but by the gods below, give me a chance.Permanent V/LA.-
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Figuring things out for yourself is practically the only freedom anyone really has nowadays. Use that freedom.In post 405, notscience wrote:I like to sheep them because it tends to make good things happen
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I wouldn't worry about it. We've already established pretty thoroughly that Pasch doesn't know the meaning of the term "wagon hopping". If he insists on continuing to be scum, I only have one piece of advice, Desp:In post 414, Desperado wrote:
Don't worry baby, you're still scum.In post 409, Paschendale wrote:Oh look, Desperado is wagon hopping again. Guy's just full of conviction. He's one of the lazy or scum crowd. Either way, a detriment to town. Notscience is apparently taking the same route. This is not out of character for either of them.
Also: "A detriment to town" are you fucking high son? If there is one thing I am not when I roll town, it is a detriment to the town. The sooner you understand this the better it's going to be for you, regardless of your alignment.
Forget the insecticide, bring on the nukes!Permanent V/LA.-
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Spyrex's case on Generic is pretty juicy. I want to see where this goes. (Don't worry Pasch, I won't forget about your scum-ass. Or PorkenScum, for that matter)
Unvote, Vote: Generic
Young people from all over the globe are joining up to fight for the future. If you're doing your part, say the following in your next post:
"I'm doing my part."
Then vote Generic.Permanent V/LA.-
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Those vigs calls are AWFUL. Picking people whose deaths would give us the least information possible...not to mention not wanting ANY of his top lynch bait vigged? That's what scum do.
Unvote, Vote: Porkens
Put your hand on that wall, trooper. PUT YOUR HAND ON THAT WALL!Permanent V/LA.-
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In post 537, Paschendale wrote:
NS was an RVS vote. No one else was voting for MoS. Prana's wagon certainly wasn't hot. And I'm the third vote on you.In post 527, Generic wrote:You like to follow the hot wagon at the time don't you pasch...
If that's the best you've got, then I feel even better about voting for you.
To the rest of the town -
Here's a tip: Aim for the nerve stem, and put it down for good.Permanent V/LA.-
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Scum say things like this to extend their lifespan, because it puts us on the hook to leave them alive for another day:
If you were really town, you'd have the opposite stance. The best thing a townsperson can do before they die is give the town as much information as they can about their thoughts on the game, because after they die, they become the only people whose posts we can actually trust to be 100% town-motivated.In post 626, Generic wrote:I said I would do a full analysis of the players left day 2 because I don't see any point in putting my back out if I'm lynched or vigged.
Tell me the moral difference, if any, between pro-town and town-aligned?
Answer:The difference lies in the field of civic virtue. A pro-town player accepts personal responsibility for the safety of the body politic, of which he is a member, defending it, if need be, with his life. The town-aligned does not.
Generic is claiming to be town-aligned, but he is not embodying the truly pro-town.
Unvote, Vote: Generic
At this point, I don't care which one of my top three scumreads gets lynched. This game is stalling like a motherfucker and I'm starting to get bored.Permanent V/LA.-
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PL is just a small part of my vote. I think Generic is just trying to survive another day because he can see the momentum of the game...but instead of trying to help the town, he's being purely self-interested. That reeks of scum (or SK), not town. Also, I'm compromising on my #3 scumread because there aren't enough votes on Porkens or Pasch right now. I'd gladly switch to either of them if it seemed like we could get it done before deadline.In post 681, Desperado wrote:Closest he comes is sheeping Spyrex' case and "seeing where it goes."
Then he said
Which reads PL to meIn post 642, Mastermind of Sin wrote:If you were really town, you'd have the opposite stance. The best thing a townsperson can do before they die is give the town as much information as they can about their thoughts on the game, because after they die, they become the only people whose posts we can actually trust to be 100% town-motivated.
Tell me the moral difference, if any, between pro-town and town-aligned?
Answer: The difference lies in the field of civic virtue. A pro-town player accepts personal responsibility for the safety of the body politic, of which he is a member, defending it, if need be, with his life. The town-aligned does not.
Generic is claiming to be town-aligned, but he is not embodying the truly pro-town.
Unvote, Vote: Generic
As for my wording, c'mon...has no one here seen Starship Troopers? Jeez...
I don't think you even know what that means...In post 695, Paschendale wrote:MoS is still a good vote. He's two-faced.
This game is quickly reminding me why I retired. There are a handful of people actually playing, several more derping around being dumbasses, and everyone else is just jacking off in a corner and not participating. Come on you apes, you wanna live forever? Start posting, and not just prod-dodge bullshit.
People who might as well not be in the game right now:
- Formerfish
- EPM
- Garruk
As far as I'm concerned, only Garruk out of that list has left any impression at all on this game, and they basically stopped contributing anything as soon as the Garruk-wagon moved on. Plus, we've already had 4 replacements on Day 1. WTF is that shit?Permanent V/LA.-
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Hey morph wanna reboot the Porkens or Pasch wagons with me? I need a corporal. You're it until you're dead or I find someone better.In post 772, morph the cat wrote:Not so Town
8. Paschendale - Nacho's 274 is a good summary of why.
11. HirakiSajin- need to re-ISO, but not liking him at all atm
14. evilpacman18* - mostly due to long periods with no posting. The out-of-synchness of some of his opinions could be due to periods of inactivity but I don't like some of his stances.
15. Porkens - lots of scumposts
19. MiccMaenara- maenera looked terrible for the most part. Micc hasn't done much since replacing in. I want to understand why this wagon dissipated.Permanent V/LA.-
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I'm slightly less than ambivalent toward an EPM flashlynch. I'm not townreading him, but he's not in my top 3 either. Would only switch to prevent NL at this point...Porkens/Pasch/Generic are still better votes. We must meet this threat with our valor, our blood, indeed with our very lives to ensure that townie civilization, not scum, dominates this song contest now and always!Permanent V/LA.-
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Vote: Porkens
Duh.
In other news:
- morph looks weird today. His interactions with Nachomollie seem off
- Nachomollie is townposting today. Pretty much agreed on the not liking Majiffy's posts
- pecanpie's early posting today leaves bad feelings in my gut
- T-Bone wanting to go back and dissect the Hiraki lynch sounds like scum who knows it was a clusterfuck that will work out in favor of his team if he gets the town to focus on it
- Garruk and notsci continuing to derp through this game and be generally useless
- SpyreX, where is that Micc vote coming from? I don't care that you're continuing your vote from yesterday. You didn't justify it then and you didn't do so now. So what gives?Permanent V/LA.-
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If this is you not derping then uhhhhh...In post 1311, notscience wrote:If I was "derping" This game would probably be >20 pages longer btw
...
They sucked his brains out.Permanent V/LA.-
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Nacho, you once asked me for advice. You want some now?
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I don't recall having much of an opinion either way. Pretty sure they were on my shitlist for doing absolutely nothing this game, but as a result I don't have much of anything to base a read off of. So I'm pretty ambivalent. Feel free to make a case, but I'm pretty happy with my scumreads atm.In post 1332, 50 Shades of Purple wrote:mosy why not micc?
He's quicky moving into the top of my scumreads based on yesterday, and his posting today looks shitty to me.In post 1344, notscience wrote:Can someone remind me why we aren't wagoning EPM
You're dumb. Like...seriously. Why the fuck would you think that claim makes sense right now? I have some more thoughts/questions on this, but I think it's best to hold off for now. I've had a townread on you for a while, so this can wait I think.In post 1348, Garruk Relentless wrote:Alright, so I finally got to talk to SSK.
We're claiming.
We're Poe--Haunted. Roleblocker. We blocked SpyreX last night. I assume you guys can do the math.
Porkens' 1357 has so many things wrong with it:
1) Why would anyone put Formerfish in a townbloc? Or Fake-mastin, for that matter?
2) You've been here since 2008 and you've never seen a town RB? You're shitting me right? Town was the original alignment for RB...it only became a common scum role in very recent years because of its inclusion in one of the newbie setups.
Lawl. They sucked his brains out.In post 1362, morph the cat wrote:In post 1357, Porkens wrote:My only hesitation is that I don’t think I’ve ever seen a town role blocker. Anyone?In post 1337, Alton Brown wrote:You are Hannah Hart, Town Post Restricted 2-shot Roleblocker!
Image
As the host of My Drunk Kitchen, you... mostly drink a lot. Also, you make tons of puns! (Punderful ones!) Oh yeah, and you cook. You’re actually getting better at that, too, I guess.
Cheese Pleasin’ Me: You must include a pun in every post. If you forget 3 or more times during a day phase, you lose your vote for that phase.
Hello!: Twice in the game, you may visit someone and give them alcohol, which will roleblock them.
BOOP-BOOP!: You have a vote.
Win Condition: You win when no threats to the town remain in the game.
The game thread is here. Please confirm by PMing me your rolename, alignment, and brief description of your abilities.
3) That vigbucket is still and always will be completely retarded. Why don't you want anyone you think is actually scum to be vigged? For that matter, why are you calling for vig kills and speculating about SKs on Day 2 when there were no kills last night?
Watching people completely ignore how scummy Porkens is being is so frustrating. Genocide doesn't compare to this.
I was totally feeling morph's responses re:Roleblock, until this:
...as if a Doctor's chances of protecting the kill target night 1 weren't equally small. This is a huge statistical fallacy that confuses a priori probability of a specific event with a fortiori probability of a specific class of events. It serves absolutely no purpose in advancing any logical argument, but it does help morph make it seem more improbable that Garruk correctly blocked SpyreX.In post 1361, morph the cat wrote:Roleblocker's chances of hitting scum night 1 in a 20 player game is pretty small.
FoS: morph, SpyreX
Nachomollie, I will love you forever if you help me lynch PorkenScum. We can deal with the Garruk-SpyreX clusterfuck tomorrow, I think. No later than that, though. We need to get some more information first, but we shouldn't let it fester.
Here's a quick off-the-cuff snapshot of my reads:
Scummy
Porkens
Paschendale
evilpacman18
Generic
morph/SpyreX (they are somewhat intertwined)
Agent Minnesota
T-Bone
Micc
Formerfish
pieceofpecanpie
fake-mastin
caledfwitch
notscience
Majiffy
Garruk Relentless
Desperado
Nachomollie
TowniePermanent V/LA.-
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No, really.In post 1374, Mastermind of Sin wrote:Nachomollie, I will love you forever if you help me lynch PorkenScum. We can deal with the Garruk-SpyreX clusterfuck tomorrow, I think. No later than that, though. We need to get some more information first, but we shouldn't let it fester.
My vote isn't moving.
They'll learn, They messed, With the wrong species.Permanent V/LA.-
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Prepare for Battle!
Where the fuck are these people:
caledfwitch
Agent Minnesota
Micc
Pasch's most recent post is actually pretty reasonable. Not sure how I feel about that.
EPM's 1406 was also mostly reasonable. Not that scum can't sound reasonable from time to time, but I'm noting the change because EPM hasn't been doing or saying much that seems useful or logical so far this game. My gut feeling is scum that's trying harder to head off the potential wagon on him that seems plausible based on various grumblings throughout the game.
Porkens is scum for any/all of the following (not all-inclusive):
1) Trying to make a serious attack in a lighthearted manner so that he positions himself easily to either back out of it (oh, couldn't you tell I was just having fun?) or push it harder, depending on how people react.
2) Calling for vig kills on people he thinks are town (coincidentally trying to tie up the vig kill so that it doesn't get aimed at his scumbuddies that he's probably bussing). Continuing to call for vig kills after a N1 with no kills is just a way to add fluff to his posting and talk about things that don't actually matter (as much as calling for vig kills ever matters...)
3) Claiming that the Micc slot has "reeked" of scum (right along there with SpyreX, neither of them giving a case for it)
4) Trying to cast doubt on Garruk's claim at the same time that he calls them town, AND while he ties morph to SpyreX in "defending so hard" (any of the above would be fine in isolation, but this reeks of scum not committing to a stance so that they have options depending on game momentum, yet again)
I don't understand the point of Generic speculating publicly on whether or not SpyreX would be a NK target.
fake-mastin, why don't you believe SpyreX is scum?
notsci, how do you feel about Agent Minnesota, fake-mastin, and Paschendale?Permanent V/LA.-
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Since you're here for a few hours, give us your cases on Micc and EPM, SpyreX. In every age there is a cause worth fighting for, so why don't you put in that "waste of time" you mentioned and actually help us understand why you have those suspicions?In post 1467, SpyreX wrote:FYI I actually am HERE for at least a few hours while everyone is asleepPermanent V/LA.-
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I still can't tell if you are scum or just stupid. You only wrote two sentences and still somehow managed to convey that you don't understand mafia AT ALL.In post 1479, Paschendale wrote:In post 1466, SpyreX wrote:
I haven't claimed anything and you already don't believe it? Thats a pretty neat trick.Pasch wrote:That said, I'm not seeing much reason to believe Spy's claim at all. That's the one argument Jiffy doesn't make. Yeah, maybe it's better to leave it soft, but it doesn't seem particularly true.
Are you denying that the intent of this post was to claim that you are a PR? Why would anyone be reluctant to claim VT?In post 1417, SpyreX wrote:If you really need the claim from me, I will but I'd rather not. The one thing I will say I'm pretty damn positive Garruk is telling the truth and town.
Sometimes I come back from retirement for a game and it feels like I'm on the front lines of the next frontier; encountering alien species that have not evolved to the point where they can understand universal communication standards. So frustrating...Nacho please save mePermanent V/LA.-
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Really?In post 1482, Paschendale wrote:Why would he bring up claiming at all? No one asked him for one.
Hmmm...In post 1427, Porkens wrote:I say we force Spyrex to hard claim. If he is town, #2 is probably true and he will have protection.
Unvote, Vote: SpyreX
Is there an echo in here?In post 1495, evilpacman18 wrote:oh it just occurred to me Porkens is also scum for wasting time talking about a vigbucket/defending his choices for it when there was no kills tonight
In post 1374, Mastermind of Sin wrote:3) That vigbucket is still and always will be completely retarded. Why don't you want anyone you think is actually scum to be vigged? For that matter, why are you calling for vig kills and speculating about SKs on Day 2 when there were no kills last night?
EPM acting like he just had an independent revelation that hadn't already been fed to him multiple times in-thread really makes me consider giving up on my conviction to lynch Porkens today...grrrrr...In post 1460, Mastermind of Sin wrote: Porkens is scum for any/all of the following (not all-inclusive):
[snip]
Continuing to call for vig kills after a N1 with no kills is just a way to add fluff to his posting and talk about things that don't actually matter (as much as calling for vig kills ever matters...)
That said, I certainly agree with this potshot:
Put your hand on that wall, trooper. PUT YOUR HAND ON THAT WALL!
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I keep forgetting that you are not BBmolla...keep getting molla confused with mollie (esp cuz you're playing with Nacho) and think that you know me. Then I remember that we've basically never played together and you know jack shit about me.
*sigh*
Genocide doesn't compare to this.
Although I have to say that you seem awfully quick to accuse me of trying to set up "another" mislynch. Who, exactly, pushed through Hiraki's lynch? Please, enlighten us all, oh wise one.Permanent V/LA.-
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Hurry up and bus him already, then!In post 1541, evilpacman18 wrote:I want to lynch Porkens.
Liberty is never unalienable; it must be redeemed regularly with the blood of patriots or it always vanishes. Of all the so-called natural human rights that have ever been invented, liberty is least likely to be cheap and is never free of cost.
ie GET THE FUCK OFF YOUR ASS AND DO SOMETHING USEFUL FOR ONCE!
God I am this close to voting EPM...Permanent V/LA.-
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I'm pretty sure Generic is just mudslinging random stuff to give him the chance to bus his scumbuddy when we finally get this wagon moving.In post 1553, T-Bone wrote:
Aside from hitting the panic button, how is his play different from Day 1? It's been consistent, albeit consistently not very good.In post 1546, Generic wrote:Porkens play today is a complete 180 on day 1.
Is it enough to see him lynched? Since spyrex dangled the bait of his role porkens has begun to panic.
Not liking morph's responses to T-Boneat all.
Then again, T-Bone's responses to Nachomollie don't fill me ith confidence either.
I'm from Buenos Aries and I say, KILL 'EM ALL!
morph obviously thinks that everyone I call scum is a buddy I'm bussing. For that matter, mollie seems to think that way, too.In post 1619, 50 Shades of Purple wrote:like right now you are voting epm...why exactly? after mosy whom you were supposed to be looking at fosed him?
Hmm...
Porkens/EPM/Paschendale/morph/T-Bone/Generic for scumteam? Probably not 6 scum, but I think if we lynch from this group we'll hit a lot of them.Permanent V/LA.-
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Formerfish reminds me of myself when I much younger and far more headstrong...ah, the good times.
Did you just admit to fishing for other people to make your cases for you? This is exactly what scum try to do...In post 1625, T-Bone wrote:Which is why I keep going "hey so and so, tell me about my scumreads" but then no one is giving me what I need so
Vote Porkens instead.
Neverpass up a good thing.Permanent V/LA.-
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I'm still not sure where the DV hate is coming from. I haven't gotten any bad vibes from his posts, and his entrance to the game seems genuine. Combine this with the fact that everyone who's posting is either ganging up on him or content to sit on the sidelines, and that leads me to believe he doesn't have anybody in the game (ie scumbuddies) looking out for his well-being. I obviously don't agree with all of his reads, but for the most part they're not bad. You can't step on these ones, at least. My main concern at this point is that he didn't have *anything* at all to say about the two scummiest players in the game (Porkens & EPM). That makes my spidey sense tingle a bit, but otherwise I'd tentatively lean town on DV at this point, so I the only reason I can think of for his wagon is that people got tired of pushing their scumreads and took the easy path instead (and scum are more than willing to let that happen and/or be there to help it along).Permanent V/LA.-
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If it was explainable beyond just the feeling I got from it, I would have explained it already, duh.
Why are you asking useless questions that you already know the answer to?
So what is this suggesting to you about our respective alignments?Then again, T-Bone's responses to Nachomollie don't fill me ith confidence either.
I've always known you were scumreading me...what gave you the impression that I didn't? Do you honestly think that I'm just going to be petty and refuse to interact with people who scumread me as if it was impossible that they might actually be town and capable of logical thought?
I'm not thinking much about associative stuff until I see a scum flip. Right now, I'm trying to figure out which is my strongest scum read. You're not doing a lot to make me feel better about you while I go through that process. It's like you totally missed that I've been scumreading you since not long after we replaced in. You've exhorted me to vote with you multiple times. Finally when there are a few pages worth of posts with Mollie badgering us for an analysis on you, NOW you seem to suddenly notice what we think of your alignment
morph obviously thinks that everyone I call scum is a buddy I'm bussing. For that matter, mollie seems to think that way, too.In post 1619, 50 Shades of Purple wrote:like right now you are voting epm...why exactly? after mosy whom you were supposed to be looking at fosed him?
Hmm...
Some scum pay a lot of attention to thread details. Some don't.
I'm wondering where you fall on that continuum and if this is alignment indicative either way.
I gave you benefit of the doubt on both counts at one point. You've already lost one, and you're doing a great job of making me lose faith in the other.
You're being too short-sighted. I feel like this has been going on throughout all 3 incarnations of that slot. People have been calling them scum, no one's seen fit to take any opposite stance, and they've all just been waiting for an active player to finally step into the slot so they could justify voting someone who was present rather than getting called out for lynching an AFK player. I don't think this is an inherently scummy tactic (just good strategy for getting someone lynched, regardless of your reasons), but I think it's telling that the stance on this slot has been very one-sided throughout the game from what I remember.In post 1724, Desperado wrote:
DV's been in the game for about five seconds and it's the holidays. I think it's premature to suggest he's town because no one is defending him.In post 1721, Mastermind of Sin wrote:I'm still not sure where the DV hate is coming from. I haven't gotten any bad vibes from his posts, and his entrance to the game seems genuine. Combine this with the fact that everyone who's posting is either ganging up on him or content to sit on the sidelines, and that leads me to believe he doesn't have anybody in the game (ie scumbuddies) looking out for his well-being. I obviously don't agree with all of his reads, but for the most part they're not bad. You can't step on these ones, at least. My main concern at this point is that he didn't have *anything* at all to say about the two scummiest players in the game (Porkens & EPM). That makes my spidey sense tingle a bit, but otherwise I'd tentatively lean town on DV at this point, so I the only reason I can think of for his wagon is that people got tired of pushing their scumreads and took the easy path instead (and scum are more than willing to let that happen and/or be there to help it along).
The way that people continue to sheep onto DV without much of a case (it's not like we're in danger of deadline) just reaffirms the point I was making. Come on youapessheep, you wanna live forever? Try thinking for yourself. At least EPM is helping bus his scumbuddy, that's better than most of you fuckers.Permanent V/LA.-
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DV, there wasn't enough momentum against you that I would believe that NONE of your scumbuddies would even make an attempt at defending you in any way. This has been a wagon of apathy, and I don't believe scum get lynched apathetically, especially with no one townreading them at all. That's not to say it's never happened in the long history of this site, but I'm very skeptical of a wagon that forms this way, to say the least.In post 1818, DeasVail wrote:MoS, please answer my question. I appreciate you defending me, but as I'm sure you can understand it doesn't really make you any more town to me.
Call it convenient if you want; I don't really give a fuck. I was referring to your most recent back and forth before I made that comment, and it doesn't feel like your interaction with him is coming from town. That's all I have on that, or I'd have pushed it harder.In post 1819, morph the cat wrote:
That's conveniently non-specific. Which responses? T-Bone and I have been interacting practically since I replaced in.
You already know my reads on you, T-Bone, and Nachomollie, so you have already admitted to know the answer to the question even if you continue professing not to. Please stop wasting my time.Because I don't. I'm trying to figure out how this relates to your nachomollie read. Because understanding where a player is coming from is the first step to being able to find a potential town motivation for what they are doing.
I was calling for you to help me vote people you claimed to be scumreading; in what way did that make you think I was "blissfully unaware" of your stances? I don't even...wut?Until this post, you haven't really interacted with me. "Yo, vote my scumread" didn't give me anything useful about your thoughts on my stances - in fact it appeared you were blissfully unaware of my stances, and suggested you weren't actually paying attention to my post content.
Scumreading you and believing you incapable of logical deduction are two very different things. However, I'm glad to report that you've successfully convinced me that both are quite possible.
I thought you had already lost faith. Aren't you scumreading me? Aren't I T-Bone's scumbuddy?I gave you benefit of the doubt on both counts at one point. You've already lost one, and you're doing a great job of making me lose faith in the other.
They sucked his brains out, folks.Permanent V/LA.-
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I don't have a particularly townish read on SpyreX. However, I don't have much evidence that he's scum, either. He's in my "leaning scum" category mainly due to lack of looking protown. He's not in my top scumreads, though, so I don't know why I'd ever consider him even as a compromise today, when there are much scummier players to lynch. You can't step on these ones.Permanent V/LA.-
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We've still got a week. Why are you compromising already? It's almost like you didn't actually want to lynch your scumbuddy Porkens.In post 1883, evilpacman18 wrote:Of all my compromise options, SpyreX is the one I'm most ok with so
vote:SpyreX
50, why aren't you trying to lynch DV, you very clearly called him scum after one of his first posts.
Unvote, Vote: EPM
You're just now realizing this? I've been saying that for a while... -_-In post 1887, Desperado wrote:Pasch needs to die.
What? Why would one person who is very likely to be scum calling for SpyreX to claim making it "necessary"? How are you so arrogant as to think that your influence is so strong that SpyreX refusing to claim because you asked for it is him somehow going back on his word?In post 1892, Porkens wrote:As for SpyreX, a few things really bug me. First of all, after Garruk’s claim, SpyreX said he would be willing to claim if necessary. However, when I (essentially) said it was necessary, he replied I should be murdered. I think he read the tide of opinion and switched his stance accordingly. Many of you have said that SpyreX shouldn’t claim in order to WIFOM the mafia. In a vacuum, I agree. However, with the roleblock, and the NK, I think pinning SpyreX to a claim will be much more valuable to the town in the long run. Finally, again, sure: a million things could have happened last night. However, the scenarios I posited earlier, I maintain, are, by far, the most likely, and, therefore, it is safe for SpyreX to claim. I say that it is important for the town to understand whether SpyreX was involved in the NK or not.
Can we please lynch Porkens? I already want to switch my vote back, but the only person who would vote me with him is EPM (who was only doing it half-heartedly because they're scumbuddies).
I'm from Buenos Aries and I say, KILL 'EM ALL!Permanent V/LA.-
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I was just about to post this when the site went down. Stupid tigers.
morph, I've only played with a few people in this game: T-Bone, Nacho, MafiaSSK (maybe...I know he's played in games I've modded but can't remember if we've actually played together), and SpyreXIn post 1912, 50 Shades of Purple wrote:
I have never played with him before! I will have to reread that exchange cos tbh I skimmed I didn't understand what you were trying to do there.In post 1909, morph the cat wrote:I'm here now.
Mollie, I decided to try for some actual interaction with MoS before doing a static analysis. I was a little surprised that what I got back was as venomous as it was.
First game with him. Was that interaction typical of town-him interacting with a scumread?
what info did you gather from that exchange?
Only SpyreX has played a significant number of games with me, as far as I can recall. I've maybe done a handful or less each with T-Bone and Nacho.
I'm not going to bother to self-meta because I get the feeling you wouldn't give me any credence even if I quoted you past games myself. Plus, anyone who puts much stock in meta or past behavior is deluding themselves. Either way, it's more fun to watch you try to get the information from people who have absolutely no idea.
Figuring things out for yourself is practically the only freedom anyone really has nowadays. Use that freedom.
No comment.In post 1915, 50 Shades of Purple wrote:mosy what song did you pick? cos your posts continue to give the impression that you have to post in starship troopers speak and I can't really think of a song that would go with that
You think arrogance is more likely from town than scum? The arrogance itself is a null-tell. I'm just frustrated with the fact that he's still scummy and no one seems to see it.In post 1916, DeasVail wrote:
Don't you think this is not very scummy and in fact more likely from town?In post 1911, Mastermind of Sin wrote:How are you so arrogant as to think that your influence is so strong that SpyreX refusing to claim because you asked for it is him somehow going back on his word?
Also, scum so vehemently trying to out the claim makes me actually doubt my "leaning scum" read on SpyreX.Permanent V/LA.-
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I'm not gonna start posting more frequently just to make you happy. I'm well past the golden days where I could afford to just sit around the computer refreshing...heck, I used to be that kid that would make sure that every forum on the site listed me as the most recent poster (as if that was a worthwhile pursuit, LOL). No more, though. Plus, I'm tiring of coming up with new quotes every time, and I'm having to recycle a lot. So I'm definitely not going to engage in any quick back-and-forth two-liner exchanges.In post 1940, morph the cat wrote:I did tell you what I've got so far. The exchange isn't over and I'm intrigued by something atm. I wish MoS would post more frequently. I don't want to explain what I'm seeing until I have a better feel about something I'm picking up in his playstyle.
You haven't met Internet Stranger, have you? =PIn post 1943, DeasVail wrote:
I don't mean arrogance in general, but that specific feeling, where you believe that what you think should be what happens, and expect it to be what happens. I think this is much more of a townie attitude than a scum one. If town, he honestly believes that it's the right course of action, so it's not a huge leap for him to expect it to happen. Scum are less likely to expect town to do what they say because they know that their posts are motivated by self-interest rather than helping the town.In post 1928, Mastermind of Sin wrote:You think arrogance is more likely from town than scum? The arrogance itself is a null-tell. I'm just frustrated with the fact that he's still scummy and no one seems to see it.
This! We must meet this threat with our valor, our blood, indeed with our very lives to ensure that human civilization, notIn post 1936, caledfwitch wrote:Whoever made all those posts about previous games (probably mollie) is going off topic and deserves a bullet to the head. USE CONTENT FROM THE GAME PLEASE, I OFFER ACTUAL CONTENT IN EXCHANGE.insectmeta-freak, dominates this galaxy now and always!
LOL did Pecan just claim scum?Permanent V/LA.-
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I just want to point out that of the 6 "wagons" listed in that VC, the two with the most votes (DV/SpyreX) are the least likely to be scum (SpyreX/AMinn is probably a tossup, but whatever). That makes me incredibly sad. What the actual fuck are you dumbshits doing?
P.S. - morph I have no idea wtf you're on about. Nachomollie is correct in that you're being fucking weird. You act like you expect me to respond to something... *NEWSFLASH* nobody has any clue what you're saying! Stop being cryptic and fucking man up and explain yourself, because everyone's just sitting here looking at you like you're rain man or something. They're doing their part. Are you?Permanent V/LA.-
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In post 1994, morph the cat wrote:
Well then.In post 1991, Mastermind of Sin wrote:P.S. - morph I have no idea wtf you're on about. Nachomollie is correct in that you're being fucking weird. You act like you expect me to respond to something... *NEWSFLASH* nobody has any clue what you're saying! Stop being cryptic and fucking man up and explain yourself, because everyone's just sitting here looking at you like you're rain man or something. They're doing their part. Are you?
What I thought I might be seeing in your post wasn't there, and what is there appears to be garden variety knowledge of alignment.
I expect the best and I give the best. Here's the beer. Here's the entertainment. Now have fun. That's an order.Permanent V/LA.-
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Yea I get the feeling that scum are hoping to run you up for a claim right before deadline and then get a mislynch as people kneejerk off your wagon and have to find something before the day ends. It's what I'd do, after all.In post 2067, SpyreX wrote:What isn't going to happen is me getting run up claiming and then watching it dissolve. So, if you're committed you better actually be committed for the ride.
The problem is, the rest of the town are all dumbshits who seem content to let this happen. When you vote, you are exercising political authority, you're using force. And force, my friends, is violence. The supreme authority from which all other authorities are derived. So let's get fucking violent! (and lynch Porkens/EPM)Permanent V/LA.-
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Stop being dumb.In post 2071, 50 Shades of Purple wrote:this is a weird post. 6 shades of dumb is an allusion to our hydra and yet...we are voting for the same person he is?
VOTE: spyrella
It's not a personal crusade to want to lynch scum...and I'm not going to stop reminding people that Porkens is scum just because I have my vote on his scumbuddy. Life's tough, ain't it? Seriously though...you and DV both look WAAAAAY more town than EPM/Porkens. We should lynch one of them instead.In post 2073, SpyreX wrote:MoS... I think he's town. I like the fact hes willing to look at other things. I REALLY dont like the fact nowhe brought up Porkens again instead of crusading hard on EPM if he doesn't like either of us for a lynch.
He's part of the special epidemic that is personal crusades + delicious butternuts + lazy that is this game, but more likely town than a few of the morass.
What the fuck are fake-mastin and caled doing? They're the ones who aren't making good use of their votes.
Mod: Can we get prods on fake-mastin and caled? Neither have posted in 2014.
Newsflash: You being a dipshit and pissing me off isn't indicative of me being scum. Shocker.In post 2076, morph the cat wrote:I'm willing to entertain the possibility that MoS simply rubs me the wrong way to the nth power.
Naked force has resolved more issues throughout world history than any other factor. The contrary opinion that violence never solves anything is wishful thinking at its worst. So, nut up and deal with it.Permanent V/LA.-
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Wow...just...wow. If you had actually read Scummer of Love, you'd know that it could not be used as a meta reference on me at all.In post 2106, 50 Shades of Purple wrote:If ffery and cabd look into Scummer of Love Invitational and Balto Invitational (I think?), they might see what I'm talking about. Hint, hint.
...and I wasn't even in Balto...wtf?
Your ability to build meta cases is absolutely terrible, mollie. You decided to use Always On (a game which occurred 90% outside the thread and thus has no record for you to meta from), Scummer of Love (a game in which I got myself lynched D1 because shit got personal; why exactly would I want to repeat that type of play?), and Balto (a game I WASN'T EVEN IN).
That's some epic fail, brah.
As Neil Patrick Harris would say... Your basic Arachnid warrior isn't too smart, but you can blow off a limb...
As for the rest of your case, you claim that I've had static reads for the entire game and then berate me for switching onto Paschendale...nice contradiction. If my reads have been so static all game, then why am I voting EPM now? How did morph move from being a town read to a scum read? Hell, I'm not even sure Generic is scum anymore...he's certainly not at the top of my list right now.
And if you think I don't have a case on EPM simply because I didn't compile it all into one post, you're fucking blind. Hell, I had a case on Porkens far before I did that, too. My "compiled" case was just a reiteration of all the things I'd already said. I don't do that very often, but you dumbshits pissed me off because you weren't getting it.
Voting EPM isn't a compromise lynch. I'm voting him because I'm now equally confident in his scumminess as I am Porkens'. What made you think it would be for any other reason, seriously?
This is fucking rich as hell. You're agreeing with EPM but you think I'm scummy? You do realize that EPM copied all of his points against Porkens from me, right? That means you're agreeing with the case made on Porkens by someone you also think is scum. Why won't you just admit that? Why hide behind this facade of sheeping EPM?In post 2098, Paschendale wrote:Oh good, I didn't miss anything important while I was gone yesterday. I'm losing interest in the Spy wagon. He's not really acting all that scummy and the night result alone really shouldn't be sufficient. Everyone on it seems complacent and I feel similarly and I don't think that's a sign of a good wagon. EMP's detractors, meanwhile, are full of passion. That's a good indicator to me at the moment, but then I looked him over. I think he's right about the general consensus against Porkens. Why aren't there more votes there? Most of his posts are weak, and there are so few of them. A lot of his talk is about PRs, and sure he gives lists, but he doesn't back most of his reads up with any thoroughness. I find myself agreeing with EPM a lot more than agreeing with his detractors.
VOTE: Porkens
In case you haven't been paying attention, we're still basically in Day 1 in terms of useful information with which to do any "game solving". Come back and bitch at me once we have more to work with. You know as well as I do that there aren't any useful conclusions we can make about the game yet (other than that you and morph are fucking retarded).In post 2106, 50 Shades of Purple wrote:
I feel the strongest bits I have against MoS are his weird Porkens interactions (an important point because you're voting Porkens right now), and meta of him putting on a personality and showing a hell of a lot of confidence but no game solving early on (while his town game is usually a bit of confidence --> lots of game solving --> lots of confidence). If ffery and cabd look into Scummer of Love Invitational and Balto Invitational (I think?), they might see what I'm talking about. Hint, hint.In post 2100, Paschendale wrote:T-Bone one was a better case, though he doesn't feel particularly scummy to me. MoS one was nitpicky and weak, and I lean scummier on MoS.
Would you rather he kept his vote solo on a wagon that isn't gaining any steam, when deadline is in two days? He made it clear that he'd gladly switch back to T-Bone in an instant if the wagon went anywhere.In post 2108, morph the cat wrote:Nacho, one of the things that worries me about deas is how ready he is to move his vote, though it seems like he always has someone scummier he'd rather vote.
I remember in the Dr Who game thinking that deas seemed to often take a good while to percolate on his votes. The lack of will to push his own top reads does remind me a little of Dr Who, though. He repeatedly FoSed me, and was approving anytime someone else FoSed or voted me, but never made any real effort to get me run up, much less lynched.
Compromising a week ago would have been idiotic. Finding the best place for your vote now? That's just business.Permanent V/LA.-
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- Posts: 15163
- Joined: October 30, 2004
- Location: Sleeping with the Godfather's Daughter
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Mastermind of Sin Cassandra Complex
- Cassandra Complex
- Cassandra Complex
- Posts: 15163
- Joined: October 30, 2004
- Location: Sleeping with the Godfather's Daughter
He's been obvscum for two whole days now...what more do you need? Have youIn post 2219, DeasVail wrote:
Is there a reason why we should be auto-lynching Porkens (as opposed to your standard lynching)?In post 2215, Mastermind of Sin wrote:Why are we not auto-lynching Porkens?readhis ISO?
When you come right to it, it is easier todiethan it is to use your head. I'd like more people in this game to do something other than die.Permanent V/LA.-
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Mastermind of Sin Cassandra Complex
- Cassandra Complex
- Cassandra Complex
- Posts: 15163
- Joined: October 30, 2004
- Location: Sleeping with the Godfather's Daughter
In post 2061, Garruk Relentless wrote:I am in this position where my role actually supports a lurking disposition so scum can't play around my reads too much.In post 2235, Garruk Relentless wrote: I didn't block Morph(my other scumread) because I know they wouldn't submit kill with my eye on them.
There are no dangerous weapons; there are only dangerous men.Permanent V/LA.-
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Mastermind of Sin Cassandra Complex
- Cassandra Complex
- Cassandra Complex
- Posts: 15163
- Joined: October 30, 2004
- Location: Sleeping with the Godfather's Daughter
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Mastermind of Sin Cassandra Complex
- Cassandra Complex
- Cassandra Complex
- Posts: 15163
- Joined: October 30, 2004
- Location: Sleeping with the Godfather's Daughter
Why are our three most prolific posters the only ones not voting anyone? That seems really odd right now...When you vote, you are exercising political authority, you're using force. And the three people who have been the most active in this game aren't exercising that authority right now. Why?
(Note: Yes, I know there are people with more posts than DeasVail, but consider that he has ~120 votes in less than half the time that most people have been in this game.)Permanent V/LA.-
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Mastermind of Sin Cassandra Complex
- Cassandra Complex
- Cassandra Complex
- Posts: 15163
- Joined: October 30, 2004
- Location: Sleeping with the Godfather's Daughter
Why the fuck is everyone voting Pecan over Porkens? Porkens is so obviously the scumbag out of that pair. I mean, just look at the entirety of his behavior surrounding Pecan:
In post 71, Porkens wrote:Piece: Yeah.
Note that this comes within 1-2 pages of Porkens getting suspicions noted from the likes of M45tin, Maenara, Parama, Desperado, and Nachomollie.In post 354, Porkens wrote:I dislike pieceofpecanpie’s “do you always play like this?” question. What is that? Why is he calling out T-Bone for making the same votes he wants to make?
I liked Fish’s intro post. Good points on Pecan.
[snip]
Yeah, pecan can be scum.
(In this post he lists Pecan as one of his top three suspects, along with Maenara and PranaDevil)In post 528, Porkens wrote:Pecan is so god damn scummy, jesus.
In post 824, Porkens wrote:Deciding between Micc and Pieceofpecanpie is hard, because while PoPP has been more scummy by volume, what little I've seen from the Maneara/Micc slot has simply reeked.
Vote: PieceofpecanpieBut more evidence is more evidence.In post 1085, Porkens wrote:Pieceofpecanpie is still scum, but as needs must...
Unvote
Vote: evilpacman
(He now lists Piece along with EPM, MoS, Micc/Maenara and Paschendale as his top 5 suspects)In post 1357, Porkens wrote:Hiraki’s lynch, color coded, for your convenience:Desperado,Generic,notscience,morph the cat*,M45t1n,Garruk Relentless,Formerfish,evilpacman18,pieceofpecanpie,50 Shades of Purple,Hiraki(LYNCH)
[snip]
Piece isto me.obvscum
[snip]
Vote: pieceofpecanpie
In post 1538, Porkens wrote:@World:I'm more than happy to lynch Pecan after we run SpyreX up the ladder and see what shakes out.In post 1681, Porkens wrote:of course I'm fine with lynching pecan, mos, or any other of the BRIGHT RED SCUMBAGS on my scum list.In post 2193, Porkens wrote:Why do I somehow feel that this game, even with all the new people, is going to be so much more of the same.
Once more into the breach. Ho.
Vote: PecanIn post 2310, Porkens wrote:There goes pecan, Jesus.If reading this isn't enough for you to vote PorkenScum, I honestly don't know what is. The timing of his #354 seems to me like scum trying to capitalize on momentum against Pecan to try and get a mislynch. However, he's obviously not actually worried about scumhunting him, because he's spent a LOT of time proclaiming Pecan as scum and next to zero time actually presenting reasons for Pecan to be scum (probably because he knows it's not true). By the numbers, he's spent 9 posts talking about how Pecan is scum and he'd like to lynch him. He's spent exactly ONE post (#354) presenting anything that could remotely be construed as a reason to think Pecan might be scum.
I mean, seriously, how retarded are you people? Come on, you sons of bitches! Do you wanna live forever?Permanent V/LA.-
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Mastermind of Sin Cassandra Complex
- Cassandra Complex
- Cassandra Complex
- Posts: 15163
- Joined: October 30, 2004
- Location: Sleeping with the Godfather's Daughter
What the fuck just happened?
I seriously have no idea how to process all of this information...I feel like half the PRs in the game are probably lying right now.
Like, seriously, I don't trust ANY of the claims that have been made. The question "but why would the claim what they did at that time?" is moot, because it doesn't make sense for scum to make any of the claims that have been made so far, but there's no way that all of you are telling the truth.
Can someone please compile a player list with claims so we can try to sort this out?
The most noble fate a man can endure is to place his own mortal body between his loved home and the war's desolation.Permanent V/LA.