Suburban Warfare - GAME OVER

[farside22]

Vote: oversoul

He knows why.

[farside22]

How did everyone else's neighborhood chats go

Mine was boring. People said hello, metal was hoping for day chat. Anxiety was anxiety. Mollie just said hi.

Did you get anything from anyone?

[farside22]

Damn phone, why won't it take the quote stuff from each page?

Hoopla: you can come to my neighborhood I need someone.

Mollie: felt like she over reacted to maf but lot looks like a history there. I didn't believe mollie thought just confirm in the neighborhood, but I like her questions. Il put her at null till I get more info that makes my initial feelings either disappear or expand.

I don't like hoopla. I've got a good feeling about oversoul and I feel that they are scum v town.
I especially don't like the way he claimed. I feel he is scum trying to get a claim out day 1 and resist until later days. I think he is some kind of 2 shot something

Didn't you have the neighborhood that had claims in it? Why is hoopla scum with his claim and asking if lynching him is beneficial?

Unvote: oversoul
Vote: vezo

[farside22]

Unvote: oversoul
Vote: vezo

Fucking phone. I will be swearing each day about it.

[farside22]

Hoopla: why would you claim something you know is more helpful to the town? Please don't give the not sure how to handle role response. My expectations of you are higher then that.

[farside22]

Hoopla: why would you claim something you know is more helpful to the town? Please don't give the not sure how to handle role response. My expectations of you are higher then that.

daytalk for the neighborhoods is not objectively better

@ vezok: someone asked you why you want to lynch hoopla for claiming when your neighborhood included multiple claims. you should answer them.

I disagree. Experience is that scum don't work well being grilled by a smaller group.
Why do you think it is not better?

Also, vezo answer is thus.

Vezok, what claim would hoopla be trying to get out?

You misunderstood me.

I meant that Hoopla is a player who played a lot. She probably has pretty god town and scum games.

I fear that her claim is of anti-encryptor was just a risky move so she can make it through the day. She knows that MS meta is to not lynch RVS anti-town claims (I.e. : miller).
Her relaxed nature could very well be faked as scum.

It isn't anything substantial hence why I didn't vote. Consider her in null-scum territory.

I was satisfied overall, what is your issue with vezo?

[farside22]

I noticed spyrex is.. basically no where to be found d.


Even in the qt he just came and said hi.

Anyway

What are trying to get at with this? not posting at this point is pretty null.

Hoopla: why would you claim something you know is more helpful to the town?

This was already asked and answered. Current read of hoopla? and/or thoughts on her response to me?

If you read my question in full you could tell I was not thrilled with hoopla's original response. As a current read for hoopla and his response I lean town but wary of him. Last game I recall hoopla I was town reading him and he was scum. As for you I lean null with not enough info.

[farside22]

yeh I saw that part about not wanting "how to handle role?" - didn't get that you were referring to original. Thought you were just rehasing my question or didn't see it.

(plus was curious where the wariness was coming from since you were comfortable extending a neighborhood invitation to hoopla)

I liked hoopla's original response. Felt honest to me.

Vezo's comment about hoopla reminded me about the type of player he can be.

What's your thoughts on desp?

[farside22]

Liking anti for town mollie

I am leaning in that direction mebbe.

he looks super relaxed.

he has "experimental fridays" so I hope to see him before this round ends cos my participation will be spotty.

@ anti

I don't think I have experience with bv but we were a LURVE match in chamber's vday thing or whatever it was.

I can see hoopla's claim as coming from town with the set up but I don't know much about hoopla. ony 1 game and I subbed in and I thought she was town.

question for those who know hoopla: does she tend to play towards the game mechanic or to her meta?

Game mechanic if I remember correctly.

meta on despy, mollie?

bv's despy vote = good or bad? i think bad

Why was it bad?

[farside22]

I am sure scum will have ways to end discussion in a neighborhood.

You should stop posting before I lead a lynch on you. You look townier when you

lurk

.

Since when have I been lurking? Or is this a meta call on me?

Neigher. It was a cheeky line about how I find your posts scummy.

Which im now voting you for.

VOTE: Oversoul

Is it self meta you found scummy or something more?

selfmetaselfmetaselfmeta

poop

Why is self meta scummy? Are you saying only scum do it?

Also one post out of I don't know how many does not equal scum in my book.

Here is where my interest lies.

Vote: AGar

[farside22]

My why agar is scum post.

Majiffy claimed cult recruiter.

Discuss.

Doesn't offer any thought on the subject and states nothing further about this.

Hoopla: why would you claim something you know is more helpful to the town? Please don't give the not sure how to handle role response. My expectations of you are higher then that.

daytalk for the neighborhoods is not objectively better

@ vezok: someone asked you why you want to lynch hoopla for claiming when your neighborhood included multiple claims. you should answer them.

I answered that. And stop misrepping me. I never said I want to lynch hoopla. I said I find his claim and the way he did it scummy. That doesn't equal lynch.

We should lynch this.

where did you answer that question?

and i'm not misrepping you, you're creating unreasonable distinctions and then crying wolf. you said that you don't like hoopla and feel good about oversoul and think they're tet-a-tet was scum v town. you also

especially

didn't like his claim and created a narrative for why he is scum doing it. saying all of this and then calling misrep because you don't actually want to lynch him, you just think he's scummy is seriously terrible

And this.

Never mind.

Don't answer that question.

Hoopla's shtick is game mechanics, so let her do her thing. Why are you guys thinking she is scum? When she is advocating her own death to forward the game?

And definitely this.

Also, Hoops/Bob/Desp, was he this loopy in the QT?

was this the post overly soul?

is it cos it he is trying to tie teams? cos yeah I caught that.

so in his pool do you think is most likely scum? there will be at least 1 in there.

@ bv

what are all of your reads right now?

My reads can be summed up in the phrase "It's page 5 and most of that is loopy mcdingus mass-posting".

@Mollie, he's asking about when I asked if the vote was for a real reason, meta reason, or discussion-making (which you didn't answer, btw)

But not this.

We should also stop talking about Hoops' claim because dumb.

Has 3 scum reads but doesn't vote for any of them.

So all three scum came in the same neighborhood as you?

That's literally what you've said thus far.

since neighborhood mechanic is random, i'm disregarding it to start

Yes but three of four. Literally 75% of the scumteam, and 75% of the neighborhood. I don't know math that well but the statistical probability of that has to be one in a fuckton fucktons.

why should we lynch desp?

The angle of how he's pushing Vezok. He's not

wrong

but he comes across hyperfocused on what Vezok is saying. Either they're scum together or Desp is hyperfocused on getting Vezok lynched to the point where he is going to overanalyze the shit out of him.

also, what was particularly incriminating about the oversoul quote?

"Let hoops do her thing" is "Leave hoops alone." which is never a town mindset to have.
"Why would scum offer themselves up?" is just plain shite.

Explains further still no vote

selfmetaselfmetaselfmeta

poop

isntasbadaspeoplemakeitouttobeisntasbadaspeoplemakeitouttobeisntasbadaspeoplemakeitouttobe

ah!

yesitisdontgetmestartedyesitisdontgetmestartedyesitisdontgetmestarted

VOTE: Oversoul

Look wagon starts and he jumps on. Agar town would have voted out the gate

[farside22]

oversoul / bob / vezok / maybe metal sonic

i'm right there with you on vezo/bv but not os/bob. explain?

Someone is noticing the usual policy lynches as a scum read, noted.
Also there is a wagon on os did you miss it, disagreed with it, if disagreed who is scum on the wagon?

[farside22]

what's this about policy lynches?

maybe there was a time when you could say that for vezok, but oversoul/bob/bv don't seems like VIs and vezok's come a ways from his VI days himself.

Just a few things you may have missed.
1. Desp called out only vezo and bv as scum,
2.what you may in this group falls under easy lynches.
3. My meta on them is more from close to 2 years old.

Giving people space to let them slip up is holy crap, a viable strategy!

Especially for people who are prone to lurk as scum!

How they gonna slip up if you just wanna let 'em lurk?

HUH?

The angle of how he's pushing Vezok. He's not wrong but he comes across hyperfocused on what Vezok is saying. Either they're scum together or Desp is hyperfocused on getting Vezok lynched to the point where he is going to overanalyze the shit out of him.

no shit i'm hyperfocused on what vezok is saying...that's the whole point of the conversation.

unless you're suggesting i should have just ignored him erroneously crying misrep?

I'm saying it's unnatural of how hyperfocused you are on

Page 5

. We're not days into a day phase where you suddenly zero in on every little thing because you want a suspect lynched.

You went from zero to "KILL WITH FIRE" in about 2.4 seconds. Now if you saw something REALLY worth the hyperfocus, by all means, point it out. But "Hoopla's claim was scummy but I don't want to lynch her" isn't gonna cut it. People do scummy things worth noting but not an immediate lynch all the time.

Misrep as far as I'm concerned is always a term worth ignoring.

You be kettle, desp can be pot.

agar wagon is good actually. not forgetting about antihero. putting dat in my mental notez

UNVOTE:

VOTE: agar

What exactly is bothering you about anti?

[farside22]

Just a few things you may have missed.
1. Desp called out only vezo and bv as scum,
2.what you may in this group falls under easy lynches.

3. My meta on them is more from close to 2 years old.

... i rest my case...

So your reason for finding vezo scum is what?

[farside22]

Majiffy: are you town reading agar? If so why? If not why is hoopla's vote bad?


Agar: you accused desp from going to 0 to die with fire on vezo. I see you going the same with oversoul.

I found your posting regarding neighborhoods disingenuous and anti-town. I found your reactions to my vote incredibly scummy.

I won't be unvoting any time soon.

Which post read that way?

Mollie:

I am thinking that far is town when shd probs convince her that it is a good idea to work with us mebbe. desp I am waiting on, he knows how to sneak past me as scum in rvs so NO COOKIES FOR YOU RIGHT NOW DESP.

agar is still a loose town read on that I can get weird on later.

You want to explain the agar town read.

I have done town bloc's before.

Sure let's talk reads for a moment. I want your views on agar and desp back in return.

First oversoul: oversoul from what I notice exaggerates things in general. He's you always scum read me and he'll say no one can read me is null, go look he does it often. He tried to generate discuss from the start asking about people's neighborhoods. Mostly I see oversoul chatting it up, not alignment inductive, but the thought process on hoopla looked genuine. Willing to think of the pro's and con's of the lynch reads town. Scum would just fluff the question without the back and forth thinking.

Hoopla: hated, hated hoopla's first post. It was weird to me. He did want a better neighborhood that talked, null.
Hmm rereading hoopla I'm feeling worse about my initial town read. I see now he talks about oversoul and not liking his response but votes for maffijy. I agree with hoopla about oversoul being town. I see he posted more since the question was asked so just leave hoopla as wary till I catch up.

Hoopla

: why did you vote do maffijy if oversoul's response bothered you.

Bv310: he is pretty null. Bv paying attention to the game is the one pro I find. He's at best weak town to null. I'm not very good reading people that post one liners.

[farside22]

Mollie:
The neighborhood of ours was boring. I don't know how you get anything from it. Based on the game and our group. I think you are town and I my gut think aniexty is town. I have nothing on metal.


I haven't been back to the neighborhood, I am not gonna until i hear from all of my neighbors! can you all give a reads list (of our neighbors) pretty plz?

More to the point (and something I'll want a hand with parsing through) the amount of background heat on OS is waaay to high for it to be natural.

I totally agree with this. Majiffy --> Antihero --> Agar is a pretty junk wagon. I would say the amount of overall suspicion on Oversoul (not just the votes he's getting) makes him seem town and that what is happening right now is scum are gleefully chomping at that low-hanging fruit.

Looking back at the game I think some may find your interaction with oversoul a bit suspect and oversoul's comments to you pretty worthless.

Looking at a few of the lurkers:

- Metal Sonic seems VI'ish. Anyone played with him a lot that can comment on his style? Seems kinda useless, but not really in a suspicious way.
- ZZZX is more active lurky and suspect than MS, mostly because he asks a few comments and has weighed in on a couple of theory topics. Looks like he is just skating by, while still kinda here, as opposed to MS who is completely away with the fairies. Dunno why that feels more suspicious, but it just does.
- If I remember bv is usually pretty laconic and borders on lurking some of the time. So maybe not that out of character for him?

As usual, I'm not that opposed to lynching a lurker on D1 if other wagons fall through.

How does metal read vi? He reads pretty useless.
Bv hasn't really changes as far as I can tell, but it's early.

[farside22]

I said before I have finals in the next few weeks so I have hte right to lurk for a day phase.. please? At least I am trying.

Do me a favour and make a non-RVS vote.

If you are unsure just join the AGar-train

Agar train isnt good enough .

I need to do a quick check. I am not sure about my neighborhood as I did something scummy to test thier reactions(and failed horribly) but this is interesting as I dont see the early votes (RVS or non-RVS) that I would have expected. I am sure that at least one in my neighbor is town trying to slightly whiteknight me or something like that. As I believe I am usually an easy lynch to push because of my bad playstyle.

Vezo voted for you does that tell you anything?
Second spy is too seasoned to fall for traps.

Hoopla: why did you vote do maffijy if oversoul's response bothered you.

i was originally voting majiffy for his general tone/vibe this game. dunno what i was expecting from him, but he seems kinda passive.

Meh, the last game with maffijy I read his as scum based on bad switch he made with shit reasoning and he was town. I don't know maffijy enough obviously to form a good read.

[farside22]

Majiffy:

Also what the fuck you live in Buffalo and we haven't hung out yet? The shit are you doing with your life?

Long story short working a desk job 40 hours a week and dealing with raising a child and having a hubby I'm betting too old to be cool.
Also I live an hour south of buffalo in a small village. Love the school out here for my son hate the job.

Back to mafia: you should vote for agar.

[farside22]

Just to add to my reasoning since nothing is changing.
Below in this quote agar states the bold.

Nope, not saying that. Saying the manner and perceived sureness feels very off, and probably scum-driven.

perceived sureness

of what???

your entire angle here is fucking terrible agar. terrible.

Of Vezok being scum.

i think agar is butthurt. what do you think?

About what? You bussing Vezok? Dude, I used to bus Vezok before it was cool.

Agar: you accused desp from going to 0 to die with fire on vezo. I see you going the same with oversoul.

Eh. I really just wanted to see if a wagon would gain traction to get me out of this RVS hell that I was stuck in and maybe get some reads.

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Desperado

I'd quote the Eagles but scum don't come to their senses.

He pushed on oversoul more then once and it doesn't read as non-serious.

So all three scum came in the same neighborhood as you?

That's literally what you've said thus far.

since neighborhood mechanic is random, i'm disregarding it to start

Yes but three of four. Literally 75% of the scumteam, and 75% of the neighborhood. I don't know math that well but the statistical probability of that has to be one in a fuckton fucktons.

why should we lynch desp?

The angle of how he's pushing Vezok. He's not

wrong

but he comes across hyperfocused on what Vezok is saying. Either they're scum together or Desp is hyperfocused on getting Vezok lynched to the point where he is going to overanalyze the shit out of him.

also, what was particularly incriminating about the oversoul quote?

"Let hoops do her thing" is "Leave hoops alone." which is never a town mindset to have.
"Why would scum offer themselves up?" is just plain shite.

selfmetaselfmetaselfmeta

poop

isntasbadaspeoplemakeitouttobeisntasbadaspeoplemakeitouttobeisntasbadaspeoplemakeitouttobe

ah!

yesitisdontgetmestartedyesitisdontgetmestartedyesitisdontgetmestarted

VOTE: Oversoul

I'm starting to feel this vezo/agar scum combo, but desp keeps bugging me.

[farside22]

If this going to be a meta argument please link to games I will not do research.

[farside22]

i'm more than happy to discuss all the stuff i talked about that's happened in this game though

yeah... mollie is ridiculously town soooooo... /fart

mollie

(and anyone else): i don't agree with the anti-agar sentiment/wagon. i read farside's case and i feel like the crux of it is "he didn't explain stuff until antihero asked him" and "he didn't vote until later". is there anything other than lagging explanation/vote that bugs you?

Why does that make agar town in your book?

[farside22]

This is literally Mollie v. Waffles, Mollie v. Thor, Mollie v. Majiffy, and now Mollie v. Desperado.
Like all the other times, I don't think it is worth reading..

Wheeee

Forget Mollie's view, do you think desp has a valid point?

click mollie's username, search her topics, and then ctrl+t every game you see that she's posted from her main--chances are she hydraslipped so that should be basically all of them. i looked at the opening from every one i could find.

So no link or pacific game you are referencing...fascinating.

Vote: desperado

desp isn't willing to back his shit up.

I did.

agar is discrediting but not voting which means he is weaving which kind of translates to idk SCUM.

I am pretty committed at this point.

I think desp and agar are scum.

I am standing behind my townreads on anti and majiffy no matter how bizarre they act.

I suppose I should read our neighborhood.

I thought agar voted for desp already.

[farside22]

I thought that his opening post looked kind of like he was blending in as in he did not say anything that was not super duper obv about the gamestate at the time he made his post. I like that you think he is town because of it and for the reasons you gave, town tends to move in herds so your reasoning processes make sense to me hence the move. so it gave me more solid of read on you but I am still unsure about spyrella. I like his reaching out to you but he is only reaching out to YOU and that is why I question spyrella. like I am srsly feeling neglected here.

Ok so I half follow but why the hell would you think I was specifically reaching out to hoopla ignoring anyone else when hoop not only posted something relevant but was the only post while I was on last night?

The times I get to hop on are fragmented. So, you're damn right i'm going to engage with someone who is on in my tiny windows. Ideally its going to be better the next few weeks and not hell on earth like the last month or so has been.

That said, you're town. Lets play ball. If I'm right and its super obvious lets get to work instead of fillibustering until something stupid that happens. Lets grab this sonsabitch by the face and ride it until it dies. The combination of neighborhoods and the nice town feelings mean an early scum lynch goes a long damn way to a stranglehold.

I don't get majiffy town but thats fine. I want agar dead more than desp by a small margin. I really, really want to see someone shoot ZZZX in the face tonight because his multi-game activity already has started a pattern that'd going to need to be purged. I wish I could say it wasn't 50-50 irritation-scum but its there.

No shoot vezo. Seriously.

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=23&t=45535 This was town mollie.
ITT we have scum mollie. I can't put my finger on it, but reading her posts from playing card is totally different than reading her posts from here.

vote: pirate mollie

One game and that is all you are basing the read on. Dude.

[farside22]

Mollie: add vezo on scum list. Something came to my mind I would rather not expand on currently.

In regard to spyrex he's null. I think he was in modern family mafia with me, not sure. If so I would move him up to town if I'm thinking of the same player, if not he's null.

[farside22]

Aniexty do you think Mollie is scum based on desp case?

[farside22]

Well here is my issue with desp case and why it comes off scummy to me.

do what now?

hated the opening (compensating too much for her recent trolly scum openings), the reaction to majiffy in 43 was whack, the majiffy/agar slip in 216 was weird and her townreads on those two don't make sense and haven't been explained. also her reason for you being town is pretty shitty. also also i didn't like "i'm interested in watching what desp and agar do with each other" as if i'm not even in the game.

if you are going to try to catch scumdesp it most likely won't be from that kind of a "slip". and I don't even think it is a slip, I think he is just familiar with the mod and is doing game spec. same thing anti was doing that some1 else tried to pinpoint as scummy.

like this. going out of her way to defend/buddy me (even though i know how to sneak past her in rvs and she isn't townreading me) before i've had a chance to respond--while being wrong about the particulars of that defense--is pretty scummy.

1. The first post he is talking meta. This is mollies first post

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... 7#p5928017

2. Why is post 43 wack? This post http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... 2#p5928182 that he is talking reads as a history issue between Mollie and majiffy

3. The reads on majiffy is not explained but mollie is no longer town reading agar, the question what changed hasn't been asked.

4. Mollie is not calling desp town or defending desp. Buddying I could see the others no.

So no link or pacific game you are referencing...fascinating.

nope, because the

meta has nothing to do with my motherfucking case

. mollie is still scum even if we had never played a game together before. researching her openings as scum and town simply served to confirm suspicions i had based on things mollie has done

in this game

.

Finally most of this argument reads as meta. I mean desp vote for Mollie before she even posted a single word but she's scum read? Because she didn't explain a few town reads. That is the only non meta argument you could have with everything listed and that at this point is sure as shot not scummy enough.

Also I'm bothered that desp is not voting agar although he believes agar is scum. Why not vote agar? Why push Mollie over agar?

[farside22]

Spyrex' play seems to consist of being oddly compliant and scaring other inactive players into being active

jiffy is still the scummiest see earlier points and his interaction with marquis in which he completely fails to fake a town perspective

If desp is scum his partners are probably also under suspicion. I don't like vezok's comparision to playing card because he had a strong team to back him up and he could get by with pushing easy angles

zzzx you said the agar wagon wasn't good enough I asked you to expand please do so

I dont see the reason why he is scum. I read some things but I wasn't convinced. Can you do a better job of convincing me?

What makes spy a good reason and why?

If I haven't said it before vezo is on my scum list. Desp attacked many people but his case on Mollie is shit my vote stands till someone tells me better why it is not shit.

[farside22]

Hoopla: In the Reckoning invitational, Mollie and Waffles were town. I think there's been more than one Mollie v. Thor confrontation, but in Patator they both were town. I think there's also been more than one Mollie v. Majiffy argument, but I don't remember anything specific like that other than it being a shitstorm. I want to say there was one she did as scum with him, don't quote me on that. I am not certain.

There are few people on this site that I trust to have solid Day 1 reads (including my own), so when people like Mollie or Desperado zero in on each other assuring the town that the other one has to be scum, it makes me not trust their judgment AT ALL. It just makes me think they're oblivious to possibilities and that their instincts are governed by confirmation bias.

The fact that this seems to be a regular occurrence for Mollie (without overwhelming success) means that she is somehow instigating or attracting the type of people similar to her that are willing to tunnel back. Stop putting out that energy, simmer down and genuinely think about the possibility you might be wrong, because if this is TvT then you're fucking up the game. I think it's the height of narcissism to presume your reads hold more value than everyone else's, and that is essentially what your play implies: that this is

the

important topic of the day that must be heard. It isn't. And I am actually going to put forth that TvT is pretty likely here.

My issue with this is desp should be aware of this since mollie and him have played together before.
If desp us aware of mollie actions to do this why is he attack mollie?

[farside22]

because he's a silly goose just like mollie.

I think my expectations are higher but I do tunnel and become unreasonable.

Vote: AGar

Desp:

4. i didn't say she called me town, and if you agree that she might have been buddying then i don't understand how you can disagree that she was defending me? bv thought i scum slipped and mollie went out of her way to tell him that i hadn't--in other words, his reason for thinking i'm scum is invalid (with the implicit conclusion being he shouldn't be scumreading me for that). how is that not a defense?

Actually I read it as someone that respects another player. Ie: she thinks you as scum would not make that tell as scum and you would have to really do digging to catch desp scum.

Why are you not scum reading agar?

[farside22]

So in case people missed it agar voted for spy for no reason stated and isn't pushing a case there. Why does that make him town?

Come on vezo bus your scum buddy.

[farside22]

So in case people missed it agar voted for spy for no reason stated and isn't pushing a case there. Why does that make him town?

Come on vezo bus your scum buddy.

How about Titus who continues to call me scum and make associative lynch plans yet won't even pony up to try to get me lynched?

Titus?

[farside22]

Marquis I think

Well if that's who majiff is talking about I don't see it as scummy. He's been voting and calling majiffy scum for some time, no one's on board with it and how is he making associated lynch plans? He just looks to be tunneling. Agar jumping to whatever wagon is going on and adding nothing to the discussion.

[farside22]

why would that make it null?

oh hell, i don't know. i'm confusing myself...
i think my problem is that i'm trying to tie the agar read to the spyrex read and imagine what the scum/town dynamic is before either flip. they're cross-voting (spyrex is 3rd vote on agar and agar is 2nd vote on spyrex). but that doesn't really tell me much. it could just as easily be town v scum as scum cross bussing.

plus my suspicion of spyrex might not be entirely rational.

Why are you making associative tells with no flip? That is as pointless as shooting at a flying disk blindfolded
Also where did Mollie claim the agar read was all meta?

Spy: we need to talk because your reads are matching mine so far. I have zzzy, vezo and agar so far. All the hyperactivity and chaos from Mollie /desp leads me with Mollie town and desp still looking scummy. What's your thoughts on desp?

[farside22]

and she didn't abandon you. she padded the fake guilty. so no, you are trying to make a correlation in which you are incorrect.

she abandoned me. she didn't post at all d1, barely d2, and we still haven't even spoken about the game (during or afterwards).

okay.

do you see why I think marquis might be a good cw?

I'm curious why Marius?

[farside22]

and she didn't abandon you. she padded the fake guilty. so no, you are trying to make a correlation in which you are incorrect.

she abandoned me. she didn't post at all d1, barely d2, and we still haven't even spoken about the game (during or afterwards).

do you see why I think marquis might be a good cw?

I'm curious why Marius?

in the posts that I referenced to hoopla (sorry I am lazy) first marquis demonstrates an anxiety level that is pretty strong. in my experience this is a scumtell cos most of the people who play mafia are pretty freaking good people and don't like the bloodbath that follows. some do and feed off of it but marquis is not 1 of those people. at least not in my experience and we have a good amount of games together.

so it is a way to distance themselves from ongoing action which if they were paranoid retarded town they would jump all over.

plus I am trying to see if dgb is right about taking out the weakest link in the chain.

I tend to go for the head before the ass. which might lead to majiffy.

the "no u" response that followed that post again, highlights where scum might feel uncomfortable. some scum don't know how to handle their shit when being called out on.

The weakest is vezo then. Not sure the no u is a scum tell because I've seen it come from both alignment. Also I'm the go after the head type.

[farside22]

and whining about all the meta being flung around that you can't understand when that really isn't an accurate representation of the arguments you've referenced looks really really bad

There is a bunch of meta references. I started tuning some people out because of it. But I'm a bit jaded with meta recently.

[farside22]

The weakest is vezo then.

I disagree. Not sure the no u is a scum tell because I've seen it come from both alignment. Also I'm the go after the head type.

the "no u" is situational? in this case I think it applies.

so who is the head?[/quote]

Agar....the person I'm voting for. You now the one making shit votes and disappearing, then goes agro because you called him out but still doesn't explain shit.

[farside22]

I agree with marquis.
I find it very hard to engage in discussion. It's just a group of people who formed opinion about everyone and they haven't stopped.

Why is anxiety scum?

[farside22]

I agree with marquis.
I find it very hard to engage in discussion. It's just a group of people who formed opinion about everyone and they haven't stopped.

Why is anxiety scum?

Fence-sitting.
Why every time I put a pressure vote on someone people come asking me about it before I see the effects of the vote?

I am trying to pressure him in order to better form a read on him. I find fencesitting scummy and I want to see what anxiety has to offer.

He's fence sitting on one player. Do you have a read on oversoul? How about bv?

[farside22]

He's fence sitting on one player. Do you have a read on oversoul? How about bv?

He's fence sitting on two players with a polarizing argument between them.

Are you even reading?

Oh no's it's two people instead of one the horror!

I know your voting aniexty already I'm looking at the follows.

[farside22]

He's fence sitting on one player. Do you have a read on oversoul? How about bv?

He's fence sitting on two players with a polarizing argument between them.

Are you even reading?

Oh no's it's two people instead of one the horror!

Why don't you do something useful instead of snark up the thread?

I'm staying away from the argument and questioning my scum reads.
Just because I don't agree with you doesn't mean I'm not useful.

I keep pushing my point on why agar is scum.

[farside22]

but what is

infinitely

moar important is why did agar unvote desp at the time that he did.

Because reasons that are making me doubt my townread on you.

Why aren't you trying to work with me?

mebbe you shld inverse the question

cos I am pretty sure I listened to you about anti but what are your thoughts on marquis

Marquis can DIAF but Marquis can always DIAF.

Why are you still arguing with Desperado? I am telling you the slot is almost certainly town.

I'm staying away from the argument and questioning my scum reads.
Just because I don't agree with you doesn't mean I'm not useful.

I keep pushing my point on why agar is scum.

I don't see you doing anything. Point to things you've done.

You know what an ISO is. You say I'm not pointing out agar? Because that would be a lie. No one looks to be doing anything next to Mollie/desp argument.

[farside22]

Desperado: is agar town to you? Is so why? If not why are you not voting him?

Hoopla: why are you wanting a counter wagon? What purpose would you gain from it?

[farside22]

What else have you done besides waggle your finger at Agar and say "zomgz scum!"?

Throw questions out and talked about my scum reads.

[farside22]

I am actually thinking Majiffy could be the best secondary wagon with AGar. Bob is town and his 209 about Majiffy was good, Marquis is alright, and I still have a vague gut scumread on Majiffy anyway.

Bob and Marquis:

lets recruit some followers for Team Oak and get Majiffy's wagon going. I will even temporarily jump ship to get this off the ground if need be.

Ummm he puts two quotes in there about majiffy saying neighbors are town sided and how majiffy caught Mollie. How is that scummy?

[farside22]

Hoopla: why are you wanting a counter wagon? What purpose would you gain from it?

Rival D1 wagons are awesome for future analysis. Also gives some of the left-behind players another good game-furthering vote option if they're not down with AGar. When there's only one clear wagon, it's easy for scum to just sit back and watch if it's town.

I am concerned a rival wagon will allow scum agar to slip from the noose.

You seem to be avoiding me while subsequently attacking people that follow my votes, Farside. Why are you uninterested in my alignment?

You never questioned me on my Desp unvote, but questioned Agar.
You never questioned me on my Anxiety vote, but questioned the mason-claimed Vezok.

My experience with you is bad. Last game I scum read you because your vote was shit in that game, this game I see shit reasoning but at least your pushing players. I get the impression your using your vote to get reaction from the player in question. I figure it's best to watch what people say after you vote them and question things that stand out.

[farside22]

it is setup speculation for the sake of speculation or worse

his tone doesn't match any intention

Since the dawn of time things have changed.

Ie: that was many post ago, is there anything new to that scum read?

Ummm he puts two quotes in there about majiffy saying neighbors are town sided and how majiffy caught Mollie. How is that scummy?

he was the only one to go along with the idea of lynching me to gain neighbour daytalk, but made zero effort to convince anyone. he just floated his opinion for the sake of contributing but didn't really care about the outcome, other than that he was saying something.

Yah I'll take the one issue you have and raise you multiple post by agar and vezo that are absolute shit.

[farside22]

I am concerned a rival wagon will allow scum agar to slip from the noose.

Agar isn't scum.

You seem to be avoiding me while subsequently attacking people that follow my votes, Farside. Why are you uninterested in my alignment?

You never questioned me on my Desp unvote, but questioned Agar.
You never questioned me on my Anxiety vote, but questioned the mason-claimed Vezok.

My experience with you is bad. Last game I scum read you because your vote was shit in that game, this game I see shit reasoning but at least your pushing players. I get the impression your using your vote to get reaction from the player in question. I figure it's best to watch what people say after you vote them and question things that stand out.

Your giant super strong scum read on Agar boils down to weak unsubstantiated meta and a lot of empty assumptions based off that.

What else are you doing?

You obviously did not read my ISO. Till you do, will talk.

[farside22]

Do you know why agar is voting spyrex majiffy?

[farside22]

selfmetaselfmetaselfmeta

poop

isntasbadaspeoplemakeitouttobeisntasbadaspeoplemakeitouttobeisntasbadaspeoplemakeitouttobe

ah!

yesitisdontgetmestartedyesitisdontgetmestartedyesitisdontgetmestarted

VOTE: Oversoul

Nope, not saying that. Saying the manner and perceived sureness feels very off, and probably scum-driven.

perceived sureness

of what???

your entire angle here is fucking terrible agar. terrible.

Of Vezok being scum.

i think agar is butthurt. what do you think?

About what? You bussing Vezok? Dude, I used to bus Vezok before it was cool.

Agar: you accused desp from going to 0 to die with fire on vezo. I see you going the same with oversoul.

Eh. I really just wanted to see if a wagon would gain traction to get me out of this RVS hell that I was stuck in and maybe get some reads.

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Desperado

I'd quote the Eagles but scum don't come to their senses.

agar: what's with the desp unvote? what exactly did he do... (someone else do...) to warrant an unvote?

I was actually reading his argument with mollie pretty intensely and I just got some town vibes. It pretty much amounts to "lolgut" right now, but generally I've found when I have a gut reaction, it's usually more accurate than what I try and analyze. I'm sure I could go in and convince myself of something he said that seemed scummy and justify putting a vote back on but right now I wanna follow my gut.

What you quoted is me simply following up with the reasons as to why I said OS should die off of the post I quoted. Not really "pushing more than once." Then he said something dumb and I disagreed and made an opportunistic vote because I wanted a wagon for some info.

so what info did you get?

cos this looks like fluff unless you are willing to back up your statement.

It got 3 votes including myself I think, so not as much as I would like. But remember when I said I needed to dive some ISOs?

Yep, just be patient.

Discrediting you? Nah, I actually think I have a solid grasp on reading you right now, which is generally not something that happens. You're really fuckin' transparent right now, I can follow your thought process from A to B clearly. You're as town as I'm willing to declare someone on Day 1. I just meant trying to meta me will be an exercise in futility, if only because I pride myself on my scumgame and not letting myself fall into too many patterns (I know I bus a lot but I've even tried to stray from that as much as I used to, see: Gundam).

stahp trying to placate me. am I the nk1 kill? I am aren't I.

Mollie I would never kill you that early. My general impression in games is that you're too paranoid. You'd be perfect later in the game. Probably not LYLO because I wouldn't be able to predict your vote but before that? Sure.

also you said something to anxiety about something being the dumbest thing you have ever read (but I accidentally deleted I am getting pretty zealous right now but lazy I am working a lot) in which my answer to you is what the fuck is wrong with putting pressure on lurkers in order to get them active. which if I remember correctly is what he was doing but you tried to pretty package it up into something that shouldn't be looked at and you thought other players would swallow? it is a discred.

Yes, everything I say is me discrediting people. Well, almost everything. But generally when I assault something someone says, it is precisely because I think they are wrong and have no merit to what they are saying. So I

do

try and discredit it because I am town and generally convinced in my reads and half of playing town is finding scum and the other half of it is convincing people your reads are right. You can't do that if other players are spewing things that are dumb and no one is shutting them up. And, in line with that, this is the last part of this post I actually feel merits a response.

But I still got enough proof to prove you are scum.

Feel free to share, y'know, whenever the hell would be your earliest convenience.

It just makes me think they're oblivious to possibilities and that their instincts are governed by confirmation bias.

Thank you, based Hoopla.

---

VOTE: SpyreX

When you say someone's posts are lacking, you're accusing them of active lurking.

I don't like the unvote on desp when desp said nothing during that time to quantify a genuine townread.

like that is just your opinion, man!

FIFY

you could always walk me through your change of heart on desp

Yes, that is exactly what subjective means! Congratulations!

I did already explain it. Go into my ISO and read it. Not holding hands for people.

And generally I don't give a fuck about whether what I'm doing pleases you so g'day.

---

uhhh no I'm not gonna force myself to reach a conclusion on a player D1, especially when neither are close to being lynched.

Ok.

unvote: pirate mollie
vote: 4nxi3ty

Continues to be scum. Probably worth dying soon.

I agree with marquis.
I find it very hard to engage in discussion. It's just a group of people who formed opinion about everyone and they haven't stopped.

Why is anxiety scum?

Fence-sitting.
Why every time I put a pressure vote on someone people come asking me about it before I see the effects of the vote?

I am trying to pressure him in order to better form a read on him. I find fencesitting scummy and I want to see what anxiety has to offer.

In order for a pressure vote to actually do anything, you need to get other people behind it or get a wagon rolling because 1 vote is not going to do a damned thing.

You've been around and in enough games to know exactly that this is how it works. So stop bitching there about your "pressure votes" not working.

I'm down to phone posting so here are the quotes I'm referencing

He had issues with oversoul but doesn't vote till a wagon happens. Why is that town to anyone?
Vote desp, another wagon, vote spyrex for no fucking reason, just another wagon jump.
Finally he doesn't explain hack fucking shit, argues another player is scum but pushes no fucking case.
This is agar scum any day of the week.

[farside22]

This is agar scum any day of the week.

It's almost like you're trying to push a meta case without actually knowing what you're talking about.

So, in other words, SOP for people trying to push meta cases.

So town player jump from wagon to wagon and don't push cases in your book?

[farside22]

Majiffy the attitude is unnecessary. I made a case and you complain about how I do it. I ask questions and make points and apparently that's not good enough.
Apparently only you are good enough for the game.

*Puts majiffy on ignore for the rest of the game.*

[farside22]

Oversoul: this argument reminds me of an ongoing game. Am I crazy?

[farside22]

Oversoul: this argument reminds me of an ongoing game. Am I crazy?

Between who and who?

Between me and majiffy.

This is agar scum any day of the week.

It's almost like you're trying to push a meta case without actually knowing what you're talking about.

So, in other words, SOP for people trying to push meta cases.

So town player jump from wagon to wagon and don't push cases in your book?

See if you just said "This is scum" I'd be "Ok, this is whatevs. Wrong but whatevs."

But you specifically said "agar scum" when you addressed it. Like these are things specific to my scumgame. Which is where I come out and call you on your shit because you're literally pulling shit out of thin air.

So take out agar name and it's still scummy good to know. Why do you think majiffy see's it as null?

if you are town then why are you not helping me push on marquis

Because he's painfully obvious town.

she isn't pushing a meta case agar, no matter how you spin it

AGar's wacky waving hand games and painting farsides vote as meta is total garbage.

In this game she has both said "This is not town agar" and "this is scum agar every day of the week." Almost verbatim. How I

wouldn't

interpret that as a meta vote is beyond me. Those are phrases you use when you are showing a certain level of familiarity with playstyle and attitude from a player. I don't just say "Nope this isn't SpyreX town" because

I don't have a level of familiarity with your playstyle.

I might say "This isn't town play," or "This is definitely scummy." but I wouldn't specifically link it to you individually unless I had a very good reason to, i.e, a meta read.

---

SpyreX is

coming in here and throwing generally vague and loose accusations. Not really trying to find scum,

just trying to find where he can slide in and parrot some words and stuff that's already been said, just with synonyms. He's not actually looking to engage with anyone he finds scummy, rather just positing his "beliefs" as general statements of fact and then moving on with life. The whole reason I threw the naked vote was because I saw he was doing that and wanted to see if I could goad some kind of interaction from him. It was objectively a terrible vote - I switched from one wagon to another without so much as an explanation as to why I was voting my new target - and one that

if I was scumreading someone I would definitely be grilling them

on. Even when he comments on my "meta" spin, he specifically words it to avoid direct interaction with me - read it again. Contrast that with farside and Mollie who have directly engaged me at points in this game. If he truly believed in his read right now, he'd be engaging me, because we are way too early in this game to have some kind of slam dunk read that you don't feel the need to engage and further chip away at the player.

Half of what you are accusing spyrex of I could say you are doing the exact same thing. Example would be the bold.

The underline is something you are not doing.

[farside22]

What?

that was all in the setup info at the beginning

I know. Why is he saying that now? To lend legitimacy to his claim?

No. It's cause he can search for relations between spyspy and other players.

Do you believe metal's claim?

[farside22]

Logic says metal isn 't lying. Lying means he gets lynched or insert comment that not making here.

Vote: spyrex

Still say agar is scum.

[farside22]

ALSO also also, from spyrex read's list, i'm getting a bob townread, a farside townread, and a marquis townread.

vezok is definitely town

yep

I think bv is too no way do you say that a scummate shld eat a bullet.

gonna' have to disagree with you on that one, mollie.

calling for a vig kill on a partner is a lot easier than bussing because 1) he doesn't even know if there's a vig in the game and 2) even if there is a vig, said vig is probably not putting much weight on who spyrex is telling him to kill.

that is fine but I am right.

I personally would go apeshit on a scummate if they said that I shld eat a bullet.

what do you think about zzzxx or w/e his name is? i lean derptown.

Still reading him as scum.

[farside22]

i do too, especially given spy's attacks.

though i have to wonder what kind of school he goes to if he has finals now....

high school it looks like since he is only 16.

they probs had snow days.

eta: far, I am not so sure about that. why are you reading him as scum?

1. I've learned doing associates tells are bad. So looking at spy interaction will not net you this understanding
2. There is no way I believe zz has read everything that fast to know that metal claimed cop on spy. If you look at zz's last post till now he either has been reading the game this whole time and not making comments (not town) or he read the most recent post and decided to bus because what else could scum do with a guilty verdict.
3. He 's not as busy as he claims if he's posting elsewhere.
http://forum.mafiascum.net/search.php?a ... 6&sr=posts

[farside22]

I think spyrex has 7 votes.

No more votes till vote count from the mod.

[farside22]

1. Is a long story but the short and sweet is read small town shitty game where I tunnel tier most of the game and associate off if him before a flip.
2. Zz is not that new
3. Is not invalid

As for os i think he is town. I don't blame him for questioning metal and it's not something scum would do even with there scum buddy being suspect.

Hoopla point out problems with spy from the start. Hoopla also would have buddies up more to players as scum. I wonder if your gut mollie is based on past experience or hoopla putting your value as a player down.

[farside22]

I'm concerned lightly that metal is lying. But it would be stupid to lie and he was grilled by os about the timing.
I'm leaning that he is telling the truth because he would be lynched if spy was to flip town.
My slight concern is I've had people lately fake claim to ensure a lynch on someone they think is scum and that player is town.

Also I'm just going to disagree with your new read on zzzy.

[farside22]

All right, all right, this is all a gambit. That I pulled stupidly because "lol fuck it not using my brain "


Good thing is, it was successful in gaining positive reactions, and town was surprisingly cooperative to help this through. Bad news is Spyrex reaction is inconclusive, I only have a ~ 65% confidence that he is town. And that some people are going to get irritated.


I'll write an essay on my findings soon.

Ummm ahhhh I can hear you going *gasp* over there right though your computer screen

Please don't punch your screen this was a successful gambit by all means

65% town read is not successful. If you are town consider yourself blacklisted if spy is town, which I suspect he will.

Just in case Mollie's vote doesn't count.

Vote: agar

[farside22]

I'll write an essay on my findings soon.

And as for your essay. Here's what you should do:

Make yourself a nice cup of hot cocoa or a green tea (whatever your particular fancy is), put on some nice ambient background music, maybe light some votives and settle into your chair. Open up a fresh word document, go through your observations, write down some notes and setup the framework for your findings. Expand on them, come to some clear conclusions, give it a proof read, and save the file just in case of a freak power outage or something.

Then, open up this thread, go to new post AND THROW YOUR FUCKING COMPUTER OUT THE WINDOW AND DON'T COME BACK

The rant I feel does nothing for these people. They ruin games and say oh I thought he was scum or worse out the real fucking cop. But you know common sense is a foreign concept. It 's just a game mentality that makes me vomit and personally want to see players who do it that are town be banned from mafia.

Let me know if that can be a rule, because fake claiming as town in my view is against the win condition in my oppinion. If ms is town can he be made an example?

[farside22]

Mollie has to answer for this

I would like Mollie yo explain, but my read on her is she is an emotionally driven player. Desp, oversoul, anti and majiffy can tell me if this is accurate or not. But everything that happened seems to build and build and build and then boom she seems to just react instead of analysis on a rational pov. If she does I don't see it.

[farside22]

I don't understand how I was basically the only one suggesting we wait until spy and metal posted again. It was so obviously fishy. That means that there are at least SOME townies who bought it and were completely cool with lynching spy off one post.

This town...

I said no more votes but some people don't either read or are scum happy to help

[farside22]

Mollie has to answer for this

I would like Mollie yo explain, but my read on her is she is an emotionally driven player. Desp, oversoul, anti and majiffy can tell me if this is accurate or not. But everything that happened seems to build and build and build and then boom she seems to just react instead of analysis on a rational pov. If she does I don't see it.

I'm not going to comment on Mollie meta anymore since she was getting so bent out of shape about me last time.
I think she's town but what the hell. This game wasn't even a week old.

I understand.

What do you think of vezo and who else is a scum read?

Like I can replace out but that would be pretty irresponsible . I need to clean up the shit first

I would seriously go out of my way to ban you from mafia if you replace out. You did this, if your town fucking fix it.

[farside22]

terrible, all of it

not exaggerating

all of it

Why? Give an example that you find terrible.

[farside22]

Not going to disagree at vezo. Was his comment vote hope on hoopla asking her to respond to the case while vezo does not respond to the case against him from meta sonic mentioned?
If not note it for those not scum reading vezo.

Vote: vezokpiraka

Mollie:

even after all of this I still think scum are agar, hoopla, overlysoul and spyrella.

I can't even begin to understand why you think this.

[farside22]

Waking up and typing sense would be better.
Let me rewrite here.

Add to vezo's obvious scumminess that he votes hoopla (the popular wagon) and demand hoopla respond to metals case, but vezo doesn't respond to the case from metal against vezo.
Still say agar is scum

[farside22]

First vezo is correct and agar lied about what vezo said in the game

Vote: AGar

This won't move again.

Second I still think vezo is scum and this is a bad bus job.
Vezo pretty much slides his vote in without making a comment so it's easy to vote without back tracking (yes no opinion is scummy)
Here are some examples.

vote: spyreX

Yeah I agree with Ms's claim. I forgot to vote in my last post.

unvote: spyrex
vote: metal sonic

This should die like right now.

unvote: metal sonic
Vote: HOOPLA

Respond to sonics posts please

For example from the above no opinion why metal is scum and the quickly switches to hoopla based on metal's post, the person he voted for previously.
Vezo never questioned the claim from metal and why believe the claim? Does anyone know reading vezo's post if he tried to figure out metal?
No

[farside22]

First vezo is correct and agar lied about what vezo said in the game

Vote: agar

This won't move again.

Second I still think vezo is scum and this is a bad bus job.
Vezo pretty much slides his vote in without making a comment so it's easy to vote without back tracking (yes no opinion is scummy)
Here are some examples.

vote: spyreX

Yeah I agree with Ms's claim. I forgot to vote in my last post.

unvote: spyrex
vote: metal sonic

This should die like right now.

unvote: metal sonic
Vote: HOOPLA

Respond to sonics posts please

For example from the above no opinion why metal is scum and the quickly switches to hoopla based on metal's post, the person he voted for previously.
Vezo never questioned the claim from metal and why believe the claim? Does anyone know reading vezo's post if he tried to figure out metal?
No

I never questioned the claim from ms because I believed it to be genuine. After that I was upset that he fakeclaimed and thought spy actually as lynched.
And I switched to hoopla because she refused to answer ms's case. I've seen scum before dismiss cases made by players who they consider bad/

Here are my following questions:

Are you saying you have never seen town fake claim? If so why believe ms right away?
Why is hoopla scum dismissing a case and you don't look like scum dismissing a case against you?
Why switch from metal to hoopla? If you thought spy was lynched what the fuck is the point of voting someone else?

[farside22]

I'm not sold on hoopla town, but the idea of it being because of seeing through your "gambit" is just dumb

The case on hoopla is opinion (example: this reads fake, that reads fake) or confirm basis (re: metals case, which vezo apparently didn't read)

[farside22]

98% of cases are opinion. Welcome to mafia.

Gut sure, case worthy no. Why you poo poo everyone else's case? Mine I can say sure some meta but mostly how scum behavior 90% of the time. Your case is with no knowledge of the player and can be faked reading as scum. Basically I don't buy what you smoke.

[farside22]

98% of cases are opinion. Welcome to mafia.

Gut sure, case worthy no. Why you poo poo everyone else's case? Mine I can say sure some meta but mostly how scum behavior 90% of the time. Your case is with no knowledge of the player and can be faked reading as scum. Basically I don't buy what you smoke.

Try this post again because I found it largely incomprehensible.

Mafia is not just opinion. Saying something is fake is not a case and frankly saying something looks fake reads to me as fake scum hunting.
My case is based on behavior I see from scum 90% of the time. Voting on popular wagons, offering little and vague opinions, lurking and if you read agar stated what his play is like and he 's not doing those things.
So your meh whatever attitude doesn't really make me want to follow your reads.

[farside22]

General scum meta changes between sites and over time. It doesnt hold as any better than an opinion.

And my push on hoopla doesnt boil down to x post looks fake. Try reading before you try lecturing me on my own play.

Looked back and all I see prior is vague reasoning for finding hoopla scum.
Hoopla attacks you for something you did pages ago. ( null by the way ) not everyone thinks if things right in the fucking moment and guess what people read the game when someone points it out and go back and look.
Finally we have the this looks fake read so please tell me what makes your fuching case any better than anyone else.
Right now I'm sick of your shitty and unnecessary comments about others cases when your case is not strong enough to wipe my ass on.

[farside22]

not really seeing ZZZX wagon taking off atm, but I gotta try. The sheep metal post was pretty bad, like lynch worthy bad.

vezok's been a meh read for me for most of the game, but I find myself agreeing with the points metal sonic and farside brought up recently.

pedit: zzzx is the better bet for a scumflip imo

with ZZZX saying that he's going to be V/LA for a bit, do you really expect any good reads to come of it / any good reactions?

i still don't get your position re: vezok. the vezok wagon already has the support of agar, metal sonic, and hoopla. farside has a scumread on vezok too. from what i recall of this thread, zzzx's wagon doesn't have nearly as much support (i think i remember farside and spyrex calling him scum once).

why would you back the zzzx horse when it's clear a vezok horse would have the best chance of winning in a race against the agar wagon? and, more importantly, why would you want to split the Agar counterwagon votes between ZZZX and vezok if you really think agar is town?

For a person that claims v/la and still posting elsewhere http://forum.mafiascum.net/search.php?a ... 6&sr=posts
Do you see town motive antihero?

[farside22]

Mollie: stop defending scum reads he should answer for himself. (This is in regards to zzz)

[farside22]

not really seeing ZZZX wagon taking off atm, but I gotta try. The sheep metal post was pretty bad, like lynch worthy bad.

vezok's been a meh read for me for most of the game, but I find myself agreeing with the points metal sonic and farside brought up recently.

pedit: zzzx is the better bet for a scumflip imo

with ZZZX saying that he's going to be V/LA for a bit, do you really expect any good reads to come of it / any good reactions?

i still don't get your position re: vezok. the vezok wagon already has the support of agar, metal sonic, and hoopla. farside has a scumread on vezok too. from what i recall of this thread, zzzx's wagon doesn't have nearly as much support (i think i remember farside and spyrex calling him scum once).

why would you back the zzzx horse when it's clear a vezok horse would have the best chance of winning in a race against the agar wagon? and, more importantly, why would you want to split the Agar counterwagon votes between ZZZX and vezok if you really think agar is town?

For a person that claims v/la and still posting elsewhere http://forum.mafiascum.net/search.php?a ... 6&sr=posts
Do you see town motive antihero?

why are you linking to an iso that contains ongoing games when I can't remark on any of them?

and I will defend my reads if I want to so

1.That is not linking to on going games that is showing a player posting and active.
2. Why is he town based on weak theory? Do you know him personally?
3. Did not ask you to comment on ongoing games. I'm showing an active lurker that is lying about v/la.

Mollie: stop defending scum reads he should answer for himself. (This is in regards to zzz)

no farside, we're trying to get to the bottom of anxiety's scumread on zzzx.

difference.

I have a scum read on zzx so I'm going to ask again why are you giving zzx an out to keep lurking when clearly he's posting on MS?
Do you think zzx is town and then explain why in detail?

In my world not every fucking person is a lemming. So if a player wants to pressure a scum read why is that scummy? Because it's not popular, because the player said he finds the player scummy but hasn't said much on it in the past? Like you didn't say much about agar till he called you scum?
If you did please let me know

[farside22]

For a person that claims v/la and still posting elsewhere search.php?author_id=22056&sr=posts
Do you see town motive antihero?

not particularly, but there's a number of factors that play into post distribution across games at any given time. how caught up you are, how interested you are, what the gamestate happens to be (is it LYLO or some other high pressure time?), how well you like the playerlist, how please you are with how the game is going.

alignment's just one of those factors and differs between players (for some players, it's more important than others). i don't happen to know how important it is for ZZZX. do you?

Nope but I'm not going to let him keep lurking it up and offer nothing to the game. Are you?

[farside22]

In my world not every fucking person is a lemming.

this is true.

HOWEVER

i would expect more things to play into a scumread other than just *principle*, namely what's happening in the landscape of the game. what are your townreads doing? how are they interacting with other people? how are other people interacting with your scumreads? etc...

if one of my townreads was getting wagoned and a scumread of mine was the top counterwagon, you'd better believe i'll be on that counterwagon

You want to compare list?
It's all in my head but I already look into that and try to stop my town reads from fighting one another.

I mean let's look at this from my side your questioning aniexty for voting zzx over agar (the gist if the argument )
But why did zzx believe the claim from metal? Why did he follow along at the right time and right place to put a vote on a growing wagon without commenting in metals claim?
You think that is just coincidence? You think the timing for someone that may just be disinterested came in at the interesting part of the game and did not participate?
How deeply did you think about zzx at this point?


Epwop: look who popped in after being called.

[farside22]

not really seeing ZZZX wagon taking off atm, but I gotta try. The sheep metal post was pretty bad, like lynch worthy bad.

vezok's been a meh read for me for most of the game, but I find myself agreeing with the points metal sonic and farside brought up recently.

pedit: zzzx is the better bet for a scumflip imo

with ZZZX saying that he's going to be V/LA for a bit, do you really expect any good reads to come of it / any good reactions?

i still don't get your position re: vezok. the vezok wagon already has the support of agar, metal sonic, and hoopla. farside has a scumread on vezok too. from what i recall of this thread, zzzx's wagon doesn't have nearly as much support (i think i remember farside and spyrex calling him scum once).

why would you back the zzzx horse when it's clear a vezok horse would have the best chance of winning in a race against the agar wagon? and, more importantly, why would you want to split the Agar counterwagon votes between ZZZX and vezok if you really think agar is town?

For a person that claims v/la and still posting elsewhere http://forum.mafiascum.net/search.php?a ... 6&sr=posts
Do you see town motive antihero?

why are you linking to an iso that contains ongoing games when I can't remark on any of them?

and I will defend my reads if I want to so

1.That is not linking to on going games that is showing a player posting and active.
2. Why is he town based on weak theory? Do you know him personally?
3. Did not ask you to comment on ongoing games. I'm showing an active lurker that is lying about v/la.

Mollie: stop defending scum reads he should answer for himself. (This is in regards to zzz)

no farside, we're trying to get to the bottom of anxiety's scumread on zzzx.

difference.

I have a scum read on zzx so I'm going to ask again why are you giving zzx an out to keep lurking when clearly he's posting on MS?
Do you think zzx is town and then explain why in detail?

In my world not every fucking person is a lemming. So if a player wants to pressure a scum read why is that scummy? Because it's not popular, because the player said he finds the player scummy but hasn't said much on it in the past? Like you didn't say much about agar till he called you scum?
If you did please let me know

How I handle limited access generally (not talking about any game just my play style)


Post a few posts in games nearing deadlines - ignore rest cus I can't read whole threads in a trip/with finals etc

There you have it again ladies and germs. Timing is everything.
Not paying attention to game while on v/la, happens to pop in game after beling called out.
Please tell me the name of your psychic!

[farside22]

alright

I mean let's look at this from my side your questioning aniexty for voting zzx over agar (the gist if the argument )
But why did zzx believe the claim from metal? Why did he follow along at the right time and right place to put a vote on a growing wagon without commenting in metals claim?
You think that is just coincidence? You think the timing for someone that may just be disinterested came in at the interesting part of the game and did not participate?
How deeply did you think about zzx at this point?

i'm having a little bit of a hard time following you.

zzzx did comment on metal's claim (albeit a somewhat bizarre comment, but a comment that kind of makes sense in context)
i can tell you think lurkers are annoying and hard to read. this is true, but not all lurkers are scummy.

I looked back he stated:

Real claim from metal or not...

When I am confused,ill and having finals and posting this from my mobile whole fighting headaches and explosive diarrhea...


The Only thing to do is to sheep metal.

If he is so sure that he would cop/fake cop to get him lynched/is playing derp he is the man to be sheeped.

vote spyrex

If I was voting him before than sorry but I really lost a pound .. or two writing this

-ZZZX

Metal is not that good to be sheeped. No fucking player is that good to be sheeped.
It's not weird. It takes no guilt, no fault, and no reasoning that makes sense. In short following and yes lurking bothers me when I see a player following along and not posting shit.
But hey I'm not voting him, once finals are over, which I believe they are done (someone can correct me since zzzx stated a couple of days v/la) that if zzzx continues this trend my vote will move.

[farside22]

VOTE: farside

so fake

His name is (far side is tunneling me needlessly

vote: farside

Yes this is a omgus if you ask
)


Here is a question for you
You are aware this is just as the game of world cup started. Such a thing existed waw.


Another question. You have been tunneling me this game hard enough that you wanted to ISO me from other games to check my vla? My vla is global and my posting times are consitent at this time range. Now I got to go. Thanks for that good speach

Bahwahahah
Yes it's global scum point is you still are posting.

Don't care about soccer but will that be your excuse for lurking for another week?

[farside22]

bob and zzzx, your votes are bad and you should feel bad.

How's that zzzx town read going for you?

[farside22]

Farside im still reading you as town but all of the last page was just so inherently antitown and you need to step back and reevaluate things.

What was anti-town about my post?
I called player for lurking.
Lurking player shows up and omgus for calling me out and tunneling me (lie by the way) I'm working on at least 3 scum reads. So explain what reads anti-town?
Lurking should be ignored? A player explains himself is scum but hey let's those that say shit all keep saying shit all because apparently that is town?
Right?
Because this ims opposite of what I think town should do? So fucking what.
At the end of the game scum will be known and people who claim fake read might fucking learn there this looks fake is useless.
God if only dreams could come true.

[farside22]

Farside im still reading you as town but all of the last page was just so inherently antitown and you need to step back and reevaluate things.

What was anti-town about my post?

The complete lack of conciseness, general spammy posting habits, and the fact that you're a dummy mc dummy head.

Also the fact that you continue to not at all understand my reads that you advocate against.

so you are agar's scummate. huh

cos they don't come any townier than far and she isn't being anti-town and it is pretty funny for you to call her anti-town for spamposting.

I think majiffy is town. I'm just being pissy with him because a he's being an asshole about my case. I usually become an asshole right back to prove a point that no one person's case is perfect.
As for spam post, I'm not sure how responding to a player right back is spam posting. *shrug*
I'll look over hoopla's ISO today. Just to see what majiffy is looking at, frankly I disagreed with maffijy in the only game I recall playing with him and he was wrong about that player and scum followed maffijy logic on that game, which is why I pressure those following majiffy's point.

[farside22]

I think Farside is actually town. Sometimes her cases aren't the best but I still think it has town intent.

Hey you think agar is scum. I find agar scum.
Really the differences are I made a case and you....well I don't remember if you made a case.

People seem to be ignoring my reasoning for agar scum maybe you can push with reasoning there.

[farside22]

This game has lost all its fizz. We finally got mollie to simmer down, yet nobody is stepping up now that there is room to breathe. Surely there is a happy medium somewhere between the two extremes?

@Team Oak

I think both of your votes are being wasted at the moment and aren't really furthering the game. There is no way farside is getting lynched today when the majority of the town has her in their top few town reads, so

Bob

, you need to move that vote.

Marquis

, I think the Majiffy wagon failed. I was kinda interested in it pre-Metal-gate but I think there are greener pastures.

If you are both unsure, just sheep me onto vezok whose reads and play have been arbitrary and forced. You can't go wrong with a vezok wagon.

Vote count has you on majiffy did you change your vote?
Can you also expand on your thoughts a bit on what is currently going on, example do you think maf is scum still, if so why.

[farside22]

1. Hoopla: I misread the vote count and see you voting vezo. Still want your views on others and how you see agar at this point.

2. Marquis: who's scum besides the player you are voting?

[farside22]

And I dont mean omg Agar is absolute scum. Its fine but I'm not excited like I'd love to be.

Its more why in the name of god wont today end

Do something like scum hunt would be awesome. If agar is not scum who is and push them.

I just want to go around and creep some houses while Spyrex sends someone a painting

zzz

I asked for a case from you.

I've been prodded.

Why is this day still going on. Seriously

I am pretty pro getting on with the day too. People are getting lazy.

Agar vs. Vezok head2head battle. Lets go!

The day is going, your tired but still looking between the two wagons?

[farside22]

Zivel's excellent contributions mark him for death as it sits
This game needs to get its shit together and lynch someone.

Glad you like my excellent contributions, but I am struggling to get into the game. Coming in and reading that meta stuff at the start of the day from a newish person to the site just threw me. I dont know shit about anyone here and everyone seemed to know how everyone played and made assumptions based on this prior knowledge. I felt like the new kid at school, who comes in halfway through the year when everyone has lots of friends and I am left eating my lunch by myself.

The later day is making more sense but I still dont feel confident to toss my hat into the ring.

Don't worry about the meta, just put who you think is scum and why.

[farside22]

*pokes oversoul*'

[farside22]

Agar: who is scum on your wagon and why.
Give me a case that is not vezo.

[farside22]

Agar: who is scum on your wagon and why.
Give me a case that is not vezo.

Oversoul.

He's done pretty much fuckall this entire game. I laid out the crux of it in this post that apparently nobody read.

I agree with SpyreX on ZZZX.
And antihero should die a fiery gruesome death that involves rope and carpenter bees. Oh look, he's on my wagon too.

Here is my issue with what you call a case. There is no thought process that shows examples. 2. You're calling antihero scum for no fucking reason and 3. You stated that you feel it best to scum search but your scum searching is pretty much non-exaistant

[farside22]

Yeah I really think the case on me is tantamount to a hot, steaming pile of bullshit and that's sapping my ability to give a fuck with this game.

Vezok is pretty obviously scum and all I'm getting is "low hanging fruit" comments. We had a fake guilty that resulted in a lynch but not really. And then we have half this game who apparently gives no fucks.

So I'm finding it hard to not join them.

As for my case that you take issue with, I really give zero fucks what you think about it. You asked, and I gave it to you. Take it or leave it. I'm not you - I'm not going to make a case like you. And I have laid out why I find Antihero scummy. You're literally just not reading my posts unless you see something you can cherry pick. Park your vote, say some shit about what's scummy or whatever it is you think you're spouting, but stop making posts directed at me if you won't even be bothered to read my posts. It's really grating.

Oh I'm sorry should I look at this pile of shit that is wrong http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... 5#p5948715
Where antihero did not hem or haw in the fucking least.
Or this pile of crap where you realized you did not clarify why anti is scum http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... 0#p5949790
The above you link post and call it scummy as fuck which really why?
Basically if anyone read the link it says nothing and shows you are not reading the thread and cheery picked post by antihero that he voted for a player and wasn't the only one.

[farside22]

Where antihero did not hem or haw in the fucking least.

See this is what I mean.

If you read my fucking posts instead of cherry picking, you would've seen my follow up stating that "No I didn't state that Anti hemmed and hawed, I meant a paragraph well above that when I said 'see above', sorry that wasn't clear."

I'm done with you. Enjoy being fucking wronger than wrong.

All you stated above in the post was antihero is scum.

That was all you said in that post about why anti was scum. But sure fake scum hunting and all.

[farside22]

can we not just all say kumbaya to scum agar? why? why is this not happening?

and then spyrella?

I'm starting to think this, add in vezo.....still unsure about who is the 4th scum. The apathy in this game is giving me fitz.

[farside22]

Ive been trying but you and your buddies have done a good job discrediting the wagon as unviable.

The problem you face in my eyes is hoopla's statement here.

I'm going to be conftown tomorrow anyway, so again, quit killing the game's momentum.

What is the point of lynching a player today if she is truthful we know tomorrow, if lying we know tomorrow.
So really majiffy is there a point not to wait till tomorrow for hoopla 'a claim?

Thats the prob desp theres plenty of people calling hoopla scum but no one will pony up with a vote.

Sure, whatever, let's ignore all logic and be stupid and vote a player claiming they can confirm themselves tomorrow. That makes so much fucking sense.

[farside22]

I find it highlh unlikely she can confirm herself and instead wager she has an unlikely scum role that confirms her from wifom. See: fruit vendor, hider, etc.

Till tomorrow your point is theory and useless.

[farside22]

Yeah idk about that one.

Im sure in a month or so well all kick back and laugh about how ridiculously right I am.

If we all 3 are alive day 2 it may be a fun discussion then, but considering spy's claim the fruit vendor theory is pretty bad.

[farside22]

someone give intent now so agar can't pretend like he doesn't have to claim in his next post

I just feel like this was inevitable and he should have claimed already as town.

[farside22]

someone give intent now so agar can't pretend like he doesn't have to claim in his next post

I just generally don't claim unless I feel it would serve a purpose. This isn't one of those cases.

We have like 3 days to lynch, and I don't see everyone actually coming to a consensus on a lynch other than my own, no matter what I claim. I pretty much see it going claim -> a few unvotes -> circular, pointless discussion -> lynch me anyways. Let's cut out the bullshit here. We've had enough of it today.

Either you lynch me or you don't. Take your pick. I'm town. I'm not some role that seriously shoots the town in the foot if I die. I still win if you guys manage to lynch the obvious scum. It's pretty simple.

I'm somewhat frustrated because I'm starting to buy into Antihero's point on 4nxi3ty but seriously doubt there will be enough of a swing there in the time left. Vezok piled on after realizing he couldn't white knight me into a Hoopla lynch anymore. Start with those two. Anti trying to bus 4nx and also use that to bail on the wagon on me sorta (you can tell he wants to jump ship by his posts) is definitely in play. And Oversoul is scummy as shit.

I have not argued that vezo is not scum. If fact I've listed you two as scum for sometime.
My reason for pushing you over vezo is as scum you would worm your way out of peoples finds and continue your lack luster performance for a scum win.
But hey you want to lynch your scum buddy I won't stop it.

[farside22]

vezok saying that hoopla pushing agar makes agar more likely to be town and then putting him at l-1 for no reason while continuing to beg for hoopla's head tomorrow is a pretty damn good reason to vote vezok.

Fine. But I'm fucking serious about agar scum at this point.
Agar's case on anti was shitty as fuck, and him calling out is when I could list 3 others players doing shit all is a piece of shit too.

Vote: vezokpiraka[/list]

[farside22]

Is should be OS

[farside22]

Mollie if you can convince people to vote agar again I would love the help. All I get is that's a shitty meta case attitude

[farside22]

For three weeks?

One week only. I lurked first two weeks for my own selfish lazy reason. Does that make me magically scum? At least I kept the pages clean and readable instead of active lurking many people here are doing.

Vig this ^

Sure let's all lurk for 3 weeks, provide no information and magically find scum. That sound like a fun fucking game.

[farside22]

my braincells are committing suicide in protest of me exposing them to that piece of shit that is your post.

QFT!

@zzy: I never called you town. Personally I would policy lynch you but from your attitude of this game I figure PL is like banging my head on a brick wall.
Second you claimed not to be into mafia. http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... 1#p5967801
Well if you happen to be posting in other games that statement is a lie.

[farside22]

I wish there was a magic button that let me reference ongoing games.

[farside22]

why are you staying away from that zzxthing, agar

Detailed in this post.

I mean, when I can make a paragraph like that about someone, I don't see the point in voting someone else who I don't feel as confident about. ZZZX's play has been lurky, shitty and downright useless, but I just don't get the same bloodthirst for him right now.

I endorse this product and or service.

Now if you could write a good case on your scum reads I maybe retracting a lot of stuff I stated earlier.

[farside22]

Well besides the vezo case.

[farside22]

has he claimed yet?

Yes, he claimed scum.


In all seriousness he just was put to L-1

[farside22]

V/LA for 3 days. Family in town.

[farside22]

vezok's claim is null leaning scummy. he could have that role, or he could just...use his scum buddies to tell him what happened in their neighborhood that night in their scum qt.

I agree. There is nothing from the mod saying where the scum are in the neighborhood and why would it be considered a town role?

Hoopla: why assume vezo's role is town aligned?

[farside22]

Because no one in their first post says they have an ability that could be useful, effectively painting a target in their back in the first post of the game effectively.

How is the ability he is claiming useful.

Seriously.

[farside22]

Its not a very good role for either alignment, but its more worthless for scum than town.

Your acting like scum is in each neighborhood.
If you believed that why are you not evaluating those in each neiborhood by POE?

Example: vezo, oversoul, spy and zzzy are in the same neighborhood if you believe 3 our town why not vote the 4th player in the group?

[farside22]

Its not a very good role for either alignment, but its more worthless for scum than town.

Your acting like scum is in each neighborhood.
If you believed that why are you not evaluating those in each neiborhood by POE?

Example: vezo, oversoul, spy and zzzy are in the same neighborhood if you believe 3 our town why not vote the 4th player in the group?

It's highly likely scum are in 3 OR 4 neighbourhoods. I don't think I ever said anything about scum deffos being in all four.

But vezo's is more possible town because something likely?
I'm confused by this logic.

[farside22]

It's a useless (or almost useless) role for scum, but has some value for a townie as they can look in three different neighbourhoods they cannot see. Little value for scum, some for town.

Reck is more likely to give a role with no value for scum but some for town to a townie, in the same way you'd normally give a cop (little value for scum, some for town) to a townie instead of scum. Do you get my logic?

See my thought process is more a spy for scum in a room they are not in. For example you think I can talk about my reads and claim in my neighborhood due to reading all players in my neighborhood. Scum now can peek at that private convo and get an insight on things stated in a room you believed was safe.

[farside22]

or he just made it up

That's possible too. I don't see a reason to unvote a player I find scummy

[farside22]

I think vezok lynch is the best lynch that isnt me and therefor isnt a confirmed mislynch.

Vote: Vezok

Oh and if you say this is just me saving my own skin I would perfer a lynch with a chance to flip scum than my lynch which is confirmed to be a mislynch that happened just after someone made a certain counter wagon to save his scumpartner. Much original Such Play (No this last one aint english).

Anyway dont you see how fast they were to just jump on my wagon with no explaination required and leave the biggest scum read alive? I find it amusing.

Bawahahahaha

Vote: zzy

I would live for you to explain how you are a confirmed mislynch other then because I'm town response.

[farside22]

Sorry it's early.

VOTE: ZZZX

[farside22]

Vote: vezokpiraka

I rather see vezo's bs claim die. Don't believe, no it doesn't sound like a "fun" role and hoopla suddenly given a let go of vezo based on a crap claim gives me some really bad vibes.

[farside22]

Mod: vote count please!

If need be I'll check back here again. Anyone besides hoopla, vezo and o.s that vezo claim looks legit let me know.

[farside22]

Vote: Vezo

I rather see vezo's bs claim die. Don't believe, no it doesn't sound like a "fun" role and hoopla suddenly given a let go of vezo based on a crap claim gives me some really bad vibes.

well, my desire to lynch outside of the two watcher claims we have is pretty close to zero.

my desire to lynch mollie is less than zero.

You know I read this and thought you wanted to lynch Mollie. Wow brain spaz moment.

I asked about the vote count I don't know if lynching vezo is outside the realm

[farside22]

Can the meltdown wait till day 2 and we lynch scum vezo please.

Yes vezo as scum is this bad. His town play is hella better then this shit.

[farside22]

MOLLIE. come off the ledge!

the you/desp exchange didn't make anyone lurk. lurksacks will be lurksacks regardless of if there's 2 pages or 200 pages.

i'm still here.

let's lynch zzzx, get our first scumflip and go from there

Why not vezo?

[farside22]

I think we have 6 hours or so.

Vezo: thought on the claims thus far? Why vote Mollie?

[farside22]

I think we have 6 hours or so.

Vezo: thought on the claims thus far? Why vote Mollie?

I don't like the meltdown. I've played with mollie before and she is calculated and actively scumhunting. I've never seen her do something like this. My first reaction is that she is scum doing an over the top AtE.
I don't know what to say about the claims. I'm pretty sure one of them is scum. Maybe both. I need a flip to understand this better.

I'm the queen of past meltdown's, it null and not alignment indictive.

[farside22]

ps that's l-1

Sorry to see you go.

Game is a powder house of emotion.

[farside22]

I'm hammering myself if I come back after I finish this lol match if I'm not hammered yet.

If you were town you would be listing you scum reads for people to consider with a reason why before a hammer.

[farside22]

I'm sorry I disappointed you guys.
I'm town.

Look into hoopla, zzx and mollie tomorrow. At least one of them is scum probably two.

Zzx I can see, hoopla and zzx together is hard to see.

[farside22]

I'm thinking oversoul is scum.

[farside22]

Why the vote on bob over zzx oversoul?

[farside22]

VOTE: hoopla

Bawhahaha


Zzzx: did you see someone target spyrex?

[farside22]

Also my neighborhood was terrifyingly quiet. Anyone elses?

Anxiety is on my shit list for not posting in our QT at all.

[farside22]

ZZZX

did you see someone target spy? If so who ?

[farside22]

I just have a list of WHO visited our neighborhood. I got 3 people.

Well spy stated he was redirected by someone. With the 3 names does one stand out as scummy?

[farside22]

No more votes till hoopla says why she is confirmed town and marquis replies.

[farside22]

I'm trying to work something out here for a moment.
Spy is one player that targeted the group that zzzx is in, one player targetted the group to put zzzx up (I assume it's an ability of a player and not game mechanic unknown) and one was marquis?

Zzzx: would the above be correct thus far?

[farside22]

Ohh and OS

Why the hell would I hide I was redirected?
What in ZZZ's "OHH GOSH YOU GUYS REALLY" post in our neighborhood stood out as extra townie?

Oversoul is most likely scum.

all his posts are active lurking and not furthering the game.

Agreed....weren't you following his thought process on majiffy yesterday?

Just pick who I want once in the game.

That's odd. Why would zzx not see you target then?
FTR: I don't think zzx would be lying about that or as scum say sure I saw X too as scum when I started with my questions about those targeting the neighborhood.

[farside22]

Should I claim all visitors to the neighborhood?

Was it Bob? If not I say wait till marquis post.

[farside22]

I can see scum bob gladiating zzzx. I cant see scum zzzx gladiating bob.

...didn't hoopla just claim the gladiator thing?

It's almost as if majiffy isn't reading the game.

I'm sorry did you say something?


Hoopla: what's your current view on zzzx?

[farside22]

VOTE: Bob

[farside22]

someone explain things

Why did you target zzzx neighborhood?

yeah, i'm thinking hoopla is scum too

Besides WIFOM crap that bob just threw out, care to explain?

[farside22]

Mmmmmnope
Town

Sure, right, just like you are that great at town reads and never doubt yourself?
Please let me know how clear your reads are when skeptism doesn't effect you.

[farside22]

i'm so confused

CLAIM

[farside22]

i just read zzzx iso

i'm not claiming until he fullclaims (WHOLE ROLE NAME) but i can confirm that my kids visited CEDAR instead of MAPLE

Can I head smack myself on the desk?

[farside22]

i just read zzzx iso

i'm not claiming until he fullclaims (WHOLE ROLE NAME) but i can confirm that my kids visited CEDAR instead of MAPLE

Can I head smack myself on the desk?

go for it

Must resist urge to rant.

Zzx is part of Cedar. He saw you target his neighborhood.

Kicks Oversoul Ass

Let's see that flip.

[farside22]

Farside, you wound me

If you all saw a naked man wandering your street... *waves dong*

1-shot ass kicker.
Die scum die!

[farside22]

Besides WIFOM crap that bob just threw out, care to explain?

you misunderstand

the mod meta stuff is to show hoopla's role isn't a town-only role like she claims

she's scum because she gladiatored me and zzzx on day 2 and hinted at it on day 1 without being pressured while sounding like she was pressured

I agree the role is not clearly town only role and weak.
I'm also bothered that hoopla followed your logic day 1 voted maff and puts you on the block over others that were not very chatty.

[farside22]

That's a really lame way to day kill someone, fitting for Reck

Dude you obviously never lived in a complex.
I laughed when I read the role.

[farside22]

Totally given oversoul scum read.
Damn you mod for ruining my fun. I want rights if you ever create an ass kicker role

[farside22]

aSTOP TELLING ME TO FULLCLAIM ZZZX'S CLAIM WAS REALLY VAGUE AND I HAVE SOMETHING ON HIM WHICH HE SHOULD NOT BE ABLE TO GET OUT OF JUST BECAUSE HE GOT TO THE THREAD FIRST

You should sort of hint what you got on him.

[farside22]

Hoopla: why did you pick Bob when you were agreeing and following his logic on day one?

Still waiting on marquis to explain himself.

[farside22]

Mostly PoE. I have so many town reads now that it made me reevaluate things.

And majiffy, one of your scum reads day one, was not picked because...????

[farside22]

Zzx: if you get lynch you should claim your result. Someone that targetted the neighborhood is a potentional redirector if spy is being truthful.

Majiffy: hush you were pushing Mollie at the end of the day.

[farside22]

Also on a side note: the neighborhood with the extra vote, both marquis and metal voted for zzx currently. No word from aniexty.

[farside22]

VOTE: bob

byebye bob

Why are you voting zzx in the private topics?

[farside22]

i sheep marquis

why aren't you voting in the private topics?

I'm waiting for marquis to explain why he wanted a full claim from the person who saw him visit there neighborhood.

Howd you guys get a private topic thats open?

I don't know. Just received a pm saying we get to have as a group a second vote.
We can not communicate in the thread, just vote.

[farside22]

V/LA till Monday, forth plans

[farside22]

Marquis or anyone: what was marquis track results?

Something crazy hit me on my walk and I wonder if I remembered incorrectly?

[farside22]

i'm a 1-shot tracker

last night i submitted track maple

but

somehow my kiddies got lost and tracked cedar

spyrex visited cedar

oversoul visited pine

but i got no mention of zzzx... but he claimed a watcher action last night.

so. i'm pretty sure zzzx claimed an active 1-shot action too so i'm just wondering if we're all going to work off of zzzx's results why exactly you guys are all trusting those to be completely true because i also thought there was something crazy about claims.

I found it.

Oversoul why were you visiting pine street?

I'm asking you know because Mollie was part of pine street and you were there.

[farside22]

no wait nvm

I think you were more questioning zzx because of your results.
I'm a part of pine street but it didn't hit me at first and I pushed it as possible crazy because oversoul is a scum read.

[farside22]

You know for a player that forced this situation you would think she would ask the 2 suspects up for nom's some questions or be more involved to figure out which, if either was scum.

Yawn

[farside22]

You know for a player that forced this situation you would think she would ask the 2 suspects up for nom's some questions or be more involved to figure out which, if either was scum.

Yawn

i guess this game apathy make us all sleep.

lets just find the remaining scum via PR because we aren't in any capability to do scumhunting.

yawn

Oh I'm sorry I'm pointing out that a player saying the ability confirms her as town would scum hunt as town.

My vote on bob hasn't moved because zzx has provided info and been involved in discussion today. Bob did next to nothing day 1 and now nothing day 2.

What's your take on the two?

[farside22]

I didn't provide any info or insights?

on day 1 I was the only one to make a solid case on majiffy

today I made a case (1601) on hoopla which has been rehashed by anti and agar

the point agar made on hoopla's probable inability to use her ability late-game and a lot of the mistakes anti pointed out in her narrative (the early claim, the priming, the anti-town choice of targets) were all in my original case

Your case on Hoopla was one big fucking modding the game. Your tunnel on majiffy was from what I remember rehash of the same issue repeatedly through the day.

Was zzx useless day 1. Absolutely. Did I piss him off my pointing out he was not involved the the game day 1.? Sure did. Well guess what today is the day I point out your flaws.

Why should I want to lynch zzx? He claimed a role, sure role could be scum, called out those he saw visit his street, no denial from players this happened and the one person who tracked said he didn't see him target the neighborhood. That is the only thing I really need to check on.

[farside22]

Hmm. Apparently the people in the neighborhood street won't even see me either. Just people with what classified "observer" class roles.

So yeah. When I was talking about Vanilla Lite or French Vanilla early in the game about spec I was thinking of my role. While not exactly vanilla, it is pretty damn useless.

[farside22]

So clearly Maple is the source of the redirector.

Did spy and marquis both try to target maple street?

[farside22]

Technical if zzx is town scum have to kill him to kill either os or spy. Considering scum os is there it won't happen.

[farside22]

Technical if zzx is town scum have to kill him to kill either os or spy. Considering scum os is there it won't happen.

What?

Does zzx ability hurt you if you are scum?

[farside22]

Official Vote Count

ZZZX

(6): Bicephalous Bob, SpyreX, Marquis, Zivel, Antihero, Pine St

Bicephalous Bob

(5): Oversoul, Majiffy, farside22, ZZZX, Metal Sonic

Not Voting

(4): chamber, Desperado,

Hoopla

, AGar

No, no the bolded not voting is bull shit.

[farside22]

majiffy what is bullshit?

farside why is hoopla not voting bullshit?

She created this block and has not been part of it

[farside22]

Funny bob's scum read on hoopla then is just role related.

[farside22]

yeah, i think there's a

really

good chance of chamber's slot being scum

Me too.

[farside22]

Before a lynch I have one question I want answered.

Chamber: can you target your own neighborhood with you ability?

[farside22]

Damn phone, why won't it take the quote stuff from each page?

Can you PM me details about you phone after the game?

Just remind me. My memory is sometime shit when it comes to small things.

Also want to know if you can use your ability on your own neighborhood.

[farside22]

My ability can be used on my own neighborhood as I read it. I haven't asked the mod for clarification.

I will official vote for you tomorrow.
You may not know why aniexty did what he did, but the fact that Mollie claimed watcher and the ability was not used to deflect players from pine street makes you scum in my book.

[farside22]

My ability can be used on my own neighborhood as I read it. I haven't asked the mod for clarification.

I will official vote for you tomorrow.
You may not know why aniexty did what he did, but the fact that Mollie claimed watcher and the ability was not used to deflect players from pine street makes you scum in my book.

To what end?

To see a scum flip.

Not redirecting from pine where Mollie lived is bullshit.
Looking at anxiety ISO most of his scum reads came from Maple.
It makes no sense to direct players away from those you find scummy.

[farside22]

I meant, to what end would he redirect Mollies location?

So you redirect player or places?

[farside22]

So and help me puzzle through this mess of nonsense.

If your action is targeted, did you in any way have to directly target Cedar? As in, is mr mysterious role mod mistakes random percentages on top of EVERYTHING ELSE just flat wrong?

Please let that be the case.

Pleaseeee

---

The lynch has nothing to do with today being a debacle. We, the nation, have everything to do with it being a debacle.

Much like how I'm hardvoting hoopla tomorrow for it regardless of what happens today.

Oh bus drive. So he bus drove people away from maple to cedar.
Why did aniexty not bus drive people away from maple to x spot?
Again Mollie claimed and if you ISO aniexty those he was scum reading were at maple.
Except for agar who people suspected.

Siiigh you are 4nx.

Carry on.

And?

[farside22]

Sorry question is why did aniexty not bus drive people away from pine street?

[farside22]

I don't know why he chose the locations he chose. I'm incapable of answering your question, so answer mine for me, what value would there be in doing what you think he should have done?

As I understand things (and I still don't really understand the mechanics in this game) my ability would only work on things that affect a location. Player targeted effects like the nightkill would be left unaffected. I haven't actually asked for clarity, but I don't understand how a single targeted effect could be resolved if my ability did affect it.

That makes no sense.
Marquis targetted maple and got redirected to cedar, why would a kill not be effected by your role? Does it specifically say it does not redirect certain abilities?

As for why this is important Mollie (who was sal) claimed during day 1 a watcher role that was to watch anyone it seemed and she was killed last night.
Anyone who called her scum was off there nutter.

[farside22]

With the way everyone has been handling neighborhoods, that ability is basically useless.

Something I agree with, oh wait I'm talking to the guy not really posting in the neighborhood anyways or using it for ant value.

Speaking of bob did he ever explain his scum read on majiffy or me?

[farside22]

Then give an actual case as to why Bob is scum.

I think Bob might be town, but I don't think he is as town as ZZZX. Plus, ZZZX's role is MUCH more useful for town than Bob's. Plain and simple. Why is that hard to see?

I'd love to hear why people think bob is town.

[farside22]

I don't know why he chose the locations he chose. I'm incapable of answering your question, so answer mine for me, what value would there be in doing what you think he should have done?

As I understand things (and I still don't really understand the mechanics in this game) my ability would only work on things that affect a location. Player targeted effects like the nightkill would be left unaffected. I haven't actually asked for clarity, but I don't understand how a single targeted effect could be resolved if my ability did affect it.

That makes no sense.
Marquis targetted maple and got redirected to cedar, why would a kill not be effected by your role? Does it specifically say it does not redirect certain abilities?

Marquis can correct me if I'm wrong, but as I understand it he tracked the whole

neighbourhood

? So would be redirected because his action was tracking the

neighbourhood

. the kill targets a

single player

, how on earth would it being moved from one neighborhood to the other be resolved? who in the new neighbourhood would die? someone at random?

Ah so it redirects neighborhood.
Pretty sure that is what marquis action does.
We chat tonight about scum reads in the chat.

[farside22]

Vote: AGar

I also have a scum read on Zivel which I talked with chamber in part and suspicion on spy.

[farside22]

Desp, does that really surprise you coming from scum Antihero?

VOTE: Antihero

Agar also a good wagon. Whoever Majiffy gave to or if he claimed in his neighborhood, there is a scum there.

You better explain something more because that hammer from anti was fucking pro town.

[farside22]

Shinobi is also a pretty good wagon.

Why do you think shinobi is scum?

[farside22]

oh look, a new agar wagon. look who's here to scoop it up.

The best advice I ever received in a mafia game was from VP Baltar, when I was run up to L-1 as town in one of my first few games on site. He told me that rather than waste time trying to defend myself, I should instead focus my efforts on finding the scum. Because either I get lynched and you now have reads to work from that you know are genuine. Or I find actual scum and we lynch actual scum. It's a win-win.

Your current attitude is very different from this.

Chamber talked a little last night about my reads. I don't recall him stating scum reads.

So I thought about it some.

Invisible gives credence to ZZZX's role as much as it physically pains me.
I'm still not excited at all about the way hoopla did that yesterday but the sack makes me twitch.
Anti's town as fuck and oversoul is dumb.
I dont get EITHER side of the AGar business coming out of the gate today.

My reads this game are not good. Time for ol standby.

Unvote, Vote: Shinobi

Why are you voting for shinobi?

I honestly don't have a clue why I'm being voted.

I'm not even sure why you're alive. Didn't MS claim a guilty on you?

On page 34 or so.

No one is explaining so far. I want to see what spy says before I explain why I'm suspicious.

[farside22]

You seem kinda scummy^

Shush you. Let spy explain himself.

nah, agar first

he gave up

This^
I do not want to be chatting it up with scum agar tonight.

spyrex
you're really ready to commit seppuku over townreading bob? i think a lot of people were doing that. not sure how you can support this assertion that your reads are somehow bad to the point where you should disengage yourself.

feels like a scum pity party.

Not everyone was town reading bob and no one ever explain why he was a town read.

[farside22]

Oh my god so satisfying to have that game over their heads forever now

why are you so proud about being scummy enough to get lynched as town? pretty sure the threee of us didnt murder you singlehandedly

I mean people were reading me correctly, they were just all dead. And the argument that if someone acts scummy, no one can correctly read them is fallacious.

I'm sorry we all need to read each other correctly and not call anyone scum.


Just be happy I can not link ongoing games sir.

[farside22]

Forgive me Farside ;_;

Sorry it's not about your remark. I was trying to say your scum reads are not always right. No one is perfect.
My concern with you is that your town reads on weak reasoning. I moved you to null because you could have switched to bob yesterday and lynched zzx. Bob's role is pretty fucking strong and agar pushing bob to live based on a really weak claim looks hella scummy.

[farside22]

Vote antihero

Sleep brings clarity.

I want a reason why.

[farside22]

He ended the day before I could catch up

LOL

@anyone in chamber's neighborhood

: did he actually catch up or was that a bunch of smoke and mirrors?

He made it known he was stuck with 2 vi and me like I was pretty much worthless talking too and stated a town read on spy, wished he was with him or hoopla.

[farside22]

You are literally the one that stopped my process by hammering when I asked you not to, and yet you are trying to hold that against me? Seriously?

Well it's as stupid as holding him responsible for lynching scum.

I like interacting with the people who's play I actually find questionable, like with say, agar's inconsistency.

Yet you are not questioning agar or responding to him. You voted anti for shit reasons.

I like interacting with the people who's play I actually find questionable, like with say, agar's inconsistency.

haha, ok

so, according to you, the only people whose play you find questionable are

1) metal sonic
2) the guy who's just happening to be the one getting hard wagoned right now.

yep. looks like scumhunting at it's most earnest

poor poor pitiful pity party for you, chamber. you're the victim here.

Should I mention metal is in our neighborhood and chamber didn't say anything to him?

farside, what's been going on in that neighborhood, i'd like to know.

I want a neighborhood that chats!
Marquis has self doubts but thinks hoopla's town.
Metal is pretty much a non enitity who I would pl any game.
Chamber: few questions to me about ms and spy and Zivel.
But no info back from him.

[farside22]

I can sometimes confuse competence with towniness. He was one of the most competent seeming players when I was catching up. With that veil lifted though I think hes done a lot of overtly scummy things. He ended the day before I could catch up, he attempted to make bob vs zzzx about their roles, he tried to make me look bad for questioning agar, how else did he expect me to develop opinions? It was just thoughtless rhetoric.

I experience the same thing with regards to reading competence as towniness... actually I think most people do. I feel like I have a lot of town reads to the point where it's making me question my other town reads based on superficial stuff like activity/competence and anti is one I've been reading as town mostly because he's had a good presence in the game. I don't really agree with the rest of chamber's assertions about anti, but I wouldn't be surprised if he turns out to be scum.

Way to say absolutely nothing!

Enjoy the award.

Show me where you say you are ending the day early because my catchup is damaging to the town? You seemed all for it when I first said so. this is just some post hoc bullshit you are spewing to try and defend yourself.

That's not scummy.

zzzzzzzzzz if this is what you consider scumhunting its piss poor. he is totally capable of both catching up on an 80 page game and posting re: current events and your angle here is garbage dude

At the peak of my game I could give a shit.

Here, where I said my reads are bad I could reaallllly give a shit.

But lets go ahead and let tons of fun finish up and see what shakes out.

@Anti:

I didn't get redirected, so I think that you should have got my picture. Why act sooo surprised at my statement when I said just that in the picture.

@Everyone In Shinobi's Neighborhood:

Please, PLEASE tell me if:

1.) He was posting reads of where he was at.
2.) If anything there would have alluded to activity after page 34.
3.) Ohh god pleaseplease tell me he went why isnt SpyreX dead and someone told him why.

@All:

Before we get caught in catfighting, lets look at yesterdays wagons under the assumption both weren't scum.

Let's play wifom for a moment.
Why was bob a town read? Why was zzx still a scum read after producing info?

Stop ignoring my questions.

[farside22]

Calmed down for a moment.
I think chambers whole point is ridiculous but I don't see scum motivation for it.
I maybe bias against him for thinking I'm not a good person to bounce things off of.

The brutal fact is agar is scum. There is no arguing, trying to look for scum or nothing at all that he stated he would/should do.
He pushed zzx and let's assume zzx is scum for a second, that role bob had was so freeking awesome who would you think of pushing as scum with a wagon that is tied?
I asked people to explain why they thought bob was town. I have no response from anyone. But when you ask people why they voted against zzx wagon hoopla thought he was trying to work things out, anti thought about those I both wagons, chamber unvoted zzx to get a read going.

So that all said.
Spy why were you town reading bob?
Agar: same question.

[farside22]

Antihero: chamber is in your new neighborhood make sure someone reports his activity and whether he bounces ideas there.,
I don't 100% trust the slot

[farside22]

I actually think we are on the same team. We already have flipped scum in our original neighborhood so probabilistically the odds are much lower as there won't be more than two scum in each original neighborhood. Your wrongness in basically all your reads so far also makes me think you're town as scum like to boost their stats and claim a correct prediction occasionally.

As far agar, I think his original wagon on d1 was uninspired and lacked real competition until I forced a counterwagon. Those situations usually end up being on a townie as scum has little incentive to move the game elsewhere. I also think his refusal to claim was town which I've also talked about.

You started a counter wagon on town.
Remember majiffy he was town.
Vezo he was town.

If you believe scum in the original groups who are you scum reading between oversoul and spy and why?

[farside22]

When you get back hoopla, please explain the uninspired wagon with you comment here.

agar wagon is good actually. not forgetting about antihero. putting dat in my mental notez

UNVOTE:
VOTE: AGar

[farside22]

And I tried to derail it once it became obvious vezok was town, but everyone wanted to twiddle their thumbs around deadline. I did my best. And I had majiffy as town from d2 onwards.

Between oversoul and spy, spy is likelier scum.

You thought zzx was scum and pushed for him, today were do you stand?