Advance Wars UPick!--Game Over..?

[Ms Marangal]

confirm

[Ms Marangal]

I am regretting joining this game, I think

ffery/ceph, your hood has more than three people in it?

[Ms Marangal]

as I wait their response, I'll start off here




Saki
honey bee
Ffery
Orci
notsci

BPC
Ceph
STD

Flubbernugget
MafiaSSK
Cabd
Varsoon

[Ms Marangal]

Its a read list, yes. that is where my gut takes me, atm and as far as cabd goes, if hes town and wants to be read as town, he can go and earn it. set-up spec is null, coming from him

[Ms Marangal]

I feel like you are playing devils advocate, though Brian.

[Ms Marangal]

plz, I'm pretty much already conf. town

[Ms Marangal]

VOTE: Cabd

lets fight

[Ms Marangal]

Most, if not all of that case is insulting to my scum-game and consistency is a scum-tell

regardless of that, when have I ever shown any cases of not being able to keep my reads straight as scum?

Couldn't town-mara regret joining the game because of the gamestate at 271 and it's quick pace?
Couldn't seeing setup spec as null just mean that Mara is justifying a scum read on you by saying your setup spec is null and does not upset the scum read?

this is scary

[Ms Marangal]

why are you making a half-defense when you aren't even sure of my alignment yourself?

[Ms Marangal]

yeah, fuck you to orci.

Ceph, larger hoods are more likely to have scum hidden inside of them, and would be willing to treat anything three or less as masons

me

also called out cabd and he's ignoring me, he's pretty assured scum and that "genuine town posting" ceph was talking about is a forced reaction to an expectation

[Ms Marangal]

plz, I'm pretty much already conf. town

I would vote you for this post, but I am too busy voting Varsoon

you know this is a joke, and where it comes from

and yes, I'm reading bee as town, though he's posted once. problem?

[Ms Marangal]

Mara do you know anything about these games?

no, but I can wiki

[Ms Marangal]

Mara the immediate not-me votes on you when you "called me out" is kind of my response.

I don't see how orci and notsci voting means anything as far as a response goes

plz, I'm pretty much already conf. town

I would vote you for this post, but I am too busy voting Varsoon

you know this is a joke, and where it comes from

and yes, I'm reading bee as town, though he's posted once. problem?

how did you get a town read off of this:

/confrim

I didn't, I said I town-read him, not where the basis was from

[Ms Marangal]

Most, if not all of that case is insulting to my scum-game and consistency is a scum-tell
regardless of that, when have I ever shown any cases of not being able to keep my reads straight as scum?

Normally you don't. But this is not a time of normalcy for you (or for me or several others) and I can totally believe you fucked up your reads list majorly while trying to post in the middle of packing and stuff.

there's never been a moment where my life has been "normal"

[Ms Marangal]

You, I feel like you have been stating mostly the obvious so far. You sound madish at Cabd, but how are your feelings on him thus far?

Mad? no, but I want him, not whatevertheufuckitisheisplanningbehindthread

[Ms Marangal]

Are we going to pretend that initial post wasn't just a reaction test that Mara realized was a reaction test and catered her response to or what

I realized he responded to my read on him the way he thinks I want him to?

[Ms Marangal]

You, I feel like you have been stating mostly the obvious so far. You sound madish at Cabd, but how are your feelings on him thus far?

Mad? no, but I want him, not whatevertheufuckitisheisplanningbehindthread

What kind of interaction are you trying to have with him and how is it gonna be productive?

Something genuine, for starters.

[Ms Marangal]

Are we going to pretend that initial post wasn't just a reaction test that Mara realized was a reaction test and catered her response to or what

I realized he responded to my read on him the way he thinks I want him to?

He thinks you want him to assert rather confidently that you are scum?

He thinks I want him to respond to my scum-read in kind.

He probably knows that I intend to sort him, and that my read on him probably isn't as strong as I am leading people to believe. He's got more access to how my mind works as town, in real time because we've had more maraca town games than maracascumgames and this isn't the first time I've enforced a scum-read on a stronger player. I told him I wanted him to work for that town-read because it isn't going to be given.

I could buy 282 being partly genuine but the fact that he's made it clear that he's pulling strings behind the thread instead of directly responding to me. He's thinking, not acting and I don't like it.

[Ms Marangal]

Are we going to pretend that initial post wasn't just a reaction test that Mara realized was a reaction test and catered her response to or what

I realized he responded to my read on him the way he thinks I want him to?

He thinks you want him to assert rather confidently that you are scum?

He thinks I want him to respond to my scum-read in kind.

He probably knows that I intend to sort him, and that my read on him probably isn't as strong as I am leading people to believe. He's got more access to how my mind works as town, in real time because we've had more maraca town games than maracascumgames and this isn't the first time I've enforced a scum-read on a stronger player. I told him I wanted him to work for that town-read because it isn't going to be given.

I could buy 282 being partly genuine but the fact that he's made it clear that he's pulling strings behind the thread instead of directly responding to me. He's thinking, not acting and I don't like it.

I thought your read not being strong was pretty transparent considering you went on to promptly imply he was null!

I implied that him doing set-up work he was doing was null

[Ms Marangal]

ffery said something about it, in response to me I think but I still don't think this is outside the realm of possiblity for cabdscum

[Ms Marangal]

(because it probably was)

[Ms Marangal]

By not voting him?

You keep bringing up people's lack of votes when it's very obvious voting today is all going to end up on scumsoon anyways.

I thought that was going to be me, I already have more votes than him anyway

[Ms Marangal]

Oh and re: mara my read has nothing to do with any of our maraca games, mara. It has to do with you displaying scum-PM fatigue like in nati's bastard mini.

that isn't what you said earlier

you also know that I sort better with direct confrontation and such, but you've opted for the indirect approach and threw your neighbors at me, instead

[Ms Marangal]

it's almost like you don't want me to solidify a read on you, and you're buying time before I go out and have fun and stuff

[Ms Marangal]

You are really focused on Cabd's neighborhood, when personally I have no idea about anything to do with said neighborhood. Why are you so concerned about that?

More importantly, convince me that you don't know who is in said neighborhood.

I have a good clue to who he's with, but he said his response was the flashvotes on me right after the call out, which probably means he had them vote me

[Ms Marangal]

that also means he has some time to think through his response to me which means more of

this

Are we going to pretend that initial post wasn't just a reaction test that Mara realized was a reaction test and catered her response to or what

I realized he responded to my read on him the way he thinks I want him to?

and less this

You, I feel like you have been stating mostly the obvious so far. You sound madish at Cabd, but how are your feelings on him thus far?

Mad? no, but I want him, not whatevertheufuckitisheisplanningbehindthread

What kind of interaction are you trying to have with him and how is it gonna be productive?

Something genuine, for starters.

[Ms Marangal]

Ffery sans paranoia also isn't a whole lot of fun

[Ms Marangal]

strategic reads are strategic, but results this game are subpar

[Ms Marangal]

AKA, you're probably the one I'm going to sort next but I am going to have to figure out how to do it

[Ms Marangal]

I mean, I'm sitting here sort of laughing at the votes on me because they're meaningless, but if people want to leave some suspicion out there so I don't get shot night one be my guest.

You've misrepped me and have been blatantly ignoring anything I've said.

I'm not utterly convinced that Varsoon is getting lynched today, maybe I'm just daft.

I'd like to figure out if you are town or not personally.

I think he's mostly mocking me

[Ms Marangal]

for some reason i just dont understand maras posts this game. is it just me?

do you ever?

[Ms Marangal]

yeah, fuck you to orci.

Ceph, larger hoods are more likely to have scum hidden inside of them, and would be willing to treat anything three or less as masons

That seems imprudent.

Only if you think Nati is likely to include a 4+ member masonry in his game.

I've been told facts earlier, this is rescinded

[Ms Marangal]

flubber, Notsci, and possibly Orci

all three votes happened after I called for our 1v1, and Orci seemed to want to push it though in a kinda weird way

[Ms Marangal]

first two were naked, and orci's one might as well have been, to

[Ms Marangal]

first two were naked, and orci's one might as well have been, to

Bpc could easily replace orci (or be included, even), I think he would be more likely to follow w/e plan you came up with in qt though his vote came later

[Ms Marangal]

VOTE: Orci

[Ms Marangal]

Varsoon
Honey
STD
Ceph

guys that need to be on this wagon.

Nothing else is happening today, scum-tell with 100% application has been dropped

[Ms Marangal]

the other 5 votes can be whoeverthefuck, really. but this is happening today

[Ms Marangal]

Varsoon
Honey
STD
Ceph

guys that need to be on this wagon.

Nothing else is happening today, scum-tell with 100% application has been dropped

no more talking

[Ms Marangal]

Brian can also join that list

[Ms Marangal]

Ceph

[Ms Marangal]

Orci just scum-told, he's getting lynched

[Ms Marangal]

Nothing else matters but this Orci lynch. Nothing. I can finish sorting people out tomorrow, but Orci has to die

[Ms Marangal]

No, he isn't.

A cursory awareness of the game state should convince you of this.

What are you expecting/ That I'll drop everything and trust you on something you aren't even explaining in the thread, when I don't especially think you're town?

I have no intention of removing my vote from Varsoon today.

I'm expecting him to flip scum.
expecting you to know that I wont just, on a whim show my true reads until neccessary
I've explained the tell a couple times before, and was sure that you were in one of those games, but it does have a 100% rate so far and that tell was dropped. The replacement tell, it's one that I had made myself so no one knows how it works better than I do

[Ms Marangal]

Brian can also join that list

Are you avoiding me?

You still need to be sorted, not doing that atm

[Ms Marangal]

Mara your replacement tell has been invalid for like at least a year holy fuck i'm not voting orc over that try again.

It hasn't been used in like, a year because that's how long I've gone with minimal amount of games, and never got around to more practical applications, but it doesn't mean it's invalid

[Ms Marangal]

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... ement+tell

thread of the actual tell

[Ms Marangal]

I can't find the threads of where I had applied it, but I know that I applied it to Thor once and caught him with it.

[Ms Marangal]

I mean, sure town can give the summary, but more times than not, it's not as likely to be on their mind unless it's something they usually do, like grey or something mentioned in thread. Orci has no history of doing that. Scum have more benefits than town from giving the summary, way more benefits and, with all that aside, the way the summary is made. What the summary is aimed to do, is what really kinda matters

[Ms Marangal]

we can afford one or two, ns.

[Ms Marangal]

It is a thing, and even if it isn't, I was unsure on orci's alignment, and couldn't figure out if it was Orci just being Orci but the drop was just a big seller

[Ms Marangal]

like, Despite being one of the top posters, he's surprising low on content. He says he's pushing both mine, and varsoons wagons, but I don't really even see it. even when he's town, and not voting someone he's vocal about his scumspects and pushes them, makes cases on them and such, but he's been pretty fency from what I'm used to seeing

[Ms Marangal]

STD, give me your vote. IIRC, you were scum-reading Orci to begin with?

[Ms Marangal]

pedit: this isn't happening any day, but today short of a role that is confirmed town

[Ms Marangal]

Orci-scum

[Ms Marangal]

also, ceph, no my varsoon town-read isn't new but I don't vocalize reads unless I need to, and IMO, it didn't really seem like he was going to get lynched. I did though, say that I was going to get lynched over him and probably would have self-voted if things got serious enough

pedit: Orci is being lynched today. Not tomorrow, not D3, but today unless he's some town-confirmed role like mason or IC

[Ms Marangal]

I can buy the act that he actually thought you guys were all town from the wording. granted, my neighborhood is

considerably smaller

that your guys's one, if I were to act on impulse like I usually do I would have made the exact same mistake. I can easily see me being in varsoon slot all game, and I don't think I would have behaved any differently

[Ms Marangal]

also, what he says is true. Outting your neighborhood probably was a pro-town thing to do, especially considering the fact that it's probably the largest faction aside from scum, in the game and could also be an indicator to how big the scum-team is which is extremely beneficial to town. If scum likely already know who is within that neighborhood and what's going on inside of it, and such why hide it from the rest of town?

[Ms Marangal]

from what I understand, he didn't deny it. He just realized stuff, to little to late

[Ms Marangal]

in anycase, we're detracting ffrom the orc lynch

[Ms Marangal]

sci, every other neighborhood should be kept under wraps.

[Ms Marangal]

and yes, varsoon is shitting on the game but when the only reason everyone wants a person lynched is because of a little mistake that has been made, it's difficult not to

[Ms Marangal]

WHO CARES IF VARSOON OUTTED HIS ROLE AND ABILITY IN THREAD AND THOUGHT THE HUGE NEIGHBORHOOD WAS ALL TOWN IT HAPPENED, LETS MOVE ON AND VOTE ORCI

[Ms Marangal]

Dragons.
Honey.

[Ms Marangal]

it's multiple reason with the focal point starting from that, from what I can tell.

pedit: thinking about?

[Ms Marangal]

there are alot of reasons why people are voting/scum-reading varsoon but it all seems to boil down to the point of, him freaking out over the little mistake that he's made

[Ms Marangal]

Hey

[Ms Marangal]

The thing with Mara's tell for me is that she isn't analyzing any of the post in question, or even questioning others whether the catchup post is invalid in any way. She's applying a blanket tell but not doing any of the legwork.

uh....

[Ms Marangal]

WHy what?

[Ms Marangal]

the "tell" was Orci giving the summary, there is only one post in question that I have to analyze

[Ms Marangal]

STD?

[Ms Marangal]

The tell is still valid. Players with history/playstyle thing towards that have been taken into consideration.

STD, why aren't you voting orci

[Ms Marangal]

Sure

but that defense would have also started a whole lot sooner if I was scum

[Ms Marangal]

Becacuse?

the case remains short because I'm busy doing stuff, but Orci is still scum. He's still pretty low on content, and he isn't being as vocal as I am used to seeing him being and I don't feel any threat from his push on me, when I know I would if he was town

[Ms Marangal]

Pedit: the push and pressure happened alot sooner than my defense on him. It happened on D1, practically and I was fairly active and aware of it happening. I admitted to having a town-read on him earlier, but didn't do much to defend him until I got the lynch I want to make

[Ms Marangal]

I laughed, but he's still town

[Ms Marangal]

though

X makes sense if you're pushing this specific scumgenda but doing Y makes it less effective is a good a maratowncase as any

[Ms Marangal]

What I want, though is the Orci lynch over anything. I've already stated as much, and I will get rid of all other agendas that are being made

[Ms Marangal]

(like this wagon on varsoon)

[Ms Marangal]

Varsoon is literally god-town, though

[Ms Marangal]

and, if anything Cabd has been the more vocal pusher of both wagons. Orci's literally done shit or his pushes

[Ms Marangal]

no shit

that neighborhood has SEVEN PLAYERS

[Ms Marangal]

I'm still not scum, though and if I had info from their hood, I would be careful on making it obvious

[Ms Marangal]

and, literally nothing else matters.

I could be lynched and I'd break rules just to keep pushing him

[Ms Marangal]

I've already made my case on him though

[Ms Marangal]

like..

he's a non-threat

he isn't threatening enough to compel me to want to defend one of my town-read

he isn't threatening enough to me, when as town he is regardless of my alignment because he has the exact same bull-headedness as I do, but it isn't happening this game.

Cabd

is more of a threat despite being busy

moving

he isn't making pushes himself, he's letting others do it for him. As town, he would take everything in his own hands

his content level his low, and his post level his high, one of the highest posters in game and at the same time, he's pushing himself as one of the most useful players in this game

pedit: there isn't more, it's just more detailed stuff on what's already stated but I'm busy getting ready for a move, I can't be arsed for detail

[Ms Marangal]

If 1 was true, he would have dedicated more time to pushing Varsoon, IMO instead of letting others take the reigns on it and even then, it should matter. If we are both scum, it shouldn't matter which one of us is lynched because it will lead to a scum lynch. He shouldn't be scared to push my lynch just because of that, and I don't really think he'd be the kind of player to think like that, really. It's probably an excuse to not pushing people as hard as I know he can and will do as town

Varsoon has alot more obvious reason to be painted as scum, and is a whole lot easier to get mislynched. He's also making the scenario where, I could still be scum even if varsoon is town, and even if he didn't, he could just draw what you did and make the second mislynch of the game that much easier. Ater that, all he has to do is find other mislynches that he could line up based on my town-flip, and based on varsoons town-flip and with everyone else already reading him as town, it's probably going to be easy to keep doing so.

He's stated himself as obv-town, and implied that he is one of the most likely to be killed so yeah

as for varsoon, yes he's been anti-town, but that doesn't equate to scum. Instead of fixing it, the only thing he continues to care about is the fact that he's made a mistake, and he kinda sorta tried to fix it but not really succeed at doing so which is town. He's wallowing in his own mistake, and making more mistakes because people are pressuring him from that one and no one is giving him any breathing room. Not until STD stated him as town, and not until I included him in my list of people who are to gain stars along with me. No, not all o the people who are reading him as scum, are scum but they will be some in there. It's pretty much guaranteed that there will be people who don't really even care about his alignment anymore, and just don't want him to be around who are town themselves. I'm goinng to have to figure out the dierenece between the two later because, even when Orci flips scum me being killed is unlikely assuming I even get what I want

[Ms Marangal]

Orci also reeks of the exact same tactics cabd/prohawk and I ended up using in AMOL

[Ms Marangal]

You've seen me push scum-tammy as scum before?

[Ms Marangal]

I am already voting Orci.

also, ffery, I don't necessarily shy away from the more difficult mis-lynches as scum, though I need to be able to see if the risk/rewards will be high enough for it to happen

[Ms Marangal]

oh

ok, you're just teasing me, boo

[Ms Marangal]

but really, he shouldn't be getting lynched

[Ms Marangal]

He jumped off it at game start

[Ms Marangal]

really

[Ms Marangal]

I want mine, to but I refuse to hammer

[Ms Marangal]

Am ready to give up on this game, not going to lie

[Ms Marangal]

VOTE: Orci

this is all that needs to be done

[Ms Marangal]

I think most of the wagon on Varsoon is town, but I know firsthand the power of OMGUS, so I could even see him thinking his wagon was mostly scum.

This is interesting to me. I think there's almost certainly opportunistic scum on his wagon.

Varsoon

(11):

Cephrir

,

Brian Skies

, SMP, Konowa, Flubbernugget, Bookitty,

orcinus_theoriginal

,

Cabd

, fferyllt,

Albert B. Rampage

,

Save the Dragons

If I had to guess, one or more of {SMP, Konowa, Flubbernugget, Bookitty, fferyllt}

am interested in why green is green

fwi, no one should really put a whole lot of promise in much outside of orci lynch when I come back. hes scum, and him pushing me today is proof if that, pretty much. he started with continuing a push on me despite knowing I am v/la and why. Orci also pretty much has ~night reason~ to believe I am town based on things, and his meta is pretty off based since ue actually knows me to be agressive as either alignment.

[Ms Marangal]

I'm unwilling to fully commit to a Mara push at least until Cabd comes back. I'll stay my vote there, though.

Who's your second strongest scumread?

Like, this literally doesn't make sense with what he's posted since he knows that I was flying out

the morning day started

Like, I had literally posted in the airport

[Ms Marangal]

Aka, don't wait, but if orci really is town, the shit he's pulling is completely unacceptable and disrespectful and I will probably blacklist him

[Ms Marangal]

Hi ns, bai ns

[Ms Marangal]

No, something happened to you last night and why should have clickdd if you were town

[Ms Marangal]

But it obviously didnt, so.

[Ms Marangal]

And yeah, yoy saud that after making a case knowung I was going to be on the road, and thus unable to even engage with you or defend myself

[Ms Marangal]

Am not full-claiming. If I was the only one to visit him, then he should already know what I am able to do. Role isn't confirmable, but if I am the only one who visited him, he should know that there is next to no reason for scum-me to do what I did to him last night.

[Ms Marangal]

Am completely serious about the disrespectful shit that he's pulled while I was on the road, though it would be more understandable if he really was scum

[Ms Marangal]

pushing for my lynch and getting a wagon buit up when you know I can't fuckign respond to shit?

[Ms Marangal]

that case is shit, and way overdated and hass way to many falws. relaly

and you did. day start, while I was oin the road

[Ms Marangal]

and you fucking kewn I was on the road, on my wai to chicago

[Ms Marangal]

and you tried to get me lycned

and receede from the wagon ri9ght awoung the time I was goimg to be around chiago

[Ms Marangal]

yes you fucking did

[Ms Marangal]

you should have two stars ye?

[Ms Marangal]

and there in't a reason for scsummara to deduct a star from you when she is planning to push you to lycn. like really

[Ms Marangal]

like, I could just push your lynch and deduct a star from some other sccary as fucking player like cand or someting

[Ms Marangal]

what

[Ms Marangal]

yeah, w/e orci's scum

VOTE: mara

[Ms Marangal]

Sober mara reaffirms that she isnt staying in this game, and that she wants the replacement