Pathfinder Mafia - GAME OVER

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #12 (isolation #0) » Sat Feb 14, 2015 9:59 am

I got one of my first choices.

Vote Here There Be Dragons

Because I hate hydras and wagons are cool.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #20 (isolation #1) » Sat Feb 14, 2015 10:17 am

I hate love when hydras are involved:).

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #85 (isolation #2) » Sat Feb 14, 2015 12:09 pm

In post 71, Varsoon wrote:Shit, Fulm.
You're diggin'.
I like hobbes.

I ran Calvin and Hobbes mafia once, the game was a disaster but it was a cool idea.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #117 (isolation #3) » Sat Feb 14, 2015 9:01 pm

I'm against massclaiming. Scum don't need any help with their night targets.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #170 (isolation #4) » Sun Feb 15, 2015 10:27 am

I would appreciate if Hydra's would sign their posts with who is doing the posting.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #173 (isolation #5) » Sun Feb 15, 2015 10:30 am

Hydra's should still sign.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #184 (isolation #6) » Sun Feb 15, 2015 5:05 pm

Unvote:
Vote: Titus

Comes across as very confrontational for town.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #188 (isolation #7) » Sun Feb 15, 2015 5:17 pm

Yes, let's OMGUS to try and derail our wagon.

Titus is scum, more votes on her please.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #190 (isolation #8) » Sun Feb 15, 2015 5:22 pm

I didn't slip, I said you are being too confrontational to be town. Anyone with basic english comprehension can see that.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #192 (isolation #9) » Sun Feb 15, 2015 5:25 pm

*rolls eyes*.

So either you are being anti-town as town or you are just scum. Either way you should be lynched.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #195 (isolation #10) » Sun Feb 15, 2015 5:27 pm

I think I was pretty clear. What don't you understand, Dragons? Are you scum buddies?

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #197 (isolation #11) » Sun Feb 15, 2015 5:30 pm

In post 196, Here There Be Dragons wrote:How is she "being anti-town"? I agree that she makes no sense right now at all but I don't think you do either.

She's being anti-town by not collaborating, being over confrontational, misrepping, and OMGUSing.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #200 (isolation #12) » Sun Feb 15, 2015 5:53 pm

In post 198, Here There Be Dragons wrote:Not collaborating with you, specifically, isn't antitown. You could argue it's scumhunting.

Being confrontational is and will always be town.

Please show me the misreps.

Granted, I am voting Titus and plan to continue, but please substantiate.

I wasn't talking about me specifically. I was talking in general.

Being confrontational at the expense of collaborating is not pro-town. You should collaborate with people you think are town.

The misrep is where she tries to say I slipped when I didn't.

A little research might be helpful for you in the future.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #202 (isolation #13) » Sun Feb 15, 2015 5:57 pm

She didn't think I was scum until I voted her.

This is not a town mindset.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #204 (isolation #14) » Sun Feb 15, 2015 6:01 pm

Nearly every player that's posted has been more collaborative than Titus.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #213 (isolation #15) » Sun Feb 15, 2015 6:45 pm

I've been working on making sure that people under stand my thinking rather than just assuming that people should understand everything I say without question.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #218 (isolation #16) » Sun Feb 15, 2015 8:18 pm

I give up. I am not changing my vote today, period.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #226 (isolation #17) » Sun Feb 15, 2015 9:13 pm

That's because Titus is talking out of her ass to try and avoid getting lynched.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #229 (isolation #18) » Sun Feb 15, 2015 9:25 pm

Nope, none as far as I know.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #231 (isolation #19) » Sun Feb 15, 2015 9:26 pm

Wait, I was wrong, she was a Hydra in an ongoing game I am in, but I can't talk about that.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #249 (isolation #20) » Mon Feb 16, 2015 1:49 pm

Fluminator wrote:@MonkeyMan: You seem quite confident that Titus is scum. Are you thinking there was scum-omgus motive behind her voting you? Why you and not someone else voting her? What are some posts where she is being over confrontational?

I'm not "quite confident". She is either scum or bad town. Either way she is not going to help town win the game. I think OMGUS is usually either a scum move or just newbie/bad town who don't know how to play properly. I'll have to ISO her regarding the over confrontational question.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #256 (isolation #21) » Mon Feb 16, 2015 4:19 pm

Monkeyman576 wrote:
I'm not "quite confident". She is either scum or bad town. Either way she is not going to help town win the game. I think OMGUS is usually either a scum move or just newbie/bad town who don't know how to play properly. I'll have to ISO her regarding the over confrontational question.

Fluminator wrote:
When you use the word OMGUS, what's your definition of it exactly?

Voting someone after they have voted you, with the main intention of the vote being to derail your wagon, without due reasoning for voting said person.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #261 (isolation #22) » Mon Feb 16, 2015 4:47 pm

They responded decently to the intitial wagon, so town for now.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #266 (isolation #23) » Mon Feb 16, 2015 5:04 pm

In post 263, Muffin wrote:
In post 261, MonkeyMan576 wrote:They responded decently to the intitial wagon, so town for now.

What would a scum response to that initial wagon have looked like to you?

More panicky, OMGUSing, bad reasoning, etc.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #267 (isolation #24) » Mon Feb 16, 2015 5:05 pm

In post 264, Murder of Crows wrote:But, a wagon growing this fast 3 days into a game makes me think it might be on a town player.

Or she could just be acting really scummy.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #271 (isolation #25) » Mon Feb 16, 2015 6:06 pm

In post 270, Muffin wrote:
In post 269, Here There Be Dragons wrote:All of it? Including Monkeyman being scum?

I agree that it's a legit reason to scumread someone at this stage in the game. Does that answer your question or are you going to try to pull some more of your absolutist crap?

It's convinient and self serving. The only reason for her scum reading me is because I voted her first. If I hadn't voted her and had said it about someone else she would have nothing to say about it. And nearly every other player agrees it was not a slip and I in no way was presuming that she was town.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #326 (isolation #26) » Tue Feb 17, 2015 12:42 pm

I think the spat with Titus has run it's course. I still think she's scum, but we need to spend the day concentrating on more than one person.

So for now

Unvote

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #349 (isolation #27) » Tue Feb 17, 2015 6:20 pm

In post 343, Tammy wrote:
In post 341, Murder of Crows wrote:Tammy do you think Titus is scum?

I don't know yet. I was hoping that Nati was going to come in here and talk about her scum read there.

I don't like the nitpicking on MonkeyMan about the "slip", but I'm not entirely fond of MonkeyMan either and was hoping more would give me a clue there. I've been thinking about Book of Shadows/Serum and Steel vs. Mafia on the Air though and I'll need more. I think I picked up a couple things she does when scum, but it's in the way she scumhunts and reacts to suspicion. I need to think about adwd vs. Bowser though as well.

I don't think that d3x's "they" point is that strong though. I could easily see myself saying "they" in that situation, and I think that Titus would make that assumption regardless.

You're not fond of me? I guess my love is unrequited.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #357 (isolation #28) » Tue Feb 17, 2015 8:37 pm

My abilities match my class. In fact my abilities have a specific name that matches to my class specificly. So Titus saying that her's don't make me weary.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #398 (isolation #29) » Thu Feb 19, 2015 9:59 am

Okay, so the game I was playing were Titus was a hydra is over now so I can talk about it. It was Street Racers, and she was a vanilla townie and shot on night 1.

She gave a list of 10 players out of 29 she thought were scum. They were all town, to say the least. I'm not very confident in her day 1 scumhunting skills.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #400 (isolation #30) » Thu Feb 19, 2015 10:08 am

In post 399, Titus wrote:If you're going to quote Street Racers London, you should realize that my first and perpetual scumread was on the guy who scumslipped in post 29. While I may not be the best behaviorally day 1, you might want to make sure the evidence you cite to actually supports your proposition.

Basically, I'm much better at evidence based scumhunting rather than personality based early. No doubt about that. The whole reading people better is why I play mafia. Yet, I'm damn good with language tells, VCA, and other things as anyone who frequents my games can tell you.

So maybe you'd be better served listening to others on day 1, especially those you think are acting townish, rather than making silly assertions about scumslips that have no basis in reality.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #403 (isolation #31) » Thu Feb 19, 2015 12:07 pm

In post 402, Titus wrote:@Monkeyman, if we were talking about behavior, yes. We're talking about slips though.

Of course your request though is contradictory. Tammy (who I am townreading) is asking me to be more open and pursue my behavioral analysis more. You're telling me to defer to my townreads, but also pursue my own thoughts less because I have been wrong. Nah, not going to happen.

@Displaced, I don't really recall much of Feryscum. I would expect her scumgame to be decent. I've never rolled scum with them before and that's how I really get a feel for meta baselines. Generally, I don't use meta.

I'm asking you to consider it wasn't a slip of any kind, and perhaps just a issue of mistaken communication on your part. I haven't heard one other player think that I slipped. You seem to have a history of confirmation bias when it comes to scum reads.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #406 (isolation #32) » Thu Feb 19, 2015 12:22 pm

You're being rediculous. If you're not willing to listen to pratically every other player in the game that you're wrong than you are not behaving pro-town.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #408 (isolation #33) » Thu Feb 19, 2015 12:26 pm

It's not peer pressure, it's having respect for the opinions of other people on your supposed team.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #410 (isolation #34) » Thu Feb 19, 2015 12:37 pm

@Nero: Was she town or scum in this game?

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #416 (isolation #35) » Thu Feb 19, 2015 12:48 pm

So Titus has been wrong about slips before, and she doesn't think there's any chance she could be wrong again. It's nice to know she's so self-aware.

I'm going to do some meta research on Titus' scum meat.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #423 (isolation #36) » Thu Feb 19, 2015 12:58 pm

Here is an interesting exchange with scumTitus in Open581 shortly before her lynch.

In post 1796, Titus wrote:
In post 1795, Heartless wrote:
In post 1794, Titus wrote:So I repeat the same manuever...hoping for a different result?

yeah...

i mean.... scum protect their scumbuddies and lynch town. that's what they're supposed to do. just b/c it went badly that time in the execution doesn't mean that's not what scum should do.

also, the game is about 9 months old so...meh. past the expiration date of meta invoking.

Just mislynch me now then.

Seriously if you are so dense to consider me that stupid as scum, nothing I say will convince you when it's 2 v 1. Three if you include the dumb townie that inevitably pushes.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #425 (isolation #37) » Thu Feb 19, 2015 1:01 pm

In post 424, Nero Cain wrote:
In post 419, Murder of Crows wrote:
In post 417, Nero Cain wrote:Titus being wrong before has NOTHING to do with this game.

Why did you bring it up, then?

I like to tell stories + Monkey was ranting and raving that Titus was scummy or anti-town or whatever s I felt like it made sense to present evidence that this isn't a scumtell for her.

I'm considering both sides of the story at this point. I'm hardly raving or ranting. If she tends to concentrate on slips that aren't slips as town, then that is her town meta. Doesn't mean she isn't scum, which is why I am looking into it.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #429 (isolation #38) » Thu Feb 19, 2015 1:16 pm

In post 428, Nero Cain wrote:lets be honest, unless you count

In post 134, Nero Cain wrote:

In post 117, MonkeyMan576 wrote:I'm against massclaiming. Scum don't need any help with their night targets.

Can you explain how massclaiming classes would help scum with their night choices?

my iso doesn't really show anything but I was actually somewhat wary of your slot. You didn't have any content or scumhunting but that was early game so meh. You also then jumped on the the growing Titus bandwagon. I can sort of see what she's saying is a slip. Though I do NOT like your discredity statements to Titus.

Also a scum flip from you would make me think narn and dragons are scum but thats a nice neat package and I'm not sure if I'm that lucky.

I'm not seeing anything accusatory. Do you think I slipped or not?

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #432 (isolation #39) » Thu Feb 19, 2015 1:20 pm

Then why aren't you voting me?

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #437 (isolation #40) » Thu Feb 19, 2015 1:26 pm

In post 436, Muffin wrote:
In post 408, MonkeyMan576 wrote:It's not peer pressure, it's having respect for the opinions of other people on your supposed team.

LOL are you serious? Are you for real with this post?

"Townread me out of respect for the rest of the town"?

I'm saying town players listen to their teammates, they don't exist on an island.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #440 (isolation #41) » Thu Feb 19, 2015 1:28 pm

In post 439, Muffin wrote:
In post 437, MonkeyMan576 wrote:I'm saying town players listen to their teammates, they don't exist on an island.

How interesting that you're accepting the premise Titus is town. Is it because you and Titus don't share a QT?

I don't have a QT. I'm town.

Sometimes town players behave in anti-town or scummy ways. It's part of the game.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #443 (isolation #42) » Thu Feb 19, 2015 1:30 pm

In post 442, Muffin wrote:So you're saying Titus is a town player behaving in an anti-town way? I'm confused.

I'm saying it's possible. You think town players always behave townish and scum players always behave like scum?

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #445 (isolation #43) » Thu Feb 19, 2015 1:31 pm

In post 444, Titus wrote:
In post 440, MonkeyMan576 wrote:
In post 439, Muffin wrote:
In post 437, MonkeyMan576 wrote:I'm saying town players listen to their teammates, they don't exist on an island.

How interesting that you're accepting the premise Titus is town. Is it because you and Titus don't share a QT?

I don't have a QT. I'm town.

Sometimes town players behave in anti-town or scummy ways. It's part of the game.

Dude do you have anything to say about other players? Everything you post makes it very hard NOT to try and yell you are scum every single fucking post.

I've said things about other players. ISO me.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #452 (isolation #44) » Thu Feb 19, 2015 1:55 pm

In post 446, Muffin wrote:
In post 443, MonkeyMan576 wrote:
In post 442, Muffin wrote:So you're saying Titus is a town player behaving in an anti-town way? I'm confused.

I'm saying it's possible. You think town players always behave townish and scum players always behave like scum?

Not even remotely. What I'm saying is that the way you referred to Titus's teammates seems like you know Titus is town. The only way you could know that is daycop or scum.

I knew no such thing. I could have phrased it better, I admit.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #460 (isolation #45) » Thu Feb 19, 2015 4:06 pm

Murder of Crows, Nero Cain, Muffin.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #489 (isolation #46) » Fri Feb 20, 2015 8:49 am

I'm not trying to diffuse heat on Titus. It's more than I know I'm town, despite Titus' "95% scumread" on me, so that is causing me to rethink Titus. I want town to win, I don't want stupidity and ego to be the reason we lose.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #506 (isolation #47) » Fri Feb 20, 2015 3:30 pm

Not believing the miller claim. And he seems to be going with the flow rather than scumhunting.

Vote: Muffin

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #509 (isolation #48) » Fri Feb 20, 2015 4:12 pm

@Varsoon: I don't see a lack of effort on your part, if I was going to lynch a lurker, you would not be it at this point. Sorry you've not been feeling well.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #510 (isolation #49) » Fri Feb 20, 2015 4:20 pm

Speaking of lurkers, here are players with less than 10 posts:

Sorcerer Madness 4(replacing out)
ActionDan/beastcharizard 5
PeregrineV 6
Ankamius 7
Narninian 9
Natirasha 5
d3x 7(vla)

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #511 (isolation #50) » Fri Feb 20, 2015 4:44 pm

And before anyone asks if lurking is really scummy, I did an analysis of the 9 scum in Street Racers, and 9 random townies, and the analysis was fairly definative:

Hostile Intent 145
PeaceBringer 119
Pine 147
TriforceP 81
Aneninen 90
theamatuer 147
Belisarius 101
Kaboose 175
NeroCain 211

Average scum post count: 135.11

ArcAngel9 106
TheWayItEnds 380
NobodySpecial 129
Formerfish 148
Monkeyman576 237
Impossibear 637
Guyett 286
mastin2 222
displaced 76

Average town post count: 246.77

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #515 (isolation #51) » Fri Feb 20, 2015 6:01 pm

In post 512, ActionDan wrote:
In post 507, Varsoon wrote:If lack of effort put into scumhunting/playing is indicative of scumminess...

It's not to me. I lurk like a champ. I'm also good at figuring out people with minimal content

I'm sure you say that when you're scum.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #518 (isolation #52) » Fri Feb 20, 2015 6:58 pm

In post 516, ActionDan wrote:Sure? I tell people I lurk as town when I'm scum. It happens to be true and sometimes I don't get lynched for it. Thus it's a null tell for me and why I treat it as a null tell for others

Sounds to me like you are trying to use your meta as an excuse not to be active. Also, the fact that you are trying to state your own meta rather than let people come to your own conclusions is scummy.

FOS: Action Dan

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #521 (isolation #53) » Fri Feb 20, 2015 7:26 pm

It's not about your participation, it's about you preemptively making an excuse.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #525 (isolation #54) » Fri Feb 20, 2015 9:31 pm

It's not confbiasing, it's scumhunting. You should try it.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #546 (isolation #55) » Sat Feb 21, 2015 7:53 am

Yeah, let's attack the people attacking lurkers rather than attacking the lurkers. Good idea.

Tolerating lurkers is one of the worst parts of Mafiascum and part of the reasons scum are so successfull on this site.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #548 (isolation #56) » Sat Feb 21, 2015 8:20 am

Nah. The best way to encourage good behavior is to set a good example.

Vote: ActionDan

Muffin is probably scum, but he canw wait.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #550 (isolation #57) » Sat Feb 21, 2015 8:33 am

It's not omgus if you have reason for your vote. Mafia 101.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #551 (isolation #58) » Sat Feb 21, 2015 8:34 am

In post 549, Titus wrote:Can we lynch MM now please....he's OMGUSing everyone who suspects him.

And you accusing so.eone of OMGUS is a joke.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #553 (isolation #59) » Sat Feb 21, 2015 8:39 am

He's encouraging lurking.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #555 (isolation #60) » Sat Feb 21, 2015 8:47 am

By saying he lurks all the time and it's a null tell. It's encouraging others.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #558 (isolation #61) » Sat Feb 21, 2015 8:49 am

I'll take over posting any day.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #562 (isolation #62) » Sat Feb 21, 2015 9:30 am

You're going to policy lynch someone for being against lurking?

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #569 (isolation #63) » Sat Feb 21, 2015 9:45 am

In post 567, Here There Be Dragons wrote:
In post 562, MonkeyMan576 wrote:You're going to policy lynch someone for being against lurking?

You're going to policy lynch someone for not being against lurking, apparently...

Yes, because lurking is what scum do to avoid having to take policy stances, rather than being active. I'm willing to bet that an anti-lurking stance is going to make scum a lot more nervous than town.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #571 (isolation #64) » Sat Feb 21, 2015 9:48 am

That's not true at all. I've explained why I think ActionDan is scum.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #577 (isolation #65) » Sat Feb 21, 2015 10:50 am

@Fluminator - are you a double voter?

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #583 (isolation #66) » Sat Feb 21, 2015 12:04 pm

In post 582, Tammy wrote:The monkey man anti lurking thing is a bit humorous, but seems like it comes from a well-intentioned place? Monkey, in looking at average postings from street racers and trying to prove lurking comes more from town or scum, you can't really just go by those numbers unless all of those scum and all of those town survived until the end of the game because deaths affect post count. It also doesn't take into account playstyles.

Also, I think your vote on Dan is misplaced. I have a decent early town read on him. He does tend to lurk a lot regardless of alignment, and sometimes provides minimal content; him pointing out his playstyle isn't scummy. Him also recognizing that it's a null tell isn't scummy. Some people are capable of reading lurkers, goes along with broseidons theory and analysis of town lurk vs scum lurk.

I'm not a big fan of titus' more recent posts, can't quite put my finger on why.

I've never seen a scum varsoon before, but I thought his reputation was that he was good as scum?

Waiting to see what zzzx does.

No, I didn't take into account playstyle or time of death. I figured out everything averages out, and scum had an advantage on that because they won the game.

I challenge anyone to find a large game where scum post significantly more than town on an average basis. In large game's it's even easier for scum to lurk. It may be more of a tell for some players than others, but I still don't like ActionDan trying to preemptively say it's okay as a rule.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #585 (isolation #67) » Sat Feb 21, 2015 12:24 pm

Okay, both your point and Fluminator's arguments are well taken, Tammy. For now I'll

Unvote:

and

Vote: Ankamius

I'm still weary of Dan though.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #589 (isolation #68) » Sat Feb 21, 2015 1:23 pm

@Varsoon: What I do is just account for the fact I'm in a larger game. Days may be longer, wagons may take longer to form, etc. For me, in day 1 and 2 it's important to be partipatory, collaborative, and to be willing to listen to others. After day 2 we have more information so we can be more specific about why we think people are scum.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #599 (isolation #69) » Sat Feb 21, 2015 2:30 pm

In post 597, Fluminator wrote:Hey, I can hammer at L-2. This would stop scum from potentially self-hammering and taking away opportunities for experience.

This would be a good use of that ability, imho.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #610 (isolation #70) » Sat Feb 21, 2015 3:25 pm

I don't think I'm lynchbait. Sure, some scummy players might not like the idea of putting lurkers on the spot, but I'm far from being seen as scummy by the majority of players.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #631 (isolation #71) » Sat Feb 21, 2015 5:22 pm

I'm willing to bet one of Ankamius, ActionDan, Titus, and Muffin is scum, if not more.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #633 (isolation #72) » Sat Feb 21, 2015 5:35 pm

Sure it does, are you implying people are only allowed to have one scumread?

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #670 (isolation #73) » Sun Feb 22, 2015 9:47 am

*tired of people I am scum reading attacking my play*.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #672 (isolation #74) » Sun Feb 22, 2015 9:49 am

lol true, that's my point.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #677 (isolation #75) » Sun Feb 22, 2015 10:25 am

In post 674, ActionDan wrote:
In post 670, MonkeyMan576 wrote:*tired of people I am scum reading attacking my play*.

The irony is you're voting for possibly the one person who has expressly decided to not attack your play

Um, very few people have attacked my play, actually, so that's quite the exaggeration.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #715 (isolation #76) » Mon Feb 23, 2015 8:21 am

In post 711, PeregrineV wrote:Bookmark 25-

Short version- Whoever is getting called scum for not agreeing with people... I disagree with that sentiment.

But seriously, even if you disagree with every other payer, the worst that can make you is wrong.

Unless your faking it, then your scum.

Disagreeing with people is not scummy, but town do tend to collaborate more with other perceived townies, because they have more teammates.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #717 (isolation #77) » Mon Feb 23, 2015 8:29 am

In post 716, Titus wrote:
In post 715, MonkeyMan576 wrote:
In post 711, PeregrineV wrote:Bookmark 25-

Short version- Whoever is getting called scum for not agreeing with people... I disagree with that sentiment.

But seriously, even if you disagree with every other payer, the worst that can make you is wrong.

Unless your faking it, then your scum.

Disagreeing with people is not scummy, but town do tend to collaborate more with other perceived townies, because they have more teammates.

Both wrong.

So you think if someone disagrees with someone on logic, pointing out where they are wrong is scummy?
Scum tend to be hyper disagreeable to prevent consensus or any obvious townies from emerging or hyper agreeable as to not stand out.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #718 (isolation #78) » Mon Feb 23, 2015 8:30 am

So you think if someone disagrees with someone on logic, pointing out where they are wrong is scummy?

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #722 (isolation #79) » Mon Feb 23, 2015 8:48 am

In post 719, Titus wrote:
In post 718, MonkeyMan576 wrote:So you think if someone disagrees with someone on logic, pointing out where they are wrong is scummy?

How often is it that someone genuinely thinks EVERYONE is wrong? Once or even a majority of the posters... but everyone...

I didn't say everyone, but disagreeing by itself isn't scummy.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #727 (isolation #80) » Mon Feb 23, 2015 9:44 am

Happy scumday PV!

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #728 (isolation #81) » Mon Feb 23, 2015 9:45 am

In post 724, Ankamius wrote:OK I read MM again and I still have a townread on that slot. His underlying tone looks like he's trying to figure the game out, even if it's probably the wrong direction.

Nice that you've figured the game out day 1.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #741 (isolation #82) » Mon Feb 23, 2015 10:45 am

Titus makes a good point.

I think I've narrowed down my two scummiest players to Ankamius and Titus.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #742 (isolation #83) » Mon Feb 23, 2015 10:45 am

Ankamius and Muffin I mean.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #751 (isolation #84) » Mon Feb 23, 2015 12:04 pm

In post 749, Here There Be Dragons wrote:
In post 732, Titus wrote:If the abilities are alignment independent, how is there a miller? Why would there be a scum miller?

Why not?

Why does everyone assume that mods are terrible?

A scum miller would be redundant, not to mention a little bastard. mafia get guilty results normally anyway.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #752 (isolation #85) » Mon Feb 23, 2015 12:05 pm

The mafia equivalent to miller is godfather, which gets innocent results.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #753 (isolation #86) » Mon Feb 23, 2015 12:13 pm

Wiki wrote: Miller (sometimes called an Outsider) is a role or role modifier such that the player passively returns an unfavorable result (i.e. Guilty) if investigated by a Cop.

This version of Miller, and only this version of Miller, is considered Normal on mafiascum.net.

For obvious reasons, standard Millers are Town.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #755 (isolation #87) » Mon Feb 23, 2015 12:17 pm

That's why I find it unlikely a miller power would be used in this game.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #765 (isolation #88) » Mon Feb 23, 2015 1:38 pm

It's highly possible in my opinion.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #768 (isolation #89) » Mon Feb 23, 2015 1:41 pm

True, the question is weather to lynch someone on game mechanics or playstyle.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #776 (isolation #90) » Mon Feb 23, 2015 2:45 pm

I may have a tendancy to go on tangents, but they are largely relevant, I'm able to gauge other people from them, and I am able to refocus myself.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #781 (isolation #91) » Mon Feb 23, 2015 5:18 pm

In post 780, Titus wrote:I feel like I am on Mars.

@MM:

True or False: MM has no filter.
mM is widely considered awkward.
mM regularly uses awkward phraseology.

True, true, and true. What's your point?

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #794 (isolation #92) » Tue Feb 24, 2015 2:56 pm

Love that the lurkers think my anti-lurking post is scummy.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #796 (isolation #93) » Tue Feb 24, 2015 3:25 pm

But you're not saying I'm scum for it.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #798 (isolation #94) » Tue Feb 24, 2015 3:46 pm

I don't think wanting to stay on top of lurkers is stupid, but to each their own.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #824 (isolation #95) » Wed Feb 25, 2015 6:28 pm

In post 807, Nero Cain wrote:stop being so dense here. I mean obviously if Muffin is telling the truth he's town. What I'm talking about is like here...you are a double voter. I don't really feel like he'd change that if you rolled scum or town.

Some roles lend themselves to be town or scum. You couldn't have a town godfather or a scum innocent child, for example.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #826 (isolation #96) » Wed Feb 25, 2015 6:56 pm

In post 825, Nero Cain wrote:I like how you didn't respond to my lat post against you and instead decided to take the easy route and sheep Ceph's bullshit argument.

Also town godfather and a scum ic are both bastard mod. I might go and look but I remember this game NOT being advertised as bastard.

Repeat what question I didn't answer and I'd be glad to. I probably didn't see it.

I was making a point. There's a high probability that the mod chose roles that are not alignment specific, so that class/player allocation could be truly randomized. Lynching muffin would not only get us possible scum, but would test the role allocation theory.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #829 (isolation #97) » Wed Feb 25, 2015 7:08 pm

Because Ank is also scummy, and I'd rather see scum lynched than start a new wagon just because.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #830 (isolation #98) » Wed Feb 25, 2015 7:10 pm

You make a good point, like Tammy did, that high post counts doesn't mean you are being pro town. But do you really think that if you did a posting analysis of 100 games, taking into account posting style and time of death, that scum still don't post on average less than town?

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #832 (isolation #99) » Wed Feb 25, 2015 7:16 pm

ActionDan was disagreeing with me, unless I was misunderstanding him.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #834 (isolation #100) » Wed Feb 25, 2015 7:45 pm

Do you think claiming miller makes you conftown? Or even probtown?

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #837 (isolation #101) » Wed Feb 25, 2015 8:20 pm

Because he's scum and mad at being outed.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #848 (isolation #102) » Thu Feb 26, 2015 2:59 pm

In post 843, GuyInFreezer wrote:I already thinks muffin is town and believes his miller claim.
But I do feel like seeing if his class match up the miller claim.

Can you show me an instance in another game where someone didn't "believe their miller claim?"

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #850 (isolation #103) » Thu Feb 26, 2015 4:16 pm

In post 827, Here There Be Dragons wrote:
In post 826, MonkeyMan576 wrote:Lynching muffin would not only get us possible scum, but would test the role allocation theory.

not really, because muffin claimed to be like a miller, not a miller

~STD

There are probably lots of roles that are not explicitly called what they are. It would still give us insight.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #852 (isolation #104) » Thu Feb 26, 2015 5:29 pm

In post 851, Muffin wrote:Oh now I'm not scum but it's a utility lynch amirite MM?

No you're wrong. I never said you're not scum.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #855 (isolation #105) » Thu Feb 26, 2015 6:47 pm

In post 853, GuyInFreezer wrote:
In post 848, MonkeyMan576 wrote:
In post 843, GuyInFreezer wrote:I already thinks muffin is town and believes his miller claim.
But I do feel like seeing if his class match up the miller claim.

Can you show me an instance in another game where someone didn't "believe their miller claim?"

What's that quotation mark supposed to be

Punctiation?

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #857 (isolation #106) » Thu Feb 26, 2015 6:58 pm

I was always told in English class punctuation should be inside quotation marks.

My point is any decent player that claims miller should sound like they believe their miller claim weather they are scum or town.

MonkeyMan576 · Fri Feb 27, 2015 11:49 am

In post 868, displaced wrote:
In post 866, Muffin wrote:
In post 865, displaced wrote:Give some good reasons why class claiming is bad, given you've already role claimed
You should try this yourself. You might find it enlightening.

I have thought about it, and I dont really see a downside (or upside) to class claiming. I think we could do a mass class claim right now and it wouldnt matter a jot.

I do think your refusal is a bit weird. Maybe your class doesnt make sense as a miller, and you think class claiming will lead to your lynching?

If there's no upside then why do it?

MonkeyMan576 · Fri Feb 27, 2015 12:36 pm

Nero's behavior seems a bit different to me than when he was SK in Street Racer. There he was a lot more focused on telling everyone why he was "town" then scumhunting. So he may be town here.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #879 (isolation #109) » Fri Feb 27, 2015 2:26 pm

lol, just calling it how I see it.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #882 (isolation #110) » Fri Feb 27, 2015 3:18 pm

In post 881, Varsoon wrote:Miller claim pings to me because it's simply negative utility with no positive aspect.
And no mention of leveling up into something worthwhile?

I think he said that was his level 1 "Power", not that he couldn't level up.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #890 (isolation #111) » Fri Feb 27, 2015 6:26 pm

d3x wrote:
MM's p326 is so much ugh, especially when combo'ed with p349. I'm really not liking the back off from Titus under the banner of 'look at others' and then... not doing that. At this specific juncture, I wouldn't rule out a hard Bus when/if Titus flips Scum.

This is pretty silly. Obviously he does not have a sense of humor regarding the @Tammy on 349. Regarding Titus, what she did early on in the day was well documented, concentrating on other suspects is more productive than just sitting on the same person all day.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #892 (isolation #112) » Fri Feb 27, 2015 7:41 pm

I did, I have four scumreads now, if you haven't been reading up.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #923 (isolation #113) » Sun Mar 01, 2015 1:26 pm

Why were you ok with ActionDan lurking, but not ZZZX, nero?

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #925 (isolation #114) » Sun Mar 01, 2015 3:05 pm

@ActionDan: I didn't say you were lurking, I said he seemed okay with the idea of you lurking previously.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #929 (isolation #115) » Sun Mar 01, 2015 4:13 pm

Noted that you don't want to answer the question.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #932 (isolation #116) » Sun Mar 01, 2015 4:30 pm

I'm not, I'm concerned with both. Nice that you're trying to misrep me though.

MonkeyMan576 · Post Post #934 (isolation #117) » Sun Mar 01, 2015 4:52 pm

So if I think Jeb Bush would make a poor president, but I don't mention it in the thread, it means I don't think it?

MonkeyMan576 · Mon Mar 02, 2015 10:42 am

I don't really like that Ankamius is asking people to explain the wagon rather than saying why he's town.

MonkeyMan576 · Mon Mar 02, 2015 10:51 am

In post 978, Nero Cain wrote:
In post 975, MonkeyMan576 wrote:I don't really like that Ankamius is asking people to explain the wagon rather than saying why he's town.

Why do you feel that people shouldn't explain their votes?

That's not it. I'm saying maybe Ankamius should do a little ISOing and find out why he's being voted on. I think townies should be more self reflective rather than immediatley try to shift focus to their accusers.

MonkeyMan576 · Mon Mar 02, 2015 10:57 am

ok, so do you think the other votes are valid?

MonkeyMan576 · Mon Mar 02, 2015 11:00 am

You don't think it's suspicious that you've said you are townreading me yet you think I should be policy lynched?

MonkeyMan576 · Mon Mar 02, 2015 11:03 am

In post 986, Ankamius wrote:I would feel a lot better if d3x would start obvtowning like he did last game too.

In post 985, MonkeyMan576 wrote:You don't think it's suspicious that you've said you are townreading me yet you think I should be policy lynched?

nope

Well, there you go. Policy lynching is lazy and anti town. Much better to lynch scum I would think then someone you think is a "distraction"(tranlation: easy mislynch).

MonkeyMan576 · Mon Mar 02, 2015 11:13 am

Well, I disagree with you on a couple points. First, I trust you even less if you are scum. Second, if we do a good job lynching scum we won't get to lylo. Third, players don't get better in lylo by not being given a chance. Fourth, policy lynching players you don't like is just stupid and lazy.

MonkeyMan576 · Mon Mar 02, 2015 1:17 pm

In post 998, Muffin wrote:
In post 987, MonkeyMan576 wrote:
In post 986, Ankamius wrote:I would feel a lot better if d3x would start obvtowning like he did last game too.

In post 985, MonkeyMan576 wrote:You don't think it's suspicious that you've said you are townreading me yet you think I should be policy lynched?

nope

Well, there you go. Policy lynching is lazy and anti town. Much better to lynch scum I would think then someone you think is a "distraction"(tranlation: easy mislynch).

No, actually, policy lynches themselves are null. The point of a policy lynch is to remove a player from the game who, even if town, would be a huge liability and probably negatively impact town's chances of winning.

It's a matter of "player X might be town but they need to get lynched so they aren't around to screw things up in LYLO or something"

MM, stop this idiotic line of inquiry, you aren't going to catch scum this way.

I know what a policy lynch is, but I disagree that they are null. Scum are worse to have around than any town.

MonkeyMan576 · Mon Mar 02, 2015 1:52 pm

Fluminator wrote:@MonkeyMan, is this an accurate tell in your experience? Do you have any examples?

Nope, just gut.

MonkeyMan576 · Mon Mar 02, 2015 7:28 pm

d3x wrote:

@MM980- But why does that make him Scum?

Because town should be self reflective and seek input from other players. Scum will try to deflect blame without listening to what others have to say.

MonkeyMan576 · Mon Mar 02, 2015 8:25 pm

d3x wrote:
In post 1012, d3x wrote:@MM- Aside from the theory behind what you think is right, do you find that this actually holds true in practice? Do you have much experience with Ank?

I already answered this. Every read doesn't have to be experience related.

MonkeyMan576 · Mon Mar 02, 2015 8:43 pm

In post 1016, d3x wrote:@MM- So you're trying to fit a metaTell onto a player doesn't fit that meta?

It's not a metaTell, it's a general tell. It's my opinion about how town players should act.

MonkeyMan576 · Wed Mar 04, 2015 11:24 am

In post 1072, Ankamius wrote:displaced: Very light scumread, pretty much just for gut based on his really early vote I voted him for early in the day. Everything else is covered in the last response I made about him.
Muffin: Trying to shut down bad thought lines and overall furthering the game.

Don't you think you should have more townreads than scumreads given the normal ratio?

MonkeyMan576 · Wed Mar 04, 2015 11:33 am

In post 1074, Ankamius wrote:I still have more townreads than scumreads if you ignore my own slot, so I have no idea what you're talking about.

Not by much.

MonkeyMan576 · Wed Mar 04, 2015 11:38 am

I think townies try to townread as much as scumread. Ankamius' 6:4 town to scum ratio compared to the expected 12:4 makes it seem like she is trying to divert attention from her.

MonkeyMan576 · Wed Mar 04, 2015 11:38 am

He rather.

MonkeyMan576 · Wed Mar 04, 2015 11:43 am

OMGUSing is just as scummy as not townreading, if not more so.

MonkeyMan576 · Wed Mar 04, 2015 12:02 pm

No one has made a convincing argument that Ank is town.

MonkeyMan576 · Wed Mar 04, 2015 12:08 pm

1. Saying someone is town but wanting them lynched.
2. Not townreading.
3. OMGUSing.

One on their own might not be terrible but all three indicates a pattern.

MonkeyMan576 · Wed Mar 04, 2015 12:14 pm

You could say that about any scum argument. You would never lynch anyone at that rate.

MonkeyMan576 · Wed Mar 04, 2015 12:29 pm

Wow, I tried meta-ing Ankamius and he is hardly ever scum. Due much!?!?:P

MonkeyMan576 · Wed Mar 04, 2015 12:36 pm

Some players aren't able to handle large games that well. I came from a site where large games were the norm, so they don't really intimidate me.

MonkeyMan576 · Wed Mar 04, 2015 12:54 pm

In post 1092, Ankamius wrote:#3 is blatantly untrue, #2 makes no sense, and I don't see how #1 is a slam dunk or even has more than a couple baby teeth at max.

#3 - Why else would you lack town reads if you weren't trying to OMGUS town?

#2 - Scum will not want to townread as much as town because more town means it's more likely that they are scum and more scum means they can deflect blame.

#1 - Town should want to lynch scum, plain and simple.

MonkeyMan576 · Wed Mar 04, 2015 2:38 pm

My arguments are fine. I don't hear any superior arguments.

MonkeyMan576 · Thu Mar 05, 2015 11:38 am

That's a little suspicous that Dragons is willing to lynch someone but doesn't want to read their posts.

MonkeyMan576 · Thu Mar 05, 2015 3:31 pm

Just an FYI, we only have two days left in day 1, we need to start forming a consensus on who to lynch.

MonkeyMan576 · Thu Mar 05, 2015 4:23 pm

It would help if everyone actually voted.

MonkeyMan576 · Fri Mar 06, 2015 9:13 am

Unvote:
Vote: Titus

Not my first choice, but acceptable.

MonkeyMan576 · Fri Mar 06, 2015 10:21 am

Because I don't want a no lynch and Ank wagon has no momentum.

MonkeyMan576 · Fri Mar 06, 2015 11:18 am

So rather than saying why she's town, Titus is going with the "Player X is more scummy" argument. That doesn't do anything to convince me we should lynch Titus.

MonkeyMan576 · Fri Mar 06, 2015 11:18 am

shouldn't lynch Titus rather.

MonkeyMan576 · Fri Mar 06, 2015 12:09 pm

@Nero: Don't you think that Fluminator should hammer vote to avoid a scum quick hammer?

MonkeyMan576 · Fri Mar 06, 2015 12:28 pm

In post 1276, Titus wrote:@MM, what do you think of Varsoon?

I think he's more town than you.

MonkeyMan576 · Fri Mar 06, 2015 12:32 pm

In post 1278, Titus wrote:
In post 1277, MonkeyMan576 wrote:
In post 1276, Titus wrote:@MM, what do you think of Varsoon?

I think he's more town than you.

Why? Do you scumread us both? Townread us both? You were townreading me awhile ago I thought

I don't like your reaction to your recent wagon.

MonkeyMan576 · Fri Mar 06, 2015 12:33 pm

But for the record I am null reading Varsoon and scum reading you. I was scum reading you, then breifly null readed you but now I'm back to scum reading you.

MonkeyMan576 · Fri Mar 06, 2015 12:37 pm

In post 1281, Titus wrote:
In post 1279, MonkeyMan576 wrote:
In post 1278, Titus wrote:
In post 1277, MonkeyMan576 wrote:
In post 1276, Titus wrote:@MM, what do you think of Varsoon?

I think he's more town than you.

Why? Do you scumread us both? Townread us both? You were townreading me awhile ago I thought

I don't like your reaction to your recent wagon.

What did you not like about it?

You seem more nervous and and reactive than town would be imho.

MonkeyMan576 · Fri Mar 06, 2015 12:40 pm

In post 1283, Titus wrote:
In post 440, MonkeyMan576 wrote:
In post 439, Muffin wrote:
In post 437, MonkeyMan576 wrote:I'm saying town players listen to their teammates, they don't exist on an island.

How interesting that you're accepting the premise Titus is town. Is it because you and Titus don't share a QT?

I don't have a QT. I'm town.

Sometimes town players behave in anti-town or scummy ways. It's part of the game.

During this exchange with muffin you looked to have been townreading me?

Also, why are you nullreading Varsoon?

Because I can't tell if he's scum-lurking or just confused by being in a large game.

MonkeyMan576 · Fri Mar 06, 2015 12:42 pm

In post 1284, Titus wrote:
In post 1282, MonkeyMan576 wrote:
In post 1281, Titus wrote:
In post 1279, MonkeyMan576 wrote:
In post 1278, Titus wrote:
In post 1277, MonkeyMan576 wrote:
In post 1276, Titus wrote:@MM, what do you think of Varsoon?

I think he's more town than you.

Why? Do you scumread us both? Townread us both? You were townreading me awhile ago I thought

I don't like your reaction to your recent wagon.

What did you not like about it?

You seem more nervous and and reactive than town would be imho.

Getting reactions is how I read people. I am not nervous but I am widely misunderstood so I guess its possible you are seeing nerves.

You could say you're misunderstood any time you are wagoned. What do you think is your scum meta?

MonkeyMan576 · Fri Mar 06, 2015 6:28 pm

Just the fact that Titus is voting Ankimus, but Ankimus is not voting Titus, tells me that Ankimus is more interested in scumhunting than OMGUS, and Titus is probably the better lynch today. Plus, Titus just sounds too desperate for town.

MonkeyMan576 · Fri Mar 06, 2015 6:36 pm

800 posts later...lol.

MonkeyMan576 · Fri Mar 06, 2015 6:39 pm

I was being facetious.

MonkeyMan576 · Fri Mar 06, 2015 6:45 pm

Anyhow, I read you as scum in Mini 1542, you used the phrase "mislynch" 4 times.

MonkeyMan576 · Fri Mar 06, 2015 7:12 pm

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=54&t=37078

Because constantly complaining about being mislyched is AtE. Especially if you do it as scum. Focusing on yourself seems AtE and OMGUSy. Try finding scum independent of who is voting you.

MonkeyMan576 · Fri Mar 06, 2015 8:08 pm

So are you suggesting we lynch a lurker or go ahead with Titus?

MonkeyMan576 · Sat Mar 07, 2015 8:49 am

You have to give Titus credit for being passionate and giving the better argument. It's probably scum vs scum, but I'm willing to switch my vote if there's time to go back to Ank.

MonkeyMan576 · Wed Mar 11, 2015 3:20 pm

vote: Tammy

She was pushing for the Titus lynch pretty hard.

MonkeyMan576 · Wed Mar 11, 2015 3:33 pm

But I wasn't as gung ho as you. The main problem I had was that you weren't willing to consider Titus as town.

MonkeyMan576 · Wed Mar 11, 2015 4:20 pm

In post 249, MonkeyMan576 wrote:
Fluminator wrote:@MonkeyMan: You seem quite confident that Titus is scum. Are you thinking there was scum-omgus motive behind her voting you? Why you and not someone else voting her? What are some posts where she is being over confrontational?

I'm not "quite confident". She is either scum or bad town. Either way she is not going to help town win the game. I think OMGUS is usually either a scum move or just newbie/bad town who don't know how to play properly. I'll have to ISO her regarding the over confrontational question.

Here it is pretty obvious I wasn't sold on Titus as scum. And your insistence that I shouldn't hold you accountable because I was on the wagon is rediculous. I know I am town, I don't know you are.

MonkeyMan576 · Wed Mar 11, 2015 4:54 pm

@tammy: my problem is you're seeing the game through a black and white lens and your recent comments haven't diminished my concerns.

MonkeyMan576 · Wed Mar 11, 2015 5:04 pm

In post 1478, Tammy wrote:
In post 1477, MonkeyMan576 wrote:@tammy: my problem is you're seeing the game through a black and white lens and your recent comments haven't diminished my concerns.

I couldn't care less about your concerns. I'm town and I'm not getting lynched.

I care about figuring out your alignment.

Sounds like scum to me.

MonkeyMan576 · Wed Mar 11, 2015 5:18 pm

In post 1483, Tammy wrote:
In post 1477, MonkeyMan576 wrote:@tammy: my problem is you're seeing the game through a black and white lens and your recent comments haven't diminished my concerns.

Cool. How am I looking at the game as black and white?[/b]

Because you're not willing to look at town and scum motivations in players, you seem more interested in convincing people your side and painting them to your convenience.

Tammy wrote:
How are you not?

Because I'm looking at both sides of every equation to solve the puzzle[/quote]

Tammy wrote:
If it's scummy of me to look at the game as black and white, who else isn't doing that?

Fluminator, Here There Be Dragons, Varsoon, Ankamius

Tammy wrote:
More importantly, what is your read on d3x?

Seems to be overstating his reads. Not sure if he's scum yet though.

MonkeyMan576 · Wed Mar 11, 2015 5:23 pm

In post 1488, Here There Be Dragons wrote:MM a lot of people were on titus so you're going to have to do better than that since i have no clue what makes Tammy's vote/push/opinion on Titus worse than your vote/push/opinion on Titus, or our vote/push/opinion on Titus, or the 7 other people who voted Titus

it's starting to seem like you're picking fights on purpose.

~STD

I'm not picking fights on purpose, she was more insistant on Titus being scum than some others. If you're going to lead a town wagon then you should expect some suspicion

MonkeyMan576 · Thu Mar 12, 2015 10:07 am

[quote="D3X" You've given no reason for MM to be Town while I've given numerous reasons for him to be Scum. You just seem to continue making platitudes about him being awkward.
[/Quote]

They aren't good reasons. Here is your earlier post on me:

D3X wrote:Monkey- I'm pretty ok with his 1st TitusVote. My problems with his stance on Titus come later, starting here and here. The first is saying that he's locking his Vote on Titus. In between the two linked posts, multiple people state that they had intentions of Voting Titus. MM says she's 'acting really scummy' as opposed to her being Scum. He then checks out of the supported Wagon at L-3 leaving himself the option to get back on. I really don't like this flap in stance: 'she's Scum and I'm Vote parking' to' she's Scum, but UnVote'. His rationale for changing is to look elsewhere, but I strongly feel like he spends most of his time keeping Titus in the spotlight and not sorting anyone else.

This is town behavior. I wasn't sure that she was scum. The scummy people are the people that are acting like Scum-Titus was a slam dunk.

D3X wrote:
For his actual Vote, MM jumps off of an L-5Wagon in favor of an L-7Wagon {L-6 with his Vote}. He then proceeds to aggro-rationalize this 'acceptable' Wagon. MM finishes out the Day with this backdoor out of the impending MisLynch.

It was an acceptable wagon, that doesn't mean it doesn't make sense to look at the wagon leaders as scum.

D3X wrote:
Today, he caps all of this off with a healthy dab of MisLynch shaming despite being a key player on said MisLynch. He plays up Tammy being a key player on the MisLynch, ignores all other Wagon leaders, and tries to clear himself for the backseat driving he'd done most of D1.

I'm not ignoring anyone. I'm saying that Tammy was Titus' primary antagonist. That is where I'm starting. If anyone else has other suggestions I am open to them.

MonkeyMan576 · Thu Mar 12, 2015 10:32 am

Tammy wrote:Are you literally voting me for pushing my scum read?

I'm voting you for not adequately looking at other possibilities.

Tammy wrote:
What about the other people who voted there.

I'm willing to look at them too. Who do you think was scum on the Titus wagon?

Tammy wrote:
What was wrong with my case? What looked fake?

I think you were taking the path of least resistance.

Tammy wrote:
What was my scum motivation to push for that lynch over the others? Are you scum reading Ankamius or Vezokpiraka?[/Quote

Why Ankamius? He was apparantly not on the final lynch.

I would probably look at Vezo before Ank.

(Varsoon, Tammy, d3x, MonkeyMan576, BBMolla, vezokpiraka, GuyInFreezer, Nero Cain, Here There Be Dragons, ActionDan)

MonkeyMan576 · Thu Mar 12, 2015 10:47 am

Tammy wrote:
That does not actually answer any of my questions.

I don't care about the answer to the first one, you already answered that, but I actually love this answer. How, pray tell, was I not looking adequately at the people up for lynch that day?

You seemed fixated on Titus. Show me which other people you scumread.

Tammy wrote:
That does not in any way, shape or form answer what you think was wrong with my case. Read it. Tell me what was wrong with it.

Did you actually say I took the path of least resistance? Titus certainly didn't think so, so what are you talking about.

I think even Titus would acknowledge that she was an easy mislynch.

Tammy wrote:
You're sidestepping. Do you scum read Ank or Vezok. It's a simply yes or no answer. Stop deflecting.

I'm not sidestepping. Just because I don't answer a question to your exact specifications doesn't mean it's not valid. I would say Vezon is 6 out of 10 on the scum scale(10 being scummies) and Ank is 5.

Tammy wrote:
What was my scum motivation for pushing the lynch onto Titus.

To lynch town of course.

Tammy wrote:
Answer the actual questions and stop sidestepping.

Stop acting like a bully.

MonkeyMan576 · Thu Mar 12, 2015 2:30 pm

I would be okay with lynching a lurker if nothing else comes up, honestly.

MonkeyMan576 · Thu Mar 12, 2015 2:33 pm

In post 1603, Tammy wrote:
In post 1180, T-Bone wrote:
Vote Count #22

Titus - 1 (Varsoon)
Varsoon - 2 (ActionDan, Muffin)
ZZZX - 1 (Nero Cain)
Ankamius - 5 (Titus, MonkeyMan576, vezokpiraka, PeregrineV, ZZZX)
vezokpiraka - 3 (serrapaladin, Fluminator, Fluminator)
MonkeyMan576 - 1 (d3x)
PeregrineV - 2 (displaced, Ankamius)

Not Voting - 5 (GuyInFreezer, Here There Be Dragons, Murder of Crows, Narninian, Tammy)

With 19 alive, it takes 10 votes to Execute

Activity Check - all good, heh...if any player is able to select feats at level 1 and has not confirmed to me three feats they would like, it should be done soon

Deadline is March 7th, 8:00pm EST - 2 DAYS AWAY

Monkey msn - the reason I wanted you to answer ther questions is to see if you're actually paying attention to the game or making up bullshit.

Here is the vote count before I voted titus. She has exactly one vote on her two days before deadline. If I hadn't come in and tried to get titus lynched, by default either ankamius or vezok probably would have been lynched with a slight possibility of peregrine based on him doing nothing.

Therefore, Titus was not an easy mislynch at this stage. She, herself, called my vote on her a vanity wagon vote.

If you are not scum reading ankamius or vezok, I had absolutely no scum motivation to push the lynch to Titus. If titus/ankamius/vezok are all town, it wouldn't have mattered to me. I could have very easily found a reason to vote the top wagons, and while I fully believe my scum game sucks, one of the easiest things about scum is making up reasons to vote someone, especially people who are behaving in superficially scummy ways.

The only way you could think I had scum motivation to try to direct the lynch to Titus at that point is if you think I did it to save one of my partners, but you're not even scum reading them. So where was I going after an easy mislynch and why did I choose Titus over two, who at the time would have been a much better chance at getting a mislynch than gunning for Titus.

D3x was the next vote on the wagon, and then yours. If you had misgivings about my reasoning for voting her and continued reasoning to vote her, why did you not mention it then?

So, I mean you're free to engage in pathfinder fan fiction and retell the events of yesterday, but it's not really gonna hold up here. You are voting me for pushing my scum read and being wrong. You're voting me for this mythical lack of motivation searching where if you read my ISO, you'd see that objectively false, and when I ask you to examine my motivations, you know that thing you say I'm not doing, all you can say is going for the easy mislynch because you didn't show enough doubt but are failing to actually look at how the end of day to see how things actually played out.

What I am trying to figure out is if you are town voting me for one of the top five dumbest reasons ever, or if you're scum who doesn't really know how to fake scumhunting so are defaulting to she was wrong so is scum.

It's always easy to have hindsight, just because I evaluated something one way day 1 doesn't mean I'm not allowed to reevaluate it day 2.

And if you say the reason for voting you is dumb, well then it must be true. If a project in a business fails, blame goes to the project leader, likewise if a lynch is town in mafia, you should look to the person leading the lynch. Explain why it makes more sense to look somewhere else on the lynch.

MonkeyMan576 · Thu Mar 12, 2015 10:53 pm

ZZZX wrote:
like omgus is not scummy and I (and many others) do it all the time. Scum would go for a more tactical lynch

and no contripution isnt a reason enough for a scum read.

Effort != Town/Scum

yes it can work as a supporting factor however you cant build a case entirely on it.

OMGUS and Lurking are both scummy. OMGUS is the exact opposite of scumhunting, while lurking is just plain being lazy.

If you're not going to contribute to a game you shouldn't sign up and shouldn't be surprised when you are lynched.

MonkeyMan576 · Thu Mar 12, 2015 11:14 pm

Vote: ZZZX

FOS: D3X

MonkeyMan576 · Fri Mar 13, 2015 5:57 pm

I doubt they are neighbors.

MonkeyMan576 · Sat Mar 14, 2015 8:01 am

D3X wrote:

In post 1679, MonkeyMan576 wrote:I doubt they are neighbors.
Based on what, exactly?

[/Quote]

One of my powers.

MonkeyMan576 · Sat Mar 14, 2015 10:59 am

Read List:

Town(Towniest to least town)
---------------
Monkeyman576
Fluminator
Here There Be Dragons
Varsoon
Jaqen Hagar

Null(most town to most scum)
--------------
BBMolla
sarrapaladin
Nero Cain
displaced
Muffin
ActionDan

Scum(least scum to most scum)
------------
Tammy
Narninian
Ankamius
D3X
ZZZX

MonkeyMan576 · Sat Mar 14, 2015 11:03 am

By the way, Dragons, your name makes me think of:

for some reason.

MonkeyMan576 · Sat Mar 14, 2015 12:03 pm

Dragons wrote:
Additional Pedit: Monkey. Listen. I hate you.

MonkeyMan576 · Sat Mar 14, 2015 1:36 pm

Ok I forgot about the masons claim, i would probably move them up a notch on the town scale.

MonkeyMan576 · Sat Mar 14, 2015 2:11 pm

Maybe you should drink less if you don't want people to know that you are really scum, Tammy?

MonkeyMan576 · Sun Mar 15, 2015 8:49 am

In post 1743, vezokpiraka wrote:
In post 1712, MonkeyMan576 wrote:Read List:

Town(Towniest to least town)
---------------
Monkeyman576
Fluminator
Here There Be Dragons
Varsoon
Jaqen Hagar

Null(most town to most scum)
--------------
BBMolla
sarrapaladin
Nero Cain
displaced
Muffin
ActionDan

Scum(least scum to most scum)
------------
Tammy
Narninian
Ankamius
D3X
ZZZX

So I don't even exist in this game. Cool.

I'm down with a jeqen lynch although I'm not seeing him as a strong scum read.

Sorry, I would put you null at this point.

MonkeyMan576 · Sun Mar 15, 2015 10:53 am

With the lack of activity of quite a few people I think it's highly likely there are scum-lurkers present.

MonkeyMan576 · Mon Mar 16, 2015 2:13 am

D3x wrote:

In post 1712, MonkeyMan576 wrote:Scum(least scum to most scum)
------------
Tammy
Narninian
Ankamius
D3X
ZZZX
At what point did Tammy become your least scummy ScumRead? Why?

Her answers seem somewhat sincere. But she still lead the Titus vote.

D3X wrote:

In post 1721, MonkeyMan576 wrote:Ok I forgot about the masons claim, i would probably move them up a notch on the town scale.
Except... didn't you
just
say they weren't based on one of your powers?

No, I said they weren't neighbors. Keep up.

MonkeyMan576 · Mon Mar 16, 2015 9:03 am

D3X looks scummier every time he posts.

MonkeyMan576 · Tue Mar 17, 2015 2:59 pm

You would think a claimed miller would try more hard to look town.

MonkeyMan576 · Tue Mar 17, 2015 9:10 pm

I find it pretty coincidental that a claimed miller would be replacing out.

MonkeyMan576 · Wed Mar 18, 2015 2:07 pm

Decent case.

Vote: Vezok

MonkeyMan576 · Wed Mar 18, 2015 9:23 pm

ZZZX wrote:
In post 1883, MonkeyMan576 wrote:Decent case.

Vote: Vezok

Weren't you 100% sure of me being scum ?

Are you jumping on any oppuratnity for a vote here.. /./

You're still scum. I just prefer to catch more than one in a day.

MonkeyMan576 · Fri Mar 20, 2015 2:53 pm

In post 1940, Andrius wrote:I have a L1 ability that reads miller-like. T-Bone will not confirm Miller, but all signs point to some sort of miller-like interaction. FYI.

I accept that man's warm greetings, and like the roleplay.

ABR - RECK drew this as an impression of my old avatar. I am using it temporarily as thanksgiving. I know its ugly but it made me laugh, where its from. I can say no more.

Cephrir's 1926 is also troubling.

What do you think of your predecessor's lack of activity given his miller like ability? Don't you think he should have been more active? Is your level 2 ability more useful to the town?

MonkeyMan576 · Sat Mar 21, 2015 8:54 am

In post 1996, Ankamius wrote:We'll see. There's a few things that has to be true for me to be an active player and none of them are being hit so far.

This sounds like an excuse not to scum hunt for me.

Vote: Ankamius

MonkeyMan576 · Sat Mar 21, 2015 10:02 am

OMGUS as usual. Attack the person voting you rather than address their concerns.

MonkeyMan576 · Sat Mar 21, 2015 5:46 pm

In post 2024, Ankamius wrote:
In post 2021, MonkeyMan576 wrote:OMGUS as usual. Attack the person voting you rather than address their concerns.

Clearly it has nothing with you nitpicking and everything to do with OMGUS.

yeah because commitment to scumhunting is clearly not an issue at all.

MonkeyMan576 · Sat Mar 21, 2015 6:57 pm

In post 2027, Ankamius wrote:Find some way to find HTBD and Jaqen to completely ignore each other for the rest of the day and you might have a case.

Not really, then being scum or not has nothing to do with weather or not you're scum, unless you're scumbuddies.

MonkeyMan576 · Sat Mar 21, 2015 7:08 pm

No, I didn't miss it, you're just wrong.

MonkeyMan576 · Sun Mar 22, 2015 3:43 pm

In post 2035, ZZZX wrote:
In post 2034, Here There Be Dragons wrote:VOTE: d3x

also willing to do monkeyman and maybe vezok

obligatory jaqen is scum and you'll rue the day you let him walk free

~STD

Join the monkey wagon, Catch a scum.

his gameplay here is getting weirder. It has no sign at town intent what so ever.

Let me get this straight. You think I'm "weird", and that makes me scum? Right. I have more content than half the players here.

MonkeyMan576 · Mon Mar 23, 2015 12:20 pm

In post 2118, Tammy wrote:
In post 2100, Ankamius wrote:Oh god, I'm on a wagon with ZZZX and Vezok?

UNVOTE: MonkeyMan576
VOTE: Vezokpiraka

The thing that bugs me about this post is it comes after Nero questioned hbd for voting with their scum reads.

It also bothers me that Ankamius is so self conscious about who he is on a wagon with, yet he is more confident in his "gut" than PV's reads.

MonkeyMan576 · Mon Mar 23, 2015 1:16 pm

Sorry my bad, I was confusing two different games. Obviously, PV is not in this game.