Micro 925 | Hungarian Music | Over

[Something_Smart]

First

Oh god why am I not asleep

[Something_Smart]

sircakez and i officially concede

No.

[Something_Smart]

Respond to my vote coward

If you insist.

VOTE: SirCakez

We're going to misread each other eventually, might as well get it over with

[Something_Smart]

Oh boy oh boy I think something smart might be town already!

Hard vetoing this read, gonna tell you right now "No." is not out of my scumrange.

[Something_Smart]

Also, I'm down for rooms.

Get a room: Espeonage and S_S

Any particular reason you picked me?

[Something_Smart]

why is this game so dead? we have 2 slots who haven't posted at all yet

I'm not a detective but I wonder if you and Slaxx memeing aggressively at the start of the game was offputting to people.

[Something_Smart]

my main thing with the get a room feature is that I think overuse is gonna be anti-town

like main thread is dead enough as things stand, and if people are spending most of their time in rooms instead of in main thread it's going to be a lot of second hand reading (X: "yeah Y is being really towny in our room") vs direct reading

Give the game a little time before you assume it will be always dead. For instance, my activity varies wildly with the general activity of the game and my engagement with it.

[Something_Smart]

Look here Plato...jk

I think you mean Socrates, lol

[Something_Smart]

Idea: get every possible pair in the game to post this. We're guaranteed to win.

Congratulations, you figured out why it wasn't okay for him to post that.

[Something_Smart]

I think the most likely scenario for a hood with scum and a townie is that scum pockets the townie, not anything else.

I mean, your mileage may vary. Some people are more prone to hood pocketing, and those people should hopefully be vocal about it so we can try to help them look critically at their neighbor's posts. Having multiple hoods per person will probably help because then you can bounce reads on your neighbors off of each other and they might be able to help you avoid getting pocketed.

[Something_Smart]

Get a Room: Menalque, Best Buds, Slaxx

[Something_Smart]

How can you ask me to explain my reads but not explain this push?

Do you not want to explain your reads?

[Something_Smart]

I'm having trouble coming up with things to say this game.

[Something_Smart]

Because nobody is saying anything interesting.

[Something_Smart]

I probably wouldn't be opposed to a room with Cakez but I can't get it until my current post restriction runs out anyway.

[Something_Smart]

It's fine so far, I probably can't go into detail right now.

[Something_Smart]

Not that I would want to anyway, because what's the point of a hood if you just tell everyone everything that happens in it.

[Something_Smart]

I think "sorry you rolled scum" is a pretty common thing and usually not alignment indicative.

[Something_Smart]

Your stance on the Room itself is contradictory, and you fail to admit this as well.

That's towny!

[Something_Smart]

I mean it's not like a townlock or anything, but generally scum care a lot more about how they look than town do.

[Something_Smart]

Doing a full reread. Still hard to get a bead on anything. 77 is the first post that stands out to me but I can't tell if it's scummy or just not reading closely enough.

[Something_Smart]

Menalque is being hard to read and it feels like it's a little bit on purpose.

I'm pretty sure he did this before but I can't remember where, but I know he was town because I've never played with scum-him. AvP maybe?

[Something_Smart]

They/you feel too "go with the flow"-y. Like agreeing with that three person room that's been proposed even though they said they have no early reads. Doesn't make any sense.

Why is that scummy?

[Something_Smart]

Heaven is somewhat of a townlean for 185.

[Something_Smart]

I'm not even gonna bother responding anymore I'm sure you're scum now. Your reaction confirms it in my mind.

[Something_Smart]

I think that’s maybe true for newer scum but I think it holds significantly less among those with experience

I'm not sure about that, actually? A lot of scum players, even experienced ones, play to look town above all else.

[Something_Smart]

I read that post as pretty scummy. Why is it town?

Generally overconfidence and bravado come from town, because that kind of stuff is liable to draw negative attention. That reads more as cocky town who thinks they're onto something than scum trying to get a mislynch without coming out of it looking really bad.

[Something_Smart]

B/c that's how scum tend to blend in. It also gets them on the good side of active players.

That's fair, but plenty of townies will also play that way. I'd think it's more personality indicative than anything.

[Something_Smart]

Lots of people are off doing real-world things and have less time to post on weekends.

[Something_Smart]

I disagree; however if you find it to be indicative of Town, why are you still voting for SirCakez at this point?

Right, I'm not used to RVS'ing, lol.

Mafia is hard.

UNVOTE:

[Something_Smart]

I don’t agree with SS reads but if I recall that isn’t AI for him. I think we disagreed when he vigged me a year ago (that was you, right?)

Yes

I'm a terrible vig, okay

[Something_Smart]

Do you think Heaven’s confidence is outside the realm of scum play SS?

No. I've been fooled by a few scum players before-- notably YOU-- doing a similar tactic. But it's something that most people don't do as scum, for the simple reason that most townies wouldn't let them get away with that.

Caveat: Heaven/CSF could easily be S/S.

[Something_Smart]

I mean they haven't really gotten involved yet. So we'll have to see.

[Something_Smart]

There goes the Heaven/SS scumteam I was cooking up in my head

That'll teach you not to cook up scumteams on D1.

[Something_Smart]

I was gonna say that you have played with scum me once, in Guns n Roses III

how am I being hard to read?

Right I blocked that game out of my memory

I believe what I had in mind when I made that comment was that you seemed to be controlling your appearance, by joking around and being silly while simultaneously being tight-lipped about your reads and thoughts (saying several times "I have a thought on X but I don't want to say it yet"). You're giving reads, sure, but I don't feel like you're interacting with the thread on a level that's close or personal enough to actually get inside your head. And I know you can, because you did it in the first game I ever played with you, Pokemon Fusion.

[Something_Smart]

Idk I don't really see why a 3p neighborhood is that much better than a 2p one. If you have something important to say you should be saying it in the game thread, or at least in BOTH neighborhoods. Scum can't kill me because of what I said to them in one hood without risking that I also said the same thing in the other, and besides, I probably wouldn't say something to a neighbor that would make them want to NK me. Bodyguards exist, too.

[Something_Smart]

3p neighbourhoods also sound good I think, so at least one person can hold the other accountable if that makes sense(?)

~kanna

I don't think it does... what exactly do you mean by "hold the other accountable"?

[Something_Smart]

Scum have a factional roleblock, though.

[Something_Smart]

Get a room: SirCakez and Something_Smart

[Something_Smart]

I liked my early townread on ss but I don't know why he stopped playing the game

Disengagement + RL distraction is a bad combo. Want anything in particular from me?

[Something_Smart]

Lukewarm take, 363 is towny.

[Something_Smart]

Somebody engage me on something.

Literally anything, I don't care. I already tried to find things to talk about and didn't really succeed. I can try again if necessary but I'd rather talk about something other people also care about.

[Something_Smart]

What do you think about TSE’s brief pop-in?

Maybe slightly towny? TSE did seem to be pretty invested in figuring out what was happening. Though there's no reason that couldn't come from scum, it's just slightly more likely town.

[Something_Smart]

y r u not scum?

Because I'm making absolutely no effort to look busy.

I know the look that lurking here gives. I'm well aware that it looks like I'm laying low and trying to run out the timer. But I legitimately can't come up with discussion starters and I'm obviously not going to fake it. As scum I would be taking it, and it wouldn't be hard.

Take this with as many grains of salt as you would like, but you asked a question I could answer, so I'm answering it.

[Something_Smart]

namely that I asked him who I should try to hood with for my other hood and his only post was to ask why

I answered and he never responded since

I'm sorry. A lot's been going on recently and it slipped my mind.

My activity's pretty low and sporadic sitewide though so it really had nothing to do with you.

[Something_Smart]

To me it looks like someone more concerned about image than solving

How so?

[Something_Smart]

I mean, look at the post. I don't know if it needs more explanation. It was asking why people were voting for him and what his predecessor did that was bad.

On the surface, it has a defensive and self-interested look, not a helpful townie look. If he were really that concerned with appearance, why would he make that post?

[Something_Smart]

Do you think I should be TRing you instead of nullresding you for anything you’ve done so far?

Honestly no clue. I don't really know how I would have handled this game as scum and if it would have been noticeably different.

[Something_Smart]

I don't think anybody should use their roles this game. The more people use their role, the more confusion is causes.

How do you figure?

[Something_Smart]

I mean as much as I would love to play 7:2 mountainous which has an EV of like less than 30%, I think that using our roles is a good thing here?

[Something_Smart]

Except that activity between members of the room in the main thread is mutually exclusive with them being in a room together.

Only temporarily. The post restrictions expire after 48 hours

[Something_Smart]

The only pro-town use of a BG this game, IMO, is for a bad player to sacrifice themselves for a good player.

Or a scummy player to sacrifice themselves for a towny player? People get NK'd because they are hard to lynch or dangerous if kept alive, which means that it is inherently pro-town to prevent them from dying.

[Something_Smart]

You have no idea what I’d give for 7:2 mountainous, there’s not nearly enough mountainous on site

That's because it's miserable to play.

[Something_Smart]

I think the best use-case for roles is to keep one player alive throughout the game by designating a player each DP to protect them that night, and every other player waives their night action. Essentially follow-the-cop without the cop. I'm not sure how much I agree with that level of commitment to a unconfirmable player.

I mean, how much do you think the scum being able to NK who they want affects the game?

[Something_Smart]

Do you think town players with low town cred will voluntarily sacrifice themselves for other players if not told to by the majority of players during the dp? If so, the mafia players on this site are far more functional human beings than I am used to.

I mean, everyone in this game wanted to play in a game where everyone's a bodyguard. I can't speak for anyone else but I'm definitely planning to do it, yes.

[Something_Smart]

Why isn't it possible for there to be a legitimate basis for a scumread on Suji unrelated to their awkward posting style?

[Something_Smart]

There is. 'm not trying to say that there isn't. In fact, 'll give you two: he's not doing much to push the game forward, and he's really only replying to things that directly involve himself. If there weren't, I wouldn't be okay with his lynch at all, rather than just "okay but would be kinda disappointed".

It doesn't sound like you're okay with the lynch, given that you just said you were vetoing it...

[Something_Smart]

Alright?

[Something_Smart]

What's all right about it? You're voting town.

[Something_Smart]

Dude,

I

know that

you

know that that's not convincing.

I mean, it was a joke. I was kinda hoping to start a discussion with you about why you were voting me and/or what you wanted out of me that you weren't getting.

SS there's spicy wagons in suji and in slaxx

you will be the next spicy wagon if those move too slow

so maybe it's time for you to buck up and make a decision!!

-doggo

Wanna give me the tl;dr on both? Not that I didn't read but a summary is always nice.

[Something_Smart]

It's interesting that you want me to take sides but you don't voice an opinion on which side you want me to take, despite being on one of the wagons. It sounds like you'd be happier if I voted Suji than if I didn't vote either; is that true? (@doggo)

[Something_Smart]

What do you think I was trying to do then?

[Something_Smart]

I'd be happier if you did something townie

-d

I'm rereading to see if that helps at all.

[Something_Smart]

115 feels town.

[Something_Smart]

Yeah I think Espeonage slot is town on reread, scum-Espe didn't really play under the assumption that people would agree with him on mechanics.

[Something_Smart]

214 towny

[Something_Smart]

Suji seems like the type to have an extremely similar scumgame and towngame.

Though iirc Alyssa said she had some incriminating meta so I'll see when I get to that part.

[Something_Smart]

Get a room: Heaven, Lucky, Menalque, Suji

[Something_Smart]

266 is a mood.

[Something_Smart]

322 makes me thonk.

I think it's towny?

[Something_Smart]

Heaven townslip in 363 may be legit.

[Something_Smart]

383 Alyssa not scum with Slaxx.

[Something_Smart]

404 is > rand town

[Something_Smart]

455 is weird but not scummy? Maybe it's scummy. Townreads don't degrade, at least they shouldn't.

[Something_Smart]

I like 527, setting traps/reaction tests is more often done by town

He doesn't really go anywhere with it until I make him, though.

[Something_Smart]

545

Why do you ask a question if you think the answer is obvious, I wonder...

[Something_Smart]

Actually I would like to hear the explanation of that from Slaxx. Why did you ask me what I thought of TSE's replace in, only to say afterward that you thought the answer to your question was self-explanatory?

[Something_Smart]

Entire game. Just got to your replace-in.

[Something_Smart]

605 is non-towny bravado. It feels hollow.

[Something_Smart]

If Menalque is scum, I will become acutely aware of it in a day or two. Unfortunately it might be too late by then like it was the last time.

[Something_Smart]

I like and agree with 654.

[Something_Smart]

Idk youcan feel like someone is town in the moment but then forget why later. A lot of the time my early reads are stronger than later reads

Then why not make an effort to combat that problem?

[Something_Smart]

Okay done.

Alyssa, Heaven, Lucky, Cakez are in my townpool for now.

Between Slaxx and Suji, probably prefer Suji, but I don't mind both wagons existing. I probably won't vote until very late, as I like the state of the wagons right now and don't want to bring Suji to L-1.

[Something_Smart]

I think you started to get concerned that your lynch might happen today and felt like you had to defuse the situation. I also think that that specific attempt at defusing that you came up with is more likely to have come from scum than town.

You honestly think I'm dumb enough to expect a post like that to get people to unvote me as scum?

[Something_Smart]

It's kinda insulting that you take that as anything more than a joke/lighthearted comment, ngl.

[Something_Smart]

Okay, fair enough. If you know I know it's not convincing, then why did you say you thought I thought it would "defuse the situation"?

[Something_Smart]

where did ss go lol

Eating dinner. What's up?

[Something_Smart]

I mean, I have no issue killing Suji over myself, but we have almost two days.

[Something_Smart]

Play the game? It seems like it's finally getting moving again.

[Something_Smart]

But is it moving in the right direction?

How should I know? It depends on how people in the future will read these pages, which I can't predict.

[Something_Smart]

Lucky, just so you know, 761 is pure confirmation bias. You started with an assumption that I was scum and tried to create reasonable explanations, and indeed they are reasonable; but you haven't done anything to argue why I would be less likely to make those posts as town, or analyze why I might make those posts as town.

[Something_Smart]

I don't know if you really thought it would defuse the situation, but I think that you felt you had to defuse the situation, to do something.

This doesn't make any sense, and I know that you know that

[Something_Smart]

Not really. I read along with you and thought you were either scum or low-effort town that isn't really going to help in later DPs, but I politely waited for you to finish before deciding I wanted your head. The second part of that statement is why I don't feel the need to engage in WIFOM with you.

Can you do the things I said you didn't do, then? Why wouldn't I be likely to be make those posts as town?

[Something_Smart]

Let's hear it. How?

Because you admitted that I knew it wouldn't have any effect.

And yet you're suggesting that I felt I had to do SOMETHING, and therefore I did something that I knew would accomplish nothing instead of something that might have accomplished something. As though I suddenly forgot how to do anything that might accomplish anything? That's clearly ridiculous.

[Something_Smart]

Seems odd to say he started with the assumption you were scum. What makes you say that? Looks to me like he was townreading you before, looking through his ISO.

I mean he went straight for the "this is why scum-S_S would do X" explanation without even looking at why town-me would do it.

[Something_Smart]

I posted 724 because I wanted to understand what doggo wanted me to do, in order to read that slot better and figure out if they were just trying to bait me to join a wagon or if they actually wanted me to vote to help the town.

I focused on Slaxx because he was a main wagon, and those were some of the posts that caught my eye, and because I have notoriously misread Slaxx in the past and being able to read him here is a big priority.

I posted 747 because I don't want a repeat of the last time I played with scum-Menalque, where I caught him on D3 but I got mislynched instead and town lost.

[Something_Smart]

Wouldn't you, as town!S_S be in a better position than me, not!S_S, to explain why town!S_S would make those posts?

To some extent, sure. But you know what the town wincon is, and you know what things townies generally do to further the wincon (ask questions, try to work out reads, try to form good wagons and work together with other townies). So it's not as if you aren't able to imagine why I might make those posts as town.

[Something_Smart]

Do you think town!doggo tries to direct your actions? If yes, why are you trying to appease town players? If no, why aren't you ISOing his posts to better develop your read on the slot?

Yes, I think they might want me take certain actions to further the town wincon. I don't see how I'm appeasing them, since I didn't vote on Suji or Slaxx like they asked. I'm trying to understand why they want the thing they want.

[Something_Smart]

2/5 is a main wagon? When you said you were going to try to show that you were town by rereading the DP and posting your thoughts, was your mindset that of discovering scum or appeasing town?

2/5 is a main wagon when he's the only other person at more than 1.

I don't know why you keep using the word "appeasing." This is a team game. To win, we must work together. If I do something other people want me to do, I am not "appeasing" them. I am helping them and directly furthering my wincon.

I did the reread because other people (as well as I) wanted me to be more active, both so they could hear my thoughts and so they could read me better. I did the reread to get myself more engaged in the game, with the intent of trying to get better reads as well as helping people get better reads on me.

[Something_Smart]

Soooooo, were you just posting that to vent about the past? Is this thread therapeutic for you?

No? I want that to not happen again. I feel like that's pretty obvious.

[Something_Smart]

Do you think that town!doggo believes they have such a good read on the game that they would direct other players DP1, or do you think it's an ego thing for them?

Like I said, team game. If you recall, their directions were "vote Suji or Slaxx", which feels like a mindset of "we should get two competing wagons and people should consolidate on them", which is completely understandable. They don't need to have an ironclad read to give directions, just a thought about what the gamestate should be like.

[Something_Smart]

Why?

[Something_Smart]

I don't want the day to end yet.

[Something_Smart]

I'm implying that I won't vote until I'm ready for the day to end. This is a general policy I abide by, but in this particular situation, yes it's possible that someone hammers before I'd like the day to end.

[Something_Smart]

You know, it really hurts your credibility for how much of the game you've actually read when you keep making these basic votecount errors.

Who is this directed at?

[Something_Smart]

Possibly. I'm just trying to get him a bit riled up to see how his tone changes when he's emotional.

That's a reasonable goal, if the execution was a bit rude and manipulative. But it won't be useful on everyone.

What kind of alignment-indicative response were you hoping to get?

[Something_Smart]

I can link you to some posts where I've gotten emotional, if you want. It doesn't happen often.

When I'm frustrated (usually at someone being stubborn or refusing to listen), I get ranty and try to explain things in as simple and emphatic terms as I can. Usually doesn't come out in an alignment-indicative way, since even if scum I'll usually only get frustrated over something I do genuinely believe in.

When I'm upset or unhappy, usually it manifests by naked voting and being terse and evasive. This has been towny before, usually because of the timing.

When I'm happy or proud of myself, I usually won't alter my posting much, except for maybe being a bit more friendly and jokey.

When I'm stressed I'll make a lot of short posts and change my mind a lot. (Note that this is not the only condition under which I'll do that.)

[Something_Smart]

So you'd interpret after the fact if his emotional response was towny or scummy without making any advance predictions?

That's a cool way to avoid confirmation bias.

It actually seems more prone to confirmation bias, since if you say "town will react like X and scum will react like Y" then you have no say in the matter and the reaction is either towny or scummy (or neither), whereas if you don't lay that out ahead of time you can let your prior read color your interpretation of the response.

Doesn't mean it's impossible to do it without confbias. It can still be a workable system, but of course your results are going to vary wildly from person to person.

[Something_Smart]

Wasn't sure if that was sarcastic or not, I felt it was worth elaborating on in either case.

[Something_Smart]

I almost said "not sure if sarcastic" but that's pretty insulting if something is not sarcastic

[Something_Smart]

S_S is fine as an unambiguous abbreviation.

[Something_Smart]

You have to actually use your vote, sorry

Who said I wasn't going to?

[Something_Smart]

I don't appreciate being bullied.

[Something_Smart]

And you can't read my posts?

[Something_Smart]

I can but votes and posts are different woof woof

Well, yeah. But you can see where I stand without seeing who I vote. What do you need the vote for?

[Something_Smart]

I definitely said I preferred Suji.

[Something_Smart]

Sure, when I feel like we've gotten enough out of the day.

Several players haven't checked in since activity picked up. So I would definitely be interested in what they have to say, especially since Suji is one of them.

[Something_Smart]

Chalk it up to clashing playstyles?

You're definitely not the first person to be thrown for a loop by it.

[Something_Smart]

In some cases, yes. I don't always do this. I only do it when I feel the time left in the day will be more productive than unproductive. In this case, we had a long spell of apathy, and activity only recently picked up. The game has only really gotten interesting in the last 24 hours or so, at least for me. So I expect the next 24 hours to be people reacting to and digesting the interesting things that have happened, rather than spinning wheels and making pointless noise.

Even if D1's on average produce less information than the other days, it doesn't mean that all D1's will be low-information.

[Something_Smart]

I'm sure the relationship between those variables (total D1 postcount and town win %) is not linear. It's a bell curve, probably, and I definitely don't think we're on the right side of it.

[Something_Smart]

And I'm saying that's a linear fallacy.

[Something_Smart]

Slaxx replacing out kinda seems like a scum move so I guess we can go there.

Why do you think it was AI and not RL related?

[Something_Smart]

@Mod: Is LuckyLunatic a hydra or an alt? If a hydra, who's the main of the other head?

[Something_Smart]

Hi Dany! Happy birthday!

[Something_Smart]

So 899 is inaccurate, then?

It's against the rules to mislead people about whether you're a hydra or not.

[Something_Smart]

I think it's spelled B-A-D J-O-K-E.

[Something_Smart]

It's not like you need my vote to end the day...

[Something_Smart]

And we just had a replacement. I'd like to hear from him.

[Something_Smart]

What do you think of SirCakes, his my strongest read, where as I don't have much of a read on anyone else.

I have a terrible track record at reading him, though I do think he's fairly towny this game.

[Something_Smart]

Huh?

[Something_Smart]

I commented on maybe a dozen posts out of 700. How is that "almost everything"?

[Something_Smart]

Townlean.

I still don't get what you are referring to or why you don't like it.

[Something_Smart]

it felt like you could be making content for the sake of making content.

I mean, isn't that what playing mafia is? I was having a hard time coming up with stuff to say, so I did a reread with the intent to dive a little deeper than I had thus far. Of course my goal with that string of posts was to make content.

[Something_Smart]

I mean, I think the normal thing to do is to comment on stuff you have an opinion about. There's no point in commenting on stuff with just "ok" for the sake of doing it. It feels vaguely scummy to me because it feels like you're trying to look like you're solving.

Where did I do that?

[Something_Smart]

I haven't taken agency away from the rest of the town. Every person is free to change their vote to whomever they want.

I'm still leaning toward lynching Suji.

[Something_Smart]

I mean every short take gave an opinion, so I don't really see how you can equate it to commenting pointlessly without offering an opinion.

[Something_Smart]

Not really. If you vote one wagon or the other, and we don't hammer them, we risk the day expiring in a no lynch. The closer we get to the deadline, the more of a reality this becomes.

My vote is actually less likely to lock in a lynch than anyone else's. If, for instance, Menalque were to vote Dany, that would make the Dany wagon at 4 and the Suji wagon at 1 and it would make it extremely unlikely for anyone other than Dany to be lynched. Whereas, if I voted Dany, he'd be at 4 and Suji would be at 2, which is less lopsided.

If you want to say that people are unlikely to switch and my vote is important because it's a tiebreaker, then sure, I agree with that. But every person has used their agency in choosing who to vote, and I haven't taken any of that away.

[Something_Smart]

I think I'm fine with doing this though.

VOTE: Sujimichi

[Something_Smart]

I can't tell if you are being intentionally thick or if you have honestly never seen a day end in a no lynch because people aren't online to hammer.

I have. I don't understand what's so magical about my vote that would keep the day from ending in a no-lynch when another person's vote would not.

[Something_Smart]

You are assuming people will be online to switch their votes.

So are you. You just said that whoever I vote would probably be lynched; how would that happen if nobody was online to hammer?

[Something_Smart]

I guess we'll see.

It's not like everyone had to wait for me to organize on a wagon. They haven't really made any effort to push a wagon through to a lynch (something which very well could have happened without me).

[Something_Smart]

Suji mislynch would be better. In my experience Suji is much harder to read than Dany.

[Something_Smart]

You're preaching team play by trying to pin the responsibility for making sure town lynches on me, when it should be on everyone. It's not like people need to wait for me to start consolidating on a wagon, and it's not like they can't ask me and others who we'd be willing to vote.

Your thought experiment is jumping to extremes; I voted with 12 hours left, not 10 minutes. And I should think that if people spent the whole day talking and not voting, they'd come to some consensus, and the votes would not be a surprise. Just like my vote was not a surprise-- I mentioned that I'd probably vote Suji days ago.

[Something_Smart]

I'm amazed that scum thought there was a higher priority roleblock target than Dany.

[Something_Smart]

I didn't give any indication of who I would guard to either of my neighbors. I didn't guard anyone.

I think I'm cleared here since I had no way of knowing Dany would be on me.

[Something_Smart]

No, scum!SS would've done it to lock the idea that he was nightkilled.

Its not exactly hard to believe that he would bodyguard SS and its very unlikely anyone would bodyguard Dany

It's the type of thing I might do yes, but it's completely devastating if Dany ends up not guarding me, since listing me as a townlean before a scumflip that radically changes the gamestate is not exactly ironclad evidence that he'd guard me. If I'm scum I don't think my situation is dire enough to risk essentially everything like that.

[Something_Smart]

@SS when you get here can you give your read on me and on buds?

I feel like you've been way too much of a nonpresence for me to get a good read despite your massive postcount, but this could be my fault rather than yours. Probably because you weren't there when I was most engaged. Can you link the pages that you think are most telling on your alignment?

[Something_Smart]

I thought Dany only announced he was guarding me immediately before the end of the night?

[Something_Smart]

Can I get one with just my best pal SS?

What do you want that for?

[Something_Smart]

Lucky's lurking here is so scummy it seems likely to me they are trying to let town eat itself alive

But if Lucky is scum, that's exactly what town isn't doing...

[Something_Smart]

I mean it's a fight but it's not a fight that's gonna cause town to drop their read on Lucky and it also doesn't seem to really be impacting anyone outside of it so at worst 1/3 of the town is eating itself alive.

[Something_Smart]

yo SS what's your take on buds anyway?

I really have no opinion on anything from them except them baiting me to hammer Suji, on which I definitely have an opinion but I don't know what it is.

I think it's towny???

[Something_Smart]

If I'm being honest Menalque I have at least decent reasons not to lynch everyone except you. I don't know if this is on me or on you but I really haven't seen anything from you that I don't think you could fake as scum.

In your opinion, where's the point in the game where your posts are most telling of your alignment?

[Something_Smart]

do you think you can normally see things from me that I can't fake as scum or ?

We've only been town together a few times, right? In Pokemon Fusion I pegged you as town pretty early on, and in AvP I suspected you initially but that read worked itself out after a while.

[Something_Smart]

They didn't. We didn't talk at all.

[Something_Smart]

idr why exactly I just townbinned S_S on d2 but I remember it being compelling enough to want to sheep it

I was obviously the target of the N1 kill, lol.

[Something_Smart]

Sometimes wishes do come true.

I don't want to think about this game though. I can't read you, I can't read Buds, I can't really read Menalque since he just never got around to engaging (and him 1v1ing is not very alignment indicative).

I can sometimes read Alisae. I'll reread em when I get a minute.

[Something_Smart]

I think Alyssa's town, I don't think that's really a controversial read though.

[Something_Smart]

man, this is why we should honestly try hydraing sometime.

I'd be down

The most important thing is to try and in late game, it seems like I thrive while u just don’t really know what to do? This is what I mostly felt during AvP where sure, you were conftown, but it seemed like u were struggling to do things?

I don't know honestly, my motivation can turn on a dime for reasons that I can't always place. Sometimes external factors play a part, sometimes I just get disconnected and tilted by a bad lynch or bad night result (see: Pick Your Power where the person I used my JOAT cop shot on died that night and I was tilted for the entire day afterward), sometimes I just feel like I can't get any good reads or accomplish anything. Being conftown adds to that last bit because I don't even have anything to prove.

[Something_Smart]

I would like to see arguments and reasoning I can engage with. The Ali/Cakez shitfight that went on on the past page was not that.

[Something_Smart]

Kanna's paranoia of me and defense of SirCakez reads as pretty genuine.

I still don't really have any issues with your slot.

[Something_Smart]

Tentatively I'm okay with killing SirCakez and Alisae in either order.

[Something_Smart]

I can identify RC and FL when they're playing on alts. Beyond that, nope.

[Something_Smart]

That's how scum wins.

Unless Alisae is scum, in which case us reconsidering is how e wins...?

[Something_Smart]

this was impressively useless as a reaction test

[Something_Smart]

Sorry. I blame the site for making me not want to post yesterday.

[Something_Smart]

I think I'm close to just saying fuck it and lynching alisae/cakez back to back in whatever order

and if it happens to both hit town, then oh well

Same

[Something_Smart]

I'm not really sure you had any way to win. I guess your best shot might have been to act completely lost and try to look like you had no agenda?

[Something_Smart]

Like I honestly come to the exact same conclusion I come to as town here and probably push it the exact same way.

But if you're town then we probably still win by lynching you today because your conclusion is probably RIGHT.

[Something_Smart]

I guess maybe your best shot is to come in and try to hard pocket SirCakez?

[Something_Smart]

Ok but now u have to realize that in F3 with significantly higher stakes

yeah but I think everyone alive would have just instavoted Cakez in F3 if you flipped town.

[Something_Smart]

no
Your not an optimal push
Buds isn’t an optimal push
Alyssa kinda but I don’t feel like I could win that today

But that's exactly why it might work-- you have to come in and do something that it makes no sense for you to do as scum.

What you did, though I could see it as town, was pretty much exactly what I felt you would be doing as scum there, and I already was scummy on your slot so I was never gonna let you endgame. I'd guess Alyssa was the same way.

Even if you end up flipping on Cakez in F3 you have to look like you don't have a plan for endgaming.

[Something_Smart]

What was your plan to win F3? I don't think anyone doesn't vote you if we flip Cakez and he's green.

[Something_Smart]

PT says yes but what I actually decided to do I’m keeping a secret

Well that's a shame, I wish we'd lynched Cakez now so I could see it

[Something_Smart]

Though I'm also happy that I finally read him correctly for once

[Something_Smart]

If Alyssa does go on SS, then it makes no sense for me to kill Alyssa

Who does it make sense for you to kill? Surely not Buds?

[Something_Smart]

You can release my PT's.

Sorry you had to replace out Menalque, hope everything is ok.

[Something_Smart]

no one here cares about NKA

Especially in a game where it's hard to figure out who was actually targeted for the kill

[Something_Smart]

Also you two now have a room! It is this one. You can't talk to or about each other in the public thread during the night phase.

Lmao Plot you are great