Micro 942: Blood on the Clocktower - Game Over

[Nahdia]

There are only 5 people alive :p

[Nahdia]

voting for heal and not voting are the same thing.

[Nahdia]

if we go to LyLo i'm thinking... Elements/skitter? Or maybe Drixx/Elements?

but i dont think we're going to LyLo.

[Nahdia]

yeah but I really don't think Elbirn is scum.

[Nahdia]

Regardless, Elements is the lynch in that scenario. So it hardly matters.

[Nahdia]

If it's Drixx+A50 then this is the worst scum mechanical play I've seen in a while, and coming from Drixx? Nah fam

I mean, they'd have gotten away with it if we listened to you. Lol

[Nahdia]

Your best shot in LyLo

Alternatively, you can come up with a {Auro+Elements} solve if it hasn't been mechanically eliminated, and you automatically have both Elbirn's and Drixx's votes! You'd just need to convince Insomnia or Fire, but they don't seem to be paying any attention and Fire thinks you're towny town anyway...

Don't see you making today's play as partners with Elements.

[Nahdia]

And then, of course, talk about how my scum plan was to TMI an A50 townread and get you lynched in LyLo, etc.

If it's Drixx+A50 then this is the worst scum mechanical play I've seen in a while, and coming from Drixx? Nah fam

I mean, they'd have gotten away with it if we listened to you. Lol

At the point of time Drixx said it I was campaigning for A50's lynch the next day.

If Drixx actually predicted that I'd change my tune and call A50 a bad lynch later on and defend him with all my heart, then Drixx must be a genius.

Mmmm that's not a bad point. Regardless, both A50 and Elements are unlikely for their own reasons, but it has to be one of them.

Don't see you making today's play as partners with Elements.

Maybe you'll start seeing it then

mmm doubt it. Don't see why my read on that would change.

[Nahdia]

I mean I guess you COULD just be trying to bring the "scummiest" person to 3p lylo with your demon, but... it feels very much like the path of most resistance.

[Nahdia]

And again, it kind of... hardly matters at that point. If we go to LyLo, Elements will be confscum to me. Their partner would be immaterial; I'll speak to everyone in the town as if they're a potential vote, and not take it personally that one of them will never be convinced because they're teamed with Elements.

And there's quite some dayplay evidence for Nahdia/Skits scum as well. Maybe I'll dig it up and case in LyLo. Hm

Well, Nahdia, I think you can just change it without any rhyme or reason and internally laugh at me calling it out to no avail.

That feels like a pretty uncharitable description of my play this game... I don't think I've done much without rhyme or reason.

[Nahdia]

Yeah auro it's honestly a bit ironic that you're accusing townies here of being lazy or using bad reasoning/ignoring why A50 is a bad lynch, but also pushing myself and skitter as a team of all things.

I mean at this point, you're either

extreme

stubborn scum refusing to give up the act (which I respect, but you'd have to know it's futile), you're partnered with Elements, or you're actually just town that's got some wild tunnelvision.

[Nahdia]

Insomnia is actually mechanically clear, at this point.

[Nahdia]

I was listing possibilities!!1!

[Nahdia]

ALSO

If A50 is lock Minion and game doesn't end, it means his Demon is still alive.
Mechanically it can't be Elements or Elbirn

It has to be Nahdia.

don't do me like this, auro... look into your heart. see that i am town!

[Nahdia]

did a50 claim a different role i am not aware of.

oh my god.

[Nahdia]

don't bully me nahdia. not in the mood for it.

sorry wasn't my intention. this game has been hard to follow.

[Nahdia]

don't do me like this, auro... look into your heart. see that i am town!

My heart wishes you were! :'(

you'll be sorry in the post-game lobby! (if you are town!)

you'll be like "dang nahdia, i feel so bad that i tunnelvisioned you like that! guess i screwed up, my bad."

and ill be like "no no it's okay. i can see why you were reading things that way from your perspective. (if a50 is town: [you were right on a50, anyway]). it was a difficult game to read, and ame seriously snowed us all. i mightve made the same call."

and all will be well, and there will be no hard feelings. but SECRETLY, INSIDE, i will carry this RESENTMENT forever! and i iwll never forgive! it'll be team mafia 2030, and we'll be on a team together, in the final lylo, ready to rack up the winning points, and ill BETRAY YOU AS RECOMPENSE.

[Nahdia]

that ame part should also be in the brackets. but, you get the point.

[Nahdia]

Someone dumb down for me like I'm four years old why elements is conftown

Did he replace my monk and I forgot

This game bro I swear my brain its gone

the only real reason to clear elements is based on ame's dayplay. There's nothing mechanically clearing them, just an unlikely claim/the way they made the claim was v towny. there are teams element cant be in (cant be partnered with a50, for example), but they could possibly be demon.

[Nahdia]

the big sticking point is that because elements/A50 can't work, for elements to be demon, I have to be drunk (no one left to poison me except you, and you can only be spy as scum due to your claim).

and if im drunk and elements is demon, that means that either
1) auro is (either spy or original demon with Elements as Scarlet Woman. both are quite unlikely, IMO)
2) skitter is poisoner on Auro n1 (a longshot, but it does mechanically work)
3) you're spy. which from your perspective, obviously is a nonstarter. aand I'm pretty dang posi that you'r etown.

[Nahdia]

thinking through some possible scenarios.

Spoiler: Some A50 Scenarios

Claims

insomnia [Monk]

Auro [Virgin] (Poisoned N0)

Drixx [Undertaker]

Elbirn [Washerwoman: Ame or Insomnia is Monk]

skitter30

[Chef: 0]

[Poisoner]

Nahdia [Fortune Teller: Elbirn/Elements Negative]

Elements

[Empath: 0, 2, 1]

[Drunk]

Almost50

[Soldier]

[Demon]

Firebringer [Recluse]

Claims

insomnia [Monk]

Auro

[Virgin]

[Spy]

Drixx [Undertaker]

Elbirn [Washerwoman: Ame or Insomnia is Monk]

skitter30 [Chef: 0]

Nahdia [Fortune Teller: Elbirn/Elements Negative]

Elements

[Empath: 0, 2, 1]

[Drunk]

Almost50

[Soldier]

[Demon]

Firebringer [Recluse]

Claims

insomnia [Monk]

Auro

[Virgin]

[Demon]

Drixx [Undertaker]

Elbirn [Washerwoman: Ame or Insomnia is Monk]

skitter30 [Chef: 0]

Nahdia [Fortune Teller: Elbirn/Elements Negative]

Elements

[Empath: 0, 2, 1]

[Drunk]

Almost50

[Soldier]

[Scarlet Woman -> Demon]

Firebringer [Recluse]

some other notes:

Information

• Auro must be drunk or poisoned, or there is scum in Auro/Elbirn.
  
• skitter30 must be drunk or poisoned, or Elements/A50 is not the scumteam.
  
• Nahdia must be drunk or poisoned, or A50 must be the demon/scarlet woman.
  
• Elements must be drunk or poisoned at least Night 2, and Night 1 if A50 is not town.

Elements/A50 cannot be the scumteam. A50/Elbirn

could

work with a spy!Elbirn and demon!A50. Elbirn/Elements is possible, with me being drunk in that scenario.

quoting for reference.

[Nahdia]

(for clarity: Elements/A50 doesn't work because it requires too many malfunctions. it would mean skitter/auro are poisoned/drunk n1. and then im poisoned tonii-

wait, does that work? i was pretty sure this doesn't work. i have to think this through.

[Nahdia]

Claims

insomnia [Monk]

Auro

[Virgin]

[Drunk]

Drixx [Undertaker]

Elbirn [Washerwoman: Ame or Insomnia is Monk]

skitter30 [Chef: 0] (Poisoned N0)

Nahdia [Fortune Teller: Elbirn/Elements Negative] (Poisoned N1 & N2)

Elements

[Empath: 0, 2, 1]

[Demon]

Almost50

[Soldier]

[Poisoner]

Firebringer [Recluse]

????????????????????? Why did I think this couldn't work? Am I missing something here?

[Nahdia]

i was.... really sure. im worried i was seeing something that im missing now. it was something to do with the number of malfunctions.

could swap around skitter/auro drunk/poisoned? as well as elements/a50 roles (although on dayplay, that wouldn't make much sense... would expect elements to be putting up a strong defense for a50).

[Nahdia]

yeah, bs never claimed.

[Nahdia]

i very much agree with the ame bit. the elements part... idk, i dont want to speculate on this too much bc i dont know Xtoxm's mod meta, but i wouldn't consider it out of bounds for him to have told Elements what that slot had been fakeclaiming/give him a bit of context for the game.

[Nahdia]

since auro has been on top of the mechstuff with me id appreciate him checking my work on the a50/elements stuff to see if it really is possible or if i had it right before. whenever u get the chance.

again, not that it like, is especially important from my perspective if we go to tomorrow...

Idk
I'm not sure i've ever seen a mod tell a replacement what the og slot had fake-claimed unless it was exactly a mod-given fake-claim

i guess. but this is an odd game.

but still like, i agree with ame being town here.

honestly im just so fucking paranoid we're going to lylo because i feel like i probably am the lynch there. and auro really doesn't look like A50's partner anymore. it COULD be drixx, but i really ended up being town on him too, and the pass would be strange.

[Nahdia]

we all were the wrong and stupid

[Nahdia]

in my defense, i really wanted to finish the outsider claim strategy before d1 ended. which is what ended up giving us firebringer as a clear and a confirmed drunk.

but yeah executing a50 d2 was probably... the right move. but then a50 nommed and hurt themselves and christ almighty, we're going to lylo aren't we.

i HATE this. i am SO getting executed. what the FUCK, ame.

[Nahdia]

well, it's understandably a lot more likely from my perspective than yours. or at least, elements being demon is.

i still wouldn't put it above a50 being demon but.. i just, have a really bad feeling. especially looking back at how a50 tried to get themselves lynched on d2. it would really suggest we were in the Auro/A50 Scarlet Woman reality if he is scum. But if auro is scum here, goddamn.

[Nahdia]

this is a loss isnt it

[Nahdia]

can we move on from a50 and discuss elements versus myself at this point?

if a50 is demon, the game is over anyway.

[Nahdia]

like, im pretty sure a50 could be partners with both elements or myself. so if the game keeps going, i dont see it has helpful to continue deliberating on his slot.

i think ame is townier on play than you

for that one entrance against an entire game worth of protown play? : :\

[Nahdia]

i think ame is townier on play than you

(but, tbf, it's really close and i think the game just ends with an a50 execution)

nahdia how would you rank your scumgame + do you think you're out of your scumrange and why?

hard to answer. before i left the site for a couple years, my scumgame was known as quite good. since ive been back though, not so much.

that said though, i think this is exactly the kind of game i would excel as scum. lots of mechanics to cut my teeth on. lots of opportunities to mislead town. lots of ways to play up my own paranoia.

[Nahdia]

for that one entrance against an entire game worth of protown play? : :\

Nahdia have you read that wiki article about how some scum players play a 95% "protown" play with 5% scummy mixed in?

no, but i believe it. still it's frustrating to be executed over someone has like, 10% of the content you have bc they knocked it out of the park with a couple posts.

you wanna link me a scumgame you're proud of?

hahaha. um, no, i dont actually. but i suppose i can.

do you want the basic setup or the extremely mechanically intricate setup?

[Nahdia]

The basic game I'm proud of is a lover's mafia game: viewtopic.php?f=54&t=67167
And here's my lover PT: viewtopic.php?f=90&t=67171

The complex game I'm proud of is... well, you asked for it. Warning, it's very long, and also... just... probably a lot to take in with no context. Varsoon games always are. I only got caught this game based on flavor in the end, but it was too late: I had amassed so much power that I managed to mechanically break the setup and unilaterally lynch town within 30 seconds of daystart three days in a row as outed scum. But yaknow, the play before that is good:
viewtopic.php?f=56&t=66605
And my neighborhood, which is very relevant to that game: viewtopic.php?f=94&t=66498
Worth noting in that game that I actually occupied two slots: Nahdia & Patches the Spider

As for a recent scumgame...
viewtopic.php?f=2&t=83063

do you want the basic setup or the extremely mechanically intricate setup?

both, i guess, + best scumgame post hiatus (if any exist)

there's only this one. and it's... not good.

[Nahdia]

actually in retrospect im not sure im proud of lovers mafia lol. but it's a good representation of my play without a lot of mechanics to lean on.

[Nahdia]

viewtopic.php?f=52&t=65645 I guess maybe this scumgame maybe I'm more proud of in terms of simple games.

Man, all these games are from so long ago.

[Nahdia]

i was a waaaaaaaaaaaaaaay more emotional player back then. hmm.

[Nahdia]

as i recall that postgame is... not great. a lot of unrelated bickering about something that happened d2 between two town slots.

O yeah, Ame's townread isn't just from the claims, but a lot more strongly from the sincerity with which she believed we were in auto and was freely up to lynch herself.
In the possible A50+Elements world you posted their NKs are a little questionable, since Skitter already had wrong info - so why would it even matter if Drixx confirmed her, for example?

uhg, i AGREE with all this. gdi.

[Nahdia]

maybe i am just trolling myself and this game is about to end. or maybe Ame really is just a legendary scum player.

[Nahdia]

based off the large normal you're just town here, i think
were there other scumgames since you returned, or just the one?

just the one. i only returned to the site recently!

[Nahdia]

admittedly, a lot more handholds in this game in terms of mechanics. but yes, my fatal flaw that game was being way too self-conscious i think. also just, too many players for me to keep track of. gonna stick to micros and minis for a bit, lol.

[Nahdia]

Btw, the proposition Nahdia presented (Me Poisoner & BS/Ame/Elements Demon) works just fine from my PoV. It does indeed explain everything; including the failure of the Auro nom (with Auro being Drunk). I like it.

sorry, you like the solve that has

you

as scum?

[Nahdia]

need Elbirn to boldtext the command.

[Nahdia]

he didn't write it in bold.

[Nahdia]

is it... over?

[Nahdia]

if im being honest, there's a small part of me that hopes it isn't. ive hyped up this me vs Elements LyLo so much in my head

[Nahdia]

hey auro, are you ready for me to accuse u of being partners with Elements?

[Nahdia]

Elbirn/Elements: Positive

Which doesn't really help. Another negative could have confirmed me drunk. Bah.

[Nahdia]

I had thought about writing out some big grand post in prep for this, but I didn't. Because laziness.

Look, I know this game has been hard to follow at times. But starting from here hopefully we can all read closely.

So here's the first important bit. Unless you believe Elbirn actually nailed insomnia's role by sheer luck (or insomnia softed and never told us and Elbirn noticed), he's not demon. Spy is possible, but a spy means there's no poisoner. And that's too many role malfunctions (Elements, myself, Auro) for him to be partnered with Drixx or insomnia (the people who could hav epossibly passed on the imp role).

[Nahdia]

Question is do I nominate now and let it ride resolve right at 24 hours, or do I wait and people come in and speak their mind first?

[Nahdia]

I'm also just soulreading Elbirn as town. There's a bit of paranoia there as there always is in LYLO but... mechanically, it just seems so wild.

[Nahdia]

eh

i would agree, except i actually think A50's iso is fully of anti-associatives with elements.

[Nahdia]

and remember, if a50 and elements are partnered, you and auro need to be poisoned&drunk. possible, but the scenario is tight.

also consider a50 opened yesterday with a nomination on elements and voted to execute Blatant Scum on d1 before ame replaced in.

and that he's basically said he's gonna be gunning for elements today.

[Nahdia]

well, yes.

[Nahdia]

don't get me wrong. i'd love for you to have an alternate interpretation of their association. but i just don't see it. especially if a50 sticks to his prior positions and goes for Elements today. and i'm not gonna try and bend the truth to get you on my side.

i'm assuming you're not arguing that you're demon tho

wouldn't that be something.

i am not the demon.

[Nahdia]

you don't gotta pull your punches, friend Auro.

[Nahdia]

yea i know that's possible. my point is that he didnt start spy and become demon later.

[Nahdia]

About to go to sleep. Want to think more before I nominate. I leave you with this:

suppose I am town, Auro. In my position, who do you lynch yesterday?

[Nahdia]

@insomnia

Did you soft your role at all in the public thread before we all claimed to Firebringer?

[Nahdia]

Nahdia, you seem to be suggesting teams where I'm the demon and then saying how they're very unlikely. I'm not entirely understanding your plan here.

Hence the nightmare I find myself in.

Nothing here seems likely at all. You and Elbirn individually, absent of any teammate, don't seem likely as demon to me.

Is there a list of all the night actions so we can puzzle out the mechanics of who the drunk could be or whatever?

Literally someone help me make good decisions today

I'll try to lay things out but the short version is there are no mechanical clears here. The only partial clear is your marking insomnia as monk. You can't have known that as spy and then became demon later due to how night actions have worked out. So if you're scum, either you're partners with demon!Elements or you got very lucky.

[Nahdia]

N0 Elements got that 0 neigbors are scum, I'm pretty sure.

[Nahdia]

It was 0, then 2, then 1, and then we odn't know.

[Nahdia]

However useless it is, I don't particularly like that Elements didn't immediately claim their result and instead says they don't know what my "plan" is. Scum have plans, so maybe the implication is that they're seeing me as scum, but what a weird way to say it!

[Nahdia]

my dastardly plan:

find and execute the demon

As long as we want to talk about mechanics, let's discuss what my results mean:

Possibilities

1. Almost50 is the poisoner.
   
2. Nahdia is the drunk.
   
3. Nahdia is the demon.

If demon and minion are alive today the game would be over correct? Or does that not work due to the rules and the dead all still holding their votes???

Like please let me conclude that only the demon is alive and nahdia/elements can't be a team

Unfortunately, that's not correct. Because of the dead holding their votes, the demon and minion could still be overrode today even if they're both alive.

Request PT with Nahdia

Huh.

Accept

[Nahdia]

There actually are some Elements' results that are very interesting. So I insist he shares them at the first opportunity.

[Nahdia]

1 neighbor is the least interesting possible result

[Nahdia]

0 neighbors: You're hardclaiming drunk. Elbirn becomes conftown to A50. From my perspective, there has to be at least one scum in yourself/A50.

2 neighbors: Either I'm teamed with spy!Elbirn (Auro is drunk in this scenario) or you're drunk.

[Nahdia]

wait no auro isn't drunk in that scenario. uhhhh idk.

[Nahdia]

In that scenario you're still drunk, aren't you. So yeah, either other result would have been a drunk hardclaim.

[Nahdia]

@Nahdia: Fire counts as a neighbor to him overnight, no? So that taints it anyway...

oh, does he? probably.

eh, idk. a 0 still woulda been nice. that's why i wanted the result.

[Nahdia]

Skitter or A50 could have been a poisoner on Auro n1. Or myself/Elements could have been a poisoner with Drixx imp passing to us.

[Nahdia]

Elbirn where are you at? I'm pretty positive I'm nominating and pushing Elements here, but I don't want to rush things. Especially since that'll put a 72 hour timer on whether people vote there or not.

[Nahdia]

well actually, Elements couldn't have been an imp pass because of my previous result. I can be a pass though.

[Nahdia]

@insomnia

Did you soft your role at all in the public thread before we all claimed to Firebringer?

I think I did but it’s like really subtle

I implied I was an important role I think but I didn’t soft Monk

alright, probably not worth pursuing.

Elbirn where are you at? I'm pretty positive I'm nominating and pushing Elements here, but I don't want to rush things. Especially since that'll put a 72 hour timer on whether people vote there or not.

I may have an inkling of an idea of which of you is scum but I'd rather feign ignorance and let you both vie for my favor so I can get an even better idea of who is scum

Because my instincts are always wrong apparently so by all means sell me

All I know is if you two are BOTH scum...then what? You two can't get me executed today. So. Uhm. Make sure team towns dead save enough votes to execute the last survivor tomorrow?? Or why would the game not just end if theres only one alive person. Bleh.

I don't think it's possible for you two to be the team I have to believe that okay let's go why is elements scum dude?

I mean, I've been townreading Elements until today, so that's a hard question. I can give you reasons

I'm

town, and juxtapose them with the reasons people have been townreading Elements (it's mostly Ame's entrance and their saying we're in auto).

I'll go back over some of Ame's stuff and see if I can recontextualize it.

[Nahdia]

Alright, I'll bite.

Requesting PT with Auro

I had given some thought to strategy as well, though I didn't do much research. I was gonna jump in and say I think we should consider having the Outsiders claim. The possibilities are:

1 claim: That person is clear, we know someone is drunk.
2 claims: Either one of them is scum and there is a drunk, or both are the Outsiders.
3 claims: We know there are no drunks, we know one of the three is scum.
4 claims: As above, but everyone who didn't claim is clear.

Thoughts?

Order of Not Outsider claims:

Auro (5)
Elbirn (230)
A50 (282)
skitter (413)
Nahdia (431)
Drixx (487)
insomnia (592)
Ame (1207)


This is worth taking note of. I realize you need to take anything I say on myself with a grain of salt, but in

no fucking world

do I not claim outsider unless I'm confident my partner is going to. Even then, I probably just claim outsider anyway. The only people who claimed after me were Drixx (if you think we're partners, fucking lol) and two people who claimed directly upon re-entry to the game. I was the one that laid out the outsider claim strategy. I clearly understood the possibilty of giving us a conftownie. So why would I let that happen as scum, considering how late my own claim was?

@Mod - why is my PT with firebringer still locked?

PT's only last that day phase. You need to re-request them each day.

[Nahdia]

Elbirn I hope you know my soul hurts because I'm going through Ame's ISO and this is all so fucking towny and I'm trying to find angles to explain how it could be scum.

[Nahdia]

Is that your poetic way of saying you're going to be voting to lynch me?

[Nahdia]

So there's no reality in which I'm town and convince you to lynch Elements, huh? Dang.

Gonna look back at Ame's auto stuff.

[Nahdia]

Honestly it makes me really disappointed Ame isn't still here so I can't ask them about old stuff in their ISO.

viewtopic.php?p=11884743&user_select%5B ... #p11884743 so this is where Ame says we're in auto. Their logic is that insomnia/Elbirn/Firebringer are all clear, and A50 is clear of being demon. So demon is in Nahdia/Auro/Ame.

The way they realize it wasn't auto was that they thought my role must be malfunctioning (they claimed to not know about the red herring mechanic), indicatinga poisoner must be present if I'm town. Therefore, A50 wasn't the scarlet woman from their pov?

idk, it's hard going back and parsing the places we were.

[Nahdia]

Worth noting, A50 can't be Elements' scarlet women. Too many malfunctions again.

[Nahdia]

it's very disconcerting!

[Nahdia]

I mean, my own doubts remain unassuaged but at this point I think I just tumble into my own abyss.

I'm gonna nom Elements soon. Does anyone like, want to ask me anything before I do that?

[Nahdia]

Mechanical likelihood of Elbirn being demon is based on the chance he would correctly guess the role that either Ame or insomnia has.

From the perspective of the demon trying to guess that:
Remove self and minion from the pool. Firebringer, Drixx, and Auro had roleclaimed. That leaves 4 slots, of which you can pick two, assuming one of Drixx/Auro isn't your minion.
As for the role, the demon knows three townsfolk roles that aren't in the game. They also know Undertaker and Virgin have already been claimed. That leaves 8 possibilities.

[Nahdia]

So yes, it's quite a low chance. Unless there's some detail we're missing.

It is possible they were just counting on being able to claim drunk since they also nommed Auro. But I... just don't think so, I guess. If that was his plan, mad respect to Elbirn, because it paid off in spades.

[Nahdia]

Yeah it does feel like there are waaaay less risky claims to make as demon here.

[Nahdia]

Consider Ame's entrance again. Recontextualize it as scum entering the game:

The townsfolk roles that we know are not in the game: Librarian, Investigator, Ravenkeeper, Slayer, Mayor
Add to that Empath, which Ame ended up claiming.

The demon is given a list of three safeclaims. Let's assume demon!Ame is given Empath among those.

Librarian and Investigator are inherently risky claims. Mayor is a scummy claim and might be avoided...

actually, i just noticed something. 1 sec.

[Nahdia]

I think I get every role but Chef and Spy. Isn't there only one pair of evil players? And what is the Grimoire?

So then scum has to be in the top 5 players.

Dammit nevermind. I thought these posts were in the opposite order.

at this point there's no way that the demon is already dead, right?

Only way that's possible is if Drixx imp-passed to myself or Elements. I thiiink both of those are possible. Elbirn can't have gotten imp-passed from Drixx, too many malfunctions I think.

[Nahdia]

Well okay, maybe there's still something there.

Why does Ame say they don't understand Chef if they have Empath, a role that works off the same mechanic of the playerlist being a circle?

[Nahdia]

Eh, that's probably nothing, isn't it.

[Nahdia]

has anybody played iwth ame before?
specifically does anybody know if ame has a big scumrange? because i kinda think she's clear on play ...

no meta on Ame, I'm afraid.

I'm in a difficult spot.

I have one player near-clear on mechanics, and one player near-clear on towniness.
Do I disregard my own reads, and execute Ame? Or do I look past the mechanical unlikelihood, and execute Elbirn?

[Nahdia]

Normally I would say disregard my own reads. That probably

is

what I'm going to say, especially considering I townread Elbirn as well. Though in fairness, I have been owned by Elbirn before.

[Nahdia]

Does it? Where?

[Nahdia]

I had forgotten about that. Auro, you seemed to notice Elbirn softing their role or something, right? The halcyon era of Day 1 is a foggy memory. Remind me?

[Nahdia]

will yall get mad if i nominate elements rn?

[Nahdia]

will yall get mad if i nominate elements rn?

yes, and i was wondering if you'd ask that once i indicated i was leaning towawrds ame/elements ...

well it sounds like you're coalescing. do you need more than 72 hours?

why do you want me to delay?

[Nahdia]

Out of curiosity, isn't A50 confirmed scum to you guys - so what matters is who his likely partner is out of the three?

i dont consider a50 confscum.

[Nahdia]

as i've pointed out, it really doesn't.

[Nahdia]

if you consider a50 100% confscum, you should probably be voting me.

[Nahdia]

I agree. Hence wanting to just... push the big red button and make peace with my final answer.

[Nahdia]

It's not! But I wouldn't hold it against you if you came to that conclusion.

[Nahdia]

Normally I would get defensive. But in this case, there's strong reasons for everyone being town.

Also, I did kind of nominate you day 1.

[Nahdia]

yup. i mean, i'm at peace with my answer now. but im willing to wait a bit for people to be ready.

[Nahdia]

I agree. Hence wanting to just... push the big red button and make peace with my final answer.

Why are you not more confident in elements-scum

It seems like the only answer from your PoV

has anybody played iwth ame before?
specifically does anybody know if ame has a big scumrange? because i kinda think she's clear on play ...

no meta on Ame, I'm afraid.

I'm in a difficult spot.

I have one player near-clear on mechanics, and one player near-clear on towniness.
Do I disregard my own reads, and execute Ame? Or do I look past the mechanical unlikelihood, and execute Elbirn?

[Nahdia]

I do. But Ame spewed town.

[Nahdia]

I guess the difference between my read on Ame/Elements and my read on you is that with Ame, I can point to very specific things and say "this is town posting". With you it's more been an attitude you've held that feels consistent/genuine. And I have more paranoia that that style of read could be wrong.

But I'm still gonna be voting Elements.

[Nahdia]

BS kind of just site flaked, to be fair.

The towny Ame stuff was the manner in which they claimed as soon as they entered, and their insistence we were in auto (ironically, if we had followed their proposed auto... we wouldn't be in this situation. Though who is to say we wouldn't have aborted at some point).

Can I nominate Elements now?

[Nahdia]

im gonna do it. im gonna do it!!!

[Nahdia]

btw a50 i for one think you should still vote (for elements!)

[Nahdia]

whoops.

sorry, a lot going on today.

[Nahdia]

HURT: Elements

[Nahdia]

do it.

[Nahdia]

ame presents the auto and then instantly nominates me, the town investigative. who is to say she wasnt planning on breaking it after my flip doesn't end the game?

[Nahdia]

oh you'll be surprised alright.

[Nahdia]

The heals are pointless.

Elements can nominate me after, and dead can override our threshold if they all vote me.

People should really declare their intentions one way or another.

[Nahdia]

Actually, if we get only 2 votes, town is in autoloss.

A tie means no one is executed. And demon/minion will obviously both vote me to tie it up, at the very least.

[Nahdia]

@mod Given the nature of where we are in the game, can you please prod the dead?

Would be really ridiculous if we entered autoloss bc people lost energy for this. Vote one way or the other. Abstaining is anti-town, here.

[Nahdia]

I will legit be furious if this game ends with a loss because people were too scared or too lazy to make a decision.

Heal if you must, but you must vote.

[Nahdia]

I think it'll happen when this one runs out? Either that or Xtoxm just won't count it.

[Nahdia]

Actually, if we get only 2 votes, town is in autoloss.

A tie means no one is executed. And demon/minion will obviously both vote me to tie it up, at the very least.

@mod Given the nature of where we are in the game, can you please prod the dead?

Would be really ridiculous if we entered autoloss bc people lost energy for this. Vote one way or the other. Abstaining is anti-town, here.

I will legit be furious if this game ends with a loss because people were too scared or too lazy to make a decision.

Heal if you must, but you must vote.

quoting all this for new page.

everyone must weigh in before the current execution deadline in 21 hours.

[Nahdia]

Actually, if we get only 2 votes, town is in autoloss.

A tie means no one is executed. And demon/minion will obviously both vote me to tie it up, at the very least.

Something feels off about this post.

it's a strictly mechanical post..? am i wrong?

[Nahdia]

And demon/minion will obviously both vote me to tie it up, at the very least.

Ah!
So if elements is town dont demon/minion just vote him here?

...yes?

my point is that scum have two ways to win here: lynch town, or force a tie. either one results in a scum win.

[Nahdia]

Actually, if we get only 2 votes, town is in autoloss.

A tie means no one is executed. And demon/minion will obviously both vote me to tie it up, at the very least.

Something feels off about this post.

it's a strictly mechanical post..? am i wrong?

drixx is probably gonna end up being elements' partner, huh?

[Nahdia]

wait no drixx was nightkilled. that's stupid.

[Nahdia]

no wait i can still be drunk for that to work.

god there's so much to keep track of.

[Nahdia]

it's not!

[Nahdia]

right back atcha, elbirn <3

[Nahdia]

this is your only chance to vote elements. you dont get another chance.

[Nahdia]

one of yall is scum but some of yall are just having some Stupid Fucking Takes

[Nahdia]

decide to lynch elements, or decide to lynch me. you decide now. you dont put elements at 3 and then deliberate on whether you want to lynch me.

[Nahdia]

that's fucking stupid. dumb fuckin cowards.

[Nahdia]

actually makin me mad. i didnt delay as long as i did so you could be stupid and not vote just so you can put off your decision. fuck off with that shit.

[Nahdia]

what is it going to take for you cowards to actually make a decision? im done with the reindeer games. take a stance already. dont just abstain so you can continue running around in circles and draw this bullshit out. you're not going to come to some magical realization by forcing us all to wait even longer

[Nahdia]

yup

[Nahdia]

well i guess technically we could tie at 5 if Elbirn votes to execute me as well.

[Nahdia]

but any town who opts into a tie is actually trolling

[Nahdia]

hey auro if you really want to help me you should vote for elements.

[Nahdia]

prod firebringer

insomnia pls vote elements.

[Nahdia]

if it's auro/nahdia you're throwing!!!

[Nahdia]

groan.

[Nahdia]

auro WHAT?

[Nahdia]

guy is gonna make yall paranoid and then unvote at the last second and it'll be donezo.

[Nahdia]

p sure it's not locked in until the countdown ends.

[Nahdia]

but okay, assuming you do in fact think it's not irreversible... what switch just flipped in your head?

[Nahdia]

okay no you're just messing about to make people paranoid. literally just admitted it in the pt. but now you'll deny it here!

[Nahdia]

ive explained this. it's NOT just two votes to execute. please listen to me, im not lying to you here.

[Nahdia]

the game doesnt end when this nomination ends, even if there's two votes. once this nomination ends, we move on to elements nominating ME. and if it gets more votes than i put on elements, only i get lynched.

if it gets EQUAL votes as i got, NO ONE gets lynched. and scum automatically wins.

[Nahdia]

so yes, every vote matters.

if there are only two votes on elements when the nom period ends, WE LOSE.

[Nahdia]

and it should be really fucking evident that im town because im explaining this instead of using the mechanic to my advantage, since clearly none of you understand it.

[Nahdia]

then what the fuck do you intend to do with the other dead votes?

[Nahdia]

sorry that i dont want them hanging over my fucking head. i want people to vote for scum.

[Nahdia]

i want every last one of you to vote elements so you burn your votes now, so we dont even have to entertain the prospect of lynching me. because that road only leads to a town loss. elements is up for the nomination. we can win the game

now

. this doesn't need to be drawn out.

[Nahdia]

auro isn't going to keep his vote on elements.

[Nahdia]

it's only sensical if you honestly think that more time is going to help.

[Nahdia]

otherwise it's literally just cowardice.

[Nahdia]

No matter what, there are going to be two votes on me.
If Auro is town, there are going to be three votes on me.

I would feel a lot better with at least four votes, ideally even more, on Elements.

[Nahdia]

ive asked the mod to prod the dead. if i have to, ill be him to extend this nomination deadline so they can actually weigh in and scum dont just win by default. im not letting this game be a loss on a techicality.

[Nahdia]

Pick me! I can answer that! He literally told me in his stupid PT he made specifically to freak you and Drixx out that I accepted because I'm a dumbass!

[Nahdia]

im in hell.

[Nahdia]

hammers dont work that way in this game v_v

[Nahdia]

auro will unvote. feel free to pile more votes on; he doesn't want you to.

[Nahdia]

at 3 dead votes, a tie could still be forced. but
1) you're going to unvote right before the deadline
2) i do in fact want to end the game before we move on to my nomination

[Nahdia]

Nahdia y do u get mad and call ppl cowards u hurt my feelings

this game has eroded my last nerve. ill apologize when the ride is over

[Nahdia]

if you're town we're going to have a talk about the tactics you've been using today. trying to influence other townies' votes by inciting paranoia is sort of similar to faking a cop guilty: it presupposes that only your reads can possibly be right and you need to trick everyone else into following your lead because they're too stupid to do it otherwise.

[Nahdia]

the wine. it is in front of my eyes.

[Nahdia]

firebringer better come back and vote!!!!

[Nahdia]

minion elements means elbirn yolo'd washerwoman from the very start. or ame tried to push an autowin scenario starting with lynching her own demon.

[Nahdia]

yeah i... have no idea. wifom, hopefully. there's a tiny part of me that's screaming to drop everything and push elbirn but like... naaaaah.

[Nahdia]

yeah.

so if firebringer being AFK and not voting cost us this, im calling foul and not counting it as a loss.

[Nahdia]

auro had switched back to heal

[Nahdia]

maybe this needs to wait for after the game but ill say it now as well. xtoxm, the mechanics of the nomination deadline wrt there only being a 36 hour window where someone can vote in a crucial moment is a pretty critical flaw in the design of this setup.

[Nahdia]

he literally used a selfvote as wifom. yall, this isn't town.

[Nahdia]

(he will, at the last moment, to make you think Elements doesn't have a partner)

[Nahdia]

like, the total flip makes no sense from auro. he's literally just trying to fake people out. abstaining from BOTH votes here is nonsensical is town.

[Nahdia]

if you're sure i'm the demon, you should be voting me. your stance is, again, nonsensical.

[Nahdia]

tired of cowards too scared to vote and scum trying to take advantage of flaws in the nomination mechanic.

Abstaining from voting you means an intent to let an Ele execution go through.

THEN WHY NOT VOTE FOR HIM?

[Nahdia]

stupid.

[Nahdia]

a stupid decision, then.

[Nahdia]

assuming you're town, you've managed to delay past the point where you can make the

correct

decision.

[Nahdia]

just as a friendly reminder: if you put me at three votes, you need to be ready to unvote if no one else joins you. leaving me at three votes when the nomination period ends puts town in autoloss, regardless of who is the demon.

[Nahdia]

yeah the town thing to do would be to explain his weird behavior.

[Nahdia]

abstaining is a bad move. because you're scum.

[Nahdia]

we can only nominate people once. for everyone who didn't vote in the last nomination period: you missed the chance to vote scum. you now cannot vote scum. there is no opportunity to do so.

[Nahdia]

abstaining is a bad move, because the options are
1) vote scum
2) dont vote scum

and abstaining is option 2.

[Nahdia]

except it puts a tiny margin of error on the vote. one town getting this wrong forces us into a tie. 2 town being wrong makes us lose.

if people had voted you, we wouldnt be in that situation. but instead, they abstained, and now i have to have this mindnumbing conversation.

[Nahdia]

Literally

Nobody vote nahdia. At all. No circumstances. Not acceptable. Because elements scum buddy is going to vote nahdia at the last possible moment and 3 votes = a tie = town loss

Elements is scum
Elements is scum
Elements is scum

pagetop qft

[Nahdia]

[Nahdia]

he's saying he was trying to manipulate people rather than actually trying to make the case for why he's town and shouldn't be voted.

[Nahdia]

yeah im assuming the current plan is to hope someone else votes and then the minion votes at the last second to force a tie.

[Nahdia]

hey guys like my new avi?

[Nahdia]

Literally

Nobody vote nahdia. At all. No circumstances. Not acceptable. Because elements scum buddy is going to vote nahdia at the last possible moment and 3 votes = a tie = town loss

Elements is scum
Elements is scum
Elements is scum

pagetop qft

new page dont forget it

[Nahdia]

Nahdia|Skitter

if you're right, you'll get to tell everyone "i told you so!"

(you're not)

[Nahdia]

is this a SCUM CLAIM auro?

[Nahdia]

dude a50

[Nahdia]

if anyone besides you is scum, you're game tossing!

[Nahdia]

if there's a tie, we're in autoloss. you better hope you're scum, or this is a Game Toss!

[Nahdia]

Literally

Nobody vote nahdia. At all. No circumstances. Not acceptable. Because elements scum buddy is going to vote nahdia at the last possible moment and 3 votes = a tie = town loss

Elements is scum
Elements is scum
Elements is scum

pagetop qft

new page dont forget it

home stretch qft

[Nahdia]

but what if i want to lead a surprise wagon on elbirn?

[Nahdia]

Auro you troll. Spare us all the mind games, for once!

The game not ending is because I'm not the demon. Now I have to decide if I'm nominating Elbirn.