Micro 226 - Mafia Under the Sea [GAME OVER]

[Grimgroove]

A compelling case indeed!

VOTE: phokdapolees

[Grimgroove]

ENOUGH!

VOTE: phokdapolees

[Grimgroove]

What do you think of it?

[Grimgroove]

Well, it looks like the jig is going to be up in a second, Gg.

I think KB/Cuttle's was Town. I think you're Town for the page 1 Gambit. I'm not too fond of yabba's reaction, though. I also disliked ac's completely ignoring it.

What did you net from it?

Not much, sadly. I was hoping for a reaction by phokdapolees himself to the event, first and foremost.

I fear it was also a bit too obvious. I can't make anything out of your reaction, because you obviously knew what I was doing. So you're clever and pay attention. This is good, but doesn't say anything about your alignment. You are awfully quick to give me a townread for it, though.

yabbaguy, I'm not sure. I wonder if he really knew what I was doing right from the start and was playing along (in which case I like him, and I like his reaction better than yours), or just pretended to know after your intervention (in which case I don't what to think).

Krystal Bald I have a diverging view. I find it very odd to spew out views on Malad3xion (which I'm guessing is gr3ycat) and ac1983fan, and not say anything about my action. There's no explanation as to whyy ac1983fan's posts suck, so there's not much we can do with that. The only way they refer to my action indirectly, meaning that they did see it, is as "they guess phok will flip town". But if that's what they really think, I'd expect more flak for hammering someone they think is town right now. The reaction felt calculated, unnatural and I don't like it.

ac1983fan may have just missed the event. He seems more focussed on himself right now. He'd be still null in my book.

So, given all of this:

VOTE: Krystal Bald

[Grimgroove]

What do you guys think of the idea of claiming our fish-species (flavor) through the Popcorn-system?

I may be going out on a limb here, but I wouldn't be surprised if the bad guys are the sea's main predators, forcing those predators to come up with another, less dangerously-sounding fish species, potentially exposing them if they pick the wrong one.

[Grimgroove]

It's not a given that the mod did so this time. As the saying goes: "There's plenty of fish in the sea". So maybe he expects scum to be able to come up with their own.

[Grimgroove]

My fish is a predator.

That line might work on the ladies, but not on me.


(Is it a big predator?)

[Grimgroove]

catching up tomorrow!

[Grimgroove]

Got back just in time it seems.

Stop voting for ac1983fan!

I don't know why he's been acting like a doofus with his strange typing-patterns, but what I do know is that

1. he is town.
2. he requires one vote less to get lynched. This means that a conftown is currently at L-1 !!

The next vote on him is a HAMMER!

[Grimgroove]

REMOVE YOUR VOTE FROM AC1983FAN IF YOU'RE ALREADY VOTING HIM.

DO NOT VOTE FOR AC1983FAN NOW, OR HE GETS LYNCHED

[Grimgroove]

On the subject of peculiar inquiries...

(Is it a big predator?)

...why do you ask?

Because in a way every fish is a predator, except for the poor phytoplankton.
I think scum will be the either the biggest predators (like sharks) or non-ocean life (like fishermen).

I do see the point that we might be giving too much information to scum by claiming our rolenames. When I brought up the idea I didn't think the link between rolename and possible abilities would be very clear, just because I thought there'd be no "doctor-fish", but wiki'ing a certain fishname could give too much information. So yeah, let's drop that idea for now at least.

[Grimgroove]

I'm keeping my vote on Krystal Bald, they did not really address my points raised in post 36 adequately I think. In 44 there is a response that, as correctly noted by shos (whose entrance I quite enjoyed), is quite scummy.
There's actually three reads of me in one line, and no clear opinion or counter-argument to what I said: idiotic townie, scum, decent townie.
I'll assume that at the time of 25 they were going for the "idiotic townie"-read, but even if you do think that, it feels odd not to comment on it. It is VERY odd not to discuss the derp who did the derphammer, be it in one way or the other.

Krystal Bald also falling for it at that stage (after yabbaguy and gr3ycat knew what was going on) shows a certain lack of attention and care. Yet despite this lack of involvement, they feel the need to provide some reads. Doesn't really add up. 25 is, everything considered, a very aloof response to something that was potentially quite extraordinary. After realizing the hammer was fake, the reaction was equally aloof.

[Grimgroove]

I'm here!

[Grimgroove]

The thing is, I know ac1983fan is town, so it's difficult to assess this discussion in terms of added-value. I disagree with ac1983fan's (how should your name be abbreviated by the way?) stance on yabbaguy though, Yabba has been giving me townvibes throughout his entire posting.

KittMo is kind of under my radar, as she didn't post much. I found her statement that I was buddying to people rather odd, but her reaction to the votes on her was decent enough for now. Bought her some time as far as I'm concerned.

[Grimgroove]

oh this one is much more interesting. despite my sorta scumlean on KB(mantis & ..?), what she said was correct and made me consider voting AC. but then, Grim comes and frekin claims two things over there that are very very serious, and then AC confirms.

Now, there's two options.
1. they're lying
Grim has a reason to either protect AC or he's taking a gambit and AC is flowing with it with hope to a) see what happens next and b) keep living (lol).
2. they're not
Grim somehow knows this info, which is very, very, interesting. obviously you won't say that you're lying if you are (yet, at least) so, tell me, where is this info from? why did you decide to claim it? do you mean he is like, REAL CONF town? and did he start the game hated or did you/someone else make him hated?

All the info I gave stems from my role PM: it stated the two facts I presented to you: ac1983-town is town (and given this is a non-bastard game, this makes ac1983 conftown for me, and for all of you if I should flip), and he needs one less vote to get lynched. This "hated townie"-thing was a decision by the mod and not by any other player.

The reason why I decided to claim it is pretty obvious: ac1983fan is currently at L-2, which in his case is the same as L-1. Putting someone at L-1 for added pressure is a common practice, one I wanted to avoid in this particular case because it would result in the immediate lynch of someone I know who is town.

[Grimgroove]

I crumbed my prior knowledge of ac1983's alignment by the way in post 36. Note the tense I'm using in my opinion on ac1983fan. "He'd be still null in my book". Meaning he isn't. He already was conftown in my book then.

[Grimgroove]

I saw you refer to that scumslip earlier, but I don't see it. You were talking about post [pos]41[/post] in your own post 52, but that's not even a post by KittyMo.
I did ISO her. She posted 5 times but only the last two were of any valuable content, the first three being RVS and an announcement of personal health problems.
I commented on the 4th post saying I didn't like it,b ut I don't see the scumslip. µ
I liked the 5th and last post, where her explanation for voting you seemed reasonable enough, as well as her stance on the role-claiming-idea.

It's a pity I had to expose ac1983 as hated townie already on page 4. I don't know how problematic it is, but I don't think answering your last question in this topic is a good idea. Let scum do the guessing on that one.

[Grimgroove]

Jumping to conclusions much? :p

[Grimgroove]

Okay, sorry about not posting last night like I said I would, I was too tired/lazy to do it. But anyway, as Shos pointed out, yes, I am a noob, so forgive me if I say or do something stupid (although you shouldn't use that as a reason to not suspect me of being scum). I don't really have anyone pinned as solid scum suspects yet, although the people I do believe to be town so far are shos (that list seemed to accurately describe the opinion of somebody who's town), GrimGroove (the fake hammer on me seemed like a town response to try to get some discussion going [

there's your response to that by the way, GG, I knew it was a fake hammer

]), and Yabbaguy (his posts toward the beginning seemed to be efforts to get people to talk, especially the posts about the wagon on me). Everybody else I haven't really seen enough to convince me either way. Also might as well take my vote off of Yabbaguy, and put a vote on the player who's only made one post the entire game, nickthename.
UNVOTE: Yabbaguy
VOTE: nickthename

Not liking this by the way.
Easy vote on a flaker.
And look at the thing in bold. It feels like a lie to me, or in any case: strange.
He wants me to know he knew the hammer was fake, yet he waited until now to say anything about it. He implies he was there at the time, before it was clear to everyone. Doesn't anyone find it odd that he remained silent during all this time?
Or let's say he wasn't there, which is what I had assumed. Why is he pretending to have been there, and to have known my hammer was fake? There's not much credit to be had from knowing it was fake at a later stage, otherwise this day would have been over when he entered the topic.

Fishy business.

[Grimgroove]

Hi mastin!

and I think KB is town.

Why?

[Grimgroove]

I hope not. My wiki-page is already looking red enough as it is.

[Grimgroove]

I also disagree with the "slot"-thing being a slip, but gr3ycat catching on to the possibility makes them (gr3ycat) very very town in my eyes. I don't think scum would even begin noticing something like this, simply because they're not looking for it or are not in the mindset of doing so.

[Grimgroove]

and I think KB is town.

Why?

Try pretty much every single word they've been saying?

Like, seriously. Their thoughts earlier in the game resonated with my own. Furthermore, their posting SCREAMS town, just as yours do. They've shown quite solid posting which looks incredibly town. So let me turn the question around:
Why them as scum?

That story started in post 36. My main gripe is him not commenting on me at the time of my fake-hammer, at a time where Krystal Bald thought it was a real hammer. It feels very...awkward and planned. Refer to 36 for further details, and also post 85.
Post 44 was the first reply to that. I found it unconvincing because he doesn't say why he didn't comment on me at the time. All they do is give their thoughts on me, something they should have done earlier. It's like calling someone out for hunting for feasants, and instead of them explaining why they didn't and come up with a reasonable excuse, they just start hunting when the feasants all flew away. It was a phonepost, but also afterwards their defense was quite minimal.
His 46, well, main gripe there is not him disagreeing with the flavor-claim-plan. That's fair enough. It's the comparison with buying a lottery ticket that doesn't make sense to me. How is that like buying a lottery ticket? Why come up with such a metaphor? It looks like a scum mindset to me, because as scum you possibly have to guess which fish isn't already a role, explaining how this would be a lottery. I don't see how it is a lottery from town PoV.

After my 85 Krystal Bald gets more heat, yet the first thing he asks is for info that does not constitute scumhunting, but looks like trying to wriggle out more info out of a player who should be conftown by then in post 105. Within a couple of minutes he does respond to my case, so I'm not saying he's ignoring it, but it looks like a strange prioritisation nonetheless. In 107 there's the explanation for not mentioning me when he could: he "didn't want to waste time on it". Yet he did waste time on expressing reads on people based on 1 page of RVS'ing. This somehow doesn't compute.

I'll share right away that my read on phokdapolees is also scum. And I see a scum-interaction in post 113, which I'd call coaching. Not a strong tell, but I wanted to share it. For my reasons to find phokdapolees suspicious, I refer to my earlier posts.

I've noticed you give out townreads quite easily. Is it just this game or are you a trusting person in general?

[Grimgroove]

Pity that neither Cat nor Kitty has a wagon, because I think we should start trying to corner the fish-hating felines.

[Grimgroove]

Yeah, really not sure why you're voting me when yabba pretty much claimed scum with KittyMo.

Vote: yabbaguy.

I already this vote in itself was rather scummy (jumping to conclusions) but then this:

B- mind if i unvote yabba? i'm really not seeing him as scum.
UNVOTE: yabbaguy
seems fair to say waiting on kitty's slot, without meaning that he has prior knowledge that she will indeed replace out.

??
yabbaguy didn't post between those two instances. And this intra-hydra-talk of "mind if I unvote" sounds forcefully transparent all of a sudden.

I'm not seeing anything town coming from Krystal Bald. Where's the scumhunting?

Let me know if I'm confbiasing, but I think I've got a pretty strong case here.

[Grimgroove]

and I think KB is town.

Why?

Try pretty much every single word they've been saying?

Like, seriously. Their thoughts earlier in the game resonated with my own. Furthermore, their posting SCREAMS town, just as yours do. They've shown quite solid posting which looks incredibly town.

I don't like this by the way. You basically said you think they're town in three different ways, but where are the reasons for it? Which were the thoughts that you resonated with? Why? Please explain.

[Grimgroove]

I also disagree with the "slot"-thing being a slip, but gr3ycat catching on to the possibility makes them (gr3ycat) very very town in my eyes. I don't think scum would even begin noticing something like this, simply because they're not looking for it or are not in the mindset of doing so.

Wouldn't scum be looking for any mislynch-worthy thing they can? That's why I think it's scummy - they're

more

likely as scum to notice something that pedantic.

Yes, it is pedantic. That's also why I think it's coming from town. Scum would be more self-critical when presenting stuff like this, but here gr3ycat, in his enthousiasm, really thinks he's on to something. Scum would second-guess this a lot more, knwing he's full of shit per definition, and probably not bring it up. And I can see where gr3ycat's enthousiasm comes from because even though in the end it doesn't amount to much, when I first read his comment on it I also thought: hey yeah, he's right.

[Grimgroove]

I like the gr3ycat wagon

VOTE: gr3ycat

Why?

[Grimgroove]

Krystal Bald's posting spree on pages 7 and 8 has left me underhwelmed. Lots of "hmmm's" and obvious questions. The fact that he ignored 157 but commented on more trivial things is not the only thing that rubs me the wrong way, but the main thing.

173 and the one after that he does not go into any argument I've expressed against phokdapolees, but just expresses a general disagreement with me, and agreement with phokdapolees' non-commital reads on shos and yabba.
Re: 174: "he didn't have to say he knew it was a fake hammer" : then why did he?

The vote in 120 has to be properly explained by whichever head in the hydra who put it there. The other head stating he didn't agree with it is not enough.

[Grimgroove]

I couldn't disagree more with 195. Might get into it later, but if you want the gist of it: if mastin says A, I'll be saying B.

[Grimgroove]

I like the gr3ycat wagon

VOTE: gr3ycat

Why?

Whats not to like about it? I think Mastin is town so I'm sheeping him

Don't answer questions with questions.
+
Why do you think mastin is town?

[Grimgroove]

Because you hadn't answered mine.
And I already answered yours before you even asked it. Check my ISO

Also, I don't think simply sheeping just because you think the shepherd is town is the right way of scumhunting. Regardless of the person, which ARGUMENTS and reasons do you like that have been brought forward against gr3ycat?

[Grimgroove]

I prefer not to talk about protective measures to be taken by someone who may or may not be there.

[Grimgroove]

Everyone, answer. if you were a cop, who would you investigate tonight?

..I ask this as a lesson from the last game I lost, to prevent fakeclaims.

phokdapolees, regardless of flips

[Grimgroove]

Not voting gr3ycat btw. Get on my beautiful Krystal Bald wagon please.

[Grimgroove]

I don't see why it's hopeless given it's the only player with a real case on them.

maston is gut based on his reads being so damn poor.
gr3ycat, the only reason I could discern was him calling you out on a scumslip that wasn't one.

I normally would expect more than that as far as cases go, so please don't force me into a compromise yet. Based on the above I'd go for mastin as well, just so you know that.

I'm close to conftown, so you'll forgive me for worrying about my case not being responded to, either negatively or positively.

[Grimgroove]

Krystal Bald, stop ignoring me.

Krystal Bald's posting spree on pages 7 and 8 has left me underhwelmed. Lots of "hmmm's" and obvious questions. The fact that he ignored 157 but commented on more trivial things is not the only thing that rubs me the wrong way, but the main thing.

173 and the one after that he does not go into any argument I've expressed against phokdapolees, but just expresses a general disagreement with me, and agreement with phokdapolees' non-commital reads on shos and yabba.
Re: 174: "he didn't have to say he knew it was a fake hammer" : then why did he?

The vote in 120 has to be properly explained by whichever head in the hydra who put it there. The other head stating he didn't agree with it is not enough.

Time to come out of your shell, Mr. Turtle.

[Grimgroove]

That attention shift to Guyett looks more like a desperate tactical move to divert attention than the result of scumhunting by the way.

[Grimgroove]

Not smart to drive up another wagon, risks deadline scrambling and maybe possibly forcing out a Town PR on the off-chance we're wrong. This is a fine lynch with conf-Town aboard, I'm absolutely fine to play back-seat this time.

Solid town-thinking I'd say.
I don't think I would have moved my vote anyway given what Krystal Bald had shown.

[Grimgroove]

Why do you think mastin is town?

[Grimgroove]

Why do you think opposition to the KB-lynch is a town-tell? It could as well be the sign he's informed scum.
What did you like about his initial postings?

What I mainly dislike about him is his counter-intuitive reads. At least that's what I seem to remember of it. Need to go into more detail later.

[Grimgroove]

Mastin, would you care to flavor-claim please?

[Grimgroove]

Mastin2 will be getting my vote for sure unless he answers my question. I want him to flavour claim.

When answering, consider this question is coming from a conftown so don't play any stalling-games wih me.

[Grimgroove]

Are yabbaguy and gr3ycat your only scumreads?

[Grimgroove]

What are the reasons you don't see phokdapolees as scum? He hasn't done anything.

[Grimgroove]

Time for me to give some info I guess.

mastin2 lied about being a swordfish. I know for a fact he's an orca. As the name sounds cute and so is Willy from Free Willy, it made me wonder about his alignment. But bear in mind that the other name for orca is KILLER WHALE and that mastin lied about his flavour.

I could check flavor as long as my Mason friend actfan was alive, and mastin turned out to be a mass murdering mofo.

You may proceed lynching him now.

VOTE: mastin2

For his buddy I'm leaning phokdapolees.

This makes gr3ycat quite town in my book. Not sure about yabbaguy yet, could be a bus by mastin2, certainly considering he's not voting him.

I'm fairly certain gr3ycat is town due to interactions, as well as shos.

[Grimgroove]

As I presume I'll be dead the next day, I'll try to get some more thoughts in before quadz gets here.

[Grimgroove]

Mastin2, why are you voting Greycat?

And why did your faith in me lower? =(

Said it before and I'll say it again. yabbaguy's probably scum, but look at the ease of the wagon. That means he's not the scum PR. In contrast, look at gr3ycat. Gr3ycat is someone a fair deal of people think could be scum, and yet, aside from me, there's nobody seriously pressuring them. Generally, that's the sign that they are the more important scum player. If one scum has to die, then it being a goon is better than it being a PR.

As for my faith in you lowering, it's overall much weaker play, presence, and overall, wording. Can't remember what off the top of my head, but something you said (or a few things you said; mighta been more than one thing) made me think "scum re-entering the game". Basically, you're still a townread, but my townread on you is at the moment a bit stale. Hence, lowered faith, not removed faith. Still think you're town, but I need to strengthen my townread.

This post clears both gr3ycat and shos as far as I'm concerned. The push on gr3ycat seems too much out there in order for it to be a bus, and his read on shos and his interaction with him doesn't ring scum-scum to me at all.

yabbaguy is another matter. Would definitely not clear him yet.

Guyett looks town enough.

phokdapolees is difficult to read due to lack of content, but I'll try to make something of his ISO.

A mass flavor claim should be considered at some point.

[Grimgroove]

Good game shos, I thought you were town but given tht you had another scum-faction to hunt did make it a bit easier.

[Grimgroove]

Pffff, that's six losses in a row now, I really thought we were gonig to win this one.

[Grimgroove]

I feel bad for Day 1 now We could have had a chance if we hadn't lynched Krystal Bald. Yabbaguy played well as well I think.

MY main proble was that I was assuming there were just two scums, max three, all in one team.

[Grimgroove]

This is the dead qt

http://www.quicktopic.com/50/H/Si56drp7SKZd

[Grimgroove]

But why do the cops decide to check you all the time, though? Ever think of that?

[Grimgroove]

Despite the sub-perfect set-up, special thanks to quadz who saved this game while it still seemed for town that it was worth saving :p

Maybe Human Destroyer abandoned it out of shame?

[Grimgroove]

I decided to keep this game out of my Wiki. I don't do asterisks :p