Micro 318: AP's Stolen Setup (GAME OVER)

Jingle · Post Post #3 (isolation #0) » Wed Apr 02, 2014 4:53 pm

/confirm

Jingle · Post Post #7 (isolation #1) » Wed Apr 02, 2014 8:53 pm

24 hrs. I'm bad at following directions, but I get there eventually.

Jingle · Post Post #22 (isolation #2) » Thu Apr 03, 2014 6:08 pm

Who is this ??? and how can I be on his team?

VOTE: Aronis

Obv Jester, sheep me.

Jingle · Post Post #37 (isolation #3) » Fri Apr 04, 2014 12:12 pm

^Who is this, I can't tell.

@ Lucky- Yes. Now sheep harder.

Jingle · Post Post #40 (isolation #4) » Fri Apr 04, 2014 4:00 pm

VOTE: Luca

Serious vote.

Jingle · Post Post #47 (isolation #5) » Sat Apr 05, 2014 6:26 am

I don't feel like explaining myself yet. We'll get to that later.

Jingle · Post Post #59 (isolation #6) » Sat Apr 05, 2014 6:56 pm

@ tool- Not really. He hasn't done anything of note, and we're not yet to the point where that is a scumtell. Though that time is rapidly approaching.

@ picturehydra- Is 41 and 54 hydra dissonance or an evolution in reads?

Jingle · Post Post #62 (isolation #7) » Sun Apr 06, 2014 6:29 am

I'm pretty sure it's obvious it was serious as opposed to RVS because I expected something to come out of it. Feel free to OMGUS me, though, that will have very little impact.

Jake and Lucky, what are your brain noises regarding Van, MTD, and Luca?

Aronis, I expect more spamposting from townyou. Please rectify this situation.

Jingle · Post Post #66 (isolation #8) » Sun Apr 06, 2014 3:06 pm

^Do you maybe have plans to change that? We've got enough players sitting there being lumps that I need some activity here, and saying nothings happening isn't going to help.

I'll wait to see if lucky plans on answering before explaining myself I think, but suffice to say I have more reasons for that trio in particular than I did on the initial luca vote.

Jingle · Post Post #70 (isolation #9) » Sun Apr 06, 2014 4:31 pm

@ Aronis- Cute. I don't care that you're apparently voting me twice now. Well done on the pressure front, but there is magic in the air here and I'm too interested in where the rabbit hole leads to explain the garden it started in. We can start pursuing lurkers as scum in the morning (RL time), but for now there are too many of them to poke for them all to be scum.

@Tool- Your question implies you expect me to have an opinion on Lucky at this point. That implies you have an opinion. Care to share?

Jingle · Post Post #73 (isolation #10) » Sun Apr 06, 2014 4:47 pm

Oh and also,

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Turkish Van

More seriouser vote.

Jingle · Post Post #76 (isolation #11) » Sun Apr 06, 2014 5:05 pm

I want an answer to 59 before I explain my reasoning, but basically it boils down to two things:

1. I think there is a good chance the picture hydra is scum for reasons.
2. I think that the picture hydra is higher priority to work out their alignment than Luca.

On the Luca front, the vote was mostly just looking for reactions and voting for the person who was least townish of the more active players.

Jingle · Post Post #82 (isolation #12) » Mon Apr 07, 2014 8:58 am

If Aronis is actually a doublevoter, that puts me at L-1.

I'll post more when I get off work, but be aware that derphammers will not be tolerated.

Jingle · Post Post #101 (isolation #13) » Mon Apr 07, 2014 4:02 pm

Turkish Van (41) and MTD (43) were both quick to jump to Luca's defense before asking for reasons, which seems odd to me. Van then did a 180 on Luca after hunting for a reason I might have been scumreading him (45) and coming up with, as best I can tell, active lurking, and only active lurking, at a time with very little to interact with ITT. That interaction and 77 are very much treating me like town and disregarding the possibility that I am scum, which is something only scum and I can take for granted, raising my hackles a bit.

Also, to the best of my knowledge, the total sum of my experience with the heads of the hydra is reading a PA scumgame while it happened without playing in it and replacing mala in a scumslot, so I have no idea what the point of the end of 80 is.

Aronis is acting the same as I expect him to act and being semiserious. Most of his behavior so far is null to me.

Jake seems to be genuine in his frustration over being called a lurker, which is making my gut lean town. He was also being open about his lack of decisiveness which I don't find likely from scum.

Lucky, Firestarter, and Luca all need more meaningful posts, but I'll let the firebird slide due to his V/LA. Luca has enough pressure for now. Lucky on the otherhand needs to stop fluffposting and play the game.

MTD is doing a lot of townhunting and not a lot of scumhunting. Personally I find townhunting to be easier to fake as scum than scumhunting, so I'm a little hesitant here. MTD, of the players, who do you think is most likely to be scum?

Tool reads as town to me, but I'm pretty sure I remember a similar case from him when he was my scumbuddy, so I need to do some meta diving in that corner to see if there's some possible sunken treasure.

Jingle · Post Post #103 (isolation #14) » Mon Apr 07, 2014 4:17 pm

To be honest, I just couldn't be bothered to find which players I'd been asked about. Sue me.

Jingle · Post Post #106 (isolation #15) » Mon Apr 07, 2014 7:06 pm

Turkish Van wrote: Jingle, yeah, early game doesn't have much to interact with, but that doesn't mean it's not notable when the only way a player is interacting with the thread is defensively. If anything, the lack of ongoing discussions should make it easier to freeform scum hunt and not get locked into defensive mode.

Agreed. Also probably my biggest hangup regarding Luca. My biggest hangup regarding you would be your defense of him immediately followed by the pressure. Pressuring lurkers is not something hard to fake as scum. In looking back for meta knowledge, I realized you were town in the game I was thinking of, and thus my expectations of your play were flawed from the start.

As best I can tell I somehow managed to switch you and mastin in my mind. (Resistance Mafia, in case you care.) Your insistence that you're not a scary scum player is interesting, but you'll excuse me for not taking the argument at face value.

With regards to Luca, 90% of his posting is fluff. I find that very scummy. I'm trying very hard to stop with my tunnel visioning though, so I'm looking elsewhere before I try to tackle that can o' worms.

Jingle · Post Post #131 (isolation #16) » Tue Apr 08, 2014 4:16 pm

I'm sorry that I'm trying to address flaws in my playstyle. Other than that, as best I can tell, you're being stupid.

If you come up with anything you'd like me to address, feel free to let me know. Otherwise, you can continue making vague noises about how I'm playing it safe this game.

Lucky, any plans on actually contributing to the conversation?

In post 121, MTD wrote:
In post 116, Jake from State Farm wrote:ugh, this is why I hate people who avoid games
Not really important, but what did you mean here?

Why isn't this important? Don't you need things like context and information in order to scumhunt? This reads to me like you're dismissing jake out of hand and I don't see a town motivation behind that.

PEdit: If you seriously think your scum meta on me is worth shit, you should go back, read that game, and realize it was Jester-nightless. If I acted like that in my scumgame normally, then I'd be the worst scumplayer in the world.

Jingle · Post Post #144 (isolation #17) » Wed Apr 09, 2014 5:36 am

Just Unvote.

There's literally no reason not to. If his claim is unbelievable or he doesn't claim you can always revote him.

Jingle · Post Post #146 (isolation #18) » Wed Apr 09, 2014 6:02 am

I'm not willing to lynch without seeing something worth analyzing from Firestarter, in case anyone is excessively trigger happy.

Jingle · Post Post #167 (isolation #19) » Wed Apr 09, 2014 10:48 am

Christ guys. That was awful. Jake is probably still town, Lucky is terrible but I'm not sure about alignment yet.

This is what I see when I imagine you guys voting:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8pQAWOCofXo

Also:

In post 146, Jingle wrote:I'm not willing to lynch without seeing something worth analyzing from Firestarter, in case anyone is excessively trigger happy.

Lucky, if you're town you should be fucking ashamed.

Jingle · Post Post #177 (isolation #20) » Fri Apr 11, 2014 3:51 pm

VOTE: Lucky

Firestarter, any poignant observations about yesterday that you didn't get to share?

Jingle · Post Post #196 (isolation #21) » Sat Apr 12, 2014 6:21 pm

Policy lynches are debatably useful. Policy lynches in lieu of real scumhunting is a scumtactic. Jake, begin acting like town now, or die.

Firestarter has promised contribution. I'm not sure what your intentions as far as pushing him are, but you're definitely acting like you want to lynch him regardless of his presence. Might I suggest we wait to see if he actually does contribute before lynching him on that basis, considering lucky denied us that opportunity yesterday?

Jingle · Post Post #197 (isolation #22) » Sat Apr 12, 2014 6:22 pm

Also, homework for someone pushing Firestarter as a lurker. Go ahead and find me one post where lucky introduces new content to the thread.

Jingle · Post Post #199 (isolation #23) » Sun Apr 13, 2014 6:09 am

^Correction- you were acting like town.

Jingle · Post Post #204 (isolation #24) » Sun Apr 13, 2014 6:05 pm

In post 189, Lucky2u wrote:
In post 167, Jingle wrote:Christ guys. That was awful. Jake is probably still town,
Lucky is terrible but I'm not sure about alignment yet.

This is what I see when I imagine you guys voting:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8pQAWOCofXo

Also:
In post 146, Jingle wrote:I'm not willing to lynch without seeing something worth analyzing from Firestarter, in case anyone is excessively trigger happy.
Lucky, if you're town you should be fucking ashamed.
This is the last thing you said before night, and then you open with a vote on me today. Can I ask what made you so sure over night?

Also, how do you feel about MTD's 160?

In post 160, MTD wrote:If he flips town that lucky one seems reasonable I think, although hammering D1 as scum is, well, risky.

I'm not sure yet, but I'm leaning scum on you for being full of fluff and your terrible hammer.

MTD is also high on my suspect list, although I doubt you're scum together, so that's nice. His 160 in particular reads like he's trying to push people into lynching you and waffles, but you're scummy enough on your own that I'mma let that slide.

Given that the weekend is over, I find no reason to stop Jake from being the ravenous lurker-hound he is. Jake, you may proceed to push the firebird with no further argument from me.

Jingle · Post Post #233 (isolation #25) » Tue Apr 15, 2014 8:36 am

I'm pretty baffled about Tool's read on me in 229, TBH. I harddefended the shit out of Kaze in the game he's talking about, so I'm not sure how he got to me town based on me defending Aronis. I'm also interested that his reads match what I've said in the thread so closely. He's not ringing nearly as many scumbells as he did in that game though, so I'm still leaning town on that front. Tool, any particular reason you heard hoof-beats and thought seahorse? Also, let me know if you want any links to games.

My gut says scum is in {Lucky, MTD, and Fire}. Of the three MTD is being most transparent, so at the moment Lucky or Firestarter is where I lean. My patience for waiting on Firestarter is rapidly running out. If he hasn't managed to produce content before Jake gets back I'm all for power lynching him.

Jingle · Post Post #243 (isolation #26) » Wed Apr 16, 2014 6:38 am

Jake, are you implying that replacing out in order to further your wincon is acceptable? It's not. Ever. Replacing is because sometimes RL happens. If I ever find out someone is strategically replacing out, I will immediately blacklist them.

Jingle · Post Post #251 (isolation #27) » Wed Apr 16, 2014 4:32 pm

Jingle · Post Post #259 (isolation #28) » Thu Apr 17, 2014 8:59 am

Hey, Guyett. How do you feel about MTD?

Jingle · Post Post #263 (isolation #29) » Thu Apr 17, 2014 9:25 am

And what made you so sure on Lucky?

Jingle · Post Post #273 (isolation #30) » Thu Apr 17, 2014 7:17 pm

Guyett, please explain your scumreads further.

Jingle · Post Post #297 (isolation #31) » Sun Apr 20, 2014 12:54 pm

So one of MTD/Guyett is scum. Possibly both, but that's a nuts gambit.

Jingle · Post Post #298 (isolation #32) » Sun Apr 20, 2014 12:56 pm

I propose a massclaim starting with MTD and popcorning from there. This is LYLO, or can be assumed to be LYLO, so no votes until we're sure.

Jingle · Post Post #306 (isolation #33) » Mon Apr 21, 2014 5:46 am

Teddy, Vanilla Townie

Jingle · Post Post #307 (isolation #34) » Mon Apr 21, 2014 5:46 am

Tool, your turn.

Jingle · Post Post #312 (isolation #35) » Mon Apr 21, 2014 10:43 am

^Damn good question.

Anyone want to tell me why Jake was sold on Guyett, cause it looks like MTD scum to me.

Jingle · Post Post #317 (isolation #36) » Mon Apr 21, 2014 2:00 pm

He appears to be. I honestly have no idea what the plot of Memento is, but from my role PM Leonard and Teddy both sound pretty evil.

Jingle · Post Post #319 (isolation #37) » Mon Apr 21, 2014 2:07 pm

In the flavor chunk, yeah. It mentions that Teddy got Leonard to get his wife to OD on insulin to check his brain damage, and they later kill a druggie together. Definitely sounds like a movie AP would like.

Jingle · Post Post #325 (isolation #38) » Wed Apr 23, 2014 8:38 am

I'm really tempted to vote you MTD. Please tell me why I shouldn't.

Jingle · Post Post #330 (isolation #39) » Wed Apr 23, 2014 9:30 am

I'm going to wait for TV's analysis of teams. Guyett, thoughts on scumpartner for MTD? MTD, same question in reverse.

Jingle · Post Post #334 (isolation #40) » Wed Apr 23, 2014 10:19 am

I think the flavor in this game is probably irrelevant. I don't see how brain damage translates into IC. I'm not sure why a hotel clerk is BP. And I sure as hell don't understand why a different brain damaged guy would be a JK. In fact, Guyett's claim seems to be the only one that makes sense from a flavor point of view. On the other hand, I've found MTD scummy because of his actions, and haven't been able to form a read on Guyett at all.

326 doesn't lay to rest my doubts. I have no idea about flavor. The 2-shot thing is WIFOM and the 'guilty in LYLO' thing doesn't make any sense to me.

Dammit, I'm gonna have to see if Memento is on Netflix tonight, aren't I?

Jingle · Post Post #337 (isolation #41) » Wed Apr 23, 2014 12:24 pm

<3

Thanks ETL.

Jingle · Post Post #342 (isolation #42) » Thu Apr 24, 2014 1:15 pm

Guyett, are you still townreading tool? If so, why?

Jingle · Post Post #343 (isolation #43) » Thu Apr 24, 2014 1:29 pm

Also, PA, any luck on the analysis?

On a less game related note, I've got a really busy weekend ahead of me, so I'm probably not going to post between late Friday afternoon and Monday. I will do my best to at least keep up with the thread, but just in case

V/LA from 4/25 until 4/28

Jingle · Post Post #356 (isolation #44) » Sun Apr 27, 2014 9:15 pm

I'm way too drunk to make thoughtful arguments tonight, but I think TV makes a lot of sense. For completeness sake, I'm going to run through the other possible scumteams when I get time, but TV has been my strongest townread all day, so I don't foresee any worldshaking revelations.

Jingle · Post Post #364 (isolation #45) » Mon Apr 28, 2014 7:31 pm

I find TV and MTD as a scumteam unlikely because of their reactions to my Luca vote D1. If find tool/MTD unlikely, because tool probably would have just shut up and let us lynch Guyett. For that reason, I'm ready to

VOTE: Guyett

Thank you tool, I've been waffling hard all day on which one of MTD and Guyett was your partner.

Jingle · Post Post #367 (isolation #46) » Mon Apr 28, 2014 7:49 pm

And MTD and Guyett could be scum together, if we're looking for ridiculous options. Why would tool flip on MTD if they were scum together and risk a derphammer, considering that I was heavily suspicious of MTD?

PEdit: Fucking ninjas.

Jingle · Post Post #370 (isolation #47) » Mon Apr 28, 2014 8:46 pm

In post 359, toolenduso wrote:So I hope the third townie out there will vote for MTD, but I know that right now it's more likely to go the other way. I don't think there's much more to talk about, so I'm going to vote and if Guyett gets lynched instead of MTD,
well then I hope I'm wrong.

VOTE: MTD

This doesn't make sense from a town POV. Tool says he hopes he's wrong about Guyett if he gets lynched, but if Guyett were scum and Tool was town, the game would be over right now. There is absolutely no way for Guyett to get lynched as scum at that point if Tool is town, and a townie in LYLO would realize that.

TV, let me know if you want a case, but this seems pretty obvious from where I'm sitting.

Jingle · Post Post #386 (isolation #48) » Tue Apr 29, 2014 1:09 pm

VOTE: Tool

Policy lynch.

In post 1, EspeciallyTheLies wrote:DON'T RUIN ENDGAME FOR ME! Pretty, pretty please. I like the reveal, so just pretend it's not over yet!

Jingle · Post Post #393 (isolation #49) » Tue Apr 29, 2014 7:15 pm

Ehh. I see no need to unvote. TV can hold off for a bit and they seem reasonably cautious, so no worries there. I'll reread the pre D3 interactions to see if Guyett/MTD makes more sense, but Guyett/tool made the most sense to me yesterday. On the other hand, TV, I'm perfectly fine with trusting your judgment here, so if you're ready, I have no objections to a vote.

Jingle · Post Post #395 (isolation #50) » Tue Apr 29, 2014 8:07 pm

Nope. Just did some minor rereading and looked at the power levels of town and scum. I don't see a scum Rolecop with only a BP and IC in town. There's not enough utility there methinks. I think 346 from TV makes a lot of sense here. If you want me to reconsider, find me a game where MTD or Guyett pulled something similar to what you're trying to argue.

Jingle · Post Post #411 (isolation #51) » Fri May 02, 2014 11:24 am

Sorry, I hate getting prodded, but I've not got a lot of information to put out.

Tool, for reference, here's a bunch of reactions after I claimed scum: http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=23&t=39333

The point tool is trying to make is that MTD's second response to tool doesn't make sense, when tool fishing for reactions doesn't make sense. By his own admission, tool should have known the remaining scum. It is illogical to claim scum (which he did) in order to get a scumslip when his lynch loses him the game. He's caught, and lost, and he's doing an admirable job defending an undefendable position. Please hammer, TV. I don't see any argument convincing me at this point and you can blame the loss on me if I'm wrong.

Jingle · Post Post #417 (isolation #52) » Sat May 03, 2014 2:25 pm

Lucky was mostly a policy lynch on my part, because I was burned in Mini 1439 and did not want to see it happen again.

Jingle · Post Post #435 (isolation #53) » Mon May 05, 2014 7:35 pm

Thanks for an awesome game, ETL. Tool, I think you would have had a much better shot at lynching me than MTD to be honest, but you made a call and you made a really admirable attempt at arguing your case. Thank you Guyett for replacing in so quickly.