micro 372: game over

[kabooooom]

nope!

vote: myko

MUNITYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[kabooooom]

Oh also I'm a miller.

eh, then you re just a pain in the ass!

vote: AP

[kabooooom]

There is nothing confusing about my claim. I am a miller. If a cop investigates me, I will show up as if I were mafia.

what if you are mafia?!
and claiming miller is just a precaution, in case cop checks you at night?!

well you are experienced enough to know that if you are simple townie, this is only hurting us. so you are either miller or mafia.

also, if you want a fun game, just claim a pgo when you are a miller

[kabooooom]

yup.

[kabooooom]

. Also, he's probably town.

how?

Xay is mildly town

.

how?

Flubbernugget is possible scum, as is caled

again, how?


caled and BK, why not take part in RVS?


also, AP has to be lynched till day 2, unless he is playing obv. town.

[kabooooom]

Um. This early in the game, shouldn't that be the opposite of a town read? I'd say WIFOM again, but I've had a strange fascination with WIFOM recent history, I feel like me claming its existence in yet another scenario would be the equivalent of trying to put a piece into a puzzle upside-down and smashing it in with a mallet.

i dont think you know what wifom is? and however it may look like, i meant what i said. And i said that in early game cos later on if someone is being pressured or questioned or whatever, and i say AP should be lynched, it will look like im defending the one being pressured, or trying to divert attention towards AP.

but im curious, how does it look like a scum post?
are u sure u know why i want AP to be lynched till day 2?

caled and BK, why not take part in RVS?

got a problem?? >:T

Nop. its just you have actively taken part in rvs in your other games. makes me wonder why are you trying to lay low?

Wrong. He's taking a stance that advocates the lynch of a player with reasoning he can hide behind should you flip town.

Wrong. As i said to nugget, i just stated my intentions early, to avoid any misunderstanding later. And my vote is going to stay there untill i dont find someone more scummy.

This is exactly the type of push I expect to come from scum. On the other hand, Brood is a shiny new wagon full of promise and possibilities.

VOTE: broodking

so you think im scum, but dont pressure, question or vote me? but rather go for a unexplained wagon?

[kabooooom]

I investigated AP last night and he is not mafia. Thus he is obviously a godfather. Also, he's probably town.

VOTE: kaboom!

Xay is mildly town. Flubbernugget is possible scum, as is caled. I am limited access until sunday, but in the interest of not screwing the game I will attempt to post at least once a day. You're welcome.

Tell Tail Hart, be aware that I have a bit of a mancrush on your brother and expect you to be as awesome as physically possible. Should you fail in this, I will inevitably spiral into a deep depression and never recover. No pressure.

The positioning of AP's joke about AP's alignment feels off to me. The joke itself is obv tension about Miller's actual role that Jingle knows about. I sense a Jingle and AP scum team. The naked bw vote on me feels way too opportuinistic feels like he is looking for a quick lynch.

VOTE: Jingle

why does it feel like OMGUS?
and what makes you think anyone would hammer you?

[kabooooom]

quick hammer*

[kabooooom]

Town: Kaboooom
---^line of no return^---
Meh-town: Xayzeck, Jingle
Even more meh town, but probably town nonetheless: TellTaleHeart
----

Brood/Nugget scum team?

AP, i saw many of your games, but you have no post like this. however you mentioned that you usually forget, and it is for your reference. so can you just show in which of your completed games you have such posts.

Something makes me feel he's approving of such a harsh scum read so early because it was directed at him. It feels like a shallow way to get town points imo.

did you see me giving him town points?! did you see me taking my vote from AP?! No, right. Because i didnt give any town points for that.

On another note, that kind of play this early (aggressive over skeptic) doesn't seem incredibly town. Trying to town read bad play is anti-town at best.

firstly, no matter what your playing style is, whether is it aggressive, skeptic, lazy, active whatever. the thing is, you just cant say it later!
secondly, you are still new, with experience you will learn how aggressive play is better than others at any stage of game. besides, playing style is something natural.
thirdly, if you think my play is bad and all, and you are better then why dont you show any result?! all your posts are just fluff. none of them actually lead to a discussion. you just post to show that you post. there is no actual scum hunting done.

And I see next to no pressure on this wagon.

vote AngryPidgeon

your last post as well.

when you pressure vote someone, then you shouldnt mention in your post that you are voting just to pressure. Pressure vote looses its meaning.
infact, votes =/ Pressure. when you vote someone, you should mention where do you think they are scummy.
your vote is less of an actual vote, and more like fluff which you want everyone to think as you are scum hunting.

[kabooooom]

are u sure u know why i want AP to be lynched till day 2?

I cant even figure out what your are saying, tbh. Proper English grammar please.

sorry. I was asking him if he knows why i want to lynch you till day 2.

why does it feel like OMGUS?

When did BroodKing say anything about OMGUS?

he didnt say it. but it seemed like he voted jingle because jingle voted him. And Jingle voting BK at this stage of game wasnt opportunistic, it was more of a pressure vote. And he want even at L-1, so why did he think he was getting quick lynch.

[kabooooom]

AP, i saw many of your games, but you have no post like this. however you mentioned that you usually forget, and it is for your reference. so can you just show in which of your completed games you have such posts.

No, Im fairly certain this is the first time I've ever done that explicitly.

I don't forget to make posts like this one..I regularly waffle on reads a lot and oftentimes lose sight of reads I have that are actually good and that I shouldn't be paranoid about. I dion't see what is so interesting about this post. I am making a note to myself that Im not willing to question that townread for the time being because of any paranoia. I think your posts in this game have been rather open and I think your attitude is town.

you sure have way with words and know how to convince players.
coming back to your post. there was nothing interesting about it. you said you often lose sight of your reads throughout the game, so i assumed you must be using such posts from pretty long time, and wanted to check if you are saying the truth.

[kabooooom]

MOD: any news from Marquis?

[kabooooom]

Something makes me feel he's approving of such a harsh scum read so early because it was directed at him. It feels like a shallow way to get town points imo.

did you see me giving him town points?! did you see me taking my vote from AP?! No, right. Because i didnt give any town points for that.

Is anybody else having trouble figuring out who I'm directing my poats to? I really just meant that it was an

attempt

to appear townie to everyone, and not just you. I gave no attempt at speculation as to how affective this attempt was, nor do I think it matters.

On another note, that kind of play this early (aggressive over skeptic) doesn't seem incredibly town. Trying to town read bad play is anti-town at best.

firstly, no matter what your playing style is, whether is it aggressive, skeptic, lazy, active whatever. the thing is, you just cant say it later!
secondly, you are still new, with experience you will learn how aggressive play is better than others at any stage of game. besides, playing style is something natural.
thirdly, if you think my play is bad and all, and you are better then why dont you show any result?! all your posts are just fluff. none of them actually lead to a discussion. you just post to show that you post. there is no actual scum hunting done.

I'm not sure what you mean by your first point. I might have to reread the thread to see what's going on here.

Second, the one IC that stood out to me the most through my newbie games was very reserved in the beginning off the game, mostly asking questions until day 2. I see their effective play as a counter example to being told aggressive play is the best with nothing to back that up other than learning with time. I kinda want to talk to them a little bit about aggressive playing to try and see where you're coming from there. Any suggestions on the best way to do that without speaking of this game would be appreciated.

For the third point, I mean, I got a pretty angry post out of you to say I'm not really leading to discussion. Perhaps we're just going to have to be oil and water this time around?

in first post i was talking about myself. that i didnt thought AP as town when he approved my post. but i get it now, you think it was AP's way of getting town points.

Secondly, when it comes to playing style, just play naturally. Every style has its own pros and cons. you just have to stick with what suits you the best. so lets just not call each others play bad.

Thirdly, yeah. you have posted more than many other players. but how many posts were actually helpful to us?
your post #54 was answer to my post. #55 was messed up. you think AP is scummy, but vote him saying you just wanna pressure him. #32 is just a simple question. None of your post actually add to discussion. They dont help in knowing other players' intentions.

For example, in my post #25 i ask AP to see what kind of answer he gives. in #30 i asked jingle about his early meaningless reads. now, everyone knows those were baseless reads. my reason to ask him was just to get more posts. did you see me asking same question to AP? in the same post i ask Caled and BK that why didnt they took part in rvs. For example, if Caled would have lied and said she never does takes part in rvs, then i would have caught her lie, as i already saw she does in her other games.

so you see the difference?
this is also how aggressive play is better then others. it generates more info in less time, it also helps rvs end faster, etc. etc.

[kabooooom]

So then, the IC I had mentioned would then be considered aggressive in your eyes?

if game has ended, copy paste the link here. i will tell if he is aggressive or not. if its not ended, dont talk about it.

[kabooooom]

Why are we talking about the intricacies of an IC's play from another game? >.>

nope. no one is including you in that chat.
move on!

[kabooooom]

So then, the IC I had mentioned would then be considered aggressive in your eyes?

if game has ended, copy paste the link here. i will tell if he is aggressive or not. if its not ended, dont talk about it.

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=58280

I'm inquiring your opinion on the play style to try and get on the same page as you.

ya, she was kinda aggressive i guess. i didnt read the game in any detail. but just questioning other player doesnt mean a player is aggressive. if she was pressuring and all, that would be kinda aggressive.

I am in no way assuming any authority upon you as to the validity of what you say.

This goes without saying.
my opinion comes from my own experience.

[kabooooom]

caled, you wanna vote someone?

[kabooooom]

Okay I can probably answer this better now. Or at least I thought. Then I noticed something else...

Secondly, when it comes to playing style, just play naturally. Every style has its own pros and cons. you just have to stick with what suits you the best. so lets just not call each others play bad.

...

so you see the difference?
this is also how aggressive play is better then others. it generates more info in less time, it also helps rvs end faster, etc. etc.

I'm starting to get the impression you just like hearing yourself talk. It's going to be a pain in the ass getting reads from you.

i was replying to your post.

[kabooooom]

I'm starting to get the impression you just like hearing yourself talk. It's going to be a pain in the ass getting reads from you.

Town: Kaboom, Flubber, AP
Probably Town: TellTaleHeart

huh?

[kabooooom]

huh?

Have you never seen a reads list before?

obviously i have. but i dont get it. how is that funny, or a pain in the ass in getting reads from me?
and how did he got from scum to town in your reads?

[kabooooom]

votecount

BroodKingEXE (4): TellTaleHeart, AngryPidgeon, Jingle
AngryPidgeon (3): xayzeck, kabooooom, Flubbernugget
Jingle (1): BroodKingEXE

not voting (2): caledfwitch, Marquis

BK has 3 votes not 4.

[kabooooom]

okay.
tell me why shouldn't i vote you?
i mean other then you think you are town.

[kabooooom]

I'm being open about my reads.

1) i dont know that yet. what if you are just pretending. it cant be determined in such a short period of time.
2) Your read in post #31 is fake. i checked your ongoing game(mini:1584 after 8th aug when you make post #31) and i see opportunities(calling someone town) where you can make such a post but you dont do it. it seems nugget was right afterall.

My case for you town and Nugget town is good.

not really. Both your town reads are voting you. And you seem a bit too confident about your reads this early, which i find odd.

I'm voting for probable scum.

So you want me to take my vote from you, but you dont want to show me how BK is scum and convince me to vote for him?
Which is again odd. And when i say odd i mean in a scummy way.

I'm a non-VT role.

Yes, there is no proof that you are actually a miler and not a mafia. how does this even count as reason i shouldnt be voting you??


now my vote is not just because you claimed to be a miller.

Also, if any of you guys wanna play this game with me, AP and nugget, you are welcome.

[kabooooom]

2) Your read in post #31 is fake. i checked your ongoing game(mini:1584 after 8th aug when you make post #31) and i see opportunities(calling someone town) where you can make such a post but you dont do it. it seems nugget was right afterall.

Don't talk about ongoing games, least of all ones which I'm alive in you jackass.

i know its not allowed. i thought it doesnt matter as long as it doesnt reveal any non public info. Sorry.

Mod: can you fix that?

Thanks.

not really. Both your town reads are voting you. And you seem a bit too confident about your reads this early, which i find odd.

Should there be a reason why I think voting me is scummy? I think you and Flubber honestly think Im scum. Xayzeck Im null on at this juncture. If there is scum on my wagon, its probably him.

No. Thats not what im trying to say. The thing is that both of your town reads are voting you. But you say, you are town. so our scum hunting way should be wrong, and if its wrong, why are we still your town read?

[kabooooom]

Using Occam's Razor here, either AP decided to claim a negative utility role that often gets policy lynched in a setup that might not have a cop for towncred as scum, or AP is attempting to play miller in the most protown manner possible. I don't see another possible explanation.

or he is mafia. and just to get free pass from cop, he claimed miller.

[kabooooom]

Early Miller claims are usually true and not scum- it locks you into that claim, so as scum you can't wait to fakeclaim in an opportune situation later.

AP as scum doesn't know what form the Town PR(s) take(s). It could be a Cop. But it could also be a Tracker, or something else.

What happens if a Tracker gets a guilty on AP? He can't claim Vigilante anymore, because he already claimed Miller (this is a micro normal; Miller Vigilante is very unlikely).

Basically scum has a lot to lose from a page 1 Miller claim, while claiming Miller instantly is the right play for Town. And this post isn't saying that he's Town, but rather that while the claim is in mind I'm not inclined to policy lynch him for it, nor am I inclined to scumread him solely based on the claim at all.

this never crossed my mind! :/

[kabooooom]

But what if he has a partner how does the killing?

[kabooooom]

No wait. That would still be a drawback.

p-edit: if Godfather gets lynched, you would possess a great risk when submitting a kill.

[kabooooom]

I will catch up and post today. Haven't got time to.

and

unvote

i think pokemon has a point. AP might actually be a miller.

[kabooooom]

v/la till 21

[kabooooom]

Will catchup today.

[kabooooom]

Been busy today.
have read the game, will post tmr.

also, ap is town.

[kabooooom]

I could real claim if that would progress things.

I'm a deputy (backup cop).

then why did you claim miller?!
you could have kept quiet.

and why are you claiming at l-2?

[kabooooom]

pops in occasionally to make non-alignment indicative comment, often just an obvious statement/fact
no self-investing analysis of any sort
purposefully detached scum

Uhhhh. That makes him a lurker. That doesn't make him scum. Not saying I have a strong townread on him or anything cause I don't, but this is silly.

but why cant pokemon pressure him?

what have you done to make him post more?

and why does pokemon's scum hunting criteria has to be like yours?

[kabooooom]

Tth- I will answer your questions once in done talking to ap.

[kabooooom]

This also accounts for the 5:2:2 possibility

I strongly hope that isn't the case. That would be a horrifying setup.

tell me what do you think is most probably the case? And if it not that, what is your second openion? Also state reasons for why you think that setup will be balanced.

[kabooooom]

I didn't say that he couldn't, I said that his assertion that he is scum is bad.

but its not like we were going to lynch him right away. Why are you defending someone(even though he is your town read) when he is bot at the risk of getting lynched?

Nothing? And you?

nothing. But unlike you I wasnt defending him/wasnt opposing someone who was trying to get him talk. You on the other hand were indirectly promoting, supporting and giving him confidence to let him play his way.

Because Im good at the game

plz! Dont be an asshole.

also ap,

you are neither at l-1 not near the dead line. So why did you claim? Your claim will make you a tagt. For mafia. If you really claimed miller so cop doesnt wasted his investigation on you and in case he dies scums doesnt kill you, so why throw your plans for waste? And even when you are not at risk of getting lynched?

[kabooooom]

mod: dont you think you are being a little bit(little bit only) lazy?

how about attaching deadline counter(or whatever it is called) with your VC's?

[kabooooom]

I could vote Kabooom Today.

you are standing on a very thin rope. Answers like this are only making your rope more thin.


p-edit: marquis is pokemon. Havent you seen that pokemon before?

2nd p-edit: lol caled, you remember that game?

3rd p-edit: is this your final answer ap?

[kabooooom]

tell me what do you think is most probably the case? And if it not that, what is your second openion? Also state reasons for why you think that setup will be balanced.

No.

I'm not going to go diving into setup spec, that was a mistake and I don't think setup spec is a useful idea right now.

we have 1 and half week. And I just wanna know your true openion. I will give mine too, so plz.

[kabooooom]

My phn bat. Is low, and IM going to sleep. But..
1) you were nit at the risk if getting lynched because,
a) you are at l-2
b) the deadline was 1 and half week far.
c) tell me which player, were you afraid who would quickhammer you?

I still have couple if questions, but later.

[kabooooom]

VOTE: AngryPidgeon

what changed your Mind?

[kabooooom]

I could vote Kabooom Today.

you are standing on a very thin rope. Answers like this are only making your rope more thin.


p-edit: marquis is pokemon. Havent you seen that pokemon before?

2nd p-edit: lol caled, you remember that game?

3rd p-edit: is this your final answer ap?

You need more newbie games in your life dude.

bitch plz! I have played more games than the sum if your completed, going and the games you have joined!

and this is how its played! You pressure the wagon you find scummy. Now the fact that everyone is voting doesnt necessarily means that player will get lynched! And if you find someone more scummy, you vote that wagon!

[kabooooom]

^^Yet doesn't actually vote or try to pressure a wagon. Just makes an empty threat as a defense.

nop. already did that. and i dont have time to play the way i want to. actually im going to replace out(which would be great news for you right?).

The reason it sounds like you need newbie games is because that's the only place it seems like it's 100% required to explain every read/motivation you have, and that seems like what you're trying to get AP to do.

well, you are wrong.
and because AP was my best town read! and i was totally convinced that he is town. but the time of his claim is really scummy( maybe not for you, but it was for me). And his reason for miller claim is logical but then the fact that he claims so early, ruins that logic. so i THOUGHT AP was scum.

note: While writing this post, it struck me, AP is town. because now cop can investigate him. if he is actually backup cop, cop will investigate him and get result not mafia. and it makes no sense for mafia to kill a backup cop, while real cop is alive.

But maybe I am wrong. How come when I said the same exact thing as AP in reference to Xayzeck, you brought no attention to it?

umm..not sure where exactly do you mean. mind quoting it?

mod: please replace me. sorry

and yeah, if you guys have questions, shoot. im here until my replacement doesnt comes. or atleast i will try to be here.

[kabooooom]

VOTE: AngryPidgeon

what changed your Mind?

Nothing. I saw AngryPidgeon on the activity section of the forum and I voted him in the hopes it would get his attention and he would post something. I was disappointed.

UNVOTE:
VOTE: kaboom

you know you should really do something productive. if i could, i would really try hard to make those 2 lurkers talk. and if it continues, i would lynch one of them and if other doesnt get a lesson from it, lynch the other one as well.

TRUST ME. YOU DONT WANT A LUCKER IN LYLO.

its best to get rid of them ASAP.

[kabooooom]

Not necessarily. He can say he thinks I'm lying and that won't get him anywhere. If he expects to be taken seriously he needs to provide some justification, his alignment aside. I think scum is actually more likely to provide justification than town.

not really. i have seen that

[kabooooom]

boo. We wouldn't replace this game

but i dont like playing it like half lurking
it will be better for everyone. i dont mind waiting until you get a active player. and i didnt knew this game's 'day' was 3 weeks long. i had doubt but i thought i would manage. so i didnt replace from the very start. im verry sorry

[kabooooom]

also i totally forgot reads,

town
AP
Marquis
tth
nugget
scum

also, dont let caled and xayzech play the way they are playing.

also tth, do you have any questions for me?

[kabooooom]

cos what u did was unproductive.

and is that the only question u have?

[kabooooom]

not ur play, just your action on me. just unvote and plain vote without anything. and not just caled, im fine with caled or xayzech lynch.

i cant believe did you just ask this.

i thought you had some better question. but i guess this is the type of question you are going to ask. so bye

[kabooooom]

Why did kaboom shoot me?

Well played, scum. I was wrong on the second one even from the dead thread.

well, they said keep your friends close, but your enemy closer!
with you in my stomach, you were closest to me

nicely done feirei.