Micro 650 Restart: Mislead 2 (Game Over)

[Vedith]

Who was scum last time?

[Vedith]

Infinity and Realeo. Why do you ask?

Doesn't matter, just wanted to know as I didn't see it confirmed.

[Vedith]

Realeo looked pretty scummy as soon as he was set on me being town imo.
Doesn't effect this game too much as it stands.

[Vedith]

Hey, Realeo, let me know the odds to you being scum twice in a row.
VOTE: NJAC
I'lll sheep you here and you sheep me in the maze.

[Vedith]

I like those odds!

[Vedith]

Not yet.
But you're different to last game.

[Vedith]

42 is probably by scum as well.

[Vedith]

42 is probably by scum as well.

Hmm, why

My scum senses... They are tingling!

[Vedith]

How, tell me why I should consider you as town, that will be a good start.

[Vedith]

Because I basically revealed my scum strategy, which would be pretty self-defeating if I were scum

But that statement is drenched in quite a bit of wine.

So I'm not sure what you're looking for.

It would be useless without the same scum though.
Unless you and Real were scum again, so that's all we got from that. Also the fact you could have made it up, it's not hard to have 2 plans of strategy.

[Vedith]

You wanted the game to progress. I am doing that.
Sadly you didn't convince me as on yet, not like Real with his odds of being scum twice.

Where's your vote at? You don't strike me as the player to not vote.

[Vedith]

Who's your most confident read?

Who's this aimed at?
If me, no one yet.

[Vedith]

You're right, I forgot.

VOTE: n_m

There we go!
So, RVS vote, or super serial?

[Vedith]

Probably that vedith is town, though that could change

Last person to say this was scum. :<

[Vedith]

What stands out on Infinity and NJAC?

[Vedith]

How is N_M an easy read?

Infinity and Realeo. Why do you ask?

These were NJAC's questions in the game so far.
Can you give an example how this matches to 650?

[Vedith]

Spoiler: NJAC Open 650

So, what was the key to succeed in that town win?

How so? And why is this relevant?

Where did you take this? And again why is it relevant?

I didn't say it was irrelevant, I simply thought you had a point at mentioning it. Do you have a point?

Is this a serious vote?

If you're getting "BAD vibes" then why aren't you voting me?

I disagree it's pretty obvious that Creature's vote is random. Why are you answering for him? Are you uncomfortable with me trying to get a read from him?

@Niceu: What are your heads as an hydra?

What are your thoughts on the game so far? Do you think the questions made have been useless? Are you still happy with your vote on Loop?

Care to explain this? Or explaining would ruin your secret strategy?

So, @Creature: you say they're town?

So, are you sticking your vote on Harko too long? Do you think he's acting scummy or something like that? What do you think about joining TNE's wagon?

How so?

Don't you mean Lowell?

@Lowell: why are you ignoring my question?

Tell me what I'm missing here, Creature.
Other than he asked a lot more questions here (Nearly half of his game posts were questions) just like he did in stack the deck.
He has 2 questions here, 1 implying NM isn't an easy read, and 1 asking why I wanted to know who scum was.
I'm just not seeing the connection.
I only argue this because you are saying that he seems town for this reason alone.

[Vedith]

I can agree with this reads.

Okay, why is Blade Dancer and Imperium scum?

[Vedith]

@Creature - 78

[Vedith]

All so quiet now...
Surprised that no one else is pushing Creature right now...

[Vedith]

You mean the fact he ignored me when I called him on it?
You're right, how is that scummy?

[Vedith]

He wasn't answering in hope to end the questioning over it. That is scum motivation right there.
So tell me, Infinity, what was your point there? I'm sure you had one, I just need a little help there.

Unless I read your signature wrong?

Scum tend to give bullshit reads that can't be backed up properly when poked at. Granted town do this too, but when poked I find it's scum that struggle to explain more than town.
It either leaves scum trying to avoid the situation, or they change their story.

So, would you like to keep defending Creature in this situation?
By your post, you do not think his read neither him ignoring is scum motivated or scummy in itself, correct me if I'm wrong.

[Vedith]

No I don't think either is scummy, and I disagree that scum often can't back up the things they say. I rarely say things I can't back up as scum, probably less than as town, and I find that pattern tends to hold true for most people. Scum are more careful about looking good. It's obvious you asked him a question, and from most scum's perspectives, it would be very unlikely for you to simply forget about it. So avoiding answering the question as scum would be incredibly asinine, especially since there's not much else going on in this game so the odds of you forgetting would be very low.

Hold on... This is different to what you were just pointing to me. You said to look at your signature...

"If something doesn't have scum motivation it's probably not scummy."
So my point was that there could have been scum motivation, you then change it to "Why would scum" argument. That's an instant change on what was being discussed.
Why wouldn't Creature want to stop me pushing as scum, knowing full well that I'll keep on and keep on? He made a comment that included me as possible town and it back fired. This is called trying to butter me up like a crumpet. I ain't no fucking crumpet, and as soon as I didn't just nod, he wasn't sure what to do. You also said it yourself, there isn't a lot going on, how would he have missed it? He also hasn't answered it yet, meaning that he is still trying to avoid it, and you are assisting him with avoiding it.
I'm not sure what games you have been it, but if you actually push scum and not just go "Why?" their fake reads struggle more than not. Even more so this early, scum are making up reasons to have reads (if they provide, of course) it's towns job to find which ones are forced (Oh look, I found one!).
Your argument that I wouldn't forget so he wouldn't do it is fucking terrible.
Let me confirm, it's fucking dreadful.

Tell me, why is he town for you with an in depth answer, please. Because he didn't answer my post? Because he's posting town like? Because he's your scum buddy?
As before, I'm assuming that he is town for you as you are defending him, instead of letting him engage with me, and saying that him ignoring my push on him cannot be scum motivated (in so many words, but you still said this).

You are either scum looking for town cred on him, or he's actually a scum buddy of yours. I'm set on this.

VOTE: Infinity

Lets lynch scum first.

@Creature - Feel free to answer my post still. I don't care if you have changed your view, you stated that he was town as he was playing like Open 650. Show me where and how. I'm sure you've had enough time to think of a reason.

I also find your conversation with Infinity fake and forced.

[Vedith]

No, it's not. Scum motivation isn't there unless you think scum!creature would be stupid enough to think you'd forget about it.

It's not thinking that I would, it's hoping that I would. Big difference.

I don't know, but seems more likely than thinking you'd forget about the thing you just asked him.

Again, hoping not thinking.

No, I'm not assisting him with anything. You were the one that asked why no one is pushing creature, and I explained why. Creature still needs to respond.

You are saying that him town reading someone for no reason apart from asking questions like another game (already dis proven) and him ignoring my post to him, which is extremely hard to miss isn't scummy. You are assisting him here.

If scum don't think there's enough to back up a read, chances are they won't make a read. You don't have to be a master scumplayer to do that.

That's false. As scum you need to play along the same lines as if you were town. Creature knows I would bring up him not making reads, as I've done so in the past.

Why?

Because it's fucking awful.

I didn't townread him before now, but the setup spec when no one else is posting looks slightly town to me.

Your comments indicate that he was town, since you are saying why would scum him do that, that was before his setup talk. So go over that one again?

I am letting him engage with you. I also want to currently tell you that you're pushing on something that's not scummy at all.

As scum, you really would say this.
It is scummy. Giving a town read and not answering why is no different to give a scum read then avoid answering why when asked.

Unless he's a complete idiot, right. And I don't think he's a complete idiot.

He would be a complete idiot to engage it on me more as scum, knowing what I'm like. So for you just to say "He's not ignoring you as scum because that would be stupid"
It's a scum motivation from what I said. As I said, you are either scum aiming for town cred, or scum trying to defend his buddy. Best thing you could have done is bussed it because I'm not laying off you two.

Pretty sure vedith is town, there's no reason for scum!him to push on stupid shit like this so early

Tell me, how much experience have you got with me as scum? I've pushed hard as scum before, why not now?
This is just you aiming for both town cred, and try to butter me up.
I'm not biting.

Because when I saw NJAC questioning, I thought he usually does that as town. I've checked one of his scum games and didn't see him questioning stupid things at the start.

He made 2 questions, and 1 was more of an answer. I don't buy this at all. The only reason you don't read him as town for it now is because I've made such a big deal out of it.

@NM, Real, Imperium, Pept, NJAC and Blade Dance - Get you votes on these.

[Vedith]

That doesn't make it any less stupid

Put yourself in scum!creature's position, would you ignore the argument hoping you'd forget about the question you just asked, knowing that you'd probably get called out for it?

Yes, I would... It's less of a chance to get called out of it then to reply with a very scum looking answer. Simply put, he didn't know what to say back to me because it was a lie.

If by "assisting" you mean call his actions non-scummy, yes I am doing that.

You're actually implying that he is town for it. Lets get that right for a second. You're also trying to divert from him being seen as scum.

Yeah and when you're town you make reads out of what's in the thread you don't pull shit out of thin air

Scum don't like to pull shit out of thin air. They like to make their reads based on as much truth as possible. Yes, that's a generalization, but I find it true more often than not.

Exactly... He made his read out of shit. I called him out on it and he didn't know what to say about it.
No, scum want to have reasons to scum/town read someone. Trying to fit it in nicely and not picked up on. Show me your last 5 games where scum based their comments on as much truth as possible, and I'll show you my last 5 games where scum made bullshit reads or pushes.

Lol

You know I'm right

Scum!creature would not ignore your post. So that means either

a)He missed it as town

or

b) He missed it as scum

Is that so hard to understand?

Explain to me what experience you have with scum Creature?
How could he have missed it? You said yourself that the game isn't moving, explain how he missed it? YOU ARE CONTRADICTING YOURSELF HERE.
Scum Creature didn't answer because he didn't know how to answer. Yet you are saying that Scum Creature would know exactly how to answer here... Explain that to me.

Lol, ignoring it is an open invitation for you to engage him more on it, and it's one more point you can use against him. Nice going, hypothetical stupid scum!creature!

This is false and you are giving a bad reason to claim him to be town here.
Ignoring it hopes that something else happens in the thread to distract away with it. You are constantly failing to see that he did not know what to say, but I can understand you not wanting to agree with that since you're scum.

The thing is, you're so wrapped up in your belief that you're saying that not only am I wrong, but also that I can't possibly believe what I'm saying as town. Are you listening to yourself? Just because someone disagrees with you doesn't mean they have to be scum.

Town does not say "He's not scum because scum would be all like I'm not givin' reads, shit yo!" - If you were magically town, then you're a fucking moron.
This is why I don't believe you would be saying this as town. It's not the fact you disagree, it's the fact you are defending his case with how Creature scum would act personally, which you have wrong.

I read quolls, you didn't seem to push on random shit just to look town iirc.

And lol if you think I'm trying to butter you up by calling your push stupid

Can we get more people talking here? I'm tired of going in circles without moving the game forward

At least you can give your reads on everyone else, vedith.

It makes me laugh when people go "I read 1 scum game of yours, I know what to expect" - GTFO. I have many games where I play completely different as scum. This could easily be a standard me and Creature are scum game.
You're trying to butter me up by calling me town, not stupid. This is you trying to misrep my comment. Nice try, kiddo!
Yeah this is when scum normally want to change the subject because I won't give up and it draws too much attention to them.

Town
Not_Mafia
Realeo
Imperium
Peptobislawl
NJAC
Blade Dancer

Scum
Infinity
Creature

That's my reads. And it won't be changing.

[Vedith]

jfc

I'll respond to that tomorrow

tldr It doesn't matter whether creature ignores the post he'll still have to come up with his bullshit explanation later

I'll give you 2 time to work something out.
Who knows, his response might just blow me away...

[Vedith]

@Mod: V/LA through the weekend.

Stop being useless and vote scum with me, thanks!

[Vedith]

I don't have meta with any of you so I don't know what you guys are supposed to expect from each other

I'm sure I've been in a few games with you (I assume Tammy, as I've been in plenty with Nacho).
Not sure what to think of this.

Infinity is basically calling Creature town for the reasons that I am saying scum. His reasoning is wrong and even started off arguing that Creature ignoring me wasn't scummy.
If that's not whiteknighting, then I'm Bob Ross.

What's your view on how setup spec and actions were last game to this game?

[Vedith]

Woo creature actually did answer vedith, just not o vedith said liking, so never mind my ignoring comment. Sleep now.

He never actually answered, he changed his view as I already pointed out.

[Vedith]

I really like this post.

It's gotta be either town, or super-tryhard scum, and if it's the latter it'll probably take forever to figure it out. So yeah. It does seem overdone in a sense, but I think it's more of a genuine towny effort sense than scum LAMIST. And anyway, the effort is exactly what we needed to kickstart the game. Actually, I should've made a post like that tbh

Do you really just spend your time with your tongue up people's arse as scum?

[Vedith]

Wait I forgot, he's my "scumbuddy"

Yeah I like to use the "I just called. Him my scum buddy so people dis believe it" tactic as scum too.

[Vedith]

You realise that I'm not doing any plan set by you or Infinity, right?

[Vedith]

Good luck developing a better plan then.

I feel pretty set on what I'm doing.

[Vedith]

They fail to consider it as they are scum.

[Vedith]

Everyone should just follow me.
High risk high reward.
Also happy for everyone to follow any of my other 6 town reads

[Vedith]

I hate to break the news. Infinity is town, Vedith.

Nope.

[Vedith]

Yeah. Scum is meticulous. Infinity won't vote me there if he's scum. There is something troubling about Creature but let me dig.

He even instantly unvoted.
Your point is stupid.

[Vedith]

That's the point. It's an emotional surge. scum!Infinity lacks emotion since he is following a plan.

If the one who voted me back is lane, well stupid argument. But this is not lane, this is infinit.

No...

[Vedith]

Vedith, in your view, is it possible for me to be scum with someone other than Infinity?

Don't get me wrong, it's possible for you to not even be scum.
It's just not plausible.
Same for Infinity.

Why can me and Infinity not be scum in your eyes? (Your comment makes me believe this is your view on it).
It wouldn't be the first time I'm trying to lynch a team mate for full town cred.

[Vedith]

@Infinity - This is the point you jump on your horse, buddy!

[Vedith]

In Hunger Games you said that you played a game with me where I pegged you as scum but nobody listened to me.

I was town in hunger games...

[Vedith]

Oh wait, I see what you're saying.
Yeah I've also been in about 5 more games with you.

[Vedith]

I don't know what you're looking for from me in the last sentence.

From here on I'm not looking for anything.
I have them both as scum and I'm not changing my view.
I'm not going along with any plans where it doesn't involve them both being scum, so that's that.

[Vedith]

I thought this was an answer to your question.

Ah, I thought you meant my original question to him.

[Vedith]

NM is town.

[Vedith]

NM is town.

Eh?

NM is short for Not_Mafia.
My bad for making it shorter.
I hope this is more understandable now.

[Vedith]

Titus, vote Infinity with me!

[Vedith]

VOTE: Imperium
Happy to distrust to give a proven town if needed.

L1

[Vedith]

Distrust

[Vedith]

But your plan means that NM has to go with it.
This way, it confirms us a town 100%, correct?

[Vedith]

I don't actually understand that voting system now lol.
I thought if they are scum then I take them out of the game but I stay in?

[Vedith]

Flee

[Vedith]

I don't really have much clue to what is happening.
Surely if Imperium is proven town and we get a proven town tomorrow, we can't lose?

[Vedith]

So what do we do now?
If Imperium is confirmed we can't lose now?

[Vedith]

So we can't do the same persons maze?

[Vedith]

Pepto and Vedith should probably be considered as town now, right?

No?

[Vedith]

Why Pepto?

[Vedith]

Scum can do that to look town though. This setup scum want to look town, not make town look scummy.

[Vedith]

Scum can do that to look town though. This setup scum want to look town, not make town look scummy.

Just like you did when you offered yourself to distrust?

Exactly. This is my point. Yet you said we are both town...

[Vedith]

Why are you asking these questions instead of reading the first posts of the thread? I don't think you're the kind of player that play in such an uninformed way.

Your only experience with me I didn't even read my result from mod right. Tell me again the type of player I am.

[Vedith]

You're right, I forgot that.

What gave you the impression that I'm more switched on?
Not sure I like the 180 turn around from you when I called you out for calling us town though.

[Vedith]

That's the problem, he does this both as scum and town.
Creature has fallen off the radar a bit for everyone!
I forgot he was in the game for 4 seconds then!

[Vedith]

I wouldn't say I don't scum read him. But I had a different idea of how the game works.
I thought that you vote for who you will action against and then choose your action.
I still really think there's scum in Infinity / Creature but the difference is Infinity isn't trying to look town, but rather trying to make others look town.

[Vedith]

I mean that you aren't trying to draw us to trust you but yet trust others.
Personally, I don't think scum would do that in the setup, as if caught out, it just throws the game for them.
Town cred seems to be at a minimal this game for reads.

[Vedith]

[Vedith]

It was a joke...

[Vedith]

over it moving then she's likely scum. In general I think she's more active as town so yeah.

Other than that not much AI for her.

Sadly, I agree with this.

[Vedith]

The ones I am unsure are: Titus, Peptobislawl, Not_Mafia and Infinity 324.

Why?

[Vedith]

He should really get a better understanding about how the game actually works but beyond that he hasn't done anything to alter my perception of him. Probably my strongest non-confirmed townread at the moment, though he hasn't said much in D2 yet and i'd rather like him to.

What do you want me to say?
I still don't trust Creature. Infinity might be town, Titus might be scum.
You and NJAC could be scum buddies.
I really didn't like people saying that you are almost confirmed town or whatever the wording as I don't see it.
NM can be either at this stage, it's really a 50/50.
Real probably is town, but he's a sneaky one...

[Vedith]

I'm

scared scum

paranoid town!

In fairness, I don't need an alibi to call you scum. If I think it, I'll say it.

If I was to decide on you now with a gun to the head - I'd say trust.
Personally I'm bedating that we go with either you or Infinity as town to give town a decent confirmed.
If I'm proved to be town here, I'm not in a situation to be conftable in my reads.

Creature Titus and NJAC should not be today at all

[Vedith]

Aww man, me and NM almost won!

[Vedith]

From what I know of vedith, I think he could just be weird like that

I'm not wierd. :<
In fairness {SELF META COMING} {SELF META COMING} {SELF META COMING} I change my reads as town a lot. As scum, I normally don't.

[Vedith]

Real trying to throw shade and end mine and Infinity's friendship! :<

[Vedith]

Neither of you drunk right? I remember when Nahdia and JeeReed was drunk and play mafia while drinking.

I'm not cool enough to drink...

[Vedith]

So you town read me for tunneling, then town read me for not?

[Vedith]

Well, this was our plan.

Day 1 I scum read Infinity he town reads me
Day 2 we town read one another
Day 3 Infinity scum reads me and I town read him
Day 4 we scum read each other

[Vedith]

How about this, we do Pept, Titus and Real flee. The rest follow.

[Vedith]

No!

[Vedith]

Follow

[Vedith]

If NJAC townreads pepto, you can't force him to flee. If everyone townreads pepto, no one flees.

This is flipping scum every time.

[Vedith]

Vedith is my town. Pepto kept throwing shade against him.

That was you throwing shade on me.
This is scum guys open your eyes.

He was pushing for a Pept over me so hard yesterday.

[Vedith]

Aren't I the one who forced you to flee on Imperium? If I didn't forced you to flee, you will be trapped for distrusting Imperium.

Town credit.

I'm talking about all day you were saying Pept is town and you were suspicious of me.
You wanted Pept over me from the start of the day, or am I wrong there?
You also tried to convince everyone to trust and not flee.
You're never flipping town.

[Vedith]

I'm going to work on this game tomorrow.

[Vedith]

Vedith seems to think the game is solved for him.

Easy game, easy money.

[Vedith]

Do you mind if I follow your path Vedith?

That's up to you.
I'm sure you can work out that Real is scum here.

[Vedith]

Can you leave a gigantic case on Realeo explaining everything throughout the game?

You act like you've never played with me before...

[Vedith]

That's why Real wanted to put shade on me yesterday.

[Vedith]

I can work on it more later but I just don't feel overly motivated to put additional effort in atm.
504
509

These are prime examples of Real being scummy.

504 he's trying to push for me and Infinity as scum here (not hard push, but he's going for it).
509 he's trying to say that I'm attacking Pept? He's making it look like that we should trust pept and not me in this comment. Trying to push doubt in Infinities read to think of me as scum, but yet he's happy to believe Pept is town?

We both know that isn't what town do.

701 - It was Real throwing shade on me though.
He pushes on NM as NM is an easy mis target here, and I don't think he's going to be scum here.

As scum here, he wants everyone following Pept.
630

The only post I recall that puts Infinity as scum is 297 - Typical scum play that comment to add in your partner.
Other than that, everything points to Real. Real had an issue with me town reading Infinity, and it's because the focus was mainly between me, him and Creature day 1. Day 2 we could focus more on scum but he wanted to bring it back to me and Infinity.

[Vedith]

504
509

My bad

[Vedith]

I mean, sure.
I suggest that you are done last.
NM should be tomorrow and followed by all, I don't think he's scum here and he's going to be an easier push if he stays in the game.
The other 4 give me no reason to think of them as town, that's the sad part. Real just takes the cake though.

[Vedith]

Why NJAC though?
He's my 2nd (3rd?) most likely scum.

It's just strong gut on NM. He just acts differently with his lurking when town.

[Vedith]

My question was at Titus you ninja!

[Vedith]

At d1, Vedith was pressured. I approach him individually by using Who Wants To Be A Millionaire analogy. It works. He flees.

That's not exactly true. But I expect scum to lie here.

[Vedith]

Yeah, follow me!

[Vedith]

Follow me Infinity!
Then vote up real tomorrow.

[Vedith]

Btw Infinity if you're scum then we're over. </3

[Vedith]

Thanks for the game.
I couldn't really get my head around the concept until after we voted trust on Imperium. I thought that if you followed on scum you were out of the game, so I was stumped when we were still all in it.

Would be interesting to do this again with knowledge of it now

[Vedith]

You can release the threads.

No I can't, I can't even view them.

[Vedith]

Not talking to you lol

WTF? Why not? :<

[Vedith]

Infinity broke my heart! </3
It's over between us!

[Vedith]

I tried, but I got lost with it and was trying to work it out most of it. :<