League of Legends (Old)

[JasonWazza]

Gratz

[JasonWazza]

It's not so much that he's maining FotM champs it's that they are making changes to items and giving a pile of champs radically different power levels. This Sated devourer thing is nuts along with all the AP changes have completely overhauled the game to where playing ranked right now is crazy.

um, ok, then following an FotM playstyle/buildpath?
giving champions "radically different power levels" won't mean shit if you don't play a champion that was nerfed really hard by the changes
it won't even take a quarter of the game to adjust to the different power spikes/levels of said champions

i honestly dont see the big deal?

It doesn't matter if they weren't nerfed, it's a matter of other things being buffed to the point where they are stupid.

[JasonWazza]

As an example as to how this happens, i was playing nidalee heavily until the tank meta came in, while she was getting nerfs that were rather minor, tank meta meant that nidalee as a champion was having problems, as she struggled against the sejuani's and the Gragas' of the world, as she had to dive the back line, and then had struggles getting back out.

Now this may not have been a direct nerf to nidalee, but it dropped her playability a crap ton.

[JasonWazza]

So basically it's a shitter lich bane for jungling now.

Thanks Ezreal.

[JasonWazza]

yeah except it's extremely shitter, and because of that AP junglers can only take a shitty jungle item.

[JasonWazza]

I don't get pissed off that the Pickaxe is basically a shittier version of a BF Sword when I play ADC. Gold matters. You achieve Runeglaive+Jungler item at 2250 gold, which gets you the runeglaive enchant plus the jungling item smite for 750 gold less than lich bane. That's a huge, huge difference in cost and ability to get the item early.

My problem is more they removed Magus for this shit.

[JasonWazza]

With the new zeke's item, being a support became a lot more powerful.

Giving your ADC a 50% crit chance bonus at a crucial time is ridiculous.

[JasonWazza]

Were the changes that massive?

[JasonWazza]

Go into ranked game 1 for this patch.

Game loads the old HUD

[JasonWazza]

Go into ranked game 1 for this patch.

Game loads the old HUD

Old HUD hasn't be rolled out for ranked yet.

I assume you mean new hud, and well fuck, because all my sliders are adjusted for the new hud and the old hud looking horrid.

EDIT: Also didn't realize the cocoon buff was that massive, the hell.

[JasonWazza]

Holy fuck Elise is dumb right now.

Just played her support. 1.6 second stun at level 2 is very broken combined with her early damage.

She's back to her state where you can instalock her then say "fill"

Pretty sure ADC and mid Elise are both bad.

But yeah that stun duration needs to get fucking nerfed.

I did ADC elise once, it wasn't great but it was fun.

[JasonWazza]

So elise....

http://matchhistory.oce.leagueoflegends ... /200474676

I don't play elise, but damn she is actually fairly easy to fit into my playstyle.

And strong as fuck, considering that was my first game on her in months.

[JasonWazza]

Suddenly?

Galio has always been extremely niche but extremely effective.

his win rate at top went from the 14th best to the very best after the most recent patch

With 372 games analyzed.

[JasonWazza]

Yeah just pointing out that with a amount of games so low, his win rate isn't really a massive factor.

It means this patch has mostly been people who likely main Galio, and not only that, it's possible it's luck over champion power.

[JasonWazza]

Yeah just pointing out that with a amount of games so low, his win rate isn't really a massive factor.

It means this patch has mostly been people who likely main Galio, and not only that, it's possible it's luck over champion power.

but that can't be quite right
since 57% of games analyzed involved players who had only played Galio 1-5 times
and their win rate in particular is 56%

I'm pretty sure that's not how that graph works.

"(2014-2015 Ranked Experience)"

[JasonWazza]

The graph your using isn't just who's played him this patch, but who's played him since 2014. (or at least to my knowledge.)

[JasonWazza]

Australia mother fucker.

Though i thought ponce was British

P-Edit: the main thing with Ekko is outplaying your opponent and guessing where they will be for your W.

[JasonWazza]

when i play ekko top
i tend to win lane as long as i don't slip up; i actually don't think i've ever lost lane as ekko
but as the game develops, i can't engage without getting bursted down really quickly
maybe this is a problem with me playing melee champs specifically, but i dunno

Tank top lane Ekko, give it a try.

Iceborn, into tank items.

[JasonWazza]

Devourer/Runeglaive, Hurricane, Nashor's, Rylai's and whatever item you feel if the game gets this long.

[JasonWazza]

play ashe, do everything for your team

if you think you're REALLY better than then ELO you're in, then play Ashe. If you consistently win games on Ashe, you're right! If you don't, you're wrong!

This is of course assuming you think your better then your ELO as an ADC, if this isn't the case, then doing so will probably prove you just suck at ADC.

Personally i can't ADC to save my life, hence why i always pick Tristana where possible.

[JasonWazza]

Don't pick trist if you can't ADC. Pick Sivir. Much, much, much higher win rate with better matchups and no matter what happens you can provide your ult to your team.

I pick trist because my positioning as an ADC is what sucks, W and ult mean i can re-position quite easily.

That and i enjoy Trist's kit.

Honestly i'm also terrible with spell shields, and the few times i have tried Sivir in normals i either forget my E exist's or use it at a really terrible time.

[JasonWazza]

Well, that's just for the lane. Which I suppose is what beginners should be thinking about at first, but you still have to be aware of her deep trough mid-game before she picks up 3-4 items.

This, a lot of people i see have the same problem if they pick her up, they win lane, and have no idea how to actually snowball that because they don't know how to ADC.

Caitlyn in my opinion is a terrible beginner ADC unless your ONLY problem is the early game, she's great for learning how to play laning phase (cause that's what her kit is designed around) but past that she loses pretty much everything that makes her a good champion.

And if your honestly having problems in the early game, play a top/mid laner that struggles in the early game and find what exactly your problem is.

[JasonWazza]

Debatably why Trist is a good beginner ADC.

[JasonWazza]

And if your honestly having problems in the early game, play a top/mid laner that struggles in the early game and find what exactly your problem is.

And what would those be, btw?

I think my problem is the mid-game. I think my early game is decent (it's not superawesomazing because I can still lose lane, but I'd say it's my best out of the 3.5), and my problem late is almost purely positioning. Which is part of the problem mid-game but I think it's more pronounced mid-game because I still get confused about what to do at that point, or at least how to get things down there.

(I wonder if I should just play support or top over ADC, anyways...)

Honestly my mid game isn't the best so don't go quoting me on this sort of thing, but a good way to learn (and this tends to be very champion specific) is to be extremely aggressive in the 10-20 minute zone when Mid game starts, learn the limits your champion has, and the damage they do, and this gives you a good base line of knowledge that will tell you what you can and can't do for a mid game.

As an example, Orianna is a good champion to try this with, you will find that you can't push towers for shit, but you can push waves, and do a lot of damage to enemy mid laners and roam fairly decently if you time it right.

Tristana being a decent other champion to talk about pushes towers really well at the same point in the game, but doesn't do the same sort of damages, unless the fight is sustained to the point of at least 4 autos.

As for learning positioning, the main thing to do is when you die, try to work out why you died, and how you could have done the situation better, and how you could have positioned differently, some of the more informative streamers actually do this automatically while they stream (explain what they did wrong and how they could have done it better) try to learn to do this as it will help somewhat with your positioning, of course you still have to put in the effort to do these things.

EDIT: Totally unrelated but a good jungle guide video for what to do about invades.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q6YKHaetNiQ

[JasonWazza]

Define hellish

The australian 12vies are unleashed on the server.

It is not a pretty sight.

[JasonWazza]

Can you only play on weekends?

Honestly i play whenever and just accept that at least half my team has some sort of problem doing the basics of playing league.

[JasonWazza]

However your Cho'gath, so you don't really lose any lane assuming you can half competently CS.

And if your AP, then you beat Ez pretty easily because your combo beats his escape.

[JasonWazza]

yeah AP does jack shit early because his damage source is his W and his E, and that just drains his mana bar against a cho'gath.

A hint, if you can't 100-0 a Cho'gath within 2 waves, don't bother blowing your mana on him (this applies to every champion).

[JasonWazza]

Nah i mean if you can 100-0 Cho within 2 waves at level 6 that's fine, the problem is his passive is this:

Whenever Cho'Gath kills an enemy unit or structure, he recovers「 17 + (3 × Cho'Gath's level) 」health and「 3.25 + (0.25 × Cho'Gath's level) 」mana.

Meaning a wave is easily 100 health if your not a complete retard (CSing on Cho is simple)

[JasonWazza]

IBG>tank is how i built my Naut top.

Hey, if I wanted to go Naut top, what's my gameplan (runes, masteries, item build)?

9/21/0, taking 5% CDR over AS. 5% CDR + tankiness in runes, build tank.

Question if your going only the 21 in Def, what points do you drop (mine for top lane is 5/25)

[JasonWazza]

I hate champions that have AS slows.

[JasonWazza]

My role win rates feel so backwards in ranked.

Like somehow ADC is my second best role, i suck at ADCing and can't do half of the basic mechanics that ADC's do.

Should i be relooking at the roles i'm spending time on and actually try to learn how to ADC more?

[JasonWazza]

I hate champions that have AS slows.

Isn't nasus the only remaining AS slow in the game with wither?

Nasus, Nunu, Fiora (her new W), Malphite

[JasonWazza]

http://boards.oce.leagueoflegends.com/e ... -patch-day

So i'd like to see other thoughts on this.

TL;DR:
Essentially Riot has announced that OCE will be receiving the patches a day ahead of everywhere else, honestly i see this as a double edged sword, i mean yes we will get patches early but it seems we are basically being forced to be the "Live beta testers" in that it will be OCE's job to basically find bugs for them to disable/fix

[JasonWazza]

Question, why the fuck did they feel the need to buff leblanc again?

I hate Leblanc.

[JasonWazza]

The Draven buffs are on the PBE, though i'd also say it's a nerf for the simple fact, they are announcing to the enemy team his stacks.

[JasonWazza]

More because it instantly lets everyone know how competent he is.

If he has 200 stacks at 10 minutes (exaggeration but you get my point) he is going to be the one sole focus.

[JasonWazza]

I guess, maybe i'm just being negative because i think the few gold your getting extra doesn't actually cover the fact that your probably in a more heavily camped position.

[JasonWazza]

(But no seriously, TF has like, 2 abilities. If you aren't blind to the map, how is he seen as a hard champ lol, he's so fun.)

Because pick a card is hard, hence why you hear terms like Brown card TF (cause they only pull shit).

The amount of times i've had a TF pick a Blue/Red card when we need a Gold (even just while having a gank setup for them and no pressure at all) is just ridiculous.

[JasonWazza]

Basically Titanic is just a replacement hydra for when your going to have a tanky build anyway, pick it if your actual aim is to scale your health, and buy it when you'd normally get a hydra.

[JasonWazza]

If your lacking clear and want a damage item on Naut, IBG is probably more worth thinking about then Titanic Hydra (and even then i think IBG is technically suboptimal on naut, even though i enjoy building it on him).

Think more your 1 damage item top laners, maybe even the 2 damage item top laners, and replace in the Titanic for the Trinity force (i think most 2 item's are BotRK and TF, and Titanic basically has a sheen proc on it's passive permanently.)

[JasonWazza]

Why? Seems suboptimal quite a lot. Rather have a visage or banshee in that place

You scale off AP, your the tank and going to be in the middle of the fight giving your Aura, and it's cheaper for only 10 less magic resist.

[JasonWazza]

http://matchhistory.oce.leagueoflegends ... /200474676

First ARAM game where i have focused so much on CSing, and Morde in ARAM demands it, i was like half a level ahead of everyone for so long.

[JasonWazza]

are the times besides in lategame when you have a chance to take a turret but you shouldn't?

If your able to say Dive a Nasus every time he comes to lane and kill him, then don't get the tower, as the tower just increases his safety (I think Nasus is the main reason you'd ever not want to take a tower.)

[JasonWazza]

You should be climbing on 50% if your where your supposed to be, if your a division or so lower it should be hard to climb, i think that's what i heard being said at one point.

[JasonWazza]

Does he?

[JasonWazza]

Also is it just me that thinks the Project Zed skin splash looks like it belongs to anivia.

[JasonWazza]

How is that not just complicating things (minute's and seconds thing)

Also yeah someone pointed out the mana thing to me the other day and i was actually really surprised with how nice it looked, real pity they didn't announce it with the new hud (when i assume it came to be)

[JasonWazza]

Holy shit I hate people that want to quit and eventually ragequit because we get behind against an early game comp as a scaling comp. Like, we almost won 4 against 5 if Ori didn't fucking rage.

The problem i have with this, is when people seem to think there is going to be a late game when your getting absolutely dumpstered.

This was to the point where a surrender at 20 vote failed, i afk'd for like 2 minutes to grab a drink because i was annoyed at the 4 man premade, and the game was actually over cause they were pushing to win.

[JasonWazza]

Holy shit I hate people that want to quit and eventually ragequit because we get behind against an early game comp as a scaling comp. Like, we almost won 4 against 5 if Ori didn't fucking rage.

The problem i have with this, is when people seem to think there is going to be a late game when your getting absolutely dumpstered.

This was to the point where a surrender at 20 vote failed, i afk'd for like 2 minutes to grab a drink because i was annoyed at the 4 man premade, and the game was actually over cause they were pushing to win.

You are part of the problem. You have tried to justify reprehensible behavior, but you just come across as even worse.

You see normally i would agree, but given i was abused for 20 minutes before i did the surrender vote, and honestly decided that i need a drink to even be bothered trying to continue the shit fest that was going on, yeah no.

Me being there would have made no difference to them pushing and ending, they were so far ahead it wasn't even fucking funny (vayne had a vamp specter and a long sword to Caitlyn's finished PD and BF sword.) to the point where i really don't understand why there wasn't a surrender.

[JasonWazza]

So this is an ahri mid game i won't soon forget.

Spoiler:

[JasonWazza]

if i were you i'd not play a ranked game for a month

Just as a note, if this is being said because of ranked decay, ranked decay doesn't exist for golds anymore.

[JasonWazza]

if i were you i'd not play a ranked game for a month

Just as a note, if this is being said because of ranked decay, ranked decay doesn't exist for golds anymore.

He knows? Or else he wouldn't've said this.

Because

Ranked Decay doesn't exist you can wait a month for the Season to end, collect your rewards and move on with your Ranked life (or not until next season).

Or just keep playing because unless you somehow manage to have your MMR fall so far in a month, there is no reason not to.

Sure you can wait till the season ends, there is just no real benefit.

[JasonWazza]

Honestly my personal thought is that mid is a lot harder to carry with currently just because of where the meta is, but that could just be my struggles more then anything.

[JasonWazza]

Wouldn't Leona be better for YOLO queue then Thresh?

[JasonWazza]

Thresh has more opitions available and is easier to play as when behind.

Yes but your aim in YOLO queue is to get ahead, not to play as if your behind.

[JasonWazza]

I'd heard it was still slightly buggy but a lot better then it used to be.

EDIT: Also is it just me or would Mundo be extremely strong this patch, his new E auto reset, build a titanic Hydra + Tank and your AA>E AA>Titanic AA

That's a total of 15% of your own Max health as damage on top of a 100 AD steroid late game

[JasonWazza]

Honestly i don't mind the mid lane TP meta because it was the norm for me when i used to do a lot of Nidalee mid, as ignite has little to no use for Nidalee in my personal opinion.

Might play a few games with her tomorrow and see if the juggernaut meta is any better then the tank meta for her.

[JasonWazza]

Azir probably being the champ with the shortest.

Considering all the things that you have to learn as Azir passed being able to play him, i feel this is rather inaccurate to him as a champion.

[JasonWazza]

+victorious skin.

[JasonWazza]

His E is multi target unlike Sona who's Q is 2 target, but neither have good waveclear.

[JasonWazza]

But blitz also beats them in usefulness if your team is even/ahead due to always being able to make picks.

[JasonWazza]

How are we certain that's a new champion tease and not just part of the lore?

[JasonWazza]

Because champion data for her by that same name is on the PBE with a champ select quote already?

I may have completely forgotten about that, my bad.

....
a is for attack move, s is for stop.
z = expand chat
x = mia
c = otw
v = back
t = danger
g = ping
y = help

how do you play the game w/o smartpings bound...

I have A move set to left click (middle click is the proper left click) and right click set to normal move
And MIA, OTW, Danger and Assistance are all keybound to my mouse with one select key i rebind most games for a select taunt per champion.

Gaming mice are fun.

[JasonWazza]

I don't know how much that is a downgrade considering the huge decrease in cost.

[JasonWazza]

Question, will we be moving the End season 5 into the S4 slot, or making a brand new slot?

[JasonWazza]

I feel like even what's optimal will be fairly debatable.

That being said it's good to know that you will be able to see in game what keystone mastery your opponents have.

[JasonWazza]

Is fiora really broken?

I'd honestly say she is balanced you just have to play smart around her.

[JasonWazza]

Is fiora really broken?

I'd honestly say she is balanced you just have to play smart around her.

Given how she'll proc your vitals every 2 seconds, then ult for the kill, not really.

Half of the vitals she will get are nearly always in positions where you have to LET her hit them, especially there is always at least one you can pin to a wall.

And on top of that her Q (what she will primarily use to proc them) causes her to take minion agro, so if you just trade with these things in mind you can still win the matchup.

And hell, most meta top laners can win against her if your not completely brain dead.

Fiora is always a skill match up, so it's not like you don't have an opportunity to beat her.

[JasonWazza]

Vi just got a skin.

[JasonWazza]

Really when did they say that was happening?

[JasonWazza]

Riot don't give away new skins, or they very rarely do without us having earned it (victorious skins)

[JasonWazza]

Riot don't give away new skins, or they very rarely do without us having earned it (victorious skins)

Everyone at my viewing party got Academy Ahri for free.

Yes because part of the cost of attending a viewing party isn't the bag.

Fair enough, what happened to the jungle tanks though? Sej gone, Maok gone, Naut has been banished to bot lane, Bear mostly gone, Rammus gone, Sion gone from everywhere.

Only tanks in the game right now are basically Amumu, TK, Mundo, Malphite, and Singed. What keeps amumu relevant, while all his friends have been relegated to the 45% win rate never play this guy in a real game bin?

Does league constantly have to be in a state of it's either a tank meta or a assassin meta? The Juggs(and guys that are basically juggs but not in the 4 guys they reworked) are outliers but the meta always seems to be either assassins or tanks, with the OP bruiser/juggs/we as outliers.

Sejuani got the shit nerfed out of her, and then had her item nerfed, she still works in jungle, but competitively she is a lot weaker.

Naut just has a really poor jungle clear, and that hurts his jungle extremely hard, the main way to fix it is to go out of your way with runes, and it causes you to have problems elsewhere, Sup naut drops all these problems.

Sion is the same as Sej, he got nerfed, then his item got nerfed.

Mao tends to be better for junglers that don't jungle very often over pros because while he is a pretty decent jack of all trades, he doesn't do anything to spectacularly, his ganks also generally need some form of lane CC, or else you can really easily go flying under the enemy tower, and especially for pros, a counter gank means that a mao gank goes to shit.

As for voli and rammus, i am genuinely not entirely sure.

[JasonWazza]

Yeah but kindred has a 2 second hop with her W up, she basically is a poke ADC that can sit back after a trade and get back to full health.

[JasonWazza]

I'm pretty excited about the fact that we can do ranked with more than just solo and duo parties now.

League is a team game, and it always felt really weird to be judged in solo and duo increments, rather than as a team.

I think club thing is going to make it even easier to set up ranked parties on the fly and go.

These are good changes.

I disagree. Vehemently. I'd prefer if they got rid of duos or at least gave me the option to solo and only play with other solo players. League is primarily a solo game for me and I avoid playing normals alone because i hate playing with groups of 3 and 4 as a solo player.

I want to say i agree with there should be an option to opt out of having to see Duos etc.

Being the solo and the only one without communication is always shit.


EDIT: Not to mention these changes really do just enable boosting.

[JasonWazza]

Another problem i think Riot hasn't really taken into account is the fact that being first pick really isn't an advantage at all with this new champion select thing.

The main benefit of being first/second pick right now is that we go off pick order for selecting roles, removing that there isn't really much benefit of being a higher pick.

This becomes even more prevalent if your pick is one of the champs that is only meta in your lane.

[JasonWazza]

The main benefit of being first/second pick right now is that we go off pick order for selecting roles, removing that there isn't really much benefit of being a higher pick.

The main benefit of first and second pick is being able to secure POWER PICKS.

The problem i have with this line of thinking is, unless pick order has been changed to reflect the power picks of the role and they don't just get support first pick, then this fact means nothing.

Even power picks should rarely leave a certain lane

[JasonWazza]

So question for jungling as i decided to try a couple of customs for my junglers and found something interesting.

Would starting Refillable potion, doing a camp>Buff>Backing to buy your hunters potion>Buff

Would this be optimal for junglers that want to be gank heavy after 3?

Also given the customs i ran, Rek'sai requires a leash unless i fucked my abilitys slightly (executed on red, red on 90 health)

[JasonWazza]

Like any viable jungler.

[JasonWazza]

Rageblade has actually turned into a ranged champs Tiamat if they have AD/AP scaling.

And i only realized this accidently after building it on kog'maw for lols.

[JasonWazza]

The biggest thing i see with the numbers, is nidalee needs some help, they nerfed the crap out of her last season, and she is just really falling to the wayside in terms of power, and that honestly needs to be fixed.

[JasonWazza]

I may be biased since nidalee is basically my most favorite champion, so that probably comes into play.

But honestly Nid hasn't been all that meta for months, and those that actually continued to pick her just got stomped by the meta champions, the only thing that remained meta was nidalee jungle, and that was fucked by 1 counter jungle early.

[JasonWazza]

This patch is honestly just highlighting for me the sheer number of people who don't know people are coming even with wards.

[JasonWazza]

Yeah but it's kinda rediculous how bad it is, like i can ward the entire map, some teams will still lose to ganks from mid/jungle and still blame the jungler 9/10 times.

I had a bot lane that blamed me as jungle for yas mid ganking them, legit i pinged his entire movement the entire 10 seconds of it, while he headed bot lane cause he walked through all the wards.

I think one time we didn't see him the whole 10 second trip and we still saw him long enough before that they could have backed up.

I just don't know if it's even worth me buying the warding jungle item at this point.

[JasonWazza]

Yes that would be accurate.

[JasonWazza]

Will that actually block a Karthus ult?

[JasonWazza]

Dont people realize full AD comps are a bad idea?

Generally speaking it tends to be that last pick doesn't really give a rats ass or doesn't understand that full AD comps don't work.

I still believe it's also partially the mid laners fault in all those scenarios depending on what pick he/she is, as they are probably in the easiest role to be AP in.

[JasonWazza]

You can just pick Corki ADC now if you really want to get around that. He now deals 70% magic damage.

Agreed, but knowing this as like a second pick ADC?


Btw the thing to do atm, is pick Guinsoo's champs top lane.

[JasonWazza]

Nope it's server side now for each account.

[JasonWazza]

I want to be playing some ranked games in this preseason, but i almost just flat out don't feel comfortable in doing so considering my comfort pick champion (Nidalee) is basically one of the worst champions in the game right now.

[JasonWazza]

I am trying to learn nidalee jungle.

I'd honestly say don't bother with nid atm, she isn't in any position to be played in any role.

[JasonWazza]

It happens, just focus on your own gameplay and try and work out what you personally can do better.

[JasonWazza]

P-EDIT: Or quadz could beat me to it.

Basically don't let your rank get you down because a decent chunk of people aren't as good as they would like to think they are.

[JasonWazza]

And also regarding the fact that the bump is gold V, it's because some people only care for the rewards rather then say showing off their skill.

Boosting would definitely be a part of it, but maybe only 0.5-1% of the 11.5%

[JasonWazza]

I'd probably say it's better to back when you first blood rather then do the lane push.

Because unfortunately if your FBing them at level 1/2 you have a 14-17 second window where they will be removed from lane (4 second TP timer, 10-13 second death timer).

Assuming you back instantly, you have a 6/9 second window to start walking from base.

[JasonWazza]

Yeah obviously it would depend on the specific situation of the lane waves, but given what you've said this is about the only alternative (i mean aside from running TP instead of ignite.)

[JasonWazza]

Wouldn't the problem mostly be EXP > Gold for those low levels Zor?

[JasonWazza]

That tank stats shred his autos more then normal ones because they are split (which is why it does 110% AD as even a small amount of MR makes the 10% negligible.)

[JasonWazza]

The problem i have with Illaoi, is that she has no real counterplay built into her kit outside "Kill the tentacles" and realistically this is a shitty form of counterplay.

Especially when because of her pulling your spirit horseshit, if the lane isn't in your favor you get chunked for 25+% of your health because you can't realistically go up to her and stop her.

And the regen on her tentacles is Darius Rework in stupidity, not to mention those tentacles either have the fucking stupidest hit box, or calculate their hits way before the animation (i'm not entirely sure which, but one of these have to be accurate)

She's basically a lane bully crossed with a teamfighting god, and this really shouldn't be a combination.

[JasonWazza]

The hitbox is rectangle

Yes this is obvious, my problem is that the rectangle that is shown on the ground as the hitbox is either calculating before the animation goes off, or it's too big, i was playing Yas last night against her and was Eing through her when she was Qing me, and it was hitting way too often considering the animation.

[JasonWazza]

It starts around her, so you can move just past a minion and still hit it with the skill. As yas, you'd be just past her and indeed, you'd still get hit.

The problem i have with Illaoi, is that she has no real counterplay built into her kit outside "Kill the tentacles" and realistically this is a shitty form of counterplay.

You are not in motion.

Seriously that is a really terrible hit box if it starts from behind her, in no way should that be the case.

Also for the in motion part, I am in motion, the problem being that because of her spirit pull horse shitery, and if you actually want to get into melee range of her, you have a lot less reaction time, to the point where it's near on impossible to be dodging all the tentacles, and of course all of them heal her up.

[JasonWazza]

... you're playing Yasuo into Illaoi and complaining that her skillshot E is hitting you. If she's hitting you with her E at all, you're not doing it right because you need to look for the animation and NOT the projectile to block it as a yasuo player.

These are 2 different complaints.

Yes you can block the E as yas (though i believe the cooldown is slightly higher then her E cooldown) that doesn't mean it's not an annoying rather low counterplay thing.

The Yas part was only complaining about her stupid tentacle hit box.

[JasonWazza]

Given I've not laned against an Illaoi, but I've gotten hit by her E as multiple champions. Dodging the tentacles in that case is fairly easy - you know where they will sprout from if you look for it, and the animation for them to hit is slow has shows the hitbox.

As per Illaoi's E being "low counterplay", here's some:

1) It's a skillshot. If you dodge the skillshot you keep you spirit.
2) It's blocked by minions (and presumably monsters)
3) You can hit Illaoi to lower the amount of time your spirit is around AND not take the curse. If you find a spot to hit her that doesn't involve you being hit by tenacles, even better.

1) If that is legitmate counterplay, why did nid's spears get nerfed? But seriously, it's a realtively easy skill shot to hit, and generally as a top laner you are melee, so you end up being more likely to take the E.
2) This may be the case, but with minion block atm, it's best to be no where near minions as she is likely to be able to hit you with the W and have her tentacles smack you up
3) Considering that their are several times where the wave is stacked against you even in a strong players lane, this isn't reasonable counterplay, as she can do it whenever she want's.

The fact is her E combined with her kit makes her really hard to fight as even if you try to fight her when your spirit is out of you, her tentacles are guaranteed to hit the spirit meaning she can get a huge chunk of her missing health back up (with very little risk associated with it.)

Now that I'm back from getting myself a snack, let me explain EVEN FURTHER.

I'm not saying her E isn't strong - in fact, the rest of her basic abilities are rather dull to

compensate

for just how strong it is. However, it actually has a lot of counterplay attached to it which you're carefully avoiding. On top of everything else I mentioned, you can RUN AWAY and not take the extra damage and just take the curse. You may as well be arguing that Lux snare (Q) has no counterplay because they're both very strong basic abilities with counterplay attached that requires more than basic levels of thought.

In orders of magnitude, here's the list of what you want to happen in regards to Illaoi's E:

1) It misses or you dodge
2) You get hit but can fight back, forcing Illaoi to decide between your spirit (get the curse on you maybe, but deal less damage) and you (deals MORE DAMAGE, but your E was for nothing). She can't kill both of you unless she's fed as fuck.
3) You get hit, but cannot fight Illaoi in her current state. You run away before she can damage you through the spirit and take the curse
4) You get hit, but let her wail at the spirit FOR FREE, giving you a ton of damage and the curse

No counterplay is

Vi R

. It's targetted. It's a dash. It knocks you up. It deals damage. There's nothing you can do about any of this aside from zhonya's or spellshield the knockup. And not every champion can buy a zhonya's or has a spellshield.

Did you seriously just compare Lux Snare to this spirit shit?

Not to mention you think Illaoi's other skills are dull?

Have you seen the sort of Health this bitch gets back if you ever try to gank her post-6?

I've seen her 3v1 and win against a Mid-Top-Jungler who each had about the same gold as her, and only top and jungle were 1 level behind on the illaoi.

Because basically, she got a spirit, Ulted and got 4 tentacles, and just smashed her face on the keyboard to get a triple.

[JasonWazza]

And more to the point, How specifically is Illaoi, OP? Does she beat mundo, Quinn, TK, GP, or Irelia? I think the answer is no on all accounts and the only kinda close one might be Irelia.

Yes, Maybe but quinn roams, not entirely sure, i haven't seen a GP in like a month is he even any good any more?, haven't seen irelia V Illaoi

[JasonWazza]

2) I don't think I follow this logic. Don't stand behind minions to avoid being hit by the most important ability in her kit because you might get creepblocked? Let's not forget that minion collision boxes got larger this path, and champion collision with minions got reduced at the same time.

Slightly drunk but i will address this one point.

Stand in minions and she will just Q the minions and hit you with them, stand outside the minions and she will hit her E, it's a lose/lose situation.

[JasonWazza]

Times like this I hate being oce. I miss inhaus

This.

Also for anyone having problems with pathing atm, this will be good news to you guys;

http://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en ... ing-update

TL;DR, they are reverting the minion block stuff until they do changes to pathing.

[JasonWazza]

So after a game i just played of Sivir, where i basically stalled the game out till we were able to actually beat the enemy team (http://matchhistory.oce.leagueoflegends ... b=overview), i've realized that i should be looking to have ADC's that are good at just flat out stalling games out, obviously Sivir is one with her waveclear, are there any other ADC's that have waveclear like Sivir's that i'm not thinking of?

[JasonWazza]

I feel trist's waveclear for the stall scenario isn't the best (don't get me wrong, i love playing her.) I'm just looking for the champs that can be the only one alive (or possibly one other person) and be able to clear the wave.

Jinx is probably decent at it, and i do need to get back into her.

[JasonWazza]

Only thing I hate, is it's just another fucking headbutt troll move. Just a move that seems to always go off right as I'm channeling my big AoE CC. Like tibbers.

Serious question, how are you managing this?

The thing has a channel to be sending them any sort of distance.

[JasonWazza]

I don't think people have "suddenly stopped caring", i think a lot of people never cared in the first place, and the ones who do are confused by the new system and do their warding suboptimally.

EDIT: As a note, i think anyone who runs Executioner currently on mid lane mages, should give the new meditation a try (the mana one in the same line).

Currently i have been running a 45% CDR mid lane (and having a super early 35% with Fiendish codex, Forbidden idol and Ionian boots) and i actually think this allows you to have a lot more impact early on.

I get to my 35% CDR and with idol i never run out of mana (before idol i can but it's still not that likely)

[JasonWazza]

that would get you it at like 10, and i wouldn't recommend that unless your on a champ that doesn't want sheen (i've been doing this mostly on my ekko.)

[JasonWazza]

Blue yeah, yellow no.

[JasonWazza]

Blue yeah, yellow no.

explain yellow-no please

also, what lanes get blue and what lanes keep yellow?

Yellow is a no to off cooldown because placing it off cooldown isn't completely beneficial (unless we are talking about the second ward cooldown) also if you leave the ward till you are very close to 2, you can have 3 up, whereas using it on cooldown isn't as useful.

[JasonWazza]

So just did some ranked and honestly don't know why i was worried about it.

Also i have to say, tanky Rek'sai top is fucking fun as hell, Physical/Magical/True damage, all wrapped into a sand shark.

[JasonWazza]

http://matchhistory.oce.leagueoflegends ... /200474676

That's pretty close to a full build.

Build to counter your lane, second item Titanic Hydra, then either go the MR/Armor item you missed, or warmogs.

Dead man's plate is great for all AD teams.

EDIT: As a note, the idea of the build is to basically be a massive split pushing tank, and basically make the top laner of the enemy team irrelevant, and also basically make teamfights 3v4, while still having the ability to join the teamfight easily.

[JasonWazza]

Also is it just me or is Distortion extremely underrated and never used (let alone any tier 3 bootie).

[JasonWazza]

Yeah unfortunately Klam i think you got counter picked in that lane, Poppy kinda fucks on everything a rek'sai gets in lane, and you basically are forced to play on the poppy's terms rather then your own.

[JasonWazza]

3 ranked wins in a row with top rek'sai, i am now in my series for Gold 4.

Also a question, when were we supposed to be getting Mastery tiers 6/7?

[JasonWazza]

I've been Gold V for 6 months

I am now officially a Gold V.

EDIT: the game that won me my promo's.

http://matchhistory.oce.leagueoflegends ... b=overview

And to win the game i managed to get the game ending pick on Kali so we could just slam up mid after like 2-3 minutes of baron dancing.

I just haven't played ranked properly for ages.

[JasonWazza]

she did get her HP regen buffed due to her "being let down by the item changes"

[JasonWazza]

and boxbox kinda made that obvious to everyone because everyone was busy complaining about the changes, and boxbox was just loving the extra CDR.

[JasonWazza]

Riven is still riven, the only thing that has changed is the items and masteries, and bad rivens will play like trash more because of this, actually people who main riven honestly found the changes to be a buff.

[JasonWazza]

I love deciding to roam and get someone fed as a mid laner, for that person to spend half the game typing instead of playing.

Oh and then bitches that i have low CS when they came mid and took my CS after i did 3 roams bot to get her fed.

Logic is an amazing thing.

/rant

[JasonWazza]

It just becomes second nature, tracking important cooldowns needs to really be done by each lane (cause there is no way you will see them all) but other then that, try and get into the habit of checking the map between CS's, the same can go for checking tab.

[JasonWazza]

Things my champ can do that Bard can't:

Give someone a shield for over 500HP and teleport to that person with that ability.

Who can do this?

[JasonWazza]

...ylsuoivbo ,nehS

I feel retarded now.

On another note, i am liking Shaco in the jungle as a possible second jungler for me (my main probably will be sejuani.) i feel like the thought process of planning ahead with boxes is something i have down (and i did do a decent amount of AP shaco), and that if i get down the specific mechanics (box placement for jungle camps for example) that he would be a strong jungler for me.

Is there any other more assassin/fighter type jungle that i should be picking up for comps where i can't go Shaco/Sejuani?

[JasonWazza]

I feel normals is mostly centered around learning the champs mechanics and limits.

[JasonWazza]

I enjoy games that I'm not playing like shit in.

I'm like this mostly, except in games where i'm 10/0 and trying to carry the 0/10 squad, and it's just me frustratedly trying to work out how i'm going to pick the enemy team off, when they can probably kill me if any one of them walk into a bush by themselves.

[JasonWazza]

I have wonder land, Red riding hood, and Panda annie skins, it's kinda stupid as you get them from mystery gift's so easily.

[JasonWazza]

I have wonder land, Red riding hood, and Panda annie skins, it's kinda stupid as you get them from mystery gift's so easily.

I have never received a mystery gift. I have purchased all of my skins myself.

I only got one of them as a mystery gift (Red Riding Hood) the other 2 i have bought myself (Panda i bought and then got wonderland during the skin event last year)

I have a terrible luck with receiving skins and an amazing luck gifting skins, having even actually gifted an ultimate skin, and several of the nicer skins.

I tilt when mystery gifting happens, my team mates are so bad.

[JasonWazza]

So apparently Tank corki can do the most damage in game.

http://matchhistory.oce.leagueoflegends ... 474676/eog

Ekko being on and off DC'd for half the game lost us this unfortunately, but i don't get how i managed most damage with only iceborn/BT as my damage items (and that was a late BT.)

[JasonWazza]

I really wish people would stop picking Malph into Magic damage heavy comps.

First one: Varus, AP shaco, Shen, Teemo, Sejuani
Second one: LB, Top warwick, Sona, Ezreal, Lee Sin.

I get that malph is strong, but don't pick it INTO the high magic damage comps (both malphs were last pick for my team) as your preference is to build heavy armor.

[JasonWazza]

Gold 4, woo, would feel so much better if it wasn't a freebie due to the free win but whatever.

[JasonWazza]

Free ones feel just as good as the earned ones, man. A win is a win.

Personally i feel it cheapens getting promoted, i ended up playing another game and won that anyway, so i would have got promoted either way, it's just that the feeling of earning it isn't in there when your required to honestly hit a 50% because you screwed up one of them.

Then again it probably is just me.

[JasonWazza]

I love how exploitable Corki ADC is right now, for the simple fact that not enough people understand that he deals mostly magic damage and build wrong against him.

I will say this here, build MR if your having trouble with a corki, his damage ends up anywhere between 60% and 80% magic damage (mostly dependant on whether he is in your face or shooting you from range).

[JasonWazza]

Yeah generally ranked teams are harder because from my experience they tend to be 1 really good person, and 4 ~silvers being lead by said good person.

[JasonWazza]

Unless your in the middle of your team, the ult won't make a difference, cause he will one shot you after the heal.

[JasonWazza]

You realize that shit should appear like AS he is on top of you.

Rengar's don't tend to go past your allies (or at least not good ones.)

[JasonWazza]

So foreflay?

[JasonWazza]

Taric works okay unless Rango is outrageously ahead despite the slow cc because he also mitigates the burst.

Opps no it's an AP rengar.

[JasonWazza]

So basically i got lucky enough to catch one of my better friends in a duo, so we were basically trio Queue.

http://matchhistory.oce.leagueoflegends ... 474676/eog

Support morgana who was basically trolling us (and we offered her to not be support) and mid diana just being bad actually managed to lose us this game.

The funniest part, the zed was trying to shit talk me when i killed him more then he killed me (i died twice to zed, he died four times to me, 3 of which was his own ults).

[JasonWazza]

Just gave tahm top a try, and my god is that disgusting.

It got to the point where i basically told my team to baron while i just run the entire enemy team in circles, cause why the hell not.

EDIT: and nope Illaoi feels even more dirty then tahm

http://matchhistory.oce.leagueoflegends ... /200474676

[JasonWazza]

Those builds are taking from 6 item builds only. How many high level games go 6 items?

Basically the site guesses where your going with the rest of your items, as it says on the site, that's why early game champs tend to have a lot of one build because the site can't tell if your building different to the standard in the first 2 items.

[JasonWazza]

So apparently Theorycraftr can't understand that E procs W bolts, i was trying to set up a test scenario for that but that will have to wait (not to mention i don't think it understands that the vayne Q is an auto reset)

so basically 3 AA's for both scenarios (scenario is level 6, AA>Q>AA>AA onto a level 6 ezreal)

BotRK: 392 damage, 2.8 seconds to happen.
IE: 386 damage (no crits), 3.9 seconds to happen, 51% chance of no crits.

Even without calculating the auto reset, your still looking at an extra 1.1 seconds for what is the majority of times going to be a no crit trade, the expected average of this is 116 Crit damage, which while this makes your damage stronger, you could easily fit another auto + into the BotRK and you have the active on the BotRK.

[JasonWazza]

the problem with people who blindly follow mobafire is that 90% of the time, those people don't actually read the guide, they just copy item builds and masteries and think that will make them good, fact is we aren't just giving you these items and saying build it, we are saying why they work better, in fact you have been told several times why it is better, and refuse to listen.

EDIT: You also have a sub 50% win rate in ranked, so i mean your point is invalid that it's simply because you don't play enough.

[JasonWazza]

personal experience

Either you are insanely lucky, or you don't actually understand your damage output.

And the link is in the thread, hell it was linked to you like last page.

[JasonWazza]

Buying ad first should be the way to go because withojt ad your autos do no dmf. The crit you get from rfc is wasted because you have no ad.

Are you having a stroke every time you type?

[JasonWazza]

So i want to ask opinions on a few items.

1. Wit's End, honestly i think the changes to it did a decent amount, and as someone who tends to play more hybrid champs, or champs that have an excess amount of magic damage recently (Corki/Ekko are the 2 i would think of building it on) so i kinda wanted to know what people think about it as an item.

2. Dead man's plate, in general this is a good item, i'm more curious as to people's thoughts about this item as a hybrid offensive/defensive on ranged champs (even carries?)

I dunno i just feel like i want more tankiness into some of my champs, while still being able to use them as an offensive item.

[JasonWazza]

I'm not sure that's an act. I fully believe hippo is a league bot that plays 85% of all silver 5 league games.


This might be a general gaming discussion, but how do people feel about specialized gaming equipment? Is it purchasing an unfair advantage or is it just part of the world we live in?

What sort of gaming equipment are we talking about here?

Dead man's plate is a great item, and is a go-to replacement for lots of champs who used to build randuin's (before the changes to randuins)

Yeah i'm more asking about for range champs who don't get the most out of the damaging passive (that gives a slow at max stacks)

P-EDIT: i actually forget about Steraks on a regular basis.

[JasonWazza]

So i was looking at the changes for Patch 6.1, and stumbled upon this.

Strength of the Ages [ Keystone Resolve ]

When capped, Strength of Ages now heals for 6% of your Maximum Health for both Siege Minions and

large jungle monsters

, changed from healing for 100 flat Health per Siege Minion kill.

Junglers with this are never going to have to back

And not sure how i feel about Runic Echos in that it's completely replacing runeglaive, would have loved to see them keep both.

What sort of gaming equipment are we talking about here?

mouses, keyboards, specialized controllers, ect.

Unless they are being used for macro's or anything like that, i'm not sure they give any actual advantage, and in most cases the use of a macro is more or less cheating anyway (depending on the macro)

Most things end up just being convenience over anything else.

[JasonWazza]

Take, for example, a gaming mouse for somebody playing as lee sin. THe mouse has a side button, that when pressed, autodrops a ward and presses W within the same frame.

Is that cheating?

That is a macro, and i would say that is cheating.

If said button placed the ward and you still had to press W to ward hop, that comes down to convience and still requires the button presses.

[JasonWazza]

If your leveling an account, it's not like you don't get the EXP for doing the game anyway.

Just have something in real life that you can pay slightly more attention to while you half ass play the game out (TV is an example)

[JasonWazza]

I'd be willing, that looks pretty awesome.

[JasonWazza]

While not entirely relevant to anyone outside OCE this is pretty damn awesome

http://oce.leagueoflegends.com/en/news/ ... 016-update

[JasonWazza]

While i don't know specficially if it is indeed Steel (i would assume so but it might be some other sort of metal thing that has a special name), the struture of the frame isn't hypothetical, cause if you look through all the photos you will see they have started constructing the frames.

[JasonWazza]

Yeah pretty much.

[JasonWazza]

There are 9 players that are Plat 5 and above, so i doubt they would have a full team of "mains" but they would easily be able to field a team.

[JasonWazza]

Yes that is THE Redmercy's PBE account.

[JasonWazza]

For anyone that is aiming to play Zac this patch, there is a bug that he apparently doesn't show the max range of his E while hovering over it.

[JasonWazza]

So after looking at the new Jungle item closer i just realized how stupid this is going to become.

Luden's Echo: 100 AP, 10% movespeed, 3.2k Gold, 100+10% AP scaling
Runic Echoes: 60 AP, 10% movespeed, 2.6k gold, 80+10% AP scaling, Smite ability upgrade (most likely red) and 18% missing mana if you decide to hit a jungle camp

Who's ready to see smite mid again?

[JasonWazza]

no it's not in this case.

Runic Echoes is a mana item as well as a luden's echo, and you get the smite upgrade.

[JasonWazza]

Iec your aim isn't to kill the camp, and most times at least one of the 2 raptor camps are up to throw an ability at.

[JasonWazza]

no it's not in this case.

Runic Echoes is a mana item as well as a luden's echo, and you get the smite upgrade.

does runic echoes give you bloops tho

If you mean the Luden's Echo animation then yes, they look identical.

Hmm I mean you cant have ignite then

Red smite is somewhat of an Ignite on a lower cooldown that also reduces that enemy's damage against you.

[JasonWazza]

Is that an actual steel structure?

So i ended up asking one of the rioters and getting an answer from them as to what the structure is.

The frame is what they call 'mild steel'. TIL.

[JasonWazza]

Why would you only have 8 rune pages and 44k IP?

Why not spend the IP on rune pages.

But a quick search says it would be around $100

[JasonWazza]

Maybe i just found a bunch of shitty gold accounts

[JasonWazza]

It's an ARAM, but i'll take it as it's a damn penta kill

http://matchhistory.oce.leagueoflegends ... b=overview

[JasonWazza]

She's good but tends to be outclassed by the other control mages, except for her niche of being the main control mage that can actually engage a fight (but most times will end up having to ult to do so.)

[JasonWazza]

-different MMRs between solo and dynamic queues.

This is all i ever actually wanted with this dynamic queue shit.

[JasonWazza]

Well yeah at silver Elo a lot of players lack the speed of placing a Exhaust on a rengar mid Ult leap.

Ignite is also more snowbally.

[JasonWazza]

Actually Myko that's mostly just inherently wrong, and in fact if Ray is right, it's actually possible it's a decline in skill (hear me out)

So basically there will always be Elo inflation, because a 50% win rate will make you climb (not quickly but it will) meaning if you are at your Elo (and assuming everyone is, this will be the case) you will climb, which means if your staying in the same percentage area it's probably a non-change in skill, and if everyone has this case, then everyone will slowly climb the ranks, moving the whole Percentage up in rank.

However that said, this isn't including the addition of more players to league ranked, as it's percentage based this means they the amount of players in the top x% increases, which means staying in the same percent could even be a decrease in skill level over the time.

That said the addition/changing of ranking systems also means that this data may be slightly inaccurate to an extent as well.

[JasonWazza]

Yeah I'd like to think my skill hasn't changed since the time I was playing on 20 fp with a touchpad and was gold. I've just gotten worse since getting a mouse, having a consistent 200+ fps, and a more consistent internet connection with fewer ping spikes.

1.


2. How do you go from Gold playing on a touchpad to only increase to plat, that is actually rediculous in my mind, and says you are really good at using touch pads (or that there is a huge skill difference between Gold and Plat.).

3. What i said was the pesmisitic way of looking at it, and was discussing it basically in a vacuum where people don't actually improve/get worse.

I don't think that's correct? The change of percentile will always be relative to the entire population. Now your assumption is that the population as a whole does not improve. Sure there's a group of new players, but there's also a solid group of players that have been with us since the start. Every year they got more experienced, learned new concepts, etc. Everybody got better at this game after a year.

Honestly i see very few people that "get better each year", this may come down to my friend group and the parts of the player base i regularly interact with, i feel like the players that get better and climb tend to be the edge cases and that there tends to be more complacent people that don't intend to actually get better at the game.

That being said i'm not saying no one improves from playing this game, but to actually improve to the point where your Elo change will be decent (say you're increasing faster than the average percentage) you actually have to put the effort in and make yourself better at the game.

And not to mention that these numbers are also Skewed by the number of Smurf's that exist.

As a final point, i am not at all saying that RF didn't improve, i don't believe that a single bit honestly, however that really means 1 of 2 things.

1. He doesn't play enough ranked games to actually reach his Elo
2. The parts in the game he has improved in, aren't actually going to increase his Elo (quickly)

[JasonWazza]

seems graves needs a nerf again

Graves is fine, you just need to learn that shotguns fucking hurt up close.

[JasonWazza]

So i'm currently 5/0 for the new season of ranked, actually kinda surprised as to how well i am doing.

[JasonWazza]

Wait really?

[JasonWazza]

why does champion.gg not have Kindred ADC listed? I understand that's not her most natural position, but I've seen it enough to believe it's a thing. And jungle kindred only has 85%. I have to believe that she has more games to analyze than Urgot's 491 ADC games (that 15% left over for kindred represents 3,900 games).

Considering that she gets played Mid/top as well at times, but yeah would be good to see it be based on games and not a percentage as to what gets shown.

[JasonWazza]

Dwlee no offense, but his bronze 2, and silver 4 last season, with Yasuo being one of his worst champions.

Just because he looked good to you, doesn't mean he was actually doing smart things (cause i seriously doubt it).

And learning how to play passive and aggressive at the same time is something you need to learn, likelihood was you were burning all your spells onto the wall by throwing them all at once, it's a Yasuo don't do this.

Hell if you are getting beaten, you shouldn't be using your W offensively unless you plan on playing defensive until the cooldown is back.

[JasonWazza]

Question is Kassadin's Riftwalk meant to stop you from casting your W or is that a bug?

[JasonWazza]

Eg. i ult and instantly hit my W, and it won't actually trigger.

[JasonWazza]

7/3

I went Gold 4 down to Silver 1, quite happy with that.

[JasonWazza]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ezFFy8CIrt4

That's for everyone here, basically Elise can solo Rift Herald fairly effectively from 6 onwards.

[JasonWazza]

ugh...that trick is sooooo coool but than you're stuck being elise....uggghhhhhhhhhh

Elise is amazing, i don't see your problem with her.

Mind you i am also building mostly movement speed tank (i kinda copied NB3's build)

Jungle Item > Runic Echos > Swiftness Boots > Rylai's (if ahead)/ Dead Man's (if behind) > Spirit Visage > Rylai's/Deadman's

If the game is still going by then judge what you need and take it.

[JasonWazza]

why would you buy rylais on nidalee??

(also why play nidalee?)

I personally only play nidalee occasionally because i still love her champion design.

And rylai's is an ok last item pickup on nidalee depending on how you play her.

What do I do when the enemy team is so fed by my teammates that getting within my auto range as vayne instantly kills me? The enemy team wukong could just dash to me and then knock me up and I had no way to dodge it because targetted dash. I ended up waiting for the dash to be down but my team also fed the enemy adc (tristana) so they would be autoing me while I was kiting the gnar. So what do I do in that situation?

Your targeted E beats his targeted E

[JasonWazza]

True jason, I didn't think about condeming him away. Mainly because he is invisible and I don't have a .5 second reaction time. :/
I suppose I could have a sweeper but that just shows him being around when he's invisible and I still can't target him.

So the question is, why are you in range of his W>E, and not knowing he is coming?

And as Ani said, a good vayne would never have a wukong get on top of them, because vayne is pretty much all about that reaction time.

[JasonWazza]

I love Ekko jungle for the simple fact that you can really easily get in/out for steals on Dragon/Baron.

Also just got in promo's for gold 5.

[JasonWazza]

I love games of normals when i'm with trash premades who tell me and everyone else what i said.

Before 20 minutes i hadn't even said a word outside "Zigg's you should have used your W there" (and this was because yi got away because i as wukong was just out of E range which would have killed him) and all i got was flaming

Sad thing is, i think the enemy team actually reported me because i got that "you've been bad recently" popup.

[JasonWazza]

I think this is my second time having it (first time was sub 30)

[JasonWazza]

edit: SK, what do you mean? Most people in low elo aren't capable of steamrolling/taking good advantage of their lead. No one ever builds QSS so essentially warwick is a SUPER good pick in bronze I think? ALSO, early-gank junglers are less likely to gank in a meaningful and successful way. This means junglers like warwick who are essentially delayed until level 6 aren't even held back all that much

While he isn't a bad pick in bronze, the thing to note is that while people in bronze are bad, that just means that their laners could actually be massively ahead before you can make an impact, even if you manage to farm to keep on level with the solo laners, your ganks might be impossible to pull of by time your relevant.

Plus assuming you aren't trash, your better off picking something that can make an impact early.

If your thinking of picking Warwick, i'd say pick Vi instead.

[JasonWazza]

I somewhat have to agree with panzer here, but i must say it will mean that shitters in their role that get carried just when they don't get their role will drop fairly easily.

Like i had a feeding top lane vayne that couldn't ward and was bitching cause i wasn't ganking her lane (you know, the one that was always pushed into the enemy tower), this person mains vayne and has a 27% win rate from 11.

And these are the type of people who main a role that they can't play and will just slowly demote themselves down to where they belong, it's just a matter of waiting for that to happen.

[JasonWazza]

oh hey they sped up draft pick what a surprise

They sped it up from 12 minutes to 9 minutes.

Also have to agree with the new item being stupid, not sure i want to ranked this patch, will just have to see how good i can do Jarvan Mid (about the only AD mid laner i am competent with)

EDIT: Also RIP Dominion.

[JasonWazza]

So i wanted to ask everyone something.

Before this patch, Dragon was basically a "take when it's free, but don't lose anything taking it" buff that you really didn't care for unless you were going for 5.

With the changes to 2nd and 4th buff, is it now worth actually taking this early, and possibly getting that second dragon buff (burn damage on towers) early?

[JasonWazza]

DRAGON'S WRATH (2ND STACK)

+15% damage to turrets and buildings

⇒ Basic attacks burn turrets for 10-180 over 2 seconds.
DRAGON'S DOMINANCE (4TH STACK)

+15% damage to monsters and minions

⇒ You take 20% less damage from turrets

This is why i almost think 1st dragon is actually rather strong early because it leads into a massive second dragon.

[JasonWazza]

Quinn mid is basically "push the lane and roam Where ever the fuck you please, because your a bird".

FTFY

EDIT: Also apparently, Shaco can use the new AD assassin item twice, because his clone copies all items AND takes them off cooldown (so use the item, then R, then your clone can use the item)

[JasonWazza]

Just so it's actually stated, the main reason you don't go tanky on Nidalee, is because you come with no utility, which is what you want on a tank.

All nidalee has is mobility and damage, building tank just wastes what she brings to a team.

[JasonWazza]

Vlad, it'd probably be worth against a good zac (one who actually collects the blobs)

Personally unless it's a mega healer (WW/Mundo) i more or less consider how much healing is in their entire team first (Life Steal is the main one to look for) and how easy it is for me to proc this shit.

[JasonWazza]

For the record people in the lcs are going strength of the ages. The reason going tankier is good is that it allows you to be in teamfights. You have to jump ibto the fight to kill someone, so if you instantly die youre not doing anything. It is pretty much the same reason you dont build full damage fiora, you would just get blown up. Btw the build gives you enough damage to still 100-0 people. And whoever isnt building rid of ages on nidalee jungle, regardless of going strength of the ages or not, is playing nidalee wrong.

First and foremost, i said nothing about Strength of the Ages, that shit is strong, that said, nidalee synergizes so well with thunderlords, that you can argue for either, especially since she is an early game jungler.

Fact is building damage is better for carry potential, and all nidalee has for carrying is her damage as she has no utility.

And i had already seen that video, and all it is, is an explanation as to why SotA's is strong, that said, that doesn't make it ideal on early game junglers (Lee, Nid are the two i can think of.)

And the difference as already stated is that we are talking about 2 different scenes, Professionals, and what you as a normal player should do (and btw, that is just pick a different jungler).

[JasonWazza]

I don't need to gank early though. I can clear my jungle extremely fast as nidalee and it is so much safer to do so. Yea, if a gank opportunity is there sure, but with thunderlord's I need to gank otherwise it is completely wasted. And why shouldn't I play nidalee?

You don't need to gank, but if your not ganking, you need to find the enemy jungler and kill them.

Like i feel you don't understand why you pick nidalee.

With thunderlord's you just compliment the style nidalee is supposed to have, Nidalee is in no way a farm jungler.

As for why you shouldn't play nidalee, well because she brings nothing to a team, your only piece of utility is a heal with an AS boost attached, and if your building tank, that is the extent of your use, instead just bring another champion that does useful things.

Especially given what you just said, Nidalee is a gank heavy jungler, that should be ganking or counter jungling for most of the game.

Pick a more farm heavy jungler if your going to go farm heavy, and hell a jungler with more gank potential, because that is why you can't gank as nidalee, you have to rely on your laners CC to do anything in a gank (assuming the laner isn't a potato.)

[JasonWazza]

Like the main reason Nid is any where near being a thing is the Runic Echoes introduction, and while she benefited from it, so did a crap ton of more useful junglers.

Nid's only bonus is the fact that she is a cheesey champ (Level 2 gank/invade etc.) and the only real reason to pick her is if your going into a matchup where you can abuse this (and you have to be able to abuse at least 2 lanes as well)

She has barely a 50% win rate in plat +, and in just every day games, she has a 47% win rate, because she simply isn't that good (and is high skill floor, that said the skill cap is relatively close to the skill floor.).

Just simply pick up any other AP jungler, and you will have more then you get from nidalee.

[JasonWazza]

I think i am giving up nidalee. My teammates dont know how to setup ganks or play champs that have no cc and complain abojt not gettig gankedm

How dare your team mates be used to useful junglers.

Blasphemy.

[JasonWazza]

Ahri is popular.