MINI 1674: A MINIMALIST TEXT ADVENTURE DEAD THREAD

[pieguyn]

FUCK THIS

[pieguyn]

I tried to signal to Marquis I was the traitor by blatantly following him for like the entirety of D1. Huntress did the same to me on D2 and I assumed she knew.

this is why this iteration of traitor is fucking shit

[pieguyn]

I *tried* to do that with Huntress (sitting there going "why is she town") but obviously didn't make it clear enough. -.-

also I legit used the exact same phrasing as you on certain reads ("emergency brake" re: notsci wagon, I think there were more)

fuck this shit I could have fucking won

also my half-assed plan was to fakeclaim cop and then go "herpaderp Bins trolled me", but you dying N1 kind of fucked that up entirely and I had to play for survival instead

[pieguyn]

Pie had me though. I thought she was town - though her recent posting did give me pause for concern in that she wasn't doing anything.

also, this was semi-intentional

I legitimately had no idea how to scum hunt in a scenario where it might have been multiball. I figured the optimal play would have been to wait to see how N2 played out before doing much of anything. D3 I would have come back and continued playing as usual.

[pieguyn]

{soren, the bulge, asher, blankface, possibly RC?}

needs 4 mislynches out of there to win. legit don't see Sakura-slot or notsci-slot being mislynched here.

afijfhalkdjfhaldkfjhlsdkjfhLKSJdfh WHY

[pieguyn]

yeah, agreed

having a traitor you can NK is really just fucking shit because of stuff like this. you shouldn't have to worry about NK'ing the traitor - it completely defeats the point

I sent this to Bins sometime overnight, btw. maybe we can petition for it to actually happen?!

honestly I think the iteration of traitor they made normal is the worst possible iteration of traitor - in no small part bc of things like this but also bc it's annoying in general for all parties involved

the last time I saw a traitor, it was scum didn't know traitor, traitor knew scum, scum recruited traitor on NK'ing them. while this I think is actually positive utility for scum bc when played right it royally fucks over associative tells, this I think is a fairly standard version of traitor

I also think the same thing except scum just can't NK the traitor is pretty standard

one thing I've heard of (but never seen) is scum knows traitor, traitor knows scum, scum can't recruit traitor

which I'm also fine with (and is strictly negative utility for scum bc it's just a scum player who's cut off from the rest of the team)

this version of it is smth I've never seen before and feels really inelegant. o.O def agree something should be changed there

[pieguyn]

there's also logistical reasons this iteration of traitor is bad

I asked Bins and apparently I would have got endgamed even if the SK was left, which leads to a bunch of dumb scenarios:

ex: 2 town, 2 WW (1 goon, 1 traitor), 1 SK

lynching WW is what a lot of people would do here, but if they lynch the traitor it's an autoloss

ex: 3 town, 2 WW (1 goon, 1 traitor), 1 SK (bulletproof) - night start

I kind of pulled this one out of my ass, but from a SK POV they need to shoot a WW here. however, in this case, if they wind up shooting the goon they wind up in 3p LYLO as opposed to 2-1-1 which they'd likely win due to being BP, which is really unfair for them.

it's a really inelegant role and probably shouldn't be the standardized variant, not only bc of what happened here but bc of stuff like this

[pieguyn]

it's fucking weird that apparently I was the most town player left in the game....... as scum

like, what the fuck

I always thought my scum game was rather shit. or at least I'm not really proud of it, although I am proud at the least that I managed to improve it from "always gets caught immediately".

[pieguyn]

oh btw I was blatantly making that "meta read" on you up. I thought you looked pretty town. incidentally, I'm really bad at hunting SKs because any SK who plays correctly is going to play the same way they would as town for the majority of the game, so it wound up being a sheer coincidence <_>

[pieguyn]

and yeah. I was expecting notscience or Sakura-slot to be the NK, not me, though. neither one was ever getting lynched, and although neither was onto scum, basically no one was onto either of us at this point so it's a moot point

[pieguyn]

Sakura-slot would have been a good NK if she feared hitting the traitor and wanted another day to hopefully figure it out. I wasn't lying when I said I was 100% she was town here even if h0bbes has been basically useless so far (lol).

[pieguyn]

that's actually the kind of thing I would have picked up on - although I'm a bit more strict about it bc I tend to factor outside factors and play into it and only rule someone out as scum if I can guarantee scum is taking advantage of it

here I would have ignored it for exactly that reason: it was likely either multiball (in which in one case you don't have a remaining scum partner to even push a counterwagon) or SK (in which case it's a moot point)

[pieguyn]

yeah, but as I said, even if it wasn't not multiball there was still a fairly good chance of it being an SK

especially when you have stuff like what I pointed out on D2 where it really did not make sense for it to have been a vig shot

no killing would have been positively evil ._.

[pieguyn]

lynch asher (? this will be difficult) -> nightkill NM -> lynch blankface -> nightkill notsci -> lynch soren -> nightkill anyone -> lynch {the bulge, RC}

alternatively

lynch blankface -> nightkill NM -> lynch soren -> nightkill asher -> lynch the bulge -> nightkill anyone -> lynch RC

IT CAN BE DONE

[pieguyn]

eh, huntress thinking he might have been traitor is testimony against him being town as fuck

I thought he looked town, but I think he's definitely lynchable. he was who I planned on pushing after Asher. RC also has a huge hardon for him.

Soren is (somewhat correctly) pointing out what I did to him was buddying, but I would have done probably the same thing as town. he's ez as hell to read and he should know this after the game we had before this where I town read him I think after 1 page and defended him all game. I think my read on him was reasonable. on the other hand, given the way he's trying to sell it as making him town, I don't think it'd be difficult to take that and push that I did it intentionally as his partner.

[pieguyn]

something that I learned the hard way about playing scum is that you can't just push the easiest target all the time

if you try hard enough, you can get away with some incredible bullshit. and if you actually succeed, you might be able to win a game that you otherwise would have been resigned to losing

like, I legit thought I might have been able to lynch notsci at one point - then the game went to shit and Cho flipped and I kind of... didn't

(I hate to bring this game up) Tales of You is the best example of this. the scum team literally mislynched everyone scum reading them so that they could NK all the important roles/completely-unlynchable players at night, most of which would have been (or were) able to incriminate them. *if* they didn't approach the game exactly in that way, they would have made it pretty far into the game but I doubt they wouldn't have come up short near the end; it was only bc they managed to get a bunch of ridiculous mislynches in that they could get all the way to the end

there was a newbie game where Nacho lynched me (Soren was in it). of course I shut that down by essentially forcing the town to lynch him and then his scum partner right afterward, but he was fucked either way and lynching me and then creating a bunch of WIFOM with his partner the next day (which would have been MYLO) was his only shot at victory

if huntress tryhards enough, I bet she could get at least the first 2 of mislynches in, and maybe 3

[pieguyn]

it's really dumb because we *should* have had the first 2/4 mislynches by now, but due to our kill failing N1 and me being unceremoniously killed N2 neither of them got us anywhere

[pieguyn]

Well I was about to flatline Pieguyn but she's already flipped, so I'm going to do the next best thing right now.

lol'ing at this

it's amusing to see RC trying to make me think he can read me

[pieguyn]

ftr this standardized traitor is an ok thing in that it encourages scum to try to kill town rather than a possible sk/traitor

yes, but any scum player who is playing optimally is going to look town, so that kind of defeats the point

the only argument I can see for it being good is that it's inherently negative utility in that there's a nonzero chance one of the scum team's NKs winds up hitting the traitor instead of a town player, hurting them as a result - but there are better, less random ways to make a traitor negative utility if that's what you're going for, and even then, when played correctly, this won't happen since the traitor should be signaling to the scum team who they are

I admit I didn't really play this right in that I didn't adequately signal to you all it was me who was the traitor, btw. still kicking myself bc I thought you all knew :<

speaking of that I have no idea why the fuck I even got NK'ed when everyone was suspecting me for my D2 play (which btw wasn't a good reason for scum reading me since I likely would have played similarly as town; multiball would drastically affect how I'd read people and I would not have wanted to go on a wild goose chase looking for shit when there was a chance it'd all get invalidated anyway). I guess it means the town in this game is so collectively off track that Huntress didn't care and decided to kill me anyway

[pieguyn]

all 3 of us were in great positions and I honestly think that I can say that objectively

and yeah I agree with this, except possibly myself because I didn't do a good enough job of making it clear I was the traitor and was thus at risk for being killed -.-

[pieguyn]

she tried to NK notsci N1?

[pieguyn]

legit question, did you actually have a scum read on me? now I'm curious <_>

[pieguyn]

it actually looks plausible Huntress might win this

Soren and The Bulge are the next 2 mislynches, and after that it's a tossup

and the primary investigative PR got lolflashlynched D1 already (wahaha)

[pieguyn]

indeed

I even kept telling everyone he was town and that this isn't how he plays as scum and they kept going "lol nope".

[pieguyn]

I knew you were scum because of the reasons I said in game; you were clearly holding back from having an emotional response to any of my pokes, and the most likely reason was you were afraid that I'd catch onto you if you did.

That seems to have turned out correct.

I actually agree with this. you usually can't tell the difference between mafia/SK or town/mafia in multiball based on scum hunting or motivation, but you can still occasionally catch people based on reactions/mindset/over-defensive posts/those kinds of tells (in general, behavioral tells) if one of their primary goals is survival and you have reason to suspect there's an SK in the game.

[pieguyn]

like, I'm pretty sure I'd be able to read someone like notsci or Sakura even if they wound up being SK or scum in multiball bc I know how they play well enough

obviously when played 100% correctly it would be impossible, but either way, not everyone can perfectly replicate their town game as SK/multiscum. I learned this the hard way while playing an otherwise breakout scum game and noticing even something subtle like the specific way I was scum hunting/pushing cases was different.

[pieguyn]

Like, there is no way I usually just hammer someone D1 without stating intent or whatever. I just never do that, I was fed up with the game. The meta circle was driving me insane and completely drained all my motivation to play.

wahaha

(I was deliberately pushing a bunch of meta reads bc I knew it'd piss you off )

[pieguyn]

hey, so I guess it half-worked?

but yeah, that was pretty ridiculous and I did not foresee anything like that happening. you could tell that gamestate wasn't desirable bc in 90% of cases I'd use something like that as material to hide behind but in this case I was genuinely trying to break it up :<

[pieguyn]

oh god, that makes me think of my SK game

I rolled SK in I think the 3rd (?) game I joined on this site and it was probably the most insane clusterfuck I think I've ever seen. Majiffy "caught" me on D1 for what were entirely playstyle reasons (and I know this bc every game we had after that I was scum and he town read me in all of them :>) and I got leashed. after that I'm not even kidding it was 150+ pages of people brutally arguing "LYNCH THE SK, YOU ALL ARE DUMB" vs. "WE'RE NOT LYNCHING THE SK, SHUT THE FUCK UP". what made it worse was that I *almost* got off the leash. my half-assed plan was to convince everyone there were 5 mafia - and if I had survived another day they couldn't lynch me bc they'd lose if there actually were 5 mafia, but I didn't ;w;

[pieguyn]

I don't think I've ever seen another game on this site after that with a leashed SK.

I WILL FOREVER BE KNOWN AS THE LAST LEASHED SK. KYAHAHAHA

[pieguyn]

Hahahaha, that sounds fun!

You're a pretty strong player I think. Will be keeping my eye out for you. Especially as it's very hard for me to town read people who attack me and I was still town reading you the whole game until the very end of D2.

Would be interested to see your town game.

aw thanks. I think my town game is waaay better than my scum game btw, it was only recently that I managed to improve my scum game to the point where it wasn't immediately obvious every time I was scum (honestly I think the primary reason I managed to get town read by a bunch of ppl this game was bc I had rolled traitor and said "fuck it, I'll just troll everyone". lololol I should just make that my primary strategy in all my scum games from now on lololol).

I pretty much got snowballed by your play in White Flag btw. I kept thinking in LYLO both you and Regfan were firmly scum and going "WTF HOW DOES THAT MAKE ANY SENSE" and eventually I gave up and figured you were just town bc you didn't make sense as scum with anyone. then I completely lost my shit when the game ended. that was pretty impressive :>

[pieguyn]

so far yeah

I haven't really played much recently, I've been busy with a bunch of crap (school and then when that ended an endless amt of family drama) so I was never in that many games. you've seen me as town btw (I was in the pokemon game as Seiko x Naomi and you loltunneled me based on my opening till GIF told you it was entirely null), but due to RL - and, obv, flashlynches happening every fucking day I was in the game and dramonic's lolguilty D2 - I didn't get to do anything at all that game. so that doesn't really count :p

[pieguyn]

LOL EVERYONE WHO NM NEIGHBOR'D BLATANTLY SOFTING IT AT THE SAME TIME

[pieguyn]

how the fuck are people seeing me/Cho's interactions with notsci as scum x scum

I had assumed he wouldn't have been lynchable. maybe I was wrong?!

[pieguyn]

ganbatte Huntress ~

[pieguyn]

huntress leaving NM alive the whole game was a good maneuver by her

[pieguyn]

i think this is the sound of game over