Mini Normal 2152 | JDM | Endgame

[Raya36]

VOTE: votato
I'm scum and votato is my partner. Lynch us to win.

[Raya36]

Hmm you wanted to be lynched but I don't see a self vote... suspicious

[Raya36]

But only scum lies so...

[Raya36]

Hey hey beeboy!

[Raya36]

UNVOTE:

VOTE: dsjstr

Why the vote switch?

[Raya36]

UNVOTE:

VOTE: dsjstr

Why the vote switch?

His post was worse.

Can I have more details on why it was worse?

[Raya36]

Towniest is you but for very flimsy reasons. Posting a lot, scum probably doesnt come in claiming scum lol, also you're trying to break rvs.

Beeboy is my scummiest for not participating in rvs right away. I also remember them coming across very obvtown very quickly last game together and I'm not getting that feeling at all this game. Although last game they were claimed NU.

I can't say much for in between right now but if you really want me to I can try to make a full list in the morning

[Raya36]

I mean last game I was both NU and had a public mechanic to talk about. Not to mention I could debate those stances with the people who wanted to fight me on it.

This game I have... whatever this is?
And these reads on me for not RVSing which I can't take seriously lol

Why can't you take the reads seriously? Rvs is an important phase to start a game off

[Raya36]

its an 8-player, so 3 seems excessive, even if town has a lot of power. seems like a dumbtell. which might suggest beeboy is scum? or just not paying any attention?

This is a good point. Beeboy is definitely mechanically smart

[Raya36]

its an 8-player, so 3 seems excessive, even if town has a lot of power. seems like a dumbtell. which might suggest beeboy is scum? or just not paying any attention?

Actually to add to why I think this is possible they didn't even need to say how many scum to get their point across. The "3 scum" was added in without necessity.

[Raya36]

I am bit conflicted on dsjstr. I didn't liked the apologetic nature of his 30 after maxwell's and mine posts, but then again 31 looks like he is trying to get into the game. Not sure if this is indicative for any alignment though. Just don't know why he felt commenting on votato's "scumclaim" now, if it was worrying him.

It's possible he's scum and got called out for not posting anything useful then immediately adjusted that.

[Raya36]

its an 8-player, so 3 seems excessive, even if town has a lot of power. seems like a dumbtell. which might suggest beeboy is scum? or just not paying any attention?

Why would the first suggestion be that he would be scum? I was thinking at first that this might be a townslip, but I am super careful with these because I think they are easy to fake (and it's ard to believe as it is hard to miss that this only a 8-player game) and I am not familiar with beeboy, so he might be crafty enough. Unless I am dumb and don't know what a dumbtell is.

This post comes across as town to me. Scum would probably be more likely to jump on it rather than call it town

[Raya36]

While I see some people are scumreading beeboy for not participating in rvs, why is it scum indicative here? Why is it worse than dsjstr who also wasn't participating in rvs. Just because he came back and wasn't voting again?

@dsjstr:
I reached work now so I will respond to your recent posts later in the evening.

I consider it scum indicative since rvs is needed to get the game rolling. The game had a very slow start I found and not participating in rvs only lengthens it. The reason beeboy bothered me was because it took several posts and being called out to join rvs. I think they had 3 posts of no content before placing an rvs vote. Dsj posted once then came back and placed an rvs vote on his own accord. (Unless beeboy being called out is what made him decide to rvs)

[Raya36]

I GOT IT!!!!

Votato would be the weakest of the three(comma) scum...

They town read votato and then gave their reasoning.

Actually you might be right! Weakest of the 3 town reads he gave. Then a new sentence about what scum would do.

Beeboy! How dare you forget punctuation and confuse us!

[Raya36]

Raya you said you townread me right? Your vote is on me

oops
UNVOTE:
VOTE: Beeboy
This is a better spot for it

[Raya36]

Do you still scumread Elsa?

[Raya36]

What are your thoughts on battle mage? He isnt really playing either. Why does he get a pass?

[Raya36]

What is it you like about that post? I didnt find it particularly AI

[Raya36]

Do you have any reads or thoughts Elsa?

[Raya36]

What is it you like about that post? I didnt find it particularly AI

I like those RVS please vote me posts, I won't hold that read all game but I also am fine with it on page 4.

I disagree since I don't see why scum can't easily do that. I still stand by it being NAi

[Raya36]

its an 8-player, so 3 seems excessive, even if town has a lot of power. seems like a dumbtell. which might suggest beeboy is scum? or just not paying any attention?

Actually to add to why I think this is possible they didn't even need to say how many scum to get their point across. The "3 scum" was added in without necessity.

If I go by the context of some comments you and votato seem to be familiar with beeboy and he is mechanically too smart for such a dumbtell, then why would he drop as scum such a thing in a game with people who apparently see right through it?

Not sure if you're caught up yet but it turns out there was a comma after the 3 and he did not mean to say 3 scum.

To answer your question it makes no sense both ways but I found that to be the more likely option but luckily that's cleared up so everything makes much more sense now

[Raya36]

If I was that easy I wouldn't have my title now would I?

But continue and realize after I die, not only do you not get associations, but you only get one mislynch here. Make it count.

A desperate plea here....really!? Giving up already is not the best look, and I don't buy anything you've said anyway (as you haven't backed it up).

What makes you think Elsa's entrance is scummy?

[Raya36]

I was a bit worried about Max's lack of content despite calling someone out for a lack of content (although he explained his blank votes when I questioned him) but this recent post makes up for it. Town points for asking for more reads to help push the game forward.

In response to him:
Elsa is more or less null for me although I actually lean slightly more scum on her than town. My main concern is that she is not playing like she normally would and is openly stating this. It comes across as not wanting to be as aggressive and vocal as she normally would be as town and calling herself out to make it sound more towny (like Max's read on her). Only one of her posts has a read or any thoughts. This alone isn't a strong enough basis for a read though. I want to hear more from her.

[Raya36]

To Raya: I'm not being vocal for multiple reasons I guess.

1 is that I legit forgot I signed up for this game and came in with my dress off, so to say. So I came in at a disadvantage.

2 is that I'm not 100% in my mind RN so I'm taking it slow to get back into things. I do wanna help, just... I'm working on it.

3 is... More I guess I don't have someone to bounce off of yet.

This reads as genuine so I'll give it a pass for now

[Raya36]

If I was that easy I wouldn't have my title now would I?

But continue and realize after I die, not only do you not get associations, but you only get one mislynch here. Make it count.

A desperate plea here....really!? Giving up already is not the best look, and I don't buy anything you've said anyway (as you haven't backed it up).

What makes you think Elsa's entrance is scummy?

duuuuuude did you read post 90? i don't think i've

ever

seen a scummier lead-in to a mafia game.

I am 96% sure Elsa is scum here, and 100% sure I want to lynch him today and won't compromise on that.

Can you explain why because I don't find it as scummy as you do and her recent posts come across as genuine to me.

[Raya36]

I'm baffled at anyone suggesting Elsa looks town here. Baffled!

My vote ain't moving.

Well your attitude of only having 1 lynch target isn't very townie either now is it?

Although I'm not a huge fan of this stab back at Battle Mage

[Raya36]

Alright, so we both agree its genuine you just think its scum genuinueity and I think its town

[Raya36]

Can you explain why because I don't find it as scummy as you do and her recent posts come across as genuine to me.

Genuineness can come from both sides though. Why do you think it comes here rather from town? I assume your change of opinion is based on 125 going by your 124?

Yes that's correct. I found her list of reasons to be valid and while it maybe be weak I get a sort of tonal gut read on her being town due to the genuinueity. The last point doesn't really come off as something scum would admit.

Hello. Are we eliminating today?

I'm just gonna put it out there that I'm not for eliminating elsa today. Not just for her not participating yet. Let her talk about AI stuff so we can determine if her excuses are likely true and she's town or if she's scum we can get a better read on her than just "not participating, must be scum". That said: I want participation Elsa!

[Raya36]

I'll come back and do more after work

[Raya36]

124 puzzles me. Four out of the seven reads look like setting up mislynches to pursue in case one of them gained traction, and you know this.

I already explained this, I didn't have solid reads because it was early and found more than a few people could plausibly be scum. I don't write people off as town until I feel I have good reason to. Am I going to have to repeat this over and over? God, this is annoying. At any rate, why do I need to set up 4 mislynches in an 8 player game?

But that's not my point. Raya (as town) pushed a player for a similar reason in one of his most recent completed games, so I wonder how this is any different.

Just gonna quickly intervene and say the player I pushed turned out to be town. I was wrong there.

[Raya36]

Can you explain why because I don't find it as scummy as you do and her recent posts come across as genuine to me.

Genuineness can come from both sides though. Why do you think it comes here rather from town? I assume your change of opinion is based on 125 going by your 124?

Yes that's correct. I found her list of reasons to be valid and while it maybe be weak I get a sort of tonal gut read on her being town due to the genuinueity. The last point doesn't really come off as something scum would admit.

Hello. Are we eliminating today?

I'm just gonna put it out there that I'm not for eliminating elsa today. Not just for her not participating yet. Let her talk about AI stuff so we can determine if her excuses are likely true and she's town or if she's scum we can get a better read on her than just "not participating, must be scum". That said: I want participation Elsa!

This is a disgusting misrepresentation of the fledgling Elsa-wagon. And, unrelated but it gives me the creeps when people limply imply lack of participation will eventually be alignment indicative as some sort of threat to get them engaged.

I don't care much for trying to solve the entire game on Day 1, and think that any change of focus away from eliminating Elsa would cause the town to unravel further. I won't be the catalyst for that.

To explain this a bit more I say this because I think Elsa is being genuine and I fully expect her participation to jump up soon.

[Raya36]

I'm just gonna put it out there that I'm not for eliminating elsa today. Not just for her not participating yet. Let her talk about AI stuff so we can determine if her excuses are likely true and she's town or if she's scum we can get a better read on her than just "not participating, must be scum". That said: I want participation Elsa!

Well, I mean she

is

participating. She is just by post count in the upper half of the playerlist yet I see no scumhunting, townhunting or any sorting at all or attempts to engage with other people. I think she comes across as weirdly distant in a certain way. I mean if I try to think why she acts as town as she is doing what is she trying to accomplish? If I got the timer correctly in my mind then we are already past the first half of D1.

On another note, do you still feel good with your beeboy vote? After the misunderstanding got cleared up it felt (tonally/by wording) that you were kind of relieved about it's resolution, hence I was wondering if the part about not participating in rvs was still overweighing.

Also what are you thnking about dsjstr? I noticed that you were commenting on any other player that got "wagoned", but you weren't really taking a stance there besides in 66.

Elsa - I did think her excuses came across as genuine but maybe I'm wrong here. I looked into Mage's case against Elsa and maybe he's right but her response doesn't seem defensive or reactionary. More tonally like she doesn't care which I wouldn't normally expect from scum. Elsa please do something productive. VOTE: Elsa I don't think Beeboy is happening and something needs to happen here. Maybe I'm too quick to pass her off as town for being genuine and not seeming to care.


Beeboy - My Beeboy vote was more about the part that got cleared up. rvs is rvs, I'm not going to let that affect my read much later in the game like now, but I'm still a little worried about how obvtown they were that other game and how they just really aren't coming across that way this game. They were just very very solvey last game. That said about rvs not being super important anymore I don't like where he said that he can't take the reads on him for not participating in rvs seriously. Just seemed like discrediting while acting lighthearted. I moved over to Elsa though because I think my vote will do more there than on Beeboy when it's mainly about rvs.


Dsjstr - I'm kind of null on dsj right now if I recall correctly. I'll read back through his iso tomorrow morning since I'm falling asleep lol. 66 was just speculation though.

[Raya36]

Promised read on dsjstr:

31 is good because it doesnt jump on something easy. Trying to understand Beeboy when we were all confused was good too and also so was pointing out the correction instead of trying to roll with it being a scumslip. The rest of his content is ok. So I'll give him a null townlean

[Raya36]

Well I don't like the Raya wagon much anyway so my vote goes too

VOTE: Beeboy

BM is so hard to kill me it has to be townie at this point.

Creating 2 viable counter wagons by any chance?

[Raya36]

Promised read on dsjstr:

31 is good because it doesnt jump on something easy. Trying to understand Beeboy when we were all confused was good too and also so was pointing out the correction instead of trying to roll with it being a scumslip. The rest of his content is ok. So I'll give him a null townlean

That's all you have to say? Really?

I don't know what to tell you I have a null read on him and I gave my reasons. What else do you want?

[Raya36]

I mean I wouldn't have said my read on him if I wasn't asked since I don't have a read. I'm not gonna make something up, I think his general posting is ok, nothing struck me as town or scum. He's null.

[Raya36]

Considering how this is dragging out I can't help but think that Elsa is either scum getting bussed or is town and the other scum is for some reason afraid of being the hammer while the other is already on the wagon.
In both cases I see the scum on the wagon in [Raya, beeboy], I probably like Raya less there going by the progression of her Elsa read. Sincerely doubt both scum are piling up on this wagon, since Elsa doesn't strike me as high priority target, if she is town.

Could also be both off, but I feel then one would already have hammered by this point. Game is dead af after all, there is probably rarely a better chance to not come of scummy with just hammering.

This is going off the assumption that there's 2 scum I assume? Do you think scum would bus in a setup with only 2 mafia?

VOTE: Nash

I could get on this

UNVOTE:

VOTE: Elsa

Can you explain this?

[Raya36]

Good game everyone and a very good job to the power roles who basically wiped us!