Mini Normal 2159 | Cinder Block Mafia | Game Over!

[BananaCucho]

Wtf is with that theme?

CINDER BLOCK MOOOOOOOFIA

[BananaCucho]

VOTE: RCEnigma

I wanna dance too!

[BananaCucho]

I know a few players in the playerlist (SJReaver, Frogsterking, & Walter)

I don’t know the others, but this is for everyone...

1. What is your mafia experience?
2. What is your play style strength(s)? Weakness(es)? Do you know?
3. In your opinion, what is the most important thing to look for while scumhunting? While townreading?

I’ll go first.

• - This is my 5th game game onsite, however, I have been playing the wolf/village variation of the game on a forum called WeBL since about 2006. I’m still learning how to play the game on this platform; trying to get the terms down and all that; still learning the roles and alignment s and slots and all that, so by mafia standards I’m still a noob.
  - I’d have to say my strength is the ability to townread players. Because of my overall experience I am right on village/town reads probably about 80-85% of the time all time. It’s obviously not that high on here, but still fairly high enough, I’d say about 55%. My weakness is scumhunting. A large part of this is my overthinking. Many times I’ve talked myself out of scumreads or finding wolves because of this. No matter how much I’ve tried to alleviate this flaw it keeps biting me in the butt, so I figured I’d focus on my strength and try to keep strengthening that.
  - I think looking for inconsistencies and either passiveness or aggressiveness given the context. When I townread, it’s mainly gut sometimes as I can’t point to something specific, but I’d say I look for a player being disagreeable and/or a player who has his own thoughts and mind and doesn’t go with the crowd.

Look forward to your answers.

What is this, an interview?

[BananaCucho]

I don't know anyone here

[BananaCucho]

Bad post Reaver click on the link for normal games, and to answer since this is a mini only one town and one mafia faction.
There is a list of roles on the wiki for normal games.

Why is it a bad post? Seems like it was genuine to me

Or are you just being snarky?

[BananaCucho]

Here's some better questions guys:

1) What do you like most about cinderblocks

2) What is your favorite concrete color mix?

3) When was the first time a cinder block changed your life?

4) What is the capital of Assyria?

5) Do you believe the Church and gospel of Jesus Christ have been restored through the Prophet Joseph Smith?

[BananaCucho]

Heyyy page 3.

RVS VOTE: callforjudgement as a call for peace

OK, I don't like this. Not specifically because the RVS vote was on me, but because you made an RVS vote in the first place, and labelled it as one.

The whole point of RVS is to get the game started; initially we have no information, a little later we do have information because people have started posting. So the whole point is to do things that people can react to, to do things that let your alignment shine through, to try to pressure people into making mistakes.

If you post an RVS vote labelled as an RVS vote, then:

• People will know that there's no read basis behind your vote, = you aren't trying to get your vote target voted out, = it doesn't apply any pressure;
  
• You're making yourself hard to read, because the post could just as easily be made by any alignment;
  
• In addition to muddying the waters about your alignment, you're neither forming reads nor pushing reads. So you aren't doing any of the three things a townie should be doing.

If you're town, this isn't good enough. We're at page 3, there's already alignment-indicative content being posted (and potentially alignment-indicative lack of content), and this should be fairly obvious to anyone reading the thread (I even pointed it out in my previous post!) Your post would be one thing if you planned to read the thread after making it, and immediately corrected the vote to something real. But you didn't say you were going to do that, and it's been 10 minutes since you posted it (easily enough time to read 54 posts). This isn't good enough. Please read through the thread and try to look for reads, don't try to continue RVS once it's already ended.

Bruh. That's a lot of words.

Here's some better questions guys:

When you posted these, how were you expecting players to react to them?

There appears to be many UNCULTURED SWINE in this game - nobody so far has answered #4 correctly and I feel dated >:(

[BananaCucho]

hmmm
COJ, you believe we are now out of rvs because of your two posts?
I agree with you on the crap post though by frog but that is because like you said no follow up or anything else.
No reason to label it as rvs agreed.
But your reaction seems disproportionate to the faux paus committed of continuing rvs.
Which italiano also continued with.
I think this is a tl on you for now COJ because you want better posting from people and to move on from rvs.

You town lean fluff posts?

[BananaCucho]

It is not concrete banana.
To me it is not the fact that they are fluff but rather the intent.
Move on from rvs and get better posts. I see this as someone who wants to gamesolve rather than joke around.

The intent? Mansplaining RVS? lol okay

[BananaCucho]

(PEDIT: re #58)

Why do you care about whether we're cultured, as opposed to whether we're scum? This is a Mafia game, not a classics exam. (Also, #4 doesn't have a single correct answer; Assyria no longer exists and its capital changed over time.)

There's only one town-indicative reason I can think of to make a post like #44, and if it were the actual reason, I'd expect you to have mentioned it.

As for your previous comment: I know I post a lot of text sometimes, but I'm trying to convince people to play in a more town-sided way. In the current metagame, town wins quite easily when townies put in effort, scum win quite easily when they don't. There are a lot of players out there (some of them in this game; hi Not_Mafia!) who are good players when they put their minds to it, but more commonly just end up passively floating through the game and eventually making everyone impossible to read. I therefore see trying to persuade people to get their brains into gear as important, as I'm unlikely to win otherwise.


PEDIT re #59: I believe we're out of RVS as soon as anyone posts anything that can be scumhunted from. We were out of RVS

before

my two posts, not

because of

them. That's why I didn't cast a random vote, and why I don't expect any more random voting in this game.

bruh

[BananaCucho]

K, that is a point I can respect on the rvs part. Thank you for making that clearer.
pedit one word statements are not helpful.
I was not mansplaining rvs or at least it was not intended.

I didnt mean you lol! Sorry for the misinderstanding

What I meant is that call's essay about RVS seemed very mansplainy, so I dont see why anyone would town lean off of that post

[BananaCucho]

Wow. At this point in time you are suspicious of the labeled RVS?
I guess I’d think it depends on the bandwidth each player has to invest on this but honestly I don’t get any clear read from what I’ve read so far. I’d consider random voting still valid. Let me go back and review the posts...

"RVS" and "Uncultured swine" both got essays in response lol. I don't know call, but I get the feeling this is just hows this player operates. Which should make for a fun time xD

What do you think of Woolter and SJR assigning early townpoints to them?

[BananaCucho]

There appears to be many UNCULTURED SWINE in this game - nobody so far has answered #4 correctly and I feel dated >:(

Assur or "I don't know." You're making a Monty Python and the Holy Grail reference.

Who are you who are so wise in the ways of science?

[BananaCucho]

By the end of page 3 I will have caught 1 scum.

Proceed.

Nope. By the end of day 1 no one will have caught scum. Never happened before, it isnt going to change here

In my experience, if scum is caught day 1 it's pretty much due to luck lol

[BananaCucho]

I’m out for tonight though. Will catch up and see what happening tomorrow.

^ Continued to visit the site on and off for two hours after I accused them of being scum. Didn't post anything in a public channel though.

[BananaCucho]

After reading through up to page 4 again, what it looks like to me is we were out of RVS once callforjudgment made his serious vote. @ callforjudgment I know you said that we left RVS before you made your post/vote, but I didn’t find that. Can you point to where you saw it move out of RVS?

@SJReaver: Listen I’m not gonna waste time trying to prove to you that I’m town, but can you honestly say that all of your posts have added to the gamestate and have helped in finding scum?

If you’re town your tunneling doesn’t help, but if you’re scum, you picked the wrong person to target.

VOTE: Banana

Gotta say something better than bruh my dude. Even though we’ve all been “fluffing” it overall your posts have felt very apathetic.

Bruh

[BananaCucho]

lol SJ, you are definitely my type of people

[BananaCucho]

I'm with it VOTE: SJReaper

Could you point out what you view as scummy exactly from SJ?

[BananaCucho]

What if I told you I've already caught 2?

If you have caught scum, you may as well tell the rest of us, together with sufficient reasoning to convince us, so that we can vote them out.

COJ why does your sjr read end at 22 and not say... 27 where Sjr had already done exactly what you're scumreading me for?

Because that sort of post is more scummy from someone who has a lower post count. It doesn't matter much if one individual post is being guarded/defensive if the rest of the ISO is giving away information. It does matter if the majority of a player's posts are being cagey and the rest of the ISO isn't there.

After reading through up to page 4 again, what it looks like to me is we were out of RVS once callforjudgment made his serious vote. @ callforjudgment I know you said that we left RVS before you made your post/vote, but I didn’t find that. Can you point to where you saw it move out of RVS?

The game isn't in the random voting stage as soon as there's something non-random to vote about. #31 appears to be the first post which contains a non-random (if weak) read, so it ended there.


VOTE: BananaCucho
This is a stronger read than the read I had on RCEnigma. #107 and #109 (I haven't checked #108 because I have images turned off) are the sort of content that's a) easy to post as either alignment, and b) doesn't help solve the game at all as town. This wouldn't be particularly scummy if it were posted together with more townish posts, but in isolation, it's pretty suspicious.

@SJReaver (#110): Why are you talking about day 1 in the past tense? Are you talking about a different game?

(Also, I have a mild scum read on SJReaver from #115; people are way more likely to joke about being scum when they actually are scum.)

Side note: I have limited access on Mondays and Thursdays, so I probably won't be able to post here for a few hours.

You write essays

I shitpost

We can understand each other, or be at odds with one another. Up to you

[BananaCucho]

Come on, mafia.

I'm vanilla townie. I don't care if you night kill me or not. Hang me on D1. You know people are going to look at the VC.

Try to miseliminate me. Come on, grow a pair and vote against SJR. Help save Italian VD.

Really Sj, Saying you are vanilla townie does not help.
Only helps scum narrow down prs.

Do you scum read this move? An early VT claim like this is pretty much what townies do, even though it's anti-town in nature

[BananaCucho]

I'm with it VOTE: SJReaper

Could you point out what you view as scummy exactly from SJ?

Okay, I'll help you out: I am scum.

10000% scum.

Gottem lol

[BananaCucho]

Come on, mafia.

I'm vanilla townie. I don't care if you night kill me or not. Hang me on D1. You know people are going to look at the VC.

Try to miseliminate me. Come on, grow a pair and vote against SJR. Help save Italian VD.

Really Sj, Saying you are vanilla townie does not help.
Only helps scum narrow down prs.

Do you scum read this move? An early VT claim like this is pretty much what townies do, even though it's anti-town in nature

Only slightly, but SJ did this in our previous game, claiming vt.

Ah - were they scum or town?

[BananaCucho]

After reading through up to page 4 again, what it looks like to me is we were out of RVS once callforjudgment made his serious vote. @ callforjudgment I know you said that we left RVS before you made your post/vote, but I didn’t find that. Can you point to where you saw it move out of RVS?

@SJReaver: Listen I’m not gonna waste time trying to prove to you that I’m town, but can you honestly say that all of your posts have added to the gamestate and have helped in finding scum?

If you’re town your tunneling doesn’t help, but if you’re scum, you picked the wrong person to target.

VOTE: Banana

Gotta say something better than bruh my dude. Even though we’ve all been “fluffing” it overall your posts have felt very apathetic.

Bruh

That actually made me laugh out loud. Honestly I don’t even know how to respond to that.

Something

[BananaCucho]

=)

[BananaCucho]

Town.

So why the slight scum read then? You think they're trying to manipulate based off of that game?

[BananaCucho]

Seems pretty tin foil hatty to me

[BananaCucho]

Literally everyone read you as town at the end of day 1. Your play was perfect. And now it's ass.

Still the beginning of Day 1, give it time.

Is this your stance? Really? Mr. "say more than bruh!"

[BananaCucho]

Town.

So why the slight scum read then? You think they're trying to manipulate based off of that game?

No, but that combined with the come get me scum statements as bait aren't really helping my read of sj along with saying she is scum serves no purpose except as bait.

Ehhhhhhhhh

I hard disagree, I feel like the "come get me" stuff is probably most definitely coming from a townie over a scummy, but I guess I can see your thought process in it so I'll drop it

[BananaCucho]

Literally everyone read you as town at the end of day 1. Your play was perfect. And now it's ass.

Still the beginning of Day 1, give it time.

Is this your stance? Really? Mr. "say more than bruh!"

Yup.

[BananaCucho]

Geraintm is an honest guy, I like that. But I'm scumreading him for not getting the 42nd post.

I am so very confused.

Reaver I am finding unhelpful

What is your opinion on Italiano?

[BananaCucho]

Likeable = scummy

Now I've heard it all

[BananaCucho]

The interaction between Reaver and Walter at 31 felt weird or awkward maybe. Almost felt like maybe Walter was going for a push but then backed off when Reaver responded. I got the same feeling from 67.

callforjudgement's huge post 50 was a lot. I don't townread it but don't necessarily scum read it either. I just think it's something scum could do to try to take the credit of getting us out of rvs which is what seemed to be happening (55). After reading more it feels like he's either town tryharding or scum trying way too hard to be 'obvtown'. Time will tell.

I kinda like Banana for town. Just as an early gut read.


VOTE: callforjudgement

I do get the feeling that Woolter is trying not to rock the boat much. Like he's asking questions and probing but most of them are softballs.

[BananaCucho]

VOTE: Nosferatu

I'm not buying the sobriety excuse because I'm town and posting anyway right now. Nosferatu's post seems a little lurky and overconcerned. Like he thinks he can get away with it for an ML or two.

COJ seems overly concerned with Not_Mafia. I feel like he would be able to think more critically if he stopped mentioning Not_Mafia.

COJ and Not_Mafia nominated themselves for town leader and town "anti-town" and seem well suited for their roles respectively.

WaltertheDunce10 seems like he likes Twitter or LinkedIn or both.

Nosferatu seems like he's trying to lurk and be overreactive and get town read for it by being hipster. Like Nosferatu is saying to himself "I have two or three other scum buddies, it's D1, nothing really to do, let me just throw this out there."

I feel like Nosferatu if he flipped town would just post some filler there instead of explaining that he couldn't post filler because he's drunk.

Like you really think a guy who took the time to upload an animated avatar of some movie star consuming a cigar or joint or whatever the fuck that is would feel too self-aware to post some filler because he's been drinking?

Tbh this vote feels like a pretty bad excuse for a vote. And the reaction feels forced.

VOTE: Frogsterking

[BananaCucho]

I've been maintaining that this is a real tell for years (e.g. here). Actual results have been mixed; I've seen three joke scum claims, and one of them was from scum (from Firebringer here), but one of them was from Not_Mafia (for whom a scumclaim in the first post isn't alignment-indicative because he does it basically every game). So a 50% accuracy rate isn't that bad (given that only about a quarter of players are scum), although there isn't much data from my personal experience. (I can't remember where I first heard about the tell in question.)

I disagree. I’ve seen it happen more from villagers and village power role players than from scum, not to say scum doesn’t do it, but I’ve seen it more the other way. (not on this site, but the other site I am a part of).

But in this case of SJReaver, a newb: 1) Do you really feel she would be more likely to do it and 2) Do you think her scum team would comfortably allow her to do it?

I agree with you, I've seen plenty of townies claim scum as a joke. I've done it myself as well. Besides, @Mr Essay, 2 instances is hardly data to base a theory off of

[BananaCucho]

5.
No.
Here I developed some even better questions!
1. Is it okay to put rotting produce into an uncooked stead as a filler?
What is the cinderblock you would like most as a pet?
Are pineapples good on pizzas?

VOTE: Walther
Now you’re just wasting time and space with this

Why would you call this out but not call me out for doing the exact same thing?

I disagree with any notion of "wasting time" when we have 2 week long days lol

[BananaCucho]

Likeable = scummy

Now I've heard it all

That’s

Not what CFJ said at all

It's basically what he said lol

[BananaCucho]

I feel like Nosferatu if he flipped town would just post some filler there instead of explaining that he couldn't post filler because he's drunk.

Like you really think a guy who took the time to upload an animated avatar of some movie star consuming a cigar or joint or whatever the fuck that is would feel too self-aware to post some filler because he's been drinking?

VOTE: Nosferatu

I'm not buying the sobriety excuse because I'm town and posting anyway right now. Nosferatu's post seems a little lurky and overconcerned. Like he thinks he can get away with it for an ML or two.

COJ seems overly concerned with Not_Mafia. I feel like he would be able to think more critically if he stopped mentioning Not_Mafia.

COJ and Not_Mafia nominated themselves for town leader and town "anti-town" and seem well suited for their roles respectively.

WaltertheDunce10 seems like he likes Twitter or LinkedIn or both.

Does everyone here just have a hair trigger temper when it comes to suspecting things
I feel like everyone’s just chomping at the bit for whatever vaguely suspicious thing they can find vs. actually probing to see if it’s a valid suspicion

You including yourself in that "everyone"?

5.
No.
Here I developed some even better questions!
1. Is it okay to put rotting produce into an uncooked stead as a filler?
What is the cinderblock you would like most as a pet?
Are pineapples good on pizzas?

VOTE: Walther
Now you’re just wasting time and space with this

[BananaCucho]

Walter has been scum read in every game I've seen him play. The man has a flair for being miseliminated.

No updated VC, I see. Give me time to see what you've been up to and find out how easy it is to slip under the radar.

This is helpful info. Is there a reason you can put your finger onto why Woolter seems to be scum read a lot?

[BananaCucho]

Walter has been scum read in every game I've seen him play. The man has a flair for being miseliminated.

No updated VC, I see. Give me time to see what you've been up to and find out how easy it is to slip under the radar.

This is helpful info. Is there a reason you can put your finger onto why Woolter seems to be scum read a lot?

He has a sparse posting style and doesn't engage in much of the back-and-forth other posters do that make them sticky* in other's minds. He's poor at defending himself because he tends to remain calm and level-headed. His reads are average but he's not the best at making a case, so other town posters tend to value him less.

In the first game I played with him, it was the end of D1 and we were one vote away from eliminating Walter. He came off as being okay with it. The reason we caught scum was that rolling him was so nice and easy, they made a 'jokey' post that obvscum mindset.

If it's not clear, I'm currently townreading him. Because of the consistency in his playstyle, I'll probably lock that in for D1 and then revisit it D2 when we have a flip and I can see how he positions himself.


*It's somewhat tangential, but group psychology often favors people who provoke any sort of emotional reaction, even slightly negative ones.

Can you do me a favor

Can you carry me in your enormously giant townie backpack to victory?

[BananaCucho]

Sorry guys, been really busy with work today, got a particularly nasty bug that I'm working on rn

I'll be doing some catchup here soon

[BananaCucho]

Am I the only one that thinks that is townreading Nos? I don't understand the scumreads on him and the votes on him feel opportunistic at best

[BananaCucho]

selfvotes are always scummy

They arent pro town

Yeah but townies act anti-town all the time. Anti-town =/= scummy

[BananaCucho]

Am I the only one that thinks that is townreading Nos? I don't understand the scumreads on him and the votes on him feel opportunistic at best

Could you explain why? I’m open to see things differently.

Tone feels town, I have also done the exact same thing as town multiple times myself in the past.

Mainly, I don't see the play here from a scum POV. Especially with the self vote. I understand the "AtE" argument but it feels like suboptimal play, he could just attempt to brush off the criticism as scum instead of going ham like this and self voting

[BananaCucho]

selfvotes are always scummy

They arent pro town

That's true. Ok self votes are always anti-town. And I read this particular time as scummy

The day is so early though. Why is this scummy in this instance? What's the play? There's till so much time left for day 1, his lunch is in no way a forgone conclusion

[BananaCucho]

selfvotes are always scummy

They arent pro town

That's true. Ok self votes are always anti-town. And I read this particular time as scummy

The day is so early though. Why is this scummy in this instance? What's the play? There's till so much time left for day 1, his lunch is in no way a forgone conclusion

No but he's building up a wagon and suspicion so he could easily have faked the frustration (with the self vote to emphasize) to appear more town

The frustration feels genuine though - this whole thing started over basically nothing, pushed by Frog and then multiple people have piled on

[BananaCucho]

VOTE: Italiano

This guy pinged me like super opportunistic in my catchup. Wagon jumping like crazy, jumping on Nos for being "unhelpful and pointless" (weak vote) and then to call as that wagon seemed to be building as well

[BananaCucho]

Mainly, I don't see the play here from a scum POV. Especially with the self vote. I understand the "AtE" argument but it feels like suboptimal play, he could just attempt to brush off the criticism as scum instead of going ham like this and self voting

I see. Have you played with Nosferatu as both alignments?

I haven't played with anyone here

[BananaCucho]

what's up Nosf?

waving goodbye before the mod comes and you die

Oh lmao it was a wave

o7 we salute you gamma, so long

[BananaCucho]

I know how you feel tbh
I didn't know mafia miller couldn't be a thing until I lost a game because of it

I mean if its fake why would you point that out now? They did it as a reaction test then

[BananaCucho]

I didn't explicitly point it out for some time
but Yeah I always knew it wasn't real, so with the newer playerbase for this game I figured it would garner some interesting reactions
Didn't end up being the case, very little seemed to come from it and everyone took it at face value.

It's poor form to cut someone else's reaction test short tho

[BananaCucho]

That's not a full post??????

[BananaCucho]

Who was Sordros

[BananaCucho]

She had a blank space, and he wrote her name O.o

[BananaCucho]

Nice

[BananaCucho]

I am a day banana cop

Italiano is not a banana

[BananaCucho]

2 week days is really rough